Log for #openttdcoop on 13th January 2010:
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00:12:02  <Webster> Latest update from blog: Fail-Save Joiners, Priorities and the Cyclotron example <>
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00:50:39  <jondisti> !password
00:50:39  <PublicServer> jondisti: soling
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02:23:30  <ttd_guest> @quickstart
02:23:32  <Webster> Quickstart - #openttdcoop Wiki -
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02:25:53  <mib_hcaoxr> !help
02:25:53  <PublicServer> mib_hcaoxr:
02:26:07  <mib_hcaoxr> !password
02:26:07  <PublicServer> mib_hcaoxr: Please, read the rules!
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02:30:53  <mib_yfo579> !rules
02:30:53  <PublicServer> mib_yfo579:
02:31:20  <mib_yfo579> !password
02:31:20  <PublicServer> mib_yfo579: Please, read the rules!
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02:33:56  <PeterT> !tell mib_yfo579 !password
02:33:56  <PublicServer> mib_yfo579: Please, read the rules!
02:34:03  <PeterT> !tell mib_yfo579 !password
02:34:04  <PublicServer> mib_yfo579: Please, read the rules!
02:34:07  <PeterT> !tell mib_yfodfdfsfasdg579 !password
02:34:07  <PublicServer> mib_yfodfdfsfasdg579: Please, read the rules!
02:34:28  <PeterT> How does it determine that the nickname i just typed in is a mibbit IRC client?
02:34:37  <PeterT> !tell mib_PeterT !password
02:34:37  <PublicServer> mib_PeterT: Please, read the rules!
02:36:17  <Fuco> ctcp version
02:37:58  <PeterT> really? because mib_PeterT isn't even connected...
02:38:06  <PeterT> !tell PeterTmib !password
02:38:07  <PublicServer> PeterTmib: Please, read the rules!
02:38:11  <PeterT> !tell PeterT !password
02:38:11  <PublicServer> PeterT: kneels
02:38:14  <PeterT> Hmm
02:38:22  <PeterT> PublicServer: Please, read the rules!
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03:02:55  <De_Ghosty> hey
03:03:03  <De_Ghosty> what os is the website on?
03:11:58  <PeterT> hm?
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08:21:24  <Goulp> !download win32
08:21:24  <PublicServer> Goulp:
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11:15:01  <jondisti> !password
11:15:01  <PublicServer> jondisti: bidden
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11:26:09  <V453000> !password
11:26:09  <PublicServer> V453000: oldens
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11:31:39  <PublicServer> <jondisti> howdy
11:31:46  <PublicServer> <V453000> hi
11:32:45  <PublicServer> <V453000> what are teh No-Abort shifters supposed to improve? dont you know?
11:34:15  <PublicServer> <jondisti> no idea
11:34:26  <PublicServer> <V453000> ok I am not alone :D
11:34:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> geez no maize still? :DD
11:35:01  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh there is some
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11:36:39  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
11:36:40  <Mark> V453000: trains don't get blocked while shifting
11:36:46  <V453000> WOW desynch :D
11:36:50  <jondisti> cooool
11:36:52  <V453000> hi Mark
11:37:00  <Mark> so, for example, you don't need bypases on SML networks anymore
11:37:01  <V453000> !password
11:37:01  <Mark> hello :)
11:37:01  <PublicServer> V453000: drifts
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11:38:33  <PublicServer> <V453000> hmmm ... but where is the advantage? it saves no space, works with same effectiveness
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11:39:47  <Mark> trains on SML networks don't stop anymore, meaing improved flow
11:39:54  <Mark> especially for slowly accelerating trains
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11:40:04  <jondisti> hmh
11:40:08  <V453000> oh so
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11:40:28  <Mark> you'd see the advantages clearly on a lev4 SML network
11:40:32  <Ammler> Mark: the shifter from Osai blog?
11:40:38  <Mark> yes
11:41:03  <Ammler> would be nice, if he would have mentioned it ;-)
11:41:15  <Ammler> I thought, it is theory only
11:41:52  <Mark> heh
11:42:20  <Mark> i'll add that in a comment, together with a pic of what a shifter would look like
11:42:43  <jondisti> V453000: try joining again?
11:44:36  <V453000> :)
11:44:39  <V453000> jondisti: not now
11:44:58  <jondisti> :(
11:48:42  <V453000> gotta cook lunch
11:48:47  <V453000> will be back in 15
11:49:56  <PublicServer> <jondisti> i would have had time to build overflow for maize02 now.
11:50:01  <PublicServer> <jondisti> but i'll go then :P
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14:01:01  <jondisti> !password
14:01:01  <PublicServer> jondisti: nudges
14:01:39  <jondisti> !password
14:01:39  <PublicServer> jondisti: averse
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14:14:47  <Intexon> !password
14:14:48  <PublicServer> Intexon: averse
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15:30:30  <Mark> !password
15:30:30  <PublicServer> Mark: revved
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15:35:54  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> what does "!lol" mean?
15:38:16  <Osai> hi all
15:38:17  <Osai> :)
15:39:15  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> HELO
15:39:42  <Osai> hi Ammler
15:40:20  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> I don't find your "safe" joiner on this map
15:41:50  <Osai> I didn't build it there
15:42:09  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> Mark said, there should be
15:42:12  <Osai> hmmm
15:42:14  <Osai> oO
15:43:00  <Ammler> !info
15:43:00  <PublicServer> Ammler: #:1(Orange) Company Name: 'New Safingley Transport'  Year Founded: 1960  Money: 3076927721  Loan: 0  Value: 3083883881  (T:761, R:0, P:0, S:0) unprotected
15:43:21  <Ammler> the map looks almost empty, where are those 700 trains?
15:44:11  <Osai> well, the network has capacity for maybe 3k trains :D
15:44:55  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> yes, a lot tracks
15:45:12  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> it oculd become a nice parking lot
15:45:22  <PublicServer> <AmmIer> ;-)
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15:48:42  <Mark>
15:48:43  <Mark> heh
15:49:03  <Mark> Ammler: did i?
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15:56:07  <Ammler> looks nice
15:56:47  <Ammler> ah, lev4 network isn't the current map
15:57:41  <Mark>
15:57:42  <Mark> :D
15:57:51  <Mark> doesn't quite meet the requriments though
16:03:41  <Ammler> Mark: you should anyway test your screen on a smaller window
16:03:50  <Ammler> like 800x600
16:04:08  <Mark> i'm not going to upload it anyway
16:04:13  <Mark> don't feel like creating an account just for that
16:04:18  <Ammler> then you have mostly the river on it
16:04:22  <Mark> just wanted to make one :P
16:04:43  <Ammler> I can post it for you ;-)
16:04:45  <Mark> who plays with 800x600?
16:04:50  <Mark> that's just unrealistic
16:05:12  <KenjiE20> people
16:05:14  <Ammler> hmm, I guess the rules are smaller
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16:05:26  <Ammler> ipod or such
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16:06:38  <Ammler> he, I thought, you are using original graphics
16:06:51  <Ammler> then KenjiE20 is the only one left ;-)
16:06:53  <Ammler> and XeryusTC
16:07:18  <Ammler> oh, and Osai :-D
16:07:31  <Ammler> lol, maybe others too
16:07:35  <Mark> hm, the max size my openttd allows is 1280*1024, how do i test it for 1920*1200?
16:08:05  <Phazorx> edit config?
16:09:06  <Ammler> installing 3rd party desktop configurators
16:09:15  <Ammler> like those from nvidia
16:10:20  <PublicServer> *** AmmIer has left the game (leaving)
16:12:23  <Mark> oh i actually do have an account
16:12:41  <Mark> now i remember, i created it to upload the first SRNW :P
16:14:27  <Ammler> are there any nice other intro games already there?
16:19:22  <Mark> there, put it an the forums
16:19:24  <Mark> soup time
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17:59:13  <Osai> Ammler: yeah, I prefer original gfx
17:59:52  <Osai> because, I have problems with identifying the signals
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18:18:37  <XeryusTC> Osai: is that the only reason?
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18:36:08  <Techinica> !password
18:36:08  <PublicServer> Techinica: salons
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18:49:50  <planetmaker> <Mark> [17:04:45] who plays with 800x600? <-- you may laugh, but I play it in windowed mode on 1200 x 800. And I don't maximize the window :-)
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18:50:54  <planetmaker> and... how does it forbid larger than 1280 x 1024? Just use a maximized window.
18:51:04  <planetmaker> Works nicely then on 2560 x 1024 :-)
18:51:28  <Hyppy> I play on 1920x1200 and 1680x1050 all the time
18:52:46  <planetmaker> sure. why not? :-)
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18:54:17  <Osai> XeryusTC: hehe... no :D
18:54:39  <XeryusTC> hehe ok :P
18:54:52  <XeryusTC> i dont like OGFX either
18:55:00  <XeryusTC> mainly because of the inconsistent style
18:55:52  <planetmaker> go, better get station set coding...!
18:55:57  <Ammler> but you use newgrfs, lol
18:56:18  <planetmaker> hehe @ Ammler :-)
18:56:28  <XeryusTC> Ammler: have you ever seen my newgrf lists?
18:56:36  <Ammler> yes
18:56:39  <V453000> hi :)
18:56:46  <XeryusTC> those which i use in SP?
18:56:57  <Ammler> yes
18:56:59  <XeryusTC> brb, getting some more phoodz
18:57:03  <Ammler> :-)
18:57:36  <V453000> you ever seen Error: Too many GRFs? :/
18:57:45  <planetmaker> yes :-)
18:57:52  <Ammler> yes :-)
18:58:00  <planetmaker> in screenshots in noobs forum messages :-P
18:58:13  <Ammler> he, as I configured wwottdgd72
18:58:24  <planetmaker> he :-)
18:58:27  <Ammler> !s/7/\//
18:58:48  <Osai> 72 - what year do we have? 2054?
18:58:57  <V453000> date
18:59:00  <V453000> !date
18:59:00  <PublicServer> V453000:  4 May 2204
18:59:12  <Ammler> Osai: sometimes I use the cheat in RL
18:59:31  <Osai> cheat?
18:59:43  <Ammler> mäh, nvm...
19:00:33  <XeryusTC> Ammler: even if you did as I never publish my newgrf lists, you should've known that my newgrfs are mostly all station sets (for ease) and loads of Pikka's newgrfs
19:00:48  <Ammler> yes
19:01:09  <XeryusTC> how's that for inconsistency then?
19:01:16  <Ammler> and you think all station grfs are consistence to each other?
19:01:37  <XeryusTC> no, but i dont even use all of them, i just have all of them loaded
19:02:05  <Ammler> do you think, dutsch station set is consistent to ttd default?
19:02:18  <planetmaker> :-)
19:02:24  <XeryusTC> they barely are, but i only use them because they're dutch :P
19:02:27  <XeryusTC> and i coded them :P
19:03:03  <Ammler> well, I really would like the default set sometimes too
19:03:27  <Osai> hmmm
19:03:32  <Osai> I think its time for a new game
19:03:50  <Ammler> but if you have used opengfx too much, you miss something
19:04:24  <Ammler> and there are some "glitches"
19:04:42  <V453000> !password
19:04:42  <PublicServer> V453000: mallet
19:04:56  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
19:05:33  <V453000> Osai: those joiners do amazing job
19:06:03  <Ammler> and IMO, pikka sets do match better ogfx style than default style
19:06:06  <Ammler> also does ISR
19:06:24  <PublicServer> *** 0sai joined the game
19:06:34  <PublicServer> <0sai> hmm
19:06:34  <XeryusTC> pikka makes most of his sets to fit with the default graphics
19:06:47  <Ammler> ogfx was also made to fit default
19:06:56  <PublicServer> <V453000> really? :D
19:06:57  <PublicServer> <0sai> where at?
19:07:14  <XeryusTC> it was? it has a style which is totally not consistent to it
19:07:16  <PublicServer> <V453000> Osai: meant the ones your post was is about
19:07:21  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
19:07:31  <PublicServer> <0sai> I am still searching them
19:07:34  <PublicServer> <0sai> :D
19:07:39  <PublicServer> <V453000> :)
19:07:41  <PublicServer> <0sai> or do you mean in general
19:07:49  <Ammler> Osai: Mark meant another savegame
19:07:51  <PublicServer> <V453000> I meant in general
19:07:53  <Ammler> I mixed that
19:07:56  <PublicServer> <V453000> it saves lotsa space
19:08:13  <PublicServer> <V453000> and great effectiveness
19:08:14  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
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19:08:15  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
19:08:20  <V453000> what the hell
19:08:26  <V453000> why does it desynch?
19:08:33  <planetmaker> connection lost != desync
19:08:35  <Ammler> XeryusTC: could you please make examples and maybe post them to the thread
19:08:37  <planetmaker> please mind that
19:08:44  <Osai> I think, I'll update the southern SML  track
19:08:53  <V453000> could be nice
19:09:04  <XeryusTC> Ammler: buildings? the UK buildings set does not fit with the original graphics
19:09:06  <planetmaker> Ammler, he never does. He's fine with destructive criticism... at least so far
19:09:15  <Osai> well
19:09:26  <Osai> the only think I'd change are the signals
19:09:44  <planetmaker> Well, yes, they're on the to do list, yes.
19:09:56  <Osai> the green and red lights are too small
19:10:03  <planetmaker> yes. :-)
19:10:26  <Ammler> signals are also on the TODO list :-)
19:10:56  <V453000> signals are very needed but also some buildings, such as the Steel Mill ... that is terrible
19:11:04  <V453000> tunnels ... :/
19:11:15  <planetmaker> tunnels are quite nice IMO
19:11:23  <V453000> kinda shiny
19:11:26  <Ammler> signals:
19:12:14  <Osai> the task is 6 months old D:
19:12:27  <Osai> I think, I'll delay some tasks on my todo list too ^^
19:12:27  <Ammler> yes, prio is low
19:12:29  <V453000> I just think that hte old pixelart just has its spark and I would keep it
19:12:44  <Ammler> but that could now be rised
19:12:44  <Osai> anyone wants to join PS?
19:12:47  <Osai> I want to update the SML
19:12:53  <V453000> sure
19:13:00  <V453000> !password
19:13:01  <PublicServer> V453000: mallet
19:13:02  <planetmaker> Ammler, well... prio has what is provided by the artists...
19:13:08  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
19:13:10  <planetmaker> ... and what is actually being coded ;-)
19:13:19  <planetmaker> All the alignment tests... nasty and lengthy
19:13:55  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
19:13:55  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
19:14:05  <V453000> synchronization failed
19:14:07  <V453000> damn
19:14:11  <V453000> I was there 1 minute
19:14:21  <planetmaker> does it tell at your end really sync?
19:14:30  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
19:14:35  <V453000> ?
19:14:37  <planetmaker> or just "could not connect"
19:14:48  <planetmaker> V453000, you constantly speak of "desync". The server doesn't say so
19:14:49  <V453000> syncronization failed
19:14:58  <V453000> I get only this
19:15:06  <planetmaker> Desync is a very well defined thing in OpenTTD. That's why I'm asking :-)
19:15:19  <V453000> yeah ...
19:15:23  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
19:15:23  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
19:15:26  <planetmaker> That's interesting then. Because desync is... a bug. A bad bug.
19:15:34  <hylje> desync means the state between clients goes off
19:15:38  <planetmaker> And I wonder why the server just says "connection lost"
19:15:50  <V453000> pff
19:16:07  <XeryusTC> planetmaker: because OTTD forgot how to give proper error reports :P
19:16:08  <V453000> Network-Game synchronization failed
19:16:10  <planetmaker> Because that would then be yet another bug.
19:16:14  <PublicServer> *** AmmIer joined the game
19:16:20  <V453000> how should I fix this?
19:16:35  <planetmaker> V453000, make a bug report for OpenTTD :-)
19:16:40  <Ammler> maybe time for pause_on_join :-)
19:16:43  <planetmaker> With the savegame.
19:16:45  <planetmaker> !pause
19:16:46  <PublicServer> planetmaker: you must be channel op to use !pause
19:16:46  *** lomba has joined #openttdcoop
19:16:49  <planetmaker> @op
19:16:49  *** Webster sets mode: +o planetmaker
19:16:52  <planetmaker> !pause
19:16:52  <PublicServer> *** planetmaker has paused the server.
19:16:53  <PublicServer> *** Game paused (not enough players)
19:16:54  <Ammler> wrong setting :-P
19:16:56  <planetmaker> try again :-)
19:17:04  <V453000> !password
19:17:04  <PublicServer> V453000: looted
19:17:11  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
19:17:13  <Ammler> !rcon set pause_on_join
19:17:13  <PublicServer> Ammler: Current value for 'pause_on_join' is: 'off' (min: 0, max: 1)
19:17:17  <Ammler> !rcon set pause_on_join 1
19:17:21  <Ammler> !auto
19:17:21  <PublicServer> *** Ammler has enabled autopause mode.
19:17:39  <planetmaker> did you disable pause_on_join?!?
19:17:47  <Ammler> yes, should be
19:17:51  <planetmaker> Not at all.
19:17:53  <Ammler> quite annoying
19:18:02  <planetmaker> It must not be off.
19:18:16  <Ammler> on very high usage game, it might help
19:18:17  <planetmaker> That's the only way below average computers have a chance.
19:18:34  <planetmaker> And honestly, it never annoyed me.
19:19:00  <planetmaker> Having it on is for good reasons a default setting.
19:19:12  <Ammler> it isn't afaik
19:19:24  <Ammler> or do you mean on our server?
19:19:38  <jondisti> !password
19:19:38  <PublicServer> jondisti: looted
19:19:46  <PublicServer> *** jondisti joined the game
19:19:51  *** StarLite has quit IRC
19:19:55  <Ammler> planetmaker: you know that "feature" exist since around 1-2 monts?
19:20:49  <planetmaker> uhm... ? Servers always paused for joining clients.
19:20:56  <PublicServer> *** AmmIer has left the game (connection lost)
19:21:16  <planetmaker> Maybe it was back then a feature of ap / ap+ only. Dunno
19:22:47  <Ammler> no, it was a useless feature, it paused only while joining, not downloading
19:23:00  <Ammler> and we had it off
19:23:30  <Ammler> that was why we paused sometimes manually
19:23:41  <planetmaker> I'm sure games always paused for players joining.
19:23:53  <planetmaker> sometimes we held the game additionally to allow more time
19:25:03  <PublicServer> <V453000> shouldnt the combo and exit be reversed osai?
19:25:04  <Ammler> planetmaker: but it was useless and almost not noticeable
19:25:09  <PublicServer> <0sai> where?
19:25:16  <Ammler> now it does pause while downloading too
19:25:24  <PublicServer> <V453000> there
19:25:25  <PublicServer> <0sai> no?
19:25:27  <PublicServer> <0sai> why?
19:25:38  <PublicServer> <0sai> :P
19:25:54  <PublicServer> <V453000> well ...
19:26:02  <PublicServer> <V453000> why is the combo there then?
19:26:10  *** LittleBoyRick has joined #openttdcoop
19:26:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> when the signal ends ant the first exit
19:26:26  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
19:26:31  <LittleBoyRick> !password
19:26:32  <PublicServer> LittleBoyRick: looted
19:26:42  <PublicServer> *** LittleBoyRick joined the game
19:26:42  <PublicServer> <0sai> I didn't zodate
19:26:46  <PublicServer> <0sai> update*
19:26:47  <PublicServer> <0sai> sorry
19:26:50  <PublicServer> <V453000> :)
19:26:58  <PublicServer> <0sai> but the prio is too short anyway
19:27:00  <sparr> I wish there was a "junctionary" of optimal small junctions.  Like station entrances for a particular size/flow, escape depot placement for different station widths/lengths, etc.
19:27:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
19:27:15  <planetmaker> sparr, then contribute to that
19:27:36  <sparr> planetmaker: I would, but I don't have the time to implement the system to contribute to
19:27:50  <planetmaker> ...
19:27:54  <Ammler> time is no excuse, never
19:27:57  <Osai> implement what system?
19:28:00  <PublicServer> <V453000> Osai: lets make a new SML moved to the right
19:28:06  <planetmaker> but sufficient time to complain over and over about zillion of things...
19:28:10  <PublicServer> <V453000> then demolish the old one
19:28:21  <sparr> Osai: a system for cataloging said designs
19:28:30  <Osai> !juntionary
19:28:35  <Osai> !junctionary
19:28:35  <PublicServer> Osai:
19:28:41  <planetmaker> ^ there you go
19:28:50  <PublicServer> <V453000> sparr: such a catalogue is actually PS Archive
19:29:06  <PublicServer> <0sai> actually
19:29:11  <sparr> V453000: I mean for very small things, in a way that they are easy enough to reuse.
19:29:16  <PublicServer> <0sai> this isn't real SML
19:29:21  <PublicServer> <0sai> we have to o few trains
19:29:25  <sparr> I am familiar with the Junctionary...  does anyone here actually copy designs from it?
19:29:33  <PublicServer> <V453000> Osai: true
19:29:42  <PublicServer> <V453000> no
19:29:55  <planetmaker> copy ideas: yes. Copy tile by tile: no
19:29:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> junctionary is quite oldschool if I remember well
19:30:08  <sparr> V453000: that too
19:30:15  <Osai> yes
19:30:17  <Osai> it was my idea
19:30:20  <Osai> long time ago
19:30:20  <planetmaker> yes... but it can only be up2date and new school, if it receives contributions.
19:30:21  <sparr> planetmaker: I am thinking of things to be copied tile by tile.  much smaller than hubs.
19:31:10  <sparr> planetmaker: I spent like two hours yesterday trying to design an optimal station entrance with one or two escape depots for TL12.  I probably never even came close.
19:31:12  <planetmaker> well... if you have a proper name for that (other than a t-split :-P)
19:31:40  <sparr> if I DID get it right, I'd like to share it.  if someone else had gotten it right before, I'd like to copy it.
19:31:41  <planetmaker> I'm sure there's sufficient space for extensions in the junctionary.
19:31:57  <Osai> this is my favourite:
19:31:59  <Osai> hahaha
19:32:03  <Osai> e1ko I miss you :D
19:32:04  <PublicServer> *** planetm4ker joined the game
19:32:05  <planetmaker> but a copy 1:1 in 99.5% of the cases is... not going to work
19:32:13  <PublicServer> <planetm4ker> hi
19:32:19  <PublicServer> <0sai> hey pm
19:32:26  <PublicServer> <0sai> check SLH C 01
19:32:31  <PublicServer> <0sai> I added save joiners
19:32:36  <PublicServer> <0sai> but the prio is too short
19:32:37  <planetmaker> ah... 2560x1024 :-)
19:33:12  <sparr> planetmaker: I disagree.  for a TL3 4-platform station there are probably only a handful of optimal entrances and exits, depending on train speed and incoming/outgoing track direction.
19:33:19  <Ammler> Osai: this was indeed a very nice hub, specially for that time
19:33:31  <sparr> planetmaker: but screwing up those designs by even one tile could cut station throughput by 5, 10, 20%
19:34:05  <sparr> or increase station size by a larger factor (that is, it's pretty easy to design an efficient station if you can use as much land as you want)
19:34:46  <hylje> if you have as much land as you want, you don't *need* an efficient station
19:34:52  <sparr> hylje: of course
19:35:22  <sparr> hylje: the point here being that you usually don't have that much land, so being able to go grab the "right" design to fit your available space is both faster and more effective than spending however long on trial and error in-game
19:35:35  <hylje> but what's the fun in that?
19:35:37  <sparr> and that's even ignoring the issue of network interruption while you do the trial and error
19:36:07  <PublicServer> *** planetm4ker has left the game (leaving)
19:36:19  <planetmaker> hm... not the game for this machine anymore.
19:36:22  <sparr> the "fun" is that it lets people spend more time on whichever part they find fun.  if you like designing station entrances, keep doing that, and know that more people will use your good designs.  if you DONT like designing station entrances, then use pre-designed ones and spent more time on large scale stuff
19:37:00  <sparr> I'm going to start compiling the copy/paste patch into my binaries
19:40:22  <PublicServer> <0sai> whoever built in east of SLH C 01
19:40:25  <PublicServer> <0sai> that looks good
19:40:28  <PublicServer> <V453000> me
19:40:43  <PublicServer> <0sai> I like the double shift
19:40:57  <PublicServer> <0sai> but I think
19:41:00  <PublicServer> <0sai> it can be even small
19:41:02  <PublicServer> <0sai> smaller
19:41:06  <PublicServer> <V453000> thats possible
19:41:11  <PublicServer> <V453000> but there is no penalty here
19:41:22  <PublicServer> <V453000> DAMN
19:41:23  <PublicServer> <V453000> true
19:41:25  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah
19:41:27  <PublicServer> <V453000> that could be so
19:41:32  <PublicServer> <0sai> I think
19:41:38  <PublicServer> <0sai> they don't effect each other
19:41:42  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
19:41:44  <PublicServer> <V453000> they dont
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19:42:17  <PublicServer> <V453000> then we will have to make a station-penalty
19:42:38  <PublicServer> <0sai> because of EOL
19:42:43  <PublicServer> <0sai> ?
19:42:52  <PublicServer> <V453000> because PBS wont fit
19:42:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh it would
19:43:00  <PublicServer> <V453000> mh
19:43:07  <PublicServer> <V453000> ok, nevermind
19:43:08  <PublicServer> <0sai> it works in my example
19:43:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> this should do
19:44:11  <PublicServer> <0sai> if it accepts the double-signal
19:44:17  <PublicServer> <0sai> because they are EOL
19:44:28  <PublicServer> <V453000> what does mean EOL?
19:44:29  <PublicServer> <0sai> means, the pathfinder doesn't look ahead
19:44:32  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh
19:44:34  <PublicServer> <0sai> end of line
19:44:40  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah
19:44:48  <PublicServer> <V453000> hmmm
19:44:52  <PublicServer> <0sai> I think
19:45:01  <PublicServer> <0sai> we are lucky in the SMl example
19:45:07  <PublicServer> <0sai> at SLH C 01
19:45:10  <PublicServer> <0sai> because its CCW
19:45:39  <PublicServer> <V453000> that matters somehow?
19:45:54  <PublicServer> <0sai> maybe
19:45:59  <PublicServer> <0sai> the inner way is the shorter one
19:46:13  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh you mean like this
19:46:14  <PublicServer> <0sai> but even that shouldn't count after EOL
19:46:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> ok
19:47:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> shouldnt it be Fail-SaFe?
19:48:03  <PublicServer> <0sai> OMG
19:48:13  <PublicServer> <0sai> again
19:48:13  <PublicServer> <V453000> ;)
19:48:24  <PublicServer> <0sai> I already changed the complete blog post
19:48:33  <PublicServer> <0sai> and I still do it wrong
19:48:34  <PublicServer> <V453000> but the headline ;)
19:49:08  <PublicServer> <0sai> and the headline (now) too
19:49:11  <PublicServer> <0sai> :D
19:49:15  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah :)
19:49:40  <PublicServer> <V453000> ok I think this should work
19:49:42  <PublicServer> <V453000> what now
19:50:10  <PublicServer> <0sai> I don't know :P
19:50:23  <PublicServer> <0sai> add it to the wiki
19:50:31  <PublicServer> <0sai> the SML article needs an update
19:50:32  <PublicServer> <0sai> ^^
19:50:44  <PublicServer> <0sai> or page
19:50:59  <Osai> @wiki SML
19:51:02  <Webster> Shift Mainlines - #openttdcoop Wiki -
19:51:26  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah that does
19:52:11  <V453000> shall I do some updating?
19:52:42  <PublicServer> <LittleBoyRick> hmmmm... copper ore drop station reaching point of jamming from time to time.
19:53:28  <Osai> V453000: that would be great!
19:54:01  <V453000> okay lets get to work then :)
19:54:06  <LittleBoyRick> ow... nice artical btw Osai :D
19:54:10  <Webster> Latest update from blog: Fail-Safe Joiners, Priorities and the Cyclotron example <>
19:54:16  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
19:54:25  <Osai> oh
19:54:28  <V453000> bah
19:54:29  <V453000> :)
19:54:30  <Osai> I have to update the slug
19:54:33  <Osai> grrr
19:54:36  <Osai> now (too)
19:54:56  <V453000> :D
19:55:12  <PublicServer> *** LittleBoyRick has joined company #1
19:56:13  <Osai> and delete this:
19:56:14  <Osai> :D
19:56:33  <PublicServer> <LittleBoyRick> ah... combo signal instead of exit signal.
19:57:26  <Techinica> !password
19:57:26  <PublicServer> Techinica: jambed
19:57:41  <PublicServer> *** Techinica joined the game
19:59:38  <Osai> V453000: one thing is bad right now
19:59:48  <Osai> at Fail-SaFFFFe SML
20:00:05  <Osai> a shifting train activates the prio
20:00:23  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
20:00:29  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh
20:00:32  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes it does
20:00:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> it will have to be the two tiles longer as was the first version then
20:01:00  <PublicServer> <0sai> should be long enough
20:01:09  <PublicServer> <V453000> 9
20:01:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> should do fine
20:01:30  <PublicServer> <0sai> do we have a formulat for the length of a PRIO line?
20:01:46  <PublicServer> <V453000> depends on the situation
20:01:49  <Osai> ^ KenjiE20
20:01:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> but here it should be something different
20:02:06  <PublicServer> <V453000> we dont need a proper prio
20:02:13  <PublicServer> <V453000> as the train doesnt accelerate
20:02:18  <Osai> well, Prio only guarantees a certain gap
20:02:20  <KenjiE20> Osai: (TL*2)+2 iirc
20:02:44  <PublicServer> <V453000> I think here should be 9 enough
20:02:54  <PublicServer> <V453000> anywhere else TL + 4
20:02:56  <Osai> isn't the minimum TL + (2 * Signal Gap)?
20:03:13  <KenjiE20> obv. you adjust that for just how much prio you actually want to give
20:03:32  <KenjiE20> iirc it's TL*2 because of acceleration
20:03:46  <PublicServer> <V453000> which we dont need here
20:03:47  <KenjiE20> so obvously the multiplier is newgrf dependant
20:03:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> exactly
20:04:08  <Osai> but thats not important for fail-safe join
20:04:13  <PublicServer> <V453000> yea
20:04:17  <Osai> trains are always at max speed
20:04:36  <KenjiE20> then all you need is a gap big enough + 1 signal block
20:04:55  <Osai> unless the engine driver is sleeping
20:04:59  <V453000> :D
20:05:07  <V453000> nice condition
20:07:56  <V453000> anyways ... I say 9 is fine here ... if you look at 7, it needs just a little bit to get alright ... 8 would work too but well ... it cou
20:08:01  <V453000> ld mess up the signalling
20:08:33  <PublicServer> <jondisti> hmh my openttd has never worked this slow
20:09:14  <Webster> Latest update from blog: Fail-Safe Joiners, Priorities and the Cyclotron example <>
20:09:40  <Ammler> oh, fixed title :-)
20:09:48  <V453000> :D
20:18:02  <Osai> title and slug!!
20:18:22  <KenjiE20> I was gonna mention that
20:18:53  <hylje> slug
20:18:54  <hylje> !
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20:33:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> wow Osai, I realized one more quite big problem :D the prio has to not-include twoway combo signal in the end as it detects the exit antiblock
20:33:35  <Osai> oh
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20:33:49  <PublicServer> <0sai> you here?
20:33:55  <PublicServer> <V453000> which doesnt actually change anything
20:33:56  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah
20:33:58  <PublicServer> <V453000> here
20:34:31  <Osai> !trains
20:34:31  <PublicServer> Osai: !trains <integer>: set value of max_trains
20:34:40  <Osai> !patch max_trains
20:34:46  <Osai> !rcon patch max_trains
20:34:46  <PublicServer> Osai: Current value for 'max_trains' is: '777' (min: 0, max: 5000)
20:34:52  <Osai> !rcon patch max_trains 800
20:34:56  <Osai> !rcon patch max_trains
20:34:56  <PublicServer> Osai: Current value for 'max_trains' is: '800' (min: 0, max: 5000)
20:34:56  <KenjiE20> set. set max_trains
20:36:02  <PublicServer> <V453000> if it was combo then it would go wrong
20:36:14  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has joined spectators
20:36:21  <PublicServer> <0sai> yeah
20:36:36  <PublicServer> <0sai> but it would fail
20:36:37  <PublicServer> <V453000> helps?
20:37:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> why that
20:37:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> one way only
20:37:27  <PublicServer> <V453000> if two way then it would detect it anyways
20:37:42  <PublicServer> <V453000> lets say there is another train in front of the one passing
20:37:47  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
20:37:50  <PublicServer> <0sai> then it fails agai
20:37:51  <PublicServer> <0sai> n
20:38:03  <PublicServer> <V453000> this works
20:38:10  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
20:38:24  <V453000> there is only one more problem
20:38:42  <V453000> as the trains just pass-by, there might stay some spaces between them
20:38:45  <PublicServer> <0sai> if you need a longer one
20:38:49  <V453000> so the shifting isnt perfect
20:39:13  <PublicServer> <V453000> but that detects the shifting train again
20:39:43  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
20:39:48  <PublicServer> <0sai> its only an example
20:39:54  <PublicServer> <V453000> of course :)
20:40:06  <PublicServer> <0sai> so you can use longer prio again
20:40:15  <PublicServer> <V453000> 9 is fine imo here
20:40:19  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
20:40:26  <PublicServer> <0sai> just a solution for the problem
20:40:31  <PublicServer> <0sai> you mentioned before
20:41:08  <PublicServer> <0sai> okay
20:41:13  <PublicServer> <0sai> now the 2nd thing again
20:41:30  <PublicServer> <0sai> where might stay space?
20:41:35  <PublicServer> *** LittleBoyRick has left the game (leaving)
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20:42:08  <PublicServer> <V453000> if you launch two trains on two lines at about the same time
20:42:44  <PublicServer> <V453000> there could be a space after the one where the other one should shift
20:43:01  <PublicServer> <V453000> until one of them leaves the ML
20:43:05  <PublicServer> <V453000> it will stay in that state
20:43:28  <PublicServer> <V453000> but I am not sure about that in mass effect
20:43:47  <PublicServer> <0sai> hmmm
20:43:54  <PublicServer> <0sai> can you make an example
20:44:05  <PublicServer> <V453000> I will try to
20:44:29  <V453000> I will probably send you a screenshot instead
20:44:37  <PublicServer> <0sai> okay
20:44:38  <V453000> as it is best described on a paused situation
20:44:45  <PublicServer> <0sai>
20:45:47  <Ammler> or
20:46:04  <V453000> will use the mail ;)
20:50:48  <KenjiE20> img. would be less effort
20:51:05  <KenjiE20> click -> browse -> click -> ^C -> ^V
20:51:07  <Osai> haha, you guys just want to see it too
20:51:26  <Osai> I bet he'll send me some naked girls
20:51:31  <Osai> so he can't post it
20:51:39  <KenjiE20> haha
20:52:11  <V453000> :D
20:53:15  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
20:53:28  <V453000> ok there it goes
20:53:56  <V453000> !password
20:53:57  <PublicServer> V453000: rumped
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20:55:15  <Osai> okay
20:55:24  <Osai> but isn't that a problem in general
20:55:25  <Osai> ?
20:55:57  <Osai> Mark suggested this
20:56:31  <V453000> well ... no
20:56:51  <V453000> that is a SML join where you are filling the gaps of the joined line only
20:57:04  <V453000> the gap I showed you is in the middle
20:57:21  <V453000> and we can not eliminate it
20:57:38  <V453000> since none of those unable-to-join trains are going to slow
20:57:43  <Osai> yes
20:58:07  <Osai> but its still a general problem of sml, isn't it?
20:58:13  <V453000> not really
20:58:24  <V453000> if the trains stop and wait for the gap
20:58:29  <V453000> it will be eliminated
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20:58:38  <V453000> these here ont
20:58:42  <V453000> *dont
20:58:56  <Osai> yes
20:59:00  *** Yexo is now known as Guest2017
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20:59:09  <Osai> but if two trains are parallel
20:59:32  <Osai> the other one will never join
20:59:37  <Osai> the same track
20:59:45  <V453000> it will
20:59:48  <V453000> it it stops
20:59:59  <V453000> it can wait for free space on that track
21:00:04  <V453000> normally...
21:00:48  <Osai> silly
21:00:53  <Osai> I know what you mean
21:01:21  * Osai thinks
21:01:35  <V453000> we could combine them
21:01:54  <V453000> but it would make it really big
21:02:01  <V453000> if we made this
21:02:19  <V453000> and after each shift add a wait-for-gap-shift
21:02:29  <V453000> with accelerated prio
21:02:42  <Osai> then I'd prefer a forced shift with pre-acceleration
21:02:58  <Osai> e.g. with a logic system
21:03:02  * Osai got an idea
21:03:07  <Osai> we need a gap-detector
21:03:23  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah, maybe
21:04:48  <PublicServer> <V453000> this is going to be wild
21:05:24  *** Guest2017 has quit IRC
21:06:51  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah
21:07:15  <PublicServer> <0sai> grr
21:07:42  *** PeterT has joined #openttdcoop
21:10:58  <Mark> evening
21:11:04  <PublicServer> <V453000> wait, shouldnt the other one be blocked?
21:11:07  <PublicServer> <V453000> Hi Mark
21:11:13  <Phazorx> isnt a NOT prio zone = gap detector?
21:11:22  <Mark> !password
21:11:22  <PublicServer> Mark: dabble
21:11:30  <Osai> Phazorx: yes
21:11:39  <PublicServer> *** Mark joined the game
21:11:41  <Osai> I recognized that right now too
21:11:42  <Osai> :D
21:11:44  <Osai> its super easy
21:12:21  <Mark> PeterT: are you here?
21:12:25  <PeterT> yes?
21:12:40  <Mark> i'm aware .dat and .sav are the same, i just uploaded both for people that aren't
21:12:43  <Osai> its a bit more tricky
21:12:51  <PeterT> that's YOU?
21:12:53  <PublicServer> <V453000> OH yeah now I get it :D I thought you are going to NOT-GATE block the "this" line
21:13:01  <Mark> yes
21:13:31  <PeterT> I had this person under my friends list:
21:13:33  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • Viewing profile - Mark (at
21:13:49  <Mark> yeah, Mark was taken
21:14:08  <Mark> i just added my birth day when i made that account some years ago
21:14:47  *** AdTheRat has quit IRC
21:14:53  <PublicServer> <V453000> Osai: shouldnt it be ok without the not gate?
21:15:09  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh wait
21:15:10  <PublicServer> <V453000> hmmm
21:15:14  <PublicServer> <0sai> nope
21:15:17  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah, nope
21:15:23  <PublicServer> <0sai> its has to green in two cases
21:15:48  <PublicServer> <V453000> as the forced shift this would be ok though
21:15:59  <PublicServer> <Mark> what's with the fail safe SML?
21:16:11  <PublicServer> <V453000> we are trying to improve it
21:16:28  <PublicServer> <Mark> did you see the pic i added in my comment to Osai's post?
21:16:28  <PublicServer> <0sai> time for some chocolate
21:16:34  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
21:16:37  <PublicServer> <0sai> nice ones
21:16:39  <PublicServer> <Mark> what's wrong with that? :P
21:16:46  <PublicServer> <0sai> nothing
21:16:52  <PublicServer> <0sai> despite of my typo
21:16:56  <PublicServer> <0sai> fail-saVVVVe
21:16:59  <PublicServer> <Mark> heh
21:17:06  <PublicServer> <Mark> and i copied your typo, assuming you'd know
21:17:17  <PublicServer> <0sai> it was very late last night
21:17:24  <PublicServer> <0sai> I mixed the f and v so often
21:17:35  <PublicServer> <0sai> but I wanted to complete the article
21:17:44  <PublicServer> <0sai> because I knew you else would get nervous
21:17:47  <Phazorx> f/v mix is common for german speaking population
21:17:48  <PublicServer> <Mark> hehe
21:17:56  <Phazorx> i guess dutch is close enough
21:18:13  <PublicServer> <0sai> Phazorx, normally it doesn't happen to me :((
21:18:23  <PublicServer> <0sai> I know the cases... live, life, save, safe and so on
21:19:00  <Phazorx> i'm sure you know... but if brain starts failing due to stress/tireness/booziness these are first things that show up
21:19:17  <PublicServer> <V453000> :D yeah
21:19:18  <PublicServer> <0sai> okay... point for you :D
21:19:27  <PublicServer> <0sai> or is it vor?
21:19:34  <PublicServer> <0sai> :D
21:19:45  <PublicServer> <V453000> booziness is nice expression for being brutally drunk :D
21:20:01  <PublicServer> <Mark> 0sai: fur, of course
21:20:11  <PublicServer> <0sai> i like drowsiness
21:20:49  <PublicServer> <V453000> whoever asks: doubling the tunnels
21:20:59  <PublicServer> <Mark> .. :P
21:21:08  <PublicServer> <Mark> why the heck double the tunnels?
21:21:15  <PublicServer> <V453000> isnt it ML?
21:21:29  <PublicServer> <0sai> 1:0 Mark
21:21:30  <PublicServer> <Mark> seems much easier
21:21:32  <PublicServer> <0sai> ^^
21:21:36  <PublicServer> <V453000> hell :-D
21:21:44  <PublicServer> <0sai> I just did it to have some space
21:21:52  <PublicServer> <V453000> okay :)
21:21:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> well...
21:22:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> why not to switch the lines with the prio
21:22:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> as we would evade the bridge
21:22:29  <PublicServer> <V453000> these <->
21:22:32  <PublicServer> <0sai> okay
21:22:40  <PublicServer> <0sai> but its not important right now
21:22:44  <PublicServer> <V453000> no it isnt
21:22:48  <PublicServer> <0sai> because its not working yet
21:22:52  <PublicServer> <V453000> it just makes it more compact ;)
21:22:53  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
21:22:55  <PublicServer> <Mark> you can compress it when it works :P
21:22:56  <PublicServer> <0sai> I might change it several times
21:22:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> :)
21:23:08  <PublicServer> <0sai> I am still thinking about some issues
21:23:15  <PublicServer> <0sai> I want to detect a gap
21:23:38  <PublicServer> <V453000> but to keep trains getting in even if there isnt gap
21:23:45  <PublicServer> <0sai> and then I want a prior train to join by delay
21:24:02  <PublicServer> <V453000> hey
21:24:07  <PublicServer> <V453000> what about to block the other line
21:24:14  <PublicServer> <V453000> as I signed with "this"
21:24:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> it would keep the trains shifting
21:24:29  <PublicServer> <V453000> it would only force them when there is a gap
21:24:46  <PublicServer> <Mark> perhaps you could detect if there is NO gap instead of a gap
21:24:52  <PublicServer> <Mark> whatever you're trying to do
21:25:03  <PublicServer> <V453000> also
21:25:09  <PublicServer> <0sai> hrrrm
21:25:16  <PublicServer> <0sai> ??
21:25:19  <PublicServer> <Mark> no gap = block, instead of gap = no block
21:25:32  <PublicServer> <Mark> whats that?
21:25:41  <PublicServer> <0sai> an email address
21:25:49  <PublicServer> <0sai> name@host.tld
21:25:57  <PublicServer> <Mark> yeah i figured :P
21:26:00  <PublicServer> <Mark> what's with it?
21:26:11  <PublicServer> <0sai> you answered the question
21:26:16  <PublicServer> <0sai> NO, you don't use it
21:26:24  <PublicServer> <Mark> nope
21:26:26  <PublicServer> <0sai> else you would'Ve know
21:26:29  <PublicServer> <0sai> n
21:26:33  <KenjiE20> Osai: the tag on your article is still fail-save
21:26:39  <PublicServer> <0sai> AAAAAH
21:26:46  <PublicServer> <0sai> driFFE me nuts
21:26:47  <PublicServer> <V453000> :D
21:28:09  <Osai> updated (now) too
21:28:21  <PublicServer> <Mark> 0sai: do you want to email me something..?
21:28:24  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
21:28:25  <PublicServer> <0sai> :D
21:28:40  <Techinica> !password
21:28:40  <PublicServer> Techinica: fisher
21:28:55  <PublicServer> *** Techinica joined the game
21:29:08  <PublicServer> <Mark> 0sai: you got a pm :P
21:29:40  <Osai> now you highlighted planetmaker
21:29:59  <KenjiE20> and again :)
21:31:13  <planetmaker> pfft
21:33:40  *** StarLite has joined #openttdcoop
21:33:40  *** ChanServ sets mode: +o StarLite
21:34:26  <PublicServer> <Mark> i see the problem now, just a case of unlucky timing isn't it?
21:34:31  <PublicServer> <0sai> yes
21:34:47  <PublicServer> <0sai> but with some delayed and forced shifts we can handle it
21:35:07  <PublicServer> <Mark> it might be able to shift at the next shift, if one of the lanes dodges an industries or makes a somewhat longer curve or something
21:35:18  <PublicServer> <0sai> yea
21:35:30  <V453000> Mark: it isnt that unlucky case
21:35:52  <PublicServer> <0sai> I could happen quite often if the network is really stressed
21:35:57  <V453000> yeah
21:36:38  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has joined company #1
21:36:40  <PublicServer> <0sai> errrm
21:36:43  <PublicServer> <0sai> thats bullshit
21:36:56  <V453000> what?
21:36:59  <PublicServer> <0sai> a prio always is a gapdetector
21:37:06  <PublicServer> <0sai> no gates or whatelse
21:37:16  <PublicServer> <Mark> :D
21:37:18  <PublicServer> <0sai> now I got it
21:37:34  <PublicServer> <Mark> uh oh, he's got it
21:37:54  <PublicServer> <V453000> * watching most interested what is going to come
21:38:14  <PublicServer> *** ```` joined the game
21:38:20  <Osai> !save
21:38:20  <PublicServer> Saving game...
21:38:21  <PublicServer> Game saved
21:38:21  <PublicServer> *** ```` has changed his/her name to Phoenix_the_II
21:38:28  <PublicServer> <0sai> ah, okay
21:38:30  <PublicServer> <0sai> :>
21:38:35  <PublicServer> <0sai> hi Phoenix_the_II
21:38:36  <PublicServer> <Mark> 0sai: lol, my first thought too
21:38:37  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II>
21:38:40  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> me
21:38:46  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> meow :D
21:39:37  <PublicServer> <Mark> you could ALWAYS shift, and push trains of the ML if needed, put those in a buffer and rejoin
21:39:42  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has left the game (leaving)
21:39:56  <jondisti> !password
21:39:56  <PublicServer> jondisti: taxing
21:40:00  <PublicServer> <Mark> not sure if you'd get any benefit but it'd sure look cool
21:40:04  <PublicServer> *** jondisti joined the game
21:40:06  <PublicServer> <V453000> :D
21:40:28  <PublicServer> <Mark> reversed SML so to say
21:40:54  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> how the hell does tudingworth transfer work :o?
21:41:04  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> i mean, it's like stalled on red lights
21:41:19  <PublicServer> <Mark> wait untill the dummies load
21:41:30  <PublicServer> <Techinica> with magic :P
21:41:32  <PublicServer> <Mark> one is full the other is at 90%, should be soon enough
21:41:37  <PublicServer> <Mark> there
21:42:05  <PublicServer> <Techinica> hmm...
21:42:09  <PublicServer> <0sai> fail..?
21:42:16  <PublicServer> <Mark> indeed it failed
21:42:17  <PublicServer> <Techinica> apparently...
21:42:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> something really weird there
21:42:24  <PublicServer> <Techinica> yeah
21:42:35  <PublicServer> <Techinica> haven't seen it do that before.
21:42:51  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> i maybe pushed the reverse button there
21:42:59  <Mark> @calc 1462*2/12
21:42:59  <Webster> Mark: 243.666666667
21:43:02  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> clickered wrong :O
21:43:05  <PublicServer> <Techinica> yeah, that would have done it :P
21:43:28  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> but uhm
21:43:34  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> whats the point of it really?
21:43:52  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> higher % on rating?
21:43:52  <PublicServer> <V453000> do you know what SRNW is about?
21:43:54  <PublicServer> <0sai> Phoenix_the_II: the trains don't have real orders
21:43:57  <PublicServer> <Mark> it allows trains only to enther if there's a full load
21:44:03  <PublicServer> <Techinica> load trains only enter when theres a full load for it.
21:44:15  <PublicServer> <Mark> now it works
21:44:21  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
21:44:22  <PublicServer> <V453000> magic
21:44:28  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> right :o
21:44:39  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> but only if full load...
21:44:41  <PublicServer> <Techinica> those two long dummy trains contain have enough maize hoppers for 12 standard size trains
21:45:02  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> but does it add profit somewhere?
21:45:09  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> or just fancy looking?
21:45:11  <PublicServer> <Mark> no need for setting up orders
21:45:23  <PublicServer> <Techinica> the trains don't have orders for any particular station
21:45:25  <PublicServer> <Mark> all trains for that sideline have the same orders
21:45:35  <PublicServer> <Techinica> it means they can go to any station on the sideline and collect a load
21:45:40  <PublicServer> <Mark> you don't have to add/remove trains if an industry increases production
21:45:51  <PublicServer> <0sai> hmm
21:45:54  <PublicServer> <0sai> that could do it
21:46:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> HEY :D that is the first idea I was saying :D
21:46:24  <PublicServer> <0sai> yea
21:46:29  <PublicServer> <V453000> .)
21:46:32  <PublicServer> <0sai> anything more complex is just fancy
21:46:37  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
21:46:38  <PublicServer> <0sai> but not really effective
21:46:45  <PublicServer> <0sai> now I want to update my logic gate
21:47:07  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> so trains just wander aimlessly around? :p
21:47:10  <PublicServer> <Techinica> like my 12 platform adaptation V?
21:47:23  <PublicServer> <Techinica> the packer sucks I know :P
21:47:24  <PublicServer> <Sietse> Mark, you like the result of the network plan?
21:47:34  <PublicServer> <V453000> Techinica: there is nothing to hate ;)
21:47:35  <PublicServer> <Mark> yep
21:47:44  <PublicServer> <Mark> bit unbalanced but quality is fine
21:47:51  <PublicServer> <Sietse> yes
21:47:55  <PublicServer> <Techinica> anyone with rcon wanna up the vehicle limit?
21:47:58  <PublicServer> <V453000> the plan was good
21:48:05  <Mark> !trains 1200
21:48:05  <PublicServer> *** Mark has set max_trains to 1200
21:48:12  <PublicServer> <V453000> imo we failed as we were lazy to build :)
21:48:20  <PublicServer> <Sietse> looks like the map is full a track where only some parts are heavily loaded
21:48:45  <PublicServer> <Techinica> yeah, laziness killed it...
21:48:48  <PublicServer> <Techinica> maize is barely used..
21:48:50  <PublicServer> <Sietse> full of tracks*
21:48:58  <PublicServer> <V453000> it does kill many games lately
21:49:01  <PublicServer> <V453000> :(
21:49:41  <PublicServer> <0sai> I think its the wrong climate for this plan :(
21:49:49  <PublicServer> <V453000> does that matter?
21:49:51  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh
21:49:56  <PublicServer> <V453000> yeah
21:50:01  <PublicServer> <Mark> but it's my last game and i really wanted it :P
21:50:07  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh
21:50:16  <PublicServer> <V453000> completely forgot :(
21:50:18  <PublicServer> <Mark> it's the wrong cilmate indeed
21:50:27  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
21:50:32  <PublicServer> <V453000> temperate would rock it
21:50:35  <PublicServer> <Techinica> now everyone will have to play my shit plans :P
21:50:43  <PublicServer> <0sai> but it fits quite well to australia
21:50:44  <Phazorx> hmm... have we ever had point-to-point games?
21:50:47  <PublicServer> <Sietse> your last game?
21:51:00  <PublicServer> <V453000> Osai: yeah :D
21:51:00  <Phazorx> last while being in .eu i hope
21:51:04  <PublicServer> <Phoenix_the_II> So, how often do you make a mountain map for scenery game?
21:51:09  <PublicServer> <Techinica> Mark's 'un-plugging'
21:51:12  <PublicServer> <Techinica> lol ;)
21:51:13  <PublicServer> <Mark> yeah, i'm going to bounce around the world for a while in a week :P
21:51:13  <Phazorx> .au should offer yo internet and hopefully some time to play as well
21:51:16  <PublicServer> <Sietse> moving away?
21:51:28  <PublicServer> <Sietse> backpacking?
21:51:31  <PublicServer> <Mark> yep
21:51:34  <PublicServer> <Sietse> nice!!
21:51:43  <PublicServer> <Sietse> any idea for how long?
21:51:47  <PublicServer> <Mark> first to oz, then to new zealand probobly, perhaps asia after that
21:52:02  <PublicServer> <Mark> probably between 6 months and 2 yeas, could be longer or shorter, though
21:52:03  <Phoenix_the_II> So, how often do you make a mountain map for scenery game? Wouldnt that be some other challange than a grid network? :P
21:52:22  <Phazorx> Phoenix_the_II:  i was leaning towards that too with p2p idea
21:52:25  <Phoenix_the_II> curves instead of straightened lines
21:52:27  <PublicServer> <Techinica> About three games ago was pretty mountainous
21:52:32  <PublicServer> <V453000> Phoenix the II : check the Public server archive to see for yourself
21:52:36  <PublicServer> <Mark> we have quite a few mountain games
21:52:41  <PublicServer> <Sietse> that's really long
21:52:43  <PublicServer> <Mark> pretty much any map i provide is :P
21:52:46  <Phoenix_the_II> :P
21:52:54  <PublicServer> <Sietse> adventurous :)
21:53:01  <PublicServer> <V453000> mountainous maps also end up quite well in general
21:53:01  <PublicServer> <Mark> yeah, can't wait
21:53:47  <Mark> 160 was a pretty decent mountain game
21:54:01  <V453000> that was awesome
21:54:17  <Phoenix_the_II> :P
21:54:48  <Phoenix_the_II> would love to do a pax mountain game
21:54:49  <Phoenix_the_II> =P
21:55:04  <V453000> it doesnt really matter if it is mountainous or not
21:55:29  <Phoenix_the_II> maybe we can up it to 1024x1024?
21:55:31  <Phoenix_the_II> =)
21:55:39  <PublicServer> <V453000> :/
21:56:07  <Phoenix_the_II> 453000 cant run that huge or?
21:56:08  <PublicServer> <Mark> 1024^2 is no fun, client loads get too high before we get a decent number of trains
21:56:13  <PublicServer> <Mark> especially with pax
21:56:20  <Phoenix_the_II> meh :p
21:56:44  <PublicServer> <V453000> and we will have real trouble with finishing imo ... we are not even using full potential of this map
21:56:48  <PublicServer> <V453000> lazy lazy lazy :)
21:56:51  <PublicServer> *** Phoenix_the_II has left the game (leaving)
21:57:03  <Phoenix_the_II> you know
21:57:13  <PublicServer> <jondisti> it's too laggy for me to build anything more
21:57:20  <Phoenix_the_II> does this r18758 ever close properly at your linux build?
21:57:29  <Phoenix_the_II> always have to kill -9 it
21:57:32  <PublicServer> <V453000> plus CPU on 512^2 could also be in hell
21:57:35  <KenjiE20> fine here
21:57:45  <Phoenix_the_II> opengfx + sfx?
21:57:48  <PublicServer> <Mark> it doesn't close properly on ubuntu, does on opensuse
21:57:54  <PublicServer> <Mark> those two i can tell you about :P
21:57:57  <KenjiE20> windows_*
21:58:19  <KenjiE20> Slackware 13.0 here
21:59:10  *** Hyppy has quit IRC
21:59:46  <PublicServer> <V453000> Osai: finished with that SML?
21:59:53  <PublicServer> <V453000> I would again switch the lines
22:00:04  <PublicServer> <0sai> yea
22:00:05  <PublicServer> <V453000> to make the force join prio work
22:00:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> hmmm
22:01:03  <PublicServer> <Mark> anyone knows what's the penalty for waiting for a reserved path to clear?
22:01:16  <PublicServer> <Mark> if there's another valid path
22:03:18  <PublicServer> <Kolo> trains visiting Tudingworth Transfer are generating loses not profits :)
22:03:46  <PublicServer> <V453000> because there is no other station on that SL?
22:06:52  <PublicServer> <0sai> V453000: a tunnel is nicer imho
22:06:58  <PublicServer> <V453000> no space
22:07:18  <PublicServer> <V453000> I am just wondering where, how long and how to put there the prio now
22:07:50  <PublicServer> <0sai> I am not sure whether the spacing for the pre-accelerated joiner is correct or not anyway
22:07:59  <PublicServer> <V453000> yes
22:08:04  <PublicServer> <V453000> depends on trains
22:08:12  <PublicServer> <0sai> make it one tile longer
22:08:40  <PublicServer> <V453000> aye
22:09:09  <PublicServer> <V453000> the problem is the exit twoway
22:09:34  <PublicServer> <V453000> oh not
22:09:57  <PublicServer> <V453000> wait
22:11:06  <PublicServer> <V453000> this stays within 4 tiles
22:11:40  <PublicServer> <0sai> looks good
22:12:12  <PublicServer> *** jondisti has left the game (leaving)
22:12:17  <PublicServer> <V453000> I just converted the very exit of the thing to the L _ _  L
22:12:42  <PublicServer> <V453000> ok
22:12:44  <PublicServer> <V453000> this will work
22:13:29  <Mark> yapf.rail_longer_platform_per_tile_penalty = 0
22:13:39  <Mark> that setting doesn't make too much sense if the default is 0
22:13:58  <Mark> unless you use something else than the default, of course
22:14:42  <PublicServer> *** Mark has left the game (leaving)
22:15:23  *** ODM has quit IRC
22:15:40  <PublicServer> <V453000> cant wait to see it working
22:15:46  *** Roysvork has joined #openttdcoop
22:16:13  <Roysvork> jungle is massive
22:19:26  <Phoenix_the_II> !password
22:19:26  <PublicServer> Phoenix_the_II: deftly
22:19:29  <V453000> you know that song Roy? :D
22:19:39  <PublicServer> *** Phoenix_the_II joined the game
22:19:44  <Roysvork> only in an ironic fashion I'm afraid :)
22:20:08  <Roysvork> !password
22:20:08  <PublicServer> Roysvork: deftly
22:20:08  <Phoenix_the_II> nice
22:20:12  <Phoenix_the_II> fixed my openttd now :D
22:20:15  <Phoenix_the_II> no more 100% cpu
22:20:18  <Phoenix_the_II> but 20% :)
22:20:28  <PublicServer> <V453000> 100% ?
22:20:30  <Roysvork> even at max zoom out?
22:20:38  <PublicServer> <V453000> well ... my openttd loads about 2 minutes
22:20:50  <PublicServer> *** Roysvork joined the game
22:20:55  <Phoenix_the_II> max zoom is about 60-80%
22:21:13  <PublicServer> *** Roysvork has left the game (connection lost)
22:21:23  <PublicServer> <Techinica> 2minutes? god how much extra stuff do you have installed?
22:21:32  <Phoenix_the_II> 2 minutes lol
22:21:32  <PublicServer> <Techinica> mine takes like 4 seconds.
22:21:33  <PublicServer> *** Roysvork joined the game
22:21:33  <PublicServer> <V453000> everything avaiable :D
22:21:38  <Phoenix_the_II> takes at most 5 seconds
22:21:47  <PublicServer> <V453000> all grfs, hell lots of savegames
22:21:59  <Mark> !password
22:21:59  <PublicServer> Mark: deftly
22:22:01  <Phoenix_the_II> go get yourself linux :D
22:22:16  <PublicServer> *** Mark joined the game
22:22:35  <V453000> pffft ... :/
22:22:48  <PublicServer> *** Mark has left the game (connection lost)
22:22:51  <PublicServer> <Roysvork> man that pruntburg regulator hasjammed again
22:22:54  <Mark> DESYNC
22:22:55  <Phoenix_the_II> my windows 7 takes like 10 minutes after power on to be usable.......
22:23:14  <KenjiE20> heh, mine's instant
22:23:21  <PublicServer> <V453000> Mark: I got the same about 4 times today already
22:23:33  <PublicServer> <Roysvork> I have a solid state drive in my work pc, is awesome
22:23:33  <KenjiE20> well 2mins boot
22:23:42  <KenjiE20> but that's all
22:24:10  <Phoenix_the_II> when i have the money
22:24:19  <Phoenix_the_II> ill be using a Raid SSD :)
22:24:23  <Phoenix_the_II> for my OS partition
22:24:34  <Roysvork> lol is that not a bit overkill?
22:24:40  <Phoenix_the_II> no? :D
22:24:41  <Roysvork> they're raided internally anyway :)
22:24:54  <Roysvork> did you see that youtube vid of the guys with the ssd raid array?
22:25:06  <Phoenix_the_II> raid 1 =)
22:25:09  <Phoenix_the_II> no?
22:25:10  <Phoenix_the_II> linky?
22:25:16  <Roysvork> they compared the speed of dropping a dvd out of a window vs deleting the equivilent file on the pc
22:25:26  <Roysvork> hang on let me see if I can find it
22:25:43  <Phoenix_the_II> deleting is instant
22:25:52  <Phazorx> not with SSD
22:25:54  <Roysvork>
22:25:55  <Webster> Title: 24 Solid State Drives in Raid - Hack a Day (at
22:26:06  <planetmaker> deleting time depends on the FS implementation
22:28:02  <Phoenix_the_II> LOL
22:28:26  <Roysvork> That would have been a super fun day at uni eh
22:28:44  <Roysvork> the defrag thing is stupid though
22:28:46  <Phoenix_the_II> 2000mb/sec
22:28:49  <Phoenix_the_II> hallleeeelujah!
22:28:51  <Roysvork> you don't defrag ssd as it kills the drive
22:29:55  <KenjiE20> ^
22:30:27  <Roysvork> so you gonna make something like that then eh? :)
22:30:31  <Phoenix_the_II> LOL
22:30:34  <Phoenix_the_II> DEFRAG
22:30:38  <Phoenix_the_II> morons
22:30:39  <Phoenix_the_II> lol
22:30:58  <Phazorx> with SSD deleting is kinda funky regardless of what FS is
22:31:08  <PublicServer> <Techinica> bah defrag, use a real file-system...
22:31:09  <Roysvork> I actually bought that ssd with my own money for my work pc
22:31:12  <PublicServer> *** Kolo has left the game (leaving)
22:31:20  <Phazorx> the controller has internal mapping of how information is arrnged
22:31:22  <Roysvork> haha, linux boff over there :)
22:31:33  <Phazorx> due to the fact that it can only write in full blocks
22:31:43  <Roysvork> makes me ashamed to be a MS coder really
22:31:50  <PublicServer> <Techinica> cant argue with the facts really :P
22:32:16  <PublicServer> <Techinica> waiting for my new N900 to arrive... ought to be fun to code  a few things for it :)
22:32:23  <Phazorx> so if deleting frees some blocks partially, controller has to move some information around in order to regain capacity
22:32:28  <Roysvork> Does the openttd codebase use .net at all or is it just plain old c++?
22:32:56  <PublicServer> <Techinica> Everything I've ever read indicates C++, don't take my word for it though.
22:33:23  <Phazorx> Roysvork: the game is SDL based, so it wont benefot from another framework
22:33:30  <Roysvork> ahhh ok
22:33:31  <Phazorx> especialy since it uses complety customized gui elements
22:33:42  <Roysvork> I've been thinking about taking a look at the code
22:33:44  <Phazorx> which to be honest are more efficient than standard windows anyway
22:33:57  <Roysvork> but not sure if I'd have much to contribute
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22:34:11  <Roysvork> I do have some pretty mean refactoring skills though
22:34:32  <Phazorx> refactoring?
22:34:57  <Roysvork> yeah, taking existing code and making it more easily maintainable, while reatining the existing functionality
22:35:00  <Roysvork> in a nutshell anyway
22:35:41  <Roysvork> encapsulating, abstracting, etc
22:37:05  <Phazorx> "prettying it up" i guess ;o)
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22:37:42  <Roysvork> thats one element to it yarr but so much more
22:37:58  <XeryusTC> wop wop
22:38:01  <XeryusTC> any new game yet?
22:40:00  *** Techinica has quit IRC
22:40:48  <Roysvork> these games do actually have quite a lot in common with coding in a weird way
22:40:58  <PublicServer> <V453000> BAH :D
22:41:16  <Roysvork> similar techniques... reworking, optimising, making 'design patterns'
22:41:31  <PublicServer> <V453000> well ... it works everywhere the same, doesnt it?
22:42:06  <Roysvork> sadly there are many things in life that can't be solved by aplying logic :)
22:42:19  <PublicServer> <V453000> true
22:47:56  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
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22:49:58  <V453000> ok, this game is probably over
22:50:20  <Roysvork> there's still a bit to do, but only because production increases over time
22:50:31  <Roysvork> still may have run it's course though
22:51:04  <Roysvork> can you turn industry growth off?
22:52:13  <planetmaker> you can only turn off the appearance of new industries
22:54:15  <PublicServer> *** Roysvork has left the game (leaving)
22:54:25  <Roysvork> too tired to do anything tonight now :)
22:54:32  *** mixrin has joined #openttdcoop
22:54:44  <Roysvork> ahh so we couldn't turn of production growth and then make it a goal to clear the waiting cargo
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22:54:50  <Roysvork> off*
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23:18:37  <De_Ghosty> Ammler
23:21:08  <De_Ghosty> you can apply logic to life iff people is logical, but people are crazy, you can't eat crazy
23:21:10  <De_Ghosty> beat*
23:21:26  <De_Ghosty> Ammler what os is the ottdcoop website o?
23:22:59  <Roysvork> I prefer the un-corrected version :)
23:23:10  <Roysvork> people are crazy. you can't eat crazy
23:23:33  <KenjiE20> pfft, you just have to freeze crazy first
23:24:59  <PublicServer> <0sai> omg
23:25:02  <PublicServer> <0sai> I finally got it
23:25:14  <PublicServer> <0sai> fail-safe-not-logic-gate with only one train
23:35:30  <V453000> have to see that :)
23:35:43  <V453000> !password
23:35:43  <PublicServer> V453000: canals
23:36:04  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
23:36:12  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
23:36:34  <PublicServer> *** V453000 joined the game
23:36:47  <PublicServer> *** V453000 has left the game (connection lost)
23:37:26  <V453000> insane.
23:39:53  <PeterT> canals - c
23:46:23  *** Roysvork has quit IRC
23:47:07  <PublicServer> <0sai> yea
23:50:15  <FiCE> !playercount
23:50:15  <PublicServer> FiCE: Number of players: 3
23:51:10  <FiCE> !password
23:51:11  <PublicServer> FiCE: piddle
23:51:17  <Osai> time for my bed now
23:51:22  <Osai> nite nite
23:51:22  <PublicServer> *** FiCE joined the game
23:51:36  <Osai> tomorrow its time for another blogpost, hehe
23:52:12  *** V453000 has quit IRC
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23:53:06  <Osai> nite V453000
23:53:16  <V453000> bye :) I will update the wiki tomorrow
23:53:25  <V453000> made some more progress with that ...
23:53:41  <Osai> nice
23:53:51  <Osai> tomorrow I'll blog logic gates
23:54:06  <V453000> :D
23:54:08  <V453000> yeah
23:54:09  <V453000> madness
23:54:17  <Osai> maybe a wiki page would be good too
23:54:25  <V453000> definitely
23:54:37  <V453000> I was searching for gates several times already
23:55:05  <Osai> the best:
23:55:43  <V453000> yeah :
23:55:45  <V453000> ))
23:55:54  <Osai> well, off now
23:56:56  <SpComb> ew

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