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00:05:33 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC 06:43:26 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:01:22 *** ODM has quit IRC 09:13:29 *** Doorslammer has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:13:38 *** DJNekkid is now known as DJNekkid_dot_nl 09:13:50 *** DJNekkid_dot_nl is now known as DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl 09:14:21 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> well guys... im off to a few days in the netherlands now... 09:14:57 <Rubidium> DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl: oh, you'll like the weather 09:15:06 <Rubidium> typical Dutch autumn weather 09:16:05 <Ammler> fog, raining? 09:16:18 <Rubidium> yeah, kinda 09:16:26 <Ammler> same here :-) 09:16:29 <Rubidium> snowy rain, rainy snow... whatever it's called 09:16:57 <Ammler> and every day something else :-) 09:17:01 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> "sludd" :) 09:17:22 <planetmaker> same here, too. 09:17:32 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> and; same here too btw.. 09:17:41 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> -3 - +7c 09:17:54 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> snow, "sludd" and rain, depending on the mood 09:18:34 <Ammler> hmm, suse factory needs another group detail: other, Real time or Turn based? 09:18:58 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> real time? 09:19:01 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> other 09:19:02 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> ? 09:19:10 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> atleast not turn based 09:19:19 <Ammler> Amusements/Games/Strategy/Other 09:19:23 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> altho, that could be fun :P 09:19:27 <DJ_Nekkid_dot_nl> Games? 09:19:28 <Rubidium> simulation! 09:19:34 <Ammler> nah 09:19:58 <Ammler> I do not put OpenTTD to simulators :-P 09:20:20 <Ammler> nobody except Debian does. 09:20:52 <Rubidium> http://www.andynash.com/nash-publications/2009-Nash-Web2forPT-14nov09.pdf <- does 09:21:51 <Ammler> Fedora: --add-category=StrategyGame 09:22:23 <Ammler> some of the suse packager used Turn Based :-) 09:23:19 <Rubidium> Ammler: it is turn based 09:23:38 <Rubidium> you get 33 turns a second though, or less depending on the server's settings 09:25:21 <Ammler> Sim City isn't a simulator either 09:25:36 <Ammler> and that one has it in the name ;-) 09:26:15 <Ammler> well, the linux version doesn't 09:26:28 <Rubidium> Ammler: simulation is a subset of strategy (according to pediwikia) 09:29:15 <Rubidium> Ammler: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Business_simulation_game <- that description really fits best to OpenTTD I'd say 09:29:16 <Webster> Title: Business simulation game - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org) 09:31:22 <Ammler> ah, I see 09:31:28 <Ammler> Simulation is no own group 09:31:56 <Ammler> is is just a subgroup of 3d (rpm) 09:33:04 <Ammler> http://paste.openttd.org/225451 09:34:05 <planetmaker> I guess it always depends on how you want to categorize things and how you want to put emphasis. 09:34:33 <planetmaker> a 3d immersion army trainer is a simulation as flight simulator. But... ? 09:36:22 <Ammler> hmm, menu entries have other groups 10:49:48 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 11:01:45 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 11:08:57 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 11:15:37 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 11:26:36 * Hirundo ponders actually playing 1.0.0 11:27:49 * Ammler ponders actually setup 1.0.0 server 11:30:58 <planetmaker> hm... #openttdcoop.stable still exists IIRC 11:31:38 <planetmaker> and you're master :-P 11:31:47 <planetmaker> and the only entry in the access list :-P 11:51:38 *** Doorslammer has quit IRC 12:02:47 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 12:04:56 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:24:40 *** Doorslammer has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:37:47 *** Brot6 has quit IRC 12:46:58 *** Yexo has quit IRC 12:47:15 *** Yexo has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 13:20:12 *** Doorslammer has quit IRC 15:30:56 *** Seberoth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 17:06:54 <Ammler> planetmaker: shouldn't the rev file have the version as content instead in the name? 17:07:19 <Ammler> hmm, nvm. 17:41:41 <planetmaker> Ammler: it's easier to check for a file than its contents :-) 17:51:30 *** V453000 has left #openttdcoop.devzone 18:53:55 <Ammler> he, now that is interesting 18:54:29 <Ammler> the official suse packager uses the binary zips of the open[g|s|m]fx :-) 18:54:45 <planetmaker> :-P 18:55:02 <Ammler> one spec for everything 18:55:33 <Ammler> I can remember asking the suse guys a year ago, they said to me, NO binaries :-o 18:56:12 <Ammler> well, I don't care, this way, we can be sure, the md5sum matches :-P 18:56:52 <Ammler> I am wondering, if they will package it that way to the 11.3 DVD 18:57:11 <Ammler> which you can buy 19:00:24 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 19:21:55 <andythenorth> webster is slow today? 19:22:34 <KenjiE20> hm? 19:22:36 <andythenorth> hmm 19:22:38 <andythenorth> can't push 19:23:05 <andythenorth> which would be why my commits haven't been seen by webster :| 19:23:20 <andythenorth> Ammler: has hg gone away for a bit? 19:23:31 <andythenorth> pdq2s-macbook-3:fish_build andy$ hg push 19:23:32 <andythenorth> remote: exec request failed on channel 0 19:23:32 <andythenorth> abort: no suitable response from remote hg! 19:23:39 <KenjiE20> we seem to be maxing the VPS limits on the server lately 19:28:56 <Ammler> andythenorth: try again 19:29:12 <Ammler> I guess, openttd on the same server just isn't a good idea :-) 19:29:31 <KenjiE20> openttd >1 * 19:30:00 <Ammler> ? 19:30:01 <KenjiE20> we seem to get away (just) with one 19:30:47 <andythenorth> Ammler: win 19:31:38 <PeterT> andythenorth: openttd on mac still compiling for you? 19:32:17 <andythenorth> PeterT: yep. I don't seem to have to ignore lso anymore either, which is nice. 19:32:29 <andythenorth> got some compile errors, I'm never sure if they matter :o 19:34:56 <Ammler> andythenorth: try to load a old save 19:35:08 <Ammler> ttd save 19:35:12 <andythenorth> Ammler: I just did, seems to work 19:35:28 <Ammler> compile errors or warnings? 19:35:37 <andythenorth> warnings 19:35:42 <andythenorth> map zoom mostly 19:35:54 <andythenorth> small map zoom to be precise 19:36:10 <Ammler> if it is unpatched, I guess, they would be happy to see those 19:38:00 <andythenorth> far as I know it's clean trunk 19:40:39 <andythenorth> Ammler: has redmine died too? 19:42:32 <Ammler> andythenorth: yes, seems so 19:42:38 <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FISH - Revision 262: Change: split Utility Vessels into separate files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/262> || FISH - Revision 261: Change: split Traders into separate files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/261> || FISH - Revision 260: Change: split Vehicle Ferries into separate files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/260> || FISH - Revision 259: Change: split Coasters into separate files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/259> || FISH - Revision 258: Change: split River Boats into separate files <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/258> 19:50:40 <andythenorth> planetmaker: hi hi....got time for a templating discussion? 19:52:13 <planetmaker> andythenorth: yes 19:52:18 <andythenorth> FISH 19:52:23 <planetmaker> &CHIPs 19:52:26 <andythenorth> :P 19:52:33 <planetmaker> :-) 19:52:34 <andythenorth> currently I use no templating 19:52:49 <andythenorth> I am planning to template some ships now 19:52:50 <planetmaker> ok 19:53:04 <andythenorth> the action 0 will not be templated, except for ID etc 19:53:09 <andythenorth> I can do that 19:53:23 <andythenorth> I plan to template the action 1, as they are very repetitive 19:53:32 <planetmaker> ID might be nice as it keeps a list. Is FISH actually for both TTDP and OTTD compatible? 19:53:32 <andythenorth> and the action 2/3 19:53:40 <andythenorth> no 19:53:44 <andythenorth> well maybe 19:53:46 <planetmaker> Ok, action1 makes most sense 19:54:07 <andythenorth> I think the action 1/2/3 all need to be in the same template 19:54:14 <planetmaker> How many views? 4 I assume per loading state? 19:54:23 <andythenorth> hmmm 19:54:32 <planetmaker> err... 8 19:54:36 <andythenorth> yup 19:54:40 <andythenorth> it's not like train wagons :) 19:54:42 <andythenorth> if only.... 19:54:50 <planetmaker> depends upon the train wagons ;-) 19:55:24 <andythenorth> so to use the action 1 correctly, the action 2/3 also need to be present 19:55:34 <andythenorth> so I think templating is actually simple 19:55:41 <andythenorth> but I just wanted your opinion :) 19:56:21 <planetmaker> Even if action 1 is always followed by 2/3, you could make that a separate template 19:56:22 <Ammler> if you have done the id.pnfo, post it on tt-forums and ask the ttpatchers to create the patch id.pnfo 19:56:29 <Ammler> so you don't have to care about that ;-)( 19:56:31 <planetmaker> Do you already use templated pcx? 19:57:01 <andythenorth> meaning they are all on a regular grid pattern? 19:57:01 <andythenorth> yes 19:57:15 <andythenorth> but the offsets change for each ship, I'll have to do x_offs_1 etc 19:57:16 <planetmaker> andythenorth: actually... I'd keep action1 and action 2/3 in separate files / templates 19:57:25 <andythenorth> I wondered that 19:57:28 <planetmaker> there might be cases where you use another template or so. For whatever reason. 19:57:53 <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FISH - Revision 266: Remove: redundant file <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/266> || FISH - Revision 264: Change: moved more files into own folders <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/264> || FISH - Revision 265: Remove: redundant file <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/265> || FISH - Revision 263: Change: move tow boats file to own folder <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/263> 19:57:54 <planetmaker> *another action1 template (e.g. graphics sizes different, whatever) 19:58:04 <andythenorth> yes, that could happen 19:58:05 <planetmaker> you're more flexible that way to keep it separated 19:58:12 <andythenorth> ok, that was the advice I needed, thanks 19:58:20 <andythenorth> now I just need a naming scheme for them :o 19:58:41 <planetmaker> then each ship would get action0, action1-template, action23-template 19:58:53 <andythenorth> yep 19:59:02 <andythenorth> hmmm 19:59:09 <planetmaker> well... action1_shipsmall.tnfo 19:59:17 <planetmaker> action23_default.tnfo 19:59:27 <planetmaker> and ids in ids.pnfo 19:59:31 <andythenorth> action23_enhanced.tnfo etc 19:59:36 <andythenorth> yep ok 19:59:36 <planetmaker> possibly, yes 19:59:59 <planetmaker> though "enhanced" is very cloudy. 20:00:14 <planetmaker> Rather action23_riverraft.tnfo 20:00:16 <planetmaker> or so 20:00:28 <andythenorth> it's more to do with how much cargo graphic support is provided :) 20:00:32 <andythenorth> in most cases 20:00:33 <planetmaker> or action23_noPAX.tnfo ;-) 20:00:37 <planetmaker> ah, yes 20:01:05 <andythenorth> default, enhanced, comprehensive ? 20:01:07 <andythenorth> hmm 20:01:13 <andythenorth> anyway, I'll figure that out I guess 20:01:29 <planetmaker> hm... there's some way how to put that in one template. 2cctrainset uses that for some wagons with several refits / cargos 20:01:54 <planetmaker> like #define this_cargo1 blubber 20:02:00 <planetmaker> #define this_cargo2 blah 20:02:02 <planetmaker> ... 20:02:05 <planetmaker> and then in the template 20:02:15 <planetmaker> #ifdef this_cargo1 ... 20:02:17 <planetmaker> #endif 20:02:24 <planetmaker> #ifdef this_cargo2 ... 20:02:26 <planetmaker> #endif 20:02:34 <andythenorth> it's possible, but I don't think it's necessary 20:02:59 <andythenorth> the code will be harder to read....meanwhile most ships are near-identical in their code, so might as well keep it simple 20:03:06 <planetmaker> thus you could depending upon the highest this_cargX use one or another. But it gets very easily very complicated with the cpp possibilities 20:03:14 <planetmaker> yes, I agree 20:03:17 <andythenorth> I'll see how it goes 20:03:24 <planetmaker> I'm yearning for Yexo's python2nfo ;-) 20:03:41 <Yexo> still working on it :) 20:03:45 <PeterT> andythenorth: that's good 20:03:56 <Ammler> planetmaker: what about my bash-nfo? 20:04:07 <andythenorth> PeterT: what's good? 20:04:12 <planetmaker> Ammler: what do you mean? 20:04:21 <PeterT> [15:32:17] <andythenorth:#openttdcoop.devzone> PeterT: yep. I don't seem to have to ignore lso anymore either, which is nice. 20:04:28 <andythenorth> ah yes 20:04:51 <PeterT> you said wine was buggy solution in your post 20:04:55 <PeterT> how so? 20:05:26 <andythenorth> sucky, not buggy 20:05:26 <Ammler> planetmaker: I would like to parse a bit bash before or after it goes through gcc 20:05:42 <Ammler> same could be done with pythong 20:05:55 <planetmaker> as said: use a rule in Makefile.in by defining the rule(s) there. 20:05:59 <PeterT> why sucky? 20:06:03 <PeterT> slow or something? 20:06:10 <Ammler> planetmaker: but how does it detect the files? 20:06:24 <andythenorth> on OS X, running OpenTTD in WINE: (a) uses twice as much CPU (b) is very slightly skippy on mouse / scrolling sometimes (c) is a big pain to use because I have to work with a windows file system structure meh 20:06:26 <planetmaker> %.pnfo: %.bnfo 20:06:42 <planetmaker> if it wants a pnfo file, doesn't find it, it looks for a bnfo file with the same stem name 20:06:56 <planetmaker> and then follows the rule which you defined in order to convert bnfo -> pnfo 20:07:01 <PeterT> andythenorth: Indeed, that's what I dislike about Wine on Linux 20:07:04 * andythenorth wonders....can OS X compile a windows binary? 20:07:04 <PeterT> the windows file system 20:07:13 <PeterT> No 20:07:16 <PeterT> Well 20:07:17 <planetmaker> andythenorth: via cross-compiler: yes 20:07:20 <planetmaker> same as linux can. 20:07:37 <planetmaker> when I did it, I installed windoze in a VM. 20:07:38 <PeterT> there is the fedora-mingw cross project 20:07:45 <planetmaker> was easier and used MinGW 20:08:04 <andythenorth> another reason not to want to use WINE - can't compile easily :| 20:09:34 <Ammler> planetmaker: and the command in the target is: $(BASH) $< >$@ 20:09:51 <PeterT> andythenorth: Can't just use official binaries? 20:10:05 <PeterT> I guess you must be thinking of patched ones - like your NewGRF Debug window patch 20:10:33 <andythenorth> sometimes devs give me unreleased patches to test 20:10:47 <andythenorth> and occasionally I fool with the code myself 20:10:53 <planetmaker> well... nearly. Watch the parentheses. Though I'd recommend, Ammler, to use $(shell blubber command blub $<) > $@ 20:11:00 <planetmaker> and not resort to bashisms ;-) 20:11:03 <PeterT> [16:10:50] <andythenorth> and occasionally I fool with the code myself <-- that's what she said 20:11:22 <planetmaker> PeterT: official on macos is not possible 20:11:25 <Ammler> planetmaker: as I can't test non-bash, it is hard to support that :-( 20:11:42 <Ammler> for example, dish is really debian only 20:11:44 <planetmaker> still. :-) $(shell) is already defined 20:13:05 <Ammler> so you think, it is better I use $SHELL and will be blamed for bad shell code than using bash and be blamed if someone might not have bash? 20:13:20 * andythenorth hmms 20:13:22 <planetmaker> $(shell ... ) 20:13:28 <planetmaker> you have to use the ( ) 20:13:29 <andythenorth> does my FISH makefile know about tnfo? 20:13:41 <Ammler> what is command? 20:13:42 <planetmaker> andythenorth: likely not yet. 20:13:49 <andythenorth> I'll teach it 20:14:02 <planetmaker> Just add it where there's pnfo in Makefile.config 20:14:32 <planetmaker> FILE_SRC_EXTENSIONS = pnfo template <-- change template to tnfo 20:14:35 <andythenorth> what was the intention of 'template'? 20:14:41 <planetmaker> instead of tnfo 20:14:43 <Ammler> hmm, why not "$(shell) $< >@" 20:15:03 <Ammler> what have you in mind for blubber command blub? 20:15:14 <Ammler> ah, I see 20:15:23 <planetmaker> whatever you need 20:15:24 <Ammler> $(shell $<) >@ 20:15:37 <planetmaker> then the output of all those commands is piped 20:16:04 <Ammler> bnfo is bash script, that is clear? 20:16:22 <andythenorth> oh poop 20:16:26 <Ammler> the output of that script makes a pnfo or nfo 20:16:29 <andythenorth> pdq2s-macbook-3:fish_build andy$ make install 20:16:29 <andythenorth> [Generating] Makefile.dep 20:16:30 <andythenorth> make: *** No rule to make target `Makefile.dep', needed by `depend'. Stop. 20:16:52 <planetmaker> well... use whatever extension suits, Ammler... if the pnfo is generated from a .sh file then use %.pnfo: %.sh 20:17:03 <Ammler> yes 20:17:12 <planetmaker> hmpf @ andythenorth 20:17:16 <planetmaker> anything changed? 20:17:20 <Ammler> but I still have no idea about "blubber command blub" 20:17:26 <planetmaker> there's some bug lurking in that respect 20:17:36 <Ammler> andythenorth: most likely a missing file? 20:17:41 <Ammler> typo 20:17:41 <planetmaker> Ammler: your shell script 20:17:52 <planetmaker> $(shell $<) > $@ 20:17:52 <andythenorth> planetmaker: type 20:17:56 <planetmaker> is probably all you need 20:17:58 <andythenorth> typo (the irony) 20:18:15 <Ammler> hmm, I try that 20:18:20 <planetmaker> yeah, it could tell the file, andythenorth :-( 20:18:31 <planetmaker> s/could/should/ 20:18:42 <Ammler> s/could/did/ :-P 20:18:49 <planetmaker> pssst! 20:20:44 <Ammler> actually, if I don't need gcc, I could skip that with %.nfo: %.snfo 20:21:50 <Ammler> planetmaker: you should btw. make a release of newgrf_makefile 20:22:05 <Ammler> maybe also rename it, as it isn't for newgrfs only 20:22:32 <Ammler> or we should add it to nightlies 20:22:44 <planetmaker> hm... release... there's no point to generate nightlies of it. 20:22:50 <planetmaker> release... might make sense 20:23:04 <Ammler> well, a easier way to get a snapshot 20:23:09 <planetmaker> the nightlies will be a newgrf which claims to be a newgrf - and serves no other purpose ;-) 20:23:20 <Ammler> as cloning would make unnecessary history 20:23:53 <planetmaker> In the project list it's called Example NewGRF Makefile 20:24:10 <planetmaker> I dunno really a better name, though 20:24:58 <planetmaker> A release might make sense indeed 20:25:36 <andythenorth> hmm 20:25:44 <andythenorth> I didn't think about buy menu sprites 20:25:53 <planetmaker> :-) That's a 9th sprite ;-) 20:26:28 * andythenorth ponders restructuring the Action 1 20:28:52 <Ammler> [21:07] <Ammler> planetmaker: did you ever watch helicopters in opengfx? 20:29:10 <planetmaker> Hm... I guess not much. 20:29:16 <Ammler> the rotors are glitching 20:29:17 <planetmaker> I have a few in my title game submission 20:29:38 <Ammler> I should make a test game with those 20:29:49 <Ammler> or do we have a vehicle testsave already? 20:30:35 <planetmaker> you could use my title game :-) 20:30:52 <planetmaker> it doesn't have all vehicles, but pretty many. 20:30:58 <planetmaker> It's also my tropical test game ;-) 20:31:05 <planetmaker> It's a dual-use game :-P 20:31:41 <planetmaker> you want the latest version? 20:32:04 <Ammler> it's on documents, I guess? 20:32:20 <planetmaker> not the latest. But one. I guess that'll do 20:33:37 <Ammler> "opensfx/releases/opensfx-0.2.3.zip";829;2010/04/01 22:31:15 20:34:00 <Ammler> "openmsx/releases/openmsx-0.2.1.zip";484;2010/04/01 22:31:40 20:34:08 <planetmaker> download stats? 20:34:16 <Ammler> "opengfx/releases/opengfx-0.2.3.zip";850;2010/04/01 22:32:10 20:34:23 <Ammler> yes 20:34:27 <planetmaker> nice 20:34:36 <planetmaker> bananas has about the same 20:34:41 <Ammler> only? 20:34:52 <planetmaker> that's 1600 in 36 hours 20:35:13 <planetmaker> 791 as of now 20:35:23 <Ammler> Rubidium: does installer downlaods have stats too? 20:36:45 <Rubidium> Ammler: I fear not 20:37:05 <Ammler> well, you could count the installer itself 20:37:07 <Rubidium> TB said he would unify the stat gathering, but AFAIK he hasn't done that yet 20:37:14 <Ammler> and assume 90% does download the addons 20:39:10 <Ammler> do you have msx in the installier too? 20:39:24 <Rubidium> I think you can't do that; 90% of the new installs, yes... but 90% of upgrades... definitely not 20:39:30 <Rubidium> Ammler: yeah 20:40:06 <Ammler> the same problem with all the *nix users 20:43:36 <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: OpenGFX - titlegame10.sav <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/645/titlegame10.sav> 20:46:10 <andythenorth> so a ship is conceptually a vehicle, yes / no? 20:46:45 <Rubidium> in terms of OpenTTD? 20:47:01 <Ammler> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=VehicleIDs 20:47:09 <Rubidium> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle#Water_vehicles 20:47:10 <Webster> Title: Vehicle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org) 20:50:17 <andythenorth> in terms of a sensible scheme for defines :) 20:51:21 <Rubidium> planetmaker: frontpage/templates/frontpage/ 20:51:41 <planetmaker> ah :-) 20:51:59 <planetmaker> but why is the content under templates? 20:52:32 <andythenorth> planetmaker: we could template action 0 :o 20:52:36 <andythenorth> but somehow that seems overkill 20:52:51 <planetmaker> somehow it is, yes 20:52:58 <Rubidium> planetmaker: because it isn't in a database? 20:53:06 <planetmaker> Unless the stats are gathered in a list and the action0 written by a python script 20:53:15 <Rubidium> planetmaker: because I have no real clue about django, so don't ask me? 20:53:39 <andythenorth> Rubidium: looks perfectly sensible :) 20:53:40 <planetmaker> he @ Rubidium - still "template" seems wrong. "content" would be what I expected. Or alike 20:54:09 <Rubidium> planetmaker: well, I can't find it either... so grep's my friend 20:54:24 <planetmaker> I guess so.. .yes :-) 20:54:35 <planetmaker> I guess I'm already too tired to have thought of that 20:54:41 <andythenorth> Rubidium: http://tt-foundry.com/sets/FIRS/sets/FISH/sets/heavy_equipment 20:54:42 <Webster> Title: TT Foundry: Pixel Creations for OpenTTD (at tt-foundry.com) 20:54:51 <andythenorth> it's a perfectly valid URL :) 20:56:10 * Rubidium has no clue what andythenorth tries to tell, though andythenorth has probably no clue what I'm talking about with planetmaker 20:56:18 <andythenorth> I can guess 20:56:42 <planetmaker> :-) Context is quite hard to guess without the missing piece of information ;-) 20:56:51 <andythenorth> ^^ I use a crazy python CMS too 20:57:10 <andythenorth> if I drew you the tree structure for the object db, you might wtf at how that works 21:04:42 <planetmaker> grfcodec, nforenum, catcodec, pngcodec - anything I miss? 21:05:08 <andythenorth> python2nfo :P 21:05:12 <andythenorth> oh. 21:05:19 <Ammler> you do not really want to make a "hardcoded" guide? 21:05:19 <andythenorth> not done yet :D 21:05:25 <Ammler> don't you trust the wiki? 21:05:44 <Ammler> that is stupid, imo 21:05:53 <planetmaker> Not really. 21:06:07 <Ammler> why not simply link to the wiki? 21:06:22 <Ammler> I don't mean DevZone wiki :-P 21:06:48 <planetmaker> I know 21:07:10 <Rubidium> oh, bananas downloads are spiking today :) 21:07:24 <planetmaker> Well. It makes sense to link it also there. A website should offer at least one link to its downloads ;-) 21:07:28 <Rubidium> already 55555 21:07:31 <planetmaker> :-O 21:07:33 <Rubidium> and 3 hours to go in the day 21:07:36 <Ammler> well, it is something else, if rubi or tb setup a guide there, they can edit it, but you need to commit patches for every change you need. 21:08:19 <planetmaker> Ammler: I don't want to write there lengthy treatise. Just a list of programmes: you find here a,b,c,d 21:08:26 <planetmaker> see wiki and forums for further info 21:08:44 <Rubidium> yeah; the compiler stuff is offloaded to the wiki too, right? 21:09:00 <Ammler> yeah, the main point is, they should need to read the wiki to get that stuff 21:09:05 <andythenorth> oops 21:09:18 <planetmaker> Ammler: why? 21:09:34 <Rubidium> 54705 bananas downloads the "day" of 1.0.0-beta1 (64313 is highest peak on 27/12), so maybe we're going to set a record there too 21:09:38 <Ammler> else you get new RTFM guys in irc 21:09:50 <Rubidium> @calc 55555/21*24 21:09:50 <Webster> Rubidium: 63491.4285714 21:11:25 <planetmaker> Ammler: but so far the OpenTTD page does not even mention that there are dev tools available. 21:11:44 <planetmaker> or that there's ways how to get more info to that end. And that is bad 21:11:51 <planetmaker> because that gives you questions, too :-) 21:11:59 <Ammler> ok, indeed 21:12:08 <Rubidium> which isn't that odd because the page has been written *before* we started to compile those binaries 21:12:13 <Ammler> I thought, you like to write about those tools 21:12:30 <planetmaker> I'll paste the diff in a few minutes. No books. A list 21:14:20 <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FISH - Revision 272: Change: Large Trader uses templating <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/272> || FISH - Revision 271: Change: Medium Trader uses templating <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/271> || FISH - Revision 270: Change: extended templating <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/270> || FISH - Revision 269: Change: Small Trader now uses action 2/3 template <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/269> || FISH - Revision 268: Change: moved Small Trader to templated action 1 <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/268> || FISH - Revision 267: Change: added .tnfo to make file <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/267> 21:14:26 <Ammler> .. ttdviewer, spritealigner 21:14:45 <Ammler> well, if you like to mention windows tools? 21:14:49 <Ammler> grfmaker 21:15:12 <Rubidium> grf2html? 21:15:20 <Ammler> yes 21:15:36 <andythenorth> umm....come back redmine, I need you right now :o 21:15:42 <planetmaker> http://pastebin.fr/7397 <-- Rubidium, Ammler 21:16:02 <planetmaker> Ammler: those tools are not available from the "official" website. So not 21:16:25 <Ammler> which? 21:16:33 <planetmaker> grfmaker, grf2html 21:16:44 <Ammler> but ttdviewer is 21:16:46 <planetmaker> ttdviewer, spritealigner 21:16:50 <planetmaker> is it? 21:17:03 <planetmaker> it's from an official dev, but not hosted there 21:17:07 <Ammler> from our devzone 21:17:11 <planetmaker> yes. 21:17:11 <Ammler> and tt-forums 21:17:25 <andythenorth> Ammler: is there anything you can do to kick redmine? 21:17:28 <planetmaker> well. Frosch can add it himself 21:17:33 <Rubidium> https://secure.openttd.org:444/test-www/en/development :( 21:18:11 <andythenorth> endlblocktrans :) 21:18:32 <planetmaker> ^ 21:18:36 <Rubidium> yeah, locally fixed 21:18:40 <andythenorth> yay, redmine returns 21:19:11 <Ammler> that seriously sucks... 21:19:23 <Rubidium> the development page doesn't look very useful for NewGRFs and the like 21:19:35 <Ammler> maybe all because we use 64 instead 32 bit? 21:20:04 <planetmaker> Rubidium: well... 21:20:27 <planetmaker> I agree, it's not optimal in that case. But it has at least some 32bpp stuff. 21:20:32 <planetmaker> and some hints 21:21:20 <Ammler> planetmaker: grfcodec and nforenum aren't from openttd.org either 21:21:21 <planetmaker> hm... should it be "base sets" rather than those in capital letters? I guess... 21:21:34 <planetmaker> Ammler: they're built by the CF 21:21:50 <planetmaker> and the download link is http://www.openttd.org/... 21:22:08 <Ammler> yeah, but they should have commit rights :-) 21:22:54 <planetmaker> if you have the right you have the duty ;-) 21:23:00 <planetmaker> it's a two-edged sword ;-) 21:23:32 <Ammler> well, I didn't say they should take over, just be able to contribute 21:24:07 <Ammler> and not the need to go to the knees for every single simple patch 21:25:21 <planetmaker> don't tell that me. Don't tell that the people who you think should get access, tell that those who may grant it ;-) 21:26:24 <Rubidium> which would be mr. Patch himself 21:26:44 <planetmaker> yeah 21:27:19 <Ammler> Rubidium: since I am in #tycoon, this man joined maybe once? 21:27:34 <Ammler> man* 21:27:34 *** Seberoth has quit IRC 21:27:51 <planetmaker> Ammler: only? I thought he's around at the frequency of Darkvater 21:28:09 <Ammler> maybe you confuse him with eis_os 21:28:17 <planetmaker> nope 21:28:32 <planetmaker> but I left #tycoon long ago again ;-) 21:28:36 <planetmaker> only senseless babble there 21:29:03 <Ammler> well, it is mainly a uk channel 21:29:06 <planetmaker> and the local channel reduction police cut that channel :-P 21:29:38 <planetmaker> well... yes, it is. 21:29:39 <andythenorth> #tycoon is offensively mindless 21:29:42 <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FISH - Revision 273: Change: Island Trader uses templating <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/273> 21:30:10 * planetmaker reads fish(y) commits ;-) 21:32:31 <Ammler> hehe German users thought openttd is april fool 21:32:34 * andythenorth does some mighty boring converting of offsets to defines :| 21:33:13 <planetmaker> andythenorth: the same as of the English IRC channel can be said of the German forums ;-) 21:33:44 <Rubidium> Ammler: where can I read that!?! 21:34:07 <Ammler> [23:21] <Tante|> Ammler, ist die 1.0.0 wirklich raus, oder ist das nur wieder ein blöder Aprilscherz? 21:34:29 <Ammler> he had a bit too many fools today :-) 21:34:43 <Rubidium> Ammler: say the joke this year is better than the joke of last year 21:36:00 <Ammler> [23:30] <Ammler> der Scherz ist wohl, dass die leute denken, es sei einer, es aber nicht ist 21:36:59 <Ammler> I guess, many are disappointed if they download it and see, oh no fool :-) 21:38:41 <Rubidium> still no post on the German forum though :( 21:39:17 <Ammler> http://laptops.toshiba.com/tubetop 21:39:18 <Webster> Title: Toshiba TubeTop, The World's First Inflatable Laptop | Toshiba (at laptops.toshiba.com) 21:43:21 <Ammler> but an annoucement for opengfx :-) 21:43:59 <planetmaker> Ammler: and it didn't attract a single reply there. So I cannot be bothered :-P 21:54:33 <Ammler> I annouced 1.0.0 there ;-) 21:54:50 <Ammler> http://www.tt-ms.de/forum/showthread.php?tid=4459&pid=62798#pid62798 22:00:28 <planetmaker> :-) 22:19:58 *** ODM has quit IRC 22:33:21 <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FISH - Revision 275: Change: fixed buy menu templating for Traders <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/275> || FISH - Revision 274: Change: templated offsets <http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/fish/repository/revisions/274> 22:45:11 * andythenorth contemplates some horrible things to do with offsets in FISH :( 22:49:09 <andythenorth> grrr 22:49:29 * andythenorth gets to align all the ships correctly....again :o 22:49:44 <andythenorth> but first....bedtime! 23:43:52 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC