Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 9th October 2010:
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03:11:41  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trees - Revision 37:cb36b4eb66cb: Feature: Tree Graphics - added and edited tropical tree. (Froix) @
03:23:35  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trees - Revision 38:ff2f8a5892e2: Added tag 0.2.1 for changeset cb36b4eb66cb (Froix) @
03:25:24  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trees - Bug #1611 (New): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
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03:40:19  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trees - Bug #1611: DevZone compile failed (Froix) @
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07:42:36  <andythenorth_> hi hi
07:45:48  <andythenorth_> planetmaker: what do you think of Neko's suggestions?
07:45:50  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development (at
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08:37:46  <Alberth> oi
08:37:50  <Rubidium> moi
08:38:08  <Alberth> you're in the wrong window :)
08:44:45  <Rubidium> really?
08:45:00  <Rubidium> the maker of planets is in here as well, ain't he?
08:46:38  <Alberth> sometimes, although he tends to move around in other windows too
08:51:56  <Alberth> hmm, linux starts looking like windows more and more, "I have updated a.random package, please log out and in again" :|
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09:22:51  * Alberth throws andythenorth_ an anchor
09:23:17  <andythenorth_> "waving not drowning"
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09:45:19  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1448:b43d3e721f01: Feature: Sand and Gravel Pit is now s... (andythenorth) @
09:50:45  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1449:6d4cceea0612: Cleanup: remove files and references ... (andythenorth) @
10:03:22  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1450:b4d706d75fa8: Fix: bug with Biorefinery intro date (andythenorth) @
10:03:22  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1275: Biorefinery (andythenorth) @
10:08:06  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1451:b41966c186aa: Feature: Paper Mill industry window t... (andythenorth) @
10:08:06  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1570: Some industry window texts wrong / incomplete (andythenorth) @
10:24:44  * Alberth is glad andy decided not to include nuclear energy in FIRS
10:31:44  <andythenorth_> it's just not a very interesting cargo
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10:37:41  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1452:b8175af8e60f: Feature: correct boost information fo... (andythenorth) @
10:37:41  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1570: Some industry window texts wrong / incomplete (andythenorth) @
10:46:25  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1453:d28b16d5d75e: Feature: correct boost information fo... (andythenorth) @
10:46:25  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1570: Some industry window texts wrong / incomplete (andythenorth) @
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10:54:11  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1612 (New): Should Sugar Refinery accept chemicals? (andythenorth) @
10:59:55  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1613 (New): Railbus VT42 (Voyager1) @
11:03:42  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1614 (New): Forge missing industry window production texts (andythenorth) @
11:03:42  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1570 (Closed): Some industry window texts wrong / incomplete (andythenorth) @
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11:27:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1601 (Closed): Change Sand Pit to Sand and Gravel Pit (andythenorth) @
11:27:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1602 (Closed): Remove Gravel Pit (andythenorth) @
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12:55:55  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1454:4092b10cd847: Change: more graphics in pcx for bior... (andythenorth) @
12:55:55  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1455:201970cc1cb1: Add: psd for biorefinery (andythenorth) @
13:07:44  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1456:e0cbb18e4c5e: Change: use placeholder boxes for bio... (andythenorth) @
13:07:44  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1275 (Closed): Biorefinery (andythenorth) @
13:07:44  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1615 (New): Biorefinery graphics (andythenorth) @
13:34:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1575 (Closed): Update changelog etc for 0.5 release (andythenorth) @
13:38:03  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1457:7eb5df78bd92: Feature: bumped grfid for 0.5 (andythenorth) @
13:43:42  <Hirundo> andythenorth__: do farms just require farm supplies to increase production, or also >xx% transportation?
13:44:16  <andythenorth__> just to increase production
13:44:27  <andythenorth__> far as I know % transported is not under newgrf control
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13:48:11  <Hirundo> BTW, I found that the payment for farm cargos (fruit, milk, livestock) is relatively low
13:48:39  <andythenorth__> probably
13:48:45  <Hirundo> That makes non-clustered farms very hard to service without making a loss
13:48:54  <andythenorth__> I haven't really looked at the cargo payments :)
13:49:02  <Terkhen> andythenorth__: you should not modify ids in translations; if you do, they won't be listed as modified strings
13:49:12  <andythenorth__> ok
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13:49:35  <Terkhen> only TEXT_IND_QUARRY and TEXT_INFO_MANUFACTURINGSUPPLIES_STEPUP have been modified recently?
13:49:41  <andythenorth__> yep
13:51:05  <Terkhen> okay, thanks
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14:59:03  <Brot6> SMITS - Revision 15:c97b44b83f8f: Add: graphic sprites for level crossings (Froix) @
14:59:03  <Brot6> SMITS - Revision 16:723059ab2604: Change: Update working source files. (Froix) @
14:59:03  <Brot6> SMITS - Revision 17:43c5e3eca383: Feature: Very little shadow adjustments to graphics sprites. (Froix) @
14:59:03  <Brot6> SMITS - Revision 18:4a58a23aa910: Cleanup: Some code fixing and repo cleanup. (Froix) @
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15:02:49  <fanioz> hello, have a nice weekend
15:07:26  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1458:39d7567baa5d: Change: Update Spanish translation. (Terkhen) @
15:08:36  <Brot6> SMITS - Revision 19:156a7ba60bc7: Fix: Wrong filename. Removed two lost pcx files. (Froix) @
15:11:39  <Brot6> AI-Trans - Revision 30:f923b768da36: Codechange: The Makefile need to find 150101 on Info.nut (fanioz) @
15:11:39  <Brot6> AI-Trans - Code Review #1616 (New): Review request (fanioz) @
15:15:44  <Brot6> AI-Trans - Code Review #1616 (Closed): Review request (fanioz) @
15:15:44  <Brot6> AI-Trans - Code Review #1616 (Closed): Review request (fanioz) @
15:24:06  <Brot6> AI-Trans - Revision 31:588fa3ea109f: Update: URL for our new Home (fanioz) @
15:34:10  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1459:7ca268cb074e: Feature: Glass Works produces Buildin... (andythenorth) @
15:34:11  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1460:36a367e09044: Change: update changelog (andythenorth) @
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16:20:26  <Brot6> firs: update from r1447 to r1460 done (1 errors) -
16:21:11  <Brot6> ogfx-trees: update from r36 to r38 done -
16:21:52  <Brot6> smts: update from r14 to r19 done -
16:22:01  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r615), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r68), airportsplus (r63), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r7), comic-houses (r71), fish (r394), frenchtowns (r4), grfcodec (r772), heqs (r380), indonesiantowns (r33), metrotrackset (r56), newgrf_makefile (r219), nforenum (r506), nml (r826), nutracks (r117), ogfx-trains (r40), opengfx (r550), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), snowlinemod
16:22:01  <Brot6> (r45), swedishrails (r182), swisstowns (r20), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r25), ttrs (r23), worldairlinersset (r664)
16:38:00  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1617 (New): EF64 (Voyager1) @
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16:55:53  <Froix> Is this something I can fix? ->
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17:00:27  <Alberth> most likely caused by a failing build process (ie there were no binaries generated, so they could not get copied
17:24:03  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1618 (New): NSB EL10 (Voyager1) @
17:31:06  <Froix> the nightly did build fine though so I'll assume it's not something I can fix and leave it to you devzone guys. :)
17:33:20  <Froix> g'night!
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18:10:53  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: update from r20906 to r20911 done -
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18:21:17  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r20906 to r20911 done -
18:31:24  <Brot6> serverpatches: update from hafbeae3b to hfa4136ed done (2 errors) -
18:44:05  <Alberth> andythenorth_:  alignment of heqs trucks, known issue?
18:45:18  <frosch123> <- somewhat
18:45:20  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - Length of vehicles in vehicle details/depot view (at
18:45:33  <frosch123> but noone wants to test my pony :'(
18:57:48  <andythenorth_> frosch123: sorry
18:57:54  <andythenorth_> I should test it :o
18:58:10  <andythenorth_> no planetmaker still?
18:58:37  <planetmaker> hm?
18:58:50  <planetmaker> I just returned home.
18:58:52  <planetmaker> what's up?
19:01:45  <planetmaker> hm...
19:01:51  <planetmaker> I'd keep grain. It's generic enough
19:02:02  <planetmaker> Personally I don't like 'produce'
19:02:15  <planetmaker> sounds too similar to 'product'
19:02:38  <planetmaker> calling the sand and gravel pit quarry instead sounds fine to me.
19:02:56  <planetmaker> nuclear is a no-no. Too close to war-related themes
19:03:07  <planetmaker> ^ andythenorth_
19:06:17  <Alberth> good evening planetmaker
19:06:25  <planetmaker> hello Alberth :-)
19:08:14  <Alberth> luckily, de hg devs take more time fixing my issue than it costs to register at their tracker :p
19:08:32  <planetmaker> :-P
19:17:25  <planetmaker> but... is hg broken? :-)
19:17:51  <Alberth> pretty much, if you look at their issue list :)
19:18:31  <Alberth> I tried   hg qrm x x  (the same patch twice) by accident, and it messes up the queue
19:19:32  <Alberth> the file gets deleted, but not in 'hg qseries'
19:27:26  <andythenorth_> planetmaker: thanks
19:27:42  <andythenorth_> firs 0.5 is ready to go apart from translations
19:27:54  <planetmaker> oye
19:28:02  <planetmaker> Alberth: interesting. I shall mind that :-)
19:28:08  <planetmaker> I use queues meanwhile a lot :-)
19:28:36  <Alberth> it iook me several years to encounter that case :)
19:28:44  <planetmaker> :-)
19:29:01  <planetmaker> well... I called it hg qdelete, but I just used it 2 days ago
19:29:41  <andythenorth_> planetmaker:
19:29:58  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1576 (Closed): Change grfid for 0.5 release (andythenorth) @
19:30:04  <planetmaker> did you just move or close issues? :-P
19:30:14  <Alberth> you can easily fix the problem by editing the .hg/patches/series file
19:30:29  <planetmaker> yes, I know. That's what I did previously, actually
19:31:25  <andythenorth_> mostly closed issues
19:31:28  <andythenorth_> some moved to 0.5.1
19:33:58  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: so... is the sand and gravel pit renamed?
19:34:04  <andythenorth_> yes
19:34:09  <planetmaker> hm...
19:34:17  <planetmaker> it doesn't show a changed string
19:35:15  <andythenorth_> I screwed up
19:35:19  <planetmaker> hm. You renamed the IDs also in the translation files
19:35:23  <andythenorth_> I also changed the defines in the same commit
19:35:28  <andythenorth_> refactoring == good
19:35:28  <planetmaker> meh
19:35:31  <andythenorth_> but not in this case
19:35:33  <andythenorth_> sorry
19:35:38  <andythenorth_> terkhen already slapped me for it :)
19:35:39  <planetmaker> I've no idea what you changed and what I have to check now :-(
19:35:50  <planetmaker> I've no time today to review the whole thing
19:35:58  <andythenorth_> I can tell you
19:36:02  <andythenorth_> name of quarry
19:36:32  <andythenorth_> and I changed a define for a string, but not the actual string....let me find it
19:37:20  <andythenorth_> changed an existing define to this: TEXT_INFO_MANUFACTURINGSUPPLIES_STEPUP
19:37:24  <andythenorth_> the string doesn't change
19:37:31  <andythenorth_> otherwise just the quarry
19:37:49  <planetmaker> description of glass works maybe?
19:38:17  <planetmaker> boost info for aluminum plant?
19:38:26  <planetmaker> paper mill info?
19:38:30  <andythenorth_> no string changes
19:38:40  <planetmaker> ok
19:38:43  <andythenorth_> all just changes of defines
19:38:58  <andythenorth_> nfo_lang.pnfo only
19:39:26  <planetmaker> hm... Quarry... Steinbruch?
19:39:32  <planetmaker> Sandgrube?
19:39:33  <planetmaker> hm...
19:39:43  <planetmaker> Sandgrube und Steinbruch?
19:41:11  <andythenorth_> steinbruch is stone pit?
19:42:06  <planetmaker> no. quarry ;-)
19:42:54  <planetmaker> I just ponder whether I find a way to let the name reflect that it also supplies sand
19:42:57  <planetmaker> But I fail
19:43:08  <andythenorth_> I wouldn't worry about it
19:43:17  <andythenorth_> in English it's ambiguous what it supplies
19:44:05  <planetmaker> well... we have 'sand pit' equivalent and 'quarry' equivalent. And when you give me those words I associate destinclty different looks with them
19:44:13  <planetmaker> But I guess it doesn't matter that much
19:44:33  <planetmaker> But I don't expect sand to come from a place where stone is hewn into pieces out of a mountain side
19:45:02  <andythenorth_> sand pit would probably be more common in UK english
19:45:13  <andythenorth_> but sand quarry is valid too
19:45:17  <planetmaker> but not for stones, I assume? ;-)
19:45:33  <andythenorth_> not for stones
19:45:39  <andythenorth_> sand and gravel quarry could be
19:46:16  <planetmaker>
19:46:17  <Webster> Title: steinbruch - Google Search (at
19:46:47  <planetmaker> steinbruch.
19:47:28  <planetmaker> pull
19:47:41  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1461:56c538439d8c: Change: Update German translation (planetmaker) @
19:49:07  <andythenorth_> that just leaves polish and dutch
19:49:12  <andythenorth_> polish there's a file for
19:49:28  <andythenorth_> dutch needs foobar - I'm going to ship without ;)
19:49:58  <Alberth> what Dutch texts need translation?
19:50:11  <andythenorth_> not sure
19:50:20  <andythenorth_> I don't know how up to date it is
19:50:37  <andythenorth_> planetmaker: I'm not really sure what to do with this:
19:51:04  <planetmaker> Alberth: there's a check_languages script ;-)
19:51:30  <Alberth> I need a repo first :)
19:52:57  <planetmaker> :-)
19:53:02  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: I'll take a look
19:53:09  <planetmaker> it needs somehow being committed
19:53:13  <planetmaker> it's nearly up2date
19:53:23  <planetmaker> I *think*
19:54:57  <Terkhen> planetmaker: I'm thinking about modifying the script: it would ignore all strings modified in the main language file before the last time the translation was updated
19:55:54  <planetmaker> Terkhen: would it make sense?
19:55:55  <Alberth> hmm, why does it dump all stuff in remove_defines.pnfo ?
19:56:10  <planetmaker> Alberth: that's used for all languages
19:56:34  <planetmaker> Terkhen: it may be right often, but fail sometimes. Maybe as an option?
19:56:55  <Terkhen> Alberth: use a part of the filename as first parameter
19:56:59  <planetmaker> Alberth: each language only defines its strings. And they need undefining
19:57:07  <planetmaker> or gcc will complain about re-definition
19:57:10  <planetmaker> which is ugly
19:57:40  <planetmaker> oh... that way was the question.... yes.
19:58:04  <Terkhen> planetmaker: IMO it would very useful; right now I have a big list of modified strings because of the resortings
19:58:13  <planetmaker> yes, I have some, too
19:58:28  <planetmaker> but leaving the current behaviour as an option might make sense
19:59:58  <Terkhen> okay, I'll look into it after 0.5
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20:00:52  <planetmaker> :-)
20:01:19  <andythenorth_> seems like code prettifying / refactoring causes problems maintaining translations?
20:02:31  <Terkhen> as long as it does not touch any language file besides 7F_any, it should be fine
20:02:59  <andythenorth_> maybe there should be a web translation system....
20:03:01  <Terkhen> hmmm... if you are just renaming ids without changing their string it should be fine too
20:03:09  <Terkhen> well, there is one :P
20:04:52  <planetmaker> I guess I can commit the Polish. Objections?
20:04:59  <planetmaker> It will miss two or three strings, but...
20:05:05  <planetmaker> not my main concern ;-)
20:05:12  <planetmaker> that's a fix for 0.5.1 ;-)
20:05:54  <andythenorth_> fine by me
20:08:43  <Alberth> is there a relation between 'any' and 'dutch' file? (eg order of lines)
20:08:44  <planetmaker> ok
20:08:59  <planetmaker> Alberth: probably currently not. But it'd be good, if it were ;-)
20:09:38  <planetmaker> language files were restructured somewhat recently. Sorting things alphabetically
20:10:15  <andythenorth_> (alphabetically in English that is) :P
20:10:20  <andythenorth_> I only thought afterwards that might be inconvenient for others
20:10:25  <planetmaker> Alphabetically by ID?
20:10:27  <andythenorth_> it seemed good at the time
20:10:34  <planetmaker> it's good
20:11:06  <planetmaker> alphabetically by ID is fine. Given the 'big' structure which sorts the completely different strings in its own sections
20:12:40  * andythenorth_ wonders how many downloads FIRS 0.5 will get
20:12:54  <andythenorth_> 0.4 has a disappointingly low number :)
20:13:00  <planetmaker> it's a function of time and availability, you know ;-)
20:13:16  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1462:8d89e74fd928: Change: fix alphabetical positioning ... (andythenorth) @
20:14:21  <planetmaker> I'll keep 'sand pit' for 'quarry' in Polish
20:14:59  <andythenorth_> then we can soon ship :)
20:15:22  <Terkhen> :)
20:15:38  <planetmaker> Polish updated
20:17:35  <andythenorth_> win
20:17:44  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1463:33ed554132ef: Change: Update Polish translation (Ba... (planetmaker) @
20:18:06  <andythenorth_> that just leaves dutch :)
20:18:35  <planetmaker> :-)
20:18:41  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Code Review #1588 (Feedback): Fixed Polish translation (planetmaker) @
20:19:06  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: are you positive that there'll be a 0.5.1?
20:19:12  <andythenorth_> no
20:19:20  <andythenorth_> but there'll be a 0.5.x
20:19:21  <planetmaker> :-D
20:19:26  <planetmaker> ok
20:19:36  <andythenorth_> I'm sticking to '0.x' => grfid bump
20:19:41  <planetmaker> hm... translations might actually be a good motivation :-)
20:20:12  <planetmaker> I kinda promised the Polish guy that the next update he makes would be in 0.5.1 - if he provides it by then ;-)
20:20:35  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trees - Bug #1608 (Reopened): Trees are not enabled by default (Ammler) @
20:20:40  <Ammler> you still have remove_define in the repo, btw.
20:21:36  <planetmaker> it's still not written by a script, you know...
20:21:50  <Ammler> pm, why didn't trees build?
20:22:05  <planetmaker> package conflicts, I *think*
20:22:12  <planetmaker> grfcodec 5 vs. nforenum4
20:22:44  <planetmaker> I'm not 100% positive, but I think it's a CF issue
20:23:43  <planetmaker> And I didn't find the CF project in a quick scan or I'd have it assigned to you ;-)
20:24:11  <andythenorth_> Alberth: you're updating FIRS dutch?
20:24:29  <Alberth> trying to
20:24:54  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: just FYI: if you want translations in more languages: Ask in the forums. Provide the English file. And give people _two weeks_
20:25:11  <planetmaker> and only then call it a release
20:25:28  <andythenorth_> so feature freeze -> two weeks -> release?
20:25:40  <planetmaker> two weeks is my experience what will give you most without loosing those which are willing to help but not online 24/7
20:25:55  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: not really. But no changes which require strings changing
20:26:13  <planetmaker> you can work on graphics and layouts...
20:27:06  <Brot6> ogfx-trees: update from 0.2.0 to 0.2.1 done -
20:32:54  <Ammler> planetmaker: yes, it was nforenum conflict
20:34:12  <Ammler> anyway 0.2.1 is not really nice release with red as active and green as off :-)
20:34:52  <planetmaker> :-)
20:35:56  <Ammler> pm, will you close #1611?
20:35:56  <Brot6> Ammler: pm: #1611 is "OpenGFX+ Trees - Bug #1611: DevZone compile failed - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
20:36:18  <planetmaker> solved?
20:36:19  <planetmaker> ok
20:37:11  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trees - Bug #1611 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (planetmaker) @
20:37:48  <Terkhen> andythenorth_: once you finish with FIRS 0.5.0, could you please check #1558?
20:37:48  <Brot6> Terkhen: andythenorth_: #1558 is "HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #1558: Replaced standard road vehicles - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
20:38:23  <planetmaker> :-)
20:38:24  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Revision 130:e42b5343a66d: [Compiler] Another IhavenoideawhatIhavedone or we call ... (Ammler) @
20:40:30  <andythenorth_> Terkhen: how about I deactivate HEQS if there's no eGRVTS :D
20:40:32  <andythenorth_> ?
20:41:34  <Terkhen> I won't be able to use HEQS in standard games / toyland then
20:41:42  <andythenorth_> brrr toyland
20:41:46  <Terkhen> :D
20:41:47  <andythenorth_> I should make a set of toy HEQS
20:41:51  <andythenorth_> tonka toys
20:42:07  <andythenorth_>
20:42:08  <Webster> Title: tonka toys - Google Search (at
20:42:40  <Terkhen> that's exactly what I have in mind when using HEQS in toyland :P
20:44:15  <Terkhen> besides, I find that eGRVTS has too many vehicles... standard (or OpenGFX+ road vehicles when it gets done) + HEQS is perfect for me
20:45:13  <planetmaker> hm... OpenGFX+ RV... only three trams so far, I think. But that's not made a separate grf yet
20:45:31  <planetmaker> that's still in OpenGFXPlus, though
20:46:02  <Alberth> brick works makes bricks for houses, I assume
20:46:13  <planetmaker> also, yes
20:46:47  <Terkhen> it would be complete for me with a few refittable road vehicles, as done for wagons in ogfx+ trains
20:46:58  <planetmaker> aye :-)
20:46:59  <planetmaker> true
20:47:07  <planetmaker> well. The trams need to be part ;-)
20:48:07  <andythenorth_> Terkhen: check out HEQS and patch it :)
20:48:18  <Ammler> hmm, does that happen with engine pool enabled?
20:48:49  <andythenorth_> probably does yes
20:49:22  <planetmaker> Ammler: default vehicles are easily overwritten...
20:49:36  <andythenorth_> HEQS is part-way through conversion to defines for IDs
20:50:34  <andythenorth_> Alberth:
20:50:35  <Webster> Title: Lime kiln - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at
20:50:52  <Ammler> andythenorth_: or alert if engine pool is disabled
20:50:56  <Terkhen> andythenorth_: are you following any order for IDs in HEQS?
20:51:09  <andythenorth_> Terkhen: there is/was a schema for them
20:51:19  <andythenorth_> if they all move to defined IDs it matters less
20:51:37  <andythenorth_> but all trailing parts of aRVs have to be <128
20:51:49  <planetmaker> hm, yes
20:52:44  <Ammler> pm, maybe ogfx+rv could add the default engines, so the other orignals.grf isn't needed
20:52:51  <Terkhen> I can write a patch, but I'd only bother with it if the new IDs are good enough to eventually commit it
20:53:37  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: all and including 87 are taken by default vehicles
20:54:01  <andythenorth_> 87h or 87d?
20:54:06  <planetmaker> 87d
20:54:23  <planetmaker> I'd have spellt 87h as 0x87 ;-)
20:54:39  <andythenorth_> that leaves enough for trailers
20:54:40  <Alberth> andythenorth_: thanks, got a description of TEXT_IND_BUILDERSYARD  too ?
20:54:46  <andythenorth_> looking...
20:55:13  <planetmaker> Alberth: like the municipaltiy's place to store construction stuff
20:55:21  <andythenorth_> builders yard could be any of...
20:55:25  <andythenorth_> builders merchant:
20:55:27  <Webster> Title: Jewson Builders Merchant - Building Materials and Supplies (at
20:56:28  <andythenorth_>
20:56:29  <Webster> Title: General contractor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at
20:56:57  <andythenorth_> or municipal yard as planetmaker said
20:57:56  <Ammler> [22:49] <planetmaker> Ammler: default vehicles are easily overwritten... <-- nobody does play without engine pool anymore
20:57:57  <Alberth> the latter seems to be owned by the local goverment
20:58:16  <planetmaker> Ammler: an idea indeed. It shall be a parameter.
20:58:33  <planetmaker> I'll need to (re-)define anyway those which I modify. So... maybe not even a parameter
20:58:38  <Ammler> but engine pool does disable the default vehicels
20:58:45  <planetmaker> Ammler: no
20:58:54  <planetmaker> Only newgrf disable them
20:58:54  <Ammler> so you need to add those again, that is orginals.grf for, afaik
20:59:12  <planetmaker> Engine pool does not make them unavailable
20:59:42  <planetmaker> just try ogfx+trains.
20:59:46  <planetmaker> you'll have all default
20:59:52  <planetmaker> just some re-defined
20:59:52  <Ammler> Terkhen: why do you need support for no vehicle pool?
21:01:38  <Terkhen> if you mean "Enable multiple NewGRF engine sets", it is on
21:01:58  <Terkhen> IIRC it did not protect standard engines from being overwritten
21:03:29  <Terkhen> I did not know about that original engines grf, it seems to solve the issue
21:04:33  <Alberth>
21:04:49  <andythenorth_> ach stick it in
21:04:55  <andythenorth_> if it compiles...ship it :P
21:05:35  <andythenorth_> I'll try it
21:05:54  <Ammler> planetmaker: if there is a rv grf, default rvs will be disabled
21:06:09  <planetmaker> no
21:06:16  <Ammler> or  did that change?
21:06:23  <planetmaker> or should it be different for RV than for trains?
21:06:31  <planetmaker> I guess all RV grfs just DO that
21:06:37  <planetmaker> but they explicitly do so
21:06:38  <Ammler> hmm
21:07:02  <andythenorth_> if there is an rv grf using same ids as default rvs, default will be disabled
21:07:08  <planetmaker> hm... no. It works. OpenGFX+ successfully just added the trams
21:07:16  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: sure
21:07:37  <planetmaker> and most newgrf do that. For the sake of TTDP compatibility
21:07:47  <Terkhen> the original engines grf also readds standard ships when using FISH, and I was happy without them
21:07:54  <Ammler> ogfx+trains didn't define all?
21:07:58  <planetmaker> nope
21:08:04  <planetmaker> It only defines the turbotrain engine
21:08:07  <planetmaker> and 4 wagons
21:08:08  <Alberth> andythenorth_: to be clear on the matter, you do the merge? (not that there is much choice, luckily)
21:08:10  <planetmaker> or 5
21:08:11  <planetmaker> dunno
21:08:40  <planetmaker> Alberth: it was meant as commit yourself ;-)
21:08:51  <planetmaker> (I'm 97.8% sure of that ;-) )
21:09:03  <Alberth> hence my question, I have no access rights there, luckily
21:09:04  <andythenorth_> wait for next brot announcement
21:09:06  <Ammler> I thought, it does disable all
21:09:12  <Ammler> but it seems only those which are defined
21:09:13  * Terkhen ponders coding a small grf just to define all standard road vehicles
21:09:21  <planetmaker> oh he. you con't commit via ssh, right?
21:09:22  <andythenorth_> Terkhen: would work
21:09:34  <andythenorth_> but HEQS needs moving to defines anyway....
21:09:36  <Ammler> so heqs should simply disable all rvs first
21:09:39  <planetmaker> Terkhen: then do it in NML and call it OpenGFX+RV ;-)
21:09:45  <planetmaker> it'd be a good start
21:09:50  <Ammler> then you can add originals.grf
21:09:58  <andythenorth_> Ammler: why disable default rvs?
21:10:05  <planetmaker> Ammler: exactly
21:10:05  <andythenorth_> HEQS is quite different to default
21:10:07  <planetmaker> why?
21:10:08  <Terkhen> yeah, originals.grf works, but it also adds standard ships and I hate them
21:10:15  <Alberth> planetmaker: I assumed the project needs to list me as someone it knows first :)
21:10:24  <Ammler> aren't some rvs twice now?
21:10:26  <planetmaker> Alberth: not if you use ssh in order to commit
21:10:42  <Alberth> oh, ok
21:10:48  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1464:f555196b6b1c: Feature: update Dutch translation (Al... (andythenorth) @
21:10:49  <planetmaker> not sure whether you use ssh or your redmine credentials
21:10:52  <Terkhen> planetmaker: how should I start? cloning newgrf_makefile?
21:11:10  <planetmaker> Terkhen: not cloning ;-)
21:11:10  <Terkhen> Ammler: no, they appear only once
21:11:25  <planetmaker> Easiest, if you ask me, is to copy OpenGFX+Trains
21:11:30  <Alberth> planetmaker: neither do I :)
21:11:32  <Alberth> good night
21:11:36  <andythenorth_> who wants to do the release :)
21:11:36  <andythenorth_>
21:11:39  <planetmaker> And just cut away everything related to trains
21:11:42  <Ammler> also, that originals.grf should be renamed to defaults.grf
21:11:44  <planetmaker> g'night Alberth
21:11:45  <Terkhen> good night Alberth
21:11:48  <andythenorth_> good night
21:11:50  <Ammler> and uploaded to bananas
21:12:12  *** Alberth has left #openttdcoop.devzone
21:12:26  <andythenorth_> I am not releasing tonight (tired)
21:12:32  <planetmaker> good choice
21:12:34  <andythenorth_> but if any of you want to, feel free :)
21:12:36  <Terkhen> planetmaker: okay, let's see what I can do
21:12:39  <planetmaker> a release when tired always fails
21:12:44  <andythenorth_> it's all commited
21:12:49  <planetmaker> changelog?
21:12:52  <andythenorth_> yup done
21:12:53  <planetmaker> readme update?
21:12:54  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Support #1598 (Closed): Update translations prior to 0.5 (andythenorth) @
21:12:57  <andythenorth_> hmm
21:13:00  <andythenorth_> didn't do the readme
21:13:46  <planetmaker> Terkhen: I could also create the project for you kinda empty and you start...
21:15:13  <Terkhen> planetmaker: whichever is easier :)
21:15:14  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1619 (New): Update readme for 0.5 (andythenorth) @
21:15:23  <planetmaker> Terkhen: depends for whom ;-)
21:15:24  <Ammler> planetmaker: what happens, if you add originals.grf?
21:15:32  <planetmaker> Ammler:  I never did, I guess
21:15:36  <Ammler> you have some engines twice?
21:16:05  <Terkhen> newgrf_makefile should be the default starting point, right?
21:16:40  <Ammler> andythenorth_: no, it is fine
21:16:41  <planetmaker> Well. Easier would be to copy the trains one and just edit a few things. As it's configured for NML and you have the whole structure nicley
21:17:02  <Terkhen> okay, then I'll do that
21:17:03  <planetmaker> ogfx-trains is quite up to date.
21:17:13  <planetmaker> newgrf-makefile is by default configured for NFO still
21:17:14  <Ammler> andythenorth_: I thought, if you add originals.grf, the defaults are twice, which seems not the case
21:17:16  <planetmaker> so more work ;-)
21:17:34  <Ammler> Alberth: has no ssh access
21:17:43  <planetmaker> ok
21:18:18  <planetmaker> Terkhen: if you like... I should have done it by half past 11 ;-)
21:18:36  <Terkhen> what, the empty project?
21:19:00  <planetmaker> the configured project w/o any changes but a GRFID and name
21:19:28  <Terkhen> oh, great :)
21:21:57  <andythenorth_>  /me bed time
21:21:59  <andythenorth_> good night
21:22:10  <Terkhen> good night andythenorth_
21:22:21  *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC
21:23:08  <Ammler> Terkhen: clone newgrf_makefile and run ./update ../newrepo
21:26:40  <Terkhen> does it need much changes to use NML?
21:26:48  <Ammler> pm, create the project before 23.21 ;-)
21:27:36  <Ammler> ah, 28 is still pre half past
21:27:42  <planetmaker> hm?
21:28:05  <Brot6> repository /home/ottdc/hg-repos/ogfx-rv registered in Redmine with url /home/ottdc/hg-repos/ogfx-rv
21:28:05  <Brot6> repository /home/ottdc/hg-repos/ogfx-rv created
21:28:20  <Ammler> (the cron does create new repos every 7 minutes)
21:28:40  <Ammler> nightly andy
21:30:27  <planetmaker> ah
21:32:38  <planetmaker> damn. two minutes too slow :-(
21:32:48  <planetmaker> ^ Terkhen :-)
21:32:59  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 0:364f6595d84d: Add: Initial import (planetmaker) @
21:33:08  <planetmaker> default =
21:33:48  <Terkhen> thank you :)
21:33:57  <planetmaker> you're welcome :-)
21:34:11  <planetmaker> It compiles. It has the proper name.
21:34:24  <planetmaker> But... I didn't check everything closely. But... *should* work
21:34:33  <planetmaker> credits should also be right ;-)
21:35:11  <planetmaker> as .hgignore and description
21:36:05  <Terkhen> make outputs "cat: ogfx-rv.nml: No such file or directory" two times, but it builds and installs fine
21:36:20  <planetmaker> yes. Known bug :-(
21:36:40  <planetmaker> makefile bug actually
21:36:49  <planetmaker> but of no consequence
21:36:52  <Terkhen> okay
21:37:17  <planetmaker> so... rather glitch than bug :-)
21:38:35  <Terkhen> hmmm... I'm thinking on a parameter to decide between "redefine all standard road vehicles" or "use only the refittable vehicles"
21:39:40  <planetmaker> Well. I'd go a similar approach like for train wagons:
21:40:06  <planetmaker> I defined about 5. But a bulk wagon refitted to coal uses default coal. ore default ore graphics etc
21:40:09  <planetmaker> Then you don't need that
21:40:32  *** ODM has quit IRC
21:40:35  <planetmaker> you just use the "new" ones, but still have all
21:40:48  <planetmaker> BUT it'd give new graphics for those using the TTD base set
21:40:57  <planetmaker> which is what ogfx+trains does
21:41:21  <planetmaker> but otherwise I cannot show different graphics for different cargos etc (all varaction2 stuff requires my own graphics there, IIRC)
21:41:37  <planetmaker> if it doesn't... I'm happy to learn differently
21:42:06  <planetmaker> In any case: I'd first start with just modifying a truck which becomes refittable
21:42:22  <planetmaker> And worry about the parameter later when we have also with vehicles all cargos covered
21:42:37  <planetmaker> Maybe it's a good idea to copy the CTT from the trains
21:42:50  <planetmaker> and to use even the refit scheme as for those wagons.
21:42:53  <planetmaker> but not sure
21:43:33  <Terkhen> yes, the refit scheme should be identical
21:43:55  <Terkhen> I still don't know anything about varactions so I can't help you there :P
21:44:03  <planetmaker> then 5 trucks shall be fine
21:44:12  <planetmaker> Terkhen: just look at one wagon :-)
21:44:21  <planetmaker> very easy if you look at it
21:45:32  <planetmaker> switch (FEAT_ROADVEHICLE, SELF, some_switch_name, cargo_label) { ... }
21:45:36  <planetmaker> or alike
21:46:31  <planetmaker> backdraw of the method: you really need to supply all sprites anew
21:47:04  <planetmaker> which is quite a bit of work
21:47:27  <planetmaker> it was easy for the wagons as I got those sprites already in a very very convenient format
21:47:51  <Terkhen> it seems to be missing an entry for readme.txt at .hgignore
21:48:02  <planetmaker> oh, yes, might be :-)
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21:54:38  <Ammler> planetmaker: is ogfx-trains on bananas, if no, why not? :-)
21:54:54  <planetmaker> Ammler: it's not (yet)
21:55:40  <planetmaker> why not? It's still in its infancy. But it could actually go there as 0.1.0 when I disable current maglev and monorail wagons
21:56:00  <planetmaker> possibly it should go there quickly ;-)
21:56:18  <Terkhen> hmm... it seems that the first commit will be a cleanup :P
21:56:23  <planetmaker> :-P
21:56:28  <planetmaker> did I miss so much?
21:58:36  <Terkhen> the readme.txt from ogfx-trains is in the repo
21:58:46  <Terkhen> besides that everything seems fine
21:59:06  <planetmaker> yes, there's a readme... but... isn't it saying ogfx-rv?
21:59:19  <planetmaker> I *did* change the readme...
21:59:27  <planetmaker> did I change it in the wrong dir?
21:59:42  <Terkhen> readme.ptxt is fine
21:59:56  <Terkhen> but the old readme.txt is in the repo too
21:59:57  <planetmaker> yes. There's a readme.txt in the repo?
22:00:00  <planetmaker> damn
22:00:08  <planetmaker> that must go
22:00:16  <Terkhen> yeah, I'm commiting it out
22:00:20  <planetmaker> thanks
22:00:55  <planetmaker> oh... readme.txt, 5. License: Add your name. There I forgot it
22:00:58  <Ammler> pm, and add default.grf :-)
22:01:13  <planetmaker> Ammler: I'm not an author of it.
22:01:31  <planetmaker> also the license chapter still has wrong links
22:02:51  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 1:a51882f8ec84: Cleanup: Remove an unneeded file. (Terkhen) @
22:09:49  <Terkhen> hmmm... UTF-8
22:11:22  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 2:4aae51fa7f3f: Doc: Correct license part of the readme. (Terkhen) @
22:14:44  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Revision 3:753827e2a978: Fix: convert readme.ptxt to UTF-8. (Terkhen) @
22:15:20  <Terkhen> ^ this proves that I should get some sleep before going on with this
22:15:23  <Terkhen> good night
22:15:36  <planetmaker> :-D
22:15:39  <planetmaker> Good night
22:24:54  <Ammler> [00:01] <planetmaker> Ammler: I'm not an author of it. <-- of?
22:25:28  <Ammler> I meant, you should add all default vehicles to the ogfx+
22:26:11  <planetmaker> ah
22:26:30  <planetmaker> actually, as said: I'm not sure it really makes sense when I want all cargos
22:26:47  <planetmaker> It then IMHO makes sense to re-define a few and give them many refit options.
22:27:04  <planetmaker> Where those refit options are those default vehicles
22:27:22  <planetmaker> And it'd make the purchase list a bit less bulky
22:27:43  <planetmaker> Like one flatbed truck being refit to wood, steel, piece goods (containers)
22:27:59  <planetmaker> where for wood and steel the default steel + wood sprites would be used
22:28:33  <planetmaker> it just doesn't make sense to provide about 50 trucks, one for each cargo type
22:28:56  <planetmaker> personally I like refitable vehicles also more: you can use them for more interesting orders
22:51:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 41:aea0e011faa1: Add: Maglev and Monorail support for the (default) ta... (planetmaker) @
22:51:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 42:e05a4c3d271f: Add: Some sort of crude tracking table (planetmaker) @
22:54:45  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 43:4b6403e2bc08: Add: Maglev and Monorail support for the (default) fl... (planetmaker) @
22:57:37  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 44:ba4754ebfeda: Add: Maglev and Monorail support for the (default) pi... (planetmaker) @
23:00:47  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 45:02efd369fe6b: Add: Maglev and Monorail support for the (default) re... (planetmaker) @
23:15:25  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 46:357bbeee1c03: Change: Remove unneeded monorail and maglev wagons (planetmaker) @
23:15:25  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 47:6b394cf1ad56: Fix (r41-r45): Use unique identifiers. It really helps (planetmaker) @
23:17:13  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Feature #1620 (New): Use separate sprites for maglev and monorail tank wagon (planetmaker) @
23:19:40  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Feature #1621 (New): Special sprites for monorail and maglev flatbed wagon (planetmaker) @
23:19:41  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Feature #1622 (New): Special sprites for monorail and maglev piecegoods wagon (planetmaker) @
23:19:41  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Feature #1623 (New): Special sprites for monorail and maglev refrigerated wagon (planetmaker) @

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