Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 5th November 2010:
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00:24:03  *** Lakie has quit IRC
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07:52:47  *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone
08:28:53  <dih> morning odm
08:28:58  <dih> found another thing ^^
08:29:01  <dih> ini4j :-)
08:30:41  <dih> simple and small :-P
08:38:37  <ODM> mornin
08:38:44  <dih> :-D
08:38:44  <dih> hi
08:44:40  <Brot6> Grapes - Feature Request #1752: Generic Configuration Support (dih) @
08:51:37  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Document: Ground and house tile graphics template (planetmaker) @
08:51:37  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - tile_template.png (planetmaker) @
09:13:51  <dih> what would be the gutfeeling if in a ini config file a section were named [] ?
09:14:12  <dih> or does someone have a better idea?
09:35:31  <planetmaker> what would the section contain?
09:35:39  <planetmaker> and... why not just IRC?
09:35:50  <planetmaker> or channelname.irc?
11:54:09  *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone
12:16:01  <dih> it would contain configuration of a plugin
12:16:11  <dih> and that would be the package name of the plugin
12:16:28  <dih> in order to spare confusion over multiple plugins, etc.
12:25:11  <Ammler> what does "berries" mean?
12:25:45  <planetmaker> Beere? But otherwiese... no idea
12:31:51  <Ammler> hmm, so another name for plugin?
12:32:17  <planetmaker> not sure. ask dih what his plethora of names are meant to indicate
12:32:22  <planetmaker> I lost track of what is what
12:32:27  <Ammler> :-)
12:42:21  <ODM> a grape consists of a multitude of berries
12:51:45  <dih> :-)
12:51:47  <dih> aye ^^
12:52:34  <dih> however, it should symbolize the entire package name the plugin is in
12:52:44  <dih> in java your code (usually) is in packages
12:53:04  <dih> so i could package e.g. in
12:53:09  <planetmaker> aye, that's a logic which definitely is not immediately visible, though :-)
12:53:12  <dih> then the section would be called []
12:53:24  <dih> planetmaker, hihi - no :-D
12:53:44  <planetmaker> though the singlar of 'grapes' is 'grape'
12:53:50  <planetmaker> berries grow on different plants
12:54:04  <dih> yes, but what we understand 'grape' to be, is actually not correct
12:54:20  <dih> as what we name 'grape' is either a grape berry or just 'berry'
12:54:30  <dih> and a grape consists of multiple berries
12:54:40  <planetmaker> there is no such word as 'grape berry'
12:54:52  <planetmaker> one single fruit is a grape :-)
12:54:57  <dih> same in german language
12:55:13  <dih> 'traube' is not the single 'bere' ;-)
12:55:28  <dih> but all those connected to one bunch
12:55:52  <planetmaker> Oh, of course. "Eine Traube" = one single one
12:56:06  <planetmaker> as it can be also a "bunch of grapes" ;-)
12:56:06  <dih> talk to those who make wine ;-)
12:56:26  <planetmaker> yes. But wine especially has no berries. Neither singular nor plural.
12:56:30  <dih> ...
12:56:43  <planetmaker> grapes grow in grapes ;-)
12:56:47  <dih> ...
12:56:48  <planetmaker> or in a bunch of grapes
12:56:54  <dih> "rede mit den weinbauern"
12:56:56  <dih> ;-)
12:57:42  <planetmaker> In German you can say "Weinbeere". But you cannot translate it to 'berry'
12:57:51  <planetmaker> even though, "Weinbeere" is more uncommon ;-)
12:58:32  <dih> they do
12:58:36  <dih> i looked it up ^^
12:59:00  <dih> i did do a portion of looking for that ^^
12:59:40  <Rubidium> pff... I wouldn't care about the precise definition of berry
12:59:53  <Rubidium> it's totally messy anyhow
13:00:18  <planetmaker> dih: none of my dictionaries translates "Weintraube" (sg) to berry
13:00:25  <planetmaker> neither offline nor online.
13:00:32  <planetmaker> Which means 5 different dictionaries disagree
13:00:36  <dih> because the Weintraube is not the berry?
13:00:41  <planetmaker> yes
13:01:18  <Rubidium> babygrape isn't a berry
13:01:23  <Rubidium> strawberry isn't a berry
13:01:35  <planetmaker> :-) also that
13:01:41  <planetmaker> stawberries, interestingly, are nuts
13:01:44  <Rubidium> bananas are berries
13:06:17  <dih>
13:06:18  <Webster> Title: Understanding grape berry development | Practical Winery & Vineyard Magazine (at
13:08:42  <dih> planetmaker, how about that for a read
13:09:46  <planetmaker> it only helps to prove the point that it's confusing terminology ;-)
13:10:02  <dih> i never said anything against that :-P
13:10:08  <planetmaker> :-)
13:10:40  <dih> i am merely making my point that what we name 'grape' is actually called a berry
13:10:53  <dih> and the grape itself is a bunch of those berries
13:13:00  <planetmaker> :-)
13:15:03  <planetmaker> so your berries are plug-ins to the grape(-stern)?
13:16:00  <dih> :-)
13:16:40  <dih> i was going to make a subproject, to Grapes, called Berries
13:16:57  <dih> and keep all those in one place that we develop and maintain
13:17:14  <planetmaker> good that we clarified that :-P :-)
13:17:28  * dih feels like being a xiong :-(
13:23:31  <planetmaker> that's a long way till there
13:27:31  <dih> :-P
14:54:17  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1010:24a6594ce8c2: Codechange; merge several cases for expression... (yexo) @
14:54:17  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1011:bbb408bb3233: Cleanup: remove all CONFIGFLAG_* constants (yexo) @
14:54:17  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1013:3d4eced62f88: Feature #1754: some ttdpatch flags are now ava... (yexo) @
14:54:19  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1012:1cf124283c65: Add: introduce code to handle read-only Specia... (yexo) @
14:57:42  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Code Review #1754: ttdpatch_flags / config_flags (yexo) @
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17:10:40  <Brot6> nml: update from r1000 to r1013 done -
17:19:49  <Brot6> firs: update from r1483 to r1487 done (3 errors) -
17:20:22  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r635), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r71), airportsplus (r69), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r7), comic-houses (r71), fish (r415), frenchtowns (r4), grfcodec (r786), heqs (r479), indonesiantowns (r38), manindu (r5), metrotrackset (r56), newgrf_makefile (r220), nml (r1013), nutracks (r117), ogfx-trains (r87), ogfx-trees (r41), opengfx (r554), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97),
17:20:22  <Brot6> smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45), swedishrails (r188), swisstowns (r21), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r23), worldairlinersset (r667)
17:22:10  <Brot6> indonesiantowns: compile of r38 still failed (#1755) -
17:25:00  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: airportsplus, belarusiantowns (3 errors) (Diffsize: 21), frenchtowns (4 errors) (Diffsize: 9), manindu, ogfx-trains (1 errors), swedishrails, swisstowns
17:38:09  <frosch123> what does the compilefarm compare for the "rebuilds"? also the resulting .grf being binary equal?
17:38:48  <Ammler> frosch123: indirect with the md5sum
17:40:15  <frosch123> ok, i would expect that changes in nml would result in slightly different .grf (with same behaviour)
17:44:29  <planetmaker> sometimes yes
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19:06:35  <andythenorth_> evenings
19:10:00  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: update from r21077 to r21089 done -
19:11:29  <andythenorth_> Terkhen: hi
19:11:34  <andythenorth_> how's the speed patch coming?
19:19:12  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r21077 to r21089 done -
19:20:32  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r21089 still failed (#1658) -
19:43:37  <Terkhen> andythenorth_:  <--- it has grown up a little
19:43:47  <Terkhen> I still have to check some things, but it is almost finished
19:43:49  <dih> \o/
19:43:57  <dih> ODM: i think the config stuff is sorted ^^
19:44:04  <Brot6> Grapes - Revision 14:d9fd67799278: Add: support for ini style config files (dih) @
19:44:04  <dih> ls
19:44:04  <Brot6> Grapes - Revision 15:34a44a44e692: Change: make use of the Config and ConfigSection class, move c... (dih) @
19:44:04  <Brot6> Grapes - Revision 16:bfa2996b1a2d: Add: dependency to ini4j (dih) @
19:44:12  <Terkhen> it could use some testing to make sure that nothing is broken
19:50:09  <Terkhen> bbl
19:51:07  <planetmaker> dih: wrong window :-P
19:51:42  <dih> planetmaker, yes, i hoped nobody would notice :-D
20:05:57  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - tile_template.psd (planetmaker) @
20:20:07  *** DJNekkid has joined #openttdcoop.devzone
20:20:19  <DJNekkid> sorry for MOST likely asking a stupid question, but:
20:20:43  <andythenorth_> yes that was stupid :P
20:20:44  <DJNekkid> do i need any kind of argument to make renum/codec understand .png's?
20:20:53  <andythenorth_> :D
20:20:55  <andythenorth_> no
20:21:00  <DJNekkid> r786 of codec
20:21:01  <DJNekkid> and
20:21:07  <Rubidium> self-compiled?
20:21:15  <DJNekkid> yes
20:21:23  <planetmaker> libpng installed?
20:21:26  <Rubidium> you failed to install the libpng development stuff
20:21:31  <DJNekkid> r507 of renum
20:21:41  <DJNekkid> it seems like renum //'es out .pngs
20:21:43  <planetmaker> grfcodec repo has both
20:21:55  <planetmaker> the old nforenum repo is... old
20:21:55  <Rubidium> you need r782+ of nforenum as well
20:21:58  <andythenorth_> DJNekkid: is the png format correct?
20:22:18  <DJNekkid> andythenorth_: i assume so, but renum shoult not care about that?
20:22:47  <DJNekkid> hg pull -u
20:22:47  <DJNekkid> pulling from ssh://
20:22:47  <DJNekkid> searching for changes
20:22:47  <DJNekkid> no changes found
20:23:01  <DJNekkid> wrong one?
20:23:02  <Rubidium> you need to trash your nforenum repository
20:23:11  <Rubidium> as nforenum is merged into the grfcodec repository
20:23:42  <DJNekkid> aha :)
20:24:14  <DJNekkid> so where sould i pull renum from?
20:24:47  <planetmaker> it's part of grfcodec repo
20:25:05  <DJNekkid> so, no need to pull it separately?
20:25:13  <planetmaker> you pull grfcodec. you build it. and you'll have an nforenum there as well
20:25:18  <DJNekkid> aha :)
20:25:36  <planetmaker> (and some other stuff I never needed so far)
20:28:29  <ODM> already?
20:28:38  <ODM> youre fast dihL:P
20:36:07  <Ammler> don't use ssh anymore :-)
20:36:11  <Ammler> specially for pull
20:37:02  <planetmaker> ;-)
20:37:13  <planetmaker> it will be discontinued shortly, eh? ;-)
20:41:19  <DJNekkid> hmm
20:41:33  <DJNekkid> renum still //'s out my .png files
20:41:35  <DJNekkid> :(
20:41:52  <DJNekkid> updated libpng
20:41:57  <DJNekkid> updated symlinks
20:42:21  <DJNekkid> r786
20:42:24  <DJNekkid> of renum
20:42:26  <Lakie> What arguments are you running renum with?
20:42:28  <DJNekkid> and grfcodec
20:42:40  <planetmaker> DJNekkid: mind that it's _nfo_renum
20:42:41  <DJNekkid> i have absolutely no idea
20:42:45  <Lakie> I did remember some code which I did believe could coke on them
20:42:58  <planetmaker> you don't accidentially still call a very old version?
20:43:03  <DJNekkid> no
20:43:03  <Lakie> But, never caused me any issues when testing, neither Rubidium
20:43:11  <DJNekkid> nforenum -v from "anywhere" shows 786
20:43:14  <planetmaker> DJNekkid: which repo?
20:43:54  <planetmaker> and yes. OpenGFX compiles nicely. And it's 100% png
20:44:39  <DJNekkid> the same file with .pcx works as intended
20:44:43  <Lakie> My own test grf works fine withe the nightlies
20:44:51  <DJNekkid> (as voyager now uploads both png and pcx)
20:44:53  <DJNekkid> :D
20:44:59  <Lakie> DJNekkid, do you compile your own versions?
20:45:00  <DJNekkid> no upper/lower case error
20:45:04  <DJNekkid> yes i did
20:45:09  <Lakie> grfcodec -o ?
20:45:19  <DJNekkid> even did a remake after updated libpng
20:45:39  <Lakie> If that doesn't show png renum will probably choke and die.
20:45:39  <DJNekkid> it needs -o in the makefile? (planetmakers grf makefile)
20:45:46  <Lakie> No
20:45:53  <Lakie> When you run grfcodec
20:46:12  <Lakie> It shows supported output formats, png will only appear if it was compiled with png support
20:46:40  <DJNekkid> but my problem is nforenum
20:46:51  <Lakie> They are part of the same repo now?
20:46:55  <DJNekkid> it //'s out my lines with <file.png>
20:47:03  <DJNekkid> so they say
20:47:11  <Lakie> i.e compiling grfcodec, also compiles nforenum
20:47:21  <DJNekkid> and my nforenum is symlinked to the grfcodec folder
20:47:28  <Lakie> (Along with grfdiff, grfid, etc)
20:47:31  <planetmaker> hm, does it need -o?
20:47:45  <Lakie> No
20:47:48  <Lakie> Sigh
20:47:49  <planetmaker> not that I know...
20:47:52  <planetmaker> :-)
20:47:59  <planetmaker> sorry, I was slow reading
20:48:10  <Lakie> Basically, running grfcodec ith -o ? will show formats, usually pcx and png...
20:48:21  <Lakie> If its missing in grfcodec it won't be in nforenum
20:48:28  <planetmaker> DJNekkid: got a patch for me?
20:48:31  <Lakie> Since they are compiled by the same makefuile
20:49:13  <planetmaker> and yes, first check which graphics formats are avialable by what Lakie just told
20:49:55  <Lakie> If not provide the nfo(s) & spritesheet(s) for testing...
20:50:50  <DJNekkid>
20:51:12  <Lakie> You did run "grfcodec -o ?" ?
20:51:23  <DJNekkid> that is the output from that, yes
20:51:34  <Lakie> it says just -o
20:51:38  <Lakie> Not question mark
20:51:58  <Lakie> Its mentioned even in that help at the end of -o's line
20:52:18  <DJNekkid> aha
20:52:22  <DJNekkid> it saies pcx only
20:52:33  <Lakie> Then it was not compiled with png support
20:52:35  <planetmaker> then compile it with png support ;-)
20:52:42  <Lakie> hehe
20:53:02  <DJNekkid> i assume "make with pngsupport" dont work? :P
20:53:09  <Lakie> No
20:53:28  <Lakie> It uses libcpngconfig or something to identify if it can automatically
20:53:47  <planetmaker> libpng needs to be installed
20:53:54  <Lakie> (and zlib)
20:53:58  <DJNekkid> libpng was installed...
20:54:00  <planetmaker> and probably its devel package, too
20:54:11  <Lakie> Well, actually you'll need both devels?
20:54:14  <planetmaker> zlib is afaik a dep of libpng
20:54:18  <Lakie> True
20:54:20  <andythenorth_> any reasons I should do Kogut's request?
20:54:20  <andythenorth_>
20:54:22  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Development & Translations (at
20:54:54  <planetmaker> I didn't quite understand his request.
20:55:04  <Lakie> DJNekkid, on suse atleast its libpng-devel, probably libpng-dev on *buntu.
20:55:17  <andythenorth_> he wants the town effect flag setting for more cargos
20:55:20  <DJNekkid> this is centos
20:55:35  <Lakie> Same idea, libpng-devel. ;)
20:56:29  <DJNekkid> that should do it :D
20:56:38  <DJNekkid> atleast now it saies png on the -o ?
20:56:49  <Lakie> Yeah, should work now
20:57:06  <Lakie> As stated they are compiled together, if its in one its in the other.
20:57:14  <DJNekkid> yup
20:57:17  <andythenorth_> I don't know what will happen if multiple cargos have town growth flags set
20:57:18  <andythenorth_>
20:57:19  <planetmaker> :-)
20:57:20  <DJNekkid> and, nforenum now dont complain
20:57:58  <planetmaker> andythenorth_: I'd assume it all goes. As an _or_
20:58:18  <planetmaker> But maybe frosch123 knows that better :-) what happens when there are more town growth cargos defined
20:59:29  <frosch123> there are food and water
20:59:39  <frosch123> you can define cargos to behave like food or water
20:59:55  <planetmaker> it'd be an _or_ behavioru?
20:59:58  <planetmaker> *behaviour
21:00:10  <frosch123> if you define coal and steel to behave like food
21:00:23  <frosch123> then desert towns need water and (food or coal or steel)
21:00:31  <planetmaker> ok :-)
21:01:01  <andythenorth_> so it doesn't cause fail to define town effect for multiple cargos?
21:01:11  <planetmaker> obviously not
21:01:45  <frosch123> iirc the first cargoslot defines the text in the town gui
21:02:09  <frosch123> so if coal and food behave like food, and coal is in an earlier slot, the town will say "coal required"
21:03:00  <frosch123> but that is only "iirc" :)
21:04:25  <andythenorth_> hmm
21:05:13  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1749 (Closed): EMD DDA40X (Voyager1) @
21:05:13  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Revision 636:40e38acb4746: Add: Alot of png/pcx in preparation for including lots... (DJNekkid) @
21:05:13  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Revision 637:b201cb63cd18: Change: added some name-things to the spreadsheet and ... (DJNekkid) @
21:05:14  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Revision 638:bc98e245f4e3: Add: EMD DDA40X, close #1749 (DJNekkid) @
21:05:17  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1749 (Closed): EMD DDA40X (DJNekkid) @
21:05:30  <DJNekkid> that should make nekomancer happy :)
21:09:52  <Lakie> The adding of the vehicle, or changing most things to png? ;)
21:10:47  <DJNekkid> the vehicle part
21:11:02  <DJNekkid> ref: 2cc thread on tt-forums :)
21:11:09  <Lakie> Heh
21:18:47  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1758 (New): Shangai Transrapid (Voyager1) @
21:18:47  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1758: Shangai Transrapid (Voyager1) @
21:19:10  <DJNekkid> btw, totally oftopic: what broadcaster sends X-factor in the UK? BBC or some commercial one?
21:19:42  <Lakie> Its not BBC, iirc
21:20:03  <DJNekkid> oki
21:20:04  * Lakie thinks it was channel 4
21:20:17  <Lakie> But I don't watch it so wouldn't know exactly, lol
21:20:40  <andythenorth_> ITV
21:20:47  <Lakie> ah, channel 3
21:21:11  <DJNekkid> that cher-girl is rather awsome...
21:21:15  <DJNekkid> as an artist i mean :P
21:21:33  <DJNekkid> but if it were bbc one could probably watch it online, and not on youtube the day after :)
21:22:03  <Lakie> Heh
21:28:49  <DJNekkid> only a couple of missions from an upgrade from Leutanant commander to captain :D
21:31:41  <Brot6> Grapes - Feature Request #1752 (Resolved): Generic Configuration Support (dih) @
21:31:41  <Brot6> Grapes - Revision 17:1e6fb624c448: Change: give Plugins their section of the config (based on the... (dih) @
21:31:41  <Brot6> Grapes - Feature Request #1752 (Resolved): Generic Configuration Support (dih) @
21:36:31  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Revision 639:94244b67021f: Change: Name-bit added to mu-template as well (DJNekkid) @
21:41:40  <DJNekkid> hmm, two battleships were perhaps a tad much for a puny escort
21:42:03  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1758: Shangai Transrapid (Voyager1) @
21:45:07  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature Request #1759 (New): use full meaning of train property 22, visual... (planetmaker) @
21:53:43  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1488:c1b5223f5a08: Change: some more progress on Sugar R... (andythenorth) @
21:55:47  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1758: Shangai Transrapid (DJNekkid) @
22:01:34  <dih> is it possible to force a subproject to use the parents project issue tracking?
22:08:02  <planetmaker> not that I know
22:08:30  <planetmaker> though it depends a bit on what you mean with 'use parent's project issue tracking'
22:09:52  <planetmaker> switch(FEAT_TRAINS, SELF, passenger_wills280_reversed_pos_switch, (position_in_consist_from_end - 1) < count_veh_id(7) ) { <-- with that expression I'd expect to get a value which is true for anything smaller than the amount of engines with ID7 within the consist
22:09:59  <planetmaker> but... it seems not to work
22:10:11  <planetmaker>
22:10:16  <planetmaker> and
22:10:29  <planetmaker> any pointers of what I might do wrong?
22:12:19  <dih> i.e. issues reported to the subproject are listed in the parents project issue tracker
22:13:22  <planetmaker> that's afaik the default
22:13:25  <planetmaker> did you try?
22:13:29  <Rubidium> planetmaker: not providing text/plain mime type for the nml file? :)
22:13:43  <planetmaker> Rubidium: how do I do that?
22:13:51  <planetmaker> rename to txt, ok...
22:13:58  <Rubidium> fiddle with /etc/mime.types
22:14:26  <planetmaker> I'd need to be root for that ;-)
22:14:56  <Rubidium> but isn't joan the root of the berry tree?
22:15:03  <Rubidium> hmm, but that's dih's project
22:15:29  <planetmaker> the link I posted is also on the openttd not on the devzone server ;-)
22:16:02  <dih> joan handles network connection - Java OpenTTD Admin Network :-P
22:16:18  <dih> it's 'just' a lib
22:16:46  <planetmaker> and... text/plain is listed with nml added there
22:17:12  <Rubidium> should be text/plain for devs as well now
22:17:53  <planetmaker> it still asks me to download it
22:18:03  <Rubidium> yeah, that's your browser's cache
22:18:15  *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC
22:19:21  <Rubidium> nevertheless, my nml knowledge is quite small and the file is quite huge
22:19:57  <planetmaker> the interesting line is the one I quoted... which is 2205 in my editor
22:21:18  <planetmaker> but it's either of a) a lack of my understanding how count_veh_id(x) works b) (mis)implmentation of that in NML or c) something else
22:21:30  <planetmaker> what I basically need to get is the amount of engines in a train
22:21:55  <Yexo> position_in_consist_from_end is zero-based
22:22:28  <planetmaker> yes. But checkout the newgrf
22:22:40  <planetmaker> wills280 in arctic with passenger (again)
22:23:00  <planetmaker> it returns always 1 engine in reverse mode
22:23:11  <Yexo> is it already part of the repo?
22:23:17  <planetmaker> nope
22:23:52  <Yexo> ok, downloaded your grf
22:24:13  <planetmaker> <-- diff to current repo
22:25:12  <planetmaker> in reverse mode I get one engine drawn whether it has 1, 2 or 3 in reality
22:27:17  <Yexo> how to test it?
22:27:20  <Yexo> which climate / engine?
22:27:30  <planetmaker> wills280 in arcitc with passenger wagon
22:27:46  <planetmaker> I build three such engines and attached three passenger wagons. All one train
22:27:53  <planetmaker> let it run back and forth
22:28:42  <planetmaker> (yes, I know that I'm trying to do crazy stuff ;-) )
22:29:13  <Yexo> the steam effect still shows at the engine (which has the graphics of a wagon)
22:29:22  <planetmaker> yes
22:29:33  <planetmaker> but the amount of engines displayed changes
22:29:40  <planetmaker> that's what worries me more (now)
22:29:45  <Yexo> it changes?
22:30:01  <Yexo> oh, when reversed you mean
22:30:03  <planetmaker> the steam effect is something I haven't tried to get right too much
22:30:04  <planetmaker> yes.
22:31:06  <planetmaker> if it's a one-off error I'd exect with a 3engines-3wagons train to have at least two engines in reversed mode
22:32:44  <planetmaker> is it a logic error in the if condition?
22:33:04  <Yexo> not sure yet
22:33:20  <Yexo> it's at least off-by-one
22:33:32  <Yexo> position_in_consist_from_end < count_veh_id(7) <- should be this
22:33:37  <Yexo> last wagon has position_in_consist_from_end == 0
22:33:43  <planetmaker> yes
22:34:03  <Yexo> but actually that should cause an extra engine to appear
22:34:07  <planetmaker> ^
22:50:31  <Yexo> logic error / incomplete nml documentation
22:51:02  <Yexo> count_veh_id in a block with scope SELF will start counting from the current vehicle to the end
22:51:17  <Yexo> what you want is count_veh_id with scope PARENT, so it starts looking from the first vehicle
22:53:19  <planetmaker> ah... let's try
22:53:48  <Yexo> it's not easily possible currently
22:54:09  <Yexo> it needs #1625 to code it easily
22:54:09  <Brot6> Yexo: #1625 is "NewGRF Meta Language - Feature Request #1625: Implement "calling" another varaction2 - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
22:54:38  <planetmaker> hm... does it?
22:54:46  <Yexo> not really, but that would make it easier
22:55:55  <planetmaker> hm... just changing SELF to PARENT doesn't help really, indeed
22:56:04  <planetmaker> as one is SELF and the other PARENT scope, right?
22:56:13  <Yexo> in that case position_in_consist_from_end is also from the first vehicle, which you don't want
22:56:42  <planetmaker> indeed
22:57:05  <Yexo> I'm testing this now
22:58:43  <Yexo> I don't have the wills282.png file, so can't compile without changing more
22:59:43  <planetmaker>
23:01:53  <Yexo> it works :D
23:02:16  <planetmaker> hm... I just wonder why it needs that detour?
23:03:10  <Yexo> because count_veh_id needs to be called from parent scope
23:03:12  <Yexo> but it doesn't need it
23:03:50  <Yexo> this works too
23:04:30  <Yexo> I've added "(STORE_TEMP(count_veh_id(7), 3) & 0) | " to passenger_wills280_switch and replaced "count_veh_id(7)" with "LOAD_TEMP(3)"
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23:06:22  <planetmaker> :-)
23:06:34  <Yexo> what you actually need is r, but there is currently no way to code that in nml
23:06:37  <planetmaker> Looks neat. But slightly less easy to understand
23:06:53  <planetmaker> I wouldn't have an idea about that in nfo really
23:07:22  <Yexo> actually quite easy:
23:08:25  <planetmaker> simple yes. readable... not so much ;-)
23:08:26  <Yexo> there you can see the inefficiency: you can remove line 14 if you replace you do at line 15: s/|/r/
23:10:18  <planetmaker> :-)
23:10:28  <planetmaker> It only means there's potential for improvements
23:12:56  <planetmaker> thank you very much in any case for taking this amount of time for looking at this :-)
23:13:07  <Yexo> you're welcome :)
23:13:32  <planetmaker> next step will be the placement of the smoke ;-)
23:13:39  <planetmaker> and then... it nearly can be implemented
23:13:44  <planetmaker> on a per-wagon basis
23:14:09  <Yexo> per wagon per engine, right?
23:14:16  <planetmaker> it will need some more checks for uniform trains.
23:14:18  <planetmaker> yes
23:14:24  <planetmaker> or much more ifs ;-)
23:14:44  <planetmaker> luckily it's only 5 wagons
23:14:53  <planetmaker> and the engine code can be re-used
23:15:11  <planetmaker> as can the wagon display code
23:15:25  <planetmaker> so... "just" a few switches to check what needs drawing
23:16:17  <Yexo> I wonder when you'll run out of action2 ids
23:16:23  <planetmaker> :-)
23:16:34  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1014:afcd338bc4b7: Add: new escape sequences for some varaction2 ... (yexo) @
23:16:38  <planetmaker> How many do I have?
23:16:53  <planetmaker> or rather how many could I theoretically use?
23:16:54  <planetmaker> 256?
23:17:41  <Yexo> 256
23:18:08  <Yexo> and they are reuseable, but not as long as there is a reference later in the file
23:18:33  <Yexo> I tried to say: they can only be reused after the last reference to them
23:20:09  <planetmaker> yes...
23:20:37  <planetmaker> well. ... might be come an issue indeed
23:22:11  <Yexo> you're only using 24 right now :p
23:22:20  <planetmaker> well. so far :-)
23:22:37  <planetmaker> but maybe it'll work. As the real sprites don't count, do they?
23:22:53  <Yexo> the real action2's also count
23:23:16  <planetmaker> and then it's only 24?
23:23:25  <planetmaker> in the whole of ogfx+trains?
23:23:27  <planetmaker> hm.
23:23:28  <Yexo> yes (nml is quite good at reusing the ids)
23:23:58  <planetmaker> then let's see how to stretch the limits ;-)
23:24:24  <planetmaker> though honestly, the more I dive into this, it seems to me that it better would be part of openttd itself
23:25:56  <planetmaker> this = trains not magically turning around
23:26:12  <planetmaker> except in depots maybe
23:27:10  <Yexo> agreed, but it probably should only change for newgrfs that are designed for it
23:27:18  <Yexo> not for the default vehicles / old newgrfs
23:27:39  <planetmaker> yes.
23:27:48  <planetmaker> I thought about a flag similar to MU
23:27:53  <planetmaker> or 2cc
23:28:01  <planetmaker> maybe even at the same place
23:28:57  <Yexo> than there is the problem of implementing it in openttd
23:29:41  <planetmaker> yep :-)
23:34:54  <planetmaker> but for now I wish you and any other night owl here a good night
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