Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 12th December 2010:
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00:54:20  <Brot6> WebOTTD - Revision 76:9cda4e36553d: Codechange: move content controller to their own directory (avdg) @
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01:54:13  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Bug #1956 (Closed): Bundles Folders Dates not updated (athanasios) @
01:54:13  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Bug #1956 (Closed): Bundles Folders Dates not updated (Ammler) @
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05:33:21  <Brot6> Bundles Update: gd9d2bc2e 2010-12-12 cargodist   (
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08:37:58  <planetmaker> moin
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09:14:59  <andythenorth> hi
09:21:21  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 571:aa656cb54843: Feature #1959: Red-nose for all other toyland vehicles (DanM... (planetmaker) @
09:22:57  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #1959 (Closed): toyland road vehicles (planetmaker) @
09:37:08  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2012 (New): New York Central T-motor (EmperorJake) @
09:57:46  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1975: FLIRT (EmperorJake) @
10:12:02  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #1975: FLIRT (trainboy2004) @
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11:21:17  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 572:0238995e41a0: Change #1527: Slightly modified shore line tiles in the base... (planetmaker) @
11:48:07  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 573:37bd3b5696ef: Change #1527: Slightly modified shore line tiles for the ext... (planetmaker) @
11:49:34  <Brot6> NFORenum - Bug #2013 (Confirmed): nforenum warns about action5 sprite count for shore tiles in ba... (planetmaker) @
11:51:19  <Rubidium> planetmaker: you are aware that the spec state it isn't valid form non-OpenTTD base graphics sets, right?
11:52:00  <planetmaker> I'm aware that that is only valid for openttd base sets, yes
11:52:32  <planetmaker> you might be right, it possibly should be guarded with #ifnot ttdpatch
11:52:53  <Rubidium> it's far from trivial, at best, to determine whether it's only used by OpenTTD
11:53:03  <planetmaker> I know...
11:53:24  <planetmaker> I thought actually about something like checking for the grfID
11:54:06  <planetmaker> openttd base sets must have an ID where the first three(?) bytes are like opengfx-extra's newgrf. So skipping the warning in that  case might be appropriate
11:54:55  <planetmaker> Also it definitely it's not critical, but I just noticed when adding those new sprites and wondered whether that warning still needs disabling
11:55:34  <frosch123> imo this is a case for disabling the warning in the .nfo itself
11:56:13  <planetmaker> that's what we do now
11:56:46  <planetmaker> but it basically means that nforenum will always warn about that feature...
11:57:10  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2014 (New): GT1 (Voyager1) @
11:57:17  <planetmaker> which seems IMHO not... like what it should do. Warning about correct code
11:57:45  <planetmaker> It could also assume that anyone defining 10 sprites knows what s/he does
11:58:01  <planetmaker> but of course it will also fail. Probably earlier than later
11:58:31  <planetmaker> hm... updating grfcodec fails :-(
11:58:33  <planetmaker> src/data.cpp:1053: error: ‘fmemopen’ was not declared in this scope
11:58:49  <Rubidium> yay! :)
11:59:00  <planetmaker> I know...
11:59:11  <planetmaker> my bad
11:59:38  <Rubidium> then why did Apple declare fmemopen in stdio.h?
12:01:41  <planetmaker> ask them ;-)
12:03:37  <Rubidium> well... by what is it guarded? Maybe we need to define something
12:04:09  <Rubidium> ofcourse that doesn't quite help with 5.1.0 failing on Mac OS X
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12:04:51  <planetmaker> well. it compiles fine when I add && !__APPLE__
12:05:02  <planetmaker> but that's not the proper solution.... let me find out
12:05:23  <Rubidium> Makefile tries to detect whether fmemopen exists
12:05:29  <Rubidium> that's what needs to be amended
12:07:26  <planetmaker> where is that supposed to be found? /usr/include> cat *.h | grep "fmemopen" returns empty
12:09:30  <planetmaker> the comparison with 0 might not work:
12:15:56  <Rubidium> oh noes... you're saying Apple adds spaces to it?
12:18:03  <Rubidium> *why*
12:18:26  <Rubidium> that makes it *useless* in scripts
12:18:32  <planetmaker> not really...: [ `grep fmemopen /usr/include/stdio.h 2> /dev/null | wc -l` == 0 ] && echo "none" || echo "some" --> "non"
12:18:37  <V453000> andythenorth: we will be making a game specially dedicated for HEQS on our stable server :P feel free to join us
12:18:57  <planetmaker> eh...?
12:19:08  <Rubidium> then why does comparing it to 0 fail by make?
12:19:08  <planetmaker> why, V453000 ?
12:19:26  <V453000> pm: because he asked for testing?
12:19:32  <planetmaker> or something else defines WITH_FMEMOPEN
12:19:35  <frosch123> planetmaker: because it is no train game :p
12:19:55  <planetmaker> ah
12:22:51  <planetmaker> hm... make mrproper spawns a few of /usr/include/version.h:16:3: error: #error Never include this file directly. Use <lzma.h> instead.
12:27:12  <planetmaker> wait... that is bullshit... :S - it should use our version.h. Hmpf
12:32:17  <andythenorth> V453000: can't today (we're having christmas!) :)
12:32:22  <andythenorth> but remind me later!
12:34:39  <planetmaker> hm, that complaint about version.h only spawns when make mrproper is run twice, e.g. when the local one is not there anymore
12:34:41  <planetmaker> oh well
12:42:26  <planetmaker> well, actually, Rubidium, yes. wc returns leading spaces here
12:42:35  <planetmaker> I'll commit a fix
12:42:53  <planetmaker> which just sed's them away
12:43:57  <V453000> andythenorth: I wasnt really expecting you to, just wanted to give you the invite :p
12:49:59  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 816:eaa1098b32e6: Fix: Some 'wc' return leading whitespace. Cut it away (planetmaker) @
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15:19:31  <Ammler> andythenorth: if heqs waggons "jump" on curves, is that worth to report?
15:20:11  <Ammler> (just wonder, if that is fixeable or simply something you have to live with)
15:20:50  <Ammler> but they jump for example less on south->east curves as on north->east
15:21:13  <Ammler> (#openttdcoop directions)
15:21:17  <andythenorth> Ammler: worth reporting as a ticket
15:21:47  <andythenorth> I tried to fix all offsets recently, so it's supposed to be fixed...
15:22:07  <Ammler> yeah, I need to find out first, if that is a generic issue or just truck 6
15:27:53  <Ammler> mc kinely dump truck is fast :-o
16:04:25  <andythenorth> Ammler: HEQS is designed to compete with trains over short-med distances
16:06:33  <V453000> trams collide with some tram track poles btw :)
16:06:46  <V453000> when going south and east (our directions again)
16:07:16  <V453000> with right hand drive ...
16:07:52  <Ammler> that looks more like a glitch
16:08:00  <Ammler> of tram poles
16:11:36  <Ammler> doesn't happe with defaults
16:11:49  <Ammler> (default tram tracks)
16:26:15  * planetmaker wonders whether Ammler feels like coding a few sprites for OpenGFX ;-)
16:26:50  <Ammler> tickets?
16:27:14  <planetmaker> plenty
16:27:27  <Ammler> he
16:27:52  <Ammler> Code Review?
16:28:10  <Ammler> you really misunderstand that tracker :-P
16:28:24  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #1527 (Closed): Grid line of shore tiles (planetmaker) @
16:28:37  <planetmaker> :-) Well... how do you call it?
16:28:46  <planetmaker> The current sprites are fine.
16:28:51  <planetmaker> So is new sprite a feature?
16:28:57  <planetmaker> A bug?
16:29:11  <planetmaker> Or does it need a new category "Revise"?
16:29:25  <Ammler> feature or bug is fine
16:29:28  <Ammler> (imo)
16:29:44  <planetmaker> but neither is IMHO true
16:29:56  <planetmaker> new sprites are the graphical equivalent of code review
16:30:01  <planetmaker> pixel review maybe
16:30:08  <Ammler> hehe
16:30:28  <planetmaker> maybe update?
16:30:48  <Ammler> hmm, but you should also link to the tt-forums post
16:31:26  <planetmaker> many don't have.
16:31:32  <Ammler> which one shall I take?
16:31:41  <planetmaker> I got sent a lot by private mail from DanMacK and Zephyris
16:31:54  <Ammler> then tell them to use our tracker
16:32:23  <Ammler> at least zeph should be aware of it
16:32:24  <planetmaker> well, I did :-)
16:33:01  <planetmaker> but when you write with a person like "look at this sprite" etc, it's also natural to receive a possible update via private mail
16:33:26  <Ammler> you shouldn't :-)
16:33:37  <Ammler> you should create a ticket and assign it to him
16:33:51  <Ammler> and if he doesn't answer that, send him a mail to look at it
16:33:55  <planetmaker> nah. That puts unnecessary pressure onto them.
16:34:07  <planetmaker> But maybe I should encourage more to reply by opening a ticket
16:34:10  <Ammler> why is bad?
16:34:29  <Ammler> I mean, now you need to make the ticket yourself
16:34:30  <planetmaker> I wouldn't like anyone opening a ticket and immediately assigning it to me
16:34:32  <Ammler> uploading etc.
16:34:53  <planetmaker> yes. That's why I should encourage both more to create a ticket when they have new sprites
16:35:03  <planetmaker> But creating a ticket for them is not nice
16:35:09  <Ammler> what is difference between a ticket assigned to you and a pm?
16:35:35  <Ammler> the ticket you can reassign, the mail is harder to delegate :-)
16:36:21  <Ammler> again, which ticket(s) shall I take?
16:36:30  <Ammler> or doesn't matter?
16:36:35  <planetmaker> :-) Pick what you like
16:37:17  <planetmaker> maybe the ships would be nice
16:37:23  <planetmaker> they'd be something really new
16:37:42  <planetmaker> or the alignment of the maglev which you reported ;-)
16:42:28  <Brot6> Grf2Html - Feature Request #2015 (New): missing man page (Ammler) @
16:44:34  <Ammler> which group would you take for the grftools: ?
16:44:54  <Ammler> current is Development/Tools
16:46:14  <Yexo> Development/Tools/Building ?
16:46:27  <Ammler> and if you are at it, which for openttd?
16:47:03  <planetmaker> games/strategy/other
16:47:09  <Yexo> Amusements/Games/Strategy/Real Time or Amusements/Games/Strategy/Other
16:48:14  <Ammler> why other?
16:48:47  <Ammler> ans simulation is only 3d, so this doesn't fit anyway
16:50:11  <Yexo> I don't understand that reaction
16:50:19  <Yexo> "ans" ?
16:51:59  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Updated Sprites #2004 (New): Toyland ships (planetmaker) @
16:52:49  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Updated Sprites #2002 (New): New station building? (planetmaker) @
16:52:49  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Updated Sprites #2003 (New): New Toyland helicopter (planetmaker) @
16:53:54  <planetmaker> Yexo: ans == and
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16:54:35  <Yexo> ah
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16:54:38  <Ammler> and
16:54:44  <Yexo> well, that makes "strategy/other" the correct category
16:54:44  <Ammler> yep
16:54:52  <Yexo> it's "simulation", which is not listed, so "other"
16:54:59  <Ammler> afaik, simulator is used by openttd makefile
16:55:27  <planetmaker> what the makefile uses is not of importance to where you classify it...
16:55:53  <Ammler> well, the makefile does create the desktop file
16:56:03  <Ammler> which is then used by the menu
16:56:56  <Ammler> so it is imo good to have group and menu category (almost) the same
16:57:06  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2014: GT1 (Voyager1) @
16:58:03  <Ammler> (group is used for the software manager)
16:58:17  <dih> srupid db :(
16:58:37  * planetmaker steals an "r" from dih
16:58:44  * Ammler gives a t
16:58:48  <dih> :P
16:59:41  <dih> trains cancled, trains delayd....
17:03:40  <Rubidium> name me a moment when there are no delayed trains in any European country :)
17:04:36  <dih> delay of 20-60+ mins...
17:04:53  <dih> on _most_ trains
17:05:06  <Rubidium> I *might* sound harsh, but isn't that *always* the case with German trains?
17:05:12  <Rubidium> like...
17:05:36  <Rubidium> I used to go from university back to my parent and I'd try to catch the German train as that stopped less
17:05:58  <planetmaker> <-- that was ages ago, dih ;-)
17:06:00  <Webster> Title: Datei:DB-Werbung 1980er Jahre "Alle reden vom Wetter. Wir nicht.".jpg – Wikipedia (at
17:06:03  <Rubidium> however more often than not it would be delayed 30+ minutes, which wouldn't a big problem as the next train would go 5 minutes later
17:06:30  <planetmaker> meanwhile things were "optimized" :-P
17:06:37  <Rubidium> now they changed the schedule so the German trains behaves more like the Dutch train, which means the next Dutch train would come 30 minutes after the planned German train
17:06:51  <Rubidium> so now I like to avoid said German plane like the black plague
17:07:10  <avdg> here in belgium the nmbs can only guarantee better times in 2013 iirc
17:07:27  <avdg> 25% of the trains are in repair atm
17:08:20  <Rubidium> avdg: to be honest, I was happy the last two NMBS trains I used had a (slight) delay
17:08:36  <avdg> :)
17:08:36  <Brot6> grfcodec: update from r815 to r816 done -
17:08:42  <avdg> I have also less troubles
17:08:51  <avdg> but I planned a bit
17:09:04  <avdg> bit cheating actually :) (but sshhh)
17:09:31  <avdg> and the return trips I simply don't care
17:10:00  <Rubidium> but then... I thought the intercity was awfully short (3 "wagons"); shorter than Dutch sprinters (stop-at-all-station trains)
17:10:05  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2010: New Taurus graphics (Voyager1) @
17:10:24  <avdg> there aren't that many train types in belgium
17:10:40  <avdg> the fast trains have often red doors with white "walls"
17:11:26  <Rubidium> this was the train Rijsel - Luik though :)
17:11:51  <Rubidium> and a free tip: avoid French trains
17:11:57  <avdg> :p
17:12:17  * Ammler has more delays than the trains
17:12:34  * avdg had already bad experiences with charle de gaulle
17:12:37  <avdg> airport
17:12:41  <Rubidium> their service... well... can't say anthing about that. There is no service
17:13:13  <Rubidium> avdg: ghehe... been there as well, though had no trouble there (for a change) although I was in the TGV and stayed there :)
17:13:13  <avdg> dad reserved a train to early -> buy new tickets (to get the money back, but never saw it back)
17:13:24  <avdg> and the next train was 3 houres too late
17:13:36  <avdg> startup problems in spain :(
17:13:55  <Rubidium> avdg: oh, if in France trains don't go it's your problem
17:14:15  <Rubidium> or at least in the south of France
17:14:27  <avdg> :p
17:15:06  <Rubidium> 4 hour delay on going there... then there are no trains further so you have to take public transport... to get to the "next" station from where you can travel further
17:15:21  <Rubidium> can't they like arrange busses for stranded people?
17:15:30  <Rubidium> going back was even worse...
17:16:00  <Rubidium> knowing there are "some" problems, you go to the station *way* ahead of time to ask what to do
17:16:10  <avdg> hmm, does me remember the time planes couldn't fly
17:16:14  <Rubidium> they tell you to go to a next station and ask there
17:16:36  <Rubidium> at that station they tell you to go to the bus station (1 km away)
17:17:06  <Rubidium> where they tell you: the next bus to the next station that operates goes in an hour, however... the busses for the next 4 days are already full
17:17:17  <Rubidium> talking about useless...
17:17:27  <avdg> :p
17:17:46  <Rubidium> was so happy I knew someone there with a car... so he was nice enough to drive me from Nice to Marseille so I could eventually get home
17:18:08  <Brot6> firs: update from r1584 to r1585 done -
17:18:35  <Brot6> fish: update from r423 to r429 done (4 errors) -
17:18:59  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r686), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r75), airportsplus (r70), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r40), comic-houses (r71), frenchtowns (r6), grfcodec (r816), heqs (r553), indonesiantowns (r39), manindu (r6), metrotrackset (r56), newgrf_makefile (r238), nml (r1091), nutracks (r120), ogfx-rv (r78), ogfx-trains (r199), ogfx-trees (r41), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97),
17:18:59  <Brot6> smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45), swedishrails (r193), swisstowns (r22), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r23), worldairlinersset (r669)
17:19:20  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #2016 (New): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
17:19:44  * avdg is happy with the compact towns system in Belgium now :)
17:20:34  <Rubidium> what's that?
17:20:55  <Rubidium> just that the major towns are all relatively close together?
17:21:03  <avdg> yeah
17:22:24  <Brot6> opengfx: compile of r573 still failed (#2016) -
17:25:05  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: 2cctrainset (8 errors), 32bpp-extra (Diffsize: 1), basecosts, bros, comic-houses (2 errors) (Diffsize: 14), heqs, metrotrackset (Diffsize: 1), nutracks (2 errors), ogfx-trees, smts (Diffsize: 8), snowlinemod, transrapidtrackset (Diffsize: 12), ttrs (7 errors) (Diffsize: 1324), worldairlinersset
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17:27:48  <planetmaker> hm... md5sum: *.tar.gz: No such file or directory <-- without further info about the project which triggered it, such e-mail is not very helpful, Ammler
17:30:03  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 574:46f2e2577048: Fix (r572, r573): Add missing files (planetmaker) @
17:30:57  <Ammler> planetmaker: did you check the build error log?
17:31:28  <Brot6> opengfx: update from r569 to r574 done -
17:31:59  <planetmaker> Ammler: But the e-mail doesn't tell which
17:32:15  <Ammler> which email, can you paste?
17:32:38  <Ammler> I thought the content of the email is the same as the ticket
17:33:52  <planetmaker>
17:34:02  <Ammler> I really wonder, how you guys commit, that you always forget files :-)
17:34:19  <Ammler> maybe you jusgt work too much ;-)
17:34:49  <planetmaker> I compile. I check the diff, I check hg st.
17:34:58  <Ammler> planetmaker: that is a cron error msg
17:34:58  <planetmaker> And visual inspection sometimes fails
17:35:13  <Ammler> not about opengfx
17:36:02  <planetmaker> I figured as much, but... still not too helpful ;-)
17:36:22  <Ammler> well, fix it :-P
17:37:04  <planetmaker> :-)
17:37:33  <Ammler> somewhere isn teh is a 2>/dev/null needed :-)
17:44:12  <Ammler> pm, you forgot #2016 in the commit message
17:44:46  <planetmaker> meh. yes
17:45:07  <Ammler> :-P
17:45:29  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #2016 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
17:45:29  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #2016 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (planetmaker) @
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18:14:42  <andythenorth> hmm
18:14:51  <andythenorth> I'm missing how to hg up to 1.0.5
18:15:20  <planetmaker> I told you in OpenTTD ;-)
18:15:25  <planetmaker> in #openttd
18:15:31  <Ammler> not possible without patch
18:15:48  <andythenorth> planetmaker: thanks
18:15:55  <Yexo> you can't "hg up" a trunk checkout to 1.0.5
18:16:10  <planetmaker> yeah. But I'm sure he has svn, too
18:16:46  <Ammler> Yexo: also not 1.0 checkout
18:17:07  <Ammler> it misses the release diff, which is made in the tags branch
18:17:11  <Yexo> true
18:19:00  <Ammler> openttd svn has no tags, just branches :-)
18:20:13  <Rubidium> svn has no branches either
18:20:24  <Ammler> true
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18:44:21  <Yexo> currently valid syntax: switch(FEAT_INDUSTRIES, SELF, coal_mine_switch, (STORE_TEMP(param_1, 0x100) & 0) | current_callback) {
18:44:27  <Yexo> proposal for new syntax: switch(FEAT_INDUSTRIES, SELF, coal_mine_switch2, [STORE_TEMP(param_1, 0x100), current_callback]) {
18:45:01  <Yexo> basically allow an array of expressions in the switch-block, where each expression is evaluated in order and the last one is used as the actual switch value
18:45:25  <Yexo> the expressions before can be used to store values in the persistant/temporary storage arrays
18:46:14  <Yexo> the current expression doesn't guarantee any ordering at all, so setting a storage value and retrieving the value in the same expression leads to undefined behavior
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18:46:34  <Yexo> planetmaker: Hirundo: any comments?
18:48:51  <planetmaker> For a single value the [...] are not needed then, right?
18:49:19  <Yexo> nope
18:49:37  <planetmaker> not yes? ;-)
18:49:39  <Yexo> it's only an extension of the syntax, not a change to the existing one
18:49:49  <planetmaker> ok :-)
18:49:50  <Yexo> "it's not needed"
18:50:03  <planetmaker> then no objections.
18:50:28  <planetmaker> it's preferrable to a funny adding via |
18:51:25  <Yexo> 1) syntax is imo better readable. 2) it leads to better nfo (although the former case could maybe be optimized to the same, but that's harder work on nml's part, 3) you can use the value after you store it in a deterministic way
18:53:56  <planetmaker> so... I could also do like ... [STORE_TEMP(1, param_1), LOAD_TEMP(1)]
18:54:11  <Yexo> yes
18:54:14  <planetmaker> (which would be the same as using ...param_1 straight away)
18:54:27  <planetmaker> nice :-)
18:55:34  <Yexo> [STORE_TEMP(1, param_1*param_3*param_4/(some_other_calculated_value), LOAD_TEMP(1) > 0 ? LOAD_TEMP(1) : -LOAD_TEMP(1)] <- better example :p
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18:57:05  <planetmaker> hehe :-) yeah
18:57:44  <planetmaker> so basically it's means to put a whole chain of calculation into one switch
18:58:10  <planetmaker> if only a single list of decisions comes from it; saves a whole tree of switches
18:58:25  <Yexo> yep
18:58:49  <planetmaker> how many temporary storages are there? and how many permanent?
18:59:12  <Yexo> 32 permanents per industry
18:59:18  <Yexo> and I think 128 temporary
18:59:25  <planetmaker> and for nothing else permanent ones?
18:59:27  <Yexo> nml reserves a bunch of those for internal use though
18:59:34  <Yexo> airports will get them
18:59:38  <planetmaker> :-)
18:59:43  <planetmaker> But not like vehicles
18:59:47  <Yexo> no
19:02:53  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: update from r21469 to r21488 done (4 errors) -
19:03:50  <Ammler> 32bpp patch works quite long without update
19:05:23  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r21469 to r21488 done -
19:06:00  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r21488 still failed (#1965) -
19:10:21  <planetmaker> it hooks into the display / sprite system somewhat low-level. So... not something which is changed on a daily basis ;-)
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19:13:00  <andythenorth> bah
19:13:04  <andythenorth> my svn co has crashed
19:13:11  <planetmaker> eh?
19:13:16  <Ammler> use the source bundle then
19:13:30  <Ammler> releases have "hardcoded" version infos
19:13:33  <andythenorth> planetmaker: it got stuck on /debian/patches
19:13:47  <andythenorth> and now my terminal won't respond to ctrl-c
19:13:52  <planetmaker> what? debian/patches ?!
19:14:14  <planetmaker> what link do you try to checkout?
19:14:19  <andythenorth> svn co
19:14:58  <Ammler> os/debian/patches maybe
19:15:20  <andythenorth> yup
19:15:24  <andythenorth> that's probably the path
19:15:37  <andythenorth> I had to kill my terminal so I lost the output
19:15:43  <Ammler> which version to you playtest your grfs?
19:15:54  <Ammler> do*
19:16:05  <andythenorth> recent trunk
19:16:11  <andythenorth> depends on what features got added :)
19:16:18  <andythenorth> or what silly things I try and patch
19:16:20  <andythenorth> hmm
19:16:26  <andythenorth> I think I lost my nice landscape patch :(
19:16:31  <Ammler> you know, you can have multiple instances running at same time?
19:16:34  <andythenorth> I do
19:16:36  <andythenorth> indeed
19:18:52  <andythenorth> Ammler: stupid but it's what I have :)
19:19:24  <andythenorth> "OpenTTD Hovercraft" was the most pleasing
19:19:32  <andythenorth> until it crashed after about 30s :)
19:21:10  <planetmaker> let's see whether I can build a static binary for you ;-)
19:22:37  <andythenorth> I should be able to make it work myself :(
19:22:42  <andythenorth> this is silly :)
19:22:54  <andythenorth> all I want to do is lurk in a coop game :D
19:23:01  <planetmaker> I've no idea why the svn checkout fails for you...
19:23:07  <planetmaker> that's nothing special...
19:23:07  <andythenorth> me neither
19:23:21  <andythenorth> I'm going to try it again
19:25:12  <Ammler> andythenorth: lol
19:25:57  <Ammler> well, until the svn co works, try the release source bundle
19:26:22  <andythenorth> svn co works
19:26:30  <Ammler> or you can use my release.diff for hg 1.0 :-)
19:26:34  <andythenorth> ./configure works (whines about liblzo2)
19:26:45  <andythenorth> make run fails - no target 'run'
19:27:03  <andythenorth> hmm
19:27:07  <planetmaker> hm. it compiles, but doesn't link. Ok, no static binary
19:27:11  <andythenorth> no makefile at all
19:27:20  <planetmaker> ./configure
19:27:24  <andythenorth> maybe ./configure failed
19:27:44  <andythenorth> liblzo2
19:27:52  <andythenorth> I thought I had that :(
19:28:15  <planetmaker> ./configure --without-liblzo2
19:28:20  <planetmaker> and all will be fine
19:28:22  <andythenorth> done
19:31:10  <Brot6> #openttdcoop Client Patch Pack - Revision 23:1198cc5ef339: Release 1.0.5 (Ammler) @
19:31:10  <Brot6> #openttdcoop Client Patch Pack - Revision 24:168ba8b97dd8: Tagging 1.0.5 (Ammler) @
19:34:06  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r20801 to 1.0.5 done (74 errors) -
19:36:41  <andythenorth> planetmaker: how do I find the HEQS coop server?
19:36:49  <andythenorth> I can only see public / welcome / pro
19:36:53  <planetmaker> welcome
19:37:10  <andythenorth> thanks
19:37:16  <andythenorth> me goes to find a lot of grfs
19:37:35  <andythenorth> omg, the *old* newgrf gui :o
19:37:38  <andythenorth> I forgot that
19:37:57  <Ammler> @wiki grf
19:37:59  <Webster> GRF - #openttdcoop Wiki -
19:38:04  <Ammler> just use the pack here ^
19:38:15  <andythenorth> I think if I untar the one I got earlier, that should do it :P
19:38:28  <planetmaker> yeah. V453000 is a real newgrf - splatter fan ;-)
19:38:32  <Ammler> (you don't need to untar)
19:38:56  <V453000> hmm? :)
19:39:03  <V453000> oh :)
19:39:14  <planetmaker> :-)
19:39:47  <Ammler> well, using a lot grfs makes fun, if you know how to combine
19:39:59  <Ammler> V453000: even uses obsolete grfs :-P
19:40:11  <andythenorth> there's some kind of in game chat?
19:40:14  <V453000> which ones? :)
19:40:26  <planetmaker> andythenorth: enter
19:40:33  <andythenorth> thank
19:40:34  <andythenorth> s
19:40:36  <Ammler> PGS...
21:36:56  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2014: GT1 (Voyager1) @
21:37:44  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2014: GT1 (Voyager1) @
21:38:46  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2014: GT1 (Voyager1) @
21:43:11  <Ammler> andythenorth: has frame-lag > 40, what is broken there?
21:57:22  <dih> his connection
21:57:26  <dih> or his openttd
21:58:47  <dih> possibly he needs more time processing everything going on
22:00:21  <Ammler> hehe, his connection swappes between 50 and 2
22:01:08  <dih> you means his frame-lag?
22:01:21  <Ammler> yes
22:01:44  <Ammler> I have quite constant 2
22:14:07  * dih is looking for the "Eier-legender-wollmilch"-laptop
22:16:24  <Rubidium> that doesn't exist
22:16:42  <Rubidium> you have to compromise somewhere
22:16:58  <Rubidium> i.e. small and 17" screen doesn't quite work
22:17:35  <Rubidium> or a Hexacore Quad SLI laptop that works for days without recharging :)
22:18:37  <dih> i am looking for something in the 11" - 12" range, preferably 4GB RAM, i5 Processor, and a good 8-10 hours battery life :-P
22:18:55  <Ammler> 2.5k €
22:19:09  <dih> 1-1.5 should work
22:19:20  <dih> there are cheaper ones, but their support in linux sucks
22:19:27  <Ammler> specially the 8-10 hours battery
22:19:38  <dih> one of the ones i saw had a broadcom wifi chip...
22:20:33  <Ammler> what about ipad?
22:20:48  <Ammler> aren't those cool? :-)
22:20:58  <planetmaker> get an 11" macbook air, dih ;-)
22:21:05  <dih> they are worse than anything else, Ammler
22:21:21  <Ammler> we had some fun in the military with those
22:21:48  <dih> you cannot open up any tcp / udp connection you want - it has to go via some apple inc. transports
22:21:55  <dih> and with that, servers
22:22:20  <dih> you cannot install interpreters - java and javac aint allowed
22:23:19  <dih> need to check linux support for thinkpad edge :-)
22:23:27  <Ammler> we just used the car race demo
22:23:55  <planetmaker> the last laptop test those lenovo (and that's thinkpad) got quite bad support reports
22:24:01  <dih> sadly the thinkpad edge only has an i3
22:24:36  <Rubidium> but isn't that like 14"?
22:24:53  <dih> with sony i have to spend at least 1.2k, toshiba only has one model which matches the criteria ... for 2.2
22:25:03  <dih> Rubidium, there is an 11" one
22:25:13  <dih> 11.6 and 13.1 i think
22:25:53  <dih> dell only have their gaming laptop, which looks really really ugly :-D
22:26:21  <Ammler> I didn't buy a new dell because they had ati
22:26:22  <dih> macbook air does not even have an ethernet connection
22:26:23  <Rubidium> or you go to crappy netbooks
22:26:33  <Ammler> that is quite sucky with linux
22:26:35  <dih> why would i do that?
22:26:42  <andythenorth> macbook air sucks
22:26:42  <dih> i'd rather not buy anything at all
22:27:19  <Rubidium> if you have to go for a videocard you might want to consider the Intel ones; it's the only big-three-GPU-makers that works actively on the GPU code in the kernel
22:27:22  <Ammler> my current dell is quite much too good still
22:27:43  <Ammler> best pc ever
22:27:56  <dih> i would go for intel gpu
22:28:19  * andythenorth has 13" macbook pro and zero regrets
22:28:19  <andythenorth> well
22:28:21  <andythenorth> not about that purchase
22:28:23  <dih> simply because going for nvidia and ati will drain more power
22:28:27  <andythenorth> maybe other things I've done :P
22:28:33  <Rubidium> yeah, the reviews I read when I was considering a new computer said that ATI's Linux drivers were much better... well, they're still plain crap
22:28:33  <planetmaker> :-P
22:28:38  <dih> 13" is too big for me
22:29:00  <planetmaker> well... 13" is not that big
22:29:00  <dih> i think nvidia drivers are better
22:29:08  <dih> ati support sucks
22:29:19  <planetmaker> but 13" is not pocket size
22:29:23  <dih> :-)
22:29:23  <Ammler> currently nvidia sucks also a bit
22:29:32  <Ammler> I can't use KDE 4.5
22:29:36  <dih> my graphics works well here :-)
22:29:39  <Rubidium> actually, the ATI drivers I'm using now are working quite well
22:29:42  <andythenorth> macbook pro is also eye-watering expensive
22:30:02  <Rubidium> okay, they're from 7 months ago because whatever came after that was just crap
22:30:06  <planetmaker> well... you pay the same for the competition like sony vaios
22:30:08  <dih> "geldbeutel aus zwiebel-leder: reinschauen und heulen" :-P
22:30:33  <dih> quite true planetmaker
22:30:40  <dih> however sony does have more connectors ;-)
22:30:53  <planetmaker> yep :-)
22:30:54  <andythenorth> dih: I am pretty well equipped for connectors
22:30:56  <dih> e.g. esata, hdmi, vga, eth, ...
22:31:13  <andythenorth> esata I don't miss
22:31:20  <dih> without having to cary a bag full of usb devices and converter cables
22:31:37  <andythenorth> does anyone even connect devices any more?
22:31:49  <andythenorth> I used to connect stuff all the time, had chained usb and fw hubs
22:31:52  <planetmaker> sometimes an external HDD
22:31:52  <andythenorth> now....almost nothing
22:31:59  <andythenorth> camera
22:32:03  <planetmaker> and an USB stick
22:32:08  <planetmaker> and camera
22:32:14  <Rubidium> andythenorth: yes. I've connected 3 devices to my laptop at the moment
22:32:41  <planetmaker> mouse, keyboard and screen?
22:32:45  <dih> powersupply?
22:32:48  <dih> :-P
22:32:59  <Rubidium> mouse, power supply & DSL modem
22:33:24  <dih> you have a usb dsl modem? :-P
22:33:41  <Rubidium> nope, RJ45
22:33:52  <dih> and you connect to that directly?
22:33:55  <planetmaker> since I have wifi I never connected ethernet anymore...
22:34:02  <dih> heh
22:34:06  <andythenorth> I used to have mouse, trackpad, graphics tablet, monitor, scratch drive, scanner, printer
22:34:06  <andythenorth> keyboard
22:34:06  <andythenorth> stereo out, remote control
22:34:06  <andythenorth> video camera, webcam
22:34:06  <andythenorth> ethernet
22:34:08  <andythenorth> nearly all now gone
22:34:08  <dih> depends what i am doing
22:34:08  <Rubidium> dih: yes...
22:34:21  <dih> Rubidium, you do firewall your laptop right? :-D
22:34:36  <Rubidium> dih: why would I? DSL modem does NAT
22:34:56  <Rubidium> in any case, I have an wireless router but that's at my parents for logistical reasons
22:35:27  <dih> Rubidium, that's a dsl router, the dsl modem does no nat at all actually
22:35:36  <dih> and your laptop would have the public ip
22:35:40  <Rubidium> needed it for somewhere where I went from my parents home a while ago, went back to my parents home
22:35:42  * andythenorth doesn't suffer port envy any more
22:35:48  <andythenorth> but the macbook air is still dumb
22:36:05  <Rubidium> dih: I refuse to call it a router. It's too plain stupid for that
22:36:37  <dih> i once scanned the subnet the dsl provider stuck me in, then i checkt for usernames on the windows machines, and then i tried opening standard shares with usernames and no pw
22:36:39  <dih> :-P
22:37:00  <dih> windows terminal servers connected to the internet, without any protection :-D
22:37:02  <dih> lovely
22:37:30  <dih> at that time, looking around computers was not illegal, only looking at file contents one was not allowed to see
22:37:47  <dih> Rubidium, if it does nat, it routs :-P
22:37:50  <Rubidium> also it has *only* one RJ45 connector... so not really router-ish
22:38:26  <dih> i was rather amused by companies advertising for layer-3 managed switches
22:38:34  <Ammler> dih: did you check dell M101z?
22:38:36  <dih> i do ask why they do not sell them as 24 port routers :-P
22:39:13  <dih> Ammler: that has an amd processor
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22:39:27  <dih> i refuse to even consider amd processors :-P
22:41:20  <Ammler> yoh, the new dell 15" have again nvidia
22:41:49  <dih> i will probably give some companies a call
22:42:04  <dih> and try to lower costs by asking for laptops without operating system
22:42:35  <Rubidium> dih: that means that you won't get support either...
22:43:00  <dih> but i get warrenty
22:43:03  <Rubidium> as the fuctards at Dell support need Windows to diagnose the problem
22:43:03  <dih> which is all i need
22:43:32  <dih> well - i rather mean calling toshiba, sony and lenovo :-P
22:43:34  <Rubidium> I fucking had to install Windows so they could get the CPU/GPU temperature
22:43:43  <dih> lol
22:43:53  <dih> i would opt in for extended warrenty with extra services
22:43:59  <dih> e.g. next business day
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22:44:02  <Rubidium> but then the fucktards at Dell didn't know what tool to install, so they tried to (remotely) update the BIOS
22:44:25  <dih> HAHA
22:44:35  <Rubidium> which was a very wise choice as it overheated during the BIOS update and failed to do anything after that
22:44:51  <dih> i do think that is support i can happily do without
22:45:09  <Rubidium> so the sent another fucktard to replace the complete motherboard with GPU
22:45:35  <Rubidium> just to put a ginourmous amount of cooling paste between the chips and the coolers
22:45:47  <dih> LOL
22:45:49  <Rubidium> so it worked fine for 10 minutes and he left
22:46:21  <Rubidium> and now it fucking went into overheat protection for simply being turned on, instead of doing stuff
22:46:28  <Rubidium> so they had to send another fucktard
22:46:37  <dih> acer has a nice i5 11" laptop, but like i said, broadcom wifi chip :-(
22:47:05  <Rubidium> which had removed all cooling paste, and now it's cooling paste free and cooler than it ever was
22:47:46  <dih> it should not be allowed to be named cooling paste as of more than 0.1mm
22:48:00  <dih> thinkness, that is
22:48:28  <dih> anyway - little dih has to go to bed ^^
22:48:32  <dih> good night
22:48:38  <Rubidium> night
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22:57:00  <Ammler> hmm, just read on the proxmox forums, they recommend to use 32bit vps when possible
22:57:20  <Ammler> would need less memory
22:57:44  <Ammler> mäh
23:31:48  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r686), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r75), airportsplus (r70), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r40), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1585), fish (r429), frenchtowns (r6), grfcodec (r816), heqs (r553), indonesiantowns (r39), manindu (r6), metrotrackset (r56), newgrf_makefile (r238), nml (r1091), nutracks (r120), ogfx-rv (r78), ogfx-trains (r199), ogfx-trees (r41),
23:31:48  <Brot6> opengfx (r574), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45), swedishrails (r193), swisstowns (r22), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r23), worldairlinersset (r669)
23:32:41  <Ammler> planetmaker: your mail cron bug should be fixed...
23:32:55  <planetmaker> :-)
23:33:04  <planetmaker> No mails anymore? ;-P
23:39:49  <Ammler> no, fixed
23:39:54  <Ammler> not silenced :-P
23:43:22  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Revision 133:b9af5e13e680: [Compiler] multipatchset: (Ammler) @
23:44:11  <planetmaker> hehe :-)
23:46:19  <Ammler> I quite much never commit my changes :-)
23:46:39  <planetmaker> bad bad :-)
23:51:12  <Ammler> indeed indeed
23:51:31  <Ammler> hmm, building on the server with -j8 is fun
23:51:57  <Ammler> openttd building with setup of the chroot in 1min
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