Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 1st February 2011:
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05:24:23  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
05:29:14  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
05:33:27  <Brot6> Bundles Update: g6fcf912c 2011-02-01 cargodist   (
05:35:21  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
07:28:38  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (Voyager1) @
07:46:53  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
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08:08:58  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
08:19:05  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2228: r727 (EmperorJake) @
08:28:08  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2157: China Railways HXD3 (EmperorJake) @
08:37:08  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
09:32:14  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (Voyager1) @
09:34:21  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (Voyager1) @
10:54:21  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
10:58:06  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (EmperorJake) @
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11:30:38  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #2216: Naming of engines (Voyager1) @
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12:45:26  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2213: NS DH1 (Purno) @
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12:58:00  <DanMacK> Hey all
13:00:51  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (Purno) @
13:07:38  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (planetmaker) @
13:07:48  <planetmaker> hi DanMacK :-)
13:07:56  <planetmaker> you're always up very early recently ;-)
13:11:58  <DanMacK> Yeah...  start earlier at work
13:18:20  <planetmaker> Yexo, would it be possible and sensible for NML to get a command 'basesprites' similar to 'replace' which does the same except writing the actionA - thus allowing to write stuff for a base set?
13:18:31  <planetmaker> it'd be tremendously useful ;-)
13:19:19  <planetmaker> I'd like to start to employ something like that for OpenGFX as it eases work quite a bit...
13:19:30  <planetmaker> but so far output always needs post-editing which is not optimal
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15:30:22  <dihedral> hey ho
15:35:56  <Yexo> planetmaker: makes sense
15:36:12  <Yexo> nml still misses support for recolor sprites though
15:45:27  <planetmaker> I don't care for that so far.
15:45:57  <planetmaker> What I need now is using NML to generate some NFO output which I can use
15:46:08  <DJNekkid> doea anyone know where i can find a palette-file with the 8bbp palette?
15:46:20  <DJNekkid> im so sick of copy/paste into a file that i know works :)
15:46:36  <planetmaker> That way I can somewhat start the transition without actually requiring so far NML as a tool; I'd just add both, NML and NFO output generated by NML to the source
15:46:51  <planetmaker> DJNekkid, DevZone?
15:48:39  <planetmaker> Yexo, could I ask you the favour to actually add that to NML if it's not much hassle? I stared at it this morning / last evening but not quite got it working...
15:50:02  <planetmaker> <-- DJNekkid
15:50:18  <Yexo> sure, np
15:52:22  <DJNekkid> i was looking for a .pal file
15:53:08  <planetmaker> Well. There are photoshop and gimp palettes. As you don't tell what palette file you need...
15:53:17  <planetmaker> but I know of no others.
15:53:36  <DJNekkid> i know i saw one not too many days ago... arg!
15:56:26  <Ammler> you are using paint shop pro or which app does use .pal?
15:57:02  <DJNekkid> i.mage
15:57:20  <planetmaker> if you obtain it: make sure you upload it to the same place I just linked you
15:59:24  <DJNekkid> i'll just install gimp :P
16:07:49  <DJNekkid> oh jesus christ
16:07:54  <DJNekkid> an app in norwegian!
16:07:59  <DJNekkid> i HATE norwegian software!
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16:11:53  <DanMacK> Hey Lakie
16:15:48  <Lakie> Hi DanMacK
16:16:36  <Brot6> Nutracks - Revision 176:c7a785ac7a6a: Change: New High Speed Tracks (230kmh) gfx (DJNekkid) @
16:20:58  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1140:196e4b0807af: Feature: base_sprites block, works the same as... (yexo) @
16:21:32  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1141:1d93229c097d: Fix: don't forget to hg add new files (yexo) @
16:21:33  <Yexo> planetmaker: NML syntax: base_sprite [block_name]([default_file]) { ..real sprites.. }
16:21:48  <Yexo> so same as replace-block but without the spritenumber
16:24:15  <planetmaker> Well. Sprite number might be useful, too
16:24:39  <planetmaker> Because for base sets the sprite numbers have to be exact the chosen one
16:25:01  <planetmaker> They might only make sense for illustration purposes or for writing NFO, though
16:25:25  <planetmaker> I'd like nfo to show the proper sprite number :-)
16:25:25  <DanMacK> Some people have really odd issues with this game...
16:25:45  * DanMacK quietly looks in #openttd
16:26:41  <Terkhen> and they defend their solutions fiercely :)
16:28:35  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (DJNekkid) @
16:29:31  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2213: NS DH1 (Voyager1) @
16:30:37  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (V453000) @
16:32:44  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2213: NS DH1 (Voyager1) @
16:35:13  <Yexo> planetmaker: that'd make 2 optional arguments (file and sprite number) without a way to distinguish which one is given
16:37:01  <planetmaker> then I'd keep the sprite number actually necessary
16:37:15  <planetmaker> It would (later) possibly allow to check for sanity
16:37:35  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (Voyager1) @
16:38:00  <Yexo> I'm not sure I agree with that, the written sprite number is consecutive
16:38:04  <planetmaker> Let's say when we define a grf to be a base file, the sprite(s) xy really has to be starting with the sprite xy which is written to the file
16:38:19  <Yexo> if anything I'd rather have a commandline argument that prints sets the starting spriteid
16:38:22  <planetmaker> yes. But for a base set every sprite has to be at an exact number
16:39:13  <planetmaker> Well. I imagine that NML could maybe later feature an extension to the grf block which tells it to be a base set grf
16:39:28  <Yexo> a base set doesn't need a grf block
16:39:35  <planetmaker> Well, yes
16:42:39  <planetmaker> hm, how can the file actually be optional for real sprites?
16:42:50  <Yexo> filename can be part of the real sprite
16:43:17  <planetmaker> not must be?
16:45:06  <Yexo> both blocks result in the same output
16:45:58  <planetmaker> ah, I forgot the 2nd syntax. Thanks for reminding me :-)
16:46:14  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (V453000) @
16:47:09  <planetmaker> I still think that base sprites only make sense with a fixed number. It's not a variable which can be freely chosen
16:47:54  <planetmaker> So forcing it is a kind of implicit debugging mechanism, if numbers are not consecutive
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16:48:34  <planetmaker> quak :-) - maybe frosch has an opinion on that, or Ammler ;-)
16:49:07  <Yexo> planetmaker: but numbers have to be consecutive
16:49:14  <frosch123> moin
16:49:19  <Ammler> I wonder, how else you identify a base sprite?
16:49:24  <Yexo> the actual number in the nfo is never written to the grf file, it's just to make errors more readable
16:49:37  <Yexo> the order of sprites in the grf file is how they're identified
16:49:58  <Yexo> ie first sprite is 1, second sprite is 2. What the numbers in the nfo file said is not relevant
16:51:12  <Ammler> planetmaker: can you make a example, how it looks now and how it should look
16:51:21  <Ammler> I don't get where you miss the number
16:51:51  <planetmaker> the question is: should a command in NML for base set sprites require the sprite number to be given or not?
16:52:03  <Ammler> how else?
16:52:15  <Yexo> <- Ammler
16:52:23  <planetmaker> Yexo, the resulting sprites have to be consecutive. I could with one base_sprites command probably write 8 or so (e.g. a vehicle) - like with actionA
16:52:38  <frosch123> hmm, i read the logs, but i don't get the point... :)
16:52:47  <frosch123> planetmaker: do you want to code base graphics in nml?
16:52:53  <planetmaker> yes
16:53:11  <Yexo> planetmaker: even if you could specify the sprite number, nml can't do anything useful with it
16:53:11  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (DJNekkid) @
16:53:17  <planetmaker> I don't want to require it (now). But I want to make my live easier
16:53:22  <Yexo> as such I'm against including it, it's askig the user for more information than needed
16:53:27  <frosch123> Yexo: maybe an assertion?
16:53:34  <Yexo> that's the only use
16:53:40  <planetmaker> yes, quite a good one
16:53:48  <Yexo> but since the filename is already an optional parameter, we would have 2 optional parameters
16:53:54  <planetmaker> messing up sprite numbers in a base grf otherwise leads to assertions in OpenTTD
16:53:59  <Yexo> I don't see a good way how to handle that
16:54:06  <Yexo> unless we only allow the sprite number if a filename is given
16:54:16  <frosch123> but nevertheless, i don't consider nml suited for base graphics
16:54:23  <frosch123> is it only about sprite templates?
16:54:35  <planetmaker> frosch123, it is. Yes, it's about sprite templates. VERY useful
16:54:40  <planetmaker> with x and y offsets etc.
16:55:02  <planetmaker> the cpp templates are... bulky
16:56:37  <frosch123> well, i guess it makes no sense to combine base graphics with any other nml elements, e.g. there must be no "grf {}" tag, nor may nml write sprite 0. so basically the input needs quite different syntax
16:57:06  <Yexo> sprite 0 is only written if there is a grf-block
16:57:16  <planetmaker> frosch123, for now I'll be happy by a simple list of real sprites. And ...^
16:57:24  <frosch123> oh, so the grf block is already optional?
16:57:28  <planetmaker> yes
16:57:34  <planetmaker> always was ;-)
16:57:50  <Yexo> you won't get an action8 without one
16:58:15  <Yexo> it's useful for basesets but also to generate nfo files from nml to include in an nfo-project
16:58:17  <Ammler> Yexo: but you need it for a kind of offset, don't you?
16:58:25  <frosch123> and no a14 either, i guess
16:58:36  <Yexo> A14 is only written when needed
16:58:44  <Yexo> since all information is in the grf-block, it won't be written
16:59:01  <frosch123> you don't set the palette type in the grf block
16:59:08  <Yexo> hmm, good point
16:59:10  <Yexo> let me check
16:59:34  <Ammler> I don't see, how you will make the nfo without the sprite number
17:00:28  <Yexo> NML: base_sprites my_replace_name("8bpp_graph_sprite.png") { [-8, -8] }
17:00:36  <Yexo> generated nfo: 0 8bpp_graph_sprite.png 0 0 01 20 20 -8 -8
17:00:51  <Ammler> and where is that "0" from?
17:00:53  <Yexo> no need for a sprite number :)
17:00:59  <Yexo> consecutively numbered
17:01:08  <Yexo> first sprite is 0, second one is 1, etc.
17:01:15  <Yexo> it doesn't matter anyway
17:01:17  <frosch123> what kind of block is "base_sprites" ?
17:01:31  <Yexo> just "real sprites", without any other actions
17:01:41  <Yexo> basically a replace-block without writing the actionA
17:02:00  <frosch123> so something which only makes sense in base graphics? i.e. it is not nested in some action1/5/a/12 ?
17:02:03  <Yexo> a14 is only written when a grf-block exists
17:02:10  <Yexo> correct
17:02:32  <Yexo> actionA = replace-block (almost the same syntax but requires a sprite number)
17:02:41  <frosch123> but then you could add the spritenumber as optional parameter, which behaves as assertion, right?
17:02:43  <Yexo> action5 is replacenew-block, same as replace-block
17:02:54  <Yexo> yes, I'm trying to do that now
17:03:07  <Yexo> problem is: the filename is already optional, so we'll have 2 optional parameters
17:03:20  <Yexo> result: sprite_number is only allowed when you also give a filename
17:04:07  <frosch123> what does it do without a filename? uses the last one?
17:04:29  <Yexo> the sprite definition will need to have a filename in that case
17:05:06  <Yexo> like this
17:05:27  <frosch123> oh
17:06:49  <frosch123> alternatively there could be a different block, which just acts as assertion. "base_sprite_number(123);" or so
17:07:17  <frosch123> i have no idea whether there is any block without {} though :)
17:07:46  <Yexo> param[3]  = 4; <- "block" without {}
17:08:19  <Yexo> I've thought about that, but due to the processing order in nml that will be  a lot more difficult
17:08:55  <Brot6> nml: update from r1139 to r1141 done -
17:09:11  <frosch123> well, i am neither developer nor user of that feature :)
17:09:34  <frosch123> but i can assist in forcing pm to like it :p
17:10:11  <Yexo> :p
17:12:13  <planetmaker> he...! ;-)
17:12:39  <planetmaker> Well, yes, I understand that a sprite number is not needed.
17:13:20  <planetmaker> But it is a very good sanity check. But yes, maybe the suggestion of frosch to force for consecutive sprites starting at a given number that syntax is ok for me, too
17:16:11  <Yexo> what should be done if the given sprite number doesn't match the output number?
17:16:20  <Yexo> currently it prints an error message
17:18:40  <Brot6> nutracks: update from r172 to r176 done -
17:18:48  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r732), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r75), ai-aroai (r11), ailib-common (r21), ailib-direction (r17), ailib-list (r32), ailib-string (r29), ailib-tile (r16), airportsplus (r70), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r45), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1658), fish (r567), frenchtowns (r6), grfcodec (r821), heqs (r572), indonesiantowns (r41), manindu (r6), metrotrackset
17:18:48  <Brot6> (r56), narvs (r5), newgrf_makefile (r254), nml (r1141), ogfx-industries (r3), ogfx-landscape (r22), ogfx-rv (r78), ogfx-trains (r201), ogfx-trees (r42), opengfx (r593), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45), spanishtowns (r10), swedishrails (r193), swisstowns (r22), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r24), worldairlinersset (r671)
17:19:28  <planetmaker> that's just fine, nothing else needs to be done. Not sure whether it should be fatal error, though.
17:19:46  <frosch123> it does not make sense to have holes in the middle, but if you want to concat multiple files it might make sense to not start at 0
17:20:07  <frosch123> i.e. what about mapgen sprites or similiar surprises?
17:20:18  <frosch123> hmm, though they were kind of images afaik
17:20:26  <Yexo> mapgen sprites are some sort of images
17:20:55  <planetmaker> they are
17:21:25  <planetmaker> hm. Possibly a better name right now would be base_graphics(...) than base_sprite
17:21:33  <planetmaker> As the latter could also be a recolour sprite
17:21:34  <Brot6> ogfx-rv: rebuild of r78 done (1 errors) (Diffsize: 1) (DiffDiffsize: 5) -
17:21:34  <Yexo> not starting at 0 is imo a different feature request (which indeed makes sense if you compile some file separately) but that needs a commandline-argument
17:21:41  <Yexo> or a different syntax at least
17:21:47  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1142:c4e1c301cb5e: Change: add optional sprite_num parameter to b... (yexo) @
17:22:42  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1143:6e5630ea85d8: Change: rename base_sprites to base_graphics (yexo) @
17:22:50  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: airportsplus (Diffsize: 1), belarusiantowns, frenchtowns, indonesiantowns (1 errors) (Diffsize: 1), manindu (Diffsize: 1), narvs, newgrf_makefile, ogfx-industries, ogfx-landscape, ogfx-trains (Diffsize: 1), spanishtowns, swedishrails (Diffsize: 6), swisstowns
17:25:39  <planetmaker> hm, not starting at 0...  yes, possibly cmd line argument is the most sensible
17:27:45  <Ammler> planetmaker: the ogfx-rv is a issue with new check.md5, will you fix that or do I need to change it on the default build settings?
17:28:59  <planetmaker> hu?
17:30:30  <planetmaker> can you tell me what is actually wrong?
17:30:33  <planetmaker> or different?
17:30:33  <Ammler> you create check.md5 also for non source bundles?
17:30:56  <planetmaker> I don't think so
17:31:22  <planetmaker> non-source bundles don't need that
17:31:40  <planetmaker> and actually: I must not
17:32:01  <planetmaker> otherwise I create a bundle_zip from a source bundle - and voilĂ  - I've overwritten the check.md5
17:32:38  <Ammler> but but, why does ogfx-rv have one? :-)
17:33:18  <planetmaker> you built it from source? or it was explicitly asked to be built?
17:33:32  <Ammler> don't think so
17:33:51  <planetmaker> a source bundle will differ from the checkout always by the ...check.md5
17:34:00  <planetmaker> an some Makefile addition
17:34:05  <Ammler> hmm
17:34:36  <planetmaker> but I don't understand why that now should lead to an error. It's like that literally for months
17:34:41  <Ammler> I guess, I am wrong
17:34:43  <planetmaker> if not even a year or so
17:34:49  <Ammler> it had check.md5 but not anymore
17:35:14  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Support #2211: Feedback from the community / playerbase (Voyager1) @
17:36:08  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2235 (New): Toronto H-series (Voyager1) @
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19:03:21  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: update from r21931 to r21937 done (2 errors) -
19:06:14  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r21488 to r21488 done -
19:07:26  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r21937 still failed (#2080) -
19:22:47  <DJNekkid> planetmaker: i think this might be in your spirit:
19:24:08  <planetmaker> what about starting the vehicle?
19:24:17  <planetmaker> wouldn't it be inconsistent?
19:24:23  <DJNekkid> the "green button" in the depot window?
19:24:44  <DJNekkid> atleast that is what i do when when i make multiple clones
19:24:57  <planetmaker> yes, me too.
19:25:09  <planetmaker> I'm just not sure... it would break GUI consistency somewhat
19:25:57  <DJNekkid> could ofcourse be made an option in the 'interface' section
19:26:21  <DJNekkid> i just got the idea last night (literarely, around 4am) when playing a paxdest game with chillcore
19:26:34  <DJNekkid> and i were constatnly building tram networks in some large citites
19:26:49  <DJNekkid> where i made 2x10 trams (10 clockwise, 10 anticlockwise)
19:27:03  <DJNekkid> and i thought: Why do theese keep popping up exactly...
19:27:46  <DJNekkid> as there is absolutely no need for it as far as i could see...
19:28:52  <planetmaker> it could be coupled to the building tool setting. A new one... I don't fancy many options ;-)
19:29:17  <planetmaker> but in principle you're right. For cloning it's not needed.
19:29:23  <DJNekkid> as i had to 'pin' the two depot windows, and then press delete to remove the first ten, and then shift-del to remove all windows all together
19:29:33  <planetmaker> :-)
19:29:39  <planetmaker> what I do, too, yes
19:29:47  <DJNekkid> to many clicks :P
19:29:57  <DJNekkid> why not just
19:30:05  <DJNekkid> and grenn button, then the X :)
19:30:06  <DJNekkid> hehe
19:30:11  <DJNekkid> *green
19:31:52  <planetmaker> :-)
19:57:05  <DJNekkid> so, committing it? :P
20:30:33  <Hirundo> I tend to agree with pm: "I'm just not sure... it would break GUI consistency somewhat"
20:30:53  <DJNekkid> as an interface option then...
20:31:01  <DJNekkid> as its MUCH less harrasment :)
20:31:04  <planetmaker> DJNekkid: not in that form... it has issues most possibly
20:31:29  <DJNekkid> i'll add it to a local build and see if i can spot anything
20:32:15  <DJNekkid> but on it saies:
20:32:21  <DJNekkid> tar xvfz zlib-1.2.5.tar.gz
20:33:32  <DJNekkid> but that does not work:        c:/dev/msys/1.0/bin/tar.exe: you must specify on of the '-Acdtrux' options
20:33:38  <DJNekkid> and i did try -xvfz as well
20:33:52  <Rubidium> old msys?
20:34:13  <Rubidium> I'd think that the version mentioned in the manual would work
20:34:58  <DJNekkid> i did click this link:
20:35:00  <Webster> Title: Download MinGW - Minimalist GNU for Windows from (at
20:35:10  <DJNekkid> and it downloaded and things
20:35:35  <Rubidium> odd; try to remove the v and z, so tar xf zlib-1.2.5.tar.gz
20:35:54  <DJNekkid> same error
20:36:02  <DJNekkid> also with -xf
20:36:32  <Rubidium> that makes *no* sense
20:37:09  <Rubidium> did you have mingw and the likes installed before on your system?
20:38:03  <DJNekkid> i dont _think_ so, but i guess i could uninstall and try again :)
20:39:35  <Hirundo> There are already too many settings, IMO
20:40:09  <Hirundo> To misquote someone: "Every problem can be solved by adding a setting, except having too many settings"
20:40:22  <DJNekkid> hehe
20:41:12  <Rubidium> Hirundo: nah... that can't be true
20:41:12  <andythenorth> Hirundo: have another setting:
20:41:21  <andythenorth> settings: some | lots
20:41:34  <Rubidium> today someone had a problem that could be fixed by removing a setting
20:41:39  <planetmaker> that's not the first time that thought was thought, andythenorth ;-)
20:41:54  <Rubidium> and FS#4456 can be solved by removing a setting as well
20:41:54  * andythenorth is a fan of sensible defaults :P
20:41:58  <planetmaker> Rubidium: and I still favour that solution :-)
20:42:44  <DJNekkid> that is true Rubidium
20:43:11  <DJNekkid> and that is a setting i would imagine everyone use
20:44:47  <Hirundo> I'd consider making 'clone with shared orders' work without ctrl-magic a higher priority
20:45:57  <DJNekkid> 4458?
20:47:13  <andythenorth> consists!
20:47:18  <andythenorth> orders!
20:47:33  <andythenorth> planetmaker: I broke compatibility of FIRS nightly :P
20:47:37  <andythenorth> should I update min version?
20:47:50  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1661:64fca886abd5: Change: modify forge acceptance and c... (andythenorth) @
20:47:50  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1662:6281ecd90110: Change: (translations) Forge industry... (andythenorth) @
20:47:52  <andythenorth> in fact, can min version just auto-increment to 'current rev' ?
20:48:09  <planetmaker> andythenorth: of course you should update min_version
20:48:22  <planetmaker> but it cannot auto-increment
20:50:07  <andythenorth> why not? :o
20:50:47  <Hirundo> That'd defeat it's purpose
20:51:11  <andythenorth> ho
20:51:13  <andythenorth> :(
20:51:41  * andythenorth considers some kind of commit hook to bump min version
20:52:50  <andythenorth> maybe 25% of commits are savegame unsafe
20:53:07  <andythenorth> that's quite a lot of bumping I have to remember to do
20:53:23  <andythenorth> how many downloads to nightlies actually get?
20:53:33  <andythenorth> what happened to 'use nightly at your own risk' ?
20:53:41  <Hirundo> I guess, min_version is mostly useful for 'stable branches'
20:54:07  <Hirundo> nightly users generally know what they're doing anyways
20:54:36  <planetmaker> andythenorth: well, own risk, sure. Even when Hirundo is right, I think it's sensible to exercise that in order to remember and not forget it
20:55:19  <planetmaker> also... what you *could* do, andythenorth: keep the 'old' layouts till just before the stable release as additional layouts
20:55:36  <planetmaker> can you forbid a layout to be built?
20:56:55  <andythenorth> :(
20:57:21  <andythenorth> I refer you to
20:57:26  <andythenorth> which I should try and fix
20:57:32  <andythenorth> but it's so far beyond me
20:57:38  <andythenorth> I can write some game code happily
20:57:57  <andythenorth> but nested functions with insane numbers of parameters are beyond me so far
20:58:06  <planetmaker> that's why I was asking. I was not sure whether it was / has been worked on.
20:58:10  <andythenorth> I tried to fix it and just ended with a broken mess
20:58:24  <andythenorth> it's needed for a decent FIRS
20:58:36  <DJNekkid> eek
21:00:03  <DJNekkid> when i try to wget: "the program cant start because msys-crypto-1.0.0.dll is missing on your computer"
21:00:14  <planetmaker> that's in parts of the code I've not explored yet either
21:00:47  <andythenorth> planetmaker: now I started working with vehicle and drawing code...
21:00:57  <andythenorth> ....I realised just how insane a lot of the industry code is
21:01:12  <planetmaker> quite, yes
21:01:13  <andythenorth> it's just incredibly hard to follow unless you know the spec inside out
21:01:19  <andythenorth> and has lots of special cases
21:01:31  <andythenorth> and when I read some of the special cases, they were extra special
21:01:37  <andythenorth> i.e. broken
21:01:41  <andythenorth> and not in spec :P
21:01:59  <andythenorth> am I encouraging you to pick up this problem? :D
21:02:21  <planetmaker> totally
21:02:26  <planetmaker> sounds like a 5 minute job :-P
21:02:33  <andythenorth> frosch123 thought it wasn't too hard actually
21:02:39  <planetmaker> look. see. run.
21:02:42  <andythenorth> you just have to have a clear idea of what to do
21:04:17  <andythenorth> I don't :(
21:05:20  <frosch123> according to forums about anything "can't be that hard"
21:05:40  <andythenorth> well in this case you actually told me what to do
21:05:41  <andythenorth> :)
21:05:44  <andythenorth> I just couldn't do it
21:05:50  <andythenorth> I even have a transcript somewhere
21:08:02  <planetmaker> is there a limit on the number of layouts?
21:08:14  * andythenorth looks in spec
21:08:31  <andythenorth> stupid flyspray has help keys :P
21:09:23  <andythenorth> planetmaker: num layouts is a I guess there's a limit :)
21:09:45  <planetmaker> :-)
21:12:52  * andythenorth can't find the transcript :(
21:12:56  <andythenorth> sometime in october last year
21:57:31  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1663:2ed28a9eae31: Add: pnfo files for ironworks (andythenorth) @
21:57:31  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1664:df75ee1b1f8b: Change: (translations) add English st... (andythenorth) @
21:57:31  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1665:2da8d205bc43: Change: (translations) industry windo... (andythenorth) @
21:57:35  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1666:d1679ed67175: Change: Iron Works uses correct indus... (andythenorth) @
22:03:06  *** frosch123 has quit IRC
22:03:35  <andythenorth> 333 commits to FIRS 2k :P
22:04:12  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1667:3998b46e8485: Change: Iron Works uses correct path ... (andythenorth) @
22:11:50  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1668:e0fc7d13053a: Change: set Iron Works closure date (andythenorth) @
22:18:49  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1669:f9e692ac5634: Change: rename cb28 colocation templa... (andythenorth) @
22:18:49  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1670:d12b68fcb209: Change: Iron Ore Mine and Forest no l... (andythenorth) @
22:19:51  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1671:6a3438bc2e13: Change: Iron Works tries to locate ne... (andythenorth) @
22:32:42  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1672:c7dc25495b6f: Change: Iron Works clustering value t... (andythenorth) @
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22:35:48  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #2236 (New): Consider colocating more primary / secondary ind... (andythenorth) @
22:35:54  <andythenorth> bed time
22:35:56  <andythenorth> good night
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22:41:13  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #2237 (New): Munchen MVG A2 (Voyager1) @
22:42:25  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #2011 (Resolved): Change forge -> Ironworks + Blacksmith (andythenorth) @
23:00:25  <planetmaker> thanks for the base_graphics support, Yexo - I'm having fun with it :-)
23:01:31  <V453000> how to satisfy a madman :P
23:02:42  <planetmaker> haha :-)
23:03:13  <Yexo> are recolor sprites now the only missing feature for full baseset support?
23:03:57  <planetmaker> I think so. I haven't actually tested whether grfcodec would get confused by several consecutive grf file headers
23:04:01  <planetmaker> they get always written
23:04:33  <planetmaker> but that's ok - as nml is not made for having its output concatenated afterwards
23:10:16  <Yexo> no, that doesn't matter
23:10:19  <Yexo> it's just comments
23:12:29  <Yexo> --disable-nfo-header <- suggestions for a better name? (as commandline option)
23:14:03  <planetmaker> then there's no need to disable it actually
23:14:12  <planetmaker> if so, it's a good name
23:16:24  <planetmaker> this does convince NML to accept a sprite number offset. But it doesn't convince it yet to use it for NFO output
23:16:29  <planetmaker>
23:20:23  <planetmaker> hm... snow outside...
23:21:25  <Yexo> planetmaker: revert the last block, and change the for loop there to: for num, action in enumerate(actions, start_sprite_num):
23:21:39  <Yexo> +    start_sprite_num = opts.start_sprite_num <- that line can be left out
23:21:52  <Yexo> +start_sprite_num = 0 <- as can that line
23:22:42  <Yexo> that syntax needs python 2.6, was that already a requirement or did python 2.5 still work?
23:24:15  <planetmaker> I don't know... I guess I can test at work tomorrow
23:24:24  <planetmaker> IIRC it did
23:28:30  <Yexo> seems to work fine
23:31:40  <DJNekkid> that little line of Chilldore were doing its job very nice
23:31:43  <DJNekkid> *chllcore
23:33:04  <DJNekkid> chillcore god damn it
23:33:06  <planetmaker> indeed it does, Yexo
23:33:29  <planetmaker> but there's one quirk: the default offset should be 0 and not 3092 ;-)
23:33:37  <Yexo> indeed, I copied that from you :p
23:33:43  <planetmaker> yep :-P
23:35:14  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1144:d7b4a96cc3b9: Add: commandline option to specify sprite numb... (yexo) @
23:36:20  <planetmaker> DJNekkid: there are concerns of its working in an MP environment. And about GUI consistency. Would people then not think using ctrl is just about not showing the vehicle?
23:36:55  <planetmaker> or should the clone and copy behaviour possibly be re-considered a bit more thoroughly wrt how it works?
23:36:58  *** Lakie has quit IRC
23:37:12  <DJNekkid> well, that is one way to see it :)
23:37:50  <DJNekkid> atleast the idea have come, and there have come a solution...
23:37:57  <DJNekkid> atleast one possible solution
23:38:22  <DJNekkid> btw, chillcore is currently on my server, and he use that 'mod', and i do not and we heavent had a desync yet :D
23:38:29  <planetmaker> it's not a solution should it desync in MP ;-)
23:38:58  <planetmaker> he :-)
23:42:12  <DJNekkid> come join us :D
23:42:34  <DJNekkid> if not for anything else then looking at our network :D
23:44:26  <Yexo> DJNekkid: the problem is not that it'll desync
23:44:46  <Yexo> if you release (or press) ctrl just after clicking on clone vehicle but before the new vehicle appears, the wrong thing will happen
23:45:46  <DJNekkid> oki :D
23:45:49  <DJNekkid> :( :(
23:46:50  <Yexo> that's just an implementation detail though, it can be fixed quite easily
23:47:11  <Yexo> main reason it isn't in yet is what planetmaker already said: it feels inconsistent with the rest of the gui
23:47:11  <DJNekkid> what is your idea about the idea in general btw?
23:47:27  <Yexo> it's a good idea, but it needs a bit more though :)
23:47:32  <Yexo> +t
23:47:45  <DJNekkid> :D
23:47:55  <planetmaker> that was the general concensus ;-)
23:48:13  <planetmaker> s/c/s/
23:53:14  <DJNekkid> well, i hope you brainy guys find a solution :)
23:57:57  <Ammler> DJNekkid: what is the server running?
23:58:15  <DJNekkid> chillcore patchpack 21900
23:58:37  <Ammler> and you join the server without?
23:59:42  <DJNekkid> yes
23:59:43  <DJNekkid> and he with

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