Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 1st March 2011:
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00:50:31  <Brot6> DictatorAI - Revision 79:c86e156271bf: - Keep updating to new class (krinn) @
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07:56:37  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2382 (New): snowline height not configurable via newgrf parameter (planetmaker) @
07:57:14  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2382: snowline height not configurable via newgrf parameter (planetmaker) @
07:58:01  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2382: snowline height not configurable via newgrf parameter (planetmaker) @
08:03:01  <Yexo> planetmaker: that's actually a though one
08:03:33  <Yexo> when using a non-constant height nml can't compute the intermediate values, at least not efficiently
08:08:06  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1274:c1bae90b97e1: Fix: bogus line number in error messages about... (yexo) @
09:04:24  <planetmaker> Yexo: true; it shouldn't be needed in that case actually
09:04:26  <planetmaker> I gave all those dates where it changes by one
09:05:26  <planetmaker> moin also :-)
09:06:01  <planetmaker> hm, but the same error when I choose "equal"
09:14:46  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2382: snowline height not configurable via newgrf parameter (planetmaker) @
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09:55:58  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1815:e86022586a31: Feature: improved appearance of Lime ... (andythenorth) @
09:55:58  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1816:4461fab82029: Change: use company colour for Plasti... (andythenorth) @
09:55:58  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #2312: Improve Lime Kiln graphics (andythenorth) @
10:28:54  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1817:22c8615e190c: Fix: remove some white pixels (andythenorth) @
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10:46:36  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1818:5ceedd402768: Change: use 2CC for Plastics Plant (andythenorth) @
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13:31:32  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Revision 26:0d202be3387e: forgot to include the Worksta... (oberhuemer) @
13:33:01  <Brot6> narvs: compile of r26 still failed (#2381) -
13:33:40  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Bug #2383 (New): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
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13:35:59  <Brot6> narvs: compile of r27 still failed (#2383) -
13:35:59  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Revision 27:720005e97a19: file had wrong name (oberhuemer) @
13:36:06  <Brot6> narvs: compile of r27 still failed (#2381) -
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13:48:57  <planetmaker> heya Lakie, I just sent you a mail wrt the language template / script you suggested
13:49:11  <Lakie> Yeah, I saw. Shall have a look at FIRS
13:50:00  <Lakie> I was thinking more of a template defining what 'code' should be generated for the various strings, and then linking all the generated chunks into lnfo's which the pnfo wouild incude.
13:51:02  <Lakie> 'tis a little messy though
13:51:29  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Revision 28:aee00e9d8b4b: fixed incorrect loading stage... (oberhuemer) @
13:51:45  <Brot6> narvs: compile of r28 still failed (#2383) -
13:52:00  <Brot6> narvs: compile of r28 still failed (#2381) -
13:52:30  <Lakie> The alternative I thought of was to use predefined strings, GRF_NAME/GRF_DESC, Param[0-9]_(etc)... for action14 stuff, and the rest got me a little stuck
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13:59:19  <planetmaker> well. I'd suggest to use things like STR_PARAM, STR_NAME, STR_DESC. That makes things easier ;-)
13:59:36  <Lakie> Heh,
14:00:02  <Lakie> STR_NAME becomes ambigious when a name could be the grf or the vehicles, but maybe
14:00:13  <planetmaker> STR_GRF_NAME
14:00:24  <planetmaker> that's what I use anyway in my newgrfs ;-)
14:00:33  <Ammler> isn't it always a string?
14:00:37  <planetmaker> yes
14:00:45  <planetmaker> STR_GRF_DESC
14:00:48  <Ammler> sot STR_ is useless
14:01:06  <planetmaker> not quite. It makes the define naming unique and clear
14:01:13  <Ammler> or is there something else for GRF_DESC?
14:01:50  <planetmaker> Ammler, it's good practise IMHO to prefix all defines of a single category with a common prefix
14:01:54  <planetmaker> so STR_ for strings
14:02:02  <planetmaker> VID for vehicle IDs
14:02:03  <planetmaker> etc
14:02:15  <planetmaker> easier to read
14:02:20  <Ammler> ah ok, so it is not always a string
14:02:27  <planetmaker> eh?
14:02:35  <planetmaker> STR_XXX will always be a string
14:02:47  <planetmaker> VID_XXX will always be a number
14:02:53  <Ammler> yeah, I thought every define is a string, never mind
14:03:00  <planetmaker> :-)
14:03:19  <planetmaker> in a language file, yes. But not in a whole grf ;-)
14:05:48  * Lakie wasn't planning to have them as defines as such...
14:05:53  <Lakie> But we'll see how it goex
14:06:17  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Revision 29:7dc9db24334c: palette on Workstar was incor... (oberhuemer) @
14:06:37  <Brot6> narvs: update from r25 to r29 done -
14:06:52  <Brot6> narvs: compile of r29 still failed (#2381) -
14:09:25  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Bug #2383 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
14:09:25  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Bug #2383 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (oberhuemer) @
14:10:20  <Lakie> template + lang files --(phase 1, generating)-> chunks of code --(phase 2, linking)-> lnfo files full of code to be included.
14:10:27  <Lakie> That was my original idea
14:11:03  <Lakie> But using identifiers might work to remove the template file.
14:11:12  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Bug #2381 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (compiler) @
14:11:12  <Brot6> North American Road Vehicle Set (NARVS) - Bug #2381 (Closed): DevZone compile failed (oberhuemer) @
14:14:37  <Lakie> But 'm probably over engineering. :(
14:14:48  <planetmaker> well... getting a really good language file support for NFO is not quite easy. One might just as well duplicate somewhat the things NML does there and apply that script in the pre-processing stage, replacing all calls of STR_XXX by replacing them by the appropriate sprites
14:16:05  <Lakie> Maybe, personally, I was leaning towards icludes because I have a rough idea that an action14 might need several lines duplicated and inserted at various points
14:16:22  <planetmaker> "the things" = the parsing of the language file. And then parsing the source files for the same identifiers and writing the appropriate action(s) might actually work
14:16:53  <planetmaker> or instead of writing the actions just writing to pnfo files which need inclusion in the main pnfo file
14:17:03  <planetmaker> one prior to action8, the other after
14:17:31  <Lakie> Maybe, but then it'd have to write the Action14 in all its properties for those of us who like it neat...
14:17:53  <planetmaker> possibly it'd need some context-awareness as in that the script parses the current action it is called in and deciding upon the stringID range to apply
14:18:09  <planetmaker> hu, how do you mean?
14:18:20  <Lakie> Well, from my point of view.
14:18:34  <Lakie> Action 14 has two to three general areas it'll need strings
14:18:54  <Lakie> localizaed names for the grf info, parameter names and value names and such
14:19:02  <planetmaker> yeah
14:19:05  <Lakie> All of which is motly interweaved
14:19:13  <planetmaker> is it?
14:19:26  <planetmaker> grf info can be considered quite separately
14:19:30  <Lakie> Well, I would generally iunterweave it as one action14.
14:19:55  <planetmaker> and parameter values only make sense, of course, in the context of the associated parameter
14:20:16  <planetmaker> interweaving it might be clean but is not needed
14:20:33  <Lakie> I know, but I like having cleanish looking code. :)
14:20:36  <planetmaker> Separating different logical parts can also be a good thing. Finding errors is easier
14:20:44  <planetmaker> And is not necessarily unclean
14:20:52  <planetmaker> Like on actio14 for the general grf properties
14:20:55  <planetmaker> and one per parameter
14:21:00  <planetmaker> is clean and neat, too
14:21:23  <planetmaker> and who cares about 10(?) extra bytes per parameter?
14:21:57  <Lakie> Maybe, but then you'd end up with a lot of action14's for localization.
14:22:32  <planetmaker> Depends. I'd put the different localizations into one ;-)
14:22:48  <Lakie> Heh, maybe
14:23:00  <planetmaker> but different parameters into different ones ;-) - but it just boils down to where and how you split - if at all
14:23:02  <Lakie> 'tis all ideas on trying to build a managable system
14:23:07  <planetmaker> and is rather a matter of taste
14:23:55  <planetmaker> and besides: if the result of an easy user-managable string system is many action14s - that's IMHO a price which also can be paid
14:24:02  <planetmaker> Optimization can come when it works ;-)
14:24:11  <Lakie> True
14:26:39  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1819:7cbfb5b7de8a: Feature: improved appearance of Plast... (andythenorth) @
14:27:22  * Lakie ponders drawing out the designs and looking over python's libraries and language.
14:28:52  <planetmaker> :-)
14:43:37  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1820:711d16fcea3b: Change: improve appearance of Plastic... (andythenorth) @
14:43:37  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1821:9f3f7496db48: Change: further improve appearance of... (andythenorth) @
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15:41:33  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #978 (Closed): Anti-alias/improve Plastic Plant shading (andythenorth) @
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16:43:26  <Lakie> planetmaker: does nml support utf-8 formatted lng files?
16:43:59  * Lakie was pondering if said script should accept unicode and convert the strings to what openttd/ttdpatch would allow
16:44:15  <Lakie> Although, never mind, *thinks*
16:44:32  <Ammler> Lakie: I would be suprised if nml does allow something else then utf-8
16:44:49  <Lakie> Surely it'd allow utf-16, Ammler?
16:45:08  <Ammler> Lakie: read again my line
16:45:33  <Ammler> basically "utf-8 only" :-)
16:45:44  <Lakie> Hehe, fair enough
16:46:16  <Ammler> no idea about utf-16, I would guess, that is backwards compatible to utf-8?
16:46:53  <Ammler> is that in use on windows?=
16:47:36  <Lakie> Well, most of the core windows stuff uses utf-16, not sure about text files, I think they are utf8 usually
16:48:05  <Ammler> ok, sounds for me like space wasting :-)
16:48:52  <Lakie> Aye
16:48:54  <Lakie> bbiab
16:48:56  <Ammler> how big is the part from utf-8 bigger than 1byte?
16:49:26  <Ammler> even in non English world
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16:52:30  <planetmaker> Lakie, afaik only utf-8 is allowed
16:53:01  <Yexo> all files are read as utf-8
16:53:27  <Yexo> though I'm not sure what python does when it's told to read a file as utf-8 but it detects utf-16 (not even sure it'll try to detect that)
16:54:14  <Ammler> hmm, wikipedia does nothing tell about Windows and UTF-16
16:54:51  <Ammler> ah, found :-)
16:55:18  <Ammler> "UTF-16 is used for the native internal representation of text in Microsoft Windows 2000/XP/2003/Vista/CE."
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16:59:16  <Ammler> now I know, why Mac does make BOM on start of a textfile :-)
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17:09:10  * Lakie thinks he might end up canabolising some parts of nml..
17:09:38  <Brot6> nml: update from r1270 to r1274 done -
17:11:54  <Yexo> nml does not support utf-16, but you'll just have to change a single line in  to do so
17:12:35  <Lakie> Thats alright, I was thinking more of looking and taking its string handling to produce pnfo files. :)
17:13:37  <Ammler> does grfcodec support BOM in the meantime, btw.?
17:13:47  <Lakie> No?
17:13:48  <Ammler> or was it nforenum?
17:13:58  <Lakie> Last I remember grfcodec chokes on bom's/
17:14:35  <Lakie> bbml
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17:18:23  <frosch123> iirc nml also had trouble with BOM, and iirc it got fixed within 30 minutes
17:19:03  <frosch123> changeset:   1130:78113252a163 <- that one
17:19:04  <Brot6> firs: update from r1813 to r1821 done -
17:19:31  <Brot6> narvs: update from r21 to r29 done -
17:19:41  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r743), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r75), ai-aroai (r11), ailib-common (r21), ailib-direction (r17), ailib-list (r32), ailib-string (r29), ailib-tile (r16), airportsplus (r73), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r51), comic-houses (r71), fish (r613), frenchtowns (r6), grfcodec (r821), heqs (r578), indonesiantowns (r41), manindu (r7), metrotrackset (r56),
17:19:41  <Brot6> newgrf_makefile (r258), nml (r1274), nutracks (r179), ogfx-industries (r4), ogfx-landscape (r41), ogfx-rv (r80), ogfx-trains (r211), ogfx-trees (r42), opengfx (r613), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r45), spanishtowns (r10), swedishrails (r198), swisstowns (r22), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r36), worldairlinersset (r671)
17:23:09  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: airportsplus, belarusiantowns, frenchtowns, indonesiantowns (1 errors), manindu, newgrf_makefile, ogfx-industries, ogfx-landscape (Diffsize: 6), ogfx-rv, ogfx-trains (39 errors) (Diffsize: 27868), spanishtowns, swedishrails (Diffsize: 6), swisstowns
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19:02:40  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: compile of hf3c4c8d7 still failed (#2343) -
19:02:54  <Brot6> clientpatches: compile of r22159 still failed (#2347) -
19:06:00  <Brot6> serverpatches: update from r22158 to r22159 done -
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