Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 24th March 2011:
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01:39:28  <welshdragon> Whom can I grovel to for a build of IS agains trunk? :p
01:53:17  <supermop> its in chills patch pack
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01:56:32  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Bug #2464 (New): Alignment error with T.I.M and AsiaStar (Sylf) @
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05:33:55  <Brot6> Bundles Update: g6e021628 2011-03-24 cargodist   (
08:56:43  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #56: rework region availability parameter (EmperorJake) @
11:44:28  <Brot6> 2cc train set - Feature #56: rework region availability parameter (Voyager1) @
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16:44:34  <andythenorth> Yexo: thanks for the FIRS commits
16:44:41  <andythenorth> I'll have a look tonight
16:44:44  <andythenorth> at work now ;)
16:44:49  <andythenorth> also got some CHIPS ideas
17:10:44  <Brot6> nml: update from r1301 to r1302 done -
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17:14:34  <LordAro> moin all
17:14:51  <planetmaker> moin
17:18:59  <Brot6> firs: update from r1889 to r1894 done -
17:19:12  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r750), 32bpp-extra (r39), ai-admiralai (r75), ai-aroai (r23), ailib-common (r21), ailib-direction (r17), ailib-list (r32), ailib-string (r29), ailib-tile (r16), airportsplus (r73), basecosts (r22), belarusiantowns (r8), bros (r52), chips (r82), comic-houses (r71), fish (r617), frenchtowns (r6), grfcodec (r828), heqs (r580), indonesiantowns (r41), manindu (r7), metrotrackset
17:19:13  <Brot6> (r56), narvs (r29), newgrf_makefile (r265), nml (r1302), nutracks (r179), ogfx-industries (r12), ogfx-landscape (r58), ogfx-rv (r80), ogfx-trains (r237), ogfx-trees (r42), opengfx (r618), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), smts (r19), snowlinemod (r49), spanishtowns (r10), swedishrails (r198), swisstowns (r22), transrapidtrackset (r15), ttdviewer (r26), ttrs (r36), worldairlinersset (r671)
17:23:01  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: airportsplus (Diffsize: 1), belarusiantowns (Diffsize: 30), frenchtowns, indonesiantowns (1 errors) (Diffsize: 1), manindu (Diffsize: 1), narvs (Diffsize: 1), newgrf_makefile, ogfx-industries (Diffsize: 1), ogfx-landscape (Diffsize: 7), ogfx-rv (Diffsize: 7), ogfx-trains, spanishtowns (Diffsize: 1), swedishrails (Diffsize: 7), swisstowns (Diffsize:
17:23:01  <Brot6> 156)
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19:02:43  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: compile of tip qtip ez.diff qbase still failed (#2446) - qtip ez.diff qbase
19:06:30  <Brot6> clientpatches: update from r22272 to r22274 done (80845 errors) -
19:09:23  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r22274 still failed (#2448) -
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19:19:42  <andythenorth> evenings
19:43:32  <andythenorth> hmm
19:43:48  <andythenorth> the default graphics are very pretty with the contrast turned down on my screen :o
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19:54:08  <andythenorth> hmm
20:03:23  <planetmaker> :-)
20:06:16  <andythenorth> wrt Recycling Plant customised cargos...
20:06:25  <andythenorth> should farm supplies be less common than others?
20:06:31  <andythenorth> it's less useful in my games...
20:07:36  <Yexo> no idea, I don't play enough
20:08:22  <andythenorth> planetmaker: ??
20:08:37  <andythenorth> it's an easy tweak...
20:08:52  <planetmaker> hm... I guess that makes sense, yes
20:09:07  <planetmaker> But I'm not sure from a play balance POV
20:09:22  <andythenorth> ach, I'll leave it
20:09:32  <andythenorth> play testing will indicate if it's needed
20:09:55  <planetmaker> :-) Give V something to play with and he'll happily give good feedback ;-)
20:11:59  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1895:3ce0d55b523a: Change: swap order of cargos at Recyc... (andythenorth) @
20:12:33  <V453000> ;)
20:12:41  <andythenorth> Yexo: does the production-by-population code account for number of times production cb runs?
20:12:52  <andythenorth> it produces quite high values at the moment ;)
20:13:22  <V453000> just leave exact numbers out, we can give you hints on that later ;)
20:13:22  <andythenorth> (I mean 'runs per month')
20:13:37  <Yexo> it doesn't, and imo it shouldn't do that
20:13:59  <Yexo> it produces the same (given a static population) amount of cargo every 2.5 days
20:14:11  <Yexo> so the amount of cargo produced depends on the length of a month
20:14:21  <andythenorth> yes
20:14:36  <Yexo> it can vary slightly depending on the month, but that is the same as the default industries
20:14:41  <andythenorth> yes
20:14:42  <andythenorth> that's fine
20:14:58  <andythenorth> but I might divide the amount further in that case ;)
20:15:03  <Yexo> as for high production, that's why I've left the ticket open
20:15:42  <Yexo> line 93, the \wx7 \wx8 is "divide by 8 but round up"
20:16:04  <Yexo> change to "\w15 \w16" for "divide by 16 but round up" (= half current production values)
20:16:05  <andythenorth> ok
20:16:27  <andythenorth> my results differ from your guide in the ticket
20:16:45  <andythenorth> 1,569 popn = 2,349t / month
20:16:50  <Yexo> what?
20:16:54  <Yexo> that's quite a big difference
20:16:58  <andythenorth> indeed :)
20:17:09  <andythenorth> let me test a little more to check it's not a mistake
20:17:18  <Yexo> did you pull my changes?
20:17:23  <andythenorth> let me check
20:17:31  <andythenorth> yes
20:17:47  <Yexo> and are you using that version in the savegame you're testing with?
20:18:26  <andythenorth> yes
20:18:32  <andythenorth> let me check clean game etc
20:18:32  <Yexo> 2349t / month looks a lot like the production value before my commit
20:18:36  <andythenorth> just to be sure
20:18:40  <Yexo> which was 255 tons / production cycle
20:18:53  <Yexo> 255 x (8 or 9)
20:19:01  <Yexo> @calc 255*9
20:19:01  <Webster> Yexo: 2295
20:19:30  <andythenorth> might be better in a new test game
20:19:38  <andythenorth> something odd about the industry I was looking at
20:20:01  <andythenorth> popn / production figures look like yours in new game
20:24:09  <andythenorth> Yexo: might increase the value a little bit
20:24:16  <andythenorth> it's currently /16 or /8 ?
20:24:22  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2458 (Closed): Internal error: Divide by zero in snowline code (Hirundo) @
20:24:22  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1303:d84e3764fd06: Fix r582: day_of_year(month, day) used the sam... (Hirundo) @
20:24:22  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1304:06db18f4591f: Fix #2458: Divide-by-zero in the snowline line... (Hirundo) @
20:24:23  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #2458 (Closed): Internal error: Divide by zero in snowline code (Hirundo) @
20:24:54  <Yexo> it's currently (pop>>4)/8
20:25:06  <Yexo> so basically pop / 16 / 8 == pop / 128
20:25:50  <andythenorth> might do /12 /8
20:26:11  <Yexo> not possible, the first divide is actually a shift
20:26:30  <Yexo>  /8 /12 is possible
20:26:33  <andythenorth> :)
20:34:35  <andythenorth> shift 3?
20:34:48  <Yexo> yes
20:34:59  <Yexo> so 63 instead of 64
20:35:53  <andythenorth> then \wx11 \wx12
20:36:16  <Yexo> correct
20:36:32  <andythenorth> I quite like advanced varaction 2
20:36:38  <andythenorth> it's quite intuitive
20:37:20  <Yexo> once you get used to it, yes
20:37:35  <Yexo> but that takes quite some time
20:38:03  <Yexo> <andythenorth> then \wx11 \wx12 <- actually, \w11 \w12
20:38:13  <Yexo> or you'd do /18 (round up)
20:39:29  <andythenorth> hmm
20:39:50  <andythenorth> well this seems to produce required result ;)
20:39:50  <andythenorth> r   82 63 \wxFFFF \wx11 \wx12
20:40:15  <Yexo> and to be correct the mask should be changed to \wx1FFF
20:40:33  <Yexo> that code does /8 /18
20:40:45  <andythenorth> ok
20:40:50  <andythenorth> I see why
20:40:55  <andythenorth> and the numbers are off
20:41:50  <Yexo> <Yexo> and to be correct the mask should be changed to \wx1FFF <- doesn't have an effect in openttd for this case, in ttdpatch it probably has
20:43:21  <andythenorth> hmm
20:44:05  <andythenorth> r   82 63 \wx1FFF \w11 \w12 // Population. shift by 4 (=/8), add 11, divide by 12
20:44:10  <andythenorth> correct?
20:44:14  <andythenorth> the final result is good
20:49:40  <Yexo>  shift by 4 <- only error
20:56:26  <andythenorth> fixed
20:59:14  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1896:7afd1e46f3b7: Change: adjust production for Recycli... (andythenorth) @
20:59:14  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #2462 (Closed): Recycling Depot production to depend on t... (andythenorth) @
21:00:31  <Yexo> ah, I was wondering what I missed, but it was probably that production multiplier
21:02:20  <andythenorth> that might affect production a little :)
21:02:35  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1897:0a3c07ac0d45: Change: add Yexo to credits (andythenorth) @
21:12:26  <andythenorth> Yexo: fancy some CHIPS?
21:12:37  <Yexo> sure :)
21:12:54  <andythenorth> I'm not sure how to spec what I'm thinking
21:13:12  <andythenorth> I think the current stations need more variety.
21:13:22  <andythenorth> I'm thinking....(approximately)
21:14:05  <andythenorth> - a hut or building by a track exit from a station
21:14:30  <andythenorth> - a crane or other vehicle (maybe random), one per platform
21:14:39  <andythenorth> - randomly alternating cargo graphics
21:14:56  <andythenorth> - maybe lights where there are two platforms
21:15:05  <Yexo> hut/building works exactly opposite like the buffers, right?
21:15:12  <andythenorth> exactly opposite
21:15:26  <andythenorth> except it might look bad if there are lots of platforms
21:15:34  <andythenorth> to have a hut at every exit
21:15:36  <Yexo> not if there are a few random graphics for it
21:15:44  <Yexo> and maybe randomly display it or not
21:15:46  <andythenorth> yes
21:15:56  <andythenorth> I can commit a test graphic now
21:16:20  <Yexo> randomly alternating cargo graphics are easy, just a lot of drawing work
21:16:43  <andythenorth> I know :(
21:16:48  <andythenorth> but it's needed for it to look good
21:16:56  <andythenorth> lets do the other structures first :D
21:17:14  <Yexo> lights between two platforms seems a good idea, though that might require some though on how many lights to show
21:17:17  <Yexo> hehe ;)
21:17:37  <Yexo> no cargo on the tile with the hut/building, is that ok?
21:18:04  <andythenorth> absolutely
21:19:03  <Yexo> another thing I thought about: don't switch between the graphics for little/lots of cargo for all tiles at the same time
21:19:28  <Yexo> if the amount of cargo needed for that switch would be slightly random, there would already be more variety for the station depending on the amount of cargo
21:21:13  <planetmaker> that sounds very good idea, Yexo
21:21:18  <planetmaker> +like a
21:23:46  <andythenorth> Yexo: good idea
21:23:58  <andythenorth> we should increase the initial threshold somehow as well
21:24:08  <andythenorth> the flicker is horrible at the moment when vehicles are loading
21:24:12  <Yexo> indeed
21:24:21  <andythenorth> huts incoming
21:24:23  <Brot6> CHIPS Station Set - Revision 83:0593efdc8b0c: Add: psd file for huts (andythenorth) @
21:24:23  <Brot6> CHIPS Station Set - Revision 84:53f5d6bf95fe: Add: png file for huts (andythenorth) @
21:24:24  <andythenorth> I'll add cranes
21:24:24  <Yexo> great :)
21:24:35  <andythenorth> it's cheating :P
21:24:39  <andythenorth> I have FIRS graphics
21:24:54  <Yexo> that means they'll fit together very good :)
21:25:07  <Yexo> huts look a bit wide, not sure if they'll fit
21:25:22  <Yexo> the upper row of buildings at least, middle row will fit easily
21:29:39  <andythenorth> upper row is for non-track tiles, if we choose
21:29:50  <andythenorth> I'll replace them with better ones if they look ok
21:30:06  <Brot6> CHIPS Station Set - Revision 85:7d5802652117: Add: files for cranes (andythenorth) @
21:30:16  <andythenorth> same for cranes
21:30:24  <andythenorth> template follows same pattern as cargo
21:30:31  <Yexo> great :)
21:30:39  <andythenorth> I can include the pink areas for reference if that helps code ;)
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21:30:46  <Yexo> doesn't really matter
21:30:53  <andythenorth> k
21:31:08  <planetmaker> good night
21:31:10  <andythenorth> anyway, same pattern of non-track tile, track tile
21:31:13  <Yexo> I guess the offsets than adjust via the in-game sprite thingy
21:31:31  <Yexo> for cranes I see no difference between top and middle row
21:31:58  <Yexo> night planetmaker
21:32:16  <andythenorth> Yexo: there currently is no difference
21:32:25  <Yexo> ok, I wasn't sure if that was intended
21:32:26  <andythenorth> I'll add some other stuff to the non-track tile when I decide what
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21:44:43  <Brot6> MinchinWeb's Random Town Names - Revision 29: [Minchin Town Names] [AB Town Names] Removed GRF's ... ( @
21:44:43  <Brot6> MinchinWeb's Random Town Names - Revision 30: [Minchin Town Names] [AB Town Names] Removed images... ( @
21:46:19  <MinchinWeb> A couple of days ago, the 'MinchinWeb Town Names' project was created on DevZone... can the same thing be done for my 'Alberta Town Names' please?
21:47:06  <Yexo> sure
21:47:14  <Yexo> what should the project identifier be?
21:47:34  <Yexo> mwrandtownnames <- that is the project identifier for MinchinWeb Town Names
21:47:36  <MinchinWeb> ABTownNames
21:48:37  <Yexo> there you go
21:49:02  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/abtownnames registered in Redmine with url /home/hg/abtownnames
21:49:02  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/abtownnames created
21:49:10  <Ammler> if you once are Manager, you can make as many projects, you want :-)
21:49:23  <Yexo> but not under the correct project
21:49:25  <Ammler> you might need Admin like Yexo to move it
21:49:39  <Yexo> you can only create subprojects under projects you're admin off
21:50:05  <Ammler> yep, should be no issue to create it that way and then ask us to move it around
21:50:25  <Yexo> true
21:50:44  <Ammler> theoretically, we could allow them to create it where ever they want...
21:50:51  <Yexo> I wouldn't do that
21:51:15  <Ammler> I agree, we have already a lot managers
21:51:15  <Yexo> as it's now we have a little more control over the structure of all projects
21:51:40  <Ammler> MinchinWeb: you wanna use mercurial for it?
21:52:21  <MinchinWeb> no Subversion please
21:52:27  <Ammler> :-D
21:52:35  <Ammler> we don't support new svn repos
21:52:50  <Ammler> but you can link it to your existing, if you want
21:53:00  <MinchinWeb> yeah that would work great
21:53:19  <MinchinWeb> (then I only have to keep track of files in one place too)
21:53:26  <Ammler> just edit the Repository settings like those for the other grf
21:53:49  <Yexo> is that actually possible?
21:53:53  <Yexo> I can't change the SCM there
21:54:03  <Ammler> you need first to delete the existing
21:54:11  <Ammler> as it is already created
21:54:22  <MinchinWeb> do you have to set up the repo in creating the project?
21:54:27  <MinchinWeb>
21:54:54  <MinchinWeb> ^ my Google code repo for the project in question
21:54:58  <Yexo> seems already done
21:55:08  <Yexo> though I still can't figure out how you'd go about changing that value
21:55:16  <Ammler>
21:55:50  <Yexo> SCM=Mercurial is still there
21:55:52  <Ammler> bottom right are functions "Users" and "Delete"
21:55:56  <Yexo> and the repository tab doesn't work
21:55:59  <Yexo> ah, there :)
21:56:27  <Ammler> Users is for aliases if the committer doesn't fit the devzone account
21:57:02  <Yexo> indeed, I've fixed that now for minchinweb's random town names
21:57:37  <MinchinWeb> I think I fixed it
21:57:39  <MinchinWeb> :)
21:58:08  <Ammler> you didn't
21:58:11  <Yexo> yep, looks like it works now
21:58:12  <Ammler> it is still mercurial
21:58:15  <Ammler> hmm
21:58:38  <Ammler> ah
21:58:40  <Ammler> refresh
21:58:41  <Ammler> :-P
21:59:48  <MinchinWeb> thanks so much
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22:25:55  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1898:b1220e1af7da: Change: adjust probability and locati... (andythenorth) @
22:26:27  <andythenorth> good night
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23:10:16  <Brot6> Alberta Town Names - Revision 29: [Minchin Town Names] [AB Town Names] Removed GRF's (moved to do... ( @
23:10:16  <Brot6> Alberta Town Names - Revision 30: [Minchin Town Names] [AB Town Names] Removed images (moved to W... ( @
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23:44:46  <MinchinWeb> when you upload an AI, how does it create the 'Unique ID'? Is there a way I can set that directly?
23:48:00  <Yexo> yes, the return value from GetShortName() in your info.nut
23:48:22  <Yexo> AIs and AI Libraries: unique identifier is constructed from the four character short name defined in the info.nut. The MD5 checksum is the exclusive or of the MD5 checksums of all scripting files that are part of the AI or AI Library.
23:48:25  <Yexo> from
23:49:02  <Yexo> you can see an (possible incomplete) list of used identifiers here:
23:49:03  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums View topic - AI ShortName In-use (at
23:54:44  <MinchinWeb> can you set it directly like you do using NML?
23:54:55  <MinchinWeb> (ie with the hex codes?)
23:56:11  <Yexo> not sure, you'd have to check the squirrel documentation for that
23:56:28  <Yexo> why would you want to use anything other than ascii though?
23:57:09  <MinchinWeb> just wondering if I can get the first four numbers to match my TownNames
23:58:31  <Yexo>
23:58:32  <Webster> Title: Squirrel 2.2 Reference Manual (at
23:58:48  <Yexo> some escapes are possible, you'd have to try how to though
23:59:35  <MinchinWeb> the NoAI spec requires that the short name be a string?
23:59:42  <Yexo> yes

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