Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 7th October 2011:
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00:02:49  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Feature #3105: Länderbahn electric engines and MUs (oberhuemer) @
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08:58:48  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 746:029f04234558: -Doc: Update changelog and credits for 0.3.7 (planetmaker) @
09:16:18  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 747:9a946a26a032: Added tag 0.3.7 for changeset 029f04234558 (planetmaker) @
09:18:41  <Brot6> opengfx: update from 0.3.6 to 0.3.7 done -
09:27:23  <Brot6> OpenGFX - OpenGFX 0.3.7 released (planetmaker) @
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12:05:56  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115 (New): Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (UnicycleBloke) @
12:15:20  <Ammler> interesting ^
12:16:12  <Terkhen> yes :P
12:16:43  <Terkhen> I thought about doing something like that after finding grfmaker too lacking
12:17:07  <Terkhen> of course I found it too big :P
12:17:15  <planetmaker> he, I wrote an e-mail to him suggesting to take a look at the devzone ;-)
12:17:33  <Terkhen> :)
12:17:42  <Terkhen> before or after ^
12:17:48  <planetmaker> 2 hours ago
12:18:16  <planetmaker> mentioning SF I though he wasn't aware of the DevZone. I thought I could change that
12:18:25  <Terkhen> :)
12:20:04  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115: Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (admin) @
12:21:03  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/newgrf-viewer registered in Redmine with url /home/hg/newgrf-viewer
12:21:03  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/newgrf-viewer created
12:21:22  <planetmaker> hm, we should offer him to use another vcs, if he wants
12:21:25  <Terkhen> Qt is quite simple to use when you want to code something with a GUI, but getting releases / nightlies automatically might be a big PITA
12:21:38  <planetmaker> yes... we shall see
12:21:49  <planetmaker> thought qt surely is available as rpm
12:22:11  <Ammler> Terkhen: use a proper de and you have qt :-P
12:22:26  <Terkhen> archlinux even has mingw-qt packages for crosscompiling, I suppose other distros have them too
12:22:38  <Terkhen> Ammler: I'm strictly talking about Qt on windows :)
12:22:48  <planetmaker> ah
12:23:17  <planetmaker> long ago that I looked at qt. But back then it looked the simplest cross-platform UI thing I found
12:24:01  <Terkhen> it's quite powerful, but a bit bloated
12:24:05  <Ammler> hmm, not sure, do you need to recompile for windows or can you use the same qt apps=
12:24:46  <Terkhen> for windows you have the Qt SDK, which essentially is a special MinGW bundle with Qt already compiled
12:25:02  <Terkhen> bundled with Qt Creator and other related apps
12:25:34  <Terkhen> the libraries are dynamic, though, so you need to distribute the dlls along with your code
12:25:38  <Terkhen> and they are... big
12:25:58  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115: Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (planetmaker) @
12:26:32  <Ammler> planetmaker: the problem with other VCS is the lack of support
12:26:42  <planetmaker> from our side?
12:26:46  <Ammler> yes
12:26:49  <planetmaker> yes. Well
12:26:55  <Ammler> we can not help someone to use git or svn or whatever
12:27:00  <Ammler> does vcs are simply too complicated
12:27:11  <Ammler> but we can host those of course
12:27:18  <planetmaker> that's what I wanted to say
12:27:26  <planetmaker> the question is: what kind of support does he need?
12:27:32  <Ammler> well, not svn, but git or bazaar
12:27:35  <Ammler> or whatever
12:27:52  <planetmaker> and the other question is: what would break when trying to compile nightlies or releases from git of bazaar
12:27:58  <planetmaker> I doubt that much would break
12:27:58  <Ammler> if someone needs to learn a vcs anyway, we should recommend hg
12:28:04  <Ammler> the only useful vcs for starters
12:28:05  <planetmaker> Of course
12:28:31  <Terkhen> bbl
12:28:36  <planetmaker> But I don't know whether he has already a vcs in use. If he has... he might not want to switch
12:28:41  <planetmaker> bye, Terkhen
12:28:50  <Ammler> somewhen, I will update devzone to easy add git repos
12:29:08  <planetmaker> :-)
12:29:13  <Ammler> I also would really like to add "Fork" support
12:29:48  <planetmaker> Ammler, we maybe could consider to request a license for bamboo
12:29:58  <Ammler> what is bamboo?
12:30:12  <planetmaker> ;-)
12:30:27  <Ammler> ah well
12:31:02  <planetmaker> it's opensource and free for open source projects
12:31:18  <planetmaker> but it has not a FLOSS license
12:31:28  <Ammler> I don't think it is as powerful as our current system
12:31:30  <Ammler> rarely
12:31:51  <Ammler> we can simply build everything now
12:32:08  <planetmaker> yes, our current system is very simple to use
12:32:19  <planetmaker> I can hardly imagine it becoming simpler
12:32:22  <Ammler> well, that it lacks
12:32:24  <Ammler> :-)
12:32:36  <Ammler> bamboo might be user friendlier
12:33:07  <Ammler> but how does it support e.g. new projects with different build dependencies
12:33:29  <Ammler> hmm, does openttd still "sponsor" opendune ;-)
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12:55:28  <Terkhen> hello again
13:09:11  <planetmaker> wb, Terkhen  :-)
13:09:27  <planetmaker> Ammler, I'm not sure how easy it is to configure. I didn't have part in it.
13:09:59  <planetmaker> And yes, opendune is still 'sponsored' (but not ttdp :-P )
13:12:54  <Terkhen> no one has asked about it still?
13:13:26  <planetmaker> not officially
13:24:20  <Ammler> maybe ^Spike^ knows more as he is fan of atlassian
13:24:43  <Yexo> nobody asked outside the ttdpatch forum section
13:24:43  <^Spike^> ehm... i don't run it myself.. all i know is that the packets are very complete in what they can do...
13:25:27  <^Spike^> but can always try one of those 30 day packs of it to see what it can do..
14:03:08  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Support #2750: Tracking Table (oberhuemer) @
14:03:56  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115: Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (UnicycleBloke) @
14:06:09  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Support #2750: Tracking Table (planetmaker) @
14:10:41  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115 (Closed): Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (UnicycleBloke) @
14:10:41  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115: Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (planetmaker) @
14:10:41  <Brot6> DevZone Help Center - Membership #3115 (Closed): Applying for project: NewGRF Viewer (planetmaker) @
14:11:24  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Support #2750: Tracking Table (Eddi) @
15:13:56  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 837:0dfdd367a767: Update: changelog (Rubidium) @
15:13:56  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 838:a752c3e84979: Added tag 5.1.2 for changeset 0dfdd367a767 (Rubidium) @
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16:18:35  <Terkhen> hmm
16:19:04  <planetmaker> two letters which can express soooo much ;-)
16:19:05  <Terkhen> what "big things" are missing from nml? everyone at the forums keeps saying "a lot" but to my knowledge only stations are missing
16:19:17  <planetmaker> bridges
16:19:29  <planetmaker> canals / rivers
16:19:35  <planetmaker> and houses need a bit more love
16:19:55  <Rubidium> reflection ;)
16:20:35  <planetmaker> and procedures
16:22:06  <Terkhen> procedures are a nfo feature?
16:22:10  <Yexo> yes
16:22:22  <Yexo>
16:22:33  <Terkhen> strange :P
16:22:41  <Yexo> in fact nml uses it internally for some callbacks
16:22:52  <Yexo> the syntax for them is quite easy too, it's just not implemented
16:27:06  <Terkhen> I just find posts like the last one by AndersI amusing :)
16:27:23  <Terkhen> since nml / grfcodec are not feature complete, is it better to write different tools
16:27:34  <Terkhen> s/grfcodec/grfmaker/
16:27:41  <Yexo> he has a good point wrt grfmaker
16:27:50  <Yexo> since no sources are available, at least not for the most recent version
16:28:41  <Terkhen> yes
16:28:59  <Terkhen> I worked a bit with its code... in that case is better to start anew
16:50:55  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 211:8ecabc9d0094: move class definitions to a separate file (Eddi) @
16:52:06  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 212:78b55bd08bce: give each graphics include a unique postf... (Eddi) @
17:09:09  <Brot6> grfcodec: update from r836 to r838 done -
17:12:51  <Brot6> nml: update from r1680 to r1683 done -
17:19:32  <Brot6> opengfx: update from r745 to r747 done -
17:24:00  <Brot6> cets: update from r208 to r212 done (1145 warnings) -
17:39:23  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Feature #2924: Prussian steam engines (Eddi) @
17:43:31  <Brot6> MailAI - Revision 13:e0e8b8b779bb: BUGFIX Crash when tile used out of map borders (Hephi) @
17:51:53  <Brot6> vactrainset: compile of r1 still failed (#3044) -
18:04:57  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 213:df192191772a: misnamed graphics file and switched graph... (Eddi) @
18:04:57  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 214:8e2c24c30432: temporarily switched T3 graphics to avoid... (Eddi) @
18:04:57  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 215:648599a6cadd: implement graphic selection by date_of_la... (Eddi) @
18:12:01  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: ogfx-trains (Diffsize: 36114), narvs (11 warnings), bros (1 warnings), ogfx-industries (1 warnings) (Diffsize: 129173), firs, foobarstramtracks (Diffsize: 37000), transrapidtrackset, 2cctrainset (6 warnings), worldairlinersset, heqs, basecosts, nutracks, water-features, 32bpp-extra (2 warnings), manindu (Diffsize: 2), newgrf_makefile, rust,
18:12:01  <Brot6> snowlinemod, dutchtramset (Diffsize: 25964), swisstowns, metrotrackset (Diffsize: 1), dutchroadfurniture (Diffsize: 1984), spanishtowns (Diffsize: 2), frenchtowns, ogfx-rv, fish, ogfx-landscape (2 warnings), ttrs (7 warnings) (Diffsize: 1324), ogfx-trees, swedishrails, german-townnames, smts (Diffsize: 8), chips (1 warnings), belarusiantowns (Diffsize: 30), indonesiantowns (1 warnings) (Diffsize: 1), airportsplus (Diffsize: 964),
18:12:03  <Brot6> comic-houses (3 warnings) (Diffsize: 22)
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18:35:07  <Yexo> <- planetmaker, Terkhen: any comments?
18:37:56  <planetmaker> sounds great
18:38:12  <planetmaker> where do you plan to post it?
18:38:27  <planetmaker> I guess the three bug trackers trains / rv / airports could be linked
18:38:36  <planetmaker> and actually... landscape could use sprites, too
18:38:54  <planetmaker> if we go for it we could go for it completely
18:39:01  <Terkhen> OpenGFX+ Trains and OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles <-- better without abbreviations for a forum thread :P
18:39:08  <Terkhen> besides that, perfect :)
18:40:15  * planetmaker ponders
18:40:31  <Yexo> ah yes, I forgot about were we want the sprites
18:40:36  <Yexo> bug tracker or this forum topic?
18:40:53  <Yexo> I'm going to post it in 32-bit Graphics Development
18:40:56  <Terkhen> "bug tracker is prefered but this thread is fine too"
18:41:11  <Terkhen> some people seem to have allergy to register in new sites
18:41:14  <planetmaker> yes. I'm slightly editing it as a suggestion
18:41:50  <planetmaker> There seems to be a funny half-sentence following "ECS or FIRS" and preceeding "This is where ... come in"
18:42:52  <Yexo> should we make a new category in the bug tracker for this?
18:43:28  <planetmaker> yes, 32bpp seems fine
18:44:30  <Terkhen> new category, yes
18:44:36  <planetmaker> <-- my slight update
18:46:19  <Yexo> what link shall I use, simply ?
18:46:28  <Yexo> or ?
18:46:35  <planetmaker> hm...
18:46:43  <planetmaker> use the issues link w/o new
18:47:00  <planetmaker>
18:47:23  <planetmaker> then people can also look what's going on otherwise in that set :-)
18:47:54  <Yexo> yes, I agree
18:49:35  <Yexo> ok, there we go:
18:49:36  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums View topic - Request: 32bpp (normal zoom) graphics for OpenGFX+ projects (at
18:57:41  <planetmaker> Yexo: I just spotted a typo I didn't see earlier: last sentence must start with "Once".
18:58:52  <Yexo> thanks, fixed
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19:02:28  <Brot6> clientpatches: compile of r23012 still failed (#2964) -
19:04:21  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r23012 still failed (#2966) -
19:06:29  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: compile of r23012 still failed (#2446) -
19:08:25  <Terkhen> nice, now let's see what they say :P
19:08:51  <planetmaker> yep. I'm curious
19:23:40  <frosch123> if in doubt, then someone will be offended :p
19:24:30  <planetmaker> meh
19:28:36  <Terkhen> that's always a possibility, but why in this case? :P
19:29:07  <planetmaker> "stealing" attention of the 32bpp set as-is on jupix' server?
19:29:10  <planetmaker> not sure :-)
19:30:06  <planetmaker> at least in terms of relative attention ;-)
19:30:12  <planetmaker> which is the important thing for egos
19:44:06  <frosch123> Terkhen: there is a high percentage of "artists" in the 32bpp forum. and when i learned something on the forums, then that artists can be offended by things you never imagined before
19:44:51  <Yexo> the worst thing that can happen is that we get absolutely no sprites at all
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19:45:48  <Yexo> ben robbin's sprites are all gpl and include the source
19:45:56  <Yexo> so we can always resize those from z0 to z2 and use that
19:46:44  <Terkhen> heh
19:46:48  <Terkhen> we'll see :)
19:57:24  <Rubidium> I'm not sure downsampling them will get great quality stuff
19:57:30  <Rubidium> as the details just get blurred completely
19:58:36  <Yexo> the original 3dmax files are also available, so we could also render them at the correct size
19:59:13  <andythenorth> what madness is happening? :o
20:00:42  <frosch123> we decided to drop support for .grf. ottd will now read .3ds directly
20:00:55  <andythenorth> oh that's actually quite sane
20:01:00  <Yexo> andythenorth:
20:01:01  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums View topic - Request: 32bpp (normal zoom) graphics for OpenGFX+ projects (at
20:01:03  <andythenorth> it means I can stop contributing :)
20:01:06  <andythenorth> my life will be easier
20:39:05  <frosch123> damn, how do i edit the commit message of r1 of hg repo with 85 revisions which i have already published?
20:39:20  <andythenorth> build a time machine
20:40:55  <planetmaker> uhm... that's difficult, frosch123
20:40:56  <frosch123> i could delete the repository on the remote machine, and just assume noone ever pulled it
20:41:08  <frosch123> esp, since noone would patch it anyway
20:41:25  <frosch123> <- i just want to replace 1.8.1 with 1.8.2
20:42:03  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/spiketest registered in Redmine with url /home/hg/spiketest
20:42:03  <Brot6> repository /home/hg/spiketest created
20:43:59  <planetmaker> hm, might be the only option indeed
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21:22:14  <frosch123> <- magic :p
21:22:45  <frosch123> i doubt i will ever do "hg strip -n 0" again though :p
21:22:59  <andythenorth> bed time :)
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21:52:45  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Revision 0:25063560352b: First commit - transferred from local SVN repository (Alan@Alan-Laptop.home) @
21:56:07  <frosch123> :)
22:00:46  <frosch123> haha, svn user :p
22:01:36  <frosch123> "trunk"
22:04:33  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Revision 1:9a92fa399ef7: Added first release build and associated distributables. (Alan@Alan-Laptop.home) @
22:09:55  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Code Review #3116 (New): Simplify display of structures (UnicycleBloke) @
22:13:23  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Feature #3117 (New): Create models to represent the fields in an action (UnicycleBloke) @
22:14:53  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Bug #3118 (New): Add support for UTF8 strings to string converter (UnicycleBloke) @
22:15:12  <frosch123> compiled with some sed magic
22:16:42  <Rubidium> and the repository is already 13 times larger than needed :(
22:17:28  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Feature #3119 (New): Add edit box to display long strings, in the area in lower R... (UnicycleBloke) @
22:18:23  <frosch123> hmm, so far i did not find any grf it could open...
22:18:50  <frosch123> makes we wonder whether it is related to my linux "port"
22:19:18  <Rubidium> have you tried 001_action8.grf?
22:19:32  <frosch123> maybe i should pull
22:19:48  <frosch123> i can open plain grf without any pseudo sprites
22:19:52  <frosch123> e.g. trgt.grf
22:20:19  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Feature #3120 (New): Find a way to present property values with more human readab... (UnicycleBloke) @
22:20:52  <frosch123> oh, these are all tickets, not commits
22:21:52  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Feature #3121 (New): Switch the build to static linking (UnicycleBloke) @
22:21:52  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Feature #3122 (New): Make sure the software builds under Linux (UnicycleBloke) @
22:30:36  <Brot6> NewGRF Viewer - Code Review #3123 (New): Linux port (frosch) @
22:32:45  <frosch123> the linux binary is 532 kiB btw.
22:43:34  <frosch123> hmm, why are my gcc man pages broken...
23:00:59  <frosch123> night
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