Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 4th November 2011:
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09:09:56  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3204 (New): support for CB 0x15E (planetmaker) @
09:12:06  <Yexo> we need callback-specific variables
09:13:14  <planetmaker> yes, I suspected that I missed something in the 10 minutes I looked at it for now :-)
09:13:42  <planetmaker> though... does this CB have any special variable?
09:13:46  <planetmaker> hm... yes. 0x10
09:14:14  <Yexo> it wasn't meant as criticism on your patch
09:14:23  <Yexo> as I don't think we do anything special for 0x10 for other callbacks
09:14:59  <Yexo>     'location_check'        : {'type': 'cb', 'num': 0x28,  'flag_bit': 3}, # We need a way to access all those special variables <- from industry callbacks
09:15:10  <planetmaker> hm, might be true, yes
09:16:20  <planetmaker> and no worries, I certainly took no offence. I just attached it to the tracker as I've got to go now and I'm currently not sure I'll have time for a thorough look before Sunday (late) night
09:16:32  <planetmaker> maybe tonight, but not sure
09:16:36  <Yexo> just commit it :)
09:16:43  <planetmaker> ok, that's easy :-P
09:18:14  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature Request #3205 (New): Callback-specific variables (yexo) @
09:22:20  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1709:9d6a6e097bbd: Add: Support for callback 0x15E (refit costs) ... (planetmaker) @
09:38:17  <planetmaker> hmpf... one 's' too much
09:38:27  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1710:7a63c3ad6027: Fix (r1709): Name the callback identical to th... (planetmaker) @
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10:09:13  <planetmaker> Yexo: what's in an NML NewGRF the best way to include a CB only for new(er) versions of OpenTTD?
10:09:49  <Yexo> you can simply include it for all versions
10:09:54  <Yexo> older openttd simply doesn't call it
10:10:55  <Yexo> it's just another varaction2 block that is never used by old openttd versions
10:11:04  <planetmaker> oh, hm. That's easy
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10:38:40  <planetmaker> <-- I couldn't quite resit to produce a test. Would that make sense, Yexo?
10:39:58  <V453000> I hear my refit and my senses tingle :-D
10:40:07  <V453000> *I hear refit
10:40:09  <V453000> .. :)
10:40:40  <planetmaker> V453000: refit in stations ;-)
10:41:02  <Yexo> planetmaker: what I don't get is why you sometimes use CB_FAILED and sometimes "return 40;"
10:41:05  <planetmaker> to automatically pickup the cargo which is there most (if the vehicle can refit to it)
10:41:07  <V453000> oh, like go to station and refit to XX ?
10:41:08  <Yexo> and one time even "return 0"
10:41:27  <planetmaker> Yexo: true. 40 and CB_FAILED should be equivalent (40 is default)
10:41:34  <planetmaker> but 0 should mean allow w/o cost
10:41:42  <Yexo> ok
10:41:52  <Yexo> it'd be more clear if you replace dthe "CB_FAILED" with "40"
10:42:00  <Yexo> or maybe a define with value 40
10:42:30  <planetmaker> CB_FAILED is failing the CB. Isn't the refit_cost value as of the property used?
10:42:41  <Yexo> yes
10:42:49  <Yexo> but in your patch you're mixing the styles
10:42:58  <planetmaker> I'd consistently use CB_FAILED
10:43:12  <Yexo> fine too :)
10:43:18  <planetmaker> ah... hm... 40 | CB_RESULT_AUTOREFIT you mean?
10:43:33  <planetmaker> that's not the same as just 40 (as of the property)
10:43:45  <Yexo> I know, but bulk_wagon_refit_cost_switch has a return 40;
10:44:02  <planetmaker> yes, that should be CB_FAILED. Fully ack
10:44:02  <Yexo> sin't it possible to do this via the cargo classes?
10:44:08  <planetmaker> it's all bulk ;-)
10:44:22  <Yexo> so far for the use of cargo classes ;)
10:44:43  <planetmaker> the wagons in ogfx+trains work kind of by cargo class
10:44:53  <planetmaker> it'll be more interesting for the goods wagon
10:45:00  <planetmaker> piece goods wagon
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10:48:35  <Yexo> so clean->clean has costs and autorefit, clean->dirty is free and autorefit, dirty->dirty is free and autorefit and dirty->clean has costs and no autorefit
10:49:23  <Yexo> FRUT is refrigated btw, can it even be transported by a bulk wagon?
10:49:40  <planetmaker> yep, that's the idea with refit.
10:50:01  <planetmaker> wrt fruit: this is like apples or so which can be transported
10:50:13  <planetmaker> the refrigerated wagon will get a cost bonus to make it attractive
10:51:09  <Yexo> ok
10:51:13  <Yexo> seems fine to me
10:51:32  <planetmaker> good :-) I think I'll half the refit costs from clean->clean though
10:51:42  <planetmaker> it's not as extensive cleaning necessary
10:51:50  <Yexo> I agree
10:53:09  <V453000> tbh refit costs are rather just ugly than doing something ... I hate to see the red numbers flying over depots. Some sets have "free" refit costs which I really like ... there is no real reason to have them I suppose
10:53:55  <planetmaker> V453000: with the same reasoning buying vehicles could be free ;-)
10:54:22  <frosch123> refit costs are now just a special running-like-cost for loading/unloading
10:54:47  <V453000> not really, if you buy a wagon, you have it, you just need to select which refit you want
10:55:00  <V453000> and if the train is already running, who cares about 200 spent for last month for refits
10:57:10  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 255:e01a8efd29c1: Add: Allow in principle autorefit for all wagons (planetmaker) @
10:57:10  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 256:7c3a40d07b4d: Feature: Allow autorefit for bulk wagons from one ca... (planetmaker) @
10:57:23  <V453000> imo choosing the appropriate refit is like choosing the correct wagon. Choosing different wagons does not cost anything either
10:58:33  <V453000> or are your wagons able to refit between wagon classes? Like bulk refits to a piece goods wagon?
10:59:17  <planetmaker> in principle that's feasible now
10:59:23  <planetmaker> but I don't do that
10:59:54  <planetmaker> one wagon with all refits. Which allows refit in depot only or also in station depending on current and future cargo
11:00:45  <planetmaker> though you could have done that before, too. Just only in the depot
11:01:58  <V453000> I see, I have an "universal wagon" in the tasklist as well :)
11:05:03  <V453000> anyway, I will be going to school :) have a nice day
11:24:49  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 257:2e7c9e8bbbfd: Feature: Allow autorefit for tank wagons from one ca... (planetmaker) @
11:42:03  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 258:63c0735d1f49: Feature: Allow autorefit for flatbed wagons, unless ... (planetmaker) @
11:45:38  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 259:2c75a81367d3: Add: Allow autorefit also for the monorail and magle... (planetmaker) @
11:53:51  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 260:1047ae12fa82: Feature: Allow autorefit for the refrigerate wagons (planetmaker) @
12:23:28  <agaran> can somebody tell me how to use third button in train depot which as i understand should allow upgrade/replace of engine?
12:26:51  <Yexo> what does the button say?
12:27:02  <Yexo> as I'm not sure which button you mean
12:27:24  <planetmaker> hovering with the mouse over it should display a tooltip
12:27:34  <Yexo> if you're looking for autoreplace, you don't access that via the depot but via the general vehicle lists
12:27:59  <planetmaker>
12:29:52  <frosch123> that button triggers autorenew/replace for vehicles idling in the depot
12:30:34  <frosch123> both effects are usually triggered automatically when a vehicle enters a depot; but not for idle vehicles stopped in depots
12:39:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 261:b61dae1dadb9: Change: Allow free refit for the piece goods wagon, ... (planetmaker) @
12:50:22  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 262:52ba3525cc23: Feature: Allow free and automatic refits for the PAX... (planetmaker) @
12:56:25  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 263:d01c02a86fde: Feature: Allow free and automatic refits for the mai... (planetmaker) @
13:15:36  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 264:c3218bbf24ec: Change: Allow SH125 to refit for free between cargos... (planetmaker) @
13:17:35  <planetmaker> Yexo: ^^ r264 makes use of cargo classes ;-)
13:17:52  <frosch123> free refit to tourists?
13:18:09  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 265:c4ef2ea98560: Fix (r264): Typo - Compile before commit (planetmaker) @
13:18:19  <planetmaker> frosch123: yes
13:18:21  <planetmaker> from pax
13:18:41  <frosch123> he, was a random guess without looking at the diff :)
13:18:57  <planetmaker> and actually for mail and valuables, too
13:19:25  <frosch123> does ogfx+trains have articulated vehicles?
13:19:32  <frosch123> (which are refittable)
13:19:49  <planetmaker> no(t yet)
13:20:29  <planetmaker> that's for Terkhen to add for ogfx+rv :-P
13:20:30  <frosch123> i wondered whether it is obvious from the specs, that you set refittability per part, and thus also have to set the AUTOREFIT flag and the callback per part
13:20:49  <planetmaker> it's a vehicle property...
13:20:56  <planetmaker> and each part is a vehicle
13:21:20  <Terkhen> as soon as I have sprites :)
13:21:51  <planetmaker> trams are articulated?
13:22:11  <planetmaker> or do I err?
13:23:00  <Terkhen> oh, I thought you meant to add new ones
13:23:37  <planetmaker> no :-)
13:23:45  <Terkhen> I still have not checked the autorefit thing so I don't know much about that :P
13:24:16  <planetmaker> apropos... do you remember the amount / type of advantage the refrigerated vehicles got?
13:25:41  <Terkhen> IIRC we settled for some aging value that felt right, without any logical reasons for it :P
13:26:07  <Terkhen> something along the lines of "has a small but noticeable effect at short distances"
13:26:33  <planetmaker> yes. I hoped you'd remember and I'd not have to look it up ;-)
13:26:47  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 266:392847ac9d90: Feature: Allow armoured wagons to freely and automat... (planetmaker) @
13:26:48  <Terkhen> <--- I had to look at it to remember :P
13:28:28  <Terkhen> oooh... so you can refit vehicles directly at stations now? :)
13:30:33  <michi_cc> Yep, and even to the cargo type with the most waiting cargo (only of those that are a refit target of course) :)
13:30:56  <Terkhen> nice :)
13:31:24  <planetmaker> michi_cc: can I choose the cargo explicitly, too?
13:31:47  <michi_cc> planetmaker: Open OpenTTD and try ;)
13:31:49  <michi_cc> Yes, cou can.
13:31:51  <planetmaker> (I didn't yet play test anything there, either ;-) )
13:31:58  <michi_cc> s/cou/you/
13:32:00  <planetmaker> I first finish OpenGFX+Trains ;-)
13:32:10  <Terkhen> oh, and a ogfx-rv bug that I didn't notice
13:32:15  <planetmaker> and then fix the many errors in writing in a sandbox w/o test :-P
13:33:20  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Feature #3206 (New): Autorefit support (Terkhen) @
13:34:16  <planetmaker> Mostly I still need to check the engines now for autorefit...
13:35:11  <Terkhen> bbl
13:35:25  <planetmaker> enjoy
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14:05:37  <agaran> frosch123: thank you, i never found how to use it so far, will try later (after $work)
14:20:59  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 267:6ece887187d1: Feature: Age cargos slower in refrigerated wagons so... (planetmaker) @
14:48:57  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 268:7d8b2bee89ba: Add #3036: Add oil seeds and copper to CTT and treat... (planetmaker) @
15:14:22  <frosch123> sometimes i am frightened when i know what number means which callback :s
15:14:51  <planetmaker> :-)
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15:33:59  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 269:4ccec4008dde: Change #3036: Display the steel sprites when carryin... (planetmaker) @
16:30:07  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3207 (New): support for long date of last servicing (planetmaker) @
16:31:12  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3204 (Closed): support for CB 0x15E (planetmaker) @
16:31:12  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3204 (Closed): support for CB 0x15E (planetmaker) @
16:35:45  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3202 (Closed): easier regression handling - makefile (planetmaker) @
16:35:45  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1711:ac1343cc53b5: Add #3202: Makefile in the root dir with targe... (planetmaker) @
16:35:45  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3202 (Closed): easier regression handling - makefile (planetmaker) @
16:44:39  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Bug #3208 (New): refit options for Dash / Manley-Morel (planetmaker) @
16:52:51  <planetmaker> Yexo: any idea how NML could handle the long and short version of the last-service-variable w/o exposing that to the user (that of course would be an easy add)?
16:53:21  <planetmaker> or... Hirundo? :-)
17:10:27  <Brot6> nml: update from r1708 to r1711 done -
17:18:52  <Brot6> ogfx-trains: update from r254 to r269 done -
17:20:27  <Brot6> heqs: update from r677 to r678 done -
17:20:48  <Yexo> is the short version ever useful?
17:22:02  <Yexo> since r1707 it always uses the long version
17:22:13  <Yexo> the only disadvantage I can think of is that the minimum openttd version is a bit higher
17:22:25  <Yexo> but since we have no good way to expose that yet, I didn't care
17:25:50  <planetmaker> oh, I missed 1707 then
17:26:09  <planetmaker> a 'bit higher' is good... no stable would work. And yes, ogfx+trains uses it already
17:26:27  <planetmaker> at least I seem to recall so. I'll check
17:28:10  <Yexo> the old variable already behaved as the long version in nml
17:28:27  <planetmaker> eh?
17:29:11  <planetmaker> how could it have worked such before?
17:29:19  <Yexo> date-of-last-service was always "days since year 0" in nml
17:29:34  <Yexo> previously it just added "days from 0 to 1920" to the value it got from openttd
17:30:03  <planetmaker> oh :-)
17:30:08  <Yexo> that's why the name has changed but the functionality stayed exactly the same (only now it works before 1920 and after xyz)
17:30:23  <planetmaker> and... I should upgrade my memorey. I only use(d) so far the build year
17:31:01  <planetmaker> I guess i just played too long with that variable only to skip it for its limiation at that point
17:43:02  <Brot6> opengfx: rebuild of r840 done (Diffsize: 7) (DiffDiffsize: 8) -
17:56:37  <Brot6> vactrainset: compile of r1 still failed (#3044) -
18:12:27  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: narvs (11 warnings) (Diffsize: 39), ogfx-industries (1 warnings), firs (24 warnings), foobarstramtracks (Diffsize: 37022), cets (273 warnings), manindu (Diffsize: 2), newgrf_makefile, rust (Diffsize: 37), ogfx-biggui, dutchtramset (Diffsize: 26024), swisstowns (Diffsize: 39), dutchroadfurniture (Diffsize: 2045), spanishtowns (Diffsize: 8),
18:12:27  <Brot6> frenchtowns (Diffsize: 21), ogfx-rv (Diffsize: 40), ogfx-landscape (2 warnings), swedishrails (Diffsize: 204), german-townnames (Diffsize: 39), dach (11 warnings), belarusiantowns (Diffsize: 63), indonesiantowns (1 warnings) (Diffsize: 21), airportsplus (Diffsize: 964)
19:02:38  <Brot6> clientpatches: compile of r23113 still failed (#2964) -
19:04:33  <Brot6> serverpatches: compile of r23113 still failed (#2966) -
19:06:34  <Brot6> 32bpp-ez-patches: compile of r23113 still failed (#2446) -
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19:46:28  <Yexo> Is the order of properties relevant except for the sbustitute property for houses/industries/industry tiles?
19:49:11  <planetmaker> if you define them twice
19:50:15  <Rubidium> Yexo: for cargos there's 0B vs 1B and 0C vs 1C
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19:51:42  <Rubidium> I'd guess for sounds 0A needs to be done last as well
19:54:06  <Rubidium> for objects 0D before 14
19:55:49  <Rubidium> for trains 0B before 13
19:56:53  <Rubidium> and all long dates vs short dates
19:57:08  <frosch123> there are some properties which state that they must be set after some others
19:57:13  <Rubidium> and I'd reckon there are more
19:57:47  <Yexo> I was looking at fixing #2962. All examples given so far seem fine with it, but would it be safe to order the properties by their id?
19:57:47  <Brot6> Yexo: #2962 is "NewGRF Meta Language - Feature Request #2962: handling of substitute property - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
19:58:10  <frosch123> e.g long format vehicle intro dates must be set after the short ones
19:58:49  <frosch123> i guess you might be save in most cases when ordering then numerically
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20:34:58  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 270:2978315eea55: Codechange: Use new callback style for Turbotrain (planetmaker) @
21:17:50  <planetmaker> hm... nml doesn't treat km/h properly
21:18:01  <planetmaker> I write 160km/h as speed unit and I get 159 km/h ingame
21:18:35  <michi_cc> planetmaker: There are some km/h values that are not representable exactly in nfo units.
21:18:59  <planetmaker> but I get 160km/h ingame when I write 161km/h in NML
21:19:08  <planetmaker> And yes, I know
21:19:22  <planetmaker> but specifying km/h in NML should give the very same ingame
21:19:32  <planetmaker> whether it can be specified exactly or not
21:20:08  <Yexo> planetmaker: #1629
21:20:08  <Brot6> Yexo: planetmaker: #1629 is "NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #1629: Review conversion for speed property - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
21:20:18  <planetmaker> or, let's say, it should work the other way around: if openttd can display it, NML should allow to write that very value
21:20:40  <planetmaker> Yexo: I wonder whether we just should use a conversion table
21:20:57  <Yexo> nah
21:21:11  <Yexo> I'll just implement openttd's nfo->km/h conversion and fix nml from there
21:21:33  <michi_cc> Wasn't there some bug report about incorrect km/h conversion factor that was reverted again because of set author complaints? (*cough*mb*cough*)
21:21:42  <Yexo> yes
21:21:54  <Yexo> nml's conversion is the more correct one, but openttd does the historic conversion
21:21:59  <Yexo> so nml needs to change to follow openttd
21:25:02  * frosch123 wonders again what would happen if we would just round all speeds to steps of 5
21:25:16  <frosch123> (that is, only for display purposes, not affecting gameplay)
21:26:01  <michi_cc> I'm sure there is some engine that historically went exactly 63.7 km/h and somebody will complain :p
21:27:05  * andythenorth likes odd speeds
21:27:17  <andythenorth> like 31mph for some trams when others go 30mph
21:28:51  <planetmaker> hm... I can't yet use units in callback results, right?
21:29:36  <planetmaker>
21:29:58  <Yexo> nope, not yet anyway
21:30:59  <planetmaker> oh... I don't need that anyway when there's a livery override
21:36:41  <Yexo> almost a month without any 32bpp sprites except for those sources from zephyris
21:40:18  <planetmaker> yes :-(
21:58:38  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 679:5ba2de316f22: Feature: improved lighting on small tra... (andythenorth) @
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22:02:41  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 680:33d69f8a9faf: Fix: log loads missing from tram wagons (andythenorth) @
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22:17:25  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 681:87313ccaa355: Fix: correct lighting on tank graphics ... (andythenorth) @
22:24:58  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 682:98f184dbad83: Fix: correct lighting further on small ... (andythenorth) @
22:26:09  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #3209 (New): Some additional cargos for tram wagons (andythenorth) @
22:30:54  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles - Feature #3206: Autorefit support (Terkhen) @
22:33:54  <planetmaker> \o/
22:34:44  <planetmaker> oh... I thought it was a commit :-)
22:34:56  <Terkhen> :)
22:35:07  <Terkhen> I'm sorry, lately I have been too busy :P
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22:42:05  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 271:5fa38975bcd5: Change #1920: Give rail wagons a speed limit of 160k... (planetmaker) @
22:43:58  <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #3192: Modern cargo trams (andythenorth) @

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