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01:08:48 *** Zuu has quit IRC 01:48:12 <Ammler> Yexo: how should he be able to provide a savegame, if he isn't able to start a game? 01:49:11 <Ammler> oh, already almost 3 01:49:15 <Ammler> mäh, good night 04:05:04 *** sup has quit IRC 07:01:22 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC 08:05:01 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 08:11:03 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest22435 08:11:03 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:19:26 *** andythenorth has left #openttdcoop.devzone 09:44:18 *** TheODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:49:49 *** TheODM has quit IRC 09:53:02 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:26:50 <Brot6> Dutch Road Furniture - Revision 93:9c95eec9e863: Feature: disable roadside trees and streetlights... (foobar) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/dutchroadfurniture/repository/revisions/9c95eec9e863 10:26:50 <Brot6> Dutch Road Furniture - Revision 94:84a8d6c1db40: Feature: full UK roads support for gantries (iss... (foobar) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/dutchroadfurniture/repository/revisions/84a8d6c1db40 11:50:19 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:24:52 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:58:17 <planetmaker> hi andythenorth 13:03:18 <planetmaker> I can't say I'm surprised by his answer. It's the same as always. "This is my opinion. We discussed it. I keep it. I don't care about the rest" 13:03:44 <planetmaker> I honestly care not about ttdp and that compatibility anymore. 13:04:02 <planetmaker> and we have the new vehicle properties to make things easier. If they're used 13:04:31 <planetmaker> which he simply refuses to acknowledge and to exist. He wants to keep the traditional way with bits and xor. So let it be 13:04:50 <planetmaker> and similar with classes. It was all discussed and the result is well ignored. Oh well 13:06:18 <planetmaker> he'll repeat the same thing over and over in different words until one agrees - or ignores it. 13:06:39 <andythenorth> it's really George I need an answer from - as we've changed a class he's using 13:07:41 <planetmaker> I agree though, the tone is amiable. But the result to concede and (also) use the new opportunities is zero. 13:07:51 <andythenorth> I think BDMT would justify powdered - I overlooked the side effect of setting bulk, which is bricks etc travelling by hopper :) 13:08:17 <planetmaker> no. if it's bulk, then it's cement. then it's ok 13:08:25 <andythenorth> I'm also inclined not to change FISH to SEFD - and to close the ticket about that 13:08:28 <planetmaker> it's a "soft" cargo with many representations. like lumber 13:08:48 <planetmaker> s/lumber/wood products/ 13:09:02 <andythenorth> I wouldn't fancy counting cement grains 13:09:05 <planetmaker> I'm not sure about FISH. It has too good cargo support 13:09:17 <andythenorth> graphics? 13:09:38 <planetmaker> I think some sets do. At least they take special care of FISH already 13:09:52 <andythenorth> let's bounce the ticket then, I'll reject it 13:09:53 <planetmaker> But I'd not like powder for bdmt 13:10:00 <andythenorth> any particular reason? 13:10:03 <planetmaker> it kinda negates the argument for the secondary classes 13:10:05 <planetmaker> with the not 13:10:19 <planetmaker> imho it's 180° of what you argued for classes 13:10:32 <andythenorth> but Eddi won that argument, not me 13:10:36 <andythenorth> I conceded 13:10:54 <planetmaker> then I don't know what hte argument is. I go by what the wiki now states 13:11:06 <planetmaker> and that means "no powder" in my eyes for bdmt 13:11:12 <andythenorth> to me, wiki suggests we should be setting 'bulk + powder' if we want cement ;) 13:11:21 <planetmaker> as it would result to exclude bdmt from any non-powder wagon 13:11:23 <planetmaker> which is very bad 13:11:31 <planetmaker> I don't want cement 13:11:37 <planetmaker> as the only idea of it 13:11:38 <andythenorth> should only exclude from bulk wagons, not piece 13:11:41 <planetmaker> thus: no powder 13:12:05 <andythenorth> ...but would exclude from wagons that were bulk AND/OR piece 13:12:10 <andythenorth> such as open wagons... 13:12:12 <andythenorth> meh 13:12:18 <planetmaker> hm, makes sense 13:12:23 <planetmaker> maybe. If you prefer 13:12:38 <andythenorth> well I don't like that additional exclusion from open wagons. It's of no help 13:12:43 <planetmaker> but then other bulk things aren't covered 13:13:00 <andythenorth> I think these extra classes are broadly unusable :P 13:13:10 <planetmaker> which could also be transported bulk. Though we have sand and gravel and stuff extra 13:13:57 <andythenorth> let's leave it be 13:14:26 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #3437 (Rejected): Consider new cargo label replacing FISH (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3437#change-9018 13:17:22 <andythenorth> ho 13:17:34 <andythenorth> the UKRS 2 covered hopper has some interesting refits 13:17:51 <andythenorth> Wool, Fish, Goods, Recyclables 13:17:57 <andythenorth> none of which are remotely appropriate :) 13:18:22 <planetmaker> he. well. I'd not mind recyclables. But meh to the rest 13:18:32 <andythenorth> hey ho 13:18:55 <andythenorth> I think the answer is to make my own train set :D 13:19:02 <planetmaker> :-P 13:19:21 <planetmaker> well. That's the class cruft. And ukrs2 also doesn't yet use the new method of cargo include / exclude 13:19:29 <planetmaker> nor for special treatment 13:19:48 <andythenorth> so I'm done with classes until somebody can prove there's a problem :) 13:19:51 <andythenorth> we've done all we can 13:19:54 <planetmaker> these oddities are due to the mucked up classes in the first place. And the fuzzy way on how they should be used 13:19:57 <planetmaker> yes, I think we did 13:20:11 <planetmaker> we can't safe the world. Only make our home a better place 13:20:37 * andythenorth looks to 0.7.1 tickets 13:20:55 <andythenorth> #2755 has me baffled 13:20:56 <Brot6> andythenorth: #2755 is http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/show/2755 "FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #2755: Grain Mill snow sprites - incorrect ground tile. - #openttdcoop Development Zone" 13:21:51 <planetmaker> is it still valid? 13:21:55 <andythenorth> yes 13:22:15 <andythenorth> shows full tile snow during the snowline transition 13:22:25 <andythenorth> probably just an obiwan or such 13:22:35 <planetmaker> maybe not using the template 13:22:56 <andythenorth> iirc, we discussed that FIRS has two snow templates in use 13:23:01 <andythenorth> and that we needed to unify? 13:23:04 <andythenorth> I might misremember 13:24:15 <planetmaker> it uses, as far as a quick look goes, the old binary snow template 13:24:20 <planetmaker> not ground aware 13:24:44 <andythenorth> that would explain it 13:24:58 <planetmaker> hm. or... ? 13:25:06 <planetmaker> strange, builder's yard looks the same 13:27:50 <andythenorth> forest is interesting 13:28:00 <andythenorth> we think snow can't fall under the trees? :D 13:29:51 <planetmaker> :-) 13:32:52 <planetmaker> ah, well, andythenorth. The grain mill has a lot of custom ground tile which is drawn onto the groundaware ground 13:32:59 <planetmaker> thus the result might be either snow or no snow 13:33:22 <andythenorth> I thought I left some clear 13:33:23 * andythenorth checks 13:33:34 <planetmaker> wait... hm... grain mill? the old or the new? 13:33:48 <andythenorth> the brick one 13:33:59 <andythenorth> .old.png looks redundant 13:34:04 <andythenorth> should probably be deleted 13:34:27 <andythenorth> the ground is ~80% covered in the version I'm referring to :) 13:34:44 <planetmaker> yes, that's what I see, too 13:35:10 <andythenorth> hmm 13:35:24 <andythenorth> I remember looking at this before 13:35:38 <andythenorth> the original ttd buildings also show complete snow around buildings even on snow transition 13:35:51 <andythenorth> I'm not sure it's an issue, apart from the graphical discontinuity 13:36:06 <andythenorth> maybe we just fence the industry and it won't stand out so much 13:39:27 <andythenorth> hmm 13:39:34 <andythenorth> I don't like closing tickets with 'good enough' 13:39:40 <andythenorth> good enough != awesome :P 14:01:41 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 2697:1ae8323dae90: Change: improve text for 'no opening'... (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/1ae8323dae90 14:01:58 <planetmaker> nah, keep the ticket open for now 14:02:56 <andythenorth> planetmaker: I am writing a description text for station rating parameter 14:03:05 <andythenorth> in your words, what do you think it does? 14:03:08 <andythenorth> :) 14:03:31 <Yexo> so s/I am writing/I'm making planetmaker write/ ? :p 14:03:59 * andythenorth isn't sure where to start :P 14:06:08 <andythenorth> "By default, station ratings are a broken for the way many people play. This setting helps you fix that" 14:06:10 <andythenorth> :P 14:08:26 <planetmaker> lool 14:08:38 <andythenorth> "Station ratings affect the amount of cargo that industries provide to stations." 14:08:51 <planetmaker> sounds good 14:09:17 <planetmaker> though: The higher your station rating, the more cargo an industry delivers to that station 14:09:53 <planetmaker> (as 2nd sentence) 14:10:18 * andythenorth tests 14:14:53 <andythenorth> first sentence is redundant 14:15:59 <andythenorth> hmm 14:16:34 <andythenorth> fixed 14:17:23 <planetmaker> Station ratings influence the amount of cargo delivered by an industry to the station; the higher the rating, the more is delivered. This setting allows you to change the default behaviour of how station rating changes 14:17:46 <planetmaker> hm... much redundancy 14:17:59 <planetmaker> scrap last sentence. s/;/:/ 14:19:24 <andythenorth> currently I just have 14:19:25 <andythenorth> Station ratings affect the amount of cargo that industries provide to stations. Industry will provide more cargo to stations with higher ratings. 14:19:48 <andythenorth> but your first one is better 14:19:54 <andythenorth> Station ratings influence the amount of cargo delivered by an industry to the station; the higher the rating, the more is delivered. 14:25:42 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 2698:e4f365f50c9c: Change: set description text for stat... (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs/repository/revisions/e4f365f50c9c 14:25:42 <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #3443 (Closed): Station rating parameter needs a description (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3443#change-9019 14:30:56 <andythenorth> planetmaker: what do you want to do about #3021? 14:30:56 <Brot6> andythenorth: planetmaker: #3021 is http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/show/3021 "FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #3021: German translation - #openttdcoop Development Zone" 14:36:03 <planetmaker> keep open and look at before 0.7.1 14:36:24 <planetmaker> like an eternal reminder to me ;-) 14:36:35 <planetmaker> bounce from release to release :-P 14:36:47 <planetmaker> I'll up it when I'm done prior to a release 14:37:21 <planetmaker> or you just move it, when nothing was changed and nothing needs review. 14:37:28 <planetmaker> like would now be the case. Maybe 15:00:19 * andythenorth biab 15:00:22 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 15:36:31 *** michi_cc has quit IRC 15:37:32 *** michi_cc has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 15:46:30 *** michi_cc has left #openttdcoop.devzone 15:46:30 *** michi_cc has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 16:26:44 *** JVassie has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 17:12:34 <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Bug #3450 (New): nml output for replacenew (yexo) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3450 17:14:16 <Ammler> Yexo: did you find the different newgrf issue already? 17:14:45 <Yexo> no, I didn't find a way to download the wrong grfs compiled without the -c flag 17:15:09 <Ammler> ah, shall I prepare that for you? 17:15:16 <Yexo> please do 17:16:16 <Ammler> is it worth to make a little howto for bulding with osc, would you guys use it? 17:16:43 <Yexo> what is osc? 17:16:57 <Ammler> opensource buildservice console 17:17:10 <Yexo> I wouldn't have a use for it 17:17:36 <Ammler> it does setup build environement of all "good" distros 17:29:33 <Ammler> http://build.openttdcoop.org/~ammler/build/openSUSE_Factory-x86_64/home/abuild/rpmbuild/BUILD/opengfx-0.4.1-source/ 17:29:41 <Ammler> running for SLE_11 now 17:29:56 <Brot6> firs: update from r2695 to r2698 done (11 warnings) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/nightlies/r2698 17:31:56 <Brot6> bandit: update from r48 to r50 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/bandit/nightlies/r50 17:33:56 <Ammler> http://build.openttdcoop.org/~ammler/build/openSUSE_Factory-x86_64/.build.log 17:34:27 <Brot6> dutchroadfurniture: update from r92 to r94 done - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/dutchroadfurniture/nightlies/r94 17:35:27 <Ammler> http://build.openttdcoop.org/~ammler/build/SLE_11-x86_64/.build.log 17:35:50 <Ammler> http://build.openttdcoop.org/~ammler/build/SLE_11-x86_64/usr/src/packages/BUILD/opengfx-0.4.1-source/ 17:36:33 <Ammler> Factory: < 47056bc0e01d6a0a53fdcfd6cbd8e761 ogfxe_extra.grf 17:36:57 <Ammler> SLE_11 < a5cf9abced6a7dfff5a0ab6ef6319550 ogfxe_extra.grf 17:37:21 <Ammler> Yexo: ^ 17:37:43 <Brot6> nutracks: compile of r210 still failed (#3387) - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/nutracks/nightlies/ERROR/r210 17:53:58 <Yexo> Ammler: is it possible to download those directories as packed file? 17:54:12 <Ammler> wget -m? 17:54:19 <Yexo> ok 17:54:32 <Ammler> but I can make you tar, but that might be damn huge 17:54:59 <Ammler> also if you do not download it now, maybe better to use 12.1 17:55:06 <Ammler> instead factory 17:55:16 <Yexo> no, it's fine 17:55:20 <Yexo> the difference is in 4 sprites 17:55:46 <Ammler> oh, you already found the issue? 17:55:54 <Yexo> where was that php file with sprite overview again? 17:57:36 <Ammler> http://mz.openttdcoop.org/opengfx/newgrf.php?1=1000 17:57:49 <Ammler> or do you mean the authorsoverview? 17:57:57 <Yexo> 3133..3136, seemingly empty sprites 17:58:47 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 17:58:53 <Yexo> but not empty at all in the failed build 18:01:12 <Ammler> http://mz.openttdcoop.org/opengfx/newgrf.php?1=3133:3136 <-- those? 18:01:30 <Yexo> no, 3133 from the extra grf 18:01:47 <Ammler> ah 18:01:54 <Ammler> yes, extra has no viewer 18:02:07 *** Zuu has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:03:37 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 18:09:27 <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3434: NS100 (Voyager1) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/3434#change-9021 18:12:19 <Ammler> Yexo: do we need to fix that on opengfx? 18:13:51 *** OwenS has quit IRC 18:14:19 <Yexo> Ammler: we can't until we know what causes the difference 18:15:15 <Ammler> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/opengfx/releases/0.4.1/grf2html/ogfxe_extra/ <-- where are those sprites? 18:15:32 *** OwenS has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:15:37 <Yexo> 3133 sprites/png/terrain/waterfeatures/rivermouth_tropical_ne.gimp.png 241 97 01 23 64 -31 0 <- that's the first sprite 18:16:05 <Yexo> just search for 3133 there 18:16:16 <Ammler> ah yeah 18:16:41 <Ammler> well, since crop isn't the issue, a NOCROP wouldn't help 18:19:10 <Ammler> I guess, that is what you wanted to check :-) 18:53:51 *** seberoth has quit IRC 18:54:10 *** seberoth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 18:59:51 <Brot6> SuperLib - Revision 43:58ba718397bb: Fix: Aircrafts => Aircraft. Wrapper functions for the old na... (Zuu) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/superlib/repository/revisions/58ba718397bb 19:04:25 <Brot6> SuperLib - Revision 44:64d1ed30fa0d: As per request, make SetSign return the sign id (Zuu) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/superlib/repository/revisions/64d1ed30fa0d 19:12:25 <Ammler> year 2011: Hosting: 808.39 GoogleAds: -162.78 Donations: -43.44 Sponsoring planetmaker & ammler: 602.17 19:13:54 *** frosch123 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:17:25 <Ammler> well and 4 months in 2010 19:20:00 <Rubidium> so 2012 already surpassed the 2011 donations quite significantly 19:22:02 <planetmaker> yup 19:22:06 <planetmaker> :-) 19:23:01 <Ammler> @calc 12*41.18 19:23:01 <Webster> Ammler: 494.16 19:23:10 <Ammler> that will be hosting for 2012 19:24:19 *** andythenorth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:29:51 <frosch123> oh, right ... donations time ... which project needs some? 19:29:54 <frosch123> :) 19:30:39 <Rubidium> frosch123: see http://www.openttd.org/en/news/160 to get a clue 19:31:42 *** JVassie_ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:31:54 <frosch123> 30 months :p 19:32:05 <frosch123> silly amount 19:32:58 <Rubidium> of months or money? 19:34:58 <frosch123> months 19:35:20 <Ammler> Rubidium: well, your issue is that your current server is for free ;-) 19:35:26 <frosch123> it's about 30% of the livetime of ottd till today 19:37:26 *** JVassie has quit IRC 19:38:14 *** JVassie has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 19:41:23 *** JVassie_ has quit IRC 20:12:31 *** planetmaker has quit IRC 20:12:49 *** planetmaker has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 20:13:11 *** ^Spike^ has quit IRC 20:13:49 *** ^Spike^ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 20:13:51 *** XeryusTC has quit IRC 20:14:20 *** XeryusTC has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 20:24:39 <andythenorth> so I don't need to donate to Devzone? 20:24:43 <andythenorth> or I do? 20:24:55 <andythenorth> I offered ages ago, but nobody took me up on it :D 20:25:26 <planetmaker> well, there's the paypal button. For ages. But I can't create a subscription thingy there 20:28:38 <orudge> planetmaker: you can, but it'd have to be for a fixed amount. I tend to ask people to contact me directly if they want to set up a subscription :) 20:30:16 <planetmaker> orudge: as I see it, it'd require me to make it a commercial account. Which it isn't so far 20:30:25 <planetmaker> And I'm not sure what it implies exactly 20:35:29 <orudge> planetmaker: ah, right 20:35:29 <orudge> t 20:35:34 <orudge> well, more fees, probably 20:35:38 <orudge> do you get charged fees when you receive donations? 20:36:21 <planetmaker> I didn't see any charge from what you donated to coop 20:36:30 <orudge> that's because I paid the fees 20:36:32 <orudge> for that one 20:36:57 <planetmaker> hm... the last ones: yes, there were. Though not 100% sure whether that was declared 'donation' 20:37:15 <orudge> hmm 20:37:19 <orudge> I think "personal payments" should be fee-free 20:37:26 <orudge> although if you do a cross-border payment, they charge a small fee 20:37:32 <orudge> if they charge from a credit card, they charge a larger fee 20:37:45 <orudge> but "normal" payments (including donations) always charge something like 3% + 20p 20:37:46 <planetmaker> that might have been the case there 20:38:03 <orudge> in my experience at least 20:43:07 <Ammler> andythenorth: for you it might make most sense to simply donate to openttd/tt-forums (orudge) 20:43:14 <andythenorth> I do that :) 20:43:31 <Ammler> we got money from there so it is fine :-) 20:46:54 <planetmaker> I'll find out the fees hopefully soon enough :-) 20:47:08 <planetmaker> Ammler: why would that make more sense? 20:48:00 <andythenorth> I could always IBAN the money 20:48:04 <andythenorth> although I think IBAN has a fee too 20:48:18 <Ammler> because it might be better to donate on one place instead on 3 different 20:48:39 <planetmaker> andythenorth: it has. At least probably from GB to EUR-zone 20:48:40 <Rubidium> andythenorth: not if you've got an EUR account; then sending money to planetmaker is free 20:49:11 <andythenorth> I am -1 on EUR account 20:49:33 <andythenorth> if we wait a bit, I can donate a small amount of GBP and it will deliver you a lot of EUR :P 20:49:38 <andythenorth> maybe 20:49:42 <andythenorth> or vice versa :P 20:50:03 <andythenorth> maybe I will be sending francs, gilders and DM 20:50:42 <Ammler> andythenorth: I can give you CHF account :-P 20:51:37 <planetmaker> hehe 20:51:56 <Ammler> but CHF is very expensive right now 20:52:59 <andythenorth> also 20:53:08 <andythenorth> \o/ for truebrain and his love of optimisation :) 20:53:15 * andythenorth always thinks "buy a bigger computer" :P 20:53:20 <andythenorth> lazy 20:54:24 <Terkhen> you might want to say that in a channel where he is actually present :P 20:54:37 <andythenorth> nah 20:54:53 <andythenorth> flattery is embarassing :) 20:56:35 <^Spike^> you know this channel is logged right? :) 20:56:46 <^Spike^> all that needs to be done is pointed to the log ;) 20:57:37 <Terkhen> :D 21:16:13 *** JVassie has quit IRC 21:17:35 *** JVassie has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 22:52:30 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 23:14:31 *** [1]Mark has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 23:14:33 *** [1]Mark is now known as Mark 23:20:28 *** JVassie has quit IRC 23:24:17 *** ODM has quit IRC