Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 28th January 2012:
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00:06:38  <Brot6> cets: update from r570 to r571 done (386 warnings) -
00:13:35  *** andythenorth has quit IRC
00:42:26  <Brot6> TransRapid Track Set - Bug #3616 (New): attempt to use invalid ID (planetmaker) @
00:55:48  <Brot6> OpenGFX+ Trains - Revision 296:76348d9edd9d: Feature: Use a verbose railtype translation table, t... (planetmaker) @
01:31:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #3503: Terraform underneath quarry and claypit is possible (YukonRob) @
04:57:10  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 572:7c412e531142: Change: fix/raise many MU power and TE va... (oberhuemer) @
05:16:17  <Brot6> cets: update from r571 to r572 done (377 warnings) -
05:52:47  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 573:2b96dfb29e71: Change: Base running cost for electric en... (oberhuemer) @
06:03:24  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 574:d9e2bcae8b59: Fix: Wagons became too expensive (oberhuemer) @
06:04:36  <Brot6> cets: update from r572 to r573 done (377 warnings) -
06:08:58  <Brot6> cets: update from r573 to r574 done (377 warnings) -
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09:05:22  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Revision 575:8e8bc97f635e: must have been asleep when making that ch... (Eddi) @
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09:12:07  <Brot6> cets: update from r574 to r575 done (377 warnings) -
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10:56:01  <V453000> hello, I am trying to make an articulated wagon but somethign hates me ... I have this and the compiling says that the "CB_RESULT..." is unrecognized identifier ... I copied it exactly from
10:56:15  <V453000> can someone please tell me what am I doing wrong? :)
10:57:14  <V453000> there also is a second issue, the wagon also has a switch based on cargo_type_in_veh
10:57:38  <V453000> and I have no idea how to mix that :)
10:58:58  <V453000> perhaps making a switch block inside a switch block?
11:01:15  <Yexo> which version of nml are you using?
11:02:05  <V453000> sorry but ... where do I read that? :D
11:02:11  <Yexo> nmlc --version
11:02:55  <V453000> r1722
11:03:56  <Yexo> update nmlc :)
11:04:10  <V453000> ok :)
11:04:16  <Yexo> CB_RESULT_NO_MORE_ARTICULATED_PARTS was added in r1756
11:05:12  <Yexo> in a switch you have multiple ranges (like your '1..2') with a return and a default with also a return
11:05:24  <Yexo> instead of "return value;" you can also put "name_of_other_switch_block" there
11:05:40  <Yexo> it'll go to that switch-block, you can return a value from there (or refer to yet another switch-block
11:06:16  <V453000> ah right! :) thanks I will try
11:09:06  <V453000> hm I guess more things changed in nml :D
11:09:22  <V453000> none of the trains is in the newgrf it seems :D
11:09:29  <V453000> only the one wagon
11:09:37  <V453000> which is weird, all are defined the same way
11:10:20  <Yexo> oh, a flatbad that transports CC_REFRIGERATED?
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11:10:29  <V453000> hm ok all wagons work
11:10:45  <V453000> yes it does :)
11:10:53  <V453000> has fruit, food and stuff
11:10:59  <Yexo> ah, ok
11:11:51  <Yexo> perhaps disallow CC_LIQUID?
11:12:19  <V453000> this is how I define an engine ... all engines seem to be disabled now so I guess I have some issue there ... it worked with the previous versions
11:12:23  <Yexo> that way you don't have to explicitely exclude BEER and MILK, and it'll work properly if somebody decides to add another drink
11:12:24  <V453000> hm yeah perhaps :)
11:12:52  <Yexo> you don't have to set refittable_cargo_classes at all for engines
11:13:06  <Yexo> just set cargo_capacity to 0
11:13:39  <V453000> that one should actually be passenger train
11:14:02  <Yexo> but it has no capacity?
11:14:03  <V453000> the cargo capacity should be, say 20 then
11:14:07  <Yexo> ah, ok :)
11:14:24  <Yexo> no idea why that train doesn't show up, the code looks ok
11:14:27  <Yexo> are you past 2080?
11:14:39  <V453000> yeah
11:14:54  <V453000> no train shows up
11:15:58  <V453000> I have the original engines kept there (for now) so only those load, and wagons of my set. But not a single engine for some reason
11:16:15  <andythenorth> you don't want to exclude CC_LIQUID ;)
11:16:20  <andythenorth> violates the spec
11:16:21  <andythenorth>
11:16:28  <andythenorth> never exclude 'base' classes
11:16:44  <V453000> if I have them allowed in a tanker?
11:16:55  <Yexo> andythenorth: sorry to say, but that's stupid
11:17:09  <andythenorth> Yexo: not my spec
11:17:10  <Yexo> you shouldn't exlude it in all your vehicles, but exluding in some should be fine
11:17:30  <andythenorth> it was like...10 days of discussion and multiple drafts
11:17:33  <V453000> yeah, I have it disallowed in flatbed now, but allowed in tanker
11:18:00  <andythenorth> you just disallowed milk in crates or churns ;)
11:18:09  <Yexo> I can see the reasoning if you want to have multiple representations
11:18:24  <Yexo> but why not disallow milk in crates/churns on a flatbad wagon?
11:18:30  <V453000> I do not have milk drawn in crates or churns anyway
11:18:42  <andythenorth> you're doing it wrong ;)
11:18:51  <V453000> mhm :)
11:18:57  <andythenorth> cargo classes are to ensure vehicles are provided for unknown cargos
11:19:04  <Yexo> so he's doing it right
11:19:19  <andythenorth> no
11:19:27  <Yexo> the only thing you have to ensure is that for every combination of cargo classes there is at least one vehicle able to transport it
11:19:32  <andythenorth> trying to exclude unknown cargos with classes is doing it wrong ;)
11:19:43  <Yexo> I disagree
11:20:05  <V453000> I see what andythenorth means, but as I do not want to allow any kind of other milk than tanker, I do it that way
11:20:10  <andythenorth> yexo change the spec
11:20:17  <andythenorth> provide a better one ;)
11:20:26  <Yexo> I'm not going there again
11:20:35  <Yexo> this part of the spec is 'only' a recommendation anyway
11:20:37  <andythenorth> so the spec is invalid?
11:20:46  <V453000> it works doesnt it?
11:20:48  <Yexo> not invalid, just my interpretation is different from yours
11:21:01  <andythenorth> kind of useless though
11:21:06  <andythenorth> we might as well just rm it
11:21:21  <andythenorth> if classes are just interpretation, the idea of compatibility is binned
11:21:38  <Yexo> andythenorth: it has always been that way
11:21:56  <andythenorth> so why bother at all?
11:21:57  <Yexo> there is nobody to ensure 'correct' (whatever that is) usage of cargo classes
11:22:25  <Yexo> all known interpretations are more or less compatible
11:23:35  <andythenorth> meh :)
11:23:42  <andythenorth> I'd seriously rm the spec in that case
11:23:50  <V453000> oh 2cc set is not in nml :o
11:24:12  <andythenorth> it's bizarrely pointless to have a spec that is shot down as 'wrong' as soon it's referred to
11:24:19  <V453000> wanted to look for a difference in my engine definition :z
11:24:40  <Yexo> andythenorth: not the whole spec, I just personally disagree with the "never exlucde the base cargo classes"
11:24:59  <Yexo> You provided a good argument for it, but I'm still not convinced
11:25:14  <andythenorth> it's empirically proven to be a problem
11:25:21  <Yexo> but in the end that's of minor importance
11:26:19  <andythenorth> the aim of trying to tightly control future refitting is imho invalid
11:26:32  <Yexo> of course
11:26:49  <V453000> does NML have a changelog somewhere? so I could try to find the difference
11:27:33  <Yexo>
11:27:44  <Yexo> and a changelog.txt in docs/, but that's only used for stable versions
11:28:11  <Yexo> you could also use nfo output (from both nml versions) and run a diff over that
11:29:51  <V453000> hm guess I am not going to find it too easily
11:31:29  <V453000> how do I use the nfo output?
11:31:44  <Yexo> -o output.nfo instead of -o output.grf
11:31:49  <Yexo> or --nfo output.nfo
11:32:24  <V453000> right
11:34:05  <V453000> oh :D nfo isnt some readable text?
11:34:35  <Yexo> you never tried creating a grf in nfo?
11:34:40  <V453000> no
11:34:48  <Yexo> that's the whole reason I started nml
11:39:53  <V453000> hm :\ I compiled an output.nfo using both versions, how do I compare it?
11:40:06  <Yexo> diff -u output1.nfo output2.nfo > changes.diff
11:41:45  <V453000> guess that doesnt work in windows cmd eh :D
11:41:56  <Yexo> no :p
11:42:02  <V453000> well, shit :D
11:42:03  <Yexo> just pastebin both nfo files somewhere
11:43:28  <V453000> newer version, older version
11:44:37  <Yexo> that's not nfo output
11:44:56  <Yexo> did you use "--grf nuts_older.nfo"?
11:45:45  <V453000> in compile.bat?
11:45:49  <Yexo> <V453000> oh :D nfo isnt some readable text? <- nfo is readable text, just it's encoded using hex bytes, so not really "readable"
11:45:55  <Yexo> yes, or however you compile
11:45:55  <andythenorth> Yexo: not sure why I'm so grouchy - sorry.  Maybe lack of sleep.  Maybe bad character :P
11:46:03  <V453000> nmlc -c --default-lang=english.lng --grf=nuts.nfo nuts.nml
11:46:12  <V453000> guess I did
11:46:18  <Yexo> V453000: replace the --grf with --nfo (or -o)
11:46:27  <V453000> xD
11:46:31  <V453000> ök
11:46:41  <Yexo> with -o nml autodetecs the output type from the extension
11:46:55  <Yexo> with --grf you override that check and force it to write a grf (even though you provide a filename with an nfo extension)
11:47:05  <planetmaker> Yexo: V453000, disallowing the 'base' cargo classes like piece, liquid or bulk is probably not a good idea
11:47:06  <Yexo> andythenorth: no need to apologize
11:47:14  <planetmaker> as a liquid can be transported in barrels or bottles
11:47:55  <V453000> and I was wondering why the grf looks the same as the nfo output!
11:47:57  <V453000> :D
11:49:09  <Yexo> planetmaker: but using that argument every wagon will be able to transport over half the cargo types in a game
11:49:16  <Yexo> imo it's good to have some variety
11:49:41  <planetmaker> yes. But you can (and should) disallow the cargos via the explicit cargo disallow property
11:49:51  <planetmaker> the reason behind to not exclude is along this:
11:50:12  <planetmaker> consider "building material" as cargo. It could be, say, cement or bricks.
11:50:25  <planetmaker> Thus it gets bulk + powerderized. And piece
11:50:49  <planetmaker> thus you can make a vehicle transport bulk and it will fit. And you can make it transport piece and it will fit
11:51:13  <planetmaker> imho allowing this double categorization was the whole point...
11:52:19  <andythenorth> Yexo: "every wagon will be able to transport over half the cargo types in a game" <- rely solely on classes for refits to known cargos is the problem there?
11:52:22  <V453000> Yexo: 2nd try :)
11:52:35  * andythenorth ponders 
11:52:41  <andythenorth> if there is no single spec...
11:52:45  <andythenorth> and no enforcer of spec
11:52:47  <andythenorth> options
11:52:56  <andythenorth> (1) openttd takes on enforcing the spec
11:53:14  <andythenorth> - e.g. physically restrict what can and can't be combined
11:53:36  <andythenorth> (2) FIRS declares that it implement YACS version of spec (Yet Another Cargo Schema)
11:53:45  <andythenorth> other people choose to be YACS compliant or not
11:53:49  <Yexo> planetmaker: ok, it makes sense
11:54:06  <andythenorth> - I then refuse to deal with bug reports or feature requests for non-YACS compliant sets
11:54:38  <andythenorth> (3) we have groundhog hour / day / week every few months wrt classes - what larfs :)
11:54:48  <andythenorth> which option do *you* prefer?
11:55:15  <Yexo> andythenorth: (4) FIRS declares to implement FIRS-version of the spec (you chose cargo labels and classes). Vehicle set authors will just have to follow your lead (and George's if they want to support ECS)
11:56:03  <Yexo> as long as your definition of cargoes is more or less stable vehicle set authors will use that anyway
11:56:09  <andythenorth> 4 ~= 2
11:56:24  <Yexo> yes, basically what we have now
11:56:25  <andythenorth> I don't agree 100% with YACS, it's Eddi's proposal, but I'm prepared to support it
11:56:36  <Yexo> ehm, no
11:56:36  <andythenorth> my spec would be...leaner with fewer classes
11:56:40  <Yexo> I meant just go on like now
11:56:54  <Yexo> chose cargo classes according to how you think they should work
11:57:12  <Yexo> vehicle set authors will be forced to follow your lead or their vehicle set won't work
11:57:36  <V453000> there are some differences between the nfo things but they seem to be pretty much everywhere :o
11:58:22  <V453000> all the keywords in the beginning are +3
11:58:49  <V453000> like 3490 in newer, 3487 in older ... which I believe is the graphics {} block
11:58:52  <andythenorth> is that fair to vehicle set authors (specifically - how do they know what FIRS spec is?)
11:59:15  <Yexo> V453000: the number directly before the * is unimportant
11:59:23  <V453000> oh :o
11:59:44  <Yexo> andythenorth: how is that different from the current situation?
11:59:54  <Yexo> and how do they know; you document that on the wiki page
12:00:05  <V453000> therse are the only differences I see though :z
12:00:05  <Yexo> <- it's even already there
12:00:28  <Yexo> V453000: there is one difference, but it has something to do with the flatbed wagon, nothing with any engine
12:00:47  <V453000> hm
12:00:57  <andythenorth> hmm
12:00:58  <V453000> could you run the diff please? :)
12:01:01  <andythenorth> actually it's simple
12:01:02  <andythenorth> yes
12:01:23  <andythenorth> if you want to support FIRS, use explicit labels and the new include / exclude properties
12:01:31  <Yexo> <- V453000
12:01:35  <andythenorth> I'm not prepared to guarantee any support for classes
12:01:50  <planetmaker> andythenorth: yes. You might want to add a footnote to the FIRS labels that authors should NOT rely on the class remaining constant
12:01:55  <andythenorth> in fact, I think we said that last time we discussed this: classes are supposed to be decoupled from cargos, and may vary
12:02:10  <andythenorth> you can't lock the abstraction mechanism in stone, or it fails to abstract :P
12:02:34  <V453000> :< how do I read that?
12:02:55  <V453000> + means the line is equal, - not?
12:03:09  <planetmaker> add that line, remove the other
12:03:12  <andythenorth> by allowing classes may vary, we avoid the fricking insanity of declaring new labels when a class changed :P
12:03:15  <planetmaker> use the patch command to apply
12:03:38  <planetmaker> that was IMHO the point as well, not, andythenorth?
12:03:53  <planetmaker> s/not/right/
12:04:15  * andythenorth is not entirely good at remembering things
12:04:38  * andythenorth should do a wiki edit
12:05:05  <planetmaker> but granted. If one wants to explicitly support or not support all known cargo labels... it's a very tedious endeavour
12:05:05  <Yexo> V453000: lines between the lines with @@ are one block of code. first character is important: space=line is equal in both files, -=line is in old file, +=line is in new file
12:05:34  <andythenorth> planetmaker: not so much :)
12:05:54  <V453000> Yexo: right, but how do I use this to find my problem?
12:06:13  <Yexo> you: probably not :p
12:06:15  <andythenorth> I'm not saying don't use classes, just don't rely on them
12:06:15  <planetmaker> andythenorth: it is... you have to explicitly think about each cargo and mention it in one of the two properties
12:06:21  <andythenorth> true
12:06:24  <V453000> hm :Z
12:06:27  <Yexo> for me it was useful to see that there are no important differences in the output that both nml versions generate
12:06:50  <Yexo> can you test again whether your file compiled with the old nml version really worked in openttd?
12:07:02  <Yexo> did you test in one openttd version or in multiple versions?
12:07:16  <andythenorth> if I was doing a train set right now, I'd define cpp constants that were lists of appropriate labels for different wagon types
12:07:26  <V453000> Yexo: in one
12:07:31  <andythenorth> as types are fairly low in number
12:07:33  <V453000> r23820
12:07:38  <andythenorth> e.g. REFITS_HOPPER
12:07:42  <andythenorth> REFITS_OPEN_WAGON etc
12:07:50  <V453000> and the old worked for sure
12:08:31  <Yexo> V453000: please try again with r23836 or later
12:08:35  <andythenorth> then the classes are fallback - as intended
12:08:43  <V453000> righto
12:10:14  <andythenorth> hmm
12:10:31  <andythenorth> where should notes about FIRS be added?  classes section, labels section or both?
12:10:38  <planetmaker> andythenorth: that's what I have. It's still not handy to create
12:11:07  <planetmaker> but then the old refit properties were also lengthy to create and check. This is easier
12:11:35  <andythenorth> it's a good enough solution
12:11:45  <andythenorth> unless we can devise better, we shouldn't unpick it too soon ;)
12:11:59  <andythenorth> it's consumed enough time
12:12:09  <andythenorth> and the fun : time ratio is not optimal
12:12:27  <V453000> Yexo: both work in new trunk of openttd :D
12:12:35  <Yexo> great :)
12:12:48  * andythenorth wants instead to get on with re-coding BANDIT (again) - but has obligations :P
12:13:13  <V453000> next time I automatically update both nml and openttd :D
12:13:35  <V453000> thank you very much Yexo :)
12:13:46  <Yexo> you're welcome :)
12:15:42  <V453000> now back to the articulation! :D
12:16:16  <planetmaker> 13:13 V453000: next time I automatically update both nml and openttd :D  <-- always a good idea when testing newgrfs. And tbh especially with nml
12:16:32  <V453000> :) I am sure I will remember that now pm :p
12:16:44  <planetmaker> but also the grf v8 transition might need or another bug fix... it's not like it got extensive tests ;-)
12:16:51  <andythenorth> it's something like: "FIRS does not guarantee that classes won't vary.  Feel free to use classes in your set for conveniently refitting to FIRS cargos, but if you - the vehicle author - care about specific cargos being transported in specific vehicles, use label based refits"
12:17:11  <planetmaker> yes
12:17:35  <andythenorth> I think that's fair, and reflects the cascading order of the newgrf spec correctly too
12:18:37  <Yexo> andythenorth: but that's almost a given
12:18:47  <Yexo> george has done that twice already for ECS cargoes
12:19:02  <andythenorth> I think it needs the disclaimer :P
12:19:07  <andythenorth> otherwise there are tiresome dramas
12:19:17  <andythenorth> and I get accused of causing people to leave the community etc
12:19:26  <andythenorth> and I get irritated pms
12:19:37  <andythenorth> (and irritated planetmakers too)
12:19:38  <andythenorth> :P
12:21:02  <andythenorth> on the other hand....forgiveness > permission :)
12:22:11  <Yexo> yes, such a disclaimer is a probably a good diea
12:22:17  <Yexo> however make it more general than just for FIRS
12:22:22  <andythenorth> yes
12:22:35  <andythenorth> it's bad style to add notes about specific newgrfs to the wiki
12:22:46  <andythenorth> is a general note on classes worth knowing
12:23:04  <V453000> so now I have this :) what I am trying to do is to make a switch block with articulation, which outputs the other cargo_type_in_veh switch ... but in the game it doesnt load the sprite ... what could be wrong?
12:23:56  <Yexo> you're adding it at the wrong place
12:24:02  <V453000> I guess :)
12:24:12  <Yexo> the articulated callback is only for determining how many parts to add
12:24:24  <Yexo> it should never return a spritegroup like you do now
12:24:29  <V453000> oh
12:24:48  <Yexo> in your graphics block, add "default: maglevflatbed_wagon_switch;"
12:24:49  <V453000> so it has to return the item_maglevflatbed
12:24:57  <V453000> ok
12:24:59  <Yexo> yes, exactly
12:25:55  <andythenorth> any good?
12:26:33  <Yexo> yes :)
12:27:20  <V453000> great! :) Now the ohly problem was that I wanted 2 additional parts instead of one ... but works like charm now :))) thanks
12:27:37  <andythenorth> hmm
12:27:43  <andythenorth> there is also this page to edit
12:28:02  <andythenorth> that also references prop 1D still
12:28:13  <andythenorth> which we really ought to deprecate
12:28:18  <andythenorth> it's neither intuitive nor safe
12:28:54  * andythenorth needs to do baby things though
12:30:13  <V453000> you can consider me a baby for now
12:30:21  <V453000> I am as happy as a baby at the moment
12:35:56  <andythenorth> I've copied the disclaimer into the train page stuff
12:43:32  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 100:21bfdcec4bf3: Feature: NS1100 graphics for HSM126/NS1100 (graphic... (foobar) @
12:46:20  <V453000> I will try to be annoying a bit more: I want to make my passenger trains be compatible only with passenger wagons - not other wagons. How do I do that? I cant seem to find it on the wiki
12:48:00  <Hirundo> There's a callback for that
12:48:05  <Hirundo> IIRC can_attach_wagon
12:49:16  <V453000> ah right
12:49:18  <V453000> thanks
12:49:54  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 857:c4d92223f9b1: -Add: Action 0 cargo property 1D. (frosch) @
12:50:08  <andythenorth> hmm
12:50:14  <andythenorth> calling eval() is really not the done thing
12:55:00  <andythenorth> yay
12:56:14  <V453000> hm, where do I actually use the callback though? guess not in the graphics{}
12:57:37  <Hirundo> you add it to the graphics block
12:59:46  <V453000> works! great thanks Hirundo :)
13:03:09  <andythenorth> nml ftw
13:04:25  <V453000> hm, how do I allow multiple wagons to be attachable though? if I copy the callback multiple times, it doesnt work, and if I write it into one callback separating the item names by commas, it doesnt work either :|
13:11:54  <Hirundo> Could you copy paste your current code?
13:12:03  <V453000> sec.
13:12:35  <V453000> I tried this
13:12:47  <V453000> I want that train to attach those 3 wagons exclusively
13:14:00  <Hirundo> I doubt that that worked even for one vehicle
13:14:25  <V453000> for one wagon it does
13:14:40  <V453000> it just returns undefined string errors when trying to add a different wagon
13:16:00  <V453000> question is how to make it for 3 :o
13:16:09  <Hirundo> "undefined string errors" isn't what I call working
13:16:18  <V453000> for now it is
13:16:23  <Hirundo> also, those errors probably appear for the 'right' wagon also
13:16:29  <V453000> I guess adding the error strings can be done later
13:16:48  <V453000> oh they do indeed :D
13:16:52  <V453000> didnt test that
13:17:38  <Hirundo> So, by reasonable definition, we can agree that it doesn't work right now
13:17:57  <Hirundo> You should start by reading the description of the can_attach_wagon callback more closely
13:18:22  <V453000> cant say I understand that much
13:20:06  <Hirundo> Basically, you have to check the ID of the wagon being attached via a switch block
13:21:12  <Hirundo> then return CB_RESULT_ATTACH_ALLOW to allow attaching
13:21:27  <V453000> aha
13:21:30  <Hirundo> or return CB_RESULT_ATTACH_DISALLOW to disallow attaching
13:21:36  <V453000> right :)
13:21:41  <Hirundo> or return a custom string to disallow with a nice error message
13:22:02  <Hirundo> you will probably want to use two switch blocks for those checks
13:22:06  <Hirundo> first one to check grfid
13:22:21  <Hirundo> second to check the vehicle ID
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13:36:27  <V453000> I guess this makes more sense, but how do I call the vehicle ID please? :)
13:37:21  <Hirundo> switch should be placed before the item bloc
13:37:44  <V453000> I have that, I just pasted it here vice versa
13:38:02  <V453000> but the identifier/train_id/wagon_id/vehicle_id I tried but neither is accepted :)
13:38:07  <Hirundo> 'identifier' should be vehicle_type_id
13:38:33  <Hirundo> and strings are done via string(STR_XXX) with STR_XXX defined in your lang file
13:38:45  <Hirundo> So it can be translated into a gazillion different languages
13:39:24  <V453000> oh right :)
13:41:24  <Yexo> V453000: wher eyou have identifier you can use variables. For vehicles a list can be found here:
13:44:58  <V453000> nmlc: internal error has occured :o
13:45:36  <Hirundo> o_0
13:45:40  <V453000> error :(value error)<substring not found>
13:45:54  * Hirundo is confuzzled
13:45:59  <Hirundo> what code triggers that?
13:46:53  <V453000> I dont know :O I put all things I added into comments and it doesnt fix
13:47:41  <V453000> I see
13:48:04  <V453000> I added the string in english.lng and custom_tags.txt
13:48:06  <V453000> and then it broke
13:48:27  <V453000> but I did it exactly the same way as the other strings ... which work
13:48:49  <Hirundo> Could you paste english.lng and custom_tags.txt somewhere?
13:49:30  <V453000> I think I already found it
13:49:36  <V453000> I used // in these files
13:49:40  <V453000> that cant be done?
13:50:04  <V453000> ... I removed that and now it compiles
13:51:38  <Hirundo> Nothing should ever trigger an internal error
13:52:19  <V453000> if I place a line "//test" in either english.lng or custom_tags.txt, it breaks
13:53:02  <V453000> an ohly the custom_tags cause teh internal error though
13:54:30  <Yexo> read_extra_commands has no check for missing : in the string indeed
13:55:21  <Hirundo> indeed
13:55:50  <V453000> but my allow wagon works now :P thank you
13:58:57  <Yexo> V453000: in english.txt you can start comments with #
13:59:02  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Revision 1800:71afdc6c3d28: Fix: don't crash when a line in custom_tags.tx... (yexo) @
13:59:04  <Yexo> in custom_tags.txt no comments are allowed
13:59:20  <Yexo> currently, that is. If someone wants to add support for # there too that'd be fine with me
13:59:58  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 101:824891efcbf9: Fix (r100): use CB_RESULT_NO_MORE_ARTICULATED_PARTS... (foobar) @
13:59:58  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 102:13d6b33cf081: Feature: HSM500/NS2100 (graphics by Snail) (issue #... (foobar) @
13:59:58  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 103:401c62fb5e18: Feature: align trains in depot view (foobar) @
14:00:00  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 104:7930b8dc2b11: Feature: SS700/NS3700 (graphics by Snail) (issue #3... (foobar) @
14:00:29  <Hirundo> Yexo: #-comments work in custom_tags.txt right ? "if len(line) == 0 or line[0] == "#": pass"
14:00:45  <Yexo> oh, right :)
14:01:23  <V453000> oh :) ok
14:02:06  <Hirundo> Yexo: Could you comment on #3583 ?
14:02:07  <Brot6> Hirundo: Yexo: #3583 is "NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3583: deprecate / remove refittable_cargo_types - #openttdcoop Development Zone"
14:02:23  <Yexo> sure
14:08:23  <Brot6> NewGRF Meta Language - Feature #3583: deprecate / remove refittable_cargo_types (yexo) @
14:43:44  <V453000> hm, when I have strings, how do I make them ... red for example? or rather ... where can I find a list of those properties?
14:51:23  <Yexo>
14:51:43  <Yexo> STR_MY_STRING   :Some text{RED}Red text{BLACK}Black text
14:51:53  <V453000> my abilities to search are 0 :D thank you so much
14:52:11  <frosch123> V453000: you have to set the search namespace to "NML"
14:52:16  <frosch123> else you will find nothing :p
14:52:54  <V453000> I was just browsing the wiki
14:58:43  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 105:a4f81bf8e334: Feature: NS3800 (graphics by Snail) (issue #3359) (foobar) @
14:58:43  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 106:ba206667e24b: Feature: NS3900 (graphics by Snail) (issue #3359) (foobar) @
14:58:43  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 107:291f675012da: Feature: NBDS30/NS3500 (graphics by Snail) (issue #... (foobar) @
14:58:45  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 108:5bab63285929: Fix (r100, r102, r104): use PARENT scope for date_o... (foobar) @
14:58:49  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 109:189132fe1858: Feature: NCS70/NS3600 (graphics by Snail) (closes #... (foobar) @
14:58:53  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3359 (Closed): Templated steamers, per request (foobar) @
15:15:03  <V453000> how do I use multiple additional_text for the purchase menu?
15:22:47  <frosch123> try {STRING}
15:22:55  <frosch123> but you can only return one top-level text
15:23:47  <V453000> I have that but I need to make it on another line
15:23:58  <frosch123> "{}" is linebreak
15:24:09  <V453000> :o
15:24:38  <frosch123> is that written nowhere?
15:25:10  <V453000> it is there
15:25:58  <V453000> OH I just misunderstood it
15:26:00  <V453000> .. :)
15:27:02  <frosch123> why does nml have a special code for {COPYRIGHT] ?
15:27:24  <frosch123> want to keep english in ascii?
15:28:46  <frosch123> or was someone annoyed about people not knowing about unicode and typinc "(C)" ? :p
15:29:05  <Rubidium> frosch123: because strgen has one?
15:29:34  <frosch123> hmm, ok, that is half an answer :p
15:31:56  <Hirundo> There's indeed a lot of copy-pasta from strgen
15:34:56  <planetmaker> One of the ideas was "what works in OpenTTD language files should also work in NML"
15:35:03  <planetmaker> or as much of that as possible
15:35:06  <planetmaker> and applicable
16:12:55  <Brot6> feed NewGRFs had 15 updates, showing the latest 10
16:12:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3383 (Closed): NS 2200 (foobar) @
16:12:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3412 (Closed): ACTS 6700 (foobar) @
16:12:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3402 (Closed): Class 66 (foobar) @
16:12:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3393 (Closed): NS 2600 Beel (foobar) @
16:12:59  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3427 (Closed): RN232 (foobar) @
16:13:02  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3451 (Closed): Vossloh G2000BB (foobar) @
16:13:05  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3555 (Closed): NS 2400 (foobar) @
16:13:08  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3417 (Closed): MaK G 1206 (foobar) @
16:13:11  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3585 (Closed): NS 6400 (foobar) @
16:13:16  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3561 (Closed): ACTS 5800 (Class 58) (foobar) @
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16:32:50  <andythenorth> can nml accept arbitrary properties in an item block?
16:32:54  <andythenorth> or only known props?
16:34:01  <andythenorth> I don't want it to do anything with them right now
16:34:10  <andythenorth> it's just a matter of interest
16:39:06  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3617 (New): NS 1100 (Voyager1) @
16:42:41  <frosch123> andythenorth: of course only known ones
16:42:49  <frosch123> what would you expect it to do with unknown ones?
16:43:28  <frosch123> you know that ignoring unknown stuff can crash spaceships?
16:44:23  <andythenorth> it's not html then :P
16:44:33  <andythenorth> you can handily invent arbitrary attributes for html tags
16:44:40  <andythenorth> or tags themselves (in some cases)
16:44:51  <andythenorth> nvm
16:44:59  <andythenorth> makes no difference to what I'm doing
16:45:09  <andythenorth> but limits possibilities others might want to pursue
17:10:23  <Brot6> grfcodec: update from r856 to r857 done -
17:10:51  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3602: NS 1200 (Voyager1) @
17:14:29  <Brot6> nml: update from r1792 to r1800 done -
17:19:43  <Brot6> ogfx-trains: update from r295 to r296 done -
17:25:27  <Brot6> cets: update from r566 to r575 done (377 warnings) -
17:27:20  <Brot6> dutchtrains: update from r99 to r119 done -
17:37:04  <Brot6> feed NewGRFs had 14 updates, showing the latest 10
17:37:04  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 125:7e641937fcbc: Feature: NS450 (graphics by Voyager One) (closes #3... (foobar) @
17:37:04  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 126:c2aa22103b34: Fix (r121, r122, r123, r124): use correct identifie... (foobar) @
17:37:04  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 127:ae2e68704967: Feature: NS400 (graphics by Voyager One) (closes #3... (foobar) @
17:37:08  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3434 (Closed): NS100 (foobar) @
17:37:11  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3466 (Closed): NS 2801 (foobar) @
17:37:14  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3457 (Closed): NS 2000 (foobar) @
17:37:17  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3463 (Closed): NS 2900 (foobar) @
17:37:20  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3468 (Closed): NS 450 (foobar) @
17:37:25  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3493 (Closed): NedTrain Vossloh G400B (foobar) @
17:37:28  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3483 (Closed): NS 400 (foobar) @
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18:12:01  <Brot6> ogfx-biggui: compile of r15 still failed (#3606) -
18:31:06  <Brot6> smts: rebuild of r19 done (Diffsize: 8) (DiffDiffsize: 19) -
18:36:30  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: bros (1 warnings), ogfx-industries (Diffsize: 114167), firs (6 warnings), opengfx (Diffsize: 7), foobarstramtracks (Diffsize: 37132), transrapidtrackset, 2cctrainset (78 warnings), bandit (1 warnings), worldairlinersset, heqs, basecosts, water-features, isr (2 warnings), 32bpp-extra (2 warnings), manindu (Diffsize: 2), newgrf_makefile (Diffsize: 12),
18:36:30  <Brot6> rust (Diffsize: 188), snowlinemod, dutchtramset, swisstowns (Diffsize: 43), metrotrackset (Diffsize: 1), dutchroadfurniture, spanishtowns (Diffsize: 8), frenchtowns (Diffsize: 21), ogfx-rv, fish, ogfx-landscape (2 warnings) (Diffsize: 828), ttrs (7 warnings), ogfx-trees, swedishrails, german-townnames (Diffsize: 51), chips (1 warnings), dach, belarusiantowns (Diffsize: 64), indonesiantowns (1 warnings) (Diffsize: 29), airportsplus
18:36:32  <Brot6> (Diffsize: 441059), comic-houses (3 warnings) (Diffsize: 22)
18:42:24  <V453000> is there some secret to note about the purchase menu sprites? With normal vehicles they work perfectly, but double headed vehicles seem to break very quickly - it looks like each "head" is there twice, in both directions, but they are each in a bit different position so the "middle" piece overlaps. What should I do when I want to overwrite the purchase menu sprite of a 2headed engine and prevent such issue?
18:42:28  <V453000> seen
18:46:52  <andythenorth> V453000: you have a separate sprite for the purchase menu?
18:47:00  <andythenorth> the nml templates from foobar have a space for it
18:47:05  <andythenorth> in the trams example
18:47:27  <andythenorth> generally it's better to draw and code a specific sprite for purchase menu, to control position etc
18:47:39  <V453000> yes I have a separate image for the purchase menu sprites
18:48:07  <V453000> I have my own template that isnt a problem
18:48:31  <V453000> this is it
18:52:24  <Hirundo> multihead vehicles draw 2 sprites, using both _ views
18:52:54  <V453000> yeah exactly but is there any way how to go around that?
18:53:07  <V453000> or... how to make a "normally looking" purchase menu sprite
18:53:57  <Hirundo> easiest might be, to use an empty sprite for the second _ sprite
18:55:01  <V453000> I thought that too, but I define only one sprite at the moment for the purchase menu ... so should I define two while the 2nd is empty?
18:55:56  <Hirundo> your purchase spriteset currently only has one sprite?
18:56:41  <V453000> yes
18:57:30  <Hirundo> I'm not sure if two sprites 1 full 1 empty will work, though you can try
18:57:45  <V453000> trying now
18:58:45  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 128:d7aee385feb1: Feature: new graphics for NS 1000 (by Voyager One) ... (foobar) @
18:58:45  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3584 (Closed): NS 1000 (foobar) @
18:59:41  <Hirundo> else, put the full sprite in the normal <--- sprite slot, and empty ones in all others
19:00:30  <V453000> yeah, like normal 8 view template
19:00:44  <Hirundo> exactly
19:01:00  <V453000> the "cheat" with two didnt work :)
19:02:01  <Hirundo> I had expected that
19:04:11  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 129:81b5bfcd4e92: Feature: new graphics for NS 1100 (by Voyager One) ... (foobar) @
19:04:11  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3617 (Closed): NS 1100 (foobar) @
19:08:08  <andythenorth> dual headed trains are an articulated vehicle?  or some other magic?
19:08:32  <V453000> no just dual_headed
19:08:37  <V453000> articulated is something else
19:08:46  <andythenorth> consist position isn't available in buy menu?
19:08:52  * andythenorth -> specs
19:09:21  <andythenorth> no
19:09:42  <V453000> Hirundo: it looks like a bloody hack, but it works like charm :D
19:11:07  <Hirundo> it's not a real hack
19:11:35  <Hirundo> do mind that the ---> sprite must be non-empty, so at least 1 blue pixel
19:12:50  <V453000> I have it full of blue pixels :)
19:12:54  <Hirundo> all others (except <--- of course) may be completely empty, i.e. [] in NML
19:13:07  <V453000> oh :)
19:13:26  <V453000> doesnt matter, I just defined 7 all-blue sprites in one corner of the image
19:13:30  <V453000> in the same posisiton
19:13:46  <Hirundo> that pixel will end up 7 times in the final grf
19:14:02  <Hirundo> what a waste of bytes ;-)
19:15:04  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 130:0a5a99228dff: Feature: new graphics for NS 1200 (sprites by DanMa... (foobar) @
19:15:04  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 131:194e36006c57: Feature: new graphics for NS 1300 (sprites by Basti... (foobar) @
19:15:04  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3602 (Closed): NS 1200 (foobar) @
19:15:05  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3603 (Closed): NS 1300 (foobar) @
19:15:59  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3566 (Feedback): NS 1500 (foobar) @
19:16:32  <V453000> I already have a flood of unreferenced sprites :P
19:16:45  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 132:b43ee13b67f5: Feature: new graphics for NS 1500 (by Voyager One) ... (foobar) @
19:35:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 133:a90f8cd6848d: Feature: new graphics for NS 1600P (sprites by Purn... (foobar) @
19:35:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 134:a2dd1e8ab25e: Feature: new graphics for HLE 25.5 (by Voyager One)... (foobar) @
19:35:56  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3404 (Closed): NMBS Class 25.5 (foobar) @
19:35:57  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3591 (Closed): 1600P (foobar) @
19:44:53  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 858:edf1461c4464: -Add: Action 2 railtype variable 44. (frosch) @
19:47:52  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 135:0bdfa445de27: Feature: Plan mP (graphics by Voyager One) (closes ... (foobar) @
19:47:52  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3391 (Closed): Motorpostrijtuig mP (foobar) @
20:11:18  <andythenorth> hm
20:11:33  <andythenorth> no compiled python bytes allowed on the devzone then :P
20:13:30  <andythenorth> fuck a doodle doo
20:13:48  <andythenorth> I've accidentally added a .pyc, then committed, then removed it, then committed
20:13:58  <andythenorth> which solves nothing wrt push being disallowed
20:14:04  <andythenorth> now I'm screwed :P
20:14:58  <andythenorth> help? :|
20:15:28  <Ammler> strip
20:16:26  <andythenorth> last time I stripped, I broke the remote repo
20:16:28  <Ammler> but you can always add your own hook ini, if you don't like the default
20:16:35  <Ammler> andythenorth: no
20:16:39  <Ammler> you didn't for sure
20:17:05  <Ammler> you are not able to strip on our server or do you have ssh access?
20:17:21  <andythenorth> I need to strip locally first no?
20:17:22  <Ammler> you should strip your broken local repo
20:17:26  <Ammler> yes
20:17:38  <andythenorth> it's not broken, it just disagrees with devzone
20:17:49  <Ammler> as your push failed, you don't need to strip on the server
20:17:52  <andythenorth> no
20:18:04  <andythenorth> but last time I stripped locally I created some horrible mess of heads
20:18:08  <andythenorth> you had to fix it for me
20:18:10  <Ammler> so just strip the changeset with the bad file
20:18:17  <andythenorth> ok
20:18:17  <Ammler> commit again and push
20:18:19  <andythenorth> let's see
20:19:22  *** ODM has quit IRC
20:19:59  <Ammler> andythenorth: for safety, pull & update before you commit and push
20:20:12  <andythenorth> ok
20:21:21  <andythenorth> stripped the offending rev
20:21:28  <andythenorth> this won't create multiple heads?
20:21:36  <Ammler> I wonder, if those python scripts from you and eddi aren't useable for makefile framwork
20:21:46  <andythenorth> Ammler: we'll see :)
20:21:48  <Ammler> andythenorth: pull and update before you commit again
20:21:57  <andythenorth> no changes found
20:22:08  <Ammler> then you didn't strip too much :-)
20:22:22  <Ammler> you can also check your local repo with graphlog
20:22:33  <Ammler> so you see, if you have ugly heads yourself
20:25:01  <andythenorth> oh how interesting
20:25:06  <andythenorth> the strip removed all my code :)
20:25:44  <andythenorth> that was undesirable
20:25:54  <andythenorth> that's 1 hour of work...missing :D
20:26:25  <Rubidium> doesn't strip make a backup?
20:27:44  <andythenorth> strip-backup?
20:27:46  <andythenorth> looks like it
20:27:52  <andythenorth> dunno how to unpack that though
20:30:08  <Ammler> unbundle
20:30:25  <andythenorth> ah
20:30:28  <andythenorth> there's my code :)
20:30:39  <Ammler> but well, it is obvious that strip removes the code, what did you expect?
20:30:54  <Ammler> I guess, there is an option to keep changes in workcopy
20:31:05  <andythenorth> I want to remove the commits, not the code :P
20:31:44  <Ammler> but unbundle did also restore the commit
20:31:48  <andythenorth> yup
20:31:55  <Ammler> just you know :-P
20:32:31  <Ammler> strip -k
20:32:32  <andythenorth> :)
20:32:54  <andythenorth> yay
20:32:58  <andythenorth> ammler \o/
20:33:03  <andythenorth> [I think]
20:33:15  * andythenorth will eat dinner then try a commit again
20:33:45  <andythenorth> does devzone project stuff ship with default .hgignore set (I think it does?)
20:33:51  <Ammler> no
20:33:56  <andythenorth> oh
20:34:01  <Ammler> but I guess, teh makefile framwork has one
20:34:07  <andythenorth> it should add .pyc :P
20:34:08  <Ammler> but not pyc maybe
20:35:38  <Ammler> well, what would be cool it, if you could replace gcc with python
20:36:34  <Ammler> then only make needs to be replaced finally :-)
20:39:07  <andythenorth> Ammler: I meant the .hgignore should ignore *.pyc :)
20:39:13  <andythenorth> as devzone does not allow it to be pushed
20:41:18  <andythenorth> but also, yes, I'm replacing the use of c pre-processor entirely
20:56:19  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Bug #3618 (New): Wrong trains available for 3rd rail (Transportman) @
20:59:47  <andythenorth> Ammler: finally fixed (had to go back another rev) - thanks ;)
20:59:54  <andythenorth> hg st
21:00:15  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 136:5568290b9917: Change: rebuilding the build system (breaks the grf just a bi... (andythenorth) @
21:01:54  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature Request #3619 (New): Parameter to set train names (Transportman) @
21:03:35  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Bug #3618: Wrong trains available for 3rd rail (Transportman) @
21:04:26  <andythenorth> Ammler: BANDIT will for some time probably throw a lot of devzone compile errors
21:04:55  <andythenorth> also I've added a dep - python chameleon module
21:05:07  <andythenorth> I don't know how we tell devzone to build deps?
21:05:19  <andythenorth> easy_install Chameleon is straightforward
21:38:33  <andythenorth> Yexo: nml reports unexpected token 'visual_effect' for the following line:
21:38:37  <andythenorth>         visual_effect:                  visual_effect(VISUAL_EFFECT_DIESEL, 0);
21:38:53  <Yexo> what is the line before that?
21:39:04  <andythenorth> a line missing it's ;
21:39:09  <Yexo> ;)
21:39:09  <andythenorth> :m
21:39:34  <andythenorth> needs better idiot-proofing
21:39:41  * andythenorth can supply hi-grade idiocy
21:40:16  <Yexo> it's quite hard to make better error messages for this
21:41:09  <andythenorth> I can imagine
21:44:57  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Revision 136:ab92f387c09e: Change: move metros to top of purchase list (foobar) @
21:46:08  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Bug #3618 (Rejected): Wrong trains available for 3rd rail (Transportman) @
21:46:08  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Bug #3618 (Rejected): Wrong trains available for 3rd rail (foobar) @
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21:47:43  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3619 (New): Parameter to set train names (Transportman) @
21:47:43  <Brot6> Dutch Trains 2.0 - Feature #3619: Parameter to set train names (foobar) @
21:54:32  <andythenorth> ho ho ho
21:55:44  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 137:f2f39da80f02: Change: python build system works \oo/ (andythenorth) @
21:59:31  <andythenorth> Yexo: do you have any plans to add built-in templating to nml (and if so, can I persuade you otherwise?) :)
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22:26:21  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 138:e8e51f1b54b6: Codechange: provide for vehicles using multiple templates (andythenorth) @
22:37:04  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 139:73b29fe52efb: Change: start scaffolding for trailers (andythenorth) @
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23:25:24  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Feature #3620 (New): Force 32bpp (oberhuemer) @
23:26:07  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Feature #3620 (New): Force 32 bpp (oberhuemer) @
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23:44:54  <Brot6> Central European Train Set - Feature #3620 (New): Force 32 bpp (oberhuemer) @
23:52:06  <Brot6> BANDIT - Revision 140:2d425fc08716: Change: provide stub objects for trailers (andythenorth) @
23:53:00  <Yexo> andythenorth: I have no plans to built-in more templating in nml, there are enough fine tools for that already
23:53:08  <andythenorth> \o/
23:53:26  <andythenorth> templating would be fine, but I think you'd be wasting valuable dev time ;)
23:53:28  <Yexo> the only thing I might do is add support for including other files
23:53:37  <andythenorth> that seems sane
23:54:11  <andythenorth> Ammler: did you see my query about python chameleon as a dep. for building BANDIT on devzone?
23:55:21  <andythenorth> Yexo: it's quite interesting to construct a python obj. for each vehicle
23:55:29  <andythenorth> and then create a render method
23:55:32  <andythenorth> it's very clean
23:55:57  <Yexo> does it make the code easier to read?
23:56:13  <andythenorth> depends on what you're used to
23:56:32  <andythenorth> I'm used to reading python + html mixed in with $ and xml-style templating
23:57:34  <andythenorth> here's my build script (unfinished)
23:57:43  <andythenorth> and here's the main vehicle template
23:57:57  <andythenorth> there's other stuff, but it's quite accessible I hope
23:58:07  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #3222: alignment of trains (frosch) @
23:58:23  <Ammler> andythenorth: query?
23:58:33  <Ammler> I have no query here
23:58:46  <andythenorth> nvm :)
23:59:04  <andythenorth> but how do I install a dep. on the devzone?
23:59:13  <Ammler> you can basically have everything
23:59:30  <Ammler> if not available, we can build it
23:59:43  <Ammler> like e.q. we create nml-dot-wine
23:59:45  <andythenorth> for me it was easy_install Chameleon
23:59:47  <Yexo> SOUND_TRUCK_START_2; //cpp constant <- actually that is an nml constant
23:59:54  <andythenorth> ho
23:59:56  <andythenorth> code review :)

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