Log for #openttdcoop.stable on 8th July 2013:
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01:29:13  <Mazur> Hey, Silp.
01:29:25  <Stablean> <Sylf> ello
01:29:41  <Stablean> <Cameron> hi
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01:33:58  <Stablean> <Mazur> Smart move, completely forgot to finish the connection to Wedgewood.
01:39:20  <Stablean> <Mazur> Oh, you'll know, it 201 km/h the best one can do with cargo?
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01:42:58  <Mazur> Thank.
01:42:59  <Mazur> s
01:43:21  <Sylf> Is there even 201km/h?
01:44:05  <Mazur> Yep, the EMD 67'
01:44:13  <Mazur> Diesel.
01:44:24  <Sylf> oh that.
01:45:26  <Mazur> Since I couldn't find express cars for all types of freight, I can;t use expres locs.
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02:11:13  <Stablean> <Cameron> omg
02:11:21  <Stablean> <Mazur> Yes?
02:11:36  <Stablean> <Mazur> Or am i not your god?
02:11:38  <Stablean> <Cameron> watching Mr. Beans Holiday
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03:39:16  <Stablean> <Mazur> Bye, Cami.
03:39:28  <Stablean> <Mazur> I'm off fpor the night.
03:39:34  <Stablean> <Mazur> Well, morning, here.
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03:58:19  <Stablean> <Mazur> When something annoys me, it's doesn't leave me alone, can;t ignore it.
03:58:23  <Stablean> <Mazur> Ok, fixed.
03:58:29  <Stablean> <Mazur> bye, again.
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07:49:40  <Stablean> <Dom> ello
07:49:50  <Stablean> <Diablo> hey dom
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12:41:44  <Stablean> <Anson> hallo .... how do lumbermils work ?
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12:55:59  <Stablean> <cronux> hey Anson
12:56:57  <Stablean> <cronux> You need to build the right kind of trees on grassland I beleive to have lumber mills working
12:58:45  <Stablean> <Anson> rainforest :-)
12:59:19  <Stablean> <Anson> but my problem is: how do they work? how much do they produce, and what do i need to make them grow ?
12:59:45  <Stablean> <Anson> i started one, and at first it gave 110, then 0, then 40, then 0, then 140, then 0 .....
13:04:28  <Stablean> <cronux> it depends on how many trees are around it
13:04:30  <planetmaker> AnsonMobil, they require trees in their vicinity. Otherwise they work afaik normal
13:04:42  <planetmaker> vicinity = ~10 tails iirc
13:04:49  <planetmaker> s/tails/tiles/
13:04:49  <Brot6> planetmaker meant: "vicinity = ~10 tiles iirc"
13:04:56  <planetmaker> omg... my English deteriorates
13:08:39  <Stablean> <Anson> thanks ... I'll try it someday, when i completely have rebuilt my drop
13:10:33  <Stablean> <cronux> my drop is not as functional anymore...
13:11:01  <Stablean> <Anson> my drop itself still works perfectly
13:11:34  <Stablean> <Anson> but the access to it from the mainlone was built when there were only stations to the right, thus almost a terminus of the mainline
13:11:56  <Stablean> <cronux> I mean that some one is taking goods from the refinery
13:12:26  <Stablean> <Anson> and now, half the stations are to the left too, with lots of traffic passing on the mainline and twolane ML merging into a onelane bottleneck before splitting to platforms
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14:16:10  <Stablean> <Anson> almost done ... how does Parkallen station work now ?
14:17:25  <Stablean> <cronux> not sure how well those depots will go
14:18:56  <Stablean> <Anson> have to wait and see ... but it should work quite well, since the time to enter and leave should be the same on double depots ... maybe i have to double them, making double-double exits :-)
14:19:13  <Stablean> <cronux> haha
14:19:23  <Stablean> <cronux> i am trying to rejig ::WIP
14:19:33  <Stablean> <Anson> rejig ? wip ?
14:19:56  <Stablean> <Anson> sorry, english is not my native language
14:20:02  <Stablean> <cronux> check the sign  :: WIP
14:20:13  <Stablean> <cronux> rejig - rework - rebuild
14:20:23  <Stablean> <cronux> slang
14:22:09  <Stablean> <Anson> 1k oil with 4 platforms ... should be up to the limit soon
14:23:51  <Stablean> <Anson> why do you use two stations at enoch ? why not one pickup station for all oil ß
14:24:49  <Stablean> <cronux> 2 seperate wells = 2 seperate stations
14:24:55  <Stablean> <cronux> just how I wanted to play it :-)
14:27:29  <Stablean> <Anson> looks like it could use a really nice overflow, with loop around, waiting bay after the depots, etc
14:28:17  <Stablean> <Anson> of course, it currently works perfect too :-)
14:28:36  <Stablean> <cronux> Just wait, an influx of trains will be due in soon
14:28:58  <Stablean> <cronux> does not help that my right mouse button is not working very well
14:29:44  <Stablean> <Anson> right mouse button ? i only use it for scrolling, and that can be done with cursor keys too
14:30:07  <Stablean> <cronux> right mouse is quicker, I think i need to restart computer
14:31:17  <Stablean> <cronux> thinking of double headed trains tho
14:31:27  <Stablean> <cronux> acceleration is terrible
14:32:19  <Stablean> <Anson> i think your prio doesn't work as intended at !prio
14:32:41  <Stablean> <cronux> no it doesnt been ttrying to think of what the issue is
14:32:51  <Stablean> <Anson> the combo signals ned to be queued, not parallel
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14:34:25  <Stablean> <Anson> now it should work
14:35:03  <Stablean> <cronux> fixed
14:35:10  <Stablean> <cronux> wrong signal :-)
14:36:12  <Stablean> <cronux> thanks tho
14:36:46  <Stablean> <Anson> as someone said to me when i had a problem with some logic too: always follow the flow of signals, from start to end .-)
14:37:01  <Stablean> <Anson> and parallel signals just don't work
14:38:11  <Stablean> <Anson> do you also build "nice" tracks, or only "working" tracks ?
14:38:26  <Stablean> <cronux> I prefer nice
14:38:45  <Stablean> <Anson> look at the same prio again now
14:39:47  <Stablean> <cronux> yeh the two way combo :-)
14:46:01  <Stablean> <Anson> i think the signals are right, but the track isn't ...
14:48:55  <Stablean> <Anson> it works like this : train looks at the first/nearest platform, i 2way red, it looks at the next, etc ... and if the last is red too, it goes in the dead end track ...
14:49:29  <Stablean> <Anson> if the dead end track starts too early, it passes it, tries the 2way signals, and then is stuck at them
14:49:55  <Stablean> <cronux> ah
14:50:30  <Stablean> <Anson> same would happen if you build it to the right side of the station ... track tries right platform first, and then is stuck at the left
14:51:36  <Stablean> <Anson> look at all my stations ... they should all be identical ... entry from one side, the train passes all platforms, and finally ends up in the dead end ...
14:51:54  <Sylf> that should depend if there are any other block signals between the train's current location and the last twoway signal
14:52:12  <Stablean> <Anson> and that is the next trick : to make it try the dead end, you need a dummy split there, so that it doesn't see that it is a dead end :-)
14:52:29  <Sylf> The way you build, Anson, you can have the overflow track split at the very beginning
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14:54:42  <Stablean> <Anson> sylf, you mean like !test ?
14:55:39  <Sylf> I can't see it now... I'm at work
14:56:30  <Stablean> <Anson> i just tried to put the dead end right at the beginning, between depot and first platform, and it went to the last platform and is stuck there
14:57:34  <Stablean> <cronux> I am off now... ciao
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14:57:55  <Stablean> <Anson> CU, cron
14:58:25  <Stablean> <Anson> Sylf, i undid the test, but left the tracks there, so you can have a look later .-)
14:59:22  <Sylf> Actually
14:59:22  <Sylf> I think I'm wrong
15:00:10  <Sylf> with block signal based network, I think the train makes the path decision at the split, not at the signal
15:01:04  <Sylf> On another topic...  You can shorten your overflow tracks in most cases the way you build your overflows
15:01:22  <Stablean> <Anson> no matter when it takes the decision, the logic behind it is to test one signal after the other, nearest first, and thus the dead end needs to be at the last
15:02:03  <Sylf> it does matter in my mind.
15:02:40  <Sylf> If the train tests all possible paths available within single signal block, then you can have the split at the beginning.
15:02:58  <Stablean> <Anson> shorter dead end ? yes, mostly it would work ... 1 tile, halftile curve, then 3 tiles, and finally the split ... that would be 5
15:04:36  <Stablean> <Anson> when building straight, i build 5 tiles and then the split, although mostly the longer part of the split would be good enough as fifth tile ... but rarely, the train takes the shorter branch and then it would only be 4.5 tiles, so that the train can't directly enter the last platform on returning from the dead end
15:04:40  <Sylf> I don't know what tiles you're talking about... but you only need a space long enough for the overflowed train to have space to reverse itself, and be able to enter the depot, not a full length of the train to be in the dedicated overflow reverser track
15:05:16  <Stablean> <Anson> and just to be sure, i simply put down at least 4.5 tiles nd then the last split
15:06:18  <Stablean> <Anson> ah, that's what you mean ... of course that would work, but the train wouldn't be able to enter any platforms that might heve turned free while passing them
15:06:49  <Stablean> <Anson> with my longer dead end, the train can try all platforms once, then reverse, and try them again before entering the depot
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16:41:22  <Stablean> <Anson> hehe, really nice to watch the graphs ... always seeing whether something is rebuilt large style :-)
16:41:48  <Stablean> <Mazur> Yep.
16:42:23  <Stablean> <Anson> for four years, my graph was at zero :-)
16:42:34  <Stablean> <Mazur> In my case it was a blockage.
16:42:40  <Stablean> <Anson> completely rebuilt the Parkallen drop
16:43:19  <Stablean> <Mazur> Had forgotten to presig a block signal at a delivery station.
16:43:49  <Stablean> <Anson> a double ML, both lanes fully crowded, had to squeeze through a "merge before split" bottleneck
16:44:11  <Stablean> <Mazur> I'm not that big.
16:45:01  <Stablean> <Anson> i started in 1920 ... big comes by itself over time ...
16:45:48  <Stablean> <Anson> long ML, and then kept adding rubber stations ....
16:46:50  <Stablean> <Anson> Sylf always starts fastest ... very efficient money maker, thus more trains quickly, and thus more trains ...
16:47:20  <Stablean> <Anson> but then he let the company run by itself while i kept adding more rubber
16:47:22  <Stablean> <Mazur> Yeah, most practice at it.
16:47:56  <Stablean> <Anson> i build too nice at the start ... costs money and low profits
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16:48:16  <Stablean> <Mazur> I onjly made one diamonf mine running before hitting the million, had to wait months before primary 2 and 3 cojuld get trains.
16:49:18  <Stablean> <Anson> biggest money maker is when you have 2-3 resources going, and then add goods .-)
16:49:29  <Stablean> <Anson> goods cost almost no money, but double the income
16:49:51  <Stablean> <Mazur> Never gpot around to that until vary late, towns too pissed at me.  ;-)
16:50:05  <Stablean> <Anson> even more, when you don't need additional trains when doing refit
16:51:31  <Stablean> <Anson> towns are difficult ... i often have to move a station by one tile, but am not allowed to do that ... and while i can't move the station, i lose even more reputation
16:52:33  <Stablean> <Anson> i hate planting a forest in the desert, just to be allowed to build a single tile
16:52:53  <Stablean> <Mazur> Yeah.
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17:00:40  <Sylf> I'm not playing here to build the biggest company.
17:01:00  <Stablean> <Anson> AFK ... phone
17:01:02  <Stablean> <Mazur> But you do it anyway, you can;t help it.
17:01:24  <V453000> moo
17:01:25  <V453000> hello
17:01:48  <Stablean> <Mazur> *be-eh-eh-eh-eh*
17:02:03  <V453000> Sylf: I just uploaded 0.5.4 to bananas, please update NUTS for following games :P ... it removes mainly the maglev-has-all-signals-WETRail, plus some mistakes in other strings
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17:03:23  <Sylf> so, it should be sav file compatible?  I want to update it for PS in mid-game
17:06:42  <V453000> I did not test but it should be
17:06:53  <V453000> I already downgraded PS to 0.5.2 yesterday
17:06:59  <V453000> for the signals
17:07:26  <V453000> preferably overwrite it with 0.5.4
17:08:32  <Sylf> oh ok.
17:09:13  <Sylf> I did't pay much attention to the game yesterday, so I missed that.
17:14:38  <V453000> :P
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19:54:45  <Stablean> <Diablo> hello
19:54:56  <Stablean> <Mazur> Halo II.
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20:22:33  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> been a while since I was on here lol
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20:36:12  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> I can't remember how to build any more :D
20:40:02  <Sylf> press a, click and drag on the map, press 9, click and drag couple of times, press 7, click once, press escape, click on the depot, etc :P
20:40:32  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> I didn't mean quite that literally xD my layout sucks
20:43:27  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> can't even remember the last time I played this
20:48:55  <Stablean> <Diablo> who can help me redevelop anderson forest terminus?
20:50:27  <Stablean> <Anson> @gap 5
20:50:42  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> ?
20:52:57  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> damnit, ran out of moneyz xD
20:53:28  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> thanks :)
20:54:47  <Stablean> <Anson> just remember that this server is mostly about big train networks ... ships and aircraft are "a bit" costly ...
20:55:13  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> I haven't forgotten that  - I haven't been running any
20:55:20  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> I just got a bit ambitious with my network
20:55:56  <Stablean> <Anson> and pay back your loan when you can ... that eats up most of a beginners income
20:56:10  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> have done so :)
20:56:16  <Stablean> <Anson> ctrl-click to repay as much as you can at once
20:56:24  <Stablean> <TrainsOfSodor> think it might've been six months since I played this last :L
20:56:31  <Sylf> no, I don't consider this server being about big networks
20:56:58  <Sylf> big networks are not a challenge to build
20:58:46  <Stablean> <Anson> building 5 tracks for 5 resources, is even less a challenge, or setting up a few long distance flights ...
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21:03:36  <Sylf> Players can play in whatever style they want here without having to compete against others
21:04:01  <Sylf> You've seen people build 1 tile long train network and have fun with it
21:04:11  <Stablean> <Anson> without aircraft and without ships
21:05:23  <Sylf> and especially with NUTS, you have build networks in so many different ways - rails, monorails, maglevs, fast, slow, medium, long trains, short trains, srnw, refit, sbahn/ice, anything else
21:05:57  <Sylf> but then again, I haven't seen very many players actually building in different style often
21:06:05  <Stablean> <Anson> i built networks with TL1 and with TLmax (7, 9, 15, whatever) ... but you'll have a hard time making money with bus networks, and even less with aircraft and ships
21:06:30  <Sylf> it's a shame.
21:08:05  <Stablean> <Anson> i like going nuts, and in the last game, i even wet myself in the end, instead of using maglev :-)
21:08:10  <Sylf> don't worry about making money especially on this server
21:08:10  <Sylf> you can have some basic moneymaker line set up to support your unique road vehicle transport system
21:08:26  <Sylf> although, I haven't found roadvehicle games fun often
21:09:56  <Stablean> <Anson> max 700 trains, but only max 60 road vehicles in this game ... although you need lots more road vehicles than trains because of the capacity, if you build only with them
21:11:28  <Stablean> <Anson> btw: in this game, i didn't build statues --> resources still are far below maximum, and 3 already died after having been in use for a long time
21:16:36  <Sylf> I still hate statues, especially in PS.
21:16:41  <Sylf> IMO, having primaries with max output isn't all that good of a thing
21:17:46  <Stablean> <Anson> i hate the low output of resources in the early game, as well as high output in the late game ...
21:18:32  <Stablean> <Anson> but it mostly is too tempting to boost resources at first, and then can't get rid of the statues
21:20:27  <Stablean> <Anson> but don't tell me that you can set up nice RV networks, with only 60 RVs, and with 2x RV running costs and 4x road maintenance ...
21:21:28  <Sylf> You can.
21:21:29  <Sylf> A nice network doesn't have to be profitable
21:22:29  <Sylf> although, 60 max vehicle of any type is too small to make it the primary mode of transport
21:22:59  <Stablean> <Anson> to keep playing and not go bancrupt, your company needs to be profitable, at least by a minimum margin
21:24:50  <Sylf> If you have a nonprofitable road vehicle transport, build a money maker train line somewhere else.
21:25:52  <Sylf> We have a pretty active and responsive team of admins here.
21:25:59  <Sylf> If a player decide to build a large RV nework, they can request max RV count to be raised
21:29:01  <Sylf> I still like seeing train networks more, so I will continue to set RV limit low for new maps, but those limits can be changed
21:29:04  <Sylf> Also, if people want, they can submit new maps for this server
21:29:07  <Sylf> each new maps has everything from GRF list to vehicle limit etc all saved within
21:31:27  <Stablean> <Anson> yes ... it is quite some challenge to create a map (with grfs etc)
21:31:42  <Stablean> <Anson> btw: thanks to all the people who always do that work !
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21:43:48  <Sylf> hmmm, I'm arguing the wrong thing.
21:43:50  <Sylf> My argument should be, why would you want to build an RV network?
21:43:53  <Sylf> When in my original argument, I listed a few of rail based network ideas
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21:44:04  <Stablean> <V453000> moo
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21:44:50  <V453000> oom
21:45:02  <scshunt> omo
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23:07:24  <AnsonMobil> !password
23:08:19  <AnsonMobil> lag again. .. still waiting for password
23:10:37  <AnsonMobil> lol.... or simply the wrong chat :-)
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