Log for #openttdcoop.stable on 16th July 2013:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:03:14  <Stablean> *** KTG joined the game
00:03:53  <Stablean> *** KTG has left the game (leaving)
00:07:30  <Stablean> *** KTG joined the game
00:09:09  <Stablean> *** KTG has started a new company (#10)
00:35:45  <Stablean> *** Sylf joined the game
00:37:37  <Stablean> <Sylf> ugh.
00:37:47  <Stablean> <Sylf> I hate inflation enabled games
00:51:10  <Stablean> *** Sylf has left the game (leaving)
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00:58:28  <Stablean> *** Cameron has joined company #2
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01:04:52  <Stablean> <Cameron> can someone turn funding town construction on, please?
01:08:45  <Sylf> we can't
01:08:51  <Stablean> <Cameron> ugh
01:08:59  <Sylf> the game script disables that function
01:09:09  <Stablean> <Cameron> :(
01:10:50  <Sylf> there may be a bug where if one town's growth rate goes down to every 23k days, it never recovers back to normal growth rate no matter what.
01:11:13  <Stablean> <Cameron> great, thats 2 towns that are doing that :(
01:11:52  <Stablean> <Cameron> so every 65 game years it grow, LOL
01:12:30  <Sylf> it won't grow
01:12:46  <Sylf> not even every 65 years
01:16:06  <Stablean> <Cameron> damn, so unfortunate
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02:22:23  <Stablean> *** Dom has left the game (general timeout)
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02:28:01  <BiG_MeEcH> wooooooooo
02:28:04  <BiG_MeEcH> !date
02:28:04  <Stablean> BiG_MeEcH: 18 Nov 1995
02:28:10  <BiG_MeEcH> !dl lin64
02:28:10  <Stablean> BiG_MeEcH:
02:28:30  <BiG_MeEcH> !players
02:28:33  <Stablean> BiG_MeEcH: Client 34 (White) is KTG, in company 10 (Cargolux)
02:28:33  <Stablean> BiG_MeEcH: Client 26 (Pale Green) is Anson, in company 7 (Anson Transport)
02:28:33  <Stablean> BiG_MeEcH: Client 20 (Green) is Cameron, in company 2 (Cameron Transport)
02:33:37  <Stablean> <Anson> I HATE THIS ... third time already
02:34:16  <BiG_MeEcH> I hate it too! :P
02:34:19  <BiG_MeEcH> !ip
02:34:19  <Stablean> BiG_MeEcH:
02:34:26  <Stablean> <Anson> if you want to know what ... just look at the signs ....
02:34:49  <BiG_MeEcH> I would but my ottd cant find this server :D
02:34:56  <BiG_MeEcH> oh, there it is :D
02:36:38  <Stablean> *** Big Meech joined the game
02:37:27  <Stablean> <Anson> first, i expanded my ML to double and did a tour around the lake, to use that factofry
02:37:28  <Stablean> <Big Meech> yopu will just have to build quicker :D
02:37:30  <Stablean> <Anson> gone now
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02:37:55  <Stablean> *** Diablo joined the game
02:38:06  <Stablean> <Anson> i don't want to do speed building, but testing some layoits, building nice, etc
02:38:29  <Stablean> *** Diablo has joined company #3
02:38:35  <Stablean> <Anson> and in a game with inflation and very high TF costs (100k per tile, now even more) it takes even longer
02:38:56  <Stablean> *** Sylf joined the game
02:38:59  <Stablean> <Sylf> wewt
02:39:05  <Stablean> <Big Meech> wooooooooo!
02:39:55  <Stablean> <Sylf> this is one bare map
02:40:06  <Sylf> !rcon set industry_density
02:40:06  <Stablean> Sylf: Current value for 'industry_density' is: '4' (min: 0, max: 5)
02:40:07  <Stablean> <Big Meech> I suggest commence building
02:40:14  <Sylf> !rcon set industry_density 5
02:40:14  <Stablean> Sylf: ERROR: This command/variable is not available during network games.
02:41:48  <Stablean> <Sylf> ok, here comes my MM
02:41:50  <Stablean> *** Sylf has started a new company (#11)
02:44:42  <Stablean> <Cameron> Meeches!
02:44:52  <Stablean> <Big Meech> Camer-onz!
02:44:59  <Stablean> <Cameron> :)
02:50:51  <Stablean> *** Sylf has joined spectators
02:54:11  <Stablean> <Cameron> 212k, not bad
02:54:17  <Stablean> <Big Meech> what are the rainbow rails?
02:54:19  <Stablean> <Big Meech> :)
02:54:37  <Stablean> <Cameron> V's new uni rail
02:54:44  <Stablean> <Sylf> neon colored fancy universal rails
02:54:51  <Stablean> <Cameron> yup
02:54:57  <Stablean> <Big Meech> sounds like nyan cat
02:55:11  <Stablean> <Cameron> damn Nyan Cat
02:55:15  <Stablean> <Big Meech> :D
02:56:01  <Stablean> <Cameron> shit, shouldn't have said that XD Nyan Cats and co. might attack me >.<
02:56:23  <Stablean> *** Big Meech has started a new company (#12)
02:56:56  <Stablean> <Anson> even worse ... now, i see it flying around everywhere ... after i hadn't thought of it for months
02:57:12  <Stablean> *** Big Meech has joined spectators
02:57:14  <Stablean> <Anson> will take a long time until i get rid of it again
02:57:18  <Stablean> <Big Meech> your love of nyan cat is undenyable
03:00:26  <Stablean> <Cameron> ugh, town #3 is now doing that bug...
03:00:48  <Stablean> <Cameron> grows every 23,212 days
03:01:26  <Stablean> <Cameron> it was fine earlier
03:06:33  <Stablean> *** KTG has left the game (general timeout)
03:06:33  <Stablean> *** KTG has left the game (connection lost)
03:07:51  <Stablean> *** Sylf has joined company #11
03:09:11  <Stablean> <Big Meech> :D
03:15:12  <Stablean> *** KTG joined the game
03:16:41  <Stablean> <Sylf> looks like i'm in trouble :)
03:31:11  <Stablean> *** Big Meech has joined company #11
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03:40:03  <Stablean> <Cameron> trade an engine for a oil wagon...
03:49:06  <Stablean> *** Diablo has left the game (leaving)
03:57:58  <Stablean> <Cameron> it's growing
04:08:38  <BiG_MeEcH> I hate my connection :D
04:09:06  <Stablean> <Anson> i hate the connections of my network :-)
04:09:29  <BiG_MeEcH> :D
04:09:33  <BiG_MeEcH> burn it with fire
04:10:21  <Stablean> <Anson> how do you build a hub in the mounbtains without terraforming ? .-(
04:12:33  <BiG_MeEcH> build through the mountain and around
04:14:11  <Stablean> <Anson> tunnel with length 11 = 100k$ ... tunnel with TF on both ends = at least 500k$
04:16:38  <BiG_MeEcH> save loot
04:34:22  <Stablean> *** RTM joined the game
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04:38:06  <Stablean> *** RTM has joined company #6
04:38:11  <Stablean> <RTM> hi all
04:39:19  <Stablean> <Anson> ans now let's see how long this town accepts food and goods
04:40:05  <Stablean> <Anson> towns doesn't grow ... food required
04:40:31  <Stablean> <Anson> and after delivering food : food deivered ... growing every 23,212 days
04:48:30  <Stablean> <Anson> ih, now it went from 23k days to only 100 days
05:07:43  <Stablean> *** KTG has left the game (leaving)
05:12:59  <Stablean> <Cameron> Anson, I think it's a bug =, and I think it's happening to all of them, I have 3 towns doing that.
05:13:30  <Stablean> <Anson> it is back to 23k again :-)
05:13:41  <Stablean> <Cameron> ...
05:14:43  <Stablean> <Cameron> well, one of them is down to 199 days
05:15:14  <Stablean> <Anson> what annoys me most about town growth and the authorities : when i build a train station and connect it, i have already deleted so many trees and similar that i am forbidden to build more stations ... but how do i build a few roads and bus stations next to make the town grow ?
05:15:52  <Stablean> <Cameron> idk
05:17:02  <Stablean> <Sylf> don't try to grow towns in this game
05:17:09  <Stablean> <Sylf> it's as simple as that
05:44:10  <V453000> does SyCity bug? :P
05:44:13  <V453000> or is it used at all?
05:44:14  <V453000> idk
05:44:47  <Stablean> <Sylf> yeah, it's a bug
05:44:55  <V453000> :D
05:47:08  <V453000> is it fixable?
05:47:43  <Stablean> <Sylf> probably, but I haven't really looked into it yet
05:47:55  <V453000> alright :)
05:48:14  <V453000> do you have it on the devzone or something?
05:48:45  <Stablean> <Sylf> not this one
05:49:28  <Stablean> <Sylf> squirrel scripts are all text files, so the code should be available in the content download folder
05:50:13  <V453000> oh :D
05:50:22  <V453000> ARENT THOSE
05:50:33  <V453000> the files with .nut extension
05:50:52  <Stablean> <Sylf> yup
05:51:06  <Stablean> <Sylf> totally nutty
06:34:14  <Stablean> <RTM> for town to grow you need to complete the nesesare requemeents
06:34:30  <Stablean> <Cameron> still
06:34:40  <Stablean> <Cameron> it ain't working
06:35:02  <Stablean> <RTM> constants on mounts
06:35:10  <Stablean> <RTM> one time
06:35:32  <Stablean> <RTM> where my HQ is
06:35:35  <Stablean> <Cameron> what about the non snowline cities?
06:35:45  <Stablean> <Sylf> the gamestcript that controls town growth is broken.
06:35:55  <Stablean> <RTM> really
06:36:13  <Stablean> <RTM> so it will be fix or not
06:36:21  <Stablean> <Cameron> see Lartbridge
06:36:31  <Stablean> <Sylf> not in this game
06:37:01  <Stablean> <Sylf> not this month or next month.  I'm too busy for now
06:37:16  <Stablean> <RTM> ok
06:37:43  <V453000> you can enslave Vinnie I think he was digging some gs
06:37:49  <Stablean> <RTM> who whants a donetion of money
06:37:57  <Stablean> <Anson> can't we simply play without a broken script ß
06:38:08  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
06:38:12  <V453000> no :(
06:38:14  <Stablean> <Anson> is the script needed, even when it doesn't work correctly ß
06:38:25  <V453000> no :)
06:38:48  <Stablean> <RTM> nice V453000
06:39:00  <V453000> no?
06:39:04  <Stablean> <Sylf> you'll have to wait until the next map though
06:39:11  <Stablean> <RTM> livrate the nesesary cool it worck
06:39:13  <Stablean> <Cameron> is there a city builder type script out there?
06:39:15  <Stablean> <RTM> works
06:39:23  <Stablean> <Sylf> yes
06:39:34  <Stablean> <RTM> lok at Monfingbridge
06:39:48  <Stablean> <Sylf> srsly, don't bother with towns on this map.
06:40:18  <Stablean> <Anson> it is not for pax, but for dropping goods and food ...
06:40:20  <Stablean> <Sylf> unless you want to take the gs used on this map and debug it yourself
06:40:34  <Stablean> <Sylf> don't do goods
06:40:47  <V453000> can a gs be removed in running sp game?
06:40:54  <Stablean> <Sylf> food acceptance is done pretty much everywhere
06:41:09  <Stablean> <Sylf> I don't think so, V.
06:41:15  <Stablean> <Anson> lol ... don't do pax, don't do mail, don't do valuables, and don't do cargo ... and you will have no problems :-)
06:41:21  <Stablean> <Cameron> hack the game :P
06:41:39  <Stablean> <RTM> ok guys
06:41:47  <Stablean> <Sylf> why not valuables?
06:41:57  <Stablean> <RTM> track trains PURR
06:42:03  <Stablean> <Sylf> banks never close.
06:42:13  <Stablean> <RTM> do you guys try
06:42:15  <Stablean> <RTM> or not
06:42:17  <Stablean> <Sylf> gold and diamond mines increase production without problems
06:42:35  <V453000> yes, focus on purr and transport cargo, bitches :>
06:42:37  <Stablean> <Anson> banks never close ?
06:42:43  <Stablean> <Cameron> I have my networks done, not gunna bother removing them
06:42:51  <Stablean> <Sylf> banks never close on any climates.
06:43:20  <V453000> Which I would not be so sure about with ogfx+ industries sylf
06:43:28  <Stablean> <Anson> when was that changed ? ... i remember a game 1+ years ago, where we had to rebuild a bank every 4 or 5 years since the city destroyed it when houses were rebuilt
06:43:31  <V453000> but they probably dont die
06:43:39  <Stablean> <Cameron> green purr
06:44:25  <Stablean> <Anson> even if a bank never dies by itself, does that also mean that it can'Ät be destroyed by rebuilding something else ?
06:44:27  <Stablean> <Cameron> looks like metro rails lost cousin to me
06:44:29  <Stablean> <Sylf> as far as I know, banks never close in default industries.  and I thought it was the same in this grf too.
06:45:36  <Stablean> <Anson> as i said, 1+ years ago, towns regularly destroyed (and rebuilt somewhere else in town, out of reach of my station) the banks
06:45:36  <Stablean> <Sylf> hmmm, purrrrr'ing the whole network's gonna be expensive
06:45:46  <V453000> e.g. power plants do die with ogfx+industries I think
06:45:49  <Stablean> <Cameron> V, the purr tracks going straight are all jagged
06:45:59  <V453000> wat
06:46:05  <Stablean> <RTM> sylf is like universal rail
06:46:13  <Stablean> <Cameron> 79 million dollars for my network
06:46:15  <Stablean> <RTM> the PUR
06:46:26  <V453000> well sure :>
06:46:33  <Stablean> <Cameron> closest zoom and the next one out
06:46:51  <Stablean> <Sylf> don't use extra zoom
06:48:17  <V453000> I havent noticed anything strange with the rails, if there is, mark it on the map and I will have a look later
06:50:11  <Stablean> *** RTM has left the game (leaving)
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07:30:28  <Stablean> <Dom> towns do grow you just need to build roads :D
07:30:43  <Stablean> *** Dom has joined company #8
07:32:56  <Stablean> <Anson> just for info: a town grew every 32k at first, then every 100 for a short time aftre i started delivering food, then 32k again, and also when i transported lots of pax in town ... just now i added just 2 mail trucks, and the town grows every 80 days now
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07:55:52  <Stablean> <Diablo> im confused as to whether timeouts are local side or new client to server
07:56:07  <Stablean> <Dom> mine are local :)
07:56:58  <Stablean> *** Diablo has joined company #3
07:58:00  <V453000> everybody would timeout if it was server side
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08:00:00  <Stablean> <Diablo> cant wait for fibre optic to come into effect for better speeds
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08:01:29  <V453000> t
08:01:35  <V453000> this is probably about stability not speed
08:01:43  <V453000> openttd needs tiny amount of data transfer
08:01:54  <Stablean> <Diablo> but still, my connections crap
08:02:28  <Stablean> <Diablo> it takes ages to get the full MB to enter
08:03:48  <V453000> mhm :)
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08:05:12  <Stablean> <Diablo> oh yea...v, can u plz do something about company # 5
08:12:53  <V453000> !conpanies
08:12:56  <V453000> !companies
08:12:58  <Stablean> V453000: Company 1 (Blue): happy tran  sport Transport
08:12:58  <Stablean> V453000: Company 2 (Green): Cameron Transport
08:12:58  <Stablean> V453000: Company 3 (Red): Diablo Transport
08:12:58  <Stablean> V453000: Company 4 (Pink): Maraxus Transport
08:12:58  <Stablean> V453000: Company 5 (Mauve): TrainsOfSodor Transport
08:12:59  <Stablean> V453000: Company 6 (Purple): RTM Transport
08:12:59  <Stablean> V453000: Company 7 (Pale Green): Anson Transport
08:13:01  <Stablean> V453000: Company 8 (Orange): Dom Transport
08:13:01  <Stablean> V453000: Company 9 (Brown): one Transport
08:13:03  <Stablean> V453000: Company 10 (White): Cargolux
08:13:03  <Stablean> V453000: Company 11 (Dark Blue): Sylf Transport
08:13:05  <V453000> what is he doing
08:14:35  <Stablean> <Diablo> hes blocking me from  expanding my drop, with a current max platform count of 3
08:15:23  <Stablean> <Diablo> but u should really c the situation in game
08:15:47  <V453000> I cant join atm I am at work
08:16:15  <Stablean> <Diablo> i also complained about 10 hrs ago
08:17:11  <V453000> well I was probably sleeping at that point :D
08:17:32  <V453000> how about you send me a screenshot and I judge the situation from that
08:17:52  <Stablean> <Diablo> probably, but i am like 16 hrs ahead of u
08:27:27  <Stablean> *** Dom joined the game
08:27:50  <Stablean> <Dom> hooray for team new zealand ;D
08:27:58  <Stablean> <Diablo> did we win?
08:28:00  <Stablean> *** Dom has joined company #8
08:28:04  <Stablean> <Dom> ?
08:28:22  <Stablean> <Dom> americas cup?
08:28:25  <Stablean> <Dom> rugby?
08:29:19  <Stablean> <Diablo> umm, lets go for all
08:29:25  <Stablean> <Dom> :D
08:29:26  <Stablean> <Diablo> lol
08:30:09  <Stablean> <Diablo> but yea, americas cup 2013 is sad for team nz
08:30:15  <Stablean> <Dom> why?
08:30:31  <Stablean> <Dom> havent watched at all this year xD
08:30:34  <Stablean> <Diablo> only 1 actual race out of 4
08:30:40  <Stablean> <Dom> oh
08:30:40  <Stablean> <Diablo> 3 solo races
08:33:17  <V453000> needs more cats
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09:23:50  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
09:26:02  <Stablean> <Cameron> my farm must be on crack...
09:31:15  <Stablean> *** Player has changed his/her name to KotH
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09:37:32  <Stablean> *** KotH has started a new company (#12)
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09:52:03  <Stablean> <Cameron> way you never use ships...
09:52:13  <Stablean> <Cameron> *why
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12:17:05  <Mazur> !rcon move 79 255
12:17:05  <Mazur> "Player", when you play in a company, use a proper nick, you can set one with !name yourname in the textbox
12:17:07  <Stablean> Mazur: ‎*** Player has joined spectators
12:18:11  <Stablean> *** Player has started a new company (#12)
12:18:31  <Mazur> !rcon move 79 255
12:18:31  <Mazur> "Player", when you play in a company, use a proper nick, you can set one with !name yourname in the textbox
12:18:37  <Stablean> Mazur: ‎*** Player has joined spectators
12:18:55  <Stablean> *** Player has started a new company (#13)
12:19:17  <Mazur> !rcon move 79 255
12:19:17  <Mazur> "Player", when you play in a company, use a proper nick, you can set one with !name yourname in the textbox
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15:39:20  <Stablean> <Mazur> Halo
15:39:22  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi
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15:44:40  <Stablean> <V453000> hy
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15:44:56  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi
15:46:11  <Mazur> lo
15:46:51  <Stablean> <V453000> Cameron I think superstrong makes no sense at all for this short trains, but :P
15:46:53  <Stablean> <V453000> steamers ftw
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20:16:30  <Stablean> <RTM> hi Diablo
20:16:40  <Stablean> <Diablo> hello
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20:18:26  <Stablean> <Diablo> RTM, can u plz look at my sign - !this area here!
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21:26:27  <Stablean> <Diablo> hi happy
21:26:34  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi diablo
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21:27:25  <Stablean> <RTM> hi Happy
21:27:35  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi rtm
21:39:22  <Stablean> <RTM> and i got going
21:39:24  <Stablean> <RTM> lol
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21:47:50  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> rtm
21:48:12  <Stablean> <RTM> yep
21:48:22  <Stablean> <Cameron> complete overkill, but I like it
21:48:38  <Stablean> <RTM> my network?
21:48:45  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> see   my  sign  say this
21:48:59  <Stablean> <V453000> hello
21:49:02  <Stablean> *** V453000 joined the game
21:49:05  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi v
21:49:09  <Stablean> <Cameron> my super strong engines for 3 tile long trains
21:49:20  <Stablean> <Diablo> hi v
21:50:36  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
21:50:55  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> thanks rtm
21:50:57  <Stablean> *** V453000 has joined spectators
21:51:05  <Stablean> <RTM> for
21:51:27  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> ar  no  rone  player
21:51:27  <Stablean> <Diablo> thx v
21:51:31  <Stablean> <V453000> yw
21:51:33  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> thanks  v
21:51:47  <Stablean> *** happy tran {} sport has joined spectators
21:51:56  <Stablean> <V453000> for the greater good and purr
21:52:12  <Stablean> *** happy tran {} sport has joined company #3
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21:54:32  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> eeny  way  good  night  alll    have a  good    time  playing   on  the  map  bb
21:55:06  <Stablean> <RTM> good night Happy
21:55:13  <Stablean> <V453000> RTM why do you use those semaphore signals :D
21:55:28  <Stablean> <Diablo> night happy
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21:55:51  <Stablean> <RTM> yep V
21:55:55  <Stablean> <V453000> btw Cameron I believe that jagging is not really a problem :P there are bigger issues
21:56:15  <Stablean> <V453000> there will be more versions and improvements later
21:56:29  <Stablean> <Anson> I'm home again :-) previously had chatted while having dinner in a restaurant ... the modern marvel of smartphones to use IRC everywhere :-)
21:57:27  <Stablean> <V453000> which is why I hope I wont find out how  to use irc on my phone :D
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21:58:01  <Stablean> <V453000> btw pricing of track transitions and upgrades cannot be set
21:58:03  <Stablean> <Dom> hi
21:58:07  <Stablean> <V453000> price of a track is  the cost
21:58:08  <Stablean> <V453000> hi
21:58:20  <Stablean> *** Dom has joined company #8
21:58:37  <Stablean> <Dom> growing towns is bad :(
21:59:00  <Stablean> <V453000> SyCity being a bitch :)
21:59:30  <Stablean> <V453000> I already removed it from my config so should be k now
21:59:33  <Stablean> <V453000> or well, since next games
22:00:04  <Stablean> <Anson> abit the costs : currently, a single tile costs : maglev 17k, unirail and purr  125k, and converting one unirail/purr to another unirail/purr costs the same as new maglev = 15k to 18k
22:00:38  <Stablean> <Cameron> upgraded to green purr ages ago
22:02:17  <Stablean> <Diablo> i also upgraded to purr - cost less than 0mil for the ebtire network
22:02:23  <Stablean> <Anson> the second thig i said about prices : i tried to make building signals, stations and depots free by using basecosts grf ... but it still cost at least 2$ :-) ... thus i asked whether "free" was only a name for the lowest price, parameter 8=normal, 7=half, 1 = 1/128 = "free(no costs)"
22:02:34  <Stablean> <Cameron> mine was 79 million when I did it
22:02:44  <Stablean> <V453000> you cant have 0 cost
22:03:02  <Stablean> <V453000> the cost is only multiplied, not reduced or added
22:03:05  <Stablean> <V453000> more or less
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22:04:35  <Stablean> <V453000> either way I dont know yet, might as well make it cheaper later on
22:04:41  <Stablean> <V453000> it doesnt really matter
22:05:11  <Stablean> <V453000> people wont understand the irrelevance of money in openttd anyway
22:06:01  <Stablean> <RTM> 44 k of upgrating into GREEN PURR
22:06:16  <Stablean> <V453000> you cant even say how much it is
22:06:22  <Stablean> <V453000> 1. inflation is on
22:06:24  <Stablean> <V453000> 2. currencies
22:06:30  <Stablean> <V453000> money doesnt matter at all
22:06:32  <Stablean> <RTM> 43.903.242
22:06:50  <Stablean> <Dom> money does matter
22:07:01  <Stablean> <Dom> especcialy when near bankruptcy
22:07:05  <Stablean> <V453000> yes basically nothing out of your ~1 600 000 000 RTM
22:07:11  <Stablean> <Cameron> I have 44 trillion dolars
22:07:18  <Stablean> <V453000> Dom being near bankruptcy is like rare :P
22:07:28  <Stablean> <Dom> u have 4 mill and loosing money :(
22:07:38  <Stablean> <V453000> well yeah cause you use dead towns
22:08:29  <Stablean> <Dom> they do not wanna grow
22:09:23  <Stablean> <V453000> ofc, sycity is somehow bugged
22:09:53  <Stablean> <V453000> do something else. :)
22:09:59  <Stablean> <Cameron> 78 trillion  to maintain 1 J-tech J-1 Roku...
22:10:01  <Stablean> <V453000> towns just wont work this game
22:10:22  <Stablean> <V453000> sure enjoy your aircraft :)
22:10:44  <Stablean> <Cameron> i will, it's collects dust for me :D
22:11:47  <Stablean> <RTM> v i like the green pur
22:12:38  <Stablean> <V453000> I like them all but probably prefer the yellow one
22:12:40  <Stablean> <Cameron> here it is
22:13:10  <Stablean> <Anson> just checked: i have 890 mil $ now ... upgrading my network from rail to maglev would cost 39 mil$, upgrading to any unirail/purr would cost 440 mil$, and upgrading from one unirail to another probably would be around 50 mil$, and that is a lot when i earn less than 20 mil per year only .... btw: raising a single dot/vertex of land costs 800 mil$ and raisong a single dot/vertex of water costs 512 mil$ at the moment ... c
22:13:37  <Stablean> <V453000> in future there will be parameter settings of more colours for the rails, idk which colours and how many yet but it probably wont be too high number, likely not exceeding 9
22:13:59  <Stablean> <V453000> or 10 if I replace the nuts universal rail as well
22:14:25  <Stablean> <V453000> other 5 are necessary for nuts, maximum of rails is 15 i think
22:14:43  <Stablean> <V453000> point is, 5 colours is already enough for most usages
22:14:49  <Stablean> <Cameron> that set me back 7.7 mil to move it there
22:15:15  <Stablean> <V453000> Anson: inflation is a nice tool to show you how dumb it is to talk about money :)
22:15:26  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
22:17:12  <Stablean> <V453000> either way, next efforts will be to improve how the rails look aka making them blend better into the terrain, and improving some details
22:19:18  <Stablean> <Anson> what i don't like about the original maglev, and also the purr: showing the unused connections (where more rails could be put down on a tile that already has some rails)
22:20:20  <Stablean> <Anson> the effect isn't too bad for colored purr, but i don'Ät like it for maglev, and for dark/light grey purr
22:20:44  <Stablean> <V453000> well maglev has it almost invisible
22:20:46  <Stablean> <V453000>
22:20:57  <Stablean> <V453000> but it looks dead clear for any colour to me
22:21:03  <Stablean> <V453000> yes, the white-ish a bit less
22:21:49  <Stablean> <Anson> i have "show reserved path: on", and the reserved paths on the green purr look identical to unbuilt rails
22:22:53  <Stablean> <Anson> not exactly identical, but just another shade of grey, a bit confusing ...
22:23:31  <Stablean> <V453000> somewhat
22:23:41  <Stablean> <V453000> but there is rather little to be done about that
22:23:51  <Stablean> <Anson> best seen next to my sign "shades of grey"
22:24:21  <Stablean> <V453000> I know exactly what you mean
22:24:28  <Stablean> <V453000> I personally do not use reserved track showing most of the time
22:24:38  <Stablean> <V453000> but yes, it is a thing to consider
22:25:26  <Stablean> <Anson> is that just your personal preference, or can't it be done differently, that unbuilt rails or just not shown at all ? like the normal rails, which don't have "shadow rails" for possible but yet unbuilt rails on the same tile ?
22:27:04  <Stablean> <V453000> I did try to make them look different and yes it is extremely hard to do
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22:27:26  <Stablean> <V453000> the path reserving is no a separate sprite, it is greyscale of the green "overlay"
22:27:56  <Stablean> <V453000> the only real option I have is to furtherly darken the junctions, which is rather ugly
22:28:14  <Stablean> <Anson> the reserved paths would be less confusing without the "shadow rails"
22:28:24  <Stablean> <V453000> or removing the unused rails from junctions entirely
22:29:03  <Stablean> <V453000> there are options.
22:29:17  <Stablean> <Anson> *my* taste would be to not show all those unused rails at all
22:29:51  <Stablean> *** RTM has joined spectators
22:30:16  <Stablean> <RTM> ok byb byb see you the night
22:30:34  <Stablean> <RTM> Good Bight everyone
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22:31:02  <Stablean> <Anson> btw: the maglev does it one way for some tiles, and another way for other tiles ... eg a crossing of two straight rails doesn't show the diagonal halftiles, but as soon as you have one halftile on it, all unused halftiles are shown too :-(
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22:32:41  <Stablean> <V453000> ofc that is how railtype is defined
22:32:42  <Stablean> <V453000> cand do much with that
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22:32:57  <Stablean> <Dom> can we have a new map`?
22:33:04  <Stablean> <V453000> sure make one
22:33:22  <Stablean> <Dom> :( put an old one up
22:34:36  <Stablean> <V453000> 2084 is early, start again
22:35:35  <Stablean> <Dom> ty xD
22:35:37  <Stablean> <Cameron> get out of your hole
22:36:03  <Stablean> <Anson> I'll get back to offline game: testing more grfs, which will work together and which would i like :-)
22:36:29  <Stablean> <Dom> ill go off aswell
22:36:31  <Stablean> <Dom> cya later
22:36:31  <Stablean> <Cameron> nuts, purr and firs...
22:36:37  <Stablean> *** Dom has left the game (leaving)
22:36:45  <Stablean> <V453000> my map creating guide pdf might help you
22:36:55  <Stablean> <Cameron> saw that
22:37:17  <Stablean> <Anson> i want some complications from the grfs, like ecs limits, but not too many different cargoes which all need each other for a good network
22:37:49  <Stablean> <Anson> firs is nice, but too complicated for most games here
22:38:31  <Stablean> <Cameron> i gave him 30mil, and he runs away... >.>
22:38:54  <Stablean> <Anson> i started testing ecs, but need to find a train grf for it ... or just use nuts which seems to work with everything :-)
22:39:16  <Stablean> <Cameron> nuts and NARS are good
22:39:30  <Stablean> <Cameron> or 2CC
22:40:06  <Stablean> <Anson> anyway, any new map should NOT have inflation :-)
22:41:16  <Stablean> <V453000> pleasae dont ever mention nuts, nars, and 2cc close together
22:41:26  <Stablean> <V453000> 2cc and NARS are functionally so dogshit that it isnt even nice
22:41:41  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
22:41:43  <Stablean> <V453000> ok, modern contestants like dutch train set or xussr are way beyond them
22:41:49  <Stablean> <Anson> cameron, look at "DEADLOCK with itself"
22:42:03  <Stablean> <Cameron> but they work, so thats important
22:42:14  <Stablean> <V453000> firs has economies btw
22:42:25  <Stablean> <V453000> there is "works" and "works terribly"
22:42:43  <Stablean> <Cameron> NARS is both
22:42:53  <Stablean> <V453000> having 300 engines and only 3 of them actually useful, is not "works" for me
22:42:56  <Stablean> <Cameron> it's just limited
22:44:10  <Stablean> <V453000> generally the logic of "Oh hey you are at the end of the game so lets give you 1 ultimate engine which is better than all others" is totally broken
22:44:16  <Stablean> <V453000> or more like, breaking the game
22:45:06  <Stablean> <Cameron> what about UKRS? same story thee I believe
22:46:05  <Stablean> <V453000> no, UKRS is (more or less accidentally) the only set which actually provides multiple train choices throughout all of the game
22:46:40  <Stablean> <V453000> at any point you can choose from like 2 or 3 trains which is well above all other sets
22:47:12  <Stablean> <V453000> talking about UKRS not UKRS2
22:47:47  <Stablean> <V453000> Pikka would probably have reasons that you "should" play it with expiring vehicles
22:48:05  <Stablean> <V453000> but does having worse engines in more modern years make sense?
22:48:20  <Stablean> <Cameron> no
22:48:46  <Stablean> <V453000> not to mention that his awesome logic of expiring vehicles also means that you dont have ANY (:DD) livestock wagons in e.g. years 1960-1980
22:48:57  <Stablean> <V453000> realistic reasons: "there was no livestock transportation in uk in these years"
22:49:03  <Stablean> <V453000> or something similar
22:49:10  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
22:50:00  <Stablean> <V453000> in short all sets are shit, play nuts :P
22:50:14  <Stablean> <Cameron> I guess...
22:50:52  <Stablean> <V453000> the main motivation I had for even making NUTS is that all other sets are worthless, or have serious issues (at least some issues in every set)
22:51:10  <Stablean> <Cameron> you could extend the set...
22:51:36  <Stablean> <V453000> how
22:51:38  <Stablean> <Cameron> airplanes, ships, RV's etc
22:51:46  <Stablean> <V453000> lol why
22:51:57  <Stablean> <Cameron> stupid, but it'd make a complete set
22:51:59  <Stablean> <V453000> btw you can do that just as much as me :)
22:52:03  <Stablean> <V453000> it wouldnt.
22:52:09  <Stablean> <V453000> it is a complete set now :)
22:52:16  <Stablean> <V453000> other vehicles are worthless
22:52:31  <Stablean> <Anson> what about a "minnuts" set, that has only small/weak wagons and engines, but can be used together with all other sets, so that it fills gaps in those sets, eg in case ecs or other new cargoes are needed ?
22:52:49  <Stablean> <Cameron> bonuses?
22:53:21  <Stablean> <V453000> and what gain would you get from the other combination Anson
22:53:24  <Stablean> <V453000> bonuses?
22:53:42  <Stablean> <Cameron> idk then...
22:53:44  <Stablean> <V453000> sure, draw and code the bonuses, I am waiting :)
22:54:04  <Stablean> <Cameron> matching planes, ships, RV's...
22:54:14  <Stablean> <V453000> for what
22:54:28  <Stablean> <V453000> planes are idiotic, you build 2 airports and send aircraft, done
22:54:35  <Stablean> <V453000> almost the same for ships
22:54:41  <Stablean> <V453000> and RVs are trivial too
22:54:55  <Stablean> <V453000> trains are in the end the only option, not to mention that I do not even use other vehicle types
22:55:14  <Stablean> <Cameron> ffor every train engine that comes out you have a plane/ship/RV that supplements it
22:55:29  <Stablean> <V453000> therefore it is 0% probability that I will ever intend to spend hundreds of hours to create other than train oriented newGRF
22:55:31  <Stablean> <Anson> i just tested ecs offline ... first used the ecs wood vector, built a few things to see how forests work, and then was stuck when there were no wagons for "wood products" ... that new set would only have minimal wagons/engines (worse than any other sets), but offer at least something when the other set has some "gaps" in cargoes etc
22:56:01  <Stablean> <Cameron> Firs and nuts it is then...
22:56:08  <Stablean> <Cameron> and purr
22:56:15  <Stablean> <V453000> Anson: still dont see any gains
22:56:33  <Stablean> <V453000> also, there are other newGRFs which do provide only wagons
22:57:20  <Stablean> <V453000> btw ecs is absolutely prohibited on this server
22:57:37  <Stablean> <V453000> it is totally unplayable
22:58:36  <Stablean> <Anson> why ? ... i only tested ecs wood until now, and have to retry it using nuts for wood products :-) ... don't know yet how much chaos there will be with adding more vectors
22:59:27  <Stablean> <Anson> but i guess, it would end up like firs when zusing all vectors, and not give the desired production limits when not using all of the vectors in the same game
23:00:15  <Stablean> <V453000> firs is completely different
23:00:21  <Stablean> <V453000> firs works, simply does
23:00:55  <Stablean> <V453000> ecs has various wtf limitations like stockpiling, but you can turn that off. Problem is that even if you do, more idiotic features like seasonal production still exist
23:02:18  <Stablean> <V453000> firs is ... strange, but changing often
23:02:48  <Stablean> <V453000> I think in general the problem of industry sets is that they try to innovate the game too much
23:03:03  <Stablean> <V453000> the way how production works in the original game is quite good and does not need much changing
23:03:30  <Stablean> <V453000> perhaps making the max production like half of the current 2295 would be a good idea
23:03:33  <Stablean> <V453000> but still
23:04:15  <Stablean> <V453000> supplies are a cute concept but I am unsure how should they work instead
23:05:50  <Stablean> <V453000> in total, I think there is one main thing which a feature - anything really - train set, industries, any newGRF, openttd feature - should do, is make the player want to find out more and use more of its functions
23:06:24  <Stablean> <V453000> e.g. FIRS has a few chains like ore-metal-supplies, oil-petrol-supplies which are pointless to step away from
23:06:46  <Stablean> <V453000> farms are so much pain for almost no gain that it isnt really rewarding to use them at all
23:07:37  <Stablean> <V453000> those are the hard parts of making a newGRF, but those have to happen by concept, and then adjustments with new versions
23:20:16  <Stablean> *** Anson has joined spectators
23:22:28  <Dom_> !gap 4 10
23:22:28  <Stablean> Dom_: You need 2 tunnels/bridges for trainlength 4 and gap 10.
23:23:56  <Stablean> <Anson> the concept of starting resources very low (16/32/64) and ending at 2000+ was nice for the original game, but when the main interest is to create networks, it should start higher (to avoid the artificial growth, like getting good ratings with statues, dirty tricks like delivering cargo with trucks to itself, whatever), and not end up at insanely high production which a smaller pickup can't handle and would create huge pi
23:25:38  <Stablean> <Anson> would be interesting to see whether cargodist and limited stockpiles could work together to make interesting networks :-)
23:26:24  <Stablean> *** Anson has joined company #7
23:26:30  <Stablean> <V453000> you cannot make interesting networks with cargodist
23:33:59  <Sylf> ugh.  we're beating that topic to death again?
23:36:40  <V453000> :>
23:36:56  <V453000> yes
23:44:52  <V453000> until it is dead, and then dead again
23:44:58  <Stablean> <Cameron> lol
23:46:45  <Stablean> <Cameron>  is it possible to get IS onto thses kinds of releases? instead of finding them
23:47:09  <Stablean> <Anson> IS ?
23:47:19  <Stablean> <Cameron> or having them as seperate installs
23:47:33  <Stablean> <Cameron> Infrasturcture sharing
23:47:48  <Stablean> <Cameron> you can run stuff on my netwroks
23:48:30  <Stablean> <V453000> well you probably can try to compile it but I doubt it will ever get to trunk
23:48:44  <Stablean> <Anson> i often thought about delivering resources as feeder to some other company ... but there are many problems :-(
23:48:50  <Stablean> <V453000> its development is dead and problematic, and its usage not really bringing anything new
23:48:56  <Stablean> <Cameron> i have no clue how to compile
23:48:59  <Stablean> <V453000> me neither
23:49:13  <Stablean> <V453000> still, if you want to cooperate with people just play in 1 company and done
23:49:19  <Stablean> <Cameron> it looked so promising
23:49:29  <Stablean> <Anson> if the people you are working with, are your friends, you can have one company (now even several sub-networks, marked with purr :-)
23:50:08  <Stablean> <V453000> promising, yes, but carries so many problems along that it isnt even nice
23:50:14  <Stablean> <V453000> and I dont mean coding problems
23:50:14  <Stablean> <Cameron> I guess, but that means...ugh whatever
23:50:24  <Stablean> <Anson> and if they are not your trusted friends, how can you protect them and/or yourself for misuse of features, ege by pulling produced goods, or by overflowing other stations
23:50:30  <Stablean> <V453000> e.g. you connect your network to network B
23:50:40  <Stablean> <V453000> player B can jam your network at any time just by sending too many trains
23:50:44  <Stablean> <V453000> player A isnt online
23:50:51  <Stablean> <V453000> player B cant even fix the network as he cannot edit it
23:50:53  <Stablean> <V453000> why
23:50:59  <Stablean> <V453000> what is that cooperation then
23:51:19  <Stablean> <V453000> its cute "he is responsible for his shit" but ...
23:51:29  <Stablean> <Cameron> ah
23:51:59  <Stablean> <V453000> and  the scenarios that can happen are more than plenty
23:52:14  <Stablean> <V453000> even connecting to the other network requires both players to be online
23:52:20  <Stablean> <V453000> perhaps not at the super same time, but somewhat
23:52:54  <Stablean> <V453000> but the worst part is, it does not really add anything new in compare to playing in one company
23:53:00  <Stablean> <V453000> only brings limitations
23:53:00  <Stablean> <Anson> the only part that MIGHT be useful: creating a special type of stations ("transfer stations"), which two players can use to exchange cargo in a defined way, but otherwise keep their companies clearly separete
23:53:30  <Stablean> <V453000> that makes some sense Anson but then how do you define what and how much cargo can they take
23:53:40  <Stablean> <V453000> new interaction settings? idk
23:53:55  <Stablean> <Cameron> supply and demand limiters?
23:54:15  <Stablean> <V453000> that sounds really strange
23:54:29  <Stablean> <V453000> and having to set it on all stations would be quite a pain, too
23:54:39  <Stablean> <V453000> not to mention that the numbers are rather relative as production increases
23:55:05  <Stablean> <V453000> simply allowing company X transfer and take would probably work, but then again - one company :)
23:55:52  <Stablean> <V453000> if all of the concept leads to unifying two companies, obviously the final goal is having one company
23:55:56  <Stablean> <V453000> is all I am saying :)
23:56:03  <Stablean> <Anson> i thought of the most simple version, like allowing other players to join stations ... then they could put up signs "take goods here", or "need wood here" :-)
23:56:53  <Stablean> <Anson> for anything more than that, people can merge the companies and work as team in the same one
23:58:03  <Stablean> <V453000> well yeah exactly

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