Log for #openttdcoop.stable on 5th August 2013:
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00:42:08  <Stablean> *** Gashernite joined the game
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01:15:36  <Stablean> <Slicey> hello
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04:38:10  <Stablean> <Dnz-Ali> hi
04:38:29  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Hi!
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04:42:10  <Stablean> <V453000> m00
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04:47:03  <V453000> yooo
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04:50:01  <V453000> :(
04:50:02  <V453000> .
04:50:02  <V453000> .
04:50:03  <V453000> .
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10:27:08  <Stablean> <Ringgeest11> Hey all
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10:48:17  <Stablean> <Mks> what train that is fast have the best acceleration?
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13:53:11  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> pauze
13:54:05  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> unpause
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13:55:56  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> status
13:57:30  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> start_ai LOL
13:59:25  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> `
14:00:31  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> autoclean_novehicles
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14:12:53  <Mks> mmm
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14:14:21  <Mks> !auto
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14:14:27  <Mks> !rcon set min_active_clients 1
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15:07:09  <Ringgeest11> Looking at the 'log' on the IRC chat I think it is time to change the map again. People are not hanging around
15:07:35  <Stablean> <Mks> probarbly true
15:08:09  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> yep anotherr map
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15:09:09  <Ringgeest11> Hopefully this time it is a map that allows for a coop company between me, Gash and Slicey ^^ We plannned it for this game but that was kinda out of the question due to the map
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15:24:11  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> A nwe map plase
15:24:51  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> a new map plase my computer is starting to go slow
15:26:41  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> admin a restart of the game on difrent  type
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15:42:55  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> a new map
15:44:05  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> admin a new type of map
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16:27:17  <Stablean> <[RO] RTM> admin a new map please
16:27:31  <Stablean> *** [RO] RTM has requested an admin. (Note: Admin will read back on irc, so please do already write down your request, no need to wait.)
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17:28:05  <Stablean> <Jam35> hi ht
17:28:09  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi jam
17:28:16  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> how things
17:28:19  <Stablean> <Jam35> how things
17:28:29  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> good
17:28:29  <Stablean> <Jam35> good
17:28:35  <Stablean> <Jam35> :)
17:28:53  <Stablean> *** happy tran {} sport has joined company #11
17:31:06  <Stablean> <Jam35> how's the network?
17:31:28  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> ok  i am  trying  to make  the ml 2 way
17:32:24  <Stablean> <Jam35> looks tight @ Pladworth Woods :)
17:33:23  <Stablean> <Jam35> just about 2 lines I reckon. no more! :)
17:33:41  <Stablean> <Jam35> might need to move to the other side of that puddle
17:33:51  <Stablean> <Jam35> by Pladworth
17:34:22  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> yep  all the  ml needs  redoing
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17:36:18  <Stablean> <Jam35> I might be able to help if you like, at least when the game starts running a bit faster :/
17:36:40  <Stablean> <Muel> hi
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17:36:44  <Stablean> <Jam35> was fine 2 minutes ago
17:36:44  <Stablean> <Jam35> hi Muel
17:37:03  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> yep  i need sume  help
17:37:21  <Stablean> <Jam35> give me 5 minutes...
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18:33:58  <Sylf> yo all
18:34:09  <Stablean> <Jam35> hi
18:34:16  <Stablean> <Maraxus> hi
18:34:25  <Sylf> Is it about time for a new map?  Anyone got a map we can use?
18:36:06  <Sylf> Same can be said about the PS too
18:36:47  <Ringgeest11> What are the specifications of a map? Any certain rules they need to adhere to?
18:38:21  <Sylf> none
18:38:59  <Sylf> but flat map with no water will lead to stupid style of building
18:39:36  <Sylf> cost mod is used to discourage planes, ships and terraforming, but those are optional too
18:40:07  <Sylf> having nice infrastructure grf is nice, but not needed either
18:50:10  <Ringgeest11> I see. So technically a randomly generated map would work too if the layout of the industries is fine and there some water to cross? Although I get trying to limit Airplanes, why limit ships when they could be an asset to a well oiled train network?
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18:52:25  <Stablean> <Jam35> Maraxus: are you able to assist Happy? taking a break for a minute
18:52:43  <Stablean> <Maraxus> I am
18:52:53  <Stablean> <Jam35> nice ty :)
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18:59:57  <Sylf> ringgeest, there are couple of reasons to discourage ships.
19:00:29  <Sylf> for one, building ship network gives players no challenge.
19:00:54  <Sylf> you can have challenging network building without oil rigs
19:01:14  <Sylf> we even use grfs to disable oil rigs
19:01:58  <Sylf> then there's the issue of ships' path finder being cpu resource intensive
19:03:11  <Sylf> and any company should refrain from crossing water too, and leave those continents to other players/teams
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19:04:35  <Ringgeest11> Fair enough on the CPU demands. That ship networks are not challenging is very true, but I was mostly thinking of simply hopping resources from one island to the other.
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19:05:27  <Ringgeest11> That other continents are for other players/companies is not really always possible. No offense, but the FIRS map a couple of games ago had several companies spread over the entire map regardless of the ocean in between
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19:06:00  <Ringgeest11> In reality, I personally enjoyed the cooperation between my company consisting of me and Gashernite and the company Slicey had set up
19:06:03  <V453000> then make a map which does not allow that :)
19:06:14  <V453000> you can easily cooperate in one company regardless of what map it is
19:06:23  <Ringgeest11> I do realise this is a case of personal preference and not everyone likes it though =)
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19:06:53  <V453000> no, how is it related to map
19:07:01  <Stablean> *** Phillip has joined spectators
19:07:01  <V453000> e.g. what stopped you to cooperate on this map
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19:07:13  <Ringgeest11> To be fair,  I found that hard to achieve in the current map. The islands are of such size a single man can handle them and exchaning between islands was absurdly difficult
19:07:56  <V453000> I think the space of many islands was way sufficient for many people to play on them :)
19:08:01  <Ringgeest11> As in terraforming costs, no ships and ofcourse the rule that everyone kept to his own island =)
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19:08:12  <V453000> of course, all that was intentional
19:08:29  <Ringgeest11> I understand that, not critising it in any shape or form
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19:08:47  <V453000> you can criticize it, no harm in that :)
19:09:01  <V453000> either way, if you want a couple of hints on how to make maps,
19:09:09  <Ringgeest11> Will give it a look, thanks
19:09:46  <V453000> might need a few more looks ;)
19:09:57  <Stablean> <Gashernite> how long we be on this map for?
19:10:07  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I'm thinking of redoing my entire network...
19:10:17  <Stablean> <Gashernite> not sure f it's worth it
19:10:32  <Ringgeest11> I will read it. Giving it a look means I will read it
19:10:48  <V453000> I have no clue but I am not going to make a map or do anything similar :) got my own stuff to do
19:10:58  <Ringgeest11> I will be AFK whilest reading your "article" or rahter small book V ^^
19:11:01  <Stablean> <Gashernite> haha, okay
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19:11:32  <Stablean> <Gashernite> V: I'm amazed at how much contributing you've done to the OTTD scene..
19:11:54  <Stablean> <Gashernite> makes my contribution back in 2005-06 look like a grain of sand >.<
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19:12:36  <V453000> all I can say is, never give up :P
19:12:42  <V453000> you can still catch up
19:12:54  <Stablean> <Gashernite> haha, not to sure about that
19:13:16  <Stablean> <Gashernite> although given I'll be studying coding at uni shortly, I may start up a ptach pack
19:13:22  <Stablean> <Gashernite> patch*
19:14:10  <V453000> patches are generally quite worthless tbh :)
19:14:38  <Stablean> <Gashernite> well there are things that I want to play with, that aren't in the game anymore...
19:14:48  <Stablean> <Gashernite> or rather, the patches aren't updated
19:18:19  <Stablean> <Gashernite> so... I transport has 2 stations on my island :/
19:22:06  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Omg have 20 trains in ONE depot for refiting.
19:22:09  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Thats not good.
19:22:12  <Stablean> <Gashernite> lol
19:22:38  <Stablean> <Gashernite> you think 3.5bln is enough to flatten the whole island?
19:23:58  <Sylf> no, but it's enough to get you kick/banned
19:24:22  <Stablean> <Gashernite> O.o why would it get me banned?
19:24:22  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Why?
19:24:45  <V453000> they can flatten their own islands in this game as they want :)
19:25:06  <Sylf> :/
19:25:10  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Omg so many trains in the depot.
19:26:00  <Stablean> <Gashernite> and I have no trains LD
19:26:02  <Stablean> <Gashernite> :D*
19:26:16  <Stablean> <Gashernite> except that last one /facepalm
19:27:19  <Sylf> I just don't like any large area being flattened, normally more space than needed
19:27:45  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Dont look at my island. :P
19:28:48  <Sylf> See if I'm even in the game
19:30:47  <Ringgeest11> V: Is there a way to show more options in my ingame Advanced options window? There are more in your screenshots and most of them don't appear in the actual game
19:32:00  <V453000> top of the window
19:32:14  <mks> I wouldn't mind a new  map
19:32:15  <V453000> note that settings might also have been changed since the article was written
19:32:30  <V453000> e.g. different settings are elsewhere than before
19:32:37  <mks> V do openttcoop still run a shared infrastructure server or is that patch not even used anymore?
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19:33:22  <Ringgeest11> V: Got it, thanks
19:33:28  <V453000> nobody uses that anymore mks
19:33:36  <mks> aww why not
19:33:40  <mks> I kinda of liked it
19:33:48  <V453000> playing in one comany is just superior in every single aspect
19:34:02  <mks> I know but not really the same thing
19:34:30  <V453000> indeed, IS is worse :)
19:34:46  <mks> well it was some intressting aspects when using IS
19:35:03  <V453000> and a ton of downsides
19:35:07  <mks> well true
19:35:09  <mks> but still
19:35:31  <V453000> if you cooperate with someone, and you send your trains to their network, what when their network start jamming because of your trains
19:35:32  <mks> you could make maps with premade MLs and junctions to connect to
19:35:42  <V453000> you cant solve it without joining their company (if you can)
19:35:53  <mks> true
19:35:54  <V453000> why really
19:36:03  <mks> well
19:36:05  <mks> why not
19:36:09  <V453000> why should someone not have access to the rest of infrastructure
19:36:26  <V453000> why not - because it is complication and uncomfortable, nothing else
19:36:32  <mks> for 1 some people would screw up the ML
19:36:35  <V453000> it does not provide anything new
19:36:45  <V453000> why should people screw up the ML
19:36:53  <mks> cause they don't know how to build?
19:37:00  <mks> probarbly not meaning to do so but
19:37:05  <V453000> why would you cooperate with people who you cant trust
19:37:07  <mks> might still cause it
19:37:20  <mks> I wouldn't :P
19:37:24  <V453000> any people can screw up the ML just by sending too many trains there
19:37:24  <mks> hence the IS
19:37:36  <mks> you can share portions of the network with people you don't trust
19:37:37  <V453000> or using wrong engine type, anything
19:37:38  <mks> well
19:37:54  <Stablean> <Gashernite> pineapples!
19:37:55  <mks> simply do a ml that can swallow any amount of trains
19:38:06  <Stablean> <Gashernite> oh really?
19:38:09  <V453000> no ML can swallow any amount of trains
19:38:12  <V453000> no ML. :)
19:38:13  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I'd have a go at clogging it :P
19:38:16  <mks> well true but
19:38:20  <V453000> no but
19:38:30  <Stablean> <Gashernite> fill it with 50kmh steamers :P
19:38:33  <mks> in most cases stable won't have enough trains to jam a good ml
19:38:39  <mks> if all trains use the same loco
19:38:54  <V453000> idk how you achieve that
19:38:55  <mks> like add a speed limit to the ml so only trains certain speed may enter it
19:39:05  <V453000> I always have a ton of trains and ML under capacity on stable
19:39:16  <V453000> you cant add a limit to the ML
19:39:27  <mks> well if you could :P
19:40:01  <mks> but coop are probarbly better still I found IS to be fun sometimes
19:42:05  <mks> V btw who are allowed to change the map on stable?
19:42:51  <V453000> anybody with rcon?
19:44:10  <mks> how do you change the basecost ?
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19:44:22  <mks> the parameters in game doesn't seem to do it?
19:44:32  <mks> like increase tf and short bridges and so on
19:44:55  <V453000> the parameters in the basecots mod newgrf.
19:45:40  <mks> well I checked the basecost mod 5 and it has no changes?
19:46:05  <mks> ohh sorry can't see them
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19:59:28  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Will we get a new map soon?
20:01:03  <Stablean> *** r1kkie has left the game (leaving)
20:01:20  <V453000> leaving in 2 minutes :)
20:05:37  <Ringgeest11> Well I am working on a new map, but that might take hours as it is a first time and need to think about a lot of things ^^
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20:11:34  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Damn my network is overloaded. :P
20:11:52  <Stablean> <Gashernite> Overloaded network = start again :P
20:11:58  <Stablean> <r1kkie> Kind of.
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20:14:29  <Ringgeest11> V; Hahaha xD I loved how you mentioned Dutch stations are too clean :P What do you mean by that?
20:16:51  <V453000> graphical style without any details
20:17:45  <Ringgeest11> Fair enough. They are like that in reallife too really
20:17:57  <Stablean> <Gashernite> lol
20:20:07  <V453000> doesnt mean you need to draw them like this :/
20:20:24  <Ringgeest11> lol. Well it is hard to think of details that don't excist though
20:20:46  <Ringgeest11> Agree that the NewGRF is fairly boring in terms of stations added.
20:21:08  <V453000> NUTS has everything which does not exist
20:21:11  <V453000> please tell me more :)
20:23:16  <Ringgeest11> I would like to argue there is a difference between remaking Dutch stations as a NewGRF and adding trains in which the name's title inclines it is unrealistic :P
20:23:38  <V453000> there isnt.
20:24:06  <V453000> in fact, the very idea of drawing "realistically" is as dumb as it could get, especially if you are unable to create details even though you have a lot of photos and ideas
20:25:13  <Ringgeest11> Dutch Stations are really bare though :\
20:25:24  <Ringgeest11> In the village I go to school there is a station
20:25:52  <Ringgeest11> it is very basic. Yet it is probably one of the more asthetically pleasing stations you will find
20:26:11  <V453000> irrelevant, the point of "not enough detail" is not just in "not enough stuff there" but mainly in using not enough colours
20:26:30  <V453000> colours, randomness in shades, ...
20:26:53  <Ringgeest11> Colours are extremely limited IRL too :\ As for the randomness of shades I dont know
20:26:59  <Ringgeest11> I never really used the station set
20:27:23  <V453000> the typical "mistake" most drawers (especially the worse ones) do is that they use e.g. 4 shades out of 8 available
20:27:37  <V453000> which makes their sprites look terribly flat and seemingly without anything to look at
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20:28:40  <Ringgeest11> Don't go talking bout using 4 shades out of 8 shades to me. To me it means exactly the same as say
20:28:46  <Ringgeest11> lemme think of something good...
20:28:56  <Stablean> <Gashernite> lol
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20:29:28  <Ringgeest11> Talking Chinees...
20:29:34  <Stablean> <Gashernite> yay, about 2-30% of my network is done...
20:29:36  <V453000> think about contrast
20:29:39  <Stablean> <Gashernite> 20-30%*
20:29:43  <Ringgeest11> A contrast
20:29:50  <V453000> if you use 4 shades from the middle of the spectrum, it will reduce contrast drastically
20:30:16  <V453000> nothing will look like it has shadow, nothing will look like it has reflections
20:32:02  <Ringgeest11> Well playing a game as OTTD one of my lesser worries is graphics though ;P
20:32:08  <Ringgeest11> But yes I can see why they ar eboring
20:32:18  <Stablean> *** Player has changed his/her name to asd
20:32:20  <Stablean> <asd> s
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20:32:28  <Ringgeest11> Aside from being very plain and... well, picked from details in general
20:32:36  <Stablean> <Big Meech> wooooooooooooooooooo
20:33:18  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi  big  meech
20:33:28  <Stablean> <Big Meech> yooo!
20:33:38  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> how  things
20:33:44  <Stablean> <asd> no one
20:33:54  <Stablean> <Big Meech> good!
20:34:28  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> fill  free  to  john   big  meech
20:34:51  <Stablean> <Big Meech> I did last night for a few :)
20:34:58  <Stablean> <Big Meech> but busy right now :D
20:35:02  <Stablean> <Gashernite> are you I transport?
20:35:13  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> ok
20:37:23  <Stablean> <Gashernite> KABOOOOM!!!!
20:38:46  <Stablean> <Big Meech> howd those crash xD
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20:39:10  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I dunno... but I have been having some minor issues with trains crashing for no reason :/
20:42:16  <Stablean> <Big Meech> nice work yellow
20:42:18  <Stablean> <Big Meech> :D
20:42:30  <Stablean> <Jam35> tf hell
20:42:36  <Stablean> <Jam35> or heaven :)
20:44:36  <Stablean> <V453000> yoo
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20:48:04  <Stablean> <Jam35> hi btw
20:48:22  <Ringgeest11> Hey V, would a mixed game of Cargo & PAX be interesting for the Welcome Server? I have FIRS planned, but to compensate with the passengers cities are x3 instead of x2. As a payoff the ratio of towns and cities is 1/5 instead of 1/4
20:48:40  <V453000> wtf is a mixed game of cargo and pax
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20:48:52  <V453000> and no cities above x1
20:49:10  <V453000> x2 max
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20:49:56  <Ringgeest11> You know, not just cargo focussed, but having passenger transport as a viable option too.
20:50:13  <V453000> anyone can do that in any game
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20:51:14  <Ringgeest11> it is less tempting as it requires a lot of care for the cities to grow properly.
20:51:27  <V453000> viable
20:51:43  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> thanks for  all  your  help  jam  it  looks  gtate  now
20:51:59  <Ringgeest11> Viable? Elaborate please
20:52:01  <Stablean> <Jam35> yw :)
20:52:04  <V453000> you just need to put a lot of effort into making the cities grow, which is the biggest reason why many people do not do passengers
20:52:58  <Ringgeest11> Exactly, that is my point. If from the start passengers would be a bit more attractive, they might want to use them as a side income instead of blatently ignoring all towns and cities
20:53:43  <Ringgeest11> Now even though the x3 multiplier is not ideal to resolve this, I think it will add another opening option in the early stages of the game and make late-game interesting in keeping PAX and Cargo seperated yet compatible with the network you have set yp
20:54:06  <V453000> it does not change anything, the only thing it does is that lazy people use the towns early, but do not grow them properly
20:54:18  <V453000> the biggest amount effort is needed later, not in the beginning
20:54:55  <Ringgeest11> Yes and no
20:55:16  <Ringgeest11> The thing is that people ignoring passengers and mail full out do not ever consider towns and cities and a source of income
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20:55:31  <Ringgeest11> Therefor their network will just go straight past them not leaving room for a potentional station in the future
20:55:34  <V453000> their problem because they are wrong
20:56:24  <Ringgeest11> I know passengers are a great source of income. I build tons of systems utulizing their pocket money as my income
20:56:46  <Ringgeest11> And because those people are wrong, why not try to give them a nudge to experiment with them a little?
20:57:05  <Ringgeest11> True that not all people end up trying to grow their city as they are lazy,
20:57:30  <Ringgeest11> however the people that come to realise the income they bring do want to make the city frow to attain even more
20:59:07  <V453000> ok, go ahead, but with every person joining the server, go tell them to read the rules, and follow them
20:59:26  <V453000> because the only thing you will get is a bunch of overgrown towns for no reason
21:00:40  <Ringgeest11> I will include a set of rules and the aim I had with that map in particular. Everything for a reason right ;)
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21:01:19  <Stablean> <Jam35> It's too easy to accumulate a pile of unspendable cash; amount of income doesn't interest some people
21:01:33  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I managed to spend almost 1bln :/
21:01:47  <Stablean> <Jam35> on pointless tf :P
21:02:09  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I still spent it L:P
21:02:15  <Ringgeest11> DMSM?
21:04:14  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport>    woo     r1kkie  have got  a  tran jam
21:04:28  <Stablean> <Jam35> yeah I see :D
21:04:47  <Stablean> <Jam35> freeze frame island :)
21:05:33  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> and   anson have a tran jam
21:07:02  <Jam35> !info
21:07:02  <Stablean> Jam35:
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21:21:52  <Ringgeest11> V; How do you increase the amount of water in maps nowadays? I doesn't show up as a seperate option for me.
21:22:13  <V453000> when generating map
21:22:25  <V453000> I recommend using High, or 50-55%
21:23:12  <Ringgeest11> But the problem is it doesnt show up as an option in my map generation option settings
21:23:24  <V453000> ok
21:24:48  <Ringgeest11> I get the random lakes/puddles of water, but nothing close to resembling an ocean or a sea
21:25:36  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I wouldn't mind massive inland lakes (100+ tiles across), but not oceans that divide land masses
21:26:54  <V453000> because?
21:27:08  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I don't like planes or ships...
21:28:00  <Ringgeest11> Do you know Age of Mythology and its Archipelago settings for a new map?
21:28:14  <Ringgeest11> I have something like that in mind, but lower the ocean level
21:28:14  <V453000> you wont have planes nor ships anyway
21:28:49  <Ringgeest11> so you have different pieces of vast land divided by large bodies of water but still reachable by mountain ridges that comes from the ocean
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21:32:48  <Stablean> <Jam35> bb
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21:33:00  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> bb
21:36:43  <Stablean> <Gashernite> well so far my network is making more sense :P
21:38:54  <Ringgeest11> So V... I can understand if I am starting to bother you, but I dont see any option anywhere I can manually increase the amount of water. Also dont see it in the Config file under game creation
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21:39:52  <V453000> it is directly in the generate map menu?
21:41:43  <Ringgeest11> Hold on
21:42:13  <Ringgeest11> You mean the new Game menu.. The creation menu that pops up?
21:42:53  <Ringgeest11> if not I do not see such a menu
21:42:53  <V453000> yes
21:43:04  <V453000> what :D
21:43:22  <V453000> how do you ... start a game then ? :D
21:43:24  <Ringgeest11> No I do not see anything that allows to increase the percentage of water on a map in that menu
21:43:58  <V453000> amount of water - custom?
21:44:25  <Ringgeest11> nope... Dont have it
21:45:09  <gnemonix> choose Sea Level = Custom
21:45:10  <Ringgeest11> Everything that has to do with water are the following options: Sea Level, Rivers and the Map Edges
21:45:23  <V453000> sea level is?
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21:45:46  <Stablean> <Gashernite> if the sea level is higher than the base level... can you have tunnels going under a lake or sea?
21:45:47  <Ringgeest11> Ah that is where it was hiding
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21:46:04  <V453000> oh god it has nothing to do with the height
21:46:14  <Stablean> <Gashernite> oh >.<
21:47:08  <Ringgeest11> Ghehe confusing options are a bitch ^^
21:47:23  <Stablean> <Gashernite> that would be cool though :P
21:49:27  <Ringgeest11> Kinda yeah :P Though you would need 5 tunnels per Line going under it if the oceans were of decent size XD
21:49:44  <Stablean> <Gashernite> at least 5 tunnels :P
21:50:38  <Stablean> *** Player has changed his/her name to OD
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21:54:19  <Ringgeest11> If I have a map I am satisfied with, how do I submit it properly?
21:54:41  <V453000> preferably upload it by dropbox
21:54:51  <V453000> but email at works too
21:55:04  <Ringgeest11> just the .sav?
21:55:23  <V453000> yes
21:55:55  <Ringgeest11> Gotcha. have a map you can have a look at.
21:57:57  <Stablean> <Big Meech> hi v453000
21:58:16  <V453000> hy
22:02:35  <V453000>
22:02:55  <V453000> it is here :)
22:03:07  <Ringgeest11>
22:03:08  <Webster> Title: Dropbox - Welcome Server Map Ringgeest11.sav (at
22:04:57  <Ringgeest11> Give it a look. I cannot say whether it is bad or good, but I would personally enjoy such a map with those intentions. Ofcourse everyone is entitled to their own opinion and may regard it as either complete junk or something marvelous =)
22:05:21  <Stablean> <Gashernite> no middle ground? :P
22:06:20  <Ringgeest11> Unnecesary. Landmass is enough and TF is not cheap, but not rediculously expensive either
22:06:34  <Ringgeest11> If you need more land the ocean can be raised, but at a serious cost
22:06:44  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I like that
22:07:23  <V453000> I can fix some things, but it would be nice if you generated the map again with at least settings of: 1. FIRS should Always have set parameter to 4 for maximum distance from coast for marine industries (how else you get to them without ships)
22:07:41  <V453000> 2. original roads as default for towns is best, 3x3 is boring and there are other reasons I wont explain atm
22:08:33  <Ringgeest11> Hmm That parameter of the maximum distance should be at 4... Let me check it again. For the towns, what about improved roads? Would that look nice?
22:08:49  <V453000> fishing grounds are in the middle of lakes so cant
22:09:04  <V453000> oh wait it is
22:09:05  <V453000> my bad
22:09:05  <Stablean> <Big Meech> i want to fish with boats dammit! :D
22:09:07  <V453000> sorry
22:09:35  <Ringgeest11> yeah, it was on 4, just checked
22:09:41  <Ringgeest11> no problem, mistakes are normal
22:09:49  <Stablean> <Big Meech> turn fancy boats on :D
22:09:54  <V453000> japanese landscape - JapanSet Landscape is a lot better, it does not use the colourful fields and better roads
22:10:05  <Ringgeest11> Anyway let's see the town settings and toy with those a little too
22:10:21  <Ringgeest11> You dont like the colourful fields?
22:10:37  <V453000> I do, most people dont :)
22:10:45  <V453000> why road costs are at 8x I dont get
22:11:17  <V453000> raise/lower land at x4 is completely insignificant, needs at least x24 or around there
22:11:28  <V453000> x32/64
22:11:49  <Stablean> *** Diablo joined the game
22:11:50  <V453000> water should be more expensive too
22:11:56  <Ringgeest11> You are allowed to build RV's, but by making roads cost x8 and the vehicle limit at 100 it is not something you want to use carelessly
22:12:19  <V453000> no, the vehicle limit is 10
22:12:41  <Stablean> <Gashernite> V: that station at the end of the line O.o IT'S HUGE!!!!
22:12:49  <mks> why increase road cost if you want people to do passengers considering towns shouldn't build roads on their own
22:12:58  <V453000> ^
22:13:03  <V453000> Gashernite: :)
22:13:04  <Ringgeest11> In the Adv. Settings mine says it is 100? And MKS fair point
22:13:13  <V453000> and I will change it to 10 on the server
22:13:32  <Stablean> <Gashernite> V: some of the stuff you build blows my mind!
22:13:34  <V453000> anyway, I have to say you did exceptionally good job, I like the map. Please just fix those things I mentioned and we are good to go
22:13:39  <Ringgeest11> Ah I see
22:13:42  <V453000> only some of it? :P
22:13:48  <Ringgeest11> lol
22:13:55  <Stablean> <Gashernite> maybe a bit more than just "some"
22:14:09  <Ringgeest11> Thanks V, will get on it and upload the new .sav in a couple of minutes
22:14:14  <Stablean> *** Mks joined the game
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22:15:01  <Stablean> <Gashernite> the maps that Coop Pro's use are made for them aren't they? like designed for insanity and such...
22:16:22  <V453000> and how would you design such a map
22:16:33  <Stablean> <Gashernite> no idea...
22:16:34  <V453000> of course some maps use specific settings, but nothing out of the ordinary
22:16:46  <Stablean> <Gashernite> so they're random maps? O.o
22:17:07  <Ringgeest11> I think all maps we play on are random maps
22:17:11  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I'm refering to the bunch of oil wells in a cluster...
22:17:21  <V453000> funding industries is an option too you know :)
22:17:25  <Stablean> <Gashernite> (from the EOTLS pic)
22:17:55  <Stablean> <Gashernite> I didn't know you guys used that setting, primary industries funded as secondary
22:18:17  <V453000> on public server basically never
22:18:29  <V453000> on pro zone in a better controlled environment, often
22:18:52  <Stablean> <Gashernite> fe
22:19:06  <Stablean> <V453000> quite :)
22:20:18  <Stablean> <Mks> ohh r1kkie got a nice jam
22:20:28  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> yep
22:23:10  <Ringgeest11> Here is Version 2. Same seed, yet slightly different layout it seems. Not too bad though to my liking.
22:23:28  <Ringgeest11> Costs have been modified as well as roadlayouts for towns.
22:23:42  <Ringgeest11> Towns are also a lot smaller now due to it. (3k to start with instead of 10)
22:23:43  <Ringgeest11>
22:23:44  <Webster> Title: Dropbox - Welcome Server Map Ringgeest11 V2.sav (at
22:23:58  <mks> still quite big towns if you ask me
22:24:00  <V453000> 3k is a lot already :)
22:24:06  <mks> I kinda of prefer start with smaller ones
22:24:09  <mks> like max 1k
22:24:23  <mks> even smaller might be better
22:25:01  <Stablean> <Gashernite> R1kkie, nice negative operating profit O.o
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22:25:34  <Ringgeest11> Slightly higher population cities was on purpose ;)
22:25:37  <Stablean> <Mks> considering almost all his trains are in a jam its no wonder
22:25:40  <V453000> btw, why shanghai maglev track set when you have the nice japanese tracks for shinkansen
22:25:47  <V453000> would be nice to keep those for a change
22:25:55  <V453000> I can remove those locally
22:26:00  <mks> shinkasen and maglev isn 't really the same thing tho
22:26:16  <V453000> shinkansen runs on maglev tracks.
22:26:17  <V453000> nuff sed
22:26:21  <mks> there is a maglev version of the shinkasen train tho not sure if those tracks are available as newgrf
22:26:38  <V453000> OH FUCK
22:26:39  <Ringgeest11> Tought they would add to eachother. I never used the both of them really and have not played enough yet to really know all the NewGRF's and their posibilities
22:26:53  <V453000> actually the 2.1a japanese train set needs parameters to set to make shinkansens on maglev
22:26:58  <V453000> please find the readme and adjust that
22:27:07  <V453000> it is absolutely necessary otherwise shinksansens are outright useless
22:27:15  <mks> how come?
22:27:23  <mks> its no good on normal rails?
22:27:36  <V453000> power calculation on monorail is a ton slower without adjusting tractive effort and power majorly
22:27:44  <mks> ahh
22:27:49  <V453000> -> shinksansens accelerate beyond terrible on monorail
22:27:58  <V453000> and point is you cant do anything with it as you cant add more engines
22:28:19  <mks> doesn't shinkasen use powered wagons?
22:28:23  <V453000> exactly
22:28:28  <V453000> but that is the same logic
22:28:29  <Ringgeest11> So I need to find the option of the train set to make Shinkansen go on Maglev?
22:28:37  <mks> can you make shinkasen run on normal rails`?
22:28:37  <V453000> you only set length of train, acceleration stays
22:28:41  <V453000> no
22:28:46  <V453000> Ringgeest11: yes
22:29:12  <V453000> I think it is the 1st parameter set to 4, but find the readme and check yourself :) there are more values to check for, like setting  the capacity to maximum and loading speed to longest
22:29:35  <V453000> especially if you intend to mix it with NUTS, it is necessary to do that
22:30:49  <Stablean> *** happy tran {} sport has joined company #11
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22:35:54  <Ringgeest11> I found the readme and I think it is Parameter 1 set to 4
22:36:09  <Ringgeest11> I am trying it out now and I get carts for the train, but not the engine
22:36:21  <Ringgeest11> Let me check the other railtypes too to be sure
22:37:26  <V453000> I have about 10 more minutes, then I am off to bed :)
22:37:33  <Ringgeest11> Nope they are all royally fucked
22:37:36  <Ringgeest11> yeah same for me
22:38:09  <Ringgeest11> Hold on I will try toying with the other parameters too for a minute
22:38:21  <Ringgeest11> if I dont figure this out now it will simply have to wait till tomorrow
22:38:37  <Ringgeest11> I dont know how many of you guys will be playing the coming 8-10 hours?
22:38:45  <V453000> Sylf will probably be online soonish, he could load the game for you too
22:39:09  <V453000> and yeah, not much activity will be going on today anymore
22:39:23  <V453000> when you are done and if you have nobody to send the map to, just send me an email
22:39:29  <V453000> I will have a look at it in the morning
22:40:55  <mks> I won't play on it today at least
22:40:58  <Ringgeest11> I dont think I will be able to figure this out though. From the Looks of it, none of the Parameters are messing with trains in general
22:41:26  <V453000> describe the issues in the mail and attach the save :) I will have a look in the morning
22:41:27  <V453000> gnight
22:41:36  <Ringgeest11> Will do, gn
22:41:43  <V453000> and, thanks for your patience and effort. I appreciate it
22:41:48  <Stablean> *** V453000 has left the game (leaving)
22:42:07  <V453000> now go read the blog, bastards :P
22:42:14  <Stablean> <Gashernite> haha
22:42:15  <Ringgeest11> lol
22:42:31  <Ringgeest11> Anyways, I am off too. cya tomorrow!
22:42:49  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> bb
22:44:07  <Stablean> *** King Peky joined the game
22:44:18  <Stablean> <King Peky> Hello
22:44:33  <V453000> hy
22:44:39  <Stablean> <Gashernite> hi
22:44:50  <Stablean> <Big Meech> yo
22:45:04  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> hi
22:46:02  <Stablean> <Gashernite> V: how big was that map?
22:48:26  <V453000> see the savegame?
22:48:52  <Stablean> <Gashernite> ahh, yep
22:49:08  <Stablean> <Gashernite> thought that was just a download link, not an info link
22:50:25  <Stablean> *** Kaludjer joined the game
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22:50:56  <V453000> it is a link, thus it is there for some reason :P
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22:51:08  <V453000> and teeth brushed, pet fed, gnight
22:51:18  <Stablean> *** Kaludjer has left the game (leaving)
22:51:27  <Stablean> <King Peky> GN :)
22:51:31  <Stablean> <Gashernite> g'night
22:51:37  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> gn
22:54:55  <Stablean> *** Mks has left the game (leaving)
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23:03:03  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> gn all   have fun   i hop i  dont  mice  the new map  bb
23:03:13  <Stablean> <Gashernite> okay, g'night
23:03:19  <Stablean> <happy tran  sport> have a good night
23:03:25  <Stablean> <Gashernite> morning :P
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