Config
Log for #openttd on 25th November 2014:
Times are UTC Toggle Colours
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05:57:46  <supermop> yo
05:58:43  <Taede> moin
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06:32:22  <supermop> whats going on
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06:34:54  <Supercheese> Thanksgiving vacation in the US
06:36:35  <supermop> i get to skip that here
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10:13:39  <__ln__> http://bad.solutions/
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10:23:25  <argoneus> ayy
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10:24:57  <__ln__> https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/iron-sky-the-coming-race--2
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12:01:27  <supermop> cant decide what country my etsy store should be in
12:01:38  <supermop> or if there is a better alternative
12:02:40  <V453000> wat
12:06:01  <Eddi|zuHause> i agree with V453000 (and when does that ever happen)
12:06:15  <V453000> YES
12:06:18  <V453000> I win
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12:07:24  <V453000> thesouthone
12:09:23  <andythenorth> moin
12:09:25  <andythenorth> also pikka
12:09:48  <andythenorth> hrm
12:09:59  <andythenorth> I keep forgetting to add these to Road Hog
12:09:59  <andythenorth> http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-GU25dgOY-rE/UJNID5xQ5ZI/AAAAAAACBYw/WdF071WZuHI/s900/a17.jpg
12:10:01  <andythenorth> oops
12:12:29  <Pikka> why
12:12:39  <Pikka> what about iron hog
12:15:05  <andythenorth> what is it?
12:15:09  <andythenorth> sounds good
12:15:58  <Pikka> maybe
12:16:17  <Pikka> if it's 32bpp4ez
12:16:20  <andythenorth> :(
12:16:27  <andythenorth> you and your big pixels
12:16:36  <andythenorth> also
12:17:04  <Pikka> also which?
12:17:46  <andythenorth> this will be a right bastard to draw in pixels
12:17:46  <V453000> big pixels are the future
12:17:46  <andythenorth> http://www.hankstruckpictures.com/pix/trucks/len_rogers/2007/02/erf-blue.jpg
12:17:59  <Pikka> tres erf
12:18:05  <Pikka> erf sounds like a made-up name
12:18:26  <andythenorth> it was
12:19:16  <andythenorth> renderised powder tanker?
12:19:25  <Eddi|zuHause> erf is the integral of the bell curve
12:19:58  <Pikka> such lifted axles, also
12:20:09  <andythenorth> hmm
12:20:10  <Pikka> renderised means "correct" dimensions though
12:20:16  <andythenorth> could code those lifted axles
12:20:25  <andythenorth> at 1x EZ, definitely worth it
12:20:29  <Pikka> si
12:20:39  <Pikka> just make a new 3dtt
12:20:48  <Pikka> call it something clever like drain fewer
12:20:52  <andythenorth> we should
12:20:56  <andythenorth> but I won’t
12:23:09  <Pikka> why not
12:23:14  <Pikka> not enough pixels in the day?
12:23:59  <Pikka> In my opinion, it is not a good feature to have too much refit options, because use of autorefit become unpredictable.
12:24:33  <andythenorth> oh
12:24:36  <andythenorth> feedback
12:24:37  <andythenorth> I see
12:25:04  <andythenorth> well
12:25:05  <andythenorth> yes
12:25:23  <andythenorth> I shall definitely go ahead and break the set
12:26:15  <andythenorth> why doesn’t it expire?
12:26:23  <andythenorth> I never bother with expire, so I didn’t test it
12:26:28  <andythenorth> probably I set ‘never expires'
12:26:35  <Pikka> seems likely
12:26:37  <andythenorth> oh because otherwise it’s broken
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14:23:14  <peter1138> http://bad.solutions/
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14:23:46  <argoneus> ayy
14:23:56  <argoneus> peter1138: where did you find this
14:24:01  <argoneus> someone linked it to me like 2 hours ago
14:24:05  <argoneus> are you guys friends or what
14:32:08  <peter1138> Oh sorry.
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14:33:57  <V453000> REPOST
14:33:59  <V453000> BURN HIM ALIVE
14:34:18  <V453000> THE INTERNET REVEALED THIS KNOWLEDGE TO ME ALREADY
14:35:09  <peter1138> Yeah, __ln__ already linked it. I'm gonna perish.
14:35:18  <V453000> absolutely
14:36:01  <argoneus> nono
14:36:03  <argoneus> I meant
14:36:08  <argoneus> someone in an unrelated channel
14:36:12  <argoneus> on an unrelated server
14:36:15  <argoneus> in an unrelated discussion
14:36:40  <argoneus> mildly interesting
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14:40:54  <Eddi|zuHause> that's what virality is about
14:41:04  <Eddi|zuHause> besides, it was already posted here earlier
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16:21:34  <DDR> Good morning, #openttd. :)
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16:27:44  <Alberth> moin
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16:36:00  <planetmaker> moin
16:37:33  <Alberth> o/
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16:50:05  <Nijske> hellow
16:50:10  <Nijske> dutch people here ?
16:50:20  <Jinassi> nnet
16:51:02  <Jinassi> anyone seen kamnet lately?
16:51:08  <Nijske> i need som help but my english is not so good
16:51:36  <Alberth> Jinassi: I have never seen him here, as far as I can remember
16:51:53  <Nijske> i am new on open ttd
16:52:03  <Jinassi> Alberth, thank you, he's harder to find than a midget hooker
16:52:08  <Alberth> Nijske: just try, we'll ask for clarification if things are not clear
16:52:17  <Nijske> ok thanks
16:52:21  <Alberth> Jinassi: PM on tt-forums?
16:52:37  <Nijske> i wont new industrie on my map
16:52:50  <Nijske> wat can i download best ?
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16:53:01  <Nijske> in newGRF
16:53:13  <Alberth> there are 3 choices
16:54:02  <Alberth> 1. ECS, quite old, has stock piling, factories have an upper limit on what they accept
16:54:29  <Alberth> 2. FIRS, has supplies to increase production
16:54:57  <Alberth> 3. YETI, has workers, haven't played with it recently
16:55:15  <Nijske> ow ok
16:55:35  <Nijske> 3 is the best then ?
16:55:55  <Alberth> different people have different ideas on "best"
16:56:05  <Nijske> ow ok
16:56:19  <Nijske> and for ech of tem have you trains ?
16:56:24  <Alberth> best solution is to try all of them for a few games, and see how you like them
16:56:58  <Jinassi> Probeer ze en zie welke je wilt. Elk heeft een aantal instellingen om mee te spelen ook.
16:56:59  <Alberth> YETI  is closely connected to the NUTS trainset
16:57:03  <Nijske> YETI is 1 download i see
16:57:11  <Alberth> a BIG one :D
16:57:24  <planetmaker> there generally is no 'best'. They're just different and cater different ways to play the game
16:57:44  <Nijske> ow ok
16:57:51  <Alberth> but you need a train newgrf if you play with industry sets
16:57:57  <planetmaker> you'll need to use train (and vehicle) sets in order to transport their cargos
16:58:01  <Nijske> but 1 download is good for yeti ?
16:58:17  <Alberth> almost any modern vehicle set will do
16:58:33  <planetmaker> all three sets can be obtained via ingame content download. Those are good, yes.
16:58:39  <planetmaker> As can train and road vehicle sets
16:58:52  <Nijske> yetieextendet towns&industry
16:59:19  <planetmaker> yes, that one. Can't exactly recommend one or the other trainset either... use what you like :)
16:59:52  <Alberth> if you like the standard trains, you can use the opengfx+trains
17:00:06  <Alberth> other nice sets are iron horse, or NUTS
17:00:17  <Nijske> ow ok
17:00:20  <planetmaker> or pineapple trains
17:00:28  <Alberth> if you want ships, I can recommend squid
17:00:37  <planetmaker> and planes via av9.8
17:01:19  <planetmaker> and vehicles... egrvts, ogfx+rv. And always add heqs
17:01:20  <Nijske> thanks fot the good help
17:01:47  <Alberth> you're welcome, if you have problems or questions, just drop in :)
17:02:28  <planetmaker> also, our forums at http://forum.openttd.org has many suggestions on newgrfs. As many views on the topic as it has members ;)
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17:04:26  <Nijske> I understand english but not good typing
17:06:34  <Alberth> we understand what you're saying, that's what counts
17:07:02  <Nijske> you are currently playing the game?
17:09:02  <Alberth> no, I am cooking dinner
17:09:17  <Alberth> and I don't play the game very often
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17:27:05  <Nijske> hmm i upload anther
17:27:27  <Nijske> 1
17:27:53  <Nijske> but i forgot  number 2
17:29:31  <Alberth> @logs
17:29:31  <DorpsGek> Alberth: http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd
17:29:37  <Jinassi> 1st ecs, 2nd firs, 3rd yeti
17:29:45  <Nijske> tanks
17:29:53  <Alberth> Nijske:  ^^ is the log of the channel, you can read everything back
17:30:06  <Nijske> ok
17:30:32  <Jinassi> nifty addition
17:30:38  <Alberth> when you play FIRS, be sure to select a basic economy, eg basic temperate
17:32:17  <Nijske> how do you mean?
17:33:02  <Alberth> after activating FIRS, go to its settings, and select a different economy, before starting a game
17:33:16  <Nijske> ow ok
17:33:34  <Alberth> the standard setting is for "full firs" and that is a LOT of industries, you'll get lost completely
17:34:09  <Alberth> the basic economy is much smaller and easier to understand
17:34:15  <Nijske> in the beginning it might be better just standard game play?
17:34:34  <Nijske> so as the initial companies
17:35:26  <Alberth> indeed, you get lost very quickly if you don't know any industry
17:35:34  <Alberth> keep it simple at first
17:36:10  <Nijske> got it a few years ago played
17:37:33  <Nijske> find the firs look best
17:37:51  <Nijske> Most companies also
17:38:53  <Alberth> if you don't change the economy, firs has a lot of industries indeed
17:39:16  <Alberth> don't forget to load a train newgrf as well, or you cannot transport the cargo
17:40:24  <Nijske> what should I load then?
17:41:03  <Alberth> any train set will do,  planet maker mentioned several of them
17:42:03  <Alberth> http://irclogs.qmsk.net/channels/openttd/link/1416934806#1416934806
17:43:21  <Alberth> iron horse  train set  and  termite track grf will probably work well, they are from the same author as firs
17:43:34  <Alberth> I haven't tried them yet
17:44:18  <Nijske> ow ok
17:44:58  <Nijske> i have load iron horde
17:45:17  <Nijske> is that enough?
17:45:25  <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27067 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2014-11-25 17:45:18 UTC)
17:45:26  <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:45:27  <DorpsGek> korean - 1 changes by telk5093
17:45:49  <Nijske> @dorpsgek dutch ? :D
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17:46:30  <Alberth> termite tracks  belong with iron horse, you should load them too
17:46:42  <Alberth> and yes, dorpsgek is a dutch fool :p
17:46:54  <Nijske> happened
17:46:59  <Nijske> nice :D
17:47:04  <Alberth> or 'idiot', probably
17:47:38  <Nijske> Have point 2 downloaded and then those two for trains
17:47:39  <Xaroth|Work> village idiot
17:48:00  <Nijske> then I start I suppose
17:48:12  * Nijske slaps DorpsGek around a bit with a large fishbot
17:48:22  <Nijske> oops
17:49:04  <Nijske> I must get away speak to you soon
17:49:17  <Alberth> bye, and have fun playing :)
17:49:21  <Nijske> thank you for the help
17:50:28  <Xaroth|Work> Alberth: you still working on rct?
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17:55:18  <Alberth> Xaroth|Work: yep, and others
17:55:33  <Alberth> working on queuing of guests
17:55:49  <Xaroth|Work> nice
17:56:03  <Alberth> last weekend, I got toilets to keep guests inside for  a while
17:56:14  <Alberth> and reject them when it's full
17:56:53  <Alberth> so now I should teach queuing paths to queue :p
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18:04:04  <Xaroth|Work> ghehe
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18:39:58  <Nijske> alberth ?
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18:40:17  <Alberth> what do you want to know?
18:40:48  <Nijske> I uploading number 2
18:41:04  <Alberth> but in general, it's much more effective to just burst in with your question, and ask it in general, more people know more than one :)
18:41:34  <Nijske> There you can also use the industry standard in?
18:42:21  <Alberth> what is "the industry standard" ?
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18:42:51  <Nijske> the industry that you have when you have nothing uploads
18:43:54  <Alberth> oh, you want to have both the default industries and firs at the same time?
18:44:01  <Alberth> no that's not possible
18:44:35  <Alberth> so far, all industry newgrfs replace the default industries  instead of adding to it
18:44:57  <Nijske> I always start in the desert but if your number 2 download you can do anything you like water can retrieve only
18:45:45  <Nijske> for any business you have nothing needed and there is too little money to earn something from the start: p
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18:46:16  <Alberth> a lot of people only play temperate climate, and not anything else
18:46:42  <Nijske> ow ok
18:46:44  <Alberth> firs has an economy for tropical if I remember correctly
18:47:22  <Nijske> ok thank you and sorry for disturbing
18:47:41  <Nijske> I try that way
18:48:04  <Alberth> if you try "Heart of Darkness" (the bottom entry)
18:48:14  <Alberth> that should work in tropical climate
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18:48:43  <Alberth> but I don't know if it handles water, I never play for pax
18:48:49  <Alberth> ha, the expert!
18:48:50  <Nijske> I do not understand
18:48:54  <Alberth> hi andy
18:48:56  <andythenorth> lo
18:49:09  <Alberth> Nijske has a problem with firs, can you help?
18:49:32  <Nijske> tropical is not the desert? you can choose from four climates
18:49:52  <Alberth> tropical is the 3rd one
18:50:23  <Nijske> yes
18:51:00  <Alberth> andythenorth: apparently firs doesn't have water supplies for tropical?
18:51:08  <Nijske> but if for example you can start immediately make a train ride with water
18:51:25  <andythenorth> FIRS doesn’t have water
18:51:32  <andythenorth> it substitutes something else
18:51:36  <andythenorth> dunno what
18:51:40  <andythenorth> town window will tell
18:51:53  <Nijske> but with that 2nd uploads have only factories where you need to make something for you can pick out something
18:52:42  <Eddi|zuHause> i think it was goods
18:53:08  <Nijske> goods ?
18:53:26  <Alberth> food and goods indeed
18:56:01  <Nijske> I'm testing it out
18:57:28  <Alberth> if you click on the name of a town you get a window describing what it needs
19:01:40  <Nijske> yes that I know but it's just something where factories produced when you make something so hard: D
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19:03:29  <Nijske> have found it XD thanks for your help
19:04:22  <Alberth> as I said, you are completely lost with the industries first :)
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19:07:40  <Nijske> maybe it is difficult to start with so immediately
19:08:11  <Nijske> have the uploads are equally removed
19:08:54  <Alberth> it's normal to get lost, just like you are playing for the first time again
19:09:22  <Alberth> just take it easy, one step at a time
19:09:49  <Nijske> is certainly well I play normal playstation: p
19:11:03  <Alberth> OpenTTD is a game that takes time to learn, especially if you add newgrf
19:12:47  <Nijske> Certainly, that is why I will start as the beginning
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19:38:43  <Wolf01> hai
19:38:55  <Alberth> hi
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20:12:54  <dreck> trying to find something from forum atm but thought I'll try ask here too..any of you know what openttd seem to be looking for when wanting a heightmap file?
20:13:37  <frosch123> a greyscale png file
20:14:53  <frosch123> though i think every png image works, and ottd converts it to greyscale
20:16:04  <dreck> hmm not sure if its just some odd setting but what happens is I go to Save Heightmap .. then immedately go to Load Heightmap and its not even there even although its in the same working directory
20:16:16  <dreck> wondering if its botching up something while saving it in first place
20:20:12  <dreck> (like is there any particular gui or cli setting I could check?)
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20:43:27  <andythenorth> hrm
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20:43:32  * andythenorth yak-shaving again
20:51:16  <dreck> AHA frosch I found what the problem had been the whole time and I think its a silly one in a weird way...
20:52:07  <dreck> somehow the heightmap appeared to use the Screenshot setting which is currently set to pcx .. and the dialog for heightmap save/load somehow can't  deal with anothing that isn't png
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20:55:01  <frosch123> yeah, it's on the list of settings to remove from the gui, so it cannot be messed up
20:55:27  <andythenorth> something in my partial compile makes grfs that openttd can’t use
20:55:30  <andythenorth> how interesting
20:55:52  <andythenorth> or Eandythenorth
20:55:55  <andythenorth> which is more plausible?
20:56:52  <dreck> frosch whats weird is why Screenshot would have anything to do with Heightmap
20:57:01  <dreck> the two should be separated for sure
20:57:37  <andythenorth> because reasons :)
20:57:58  <dreck> I temporately set it to png to make the heightmap function for now..will have to switch back to pcx when I'm done with the map creation
20:58:19  <dreck> andythenorth if its supposed to be there then at least make the heightmap code accept non-png files :P
20:58:27  <dreck> or separate it from Screenshot ;)
20:58:38  <andythenorth> yes
20:58:40  <andythenorth> reasons
20:58:43  <Alberth> don't use pcx
21:00:20  <dreck> Alberth tell that to the heightmap code
21:00:58  <Alberth> no need to, it already doesn't use anything else but png
21:01:32  <dreck> so why did it try to save as pcx even although it couldn't understand that?
21:03:06  <frosch123> why did you switch to pcx in the first place?
21:05:17  <dreck> frosch where did openttd said it was using pcx for heightmap?
21:05:20  <dreck> that'll answer your question
21:05:35  <frosch123> no, why did you set pcx for screenshots?
21:05:55  <Eddi|zuHause> why did we not remove pcx yet?
21:05:57  <dreck> and again..what does screenshot have to do with heightmap?
21:06:18  <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't seen a pcx in at least a decade
21:06:25  <frosch123> that's not the point. ottd only supports pcx because noone removed it
21:06:28  <frosch123> why are you using it?
21:06:31  <dreck> eddi well its still in use by many editors
21:06:49  <frosch123> are you on dos or something?
21:07:30  <dreck> nope
21:07:46  <frosch123> i have a drawing program in dosbox
21:07:54  <frosch123> something from 92, pcx was awesome
21:09:37  <frosch123> dreck: still, the plan is to remove the pcx setting from the gui. so i wonder why anyone would activate it
21:09:57  <dreck> because its much easier for me to use than going through some third party app to convert it over
21:10:40  <frosch123> you are saying you use something that supports pcx, but not png? :o
21:11:01  <dreck> it'll take png but not in as good colors
21:11:26  <frosch123> err, they are both lossless
21:11:29  <frosch123> there is no difference
21:13:34  <Eddi|zuHause> i feel like i'm watching one of these comedies where two people are talking about two completely different things
21:13:44  <Eddi|zuHause> and don't realize it
21:14:20  <planetmaker> hi hi
21:14:33  <frosch123> hai pm :)
21:15:50  <frosch123> oi, i wanted to ask pm something about post_build, but apparently pm already changed it :p
21:15:53  <planetmaker> lol, this pcx conversation is highly funny
21:16:12  <planetmaker> frosch123, yeah, I saw that you mentioned it. Thought I have a brief look
21:16:33  <planetmaker> the alternative build VM basically is not properly setup for py3. Thus I disabled it for nml... not used anyhow
21:17:15  <planetmaker> it was more challenging to install pillow for py3 on debian than I recall. Thus I postponed that
21:17:32  <andythenorth> dreck: to shortcut
21:17:39  <andythenorth> it’s only in pcx because reasons
21:17:48  <andythenorth> it’s not particularly by design
21:18:42  <planetmaker> oh, and the other thing was that indeed the c module wasn't built for the version CF used. But that was just a minor addition, too
21:19:02  <frosch123> yup, saw it
21:19:25  <frosch123> i wanted to link you to hg and ask, but then wondered why the second ssh was commented out
21:19:37  <frosch123> first i questioned my sanity from the other day, but then i checked for new commits :p
21:19:41  <andythenorth> eh?  my buy menu sprites are truncating
21:19:44  * andythenorth mumble mumble
21:19:47  <andythenorth> fixes
21:19:52  <dreck> heh
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21:36:05  <planetmaker> frosch123, can I document better how things work?
21:36:22  <planetmaker> I'm a bit uneasy if only I understand how things work :P
21:36:39  <planetmaker> and I didn't even manage to have ^Spike^ understand it either :P
21:36:58  <frosch123> i wanted to document how to install mingw inside wine, but didn't find a place where to add it :p
21:37:33  <planetmaker> :D
21:38:36  <planetmaker> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/home/wiki/DevZone_Administration might be a place to link a new page to that topic
21:38:56  <planetmaker> or from the main help page http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/home/wiki
21:39:16  <planetmaker> alternatively always the openttd wiki could hold such knowledge, too
21:42:23  <frosch123> well, if there would have been a single ssh in post_build (like it is now), i would probably have figured it out
21:42:47  <frosch123> but that there were two surprised me, since i couldn't remember to see them in action
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21:53:38  <dreck> andythenorth there any chance you could answer a quick question re a somewhat "annoyed" FIRS industry? :)
21:54:45  <andythenorth> what’s it annoyed about?
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21:56:05  <dreck> ah, just curious if its something specific I haven't thought of but is there any particular landscaping shape the Bulk Terminal requires?
21:56:10  <andythenorth> yes
21:56:11  <andythenorth> it’s borked
21:56:18  <dreck> I've been able to place the Port and Harbour but ... ehhh not this particular one
21:56:24  <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/7064
21:56:42  <dreck> ah I should had thought to check the dev list too..not just forum...doh...
21:56:43  * dreck looks
21:56:47  <andythenorth> hmm
21:56:55  <andythenorth> I thought I made a screenie recently
21:56:57  <andythenorth> maybe not
21:57:11  <andythenorth> anyway it only builds on SW-NE slopes afaict
21:57:27  <andythenorth> and you need a shape like —\_______/
21:57:40  <dreck> well there is "sorta" a screenshot in the docs/industry.html list but it doesn't really show the terrain underneath the building
21:58:00  <andythenorth> it’s a bug
21:58:02  <dreck> ah..so a bumpout shoreline? hmm let me try that and see if I figure it out
21:58:09  <andythenorth> it’s annoying
21:58:57  <dreck> oh oh I BUILT ONE! :->
21:59:30  <dreck> I just had it bumped out by one tile long and two tiles wide .. and was able to build it now :)
21:59:43  <dreck> cheers for the instruction above tho
22:01:31  <dreck> at least its a lot easier than some of these strange Tourist buildings (I think it was a ecs thing? been awhile that I can't recall) which required a specific shape of hill to build onto
22:03:21  <dreck> while you're here I just want to tell you one thing: I -love- HEQS
22:03:22  *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit []
22:03:22  <dreck> ;)
22:03:50  <dreck> I'll admit I've rarely used the "offroad" vehicles but even then I like the trucks and trams :)
22:05:27  <andythenorth> dreck: you could screenshot your successful build and post it to FIRS thread :P
22:05:31  <andythenorth> it keeps coming up
22:06:14  <dreck> heh well...I could maybe make a screenshot of my map when I'm done creating it :)
22:07:50  <dreck> the strange thing about FIRS is that the fishing ground reminds me of MB's original (or thats what I suspect) release of that a long time ago
22:08:25  <andythenorth> there are reasons
22:08:29  <andythenorth> for that too
22:08:43  <dreck> he had beer too didn't he?  :P
22:08:43  <andythenorth> only so many ways to skin that cat
22:08:46  * dreck gets drunk
22:08:53  <dreck> heh
22:09:22  *** Progman [~progman@p57A1905F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:09:24  <dreck> mind you I still use newstationsw once in a while even although I usually have the japan station loaded
22:21:57  * andythenorth -> bed
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22:22:13  <Wolf01> me too
22:22:17  <Wolf01> 'night
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22:29:26  <planetmaker> dreck, for a NewGRF author not an entire map screenshot is interesting, but nice screenshots which show their stuff in action
22:29:51  <planetmaker> which definitely needs no waiting "till finished"
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22:33:02  <Eddi|zuHause> i was never "finished" with a map...
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