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00:56:52 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 01:46:56 *** glx has quit IRC 03:19:06 *** APTX_ has joined #openttd 03:20:34 *** APTX has quit IRC 04:28:16 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 04:50:15 *** keoz has joined #openttd 05:32:29 *** Cubey has quit IRC 05:36:28 *** Progman has joined #openttd 05:51:28 *** orudge has quit IRC 05:51:31 *** orudge has joined #openttd 05:53:02 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 06:04:33 <andythenorth> o/ 06:10:18 *** Celestar1 has quit IRC 06:11:20 *** keoz has quit IRC 06:20:07 *** Celestar has joined #openttd 06:37:35 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 06:38:18 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 06:51:26 *** Progman has quit IRC 07:15:08 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 07:37:40 <V453000> sdf? 07:51:15 <andythenorth> V453000: iz 07:55:14 <V453000> really 07:55:21 <V453000> kind of monday 07:56:55 <andythenorth> Monday as AF 07:58:46 <LordAro> it is monday 07:58:49 <LordAro> my dudes 08:07:35 *** rellig has joined #openttd 08:42:58 <Alkel_U3> I like this particular monday so far 08:43:56 <andythenorth> mine contains more <br /> than I want 08:44:07 <andythenorth> and it’s nobody else’s job to fix them 08:51:48 *** JacobD88 has joined #openttd 09:03:14 <V453000> I'm getting wrecked by blender again :D 09:03:31 <andythenorth> for F? 09:03:37 <V453000> yez 09:03:59 <andythenorth> stop moonlighting on this F thing 09:04:04 <andythenorth> just because it pays you :P 09:04:22 <andythenorth> Yetis feel neglected 09:04:25 <V453000> xd 09:04:31 * andythenorth back to html 09:04:39 <peter1138> F? 09:05:50 <andythenorth> Factorio 09:06:01 <andythenorth> we need a back-to-work bot 09:06:15 <andythenorth> for certain hours of day :P 09:06:48 <crem> If I ever recommended Prison Architect, I've reconsidered it and revoking my recommendation. 09:07:03 <andythenorth> unless I make the websites to sell more stuff, I won’t be able to employ anyone else to make the websites :P 09:07:12 <V453000> stronk recommendation statement right there 09:08:18 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 09:09:29 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 09:10:05 <peter1138> I like this review 09:10:17 <peter1138> Not Recommended: 私は工場で働き、ここにはモンスターがないことを伝えます。 09:10:20 <Wolf01> o/ 09:11:33 <Wolf01> Ahah from factorio? 09:13:37 <peter1138> i usually look at reviews 09:13:48 <peter1138> then ignore them, buy the game, install it, then never play it. 09:13:57 <peter1138> stupid humble bundles 09:14:02 <Wolf01> ^ 09:15:27 <Wolf01> I follow also indiegala which used to gift games 2 times a week, now my library is full of those 0.99-1.99€ games which I'll never play 09:16:15 <peter1138> i think i had a couple of free games years ago but nothing since 09:17:46 <V453000> I usually ignore new games and just reinstall old games again :D 09:20:52 <__ln__> also, congratulations sweden for your 50 years + 1 day of right-hand side traffic 09:21:01 <__ln__> though i don't see any swedes around here 09:31:13 <Wolf01> Meh, I can't have friends in township... they use android/ios 09:31:51 <andythenorth> I have township on the mac 09:31:57 <andythenorth> kids play it, not me 09:32:01 <andythenorth> it’s cute, but eh 09:32:10 <Wolf01> Yes 09:37:34 *** JacobD88 has quit IRC 09:46:26 *** Celestar has quit IRC 09:52:52 *** mescalito has joined #openttd 09:57:57 *** Hiddenfunstuff has joined #openttd 09:59:17 *** Celestar has joined #openttd 10:11:47 <peter1138> it's 11:11. why am i starving? 10:12:02 <andythenorth> because you haven’t had manchego yet 10:12:12 <Wolf01> It's 12:12 here 10:12:27 <peter1138> that's it 10:12:28 <Wolf01> Lol -> [12:12:12] <Wolf01> It's 12:12 here 10:12:28 <peter1138> it's lunch time 10:12:59 <Wolf01> 1 hour 'til lunch 10:13:00 <__ln__> 13:13 here 10:13:24 <andythenorth> time just don’t stop 10:16:41 *** Celestar has quit IRC 10:27:03 *** Celestar has joined #openttd 10:31:06 <andythenorth> Wolf01: shall we try and fix NRT merge? o_O 10:31:30 <Wolf01> Let's try it 10:31:45 <Wolf01> Sync master first 10:32:50 <andythenorth> ok 10:33:00 <andythenorth> pushed that 10:33:45 <andythenorth> there’s one lang conflict 10:33:49 <andythenorth> one pathfinder 10:33:51 <andythenorth> one saveload 10:33:59 * andythenorth can’t read dutch 10:34:07 * andythenorth is scared of the other two :P 10:39:59 <Wolf01> "HEAD is now at bad0212" <- it's BAD! XD 10:40:42 *** Progman has joined #openttd 10:41:18 <Wolf01> Mmmh, it's still saying that it can't merge because uncommitted changes... no changes, already reset --hard and still the error 10:41:47 <__ln__> git on windows? 10:41:55 <Wolf01> Yes 10:42:40 <__ln__> try: echo '* binary' > .gitattributes ; git checkout . 10:44:19 <Wolf01> And? 10:46:03 <__ln__> that's it, problem solved if all went well 10:46:49 <Wolf01> binary' is not a valid attribute name: .gitattributes:1 10:48:02 <__ln__> odd 10:48:36 <Wolf01> Eh, echo echoes all 10:49:12 <Wolf01> Removed the ' and worked (I executed the commands one by onw) 10:49:15 <Wolf01> *one 10:49:45 <__ln__> err, no you don't want to remove the quotes, as we want a literal * in the file, not a list of files. 10:50:28 <Wolf01> I created the .gitattributes by hand 10:51:46 <__ln__> its contents should be "* binary" without the quotes 10:51:51 <Wolf01> Yes 10:52:02 <Wolf01> That's what I wrote in it 10:52:21 <Wolf01> echo 'stuff' > file writes 'stuff' into the file 10:54:43 <__ln__> indeed 10:54:45 <Wolf01> I can't understand the conflict diff... if only it tells me where it conflicts and not all the changes 10:59:00 <Wolf01> Oh found it, the file map didn't show the right colour for conflicts 11:00:35 <Wolf01> Stupid conflict... it's because it diffs between half of the top line and half of the bottom line, and the bottom line changed 11:01:20 <LordAro> there's usually a way you can tell it to not care so much 11:03:58 *** nekomaster has joined #openttd 11:04:04 <nekomaster> Hello everyone 11:07:09 <andythenorth> lo nekomaster 11:07:25 <nekomaster> I'm having a weird issue with my Belgian Train Set project :/ 11:07:33 <nekomaster> Nothing appears unless NuTracks is loaded 11:08:21 <andythenorth> railtypes eh 11:08:46 <nekomaster> I only have 4 wagons right now but the MU Wagons dont appear even though they're set for "RAIL" 11:09:12 <nekomaster> and I set MTRO type in the Railtypes.pnml to default to ELRL if no 3rd rail or metro track is available 11:14:19 <nekomaster> I never had this issue with my NARS Add-on set when I started making it with 2cc Trains code 11:14:34 <andythenorth> got an engine for the wagons? 11:14:41 <nekomaster> Not right now 11:17:37 <Wolf01> I think $friend will come soon to ask for a solution for the grf scanning problem 11:17:55 <nekomaster> GRF scanning problem? 11:18:24 <Wolf01> Yes, the scan ottd does at the start 11:18:34 <nekomaster> Yeah, and t heres an issue? 11:19:10 <Wolf01> Yes 11:19:28 <Wolf01> The game hangs on it 11:19:35 <Wolf01> No big grf 11:19:40 <Wolf01> It just hangs 11:19:47 <nekomaster> I duno if I've had that issue before 11:20:14 <nekomaster> On slower computers though it does seem to hang for me if it can't find a bunch of GRF's already setup in a Preset 11:22:01 <Wolf01> andythenorth: it was the easiest conflict merge I ever found... 11:22:25 <Wolf01> With tortoiseSVN it should have merged automatically 11:24:53 <V453000> automating 1 minute task for the last 1.5 hour 11:24:56 <V453000> efficiency 11:29:34 <Wolf01> Mmmh, something is broken in saveload 11:33:30 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 11:36:07 <Wolf01> Oh, that doesn't matter, even forcing the subtype it still throws the error 11:37:17 <Wolf01> A nice division by 0 when trying to create an electric spark effect 11:37:25 <andythenorth> :) 11:37:59 <Wolf01> I thought it was because the vehicle was of the wrong type 11:42:20 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 11:43:07 <Wolf01> Need frosch for fix 11:44:27 <nekomaster> Ok, so not only do the MU/Metro Wagons not appear without NuTracks, but my first steam engine doesnt appear at all (even though the compiler had no issues) 11:46:16 <nekomaster> I have no idea why nothing works 11:51:00 <Wolf01> I can't understand why a vehicle has 0 max speed 11:52:20 *** eekee has joined #openttd 11:52:36 <andythenorth> effect vehicles? 11:52:38 <andythenorth> don’t move? 11:54:39 <Wolf01> I think the roadsubtype compatibility is set wrong on load 11:55:40 <eekee> is there a way to have snow-capped mountains with temperate grass? 'smooth snow transition' grf claims to set arctic grass to temperate if you set a parameter, but it's unclear and setting the first parameter to '1' doesn't do it 11:56:12 <Wolf01> It puts temperate grass on arctic 11:56:16 <andythenorth> there is a grf for Alpine climate 11:56:26 <andythenorth> but it doesn’t work with lots of things 11:56:32 <andythenorth> lots / some 11:56:38 <nekomaster> OpenGFX landscape also has an alpine setting 11:56:44 <andythenorth> quite fun though, farms close in winter in Alpine 11:57:17 <eekee> oh nice :) 11:57:36 <nekomaster> you can also set the Snowline for winter and summer in OpenGFX 11:57:49 <nekomaster> I tend to have it set to the lowest it will go for Winter to simulate a Canadian winter 11:58:03 <nekomaster> during the Summer though only really tall stuff has snow 11:58:11 <nekomaster> Like the Rocky Mountains 11:58:39 <eekee> ohhh 11:58:59 <nekomaster> Also I'm still having an issue with my Steam engine not appearing at all 12:03:43 <eekee> i'm more tired than i thought -- i'm trying to debug my life, things are wierd at the mo, lol 12:05:40 <nekomaster> I have the Steam engine set for RAIL and Rail is defined in the railtypetable.pnml, but its not appearing ingame 12:05:59 <nekomaster> its suppose to appear in 1835 and its 2001 in game 12:06:54 <eekee> when is it supposed to disappear? 12:07:13 <nekomaster> 40 years after 1835, but I have "Vehicles never expire" on 12:07:30 <eekee> did you try the 'resetengines' command? 12:07:46 <nekomaster> yeah, I set the game to 1840 and nothing still 12:07:52 <eekee> ah :/ 12:08:07 <eekee> is the rail type case sensitive? 12:08:12 <nekomaster> yes 12:08:13 <nekomaster> RAIL 12:08:31 <nekomaster> RAIL refers to the original default RAIL 12:08:35 <eekee> ah cool 12:08:58 <eekee> i'm out of guesses 12:09:17 <nekomaster> This is something I imagine I'm going to need help from a NML Coder that knows how to code a trainset 12:09:33 <nekomaster> this never happened to me before like with my NARS Add-on Set 2cc 12:10:58 <eekee> wierd yeah 12:12:34 <andythenorth> nekomaster: got a railtype table in the grf? 12:12:39 <nekomaster> yes 12:12:40 * andythenorth just guessing stuff 12:12:44 <andythenorth> dunno 12:12:46 <nekomaster> it came with the 2cc Trains code 12:12:46 * andythenorth back to work 12:15:11 <V453000> br br br / 12:15:17 <V453000> <> 12:15:19 <nekomaster> what? 12:15:28 <V453000> slugs 12:16:23 <andythenorth> yes 12:16:42 <V453000> excellent 12:16:46 <V453000> easy agreement 12:16:46 <V453000> iz 12:17:30 <nekomaster> maybe someone can look at my code and see whats screwing up my Special wagons and my only Steam Engine 12:17:31 <nekomaster> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/poqdkt0ygi3fmci/AADvVyEyXU4tk7TIm3IlMgK6a?dl=0 12:33:04 *** tokai has joined #openttd 12:33:04 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 12:40:02 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 12:41:04 <Wolf01> Mmmh, why does VEH_ROAD has gcache.cache_max_speed in one point and gcache_cached_max_track_speed in another point? 12:41:57 <Wolf01> Both are instances of RoadVehicle 12:42:57 <peter1138> one is the vehicle's max speed and the other is tile-based max speed? 12:43:08 <Wolf01> Ok 12:43:10 <peter1138> guessing 12:43:25 <Wolf01> Could be, then the problem is in the tile and not in the vehicle 12:43:47 <Wolf01> But both show the right max speed 12:44:19 <Wolf01> And I get 0 when I need it as divisor 12:51:06 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 12:52:17 <Wolf01> Ahahah I disconnected an articulated tram 12:52:28 <V453000> nice 12:53:22 <Wolf01> Ok, I could guess what it happened, the second part of the tram has max speed of 0 but tried to create an electric spark effect 12:53:28 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 12:54:06 <Wolf01> Because setting the cached max speed didn't crash on effect but the rear part started to run faster than the front part 12:54:26 <Wolf01> So the front part recalculated the real max speed, the back part didn't 12:55:48 *** _maddy has joined #openttd 12:55:52 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 12:56:08 <_maddy> is it possible to change newgrf settings while game is already running? 12:56:19 <andythenorth> not reliably 12:56:28 <_maddy> tell me the unreliable way 12:57:01 <andythenorth> https://wiki.openttd.org/NewGRF_Debugging 12:57:14 <andythenorth> if you do that, you don’t get any support ;) 12:57:23 <andythenorth> also it *does* crash a lot 12:57:33 <Wolf01> Also, why if I disable "full detail" it still trying to create the spark effect? 12:57:37 <andythenorth> forums posters will say “I do it all the time and it’s fine" 12:57:47 <andythenorth> but I do it all the time, and I crash the game a lot 12:57:59 <andythenorth> Wolf01: full detail is just fences + animated blitter 12:58:10 <Wolf01> Also full animation 12:58:19 <andythenorth> ah, no they’re two separate things 12:58:23 <andythenorth> and I was wrong 12:58:35 <Wolf01> I disabled all and still get that stuff 12:58:51 <andythenorth> full detail is just fences no? 12:58:58 <andythenorth> and full animation is animated blitter 12:59:02 <andythenorth> docs will know :P 12:59:10 <Wolf01> Useless setting 12:59:32 <Wolf01> I'll move all the separate things to Extended transparency toolbar 12:59:36 <Wolf01> You do the icons 13:00:21 <andythenorth> full detail is daft 13:00:34 <andythenorth> full animation is very useful, at least while the blitter is still shafted 13:00:51 <Wolf01> Yes, that could stay 13:00:57 <_maddy> andythenorth: thanks, it seems to work, and didn't crash.. just needed to change one setting, I would have had to restart anyway otherwise 13:01:17 <andythenorth> Wolf01: the blitter might get fixed :P 13:01:17 <andythenorth> https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6469 13:01:57 <Wolf01> Nice 13:02:25 <V453000> I dare repeat the most glaring issue: gui switch between 8bpp and 32bpp 13:02:31 <Wolf01> Now... why the rear part doesn't get the right values is a mistery 13:03:09 * andythenorth considers starting a Patch Pack 13:03:11 <andythenorth> AndyPatch 13:04:22 <Wolf01> Yes 13:05:46 * Wolf01 goes out for a walk 13:34:01 <LordAro> andythenorth: AndyThePatch 13:34:57 <V453000> =D 13:35:01 <V453000> that's going to be horrible 13:36:29 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 13:44:47 <eekee> i've gone off 32bpp for ottd 13:44:55 <andythenorth> I never got on 13:44:58 <eekee> :) 13:45:48 <peter1138> we should remove it 13:46:03 <peter1138> and 2x/4x zoom 13:46:05 <andythenorth> you won’t though :) 13:46:14 <eekee> btw, can a grf add road types? i'm thinking of rough tracks suitable for tractors or, say, cattle droves, but not busses 13:46:17 <andythenorth> MinimalOpenTTD 13:46:24 <eekee> extra zoom is vital to me :D 13:47:20 <andythenorth> peter1138: I can’t convince anybody to do 1-in, 1-out on features :P 13:47:46 <V453000> if you remove x4 and 32bpp after I have been working on it for 4 years, there will be blood XD 13:47:56 <eekee> hahaha i'm sure 13:48:08 <V453000> and it might also save my sanity 13:48:53 <eekee> i kinda know the feeling. i've had to drop 90% of my coding ambitions for the sake of my sanity 13:50:30 <V453000> I cut down a lot and progress slower than I would like, but progress. And that's what's counts eventually :) 13:50:37 <eekee> yeah :) 13:51:12 <peter1138> i should revisit terrain generation 13:51:22 <eekee> could be fun ^.^ 13:51:23 <peter1138> make variety work properly f.e. 13:53:50 <andythenorth> peter1138: even :P http://bugs.openttd.org/task/6337 13:54:44 <eekee> nothing to do except sit & watch the sailing ships go by while i wait for the money to build up. i accidentally picked just the right starting conditions for a game in my very tired state lol 13:55:22 <peter1138> what year? 13:55:26 <eekee> 1850 13:55:35 <peter1138> nice 13:56:05 <eekee> ty 14:05:30 <V453000> that would be incredible peter1138 14:09:32 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:10:10 <andythenorth> :o 14:10:16 <andythenorth> why is Steam client so bad 14:11:31 <peter1138> they're too busy working on HL3 to fix it 14:15:46 <peter1138> like i'm too busy playing minecraft to fix ottd 14:20:08 <eekee> i've been thinking for weeks, i could start looking at ottd's code, but i'm too busy playing it :) 14:22:20 <peter1138> don't 14:22:25 <peter1138> you'll stop enjoying it 14:23:47 <andythenorth> errr 14:24:00 <andythenorth> why does Steam want to register with assistive devices control? 14:24:49 * andythenorth gives up 14:26:30 <eekee> peter1138: :) 14:30:48 <peter1138> andythenorth, maybe big picture mode 14:31:02 <andythenorth> it started crashing 14:31:15 <andythenorth> I don’t want to play Euro Truck Simulator enough to figure that out :P 14:33:25 <peter1138> ETS2 is better 14:36:46 <andythenorth> actually that’s what I was trying 14:36:47 <andythenorth> crashy 14:36:53 <andythenorth> ETS 1 is a bit fuzzy 14:43:10 <Alkel_U3> \Want to drive a truck? No better game than Big Rigs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6DtVHqyYts 14:44:53 <crem> If only you could drive a truck in openttd... 14:45:05 <peter1138> 50 second intro... what is this 14:47:18 <V453000> omg not this retard again 14:50:40 <Alkel_U3> I hope that was addressing A. V. Nerd and not me :P 14:52:23 <eekee> erf... how do you keep a town sweet without any road vehicles? just pick up any cargo within its area? 14:53:07 *** Cadadadry has joined #openttd 14:53:13 *** nekomaster has left #openttd 14:53:18 <Cadadadry> hi folks 14:54:04 <Alkel_U3> iirc you need 5 active stations of any kind for maximum positive effect on the city 14:54:07 <Alkel_U3> hello 14:54:25 <Cadadadry> wishing to try and play cooperation, who's in ? 14:55:07 <eekee> Alkel_U3: interesting, ty 14:55:48 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 14:56:36 <Cadadadry> Are you guys always playing solo, or not playing any more ? 14:57:09 <Alkel_U3> eekee: that's off the top of my had, mind you. Last time I used information like that was when I played on Luukland servers and that is a few years ago and I don't guarantee it to be correct :-) 14:57:36 <peter1138> i liked playing casual coop 14:58:01 <Alkel_U3> yeah, but solo is less time restricted :-) 14:58:16 <eekee> Alkel_U3: ok :D i just want to build something to pick up my rating after i destroy all the trees lol. i built 2 1x1 train stations 14:58:22 <eekee> i'm a soloist 14:58:31 <Cadadadry> sure, but rewarding less pleasure too AFAIK 14:58:40 <peter1138> build something before your destroy them ;p 14:59:23 <Alkel_U3> eekee: I hope you have a newgrf stations with wooden platforms so you can reuse those poor trees :P 14:59:34 <eekee> :D 14:59:48 <eekee> i have actually, but the towns don't care lol 15:00:12 <eekee> peter1138: that's what i do. usually build bus or tram 15:00:25 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 15:04:43 <Cadadadry> Where can I find a list of newgrf compatible with each other ? 15:05:17 <Cadadadry> or a list of unusual not compatible newgrf's ? 15:05:38 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 15:05:38 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 15:05:47 <andythenorth> Cadadadry: there’s no list like that 15:05:51 <Alberth> o/ 15:05:52 <andythenorth> there is a nice list in Wiki 15:05:55 <andythenorth> lo Alberth 15:06:17 <andythenorth> https://wiki.openttd.org/NewGRF_List 15:06:26 <Cadadadry> cheers andy :) 15:07:20 <andythenorth> broadly, compatibility only arises for 15:07:28 <andythenorth> (1) old grfs that do things in outdated ways 15:07:36 <andythenorth> (2) industry grfs 15:07:41 <andythenorth> (3) house grfs 15:08:04 <andythenorth> most vehicle sets compatibility is zero problem 15:08:24 <andythenorth> although you might need to match up railtypes grfs with train grfs 15:08:28 <Alberth> except for artistic clashes :p 15:08:33 <andythenorth> [shrug] 15:08:38 <andythenorth> look at all my terrible fonts :) 15:08:43 <andythenorth> :P 15:08:54 <andythenorth> newgrf is pretty similar to fonts 15:09:57 <eekee> firs will tell you if a grf clashes with it 15:10:05 <eekee> not many do 15:10:07 <Alberth> often :) 15:10:31 <Cadadadry> what is firs ? 15:11:01 <andythenorth> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/LATEST/docs/html/get_started.html 15:11:46 <Alberth> oh dear :) 15:11:54 <Cadadadry> I've been DLing a lot of newgrf's a few days ago, selected all starting with "UK" and played a game that way... But I'm wondering what I can choose next to add...? 15:12:13 <andythenorth> so many choices :) 15:12:50 <Alberth> start with a few, so you can better understand what each grf does 15:13:30 <V453000> download 65 of them and file a bug report 15:13:37 <eekee> firs is firs industry replacement set. gives quite a different feel to the game 15:13:44 <V453000> specifically mention andythenorth and everything being his fault 15:13:45 <Cadadadry> just added tramways and buffers last night... Waiting for the year (?) to see tramways getting available... 15:13:46 <V453000> win prizes 15:13:53 <Alberth> :O 15:14:11 <eekee> Cadadadry: did you add a tram grf too? 15:14:32 <Cadadadry> I guess so, I can check if you want 15:15:05 <Cadadadry> btw I always start game in 1830 :D 15:15:08 <crem> Btw is there a pigeon newgrf for mail transport? 15:15:08 <andythenorth> such trams http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/road-hog/releases/LATEST/docs/html/road_vehicles.html 15:15:18 <Cadadadry> lol 15:15:36 <eekee> hehe crem! i think one could be made 15:15:40 <Cadadadry> I know one pigeon named "e_" 15:16:12 <crem> Maybe if you treat them as airplanes which need airport... 15:16:24 <crem> then it should be easy 15:16:36 <eekee> crem: oh yeah 15:17:20 <Alberth> default airports exist from 1960 :) 15:17:26 <Cadadadry> thx andy :) 15:19:14 <eekee> i mostly like egrvts, but its biggest passenger trams get too small and too slow-loading late in the game. i've taken to loading an old 2cc tram set and 'long vehicles v4 (2008)' 15:22:16 <_dp_> eekee, Alkel_U3, 5 stations limit is for town growth, for authority rating it's the more the merrier 15:22:34 <_dp_> on btpro people sometimes do like 20+ stations to get rating to 1000 rly fast 15:22:41 <eekee> _dp_: sweet, thanks! 15:23:32 <_dp_> eekee, just keep in mind they have to be active stations (1 load/unload in 50 days), inactive ones hurt rating 15:24:11 <_dp_> small towns sometimes don't provide enough passengers to sustain 20 active stations 15:24:13 <eekee> _dp_: yeah, i saw inactive ones hurt rating 15:24:22 <eekee> hehehe indeed not 15:24:50 <Alkel_U3> _dp_: interesting, I didn't know that was different 15:24:56 <eekee> 'the more the merrier' explains why i can't seem to do wrong by big towns 15:26:32 <Alkel_U3> "sure you can reshape the city center's hill into a crater so long as you keep those 100+ tram stops" :-) 15:27:17 <_dp_> Alkel_U3, and you don't even need those stops if you want to reshape it into a forest :p 15:27:45 <Alkel_U3> _dp_: forest is not usually the goal in TT :P 15:27:57 <eekee> Alkel_U3: ahahhaha yeah 15:28:17 <eekee> oh yeah coz planting trees helps 15:28:42 <_dp_> Alkel_U3, I'm starting to doubt that looking at authorities behavior in openttd 15:28:45 <Alkel_U3> I bet if people could they'd just put concrete slabs on every tile possible :D 15:29:24 <Alkel_U3> yeah, but that's only a tool to allow more destruction 15:29:27 <eekee> i wouldn't 15:34:31 <peter1138> TLS in Linux kernel 4.13. What could go wrong? 15:39:03 <milek7> nothing? 15:40:04 <peter1138> probably 15:43:53 <eekee> already i've had linux and freebsd start acting up after visiting web pages with microsoft adverts -- not joking 15:44:19 <andythenorth> get some tinfoil :) 15:44:22 <andythenorth> that will help 15:44:40 <eekee> i'm not messing about 15:45:55 <andythenorth> it’s a nice trolling attempt :) 15:46:02 <andythenorth> well played 15:48:00 <eekee> you're the one who's trolling. i tried believing all this sort of talk was just paranoia, but there's just way too much evidence for all the major corporations in computing just being incredibly nasty by normal standards. 15:48:23 <andythenorth> ok let’s take the claim seriously 15:48:32 <andythenorth> 1. do you have Flash player enabled? 15:49:51 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 15:51:33 <eekee> on freebsd, no, but given the rotten quality of web standards and sloppy attitude toward security considerations ("progress" trumps security every time), whether or not flash is installed is hardly relevant any more 15:52:04 <andythenorth> do you work in the industry? 15:52:24 <eekee> associated with some who do, and who take quality seriously, for a long time 15:52:25 <andythenorth> coding something like the network stack, browsers, or web software? 15:54:41 <_dp_> andythenorth, are you trying to say there is no way to hack a browser or what? :p 15:55:08 <andythenorth> I’m trying to connect ‘microsoft adverts’ with ‘linux and freebsd start acting up’ 15:55:18 <andythenorth> there are so many potential vectors 15:55:28 <andythenorth> but are many of them plausible? 15:55:43 <eekee> one of my friends is a kernel dev, another worked his way up through sysadmin jobs (including web shops) to administer some of the top supercomputers in the world, 15:56:00 <eekee> another works in telecom but 15-20 years ago he was the bad guy and he says he knew nothing at the time; just downloaded stuff and got into linux kernels everywhere lol 15:56:20 <eekee> sounds like he was an amateur but i didn't want to ask too much 15:56:57 <_dp_> andythenorth, well, techically it is possible to write an virus that infects via ads and does bad stuff to system 15:57:02 <andythenorth> yes 15:57:13 <_dp_> andythenorth, how plausible is it that's a different question 15:57:15 <andythenorth> well, usually malware, not virus 15:57:26 <eekee> ayup, malware 15:57:53 <andythenorth> if these microsoft ads included ‘download a binary and put in your sudo password' 15:57:58 <andythenorth> then I can believe it 15:58:05 <eekee> lol no 15:59:44 <eekee> it was primarily the graphics of my linux & freebsd machines which was affected; it got very slow for no clear reason. doesn't the web now include pretty-much direct access to load shader programs? 16:00:24 <andythenorth> webgl or so? 16:00:29 <eekee> yeah 16:00:33 <andythenorth> DoS your machine? 16:00:34 <eekee> microsoft's motive here would be just to make competing 'desktop' systems look bad 16:00:35 <andythenorth> plausible 16:00:53 <andythenorth> was it Firefox? 16:00:56 <eekee> yeah 16:01:10 <andythenorth> [shrug] 16:01:12 <andythenorth> hi Firefox 16:01:15 <andythenorth> bye bye memory 16:01:19 <_dp_> hm, and now my machine got slow too... 16:01:20 <eekee> hehe 16:01:23 <_dp_> definitely a virus :p 16:01:24 <andythenorth> Firefox will sit and spin my fans all day long 16:01:40 <andythenorth> just from being logged into Twitter in a single window 16:01:47 <andythenorth> [shrug] 16:01:51 <eekee> oh twitter is nasty! 16:01:59 <eekee> i mean because they're stupid 16:02:04 <andythenorth> in fact, OpenTTD Coop devzone will drain my battery if I leave it in a tab 16:02:06 <andythenorth> so eh 16:02:15 <andythenorth> must be evil 16:02:58 <eekee> they tried to push loads of stuff into the browser after slowing down their servers with loads of ruby nonsense 16:03:43 * andythenorth is glad to have a nice armchair 16:03:46 <andythenorth> for this expertise 16:03:50 <eekee> :D 16:04:00 <_dp_> didn't twitter go back to server-side rendering already? 16:04:16 <eekee> maybe, it did seem to get faster a few months ago 16:04:22 <_dp_> that's probably not how is it called but whatever :p 16:04:36 <eekee> maybe more than a few months, i got fed up with keeping up 16:04:38 <andythenorth> _dp_: I think their single-page app fell down in a pile of client performance problems 16:04:39 <_dp_> nah, it was more like few years ago 16:04:42 <andythenorth> but I’m only guessing 16:04:53 <andythenorth> they probably made a video or something 16:05:23 <_dp_> yeah I remember seeing a post about it 16:05:28 <eekee> i know they implemented avatars as web fonts. ?.? 16:07:10 <eekee> computing's one big stinking pile of underhandedness and "what could go wrong", as far as i'm concerned. openttd lol is about the sanest software i interact with any more 16:07:59 <eekee> i even went over to the dark side; got win10 put on my pc lol 16:08:06 *** NGC3982 has joined #openttd 16:08:59 <eekee> oh there's plan 9 too, that's from another planet, but i don't use it much any more 16:09:25 * _dp_ rly hope openttd isn't the sanest software on my pc :p 16:10:22 <eekee> hahaha 16:13:11 <eekee> it's a game, and a free one at that, but i think it's had a lot more sense and understanding put into it than... certainly any free tablet game 16:13:20 <andythenorth> I dispute that 16:13:22 <andythenorth> I’ve read the code 16:13:40 * andythenorth bbl 16:13:49 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 16:15:54 *** smoke_fumus has joined #openttd 16:17:03 <eekee> i'm still impressed by multiple viewports; it seems nobody even bothers implementing anything half as smart as that any more. also adjusting something in one window and seeing it change in others; that's like, come & gone. 16:17:45 <eekee> not that there's much call for these on small tablet screens 16:18:59 <_dp_> idk multiple viewports seem pretty useless to me 16:19:07 <_dp_> except mb for watching multiple companies 16:19:25 <_dp_> but that's not even in vanilla 16:21:03 <eekee> oh i mean the vehicle windows & everything. the other day i was placing signs in the newspaper popups; all the views just work the same! 16:23:06 <eekee> i was also using industry windows for oil rigs to add ships as needed while working on something else. kinda got a bit hectic though. 16:29:49 <Alberth> it also fails every now and then, getting newspapers about "First train arrives Foo station", and seeing a train driving on regular tracks 16:30:21 <Wolf01> <eekee> btw, can a grf add road types? i'm thinking of rough tracks suitable for tractors or, say, cattle droves, but not busses <- sorry for the delay: yes, a grf could add road types, but we must remove shiops and canals 16:30:35 <Wolf01> Ships too 16:31:00 <eekee> ohhhh! what's the link? 16:31:39 <Wolf01> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=75637&sid=242e2ab761139f4a07e69ecbd500e3d5 16:31:41 <Alberth> /me wonders what NoShips will bring 16:32:39 <peter1138> no ships 16:33:00 <Wolf01> It's NotShips BTW 16:33:14 * eekee read read 16:34:52 <eekee> ooh OFFR 16:36:26 <Wolf01> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=76017 also 16:36:56 <Wolf01> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=75986 also 16:40:54 <eekee> ty for links :) 16:43:36 <peter1138> git pull woo 16:43:53 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 16:45:45 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 16:56:39 <andythenorth> I’ve already made NoShips 17:00:43 *** Gja has joined #openttd 17:12:10 <eekee> are there plans/hopes/dreams for new ship code? 17:15:48 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 17:23:16 <Wolf01> eekee: yes, to remove ships 17:27:04 <eekee> no code != new code :) 17:27:34 <Wolf01> It's refactoring, purge things which don't work 17:28:01 <eekee> what doesn't work about ships? 17:28:06 <Wolf01> Ships 17:28:33 <eekee> i'm confused. XD i've successfully used ships in my last 5 games 17:29:42 <Wolf01> But they don't work, 10000000 ships on one tile, no collisions, shitty performance with pathfinding 17:30:14 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 17:31:02 <Wolf01> Just ask andythenorth and he will tell you better why ships don't work 17:31:39 <eekee> no collisions is a bit sad, but so are 45deg bends :) 17:31:57 <eekee> i'll ask him about it sooner or later 17:33:46 <peter1138> it was andythenorth looking at ship path reservation, no? 17:33:51 <peter1138> or wolf 17:33:54 <Wolf01> Samu 17:33:55 <peter1138> can't remember now :S 17:33:56 <peter1138> ohhh 17:33:57 <peter1138> samu 17:33:59 <andythenorth> samu 17:34:03 <peter1138> who is not here 17:34:04 <Wolf01> Samu 17:34:14 <peter1138> he was barking up the wrong tree though ;D 17:34:24 <Wolf01> Yes 17:34:25 <andythenorth> https://bugs.openttd.org/index.php?string=&project=1&search_name=&type%5B%5D=&sev%5B%5D=&pri%5B%5D=&due%5B%5D=&reported%5B%5D=&cat%5B%5D=&status%5B%5D=open&percent%5B%5D=&opened=samu 17:34:40 <_dp_> careful, don't accidentally summon him :p 17:34:49 <peter1138> why not? 17:35:17 <Wolf01> The only bad part about it is that he wanted to continue straight on his own idea, even after discussing it here 17:35:22 <Wolf01> *him 17:35:58 <eekee> hmm 17:36:31 <Wolf01> Like the wagon running cost based on length of the train and type of engine to try to fix the constant cost of the base game... 17:36:46 <peter1138> heh 17:37:00 <Wolf01> And once you set up a train, you have another different constant 17:37:20 <eekee> wat lol 17:37:58 <Wolf01> Also pointless, as you can do it right now with a grf 17:38:11 <eekee> oh he's one of those 17:39:34 <Wolf01> I would like to have an empty vanilla game and implement everything as newgrf: vehicles, infrastructures, algorythms 17:39:56 <eekee> yeah... 17:40:11 <peter1138> newgrf terrain generation? 17:40:15 <andythenorth> maybe 17:40:17 <eekee> haha 17:40:22 <andythenorth> why? 17:40:25 <eekee> that could be very cool 17:40:26 <andythenorth> is it that much slower? :P 17:40:28 <Wolf01> If you are able to put terragenesis on a grf, why not? 17:40:37 <andythenorth> it’s just some tile loop bollocks, no? 17:40:41 <eekee> lunar terrain generator grf :D 17:40:48 <Wolf01> But you should be able to set different terragenesis rules with a grf 17:41:54 <Wolf01> As far as I've read the code, you can already define (they are hardcoded) the cut off for desert and arctic mountains 17:41:56 <eekee> now imagining a grf handling ship collisions XD 17:42:13 <Wolf01> Just move them to a grf, voilà: different desert, different mountains 17:42:14 <peter1138> when i last went through the tgp code i found the perlin method was a bit shitty 17:42:18 <peter1138> but i don't remember the details :( 17:42:45 <Wolf01> IIRC it made stripes around all the map and other artifacts 17:42:56 <andythenorth> it does some pointless stuff IIRC 17:43:09 <eekee> tgp? terragenesis? 17:43:15 <peter1138> it's non standard but IS much faster than regular perlin 17:43:18 <peter1138> yeah 17:43:23 <Wolf01> TGP terragenesis perlin noise 17:43:29 <eekee> ah :) 17:43:52 <peter1138> 4096x4096 takes minutes to generate with unoptimised perlin 17:44:04 <eekee> oh dear 17:44:32 <andythenorth> why is 4096x4096? 17:44:39 <eekee> is 1024x1024 more reasonable? that's the largest size at which i find save time reasonable anyway 17:44:40 <andythenorth> 2048x2048 would have been enough 17:44:48 <andythenorth> but we had to go to 11 eh 17:45:05 <Wolf01> BTW, I would like to give it a try, I don't think that grf is the right way, but some other scripting or even just yaml/json to set values could be the way 17:45:09 <eekee> there's some unexpected straightness & Vs in my current map, but it's non-terrible 17:45:47 <eekee> so long as i can download it from bananas, i don't care what format it's in ;) 17:46:01 <_dp_> gs can mapgen a bit, but not terragen afaik 17:46:09 <_dp_> and newgrf sucks :p 17:46:14 <Wolf01> You can already download a lot of stuff from bananas 17:46:39 <Wolf01> Yeah, pointless to extend grf for something different than graphics 17:47:48 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 17:48:07 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 17:48:32 <eekee> sweet 17:49:53 <_dp_> hmmm, can gs write files? if so it could generate png with heightmap and start new game with it xD 17:50:12 <peter1138> wolf, NoTGP? 17:50:50 <Wolf01> Nah, NotHardcodedSettings 17:50:53 <Wolf01> Notconstants 17:51:02 <peter1138> changing the settings doesn't really add much 17:51:04 <Wolf01> NotMagicNumbers 17:51:45 <Wolf01> NotExternalizeTheCode 17:53:37 * peter1138 accidentally fires up minecraft instead 17:54:11 <Wolf01> For example, take tgp.cpp, the HeightMapSineTransform(height_t h_min, height_t h_max) 17:54:13 <andythenorth> NotSteve 17:55:01 <Wolf01> There is the fheight variable which could be changed to have different effect on TGP 17:55:16 <peter1138> annoying problem with landscape generation is the lack of cliffs 17:55:42 <peter1138> big height differentials are always smoothed out 17:55:44 <eekee> haha! i haven't thought about that since '05, i think 17:59:16 <eekee> i can't imagine playing ottd without ships. i'm fine without canals, and i do at times replace ships with trains, but... 17:59:42 <Wolf01> A problem with big height differences is that terrain in the game is smooth, you can't have discontinuous points, a 64 levels tall mountain fills a 256^2 map 18:00:00 <peter1138> basically the same issue 18:00:33 <eekee> oh yes! i was just thinking about the mountain height issue as i started a game today, but didn't think of cliffs 18:01:43 <Wolf01> With more slopes (0.5x, 1x, 2x and even vertical ones) you could fix that problem, but then you wouldn't be able to see what you are building on the back of a mountain and you will need map rotation 18:02:03 <peter1138> or transparency 18:02:11 <Wolf01> And I wouldn't speak for the changes needed to handle different levels 18:02:15 <eekee> yeah :) 18:02:22 <eekee> haha 18:02:54 <eekee> what happened to that other game? "the game openttd devs wanted to make" or something 18:02:58 <_dp_> even current mountains are pain in the ass to build on, adding anything more steeper is basically locking off parts of the map 18:03:12 <Wolf01> Yeah, you can use transparency, cut the terrain over some height 18:03:23 <Wolf01> But then you can just go play locomotion 18:03:28 <eekee> yeah 18:03:47 <_dp_> like, how are you even going to do bridges with 2 tile height difference on the ends? 18:04:03 <Wolf01> Fully flexible terrain, station on bridges, bridges over bridges, different curve radius 18:04:09 <eekee> i don't think bridges are relevant 18:04:14 <Wolf01> They are 18:04:39 <eekee> you can already put a bridge end on a slope with 2 tile height difference 18:04:50 <Wolf01> Nope, 1 tile max 18:05:03 <eekee> now i have to start the game again XD 18:05:11 <Wolf01> Ok, there's the double foundation, but only on certain tiles 18:06:55 <Wolf01> I've had a talk with eddi for a fully flexible layered layout which could allow building bridges like on locomotion and place signals and stations on them, that would be really cool... too bad is almost impossible to tell what are you building from a single pov 18:08:50 <eekee> _dp_: is this not what you meant by '2 tile height difference'? http://picpaste.com/Murphy___Co.__1862-01-17.png 18:09:15 <Wolf01> That's an edge case 18:09:50 <eekee> ?.? 18:09:56 <_dp_> eekee, no, I meant difference of bridge ends, that's just 0 on your picture 18:10:11 <eekee> _dp_: right, yeah, i wouldn't expect that to change 18:10:37 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 18:10:42 <Wolf01> Quak 18:10:45 <Wolf01> Need you 18:10:53 <Wolf01> Trams borked in NRT 18:11:24 <Wolf01> Electric sparks make game crash on division by 0 when loading a savegame 18:12:17 <Wolf01> Seem that articulated parts lose the cached_max_track_speed value when reloading 18:14:27 <eekee> haha i just had a mad idea re. ships. (saying it now because i'll have to go for a bit soon.) how about making WETrails (as in NUTS) buildable on water? 18:14:36 <andythenorth> canal cheat 18:14:44 <eekee> :D 18:14:58 <eekee> they could go on land & water 18:15:00 <andythenorth> it’s been done 18:15:04 <eekee> really? 18:15:07 <andythenorth> yup 18:15:32 <Wolf01> Been there, done that 18:15:34 <V453000> plus points for considering NUTS 18:15:41 <eekee> mm... imo if you're going to remove ships, this should be mainline code 18:16:01 <V453000> nobody's going to remove shits 18:16:02 <Wolf01> I would hardcode a check to disable wetrails from NUTS, NRT is the way to go 18:16:03 <eekee> V453000: i use it all the time now :) 18:16:04 <Wolf01> :D 18:16:05 <andythenorth> can build trains on water https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1160891#p1160891 18:16:08 <V453000> sick 18:16:10 <Wolf01> <3 V 18:16:53 <V453000> I am so looking forward to my next grf 18:16:59 <V453000> but need to stabilize this shit first :D 18:17:00 <V453000> treez 18:17:08 *** namad7 has joined #openttd 18:17:24 <Wolf01> Wait for NRT, I think you can do countless things by abusing it 18:17:35 <V453000> NRT is just road vehicles, no? 18:17:51 <Wolf01> Yes 18:17:53 <eekee> NRT + roads on water would be better in some ways 18:18:10 <V453000> well I can't compose a RV out of segments (engine + wagons) 18:18:17 <Wolf01> But you can do same shit as wetrails and pipes without the hassle of signals 18:18:24 <V453000> heh 18:18:26 <V453000> no :P 18:18:30 <eekee> yeah lack of signals esp. 18:18:55 <Wolf01> Also, bidirectional on same tile 18:18:58 <eekee> otoh signals are sometimes great 18:19:00 <eekee> yes!! 18:19:14 <eekee> been using road tunnels -- <3 hovertrucks btw :) 18:19:50 <Wolf01> I'm waiting for NRT to make a Venice like city and use boats instead of buses 18:19:58 *** namad7 has quit IRC 18:20:16 <eekee> sweet 18:20:30 <V453000> signals are always great, they are the core of why trains are so awesome and timeless to play with 18:20:40 <Wolf01> And in the end: https://i.pinimg.com/originals/0c/d5/96/0cd59612344c3df1e4606a91441d5fa7.jpg 18:20:56 <eekee> hehe 18:28:36 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 18:29:50 *** Eddi|zuHause2 has joined #openttd 18:30:14 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 18:32:11 *** TrueBrain_ has joined #openttd 18:32:51 *** Osai^2 has joined #openttd 18:32:58 *** [dpk] has joined #openttd 18:32:59 *** milek7_ has joined #openttd 18:33:01 *** NGC3982_ has joined #openttd 18:33:20 *** Rubidium_ has joined #openttd 18:33:22 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** NGC3982 has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Alberth has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Progman has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** rellig has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** TrueBrain has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** UncleCJ has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** milek7 has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Eddi|zuHause has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Sacro has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Rubidium has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** fonsinchen has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** avdg has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Osai has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Sheogorath has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Alkel_U3 has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** XeryusTC has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** dpk has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Ram-Z has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** goodger has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** donar has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Antheus has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** planetmaker has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** Terkhen has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** guru3 has quit IRC 18:33:22 *** ^Spike^ has quit IRC 18:33:27 *** donar has joined #openttd 18:33:51 *** avdg has joined #openttd 18:34:19 *** Sheogorath has joined #openttd 18:34:58 *** guru3 has joined #openttd 18:36:21 *** planetmaker has joined #openttd 18:36:21 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o planetmaker 18:36:31 *** goodger has joined #openttd 18:36:36 *** ^Spike^ has joined #openttd 18:36:51 *** Terkhen has joined #openttd 18:36:51 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Terkhen 18:37:28 *** Antheus has joined #openttd 18:37:51 *** fonsinchen has joined #openttd 18:38:51 *** XeryusTC has joined #openttd 18:41:26 <Wolf01> https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/am2W00y_700b.jpg ahaha 18:41:44 *** Ram-Z has joined #openttd 18:42:32 <eekee> hahaha! 18:44:39 *** Alkel_U3 has joined #openttd 18:46:02 *** Progman has joined #openttd 18:47:50 *** minisylf has joined #openttd 18:48:23 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 18:48:24 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 18:50:31 *** Sylf has quit IRC 18:51:57 <V453000> I'm starting to hate the amount of trees there is :D 18:53:31 <eekee> on the map or in the code? 18:53:37 <eekee> s/map/terrain/ 18:54:10 *** Sacro has joined #openttd 18:55:11 <andythenorth> V453000: there are a lot of variants 18:55:14 <andythenorth> growth stages 18:55:16 <andythenorth> dead ones :P 18:55:21 <V453000> yes 18:55:23 <eekee> oh those :) 18:55:25 <V453000> exactly 18:56:42 <V453000> 434 sprites 18:56:44 <V453000> ._. 18:56:50 <eekee> :o 18:57:15 <andythenorth> iz not much forums 18:57:27 <eekee> the original trees are amongst my favourite features of the game 18:57:32 <andythenorth> V453000: BRIX as base set is going to real mess with FIRS :) 18:57:38 <andythenorth> I reuse base set trees a lot 18:57:38 <V453000> well I wreck them eekee 18:57:47 <eekee> nuuuuuu! hehe 18:57:51 <V453000> I know andy, very aware 18:58:05 <V453000> I will check out how it works with firs and I will re-order the IDs accordingly 18:58:16 <V453000> might even let you choose which ones you want where :P 18:58:28 *** minisylf is now known as Sylf 18:58:48 <V453000> need to finish thing first 18:59:45 <andythenorth> such finish 19:00:01 * andythenorth needs to stop html-ing 19:00:05 <andythenorth> eyes boggle 19:02:57 *** glx has joined #openttd 19:02:57 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 19:03:26 *** _maddy has quit IRC 19:04:14 <glx> hello 19:04:27 <andythenorth> did I do it right or wrong? https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6312#comment14756 19:04:29 <andythenorth> lo glx 19:04:48 <V453000> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8590/trees-wip-2.png 19:04:55 <V453000> arctic and incomplete temperate 19:04:55 *** Alberth has left #openttd 19:05:47 <eekee> they look kinda fun 19:06:04 <eekee> blender? 19:06:12 <peter1138> arcticulated trees 19:06:13 <eekee> oh, yeah 19:06:19 <eekee> hehe 19:06:42 <peter1138> i like the tree with the red/white circle ;p 19:06:48 <eekee> i can imagine some of them dancing 19:07:17 <eekee> i like the one which looks like it's hugging its own branches 19:07:21 <eekee> lol 19:07:33 <V453000> all of them are hugtrees :) 19:07:34 <V453000> yes blender 19:07:37 <eekee> :D 19:07:52 <V453000> I used 3ds max before but now converted a few years back 19:08:23 <andythenorth> gobsmacking amount of trees 19:08:26 <eekee> bbl, bath time 19:08:29 <V453000> when I realize it's been 2 and a half years since I have been using blender, I can't understand how is BRIX in max still ._. 19:08:42 <V453000> what you see isn't even half andy 19:08:48 <V453000> gobsmacking x2 19:08:50 <V453000> + 19:09:27 <andythenorth> why is airports range? 19:10:48 <V453000> station catchment? 19:10:53 <V453000> range is only in av8 right? 19:11:15 *** Gja has quit IRC 19:11:20 <andythenorth> I couldn’t find it 19:11:42 <andythenorth> tried a couple of versions of 8, and av9 19:11:51 <V453000> did you try parameters? 19:12:03 <andythenorth> yup 19:12:09 <V453000> wtf 19:12:09 <andythenorth> probably got wrong grf 19:12:20 <V453000> I'm not sure if it's glaringly obvious at the first sight 19:12:23 <andythenorth> I have multiple versions 19:12:27 * andythenorth tries again 19:12:31 <V453000> I don't even remember if it was in the purchase menu 19:12:41 <andythenorth> it’s bollocks feature 19:12:45 <andythenorth> @summon pikka 19:12:45 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: out of chalk 19:12:47 <V453000> yes 19:12:50 <V453000> :D 19:13:24 <andythenorth> haz wrong http://pikkarail.com/openttd/planes-and-ranges/ 19:14:29 <V453000> the progression point is true 19:14:43 <V453000> but visualising it is kind of hard and it just gets annoying 19:15:34 <V453000> just increasing passenger decay rate would probably fix early aircraft being viable for super long ranges 19:15:54 <V453000> also, it will inevitably be stupidly different on 256x512 to 1024x104 or more 19:17:40 <andythenorth> ok found range in AV8 2.x 19:17:41 <V453000> I wonder how much did Pikka manage to replace with his grf 19:17:46 <V453000> landscape rail water etc 19:17:48 <andythenorth> I can see Milsa’s point from FS 19:18:08 <andythenorth> but eh, make orders even more complex just to support one grf? 19:18:25 <V453000> sure if it's nuts :P 19:23:51 <andythenorth> V453000: pikka nearly got to k eh 19:24:01 <andythenorth> that’s more than I expected 19:24:05 *** Gja has joined #openttd 19:24:06 <V453000> I don't remember the amount 19:24:15 <andythenorth> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1512547915/pineapple-graphics-for-openttd 19:24:30 <andythenorth> was looking how much he got done, to answer your Q above :P 19:24:47 *** UncleCJ has joined #openttd 19:25:12 <V453000> :D 19:26:09 * andythenorth bored now 19:26:14 <andythenorth> what shall do? 19:27:28 <V453000> I'm kind of really forcing myself with the trees atm 19:27:31 <V453000> can't give many hints :D 19:27:42 <andythenorth> newgrf trees spec? 19:27:45 <andythenorth> Wolf01: o_O 19:28:03 <Wolf01> Time to do it? 19:28:12 <V453000> I won't do it 19:28:14 <V453000> just saying 19:28:15 <V453000> :D 19:28:23 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd 19:29:03 <andythenorth> maybe I play games 19:31:04 <Wolf01> I have a 2s ping, 0.4MBps/10Kbps connection today, I can't even open sites during a human lifetime 19:31:28 <V453000> Wolf01: doesn't that help productivity? :P 19:31:44 <Wolf01> Not if you need sites to produce 19:31:52 <V453000> well :) 19:32:19 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 19:32:42 <peter1138> i'm streaming to twitch at ~3.5mbps 19:32:59 <Wolf01> ಥ╭╮ಥ 19:33:05 <peter1138> i'm a meanine 19:33:07 <peter1138> ... 19:33:09 <peter1138> i'm a meanie 19:33:16 <V453000> what do you stream, minecraft? 19:33:39 <frosch123> andythenorth: Wolf01: https://wiki.openttd.org/Frosch/ButGroundTypes <- finally wrote a first draft for butgroundtypes 19:33:56 <andythenorth> ooh 19:34:10 <Wolf01> Eh, tomorrow I could be able to read it 19:34:12 * andythenorth reads 19:34:21 <frosch123> possibly intro and gui mockup is interesting 19:34:21 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 19:34:22 <andythenorth> Wolf01: I’ll print it and post it airmail 19:34:24 <Wolf01> Ok, loaded 19:34:25 <frosch123> rest is boilerplate 19:34:38 <Wolf01> 40 seconds to load a text page 19:34:54 <Wolf01> frosch123: could we fix NRT meanwhile? 19:35:34 <frosch123> something new broke? 19:35:40 <Wolf01> Yes 19:35:41 <andythenorth> frosch123: I’m skimming but…reminds me of ‘vehicles can drive on station tiles’ from eons ago 19:35:56 <andythenorth> mart3p had it proposed for ISR somewhere 19:35:57 <Wolf01> Read log since you joined today 19:36:42 <peter1138> V453000, any old shit 19:36:54 <frosch123> andythenorth: one of the av8 versions has a setting to enable/disable range 19:37:02 <andythenorth> I found one enabled 19:37:12 <andythenorth> i’m a meanie 19:37:13 <V453000> nice 19:37:15 <V453000> ancient shit 19:37:51 <V453000> is openttd old shit? :P 19:38:04 <frosch123> turned slug shit 19:38:35 <Wolf01> frosch123: I tried to merge master in ratt branch and fix conflicts (just 3 conflicts easy to fix) and noticed that eltrams don't seem to work after loading a savegame made with the same version 19:39:04 <peter1138> hmm could try 19:39:18 <peter1138> i suspect it's too shit to work with game capture :p 19:39:34 <peter1138> yup :S 19:40:26 <V453000> nice, made 3 trees today 19:40:31 <V453000> 21 shits 19:41:31 <andythenorth> frosch123: consolidating to just one global toolbar button = winning 19:44:06 <Wolf01> I find difficult to read the catenary complementing section, but the rest make sense 19:44:17 <andythenorth> catenary boggles brain 19:45:47 <frosch123> not bridges boggle my brain 19:45:50 <frosch123> *now 19:46:25 <andythenorth> bridges on bridges 19:46:30 <andythenorth> stations on bridges over stations 19:47:36 <frosch123> anyway, i suspect that the road construction toolbar fails to provide space for two dropdowns 19:47:39 <Wolf01> Will groundtypes allow overstructures like walking bridges over the road? 19:47:39 <andythenorth> yair 19:47:42 <andythenorth> wondered 19:47:44 <frosch123> or names must be short :) 19:48:02 <frosch123> Wolf01: yes, via sidewalks stuff 19:48:03 <andythenorth> I can work on that a bit 19:48:06 <andythenorth> not now :P 19:48:26 <andythenorth> so BGT unpicks the combinatorial explosion by exposing controls for combining 19:48:29 <Wolf01> Make dropdowns inline with other buttons? 19:48:40 <frosch123> it should support most what the existing road furniture grfs do, but it restricts stuff to single-tile szie 19:48:50 <Wolf01> Open 2 toolbars like the terraforming tool? 19:48:58 <andythenorth> nobody can pick from 256 choices, but they can pick 1 out of 4, 1 out of 4 again etc 19:49:42 <Wolf01> <frosch123> it should support most what the existing road furniture grfs do, but it restricts stuff to single-tile szie <- Grf authors will find a way to abuse that 19:49:56 <Wolf01> But we aren't here to prevent abuses 19:50:15 <andythenorth> just remember, nothing stops you installing comic sans 19:50:17 <andythenorth> or even using it 19:50:31 <andythenorth> standing rule for all content systems 19:50:46 <Wolf01> $friend uses comic sans on phone, and every time he sends me a screenshots he makes my eyes bleed 19:52:25 <Wolf01> Ok, after Reading that 19:52:35 <Wolf01> When we'll start? 19:52:53 <Wolf01> Trash current NRT? Edit it? 19:52:58 <andythenorth> frosch123: wondering if this circumvents ever needing newgrf roadstops 19:53:25 <frosch123> newgrf roadstops would be multi-tile if over-arching roof and stuff 19:53:30 <andythenorth> hmm 19:53:33 <Wolf01> What could be salvaged from NRT? 19:53:46 <andythenorth> multi-tile sounds a bit 2025 to me 19:53:48 <frosch123> Wolf01: it shares a lot with nrt 19:53:51 <andythenorth> unless peter1138 does them 19:54:10 <frosch123> like vehicle and pathfinder stuff 19:54:54 <andythenorth> does depot come from ground or road/tram type? 19:55:19 <frosch123> likely from ground 19:55:27 <andythenorth> makes more sense 19:55:29 <frosch123> but depot, stations, bridges are unclear 19:55:36 <andythenorth> I am reading 19:55:47 <Wolf01> Could we do them later? 19:55:49 <frosch123> groundtype affects the groundsprite in all cases 19:56:11 <andythenorth> so unified tram/RV depots? 19:56:16 <frosch123> for bridges and tunnls it makes sense to have different ground tiles on each end 19:56:19 <andythenorth> it’s just another tile? 19:56:23 <frosch123> but that leaves the bridge surface unefined 19:57:00 <andythenorth> ok UI bothers me 19:57:00 <frosch123> anyway, for a first version i would skip: depot, stations, bridges, tunnels, custom catenary 19:57:04 <andythenorth> +1 19:57:08 <andythenorth> tarpit 19:57:11 <andythenorth> add later 19:57:12 <Wolf01> +1 19:57:13 <andythenorth> if ever 19:57:19 <frosch123> most important imho is to test the ui 19:57:35 <andythenorth> “in which andythenorth has to learn OpenTTD UI code” :| 19:57:51 * Wolf01 could do some working mockups 19:59:25 <frosch123> i wonder what the higher toolbar will cause :) but it would give a foundation to also make the transparency toolbar bigger :p 19:59:26 <andythenorth> does the ground selection clear after choosing one? 19:59:42 <frosch123> the selection window? 19:59:45 <andythenorth> yes 19:59:51 <frosch123> you can open and close it as you like 19:59:57 <frosch123> keep it open or nor 20:00:00 <andythenorth> looks like it risks same problem as station window on my screen :) 20:00:18 <frosch123> it does not need to be open for building and converting 20:00:32 <frosch123> but you can keep it open if you want to convert multiple tiles to different types 20:00:59 <Wolf01> About "Query compatibility with specific road/tramtype: (in nrt-todolist, also useful for railtypes)" : https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=54126 20:01:17 <frosch123> it's also listed for bgt 20:01:25 <frosch123> and i consider just implementing it for railtypes in trunk 20:01:47 * andythenorth wondered 20:02:18 <Wolf01> Could my "check compatibility" branch be useful? 20:02:37 <andythenorth> ok I read this all again to be sure I’ve understood 20:03:04 <frosch123> Wolf01: i do not see the relation with the forum thread 20:03:24 <frosch123> nrt talks about a simple two-sourceline va2 variable 20:03:50 <frosch123> there are some upgrade-rail inconsistencies, for which there is a fs task 20:03:58 <frosch123> no idea why that thread was dug up 20:04:55 *** Gja has quit IRC 20:09:42 <andythenorth> so 20:09:53 <V453000> played the game 20:09:54 <V453000> it's good 20:10:22 <andythenorth> iz 20:10:54 <andythenorth> frosch123: so every road and tram type has catenary on/off variant? 20:11:04 <andythenorth> is that a 2 label system, or a bit or what? 20:11:18 <andythenorth> I don’t actually care about implementation, but helps me understand 20:12:28 <frosch123> every roadtype either has "same type with/without catenary" or "cannot coexist with tramtype of different catenary choice" 20:12:48 <frosch123> the two roadtypes are separate and link each other via their label 20:14:10 <frosch123> so either you have pairs like ROAD/ELRD, or you have "ELHAUL cannot coexist with RAIL, but only with ELRL" 20:15:36 * andythenorth trying to understand upgrade vs. convert 20:16:12 <frosch123> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1191421#p1191421 <- that is about upgrading 20:16:19 <frosch123> upgrading happens automatic 20:16:27 <frosch123> upgrading should not break stuff 20:16:30 <andythenorth> right 20:16:40 <frosch123> convert is manual and can break stuff 20:16:41 <andythenorth> because it’s all compatible 20:16:45 <andythenorth> ok 20:16:54 <andythenorth> [upgrading all compatible] 20:17:21 <Wolf01> Yes sorry, I linked the whole topic and not the post 20:17:43 <andythenorth> so can I upgrade by overbuilding? 20:17:51 <andythenorth> and convert tool is for converting? 20:18:06 <frosch123> yes, imho overbuilding should upgrade 20:18:25 <frosch123> apparently this does not happen consistently for rail currently 20:18:41 <andythenorth> https://bugs.openttd.org/task/6590 20:18:42 <andythenorth> iirc 20:19:01 <frosch123> yep 20:20:38 <milek7_> hm, patch for more than 15 companies have any changes to be merged? 20:20:46 <milek7_> (maybe with extended tile array to avoid weird bitpacking) 20:20:59 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 20:21:19 <andythenorth> BGT nml patch needed eh 20:21:44 <andythenorth> frosch123: how much of this still applies to BGT? https://wiki.openttd.org/Frosch/NotRoadTypes#ToDo_list 20:21:51 <frosch123> milek7_: in theory yes, but on my list not before 2027 20:22:45 <frosch123> andythenorth: i think i addressed everything but "independent movement for road and tram" 20:23:00 <andythenorth> is a pony 20:23:01 <frosch123> which i consider the more meh the longer i think about it :) 20:23:07 <andythenorth> I couldn’t care less about it 20:23:23 <V453000> damn playing openttd feels good 20:23:24 <andythenorth> suspension railway is total PITA 20:23:24 <V453000> XD 20:23:34 <andythenorth> I tried it, it clips tunnels, bridges, rail catenary 20:23:35 <eekee> :D 20:23:41 <andythenorth> daft idea 20:29:35 *** ic111 has joined #openttd 20:31:46 <andythenorth> so NRT is dead 20:31:55 <andythenorth> basically, a bit boring 20:32:22 <frosch123> noone said the BGT will turn out good, but imho NRT has some big problems 20:32:44 <andythenorth> isn’t the main problem that it’s a bit dull? 20:32:47 <andythenorth> and catenary is a mess 20:33:01 <frosch123> i like the supermob stuff 20:33:23 <andythenorth> FWIW supermop said we should ignore the Docklands grf 20:33:36 <andythenorth> and that all the cobble types etc will use speed limits 20:33:53 <V453000> wot 20:33:56 <V453000> NRT lief 20:33:58 <frosch123> sure, but noone dealt with tram types 20:34:07 <Wolf01> We should listen also to supermod (<- just to rotate that p around some more) 20:34:22 <andythenorth> nah supermoq showed the way 20:34:30 <ic111> Question / request for brainstorming: Which values does the window engine take into account when determining the minimum allowed size of a window, i.e. the size I cannot go below during a resize? 20:34:55 <V453000> do you even supermob 20:34:58 <V453000> XD 20:35:02 <Wolf01> Then you say he will agree to whatever we will come up to? 20:35:13 <ic111> I removed all calls that set width in UpdateWidgetSize --> I could make my timetable window about 15 % smaller, which is not very much 20:35:45 <ic111> I set all SetMinimalSize calls in the window desc to quite low x values ---> Changed nothing 20:36:07 <ic111> What else does it take into account? 20:36:48 <andythenorth> FLAG_NO_LEVEL_CROSSING: moved to groundtype ? o_O 20:37:09 <frosch123> ic111: widget.cpp contains defaults for all widgets 20:37:22 <ic111> does default mean minimum size? 20:37:36 *** Gja has joined #openttd 20:37:42 <frosch123> yes 20:37:58 <frosch123> all widgets have minimum size and fill/resize behaviour 20:38:06 <frosch123> "default" size only exists in window context 20:38:44 <ic111> And do the SetMinimalSize occurrences in the window desc override them? I would assume yes, but...? 20:38:44 *** Gja has quit IRC 20:39:15 <frosch123> i think the order is 1. widget.cpp default, 2. setminimalsize in tree 3. updatewidegetsize 20:39:31 <andythenorth> frosch123: I guess dropdowns with names for road / tram because you need to see currently selected? 20:40:00 <andythenorth> nbm 20:40:02 <andythenorth> nvm * 20:40:07 * andythenorth thinking out loud 20:40:08 <frosch123> andythenorth: you need to see the selected one, and the assumption is there are only a hand full of them, and they have names instead of previews 20:40:25 <frosch123> while the groundtype selection opens a big window with previews 20:40:38 <andythenorth> I wondered about a menu instead for road/tram selection 20:40:43 <andythenorth> think it sucks 20:40:55 <ic111> Ok, so probably if the window engine calculates an unwanted big minimum size, I want to add additional SetMinimalSize calls to the tree, is this the strategy one uses in that situation? 20:41:28 <frosch123> well, did you figure out which widget causes the big size? 20:41:41 <frosch123> or are you trying to minimise the borders? 20:41:53 <frosch123> ic111: also, there is not just minimalsize, but also padding 20:42:38 <ic111> No, so far I didn´t figure it out. 20:42:40 <andythenorth> hmm 20:42:46 <ic111> Consider the screenshot from yesterday: https://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=199556 20:43:01 <frosch123> andythenorth: since you need to select both groundtype and road/tramtype, i settled for listing the last n used in the menu, instead of all 2048 20:43:06 <frosch123> :p 20:43:14 <andythenorth> I saw that 20:43:17 <andythenorth> it’s nice :) 20:43:18 <ic111> By throwing away calls in UpdateWidgetSize, I now have a window that ends about at the right end of the canal icon in the top line 20:43:37 <ic111> I decreased all explicit SetMinimalSize calls to quite low values 20:44:03 <frosch123> well, isn't the white text the important part? 20:44:05 <ic111> ... but maybe there is some widget I don´t explicitely assign a MinimalSize, probably I just have to do a closer look... 20:44:09 <andythenorth> does type dropdown need to list all speed limit, axle weight crap? 20:44:25 <frosch123> andythenorth: speed limit is part of groundtype :p 20:44:52 <andythenorth> wondering if we can just have a picture, not word 20:44:58 <ic111> NoNo, the white text clearly isn´t the problem 20:45:02 <andythenorth> make toolbar even deeper, use tile for ground types 20:45:11 <frosch123> axle weight would still be in the dropdown, but did anyone use that? or did only eddi talk bout it? 20:45:19 <andythenorth> words 20:45:31 <andythenorth> and then a menu for selecting road / tram, which draws them over selected ground type 20:45:31 <ic111> (1) because I am not aware that I still consider it, (2) Because in the running OpenTTD instance I just use for testing, it is much smaller 20:45:34 * andythenorth should mockup 20:46:03 <ic111> ... ok, so I´ll do some more code inspection now, thank you for now... 20:46:33 <frosch123> ic111: maybe you also have some EQUALSIZE containers? 20:47:27 <ic111> yes 20:47:29 <ic111> there are some 20:47:52 <frosch123> or widgetselections? 20:48:19 * andythenorth makes ugly mockup 20:48:33 <ic111> yes, also. 20:48:38 <frosch123> andythenorth: i wonder whether there is any visual difference in roadtypes :p 20:48:40 <andythenorth> can we limit displayed chars in dropdown? 20:48:55 <frosch123> it should truncate with "..." 20:48:56 <andythenorth> frosch123: enterprising people will do different lines etc 20:49:13 <andythenorth> wondering about vertical stacked dropdowns 20:49:23 <andythenorth> and some kind of preview of the resulting tile 20:49:48 <frosch123> for preview imho just open the ground selection window 20:50:03 <andythenorth> I was trying to use a preview to save space 20:50:07 <frosch123> but toolbar on its own should be minimal, i though you would be interested in that :p 20:50:12 <andythenorth> don’t have to read words 20:50:13 <andythenorth> words is boring 20:50:22 <andythenorth> well, words are great 20:50:28 <andythenorth> but not in the game 20:50:32 <andythenorth> mostly pictures 20:50:51 <frosch123> skip the cats though 20:50:52 <andythenorth> I think we can make some neat little palette 20:51:01 <andythenorth> just haven’t figured it out yet 20:54:04 <Wolf01> frosch123, andythenorth: speed limits? I would like same roadtype with different speed limit, move to BGT? (I always found stupid the proliferation of same rail track just to set a speed limit) 20:54:43 <andythenorth> how about routing restrictions per BGT? :P 20:54:51 <andythenorth> no trains > 5 tiles 20:54:54 <frosch123> the point is that groundtypes define the surroundings, like protection walls etc. also speedlimit is shared by road and tram 20:55:01 <Wolf01> No trucks in cities? 20:55:15 <frosch123> no goods for town growth :) 20:55:16 <Wolf01> andythenorth: weren't you the one who suggested it? 20:55:39 <frosch123> new disaster: town blocks good delivery due to diesel restrictions 20:55:48 <Wolf01> Aahah 20:56:05 <V453000> made 4 trees, removed 1 20:56:06 <andythenorth> third idea I had https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8591/BGT_UI_1.png 20:56:10 <V453000> total progress of day = 3 20:56:12 <V453000> iz fine enough 20:56:12 <andythenorth> not in love with it, but different 20:56:13 <V453000> gnight 20:56:23 <Wolf01> Mmmh I think no netflix this evening 20:56:31 <andythenorth> bye V453000 20:56:40 <Wolf01> nn V 20:57:07 <andythenorth> frosch123: everything is wrong in that mockup, except trying to get size 20:57:56 <frosch123> andythenorth: i would like an easy toggle between road and tram 20:58:07 <Wolf01> With that size you need to double the width of the dropdowns too 20:58:49 <andythenorth> frosch123: do both road and tram need to show at same time? 20:59:00 <frosch123> no 20:59:04 <Wolf01> 2 options: bigger toolbar; child toolbar 20:59:09 <andythenorth> dunno I have more success making UIs in html than talking them out :) 20:59:10 <frosch123> but two radio buttons looked easier than a toggle button 20:59:23 <andythenorth> maybe we need to prototype it in game, not photoshop 20:59:36 <andythenorth> concept is started at least 20:59:40 <_dp_> hmm... apparently some new players have troubles finding mono/maglev so they can't bulid trains after 2000-smth 21:00:10 <andythenorth> it’s never obvious that global toolbar is also menu 21:00:12 <andythenorth> if that’s the cause 21:00:23 <_dp_> andythenorth, it likely is 21:00:54 <frosch123> well, i don't think mono/magl is their biggest problem then 21:01:01 <Wolf01> Show main toolbar buttons with dropdown like actual dropdowns 21:01:12 <andythenorth> who made all the crazy tile grfs? 21:01:18 <andythenorth> Quast65 or so? 21:01:29 <andythenorth> we need someone to make BGT test cases 21:01:37 <andythenorth> ‘tile with parked car' 21:01:41 <andythenorth> ‘tile with phone box' 21:01:50 <andythenorth> ‘tile with cat fighting doc' 21:01:53 <andythenorth> dog * 21:02:06 <andythenorth> ‘tile with seagull eating chicken' 21:02:10 <Wolf01> Just put stuff we already have for the moment 21:02:11 <_dp_> tile with a black hole 21:02:41 <Wolf01> And yes, I'm a bit worried about the UI 21:04:15 <andythenorth> just don’t make it like the station or object UIs :P 21:04:29 <andythenorth> the object UI missed a memo about padding 21:05:56 * andythenorth could probably fix that, instead of bitching 21:06:31 <andythenorth> frosch123: BGT airport tiles? o_O 21:06:59 <frosch123> :) 21:07:10 <andythenorth> I was trolling, but it might work 21:07:26 <andythenorth> choose ground, add taxiway, runway, or airgate 21:07:33 <frosch123> canals are already stetching it 21:07:49 <andythenorth> it does canals too? :o 21:07:59 <frosch123> i wrote it somewhere 21:08:10 <andythenorth> oh you did 21:08:29 <frosch123> if it works for road, it's definitely also suitable for railtypes (and would solve the compatibility thingie) 21:08:37 <frosch123> but canals is a bit far fetched 21:08:46 <andythenorth> can’t think of a use for it 21:08:53 <andythenorth> except unifying river and canal 21:08:59 <andythenorth> then being able to build river 21:10:17 * andythenorth eyes gone 21:10:18 <andythenorth> bed 21:11:43 <andythenorth> bye :) 21:11:44 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 21:20:12 *** y2000rtc has joined #openttd 21:20:24 *** y2000rtc has left #openttd 21:32:20 *** ic111 has quit IRC 21:35:47 *** nekomaster has joined #openttd 21:36:27 <nekomaster> So I keep starting over with my Belgian Train Set and everytime I start trying to modify the code everything stops working. Stuff just doesnt appear in game even though their PNML files are included 21:37:19 <nekomaster> I dont know what I'm doing thats causing my problems and I'm ready to just give up as I've spent 4 days just trying to get set up and nothing works 21:38:22 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:48:23 *** Progman has quit IRC 21:59:47 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 21:59:59 <Eddi|zuHause> nekomaster: too little detail 22:00:11 <nekomaster> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=76961 22:00:20 <nekomaster> Basically I try modifying the 2cc Trains in NML Code 22:00:53 <Eddi|zuHause> did you make sure to set climate availability? 22:00:55 <nekomaster> and when I do, while it compiles just fine and produces a NewGRF, it just doesnt work in game, none of my steam engines or coaches appear in game 22:01:13 <nekomaster> that might be why maybe? 22:01:18 <nekomaster> 0_0 22:01:24 <Eddi|zuHause> did you set a capacity but it finds no cargo to refit for? 22:01:37 <nekomaster> Because I removed the REGION parameter since this is only a Belgian train set 22:01:57 <nekomaster> and I believe 2cc Trains removed the Climate availabilty and replaced it with the REGION parameter 22:03:10 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds plausible 22:03:27 <nekomaster> yeah, I believe that was an issue with my NARS Add-on Set that some how I figured out quickly 22:03:51 <nekomaster> I dunno why I didn't think about it or maybe look at my NARS Add-on Set 2cc Code to see why that worked and BTS didn't 22:03:54 <Wolf01> Bah, I was so bored I moved the display options to the transparency UI and I even find it more convenient 22:06:01 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 22:08:36 <nekomaster> Yay so things work now 22:08:50 <nekomaster> I spent 4 days drinking and getting angry and not getting anywhere 22:10:07 <Wolf01> http://imgur.com/a/rvwcq could be good? I made them of different colour to show they are a bit different than just the transparency options, also the title should be changed 22:12:04 <Wolf01> I think I'll move them to the transparency options array and move the loading indicators on the right too 22:12:21 <Wolf01> As it works as a display option 22:15:04 <nekomaster> Eddi|zuHause: Thanks so much for pointing that out, I'm so relived that fixed everythin 22:18:48 *** eekee has quit IRC 22:20:54 *** gelignite has quit IRC 22:20:58 *** nekomaster has left #openttd 22:38:32 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:39:01 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 22:39:13 *** ToBeFree is now known as Guest4073 22:39:14 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 22:39:59 *** ToBeFree has quit IRC 22:56:47 <Wolf01> 'night 22:57:00 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 23:06:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has quit IRC 23:07:28 *** Cadadadry has quit IRC 23:45:05 *** Flygon has joined #openttd