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00:11:41 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 00:20:00 *** debdog has quit IRC 00:24:42 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 00:27:28 *** debdog has joined #openttd 00:35:55 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 00:37:38 *** synchris has quit IRC 00:47:04 *** tokai has quit IRC 00:50:20 *** debdog has quit IRC 00:51:31 *** debdog has joined #openttd 01:53:35 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 01:54:14 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 02:09:08 *** tokai has joined #openttd 02:09:09 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 02:38:03 *** tokai has quit IRC 02:39:39 *** tokai has joined #openttd 02:39:40 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 03:00:07 *** Coobies has joined #openttd 03:04:55 *** glx has quit IRC 03:07:25 *** Cubey has quit IRC 03:08:20 *** DDR has quit IRC 03:14:15 *** DDR has joined #openttd 04:54:49 *** Coobies has quit IRC 04:55:50 *** sim-al2 is now known as Guest6676 04:55:52 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 05:00:21 *** Guest6676 has quit IRC 05:56:34 *** synchris has joined #openttd 05:58:12 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 05:58:12 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 06:15:42 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd 06:17:44 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 06:21:39 <Alberth> o/ 06:25:21 <andythenorth> moin 06:36:33 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8686/horse_edible_tanks.png 06:36:57 <andythenorth> another case where generations look the same :P 06:37:56 <andythenorth> also 06:38:21 <andythenorth> edibles tank cars and refrigerated cars are hauled by pax engines 06:38:38 <andythenorth> which will look odd with train 24 06:43:36 <Alberth> it does, just like the default set with farms 06:43:57 <Alberth> any particular reason the blue line must be horizontal? 06:44:26 <Alberth> although I also had the thought, "why do we have these tankers at all?" 06:45:18 <Alberth> but euhm, I don't expect food to be delivered by the gallon :p 06:45:53 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:46:34 <Alberth> have less generations? 06:47:20 <Alberth> it's not a rule to be completely symmetrical everywhere 06:47:49 <Alberth> hmm, place top entry holes off-center? ie not symmetrical 06:48:24 <Alberth> or don't have them at all in some case? 06:51:56 <andythenorth> I wondered about inverting white and CC for some generations 06:54:19 <Alberth> vertical CC, several lines is possible 06:54:44 <Alberth> although some form of diagonal would break the pattern more 06:55:10 <Alberth> but that may cause trouble with your other wagons 06:56:46 <andythenorth> RL has some guides 06:56:49 <andythenorth> http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/uploads/monthly_01_2012/post-2919-0-16461100-1325661152.jpg 06:57:10 <andythenorth> http://www.themodelcentre.com/product_images/uploaded_images/4F-031-005.jpg 06:57:18 <andythenorth> http://www.gwr.org.uk/gallery/badairylarge.jpg 06:57:24 <andythenorth> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-sxnqZ-p1k-Y/UABL9301IDI/AAAAAAAAC0I/DdBBN2cOTUc/s1600/GWR+Milk+Tank+W2835+of+1939.+16.4.2010.JPG 07:03:41 <Alberth> latter has some nice CC a the bottom :) 07:30:10 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8687/horse_edible_tanks_2.png 07:30:25 <andythenorth> kind of works 07:30:30 <andythenorth> not convinced though 07:42:09 *** JacobD88 has joined #openttd 07:45:09 <Alberth> yeah, looks like it's partly filled :p 07:45:27 <Alberth> make some vertical white in it? 07:48:47 <andythenorth> I think I need to keep the colour scheme, and vary the silhouette 07:49:07 <andythenorth> firs gen now smaller http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8688/horse_edible_tanks_3.png 07:50:55 <andythenorth> first * 07:58:06 *** JacobD88 has quit IRC 08:04:53 <Alberth> quite subtle, but nice :) 08:06:06 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 08:06:21 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 08:19:47 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 08:23:55 <andythenorth> hmm 08:25:41 <andythenorth> yo V453000 08:41:55 *** Progman has joined #openttd 09:02:24 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 09:10:18 *** Breckett has joined #openttd 09:10:47 <Alberth> o/ 09:11:21 *** Breckett has quit IRC 09:25:05 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has quit IRC 09:30:16 <Eddi|zuHause> which tank do horses prefer to eat, then, if the tanks are edible by horses? 09:31:16 <Alberth> filled tanks, of course 09:37:43 *** ToffeeYogurtPots has joined #openttd 09:50:18 *** urdh has quit IRC 09:51:21 *** gelignite has quit IRC 09:52:38 *** urdh has joined #openttd 09:58:09 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 10:00:48 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 10:09:24 *** Alberth has left #openttd 10:19:00 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 10:20:25 <Wolf01> Moin 10:28:46 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:32:06 <Wolf01> o/ 10:33:15 <andythenorth> lo 10:36:52 * andythenorth has design problem 10:39:01 <Eddi|zuHause> singular? 10:43:00 *** Cubey has quit IRC 11:00:28 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 11:03:11 <andythenorth> likely multiple related 11:03:14 <andythenorth> treatable as one 11:03:30 <andythenorth> logical progression means freight trains at 140mph by 202 11:03:33 <andythenorth> 2020 * 11:06:59 <Wolf01> Why not? 11:08:27 <andythenorth> 1. looks daft, freight wagons with high speed pax engines 11:08:39 <andythenorth> 2. road vehicles are 80mph for same game date 11:09:05 <andythenorth> 3. reality 11:10:21 <Wolf01> So you want to stick to reality but still don't want much realism? 11:14:19 <andythenorth> let’s say it’s about a 50% connection 11:14:57 <andythenorth> IRL freight train speeds are 75mph, or rarely 80-90mph 11:15:11 <andythenorth> 110mph is ok in game 11:15:16 <andythenorth> 140…not 11:16:32 <Wolf01> Make multistorey intermodal cars 11:17:26 <Wolf01> So speed become relative, and you double the capacity instead 11:19:39 <andythenorth> I considered higher capacity instead of higher speed 11:21:30 <andythenorth> I could use the train air drag property :P 11:21:59 <andythenorth> it’s a non-trivial factor for freight train speeds 11:22:14 * andythenorth biab 11:22:15 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 11:27:34 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 11:56:38 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 12:00:02 <Wolf01> Quak 12:00:09 <frosch123> moo 12:02:36 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 12:04:32 *** Samu has joined #openttd 12:12:23 <andythenorth> so 12:22:09 <Wolf01> Lemons 12:22:48 <Samu> hi 12:24:07 <Samu> i'm testing the results of my patch, and it's... impressive 12:24:25 <Wolf01> You filed for bankruptcy in 2 years? 12:24:53 <Samu> remember airport infrastructure costs? 12:25:23 <andythenorth> I hate designing top-end of a roster 12:25:25 <andythenorth> it’s so boring 12:25:59 <Samu> there is no luxury of having trains waiting to load now, running costs don't allow it now 12:26:06 <Wolf01> Try a rooster instead 12:27:18 <Samu> have to compare these profits with trucks 12:27:27 <andythenorth> stupid trains 12:27:29 <andythenorth> are stupid 12:28:00 <Samu> i kinda like it that I have to care about the number of wagons on a train 12:28:43 <Samu> you wouldn't make excess number of trucks if they have to wait to load, so trains now are getting the same treatment 12:31:08 <andythenorth> why do refrigerated cars and edibles tank cars go at pax train speeds? 12:32:09 <Wolf01> Express delivery? 12:32:54 <andythenorth> yair 12:33:01 <andythenorth> also it’s just a bit of variety eh 12:35:35 <andythenorth> and you can run food into towns on same tracks as pax/mail 12:38:40 <andythenorth> dunno, it all seems a bit ‘blah’ 12:39:04 <andythenorth> it’s the same in the dragon games 12:39:12 <Wolf01> You don't run freight in cities by train, you know 12:39:23 <andythenorth> the first 10 or so dragon classes are really interesting 12:39:34 <andythenorth> when you collect the 51st class of dragon 12:39:38 <andythenorth> 'whatever' 12:40:50 * andythenorth wonders if it can be solved by pretending game starts in 2020 12:43:03 <Wolf01> https://xkcd.com/1902/ lol 12:45:11 <Wolf01> Menawhile, I finished the renders https://imgur.com/a/4hRQI 12:45:19 <Wolf01> *meanwhile too 12:46:11 <andythenorth> problem is fricking high speed pax trains 12:46:14 <andythenorth> they mess up the roster 12:46:34 <andythenorth> from 1860-1985, there is a consistent pattern 12:46:47 <andythenorth> small fast, big fast, small freight, big freight 12:47:23 <andythenorth> but all modern fast pax trains have pointy engine things at both ends 12:47:35 <andythenorth> this looks stupid hauling freight 12:47:51 <andythenorth> or mail 12:51:29 <andythenorth> hmm 12:53:17 <andythenorth> maybe the pointy things are some extra pax-only class 12:56:11 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 12:57:12 * andythenorth such thinking 12:57:17 <andythenorth> brain steam 13:02:01 <Wolf01> Let's check some real life suggestions 13:03:24 <andythenorth> trying to figure out whether to split mail / freight 13:03:33 <andythenorth> currently mail cars refit to freight 13:03:41 <andythenorth> and mail cars go at pax speeds 13:03:52 <andythenorth> so you have super-fast pointy trains hauling explosives or vehicle parts :P 13:03:59 *** ToBeFree has quit IRC 13:08:37 <Wolf01> Real life says really fast freight trains it's useless 13:11:00 <Wolf01> Or ignore RL and move to galaxy express: https://ekizo.mandarake.co.jp/aucimg/8/8/8/5/0000748885.jpeg 13:18:00 <andythenorth> neat 13:18:09 <andythenorth> maybe I should split pax/mail 13:18:21 <andythenorth> hog and sam don’t combine them 13:26:35 *** roidal has joined #openttd 13:33:20 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 13:33:20 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 13:33:25 <Wolf01> o/ 13:33:29 <Alberth> o/ 13:35:56 <Flygon> o/ 13:48:49 <Wolf01> BBL, very later 13:56:06 *** Gja has joined #openttd 13:56:54 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 14:27:52 <Samu> heh, i thought the impact of inflation would be terribad, but apparently it's still under control 14:29:30 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:35:35 <andythenorth> supermop: yo 14:35:52 <supermop_> yo 14:36:15 <supermop_> what to do about inscrutable slack message from boss at 11:59 pm 14:37:11 <supermop_> that seems to be a screed about not sending out some material, when said boss was copied on the email sending it out, and even replied to the thread 14:37:47 * supermop_ is thinking the answer is 'quit job' 14:38:06 <andythenorth> maybe 14:39:20 * andythenorth thinks no HST for Brit Horse 14:39:25 <supermop_> boooo 14:39:33 <supermop_> it should be all HSTs 14:39:42 <andythenorth> I can replace it with something funnner 14:39:50 <andythenorth> an actual engine 14:40:06 <andythenorth> which one? 14:40:10 <supermop_> HST = best brit industrial design 14:40:15 <andythenorth> I know but it’s bad in game :P 14:40:18 <supermop_> way better than a dyson 14:40:25 <andythenorth> what about an iphone? 14:40:29 <supermop_> maybe better than an e-type 14:40:30 <andythenorth> iphone is quite boring actually 14:40:47 <supermop_> ives is a bad designer 14:40:51 <andythenorth> what engine then, for 1990 or so, fast pax 14:40:59 <supermop_> avocet? 14:41:05 <andythenorth> got that already, electric 14:41:07 <andythenorth> need a diesel 14:41:10 <andythenorth> either class 67-ish 14:41:11 <supermop_> hst 14:41:19 <andythenorth> the dual-headed thing is too weird 14:41:26 <andythenorth> and there’s no way to force it to pax-only 14:41:34 <supermop_> sell it one piece 14:41:44 <supermop_> let people buy two if they really want 14:41:44 <andythenorth> maybe 14:41:50 <andythenorth> dunn 14:41:52 <andythenorth> dunno * 14:42:12 <supermop_> or you could just do a dyson vacuum 14:42:16 <andythenorth> hoover :P 14:42:23 <andythenorth> could do an upgraded class 50, and call it dyson 14:42:31 <andythenorth> low quality pun 14:42:59 <andythenorth> the set progression relies on ‘fast diesel’ rather than ‘pax train' 14:43:06 <andythenorth> so HST just doesn’t fit right 14:46:45 <andythenorth> I could do the wagon-attach callback I guess 14:46:50 <andythenorth> and only allow pax coachs 14:46:55 <andythenorth> dunno, biabn 14:47:53 *** debdog has quit IRC 14:51:19 *** debdog has joined #openttd 14:52:48 <supermop_> why can't one of the buffered 43's pull hoppers? 14:54:02 <supermop_> brb laundry 15:03:53 <Samu> https://imgur.com/6e8GYRd - running costs are under control with inflation 15:14:30 *** debdog has quit IRC 15:17:37 <FLHerne> andythenorth: I don't think back-to-back pair of power cars would look too strange on freight 15:17:51 *** debdog has joined #openttd 15:17:56 <FLHerne> Happens with the sleeper trains occasionally https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-HrLMije3G3c/VI7qbo4rEhI/AAAAAAAAEDM/GZiafiK0FtU/s640/blogger-image--178116772.jpg 15:19:01 <FLHerne> http://rail.bodnet.com/hstbeds/213_1331resize.jpg 15:19:58 <Alberth> what makes you think reality is not weird? 15:21:20 <supermop_> 2 43s and a 47? 15:22:02 <andythenorth> FLHerne: is that photoshopped :) 15:22:36 <FLHerne> GWR use 57s (re-engined 47s) on the sleeper, but they're not especially reliable 15:22:54 <andythenorth> http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/50932-back-to-back-hst-power-cars-drag-the-night-sleeper/ 15:22:56 <FLHerne> And there aren't exactly a lot of spare locos out west anymore 15:22:57 <andythenorth> such 15:23:02 <supermop_> so.. the 2x 43s are the backup? 15:23:26 <FLHerne> So that happens quite often, because there /are/ a ton of HST power cars to borrow 15:23:52 <FLHerne> Well, a couple of times a year afaict 15:24:00 <supermop_> so why not just use the 43s? 15:24:23 <FLHerne> andythenorth: No, but this one is https://www.railforums.co.uk/proxy.php?image=http%3A%2F%2Falbum.atomic-systems.com%2FshowPic.php%2F24554%2Fweird.jpg&hash=66294b11ac8f0634299bb701a1ceb891 15:24:40 <andythenorth> I found that one already :) 15:25:00 <FLHerne> supermop_: They don't have a standard ECS supply 15:25:58 <FLHerne> supermop_: They looked at rewiring all the sleeper stock to work with HST power (three-phase 470V AC rather than ~1000V DC), but apparently it wasn't worthwhile 15:26:18 <FLHerne> Anyway, there haven't been any spare HST powercars until very recently 15:36:27 <andythenorth> hmm 15:36:32 <andythenorth> well I am no less puzzled 15:36:45 <andythenorth> the roster has a design, and the HST doesn’t fit :P 15:40:06 <andythenorth> maybe I should fix the railcars 15:41:15 *** glx has joined #openttd 15:41:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 15:42:12 <andythenorth> I’m splitting pax and parcels railcars 15:42:20 <andythenorth> shall I call parcels Scooby Doo? :P 16:10:46 <Alberth> sure 16:29:19 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 16:30:35 <andythenorth> so wagon attach callback….stupid and annoying? 16:30:56 <andythenorth> (that’s the one that limits which wagons can be hauled by which engines) 16:39:13 <frosch123> better than start/stop callback 16:39:37 <supermop_> what if it was only stop callback 16:39:56 <supermop_> "can't stop this train: it lacks a brake van" 16:41:06 <andythenorth> :P 16:41:49 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the worst part about is is that you can trivially circumvent it 16:42:17 <supermop_> Eddi|zuHause: there exist wagons in real life for that 16:43:46 <andythenorth> supermop: I need a fake 1990s fast diesel 16:43:56 <andythenorth> probably end up with a class 67, but that’s borings 16:44:23 <supermop_> if its fake, just take a box with a sloping cab on one or both ends 16:44:29 <andythenorth> name 16:44:31 <andythenorth> and stats 16:44:34 <supermop_> dyson 16:44:49 <andythenorth> probably a trademark :P 16:44:56 <andythenorth> also dyson is a nickname for class 92 :P 16:45:09 <supermop_> trademarks are specific to markets 16:45:36 <andythenorth> yeah, it’s trademarked for toys and games 16:45:44 <supermop_> why 16:46:00 <andythenorth> kids have toy dysons 16:46:03 <supermop_> haha 16:46:06 <supermop_> really? 16:46:07 <andythenorth> we have toy Henry also :P 16:46:09 <supermop_> so british 16:46:30 <andythenorth> https://image.smythstoys.com/original/desktop/122676.jpg 16:46:33 <supermop_> do they have toy hand dryers? 16:46:40 <andythenorth> not yet 16:46:48 <andythenorth> probably sell like hot cakes 16:47:04 <supermop_> henry shop vac is basically a toy already 16:47:14 <andythenorth> let’s fake something 16:47:38 <supermop_> hmm 90s british 16:47:46 <supermop_> 'fatboy' 16:47:47 <andythenorth> refurbished hoover 16:47:50 <supermop_> 'big beat' 16:47:53 <andythenorth> or a re-engined class 47 16:47:59 <andythenorth> or a 67 (skip) 16:48:23 <supermop_> 'blur' 16:48:28 <andythenorth> previous gen pax engine is ‘wizzo’ (class 42 / 52 hybrid) 16:49:03 <supermop_> 'gatecrasher' 16:49:13 <supermop_> does it have to be early 90s? 16:49:26 <andythenorth> no 16:49:29 <andythenorth> flying log? 16:49:37 <andythenorth> Doughnut? 16:49:53 <andythenorth> Fast Jet? 16:50:08 <andythenorth> I just added ‘Plastic Postbox’ for mail :P 16:50:22 <andythenorth> Thunderbird? 16:50:29 <supermop_> good loco name 16:50:47 <supermop_> hopefully players dont think it is only for stuck trains 16:51:19 <supermop_> going to get some lunch 16:52:32 *** glx_ has joined #openttd 16:52:32 *** glx is now known as Guest6709 16:52:32 *** glx_ is now known as glx 16:58:47 *** Guest6709 has quit IRC 17:03:11 *** juzza1 has quit IRC 17:09:05 *** juzza1 has joined #openttd 17:42:23 *** Gja has quit IRC 17:56:17 *** Gja has joined #openttd 18:17:29 *** DDR has quit IRC 18:38:11 <supermop_> hmm maybe I should re-order p list 18:39:29 <supermop_> electric trams, diesel trams, then electric mail trams, then diesel mail trams 18:39:32 <supermop_> feels weird 18:40:02 <supermop_> electric pax, electric mail, diesel pax, diesel mail? 18:40:42 <supermop_> or elec. pax, elec mail, elect articulated pax, elect articulated mail ..... 18:40:53 <supermop_> i wonder how egrvts does it 18:41:44 <frosch123> via refit? 18:41:59 <supermop_> they are separate trams 18:42:07 <supermop_> in both egrvts and my grf 18:42:35 <supermop_> RVs that change between passengers and cargo don't work well due to how roadstops work 18:42:56 <frosch123> true 18:44:39 <supermop_> egrvts seems to go all pax, then all mail 18:45:25 <supermop_> not sure how ill divide between diesel and electric though 19:06:12 <andythenorth> ach 19:06:22 <andythenorth> if a roster is Brit-ish 19:06:29 <andythenorth> and the UK doesn’t have fast passenger trains 19:06:33 <andythenorth> what to do? 19:06:38 <supermop_> dream? 19:06:39 <andythenorth> players complain there’s no fast trains 19:07:07 <andythenorth> but the stats progression doesn’t permit them 19:07:17 <supermop_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/InterCity_250 19:07:34 <andythenorth> the previous electric engine is 3,200hp 19:07:46 <andythenorth> and hp goes up in 800hp incremements 19:07:55 <supermop_> ^ has 7400 19:07:57 <andythenorth> previous speed is 110mph, and it goes up in 15mph increments 19:07:59 <andythenorth> I know :) 19:08:08 <supermop_> whoosh 19:08:51 <andythenorth> sudden huge stats bumps mess up the game 19:08:57 <andythenorth> that’s what railtypes are for 19:09:38 <andythenorth> I am thinking again about adding high speed rail 19:09:43 <andythenorth> from 2000 or so 19:12:21 <supermop_> horse is the realm of idealized BR-ish dreams 19:12:30 <andythenorth> it’s getting horribly realistic tbh 19:12:32 <andythenorth> real names 19:12:34 <supermop_> so a 93-ish loco would make sense 19:12:34 <andythenorth> real stats :( 19:13:09 <supermop_> I assume horse runs in a dream world where steel and coal are still nationalized 19:13:50 <andythenorth> you should try a nightly 19:13:53 <supermop_> how else does a steel mill get built in the middle of nowhere and sit idle for decades until you get around to serving it 19:13:53 <andythenorth> it’s not playable really :P 19:14:21 <andythenorth> hmm, maybe some very fast EMUs with pax on the engine 19:14:25 <andythenorth> like Pendolinos 19:14:34 <supermop_> makes sense 19:14:44 <andythenorth> not sure what problem I’m solving :) 19:14:50 <andythenorth> freight is capped at 100mph anyway :) 19:14:51 <supermop_> me neither 19:15:01 <andythenorth> I should add more railcars, they are easy :P 19:15:32 <supermop_> still cant decide how to stack up my tree of switches 19:16:55 <andythenorth> I don’t want to persuade you to templating :) 19:17:06 <andythenorth> but the switch order only matters for compile times :) 19:17:13 <andythenorth> [and personal satisfaction] 19:17:15 <supermop_> not going to happy until wife has more free time 19:17:23 <supermop_> *happen 19:17:40 <supermop_> if I teach myself python now, ill be bombarding her with questions 19:17:52 <supermop_> same with c 19:18:26 <andythenorth> templating first needs familiarity with writing it manually anyway 19:19:23 <andythenorth> hmm 19:19:31 * andythenorth has some ideas, might be more than one 19:28:01 <andythenorth> high speed passenger electric units 19:28:41 <andythenorth> 2-car units, with magic when multiple units are in a consist 19:34:44 *** Alberth has left #openttd 19:35:38 <supermop_> I wonder what 'date_of_last_service' returns if vehicle has not yet services 19:39:04 <supermop_> also maybe I should make livery random after 2050 or 2100, to break up monotony of 'last' livery going on forever 19:39:53 <supermop_> presumably, in 2100, a 1980s tram is a preserved novelty, and riders would be interested in all the various historic liveries it carried 19:40:39 *** Stimrol has joined #openttd 19:41:26 <supermop_> I'm thinking of shying away from frosch's code to just make livery based on build/depot year absolutely, with no random 19:44:12 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 19:52:59 *** Gja has quit IRC 19:53:49 <supermop_> if date of last service returns YYYY, MM, DD 19:54:07 <supermop_> can I make a decision only on the MM, DD? 19:54:45 <supermop_> like, and tram that goes to depot on may 5th (on any year) gets a special livery? 20:03:49 <andythenorth> someone’s birthday? 20:04:06 <supermop_> in this case the z-class's birthday 20:04:21 <supermop_> but just a way to hide an ultra rare special livery 20:04:45 <supermop_> like an art tram 20:05:26 <supermop_> easier to give it 1 in 256 change to randomly appear, but date feels more special 20:05:42 <supermop_> I think ive dropped the idea though 20:15:01 *** synchris has quit IRC 20:25:37 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 20:27:10 *** Gja has joined #openttd 20:27:30 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 20:29:11 *** gelignite has quit IRC 20:33:02 *** roidal has quit IRC 20:34:41 *** Greyfur has joined #openttd 20:35:47 <Greyfur> Hello! 20:41:16 <andythenorth> lo 20:42:12 <andythenorth> supermop: so I’m adding some express pax electric units 20:42:29 <andythenorth> wondering whether to go all way back to brighton belle? 20:42:39 <andythenorth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_403 20:47:12 <supermop_> nice 20:49:46 <Greyfur> Anyone coding vehicles in NML? 20:51:08 <supermop_> trying to 20:51:32 <Wolf01> Back, better late than never, lost in the mist 20:56:42 * andythenorth is coding vehicles 20:57:08 <Wolf01> I'm stuffed of japanese food 21:05:48 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 21:06:18 *** mindlesstux has joined #openttd 21:12:08 <Wolf01> https://www.flickr.com/photos/95779836@N06/sets/72157687742074994 trolleybus! 21:12:41 <supermop_> Wolf01 !! 21:17:14 * andythenorth bed 21:17:21 <Wolf01> Slashdot: "What Will Replace Computer Keyboards?"... other computer keyboards 21:17:42 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:24:22 <Greyfur> Wolf01: http://www.mestskadoprava.net/galeria/galleries/TMB/Akce/31-TMReckovice_21.4.07-1.jpg 21:24:42 <Greyfur> :P trolleybus. 21:25:05 <Wolf01> :) 21:25:31 <supermop_> implementing frosch's magic for repainting 21:25:39 <supermop_> fingers crossed 21:30:20 *** Greyfur_ has joined #openttd 21:31:16 *** Greyfur has quit IRC 21:43:01 <supermop_> well my implementation is almost twice as long 21:57:55 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 22:11:24 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:21:58 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 22:37:35 *** Gja has quit IRC 22:40:41 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: clearly keyboards will be replaced by minority-report-like gestures 22:40:54 <Eddi|zuHause> those are obviously way superior 22:41:14 <Wolf01> Yeah, Elon already show it IRL 22:42:05 <Wolf01> But I don't think we'll see it in homes, maybe in some companies 22:45:45 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 23:16:04 <supermop_> hmm 23:16:25 <supermop_> I think I am missing something for this random livery stuff 23:16:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 23:24:45 <Greyfur_> Supermop_ You are doing random livery road vehicles? 23:25:00 <supermop_> not entirely random 23:25:04 <supermop_> that would be easy 23:25:10 <Greyfur_> That is something I have been recently doing for Karosa ýéé buses myself... 23:25:29 <Greyfur_> Karosa 700 23:25:35 <supermop_> the idea is that a tram might be in service for 40-50 years 23:25:48 <Greyfur_> yes 23:25:59 <supermop_> and maybe even though it is old, sometimes it gets a 'new' livery 23:26:33 <supermop_> and it should only get the new livery if it is in the depot for service 23:26:34 <Greyfur_> Ok, so does the livery change base on current year? 23:26:51 <supermop_> but not all trams get repainted right away 23:27:06 <supermop_> so it has maybe only a 25% of getting the new paint 23:27:33 <supermop_> and it never will get an 'old' livery to replace a new one 23:27:51 <Greyfur_> I understand, so based on current year a % chance it will be repainted 23:28:09 <supermop_> so the problem is, if every tram always immediately gets the new one, easy just have a current year switch 23:28:53 <supermop_> and if it is just a probability what livery to get, easy, just use random_bits 23:29:25 <supermop_> but to prevent new tram getting old livery, but also allow some old trams to keep old livery 23:29:37 <supermop_> you need some big code with random triggers 23:30:08 <supermop_> because otherwise trams have no storage to 'remember' their current livery 23:30:23 <supermop_> I don't know if it works yet 23:30:51 <Greyfur_> If you know what the old livery was and in which years it has been produced... I think you could do a build_year switch, which would then point towards the current year switch, which would then point towards random_switch 23:31:36 <supermop_> yes but lets say a tram is built 1970, with 1970 paint 23:32:23 <supermop_> it goes to depot in 1980, and switch says 'from 1979 to 1982, 25% chance of getting 1980 paint' 23:32:35 <supermop_> so tram gets lucky and gets new paint 23:32:55 <supermop_> now in 1981, maybe it goes to depot again, rolls dice again 23:33:15 <supermop_> but there is still 75% chance to get the 1970 paint, 23:33:18 *** Greyfur has joined #openttd 23:33:31 <Greyfur> Got disconnected 23:33:35 <Greyfur> sorry 23:33:39 <supermop_> so now newly repainted tram gets painted back to the old 23:33:59 *** Greyfur_ has quit IRC 23:34:11 <Greyfur> yes, I see your point 23:34:18 <supermop_> so you need a way 'ratchet' the liveries 23:34:50 <supermop_> so 1970 ->1980 can happen, but 1980 -> 1970 cannot 23:35:13 <supermop_> I might give up and get rid of the random 23:35:29 <supermop_> because maybe most players do not send tram to depot often 23:35:53 <Greyfur> For custom texts, there is something like return CB_RESULT_NO_TEXT; 23:36:11 <Greyfur> Is there a way to get out of a wswitch without a change? 23:36:33 <supermop_> we couldn't figure one out 23:37:23 <supermop_> the tram doesn't really go 'into' the switch knowing it's current state, so there isn't a way to leave the switch with same state as it entered 23:37:50 <Greyfur> I know that issue 23:38:03 <supermop_> the best way seems to be to just randomly trigger whether it goes to the switch at all 23:38:42 <supermop_> but I have never used random trigger before, so I don't know if I am doing it right 23:38:54 <Greyfur> but that already asks for an option to do no change at all 23:39:00 *** Stimrol has quit IRC 23:39:45 <supermop_> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pr1k87qsc#line-35 23:39:50 <Greyfur> I do have random triggers based on % chance 23:40:02 <supermop_> here is code frosch proposed for me 23:40:42 <Greyfur> I am picking realistic liveries based on the production year 23:41:16 <Greyfur> but you cannot base anything on productrion month, so I have to do it randomly within that year 23:43:13 <supermop_> you can use date of last service maybe? 23:43:38 <supermop_> it is set to the day of construction when you first build it 23:44:08 <supermop_> ofc it will reset everytime it goes to depot 23:44:43 <supermop_> but you could use a vehicle age switch to skip that one 23:45:09 <supermop_> so if vehicle is >1 day old, it no longer looks at date of last service 23:53:43 <Greyfur> That is a good idea. I will try it 23:54:19 *** Samu has quit IRC