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Log for #openttd on 24th October 2017:
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00:00:36  <Samu> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=77176 - new patch, discuss :p
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00:26:40  <Supercheese> Oho
00:26:42  <Supercheese> there be brix
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01:24:03  <Supercheese> water not animated :(
01:24:11  <Supercheese> trees are sexy though
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02:56:25  <joseph222> Hello world
02:57:49  <supermop> yo
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08:06:39  <V453000> _dp_: it's a collage of screenshots :P I was considering doing it properly and make a collage of sprites to create a perfect "screenshot" but eh
08:23:54  <__ln__> have some cats https://imgur.com/gallery/I1FTl
08:26:28  <V453000> solid
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08:32:25  <Samu> hi
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08:40:32  <Wolf01> Moin
08:44:06  <V453000> yo
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09:23:58  <_dp_> o/
09:24:08  <crem> \o
09:24:12  <_dp_> V453000, yeah, I noticed already
09:24:24  <_dp_> V453000, do it properly and make it available in game :p
09:24:54  <V453000> no I mean I would do it properly in photoshop :P
09:25:23  <_dp_> I don't play photoshop :/
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09:42:02  <Wolf01> https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/av79DAZ_460sv.mp4 it was a slug for the entire time O_O
09:43:01  <__ln__> photoshopped®
09:44:43  <V453000> ._.
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10:40:37  <Wolf01> https://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/anjGdVn_700b.jpg found V's home :P :D:D:D:D
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11:18:36  <V453000> SICK
11:18:40  <V453000> moving in now
11:31:37  <Wolf01> Mmmh, Genoa aquarium asking for a name for the newborn seal... Slippy McSealface?
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12:43:16  <Samu> hi
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13:36:16  <debdog> is there a way to change the year for when the rating is happening? 2050 I think it is by default.
13:36:30  <debdog> on a local game, not server
13:37:31  <debdog> or is it hardcode and I'd neet to recompile?
13:38:05  <debdog> version 1.7.0
13:39:08  <supermop_> debdog: no
13:39:37  <debdog> ok
13:39:38  <crem> 2050 is a pretty balanced year anyway!
13:40:09  <supermop_> of course it's a little weird if you start in 2040
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13:40:54  <crem> I think I never reached 2050. (always started at 1930 or 1950)
13:41:05  <supermop_> i guess someone could patch it to be just 100 years from game start or some configurable amount, but the rating, like most legacy artifacts is kind of neglected these days
13:41:23  <crem> too impatient.
13:41:36  <supermop_> because it only kind of makes sense for 256x256, 1950 start, original vehicles,
13:41:42  <supermop_> just like inflation
13:42:15  <V453000> but that's the only correct way to play the game supermop_ , everything else is crime
13:42:25  <V453000> using NewGRFs is heresy
13:42:48  <crem> Also noone should play in resolution higher than 640x480.
13:42:55  <supermop_> criteria like 'have 80 stations' is sort of meaningless on a 2048x2048 map
13:43:08  <V453000> hehe
13:43:20  <debdog> just trying to adopt to my prefered mode of playing OTTD
13:43:31  <supermop_> V453000: ive been meaning to try bricks but have been too busy since yesterday
13:43:35  <V453000> just ignore ratings in tha case debdog :)
13:43:51  <V453000> supermop_: no rush, it only took almost 3 years so now you don't have to hurry :D
13:44:01  <supermop_> debdog: its the kind of thing that a GS could do much more flexibly
13:44:04  <V453000> already scheming new train set
13:44:16  <V453000> I will show andythenorth how shit's not done
13:44:34  <supermop_> GS could take different start dates, map sizes, cheaper or more expensive vehicles into account
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13:55:28  <Montana> Hi everybody. I would like to collaborate on a http://dev.openttdcoop.org project. How must I start?
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14:02:32  <_dp_> 80 stations is completely meaningless on any size of map
14:03:13  <_dp_> as most of other rest of perf rating criterias
14:05:47  <supermop_> _dp_ in 1994 before anyone had spent much time with the game i am sure it seemed like something
14:05:54  <_dp_> and btw, starting year doesn't rly matter as you can max it in like 6-8 years
14:06:16  <_dp_> supermop_, everything seemed like something without the internet :p
14:06:31  <supermop_> they had to throw something together to make it feel 'game like' to the game magazines
14:07:45  <_dp_> well, I get why it could be a good idea back then
14:08:01  <_dp_> it's just now it's like hey, it's 2050, time to show that stupid message
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14:09:56  <debdog> oopsie, was not my intention to start a discussion over this
14:10:42  <_dp_> imagine if irl in 2050 everyone gets huge message like hey, you're a looser, you only have 1 cat out of 80 xD
14:11:07  <supermop_> _dp_: i am fully expecting that msg if i am still alive
14:15:33  <V453000> omg 80 cats
14:15:36  <V453000> life meaning found
14:16:11  <V453000> where is mr south to explain to me how wrong brix is
14:16:14  <V453000> :(
14:16:50  <_dp_> V453000, yeah, and make sure they make at least 20k$/year each :p
14:17:10  <V453000> cats make $?
14:17:45  <_dp_> sure, who else?
14:20:04  <_dp_> well, I guess slugs will do too
14:22:18  <_dp_> somehow I like brix the most on 0.5x %)
14:23:26  <_dp_> 1x is ok, but 2 and 4 not so much... though mb I'm not used to having 2 and 4 in general
14:23:46  <_dp_> or mb it's too much noise
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14:31:41  <Wolf01> Quak
14:32:20  <frosch123> hoi
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14:33:58  <LordAro> quak
14:34:04  <LordAro> insufficient commits :(
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14:36:08  <frosch123> LordAro: did ms start to use "^" to declare pointer variables, like delphi did?
14:39:10  <frosch123> https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/uwp/gaming/relative-mouse-movement <- or more explicitly: what are those "MouseDevice^" things otherwise?
14:41:33  <ST2> https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comments/78ag5h/ive_never_seen_this_type_of_biter_before/  <<-- I bet it's V453000 making tests trying to acomplishing the 80 cats for the 2050 message xD
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14:41:41  <V453000> ._.
14:41:59  <V453000> already saw that one earlier today :P
14:42:23  <ST2> well, I wake up a bit later ^^
14:42:30  <V453000> lazy shit :P
14:42:49  <V453000> no timezone excuses
14:43:14  <ST2> lazyness it's a culture thing and I'l a very cultural person :P
14:43:19  <ST2> I'm*
14:44:07  <V453000> :D damn straight
14:44:13  <LordAro> frosch123: managed C++ smart pointers, i believe
14:44:22  <V453000> I gtfo
14:44:23  <V453000> cya later
14:44:29  <LordAro> only ever seen them used in ancient scary codebases no one wanted to touch
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14:49:17  <frosch123> https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/yk97tc08.aspx <- LordAro: found it
14:49:46  <LordAro> yup
14:49:57  <LordAro> terrifying ancient thing
14:50:00  <LordAro> avoid.
14:51:15  <frosch123> not even ten years old :p
14:51:30  <frosch123> sure, COM is ancient, but the "^" thingie is from msvc 2008
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14:54:34  <frosch123> LordAro: anyway, i discovered that i do not need to learn harfbuzz, but pango
14:54:43  <frosch123> harfbuzz is too low-level
14:56:10  <LordAro> ooh, lovely
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15:43:13  <planetmaker> wow, V453000 , nice BRIX and nice blog article on it :) kudos. And thanks for it :)
15:44:07  <Samu> only 2 stations get cargo? :(
15:44:24  <Samu> if there's 1 coal mine and 5 stations, only 2 get cargo? :(
15:44:44  <Samu> sounds unfair
15:49:37  <Samu> 	Station *st1 = NULL;   // Station with best rating 	Station *st2 = NULL;   // Second best station
15:49:44  <Samu> why :(
15:50:17  <Samu> i remember TTD, it would deliver cargo to at least 3 stations
15:54:19  <Wolf01> "but the "^" thingie"... ugly as shit :(
15:54:58  <Wolf01> I remember I've seen it somewhere and I said "how do I read this code?"
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16:20:02  <andythenorth> V453000: sick blog post
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17:20:24  <supermop_> Samu: ttd only did 2 stations
17:20:41  <supermop_> so did tto
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17:42:03  <Samu> u sure about that? i remember cargo being into 3 stations
17:42:32  <Samu> the 2 best stations were getting the biggest sum, the 3rd would only get a tiny fraction
17:45:06  <Samu> when i was playing vs competitors, they would get cargo
17:45:13  <Samu> ais
17:50:43  <Samu> so, how many stations would get the cargo, then?
17:51:16  <Samu> i've thought of an infinite number
17:51:23  <Samu> but that's impossible lol
17:51:35  <Samu> so, there's 15 companies, why not 15 stations
17:54:56  <Samu> i've made code for up to 3 best stations, but if I'm increasing to 15, i need to come up with a better code :(
17:55:27  <Samu> i also wonder what are desyncs and callbacks, i see some notes advertising about desyncs
17:55:37  <Samu> 	/* These two UpdateStationWaiting's can't be in the statement as then the order 	 * of execution would be undefined and that could cause desyncs with callbacks. */
17:56:59  <Samu> what's a statement :(
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18:05:38  <supermop_> yo andythenorth
18:05:41  <andythenorth> yo
18:10:48  <Wolf01> o/
18:15:12  <Samu> someone explain me https://hg.openttd.org/trunk.hg/file/38f570b5f6b1/src/station_cmd.cpp#l3896
18:15:25  <Samu> what the comment warns about
18:15:47  <Samu> I am trying to update several stations
18:16:38  <Samu> it only got 2, but i'm currently editing the code so it updates up to 3 stations
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18:25:01  <Samu> halp anyone
18:27:37  <Wolf01> It says the order must be always the same or it desyncs with callbacks
18:29:03  <Samu> the two Updates... can't be in the statement... where exactly? :(
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18:29:59  <Samu> what if I have 3 stations :( wut can i dew
18:30:13  <Gustavo6046> dew?
18:30:17  <Gustavo6046> did you mean do
18:30:19  <Gustavo6046> or mountain dew?
18:30:25  <Samu> do
18:35:44  <Samu> haallphttps://paste.openttdcoop.org/pfsmdufv4
18:35:48  <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pfsmdufv4
18:35:56  <Samu> line 101
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18:45:18  <V453000> evening gentlemen
18:45:30  <V453000> planetmaker: andythenorth fuck yeah
18:45:35  <V453000> :)
18:45:43  <V453000> onwards to moar newgrfs
18:51:05  <frosch123> the trees were quite a surprise
18:51:19  <frosch123> did i miss them before, or did you not showcase them here before?
18:51:51  <V453000> I'm pretty sure I did
18:51:53  <V453000> many times
18:52:11  <V453000> I was working on them for like 2-3 months so definitely
18:52:15  <frosch123> i knew the hugging trees, but not the more flowery ones
18:52:36  <V453000> yeah I was making arctic, temperate, tropic in that order
18:52:40  <V453000> and each of them took weeks
18:52:54  <frosch123> so, i missed the tropic ones :)
18:53:16  <V453000> yeah
18:54:20  <frosch123> i liked the idea "make trees smaller so people do not set them to transparent" :p
18:54:58  <V453000> yeah ... from personal experience I'm not sure it works as intended
18:55:02  <V453000> I still tend to hide them
18:55:21  <V453000> might be habit, might be the fact that when building I simply don't want to see anything else than terrain and tracks
18:55:40  <frosch123> also, yay for gridlines :)
18:55:48  <frosch123> i always prefered gridlines
18:57:16  <V453000> I agree at this point
18:57:18  <andythenorth> sometimes I turn trees on for a bit
18:57:22  <andythenorth> but not for long
18:57:23  <V453000> it really improves readability
18:59:12  * andythenorth hasn't written any blog posts
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19:26:17  <andythenorth> :(
19:26:21  <andythenorth> I've angered Jenkins
19:29:32  <frosch123> you are only doing it for the yippee later on
19:33:15  * andythenorth should join coop channel for that
19:33:20  <andythenorth> trains http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/docs/html/trains.html#pony
19:33:24  <andythenorth> needs work
19:33:31  <andythenorth> should I include wagons? o_O
19:35:05  <frosch123> add them at the end, like a separate roster
19:35:27  <frosch123> but docs need to include them, otherwise you cannot link them and argue about stats
19:36:24  <frosch123> there is some encoding issue with names
19:36:32  <frosch123> look at the engine between universal and roca
19:38:41  <andythenorth> so there is
19:38:46  <andythenorth> that caused trouble before
19:38:58  * andythenorth is really bad at solving encoding issues
19:43:17  <Wolf01> The 2-8-2- Collett looks too short
19:43:40  <Wolf01> It looks like a 2-6-0 or a 2-6-2
19:44:38  <Wolf01> Did you swap it with the 2-6-2 above?
19:45:04  <Wolf01> That even looks like the real Collett
19:46:18  <andythenorth> no engine sprites are finished
19:46:22  <andythenorth> they're all placeholder :)
19:46:55  <Wolf01> Oh, k then
19:47:17  <Wolf01> I have troubles making arches with lego instead
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19:57:32  <andythenorth> wagons http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/docs/html/trains.html
19:57:55  <andythenorth> the many errors are known about :)
20:00:25  <frosch123> hmm, ok, the number of wagons dwarf the engines
20:01:24  <andythenorth> yup
20:02:59  <frosch123> hmm, wagons would show other stats than engines
20:03:28  <frosch123> separate table? generations in columns?
20:07:41  <andythenorth> possibly yes
20:11:33  <frosch123> have you decided whether to use the same wagons for all track types?
20:11:37  <frosch123> specifically ng
20:14:07  <andythenorth> ng gets its own wagons
20:14:13  <andythenorth> in pony, a much smaller set
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20:27:49  <andythenorth> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/iron-horse/push/LATEST/docs/html/trains.html
20:27:55  <andythenorth> split the wagon table
20:28:15  <andythenorth> hmm, it's out of order :P
20:28:16  <andythenorth> faff
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20:48:44  <supermop_> purchase sprites for trams done
20:50:44  <andythenorth> what about online docs? o_O
20:51:31  <V453000> rocking 0 forum replies per 24 hours at this point
20:51:38  <V453000> shit's getting real
20:51:41  <V453000> :D
20:58:57  <andythenorth> 0 forum replies is most winning
20:59:10  <andythenorth> [crickets]
21:00:02  <andythenorth> V453000 also tbh if you weren't hanging out here pushing self forward, I think I'd lose interest in grfs
21:00:12  <andythenorth> although we have supermop now too :P
21:00:48  <supermop_> V453000: no replies = perfect grf
21:01:20  <andythenorth> bring back Pikka and Dan I say
21:01:24  <Samu> back
21:02:13  <supermop_> should have just paid pikka 10 grand to make that grf
21:03:05  <Samu> https://hg.openttd.org/trunk.hg/file/38f570b5f6b1/src/station_cmd.cpp#l3896 where is the statement located
21:03:09  <Samu> Wolf01:
21:04:02  <Samu> the statement order
21:04:12  <Wolf01> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
21:05:32  <Samu> do you understand what you have to do if you were to Update 3 times?
21:07:41  <Samu> These two UpdateStationWaiting's can't be in "the" statement
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21:07:59  <Samu> where is that statement at, explain me like i'm a 5 years old
21:09:53  <Samu> plzzz... :(
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21:16:19  <Samu> i need a personal code teacher :(
21:16:43  <supermop_> sounds expensive
21:17:04  <Samu> supermop_: do you know what statements are?
21:17:21  <supermop_> in terms of the source code, no
21:17:35  <supermop_> i don't know anything about C or programming
21:17:37  <Samu> t.t
21:17:46  <supermop_> i barely understand nml
21:19:53  <Samu> how am i testing for desyncs... what are callbacks :(
21:20:00  <Samu> i'm a bit lost here :(
21:20:31  <Wolf01> I think that comment is just missing a "same", but I should actually read and understand what the code does and what are the implications, but I just want to netflix now
21:22:01  <Samu> that code dumps cargo on a station
21:22:11  <Samu> from an industry, or house or so
21:22:40  <Samu> if there are various stations, it dumps to the 2 best rated stations
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21:22:56  <Samu> oh well, i'll see if i can cause desyncs
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21:57:35  <supermop_> tram list here: https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1193380#p1193380
21:59:04  <frosch123> yarra lrv is duplicated
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21:59:31  <supermop_> wrong string ugh
22:00:05  <frosch123> hmm, i am not used to that long vehicle names
22:00:37  <frosch123> there are actually a lot of duplicate names
22:01:10  <supermop_> frosch123: hard to come up with enough
22:01:25  <supermop_> or good names
22:02:03  <frosch123> is it supposed to be a japanese set?
22:02:19  <supermop_> first part of string is fake manufacturer name, 2nd part is type of tram roughly
22:02:56  <supermop_> no, supposed to be manufacturers from around the world
22:03:10  <supermop_> some based loosely on real companies
22:03:52  <supermop_> there are 2 fake japanese companies, 2-3 fake german ones, 2 fake british ones, one fake italian one, one hawaiian one
22:03:59  <supermop_> one swedish
22:04:16  <supermop_> one vietnamese
22:04:43  <frosch123> well, i would suggest to shorten the names a lot
22:04:44  <supermop_> one australian
22:05:16  <supermop_> for the trucks it is similar problem
22:05:35  <supermop_> but those i made up model numbers which helps
22:05:38  <frosch123> Abc Electric Tram -> Abc (electric)
22:05:48  <supermop_> hmmm
22:05:58  <supermop_> yes i guess it is obvious it is electric
22:06:26  <frosch123> there are many which have like 30 letters, and only distinguish in 2
22:06:41  <frosch123> Kaimuki 1M Electric TRam Motor and Trailer
22:06:45  <frosch123> vs. same with "BX"
22:07:07  <frosch123> "Kaimuki 1M" and "Kaimuki BX" would look better
22:07:50  <supermop_> +1
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23:19:33  <Samu> who worked on linkgraphs and cargodist stuff?
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23:57:30  <Wolf01> 'night
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