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00:06:15 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd 00:11:13 *** wsc has joined #openttd 01:09:06 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 01:14:06 *** gelignite_ has joined #openttd 01:21:27 *** gelignite has quit IRC 01:24:19 *** Arveen2 has joined #openttd 01:25:04 *** Arveen has quit IRC 02:41:37 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 02:44:56 *** debdog has quit IRC 02:49:22 *** adikt- has quit IRC 03:00:43 *** adikt has joined #openttd 03:01:40 *** glx has quit IRC 05:43:39 *** snail_UES_ has quit IRC 06:02:30 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:12:15 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 06:14:09 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:19:59 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 06:21:48 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:38:39 *** Samu has joined #openttd 06:39:27 <Samu> hi 07:00:12 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:05:14 *** Progman has joined #openttd 07:07:39 <Samu> _dp_ did you figure out anything about the time complexities 07:20:13 <andythenorth> 64 cargo limit per game you say? :D 07:20:18 * andythenorth wonders about breaching that :P 07:34:09 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 07:45:55 *** k-man has joined #openttd 07:52:33 *** k-man__ has quit IRC 08:02:55 <Wolf01> Hmmm, I miss traffic manager in... transport fever 08:03:38 <andythenorth> maybe 64 cargos is a goal 08:03:41 <andythenorth> hmm 08:04:11 <Samu> I just found a use case where I need https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/8074 to work 08:05:17 <Samu> somebody plz push it to next release, backport request or whatever it is called 08:22:38 <Samu> thx in advance 08:25:17 *** gelignite_ has quit IRC 08:25:50 *** kouett has joined #openttd 08:36:57 <andythenorth> Food Additives....'FADD' label? o_O 08:37:25 <LordAro> andythenorth: ENUM 08:37:31 <andythenorth> ha ha 08:37:41 <andythenorth> too good 08:38:04 <SpComb> EXXX 08:46:48 <andythenorth> Furniture is easy :P 08:47:31 <andythenorth> IKEA 08:47:41 <andythenorth> not really, I used FURN 09:04:34 <Eddi|zuHause> are we still talking about steeltown or is that "done"? :p 09:07:24 <andythenorth> 'done' 09:07:36 <andythenorth> I tried some variations, they're not adding anything 09:07:45 <andythenorth> I tried 'more stuff', also doesn't add anything 09:08:16 *** larsw has joined #openttd 09:08:28 <andythenorth> I am working on new extreme https://firs-test-1.s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/firs-new-extreme/docs/html/economies.html#better_living_through_chemistry 09:08:42 <andythenorth> very early, but the clusters are starting to form 09:09:54 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 09:09:54 <andythenorth> clusters are something like: steel industry, petro and salt chemicals chain, food 09:10:06 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 09:10:25 <andythenorth> the cement / brick / gypsum building chain isn't clustering nicely yet 09:10:39 <andythenorth> the consumer goods cluster really isn't visible 09:12:00 * andythenorth coffee 09:43:05 <Samu> great... bug strikes when least expected 09:48:17 <LordAro> that does tend to be the case 09:49:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick commented on pull request #8074: Fix: [AI/GS] AreWaterTilesConnected wasn't handling aqueducts properly https://git.io/Jvj1t 09:50:34 <Samu> aqueduct was already there 10:00:08 <Samu> interesting, my fix doesn't work here? Im sad 10:00:38 <Samu> must investigate this better 10:01:56 <Samu> ah, i'm testing this wrong 10:02:12 <Samu> the fix is correct 10:02:20 <Samu> it's something with my pathfinder instead 10:02:53 <Samu> deleted 10:05:14 *** larsw has quit IRC 10:06:00 *** Smedles_ has joined #openttd 10:08:23 *** Smedles has quit IRC 10:10:59 <Samu> oh, it's a mix of this bug, and a mix of my pathfinder 10:16:00 <Samu> I'm still doing this check AIMarine.AreWaterTilesConnected(cur_node, next_tile) for when there's water at the tiles, in this case, it returns true 10:16:23 <Samu> but when there's no water at the tile under the aqueduct, the error is on the pathfinder side 10:16:37 <Samu> gonna fix 10:19:23 <Samu> AITile.HasTransportType(next_tile, AITile.TRANSPORT_WATER) 10:19:33 <Samu> cur_node is the tile under aqueduct 10:19:42 <Samu> next_tile is the aqueduct ramp next to cur_node 10:23:17 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 10:23:17 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 10:30:23 *** tokai has quit IRC 10:40:18 <Wolf01> https://youtu.be/gk3eD1g0jrQ but people don't have a life? It's fantastic, but I need one week just to build a nice station... 10:58:42 <Samu> https://i.imgur.com/fKQ443a.png - smartened up 11:00:04 <Samu> but, if i place a canal under the aqueduct, it's gonna behave wrong again, because this time it relies on AreWaterTilesConnected, which is bugged. Just gonna confirm if this is still the case 11:01:45 <Samu> confirmed 11:03:02 <Samu> making me sad :( https://i.imgur.com/hH6ukDJ.png 11:04:09 <Samu> gonna test with PR fix, see if it goes away 11:07:36 <Samu> so slow in debug mode... 11:07:52 <LordAro> Samu: you're rambling again 11:08:02 <LordAro> enough with the stream of consciousness 11:11:07 <Samu> I am sorry, it's... just the way I am, my bad 11:11:26 <andythenorth> interesting https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1230823#p1230823 11:11:51 <andythenorth> I don't encounter any of those issues 11:12:35 <andythenorth> but for work purposes I often end up having specific fixes for things like getting libs in the path, or having a specific lib version 11:12:50 <andythenorth> I never have documentation for these, they're always a moment in time thing and stuff changes 11:13:38 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Neat 11:14:01 <FLHerne> [FIRS, I mean] 11:14:07 <andythenorth> I think it develops 11:14:20 <andythenorth> there's another 10-15 cargos to figure out 11:14:26 <andythenorth> I am going full on Extreme 11:14:59 <andythenorth> it's interesting that in both Steeltown and Better Living Through Chemistry, salt is the root cargo for all industry 11:15:30 <andythenorth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_salt#Cities_and_wars 11:16:30 <andythenorth> this was an accident, not an intent 11:17:35 <FLHerne> andythenorth: I still think too many cargos might be a design mistake :P 11:18:08 <andythenorth> some will turn out to be removable 11:18:30 <FLHerne> Sharing one cargo between several industries gives the player more options and decisions 11:18:38 <andythenorth> I'm not sure if 'household appliances' and 'furniture' might just be 'goods' etc 11:18:54 <andythenorth> in terms of options... 11:18:54 <FLHerne> And anyone playing FIRS Extreme is into that ;-) 11:19:05 <andythenorth> whereas Steeltown aims for 1 destination in most cases 11:19:17 <andythenorth> this new one explicitly will have 2 destinations in more cases 11:19:28 <FLHerne> Yes, the current version isn't too bad 11:20:04 <andythenorth> it's going to have to be acronymed BLTC 11:20:11 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 11:21:11 <FLHerne> I do kind of miss the "every damn corner of the map" thing with Chemicals from older FIRS 11:21:43 <FLHerne> Given one or two refineries, it basically forces you to make a single connected network 11:25:58 *** Smedles_ has quit IRC 11:27:11 *** Smedles has joined #openttd 12:02:55 *** gelignite has quit IRC 12:09:42 *** arikover has joined #openttd 12:15:43 *** Arveen has joined #openttd 12:20:36 *** Arveen2 has quit IRC 12:27:03 *** supermop_Home_ has joined #openttd 12:30:47 <supermop_Home_> hi 12:32:18 *** APTX_ has joined #openttd 12:32:37 *** APTX has quit IRC 12:34:45 *** arikover has quit IRC 12:35:04 *** arikover has joined #openttd 12:57:46 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 13:00:53 *** snail_UES_ has joined #openttd 13:02:22 <frosch123> TrueBrain: how does the developer authentication work? /user/developer gives 404 13:02:58 <TrueBrain> frosch123: make a POST call to /user/developer with a JSON payload {"username": "whatever"} 13:03:13 <frosch123> oh, right, POST not GET 13:03:17 <TrueBrain> the regression uses this, if you need inspiration :D 13:13:51 *** supermop_Home_ has quit IRC 13:28:08 *** arikover has quit IRC 13:28:23 *** arikover has joined #openttd 13:31:43 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 13:35:57 *** arikover has quit IRC 13:36:18 *** arikover has joined #openttd 13:48:57 *** k-man_ has joined #openttd 13:49:53 *** k-man has quit IRC 13:50:00 *** larsw has joined #openttd 13:52:05 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 13:52:22 *** arikover has quit IRC 13:52:27 *** larsw has quit IRC 13:52:40 *** arikover has joined #openttd 14:23:37 <andythenorth> oof 14:23:45 * andythenorth has been making model trains with kids 14:23:51 <andythenorth> failure to ottd 14:25:28 <Wolf01> I, need, sweets. 14:27:45 <Wolf01> A tablet of chocolate should be enough 14:28:35 *** supermop_Home has joined #openttd 14:31:32 * nielsm is looking at nautical maps 14:38:49 <nielsm> I wonder if it would be better to make the depth scale for my water depth patch non-linear 14:39:43 <nielsm> at least for ship navigation, anything deeper than 20 m is probably irrelevant 14:42:14 *** arikover has quit IRC 14:45:22 <nielsm> but having depth 0 to 5 use 20 m increments (10, 20, 40, 60, 80, 100 m) and past that use 50 m increments might give more interesting numbers (150, 200, 250, ... 600 m at depth 15) 14:45:56 <Wolf01> Do we really need more depths than shallowd and deep? 14:45:59 <supermop_Home> affect submarine disaster? 14:46:46 *** arikover has joined #openttd 14:46:57 <supermop_Home> Wolf01 i imagine it would be nice for cost of filling in the ocean 14:47:24 <nielsm> yeah the reason for large depths is mainly to support the costs 14:47:28 <Wolf01> Or even buiding some industries 14:48:03 <nielsm> I did look that up earlier, offshore oil rigs exist on anything from 5 m depth to 2500 m depth :) 14:48:26 <nielsm> though there could be a technological progression in depths they can be built at 14:49:12 <supermop_Home> shallow rigs available from 19xx, deep from 19xx +YY 14:49:45 <supermop_Home> or shallow rigs are more probable to be successful than deep 14:49:50 <nielsm> yeah, allow on depth 0 from 1940, on depth 2 from 1970, any depth from 1990 14:49:52 *** lolek has joined #openttd 14:49:53 <nielsm> something like that 14:50:28 <lolek> hi, so I've did update to openttd 1.10 and I have the streetcar lines button but it's disabled... is there anything I need to do to be able to use it? 14:50:40 <nielsm> hi lolek 14:50:55 <nielsm> yeah you need to have a newgrf loaded that supplies vehicles for it 14:51:01 <supermop_Home> firs dredging site unlikely over the mariana trench - unless you are really desperate for sand 14:51:05 <lolek> hmm 14:51:06 <nielsm> the default vehicle set doesn't have any streetcars 14:51:30 <lolek> nielsm: ok, do you have the name at hand? 14:51:45 <nielsm> there's many, and no I don't have any recommendation 14:51:55 <supermop_Home> lolek there are probably 10-30 options 14:52:15 <supermop_Home> perhaps search online content for 'trams' to see some options 14:52:32 <lolek> if it require the grf... then whey the button is showing even though I don't have it? It should not be visible...if it's not bundled imho 14:52:52 <supermop_Home> lolek that is how it was before 14:53:24 <lolek> well I see it that after few years, there will be tons of inactive buttons just because there may be someone that have the grf 14:53:29 <lolek> I think this is not how it should be 14:53:33 <supermop_Home> new features in 1.10 change the way streetcar lines work in game though 14:53:39 <nielsm> the storybook and goals buttons also show all the time despite requiring a gamescript loaded that uses them 14:53:53 *** D-HUND is now known as debdog 14:56:54 <supermop_Home> also in 16 years there have been only like 3 buttons added, i believe? 14:57:12 <nielsm> sounds about right 15:00:15 <supermop_Home> though i wouldn't mind if the game came with one crappy generic tram built in 15:01:19 <supermop_Home> lolek perhaps you would like opengfx+ for trams? it is very vanilla 15:01:32 <lolek> I'll see 15:01:35 <lolek> thanks for the hint 15:02:02 <supermop_Home> then also I personally like Road Hog, but it is a bit different 15:02:06 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/iQ8k.png 15:02:12 <supermop_Home> good balanced variety though 15:02:20 *** arikover has quit IRC 15:02:33 *** arikover has joined #openttd 15:02:49 <supermop_Home> lolek - you can also look for Mop Generic Road Vehicles, which is my Grf, but it has a few bugs still 15:03:19 <supermop_Home> Road Hog is probably the most fun 15:04:53 <Samu> locks are complicated creatures :| 15:12:08 *** k-man__ has joined #openttd 15:15:53 *** k-man_ has quit IRC 15:17:30 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GrupoDO opened issue #8084: Add option to (de)couple wagons at stations in Orders list https://git.io/JvjdL 15:17:32 *** k-man has joined #openttd 15:18:13 <nielsm> ooooh hohohoho that feature request... 15:18:36 <LordAro> ahaha 15:18:41 <LordAro> "good luck!" 15:18:59 <nielsm> someone did implement a working prototype a year or two ago 15:19:03 <LordAro> close it under the same "no vague feature requests" rule 15:21:15 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7924: Feature: Water tiles have a depth https://git.io/Jvjdn 15:22:03 *** k-man__ has quit IRC 15:25:46 <nielsm> LordAro I'll just add the "good first issue" label ok? 15:29:14 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #8084: Add option to (de)couple wagons at stations in Orders list https://git.io/JvjdL 15:29:14 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #8084: Add option to (de)couple wagons at stations in Orders list https://git.io/JvjdL 15:29:30 <LordAro> nielsm: :p 15:31:37 *** arikover has quit IRC 15:31:38 <Samu> I nearly forgot how strikingly complex it is to pathfind around locks and maintaining connections open 15:31:51 *** arikover has joined #openttd 15:38:26 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 15:38:58 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 15:40:42 *** Flygon has quit IRC 15:42:27 <supermop_Home> sometimes i think about newgrf bridges 15:42:59 <supermop_Home> certain bridges being more cost effective over deep water vs shallow 15:45:20 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro requested changes for pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/Jvjbc 15:49:23 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro requested changes for pull request #7286: Add #2155: newheightmapgame command https://git.io/Jvjbw 15:50:32 <nielsm> supermop_Home absolutely, suspension bridges with spans longer than 3 tiles 15:54:25 <supermop_Home> might need to get a bit more nuance in BRidgeTypes.. something like certain bridges cost scales per tile, maybe per depth per tile 15:55:35 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #7339: Fix #7311: External configuration file does not change directories https://git.io/JvjNe 15:55:36 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro closed pull request #7339: Fix #7311: External configuration file does not change directories https://git.io/fhpS1 15:55:41 <supermop_Home> maybe a suspension bridge is expensive even when short, but cost goes up slower as it gets longer, and doesn't go up much at all with depth 15:56:21 <supermop_Home> wood bridge is cheap, but cost goes up linearly with length and geometrically with depth 15:56:59 <supermop_Home> or maybe it is just impossible to build a wood trestle over a 300m deep fjord 15:57:33 <nielsm> wood bridge might also not support large depths (due to construction techniques), only cantilever over short spans, and have extra high maintenance cost for segments with underwater supports 16:00:19 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #7328: Feature: Improve restart command https://git.io/JvjNq 16:01:20 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro dismissed a review for pull request #7328: Feature: Improve restart command https://git.io/JvCfl 16:03:56 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro commented on pull request #7880: Fix: Remove some redundant steps during world generation https://git.io/JvjNZ 16:03:58 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro closed pull request #7880: Fix: Remove some redundant steps during world generation https://git.io/JeNLr 16:04:03 <nielsm> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Living_root_bridges,_Nongriat_village,_Meghalaya2.jpg :D? 16:05:35 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro approved pull request #7883: Fix: Ensure a minimum gap of water upon generating terrain with original generator https://git.io/JvjNC 16:12:50 <frosch123> changing features that noone uses :) 16:13:00 <frosch123> almost guaranteed to be broken, with noone noticing 16:13:56 <LordAro> quite 16:14:08 <LordAro> why does the freeform edges setting even exist? 16:14:20 <frosch123> to load old savegames 16:14:29 <LordAro> yes, but why a user-configurable setting 16:14:41 <LordAro> just load TTD saves with a water border 16:15:14 <frosch123> why the setting is in the gui, i don't know 16:15:21 <frosch123> but you cannot just load old savegames with the setting on 16:15:27 <frosch123> old maps are bigger 16:15:38 <LordAro> ooh yeah 16:15:41 <LordAro> that stupid edgecase 16:15:45 <LordAro> bleh. 16:15:45 <frosch123> old maps can have stuff on north border, which become void 16:18:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro requested changes for pull request #7886: Group management enhancements https://git.io/JvjN1 16:20:54 <frosch123> what happened to 1.10.1? 16:21:57 <LordAro> someone should do that 16:22:06 <LordAro> apparently no one other than me does releases anymore 16:23:38 <frosch123> oh, i did not know that job was also shared 16:24:28 <LordAro> :p 16:25:28 <frosch123> serious question. some jobs require constant tracking of stuff. if tasks are split over too many people, things are doomed to fail 16:33:58 <Eddi|zuHause> usually you would do releases on a thursday, so you have friday to fix the most pressing issues, and catch the people that are playing on weekends 16:34:25 <frosch123> thanks, very helpful 16:34:42 <Eddi|zuHause> (none of that really applies to openttd, anyway :p) 16:37:11 <LordAro> i'm putting a branch together anyway 16:37:19 <LordAro> just looking at #8074 first, since Samu did ask 16:37:31 <LordAro> as per usual, i'm not convinced it's the correct solution 16:38:53 <frosch123> yes, looks wrong 16:43:37 <LordAro> i was looking at the pathfinder stuff to try to work out how that works, given that works, as far as i'm aware 16:43:57 <frosch123> i think the diagdir needs reversing in the call to gettiletrackstatus 16:44:16 <frosch123> in ship_cmd that parameter is called exitdir 16:44:28 <frosch123> here it seems to be a enterdir 16:46:13 <Eddi|zuHause> don't we have a "EnterDirToExitDir" function or something? 16:46:23 <frosch123> thanks, very helpful 16:46:58 <LordAro> :D 16:48:03 <Eddi|zuHause> there'll be that one moment when he actually means it :p 16:50:40 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 commented on pull request #8074: Fix: [AI/GS] AreWaterTilesConnected wasn't handling aqueducts properly https://git.io/Jvjxd 16:51:21 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] frosch123 requested changes for pull request #8074: Fix: [AI/GS] AreWaterTilesConnected wasn't handling aqueducts properly https://git.io/JvjxA 16:52:03 * frosch123 stop wasting time with PRs, and continues with bananas 16:52:50 <Eddi|zuHause> you forgot a "wasting time" in the second half of that sentence :p 16:53:16 <nielsm> I'm having banana ice cream right now and it does not feel like a waste of my time 16:55:44 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro opened pull request #8085: Prepare for 1.10.1 release https://git.io/JvjpY 16:55:46 *** lolek has left #openttd 16:56:33 <andythenorth> hmm 16:56:35 <andythenorth> GLUE cargo 16:57:18 <nielsm> you can load but never unload 16:58:22 <Eddi|zuHause> we already have that feature, when a coal mine appears next to your coal unload station 16:59:31 <nielsm> reminds me someone should code the manual cargo selection for stations 17:00:30 <Eddi|zuHause> i kinda like the way that is done in transport fever, where that is part of the order list 17:01:47 <Eddi|zuHause> also, i think cargo selection once existed in a patchpack 10 years ago, but got rejected because you could cheat your way out of a bad cargo rating that way 17:03:23 <nielsm> hmm it should be doable without having to reset the ratings though 17:03:55 <nielsm> though it might need an extra flag per cargo 17:07:22 <andythenorth> unrelated, can 'refit fixed cargo' use a list? 17:07:27 <andythenorth> not a single cargo 17:09:07 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #8085: Prepare for 1.10.1 release https://git.io/JvjpF 17:11:59 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 17:15:51 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: what do you mean? 17:26:12 <andythenorth> currently we have 'refit fixed cargo' or 'refit any available' 17:26:19 <andythenorth> refit any available is broken with cdist 17:26:57 <andythenorth> a possible solution is 'refit to any cargo from list...' 17:28:12 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, that would be somewhat like transport fever 17:28:49 <Eddi|zuHause> this would be possible, but it runs into the "the order GUI is already hoplessly overloaded" problem 17:32:13 <andythenorth> I am aware of the UI issue, didn't think of a fix 17:32:19 <andythenorth> other than checkboxes :( 17:32:41 <andythenorth> 'refit any available' creates unwanted cdist links, with no way to remove them 17:33:01 <andythenorth> does *exactly* what the order says, but it's completely unhelpful :) 17:34:25 *** arikover has quit IRC 17:34:38 *** arikover has joined #openttd 17:37:12 *** arikover has quit IRC 17:37:24 *** arikover has joined #openttd 17:38:11 *** glx has joined #openttd 17:38:11 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 17:39:55 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro merged pull request #8085: Prepare for 1.10.1 release https://git.io/JvjpY 17:55:58 *** arikover has quit IRC 17:56:15 *** arikover has joined #openttd 18:03:33 *** arikover has quit IRC 18:09:14 <nielsm> okay so news post and release tag? 18:15:31 <LordAro> sure 18:15:39 <LordAro> nielsm: i delegate the news post to you 18:15:49 <nielsm> on it 18:38:45 <FLHerne> When is ActionD actually executed? At grf load time? 18:39:06 <FLHerne> And if someone changes grf settings in-game, does it all get run again? 18:39:49 <frosch123> yes and yes 18:40:10 <frosch123> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/GrfLoadingStages <- more details 18:40:57 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh opened pull request #156: Add: News post for 1.10.1 https://git.io/JfevL 18:41:27 <nielsm> not sure that's a good post 18:42:42 <Samu> what is root cause analysis for dummies? 18:42:43 <FLHerne> nielsm: I think the admin port change should be described better 18:42:43 <frosch123> it's a bit negative, usually we make fun of players 18:44:11 <FLHerne> "This restores compatibility of the admin port protocol with older versions. Clients that were updated to match 1.10.0 will need changing again, sorry." 18:44:16 <FLHerne> Or so 18:45:05 <FLHerne> And what's a "minor crash bug"? 18:45:33 <nielsm> one that would rarely occur during normal use? 18:47:42 <FLHerne> I guess so, but it still sounds silly 18:48:01 <FLHerne> Also, "ship depot next to a dock" isn't very unusual 18:53:09 <supermop_Home> andythenorth i used refit any available with cdist all the time 18:54:28 <nielsm> how's this instead? https://0x0.st/iQZb.txt 18:57:08 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/iQZA.txt 18:58:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh updated pull request #156: Add: News post for 1.10.1 https://git.io/JfevL 18:59:59 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro approved pull request #156: Add: News post for 1.10.1 https://git.io/JfevN 19:01:05 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro created new tag: 1.10.1 https://git.io/Jfevp 19:01:13 <LordAro> \o/ 19:09:28 <glx> <FLHerne> Also, "ship depot next to a dock" isn't very unusual <-- in details it was ship depot next to a dock and any waypoints 19:10:10 <glx> well and no even chip depot but just tile clearing 19:12:44 <nielsm> hm is this worth fixing? "Sorry about that, we're bringing the old protocol back now, your old tools will now work again." 19:12:50 <nielsm> the two "now" clash a bit 19:17:30 <LordAro> "Sorry about that, we've brought the old protocol back now. Your old tools will work again now (and new tools will be broken again)" ? 19:17:48 <LordAro> doesn't really matter 19:23:12 <nielsm> oh yeah the stickies on tt-forums, the 1.10.0-beta1 thread is still sticky and the 1.10.0 release thread is not 19:23:41 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro merged pull request #156: Add: News post for 1.10.1 https://git.io/JfevL 19:29:02 <andythenorth> supermop_Home how do you clear the spurious links it creates? 19:29:42 <Samu> is 1.10.1 out already? 19:29:44 <Samu> :( 19:29:46 <Samu> :) 19:29:46 <andythenorth> the refit is determined by what's on the station, not what's accepted on the destination 19:30:31 <frosch123> nielsm: noone here is moderator, maybe click the "!" report button? 19:31:36 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8074: Fix: [AI/GS] AreWaterTilesConnected wasn't handling aqueducts properly https://git.io/Jvhkg 19:31:43 <Samu> frosch123, hi 19:32:28 <Samu> sorry, I don't know what's a root cause analysis, but you were right, it was using the wrong diagdirection, but it's only wrong for bridges, which is kinda strange 19:33:23 <Samu> the new fix is cleaner 19:34:59 <nielsm> root cause = the actual real reason something is happening 19:36:43 <andythenorth> sometimes found with 5 whys 19:36:51 <andythenorth> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_whys 19:37:00 <nielsm> like taking painkillers to relieve a headache, without figuring out why you got that headache and fixing the reason behind the headache 19:39:00 <supermop_Home> andythenorth stuff usually doesn't show up at a station until something refited to load it does 19:39:51 <andythenorth> occasionally (rarely) I have stations where I pickup cargo for multiple destinations 19:39:52 <supermop_Home> and cdist wont distribute it to a place without a destination 19:40:08 <andythenorth> 'any station' 19:40:20 <andythenorth> it will and it does :) 19:40:30 <andythenorth> I have multiple savegames with the behaviour 19:40:42 <supermop_Home> any station is not really distribution 19:41:00 <supermop_Home> trains seem to pick up distributed cargo first 19:41:01 <andythenorth> no, it just loads it at A, then leaves it on the train at B where it is not accepted 19:41:15 <andythenorth> then back to A, until all trains are full of non-destined cargo :) 19:41:54 <Samu> frosch123, perhaps it doesn't even need to check if it's bridge tile, let me confirm 19:42:25 <supermop_Home> idk usually works for me, any non productive refits generally seem to go away with time 19:42:56 <supermop_Home> maybe you need to bootstrap the links between your intended stations a bit 19:43:30 <supermop_Home> with a few runs with explicitly set refits 19:44:04 <supermop_Home> or a few places along the trains orders where it explicitly does one thing 19:44:51 <supermop_Home> I feel like you often are remaking that x or y about cdist doesn't work at all and it's always puzzled me 19:45:05 <supermop_Home> as I've never really had such problems with it 19:46:11 <supermop_Home> maybe i can dig up a game from few months ago where i do have widespread autorefiting 19:47:12 <supermop_Home> you can also force links to be strongly persistent with a sort of piglet set up 19:48:11 <supermop_Home> like maybe in addition to 30 huge trains taking ore from x mine to y and z mills, there is also one lonely truck ordered to do that 19:48:47 <supermop_Home> it doesn't even need to drive - it can just sit in the depot with those orderes 19:49:41 <supermop_Home> i usually don't use those, except when bootstapping links i want on complex networks - added benefit is you have some use for cute trucks 19:50:04 <Samu> confirmed! 19:50:15 <Samu> code can be even more simple, brb fixing 19:51:53 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] SamuXarick updated pull request #8074: Fix: [AI/GS] AreWaterTilesConnected wasn't handling aqueducts properly https://git.io/Jvhkg 19:56:18 <nielsm> website release time? 19:57:08 <Samu> too bad it didn't make it to 1.10.1 :( I was slow today 19:58:51 <LordAro> nielsm: yup 19:59:05 <LordAro> i was waiting for 1.10.1 to appear on it 20:01:15 <andythenorth> a simple 'delete link' in cdist would do the job 20:01:24 <andythenorth> but it's adding a feature to fix a broken 20:03:55 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/website] LordAro created new tag: 1.3.7 https://git.io/JfeU9 20:04:03 <andythenorth> supermop_Home do you refit your vehicles when you buy them? 20:05:09 <supermop_Home> usually to what ever they will pick up first 20:06:03 <nielsm> hmm... are the default train engines supposed to expire after 1000+ years or something? 20:06:19 <supermop_Home> sometimes to an assortment, and will let it run a few times before telling it to autorefit 20:06:29 <nielsm> I just joined a 1.10.0 server with no train newgrfs, year 3219, and there are no train engines buildable, it does have wagons tho 20:06:51 <LordAro> nielsm: i believe that's a known "issue" 20:07:05 <LordAro> TTD trains all have an expiry date 20:07:10 <LordAro> but not all wagons do 20:10:25 <nielsm> and that's not fixable because it might break newgrf compat 20:13:28 <LordAro> yup. 20:14:32 <FLHerne> andythenorth: I used to see that years ago, but I haven't for a long time 20:14:58 <andythenorth> I had it every time I tried in recent games 20:15:43 <andythenorth> in one case I solved it by moving the station to remove an industry from catchment 20:16:06 <andythenorth> in the other I refitted consist to exact combination of cargos, and abandoned 'refit any available' 20:16:35 <andythenorth> anyway, arguing in irc is pointless 20:16:51 <andythenorth> I haven't filed an issue because I'm *never* not using unreleased grfs 20:17:06 <andythenorth> and I've always reloaded grfs, which means savegame is ineligible 20:22:49 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 20:23:17 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-frontend-web] frosch123 updated pull request #2: Add: first version of the web front-end to new BaNaNaS server. https://git.io/Jvh5V 20:25:34 <frosch123> TrueBrain: frontend works mostly with development authentication. it lacks configuration (api url), uploading files, and it disagrees with the api about the editability of "availability" 20:26:08 <TrueBrain> you currently cannot edit availability. I believe it is not even part of the API specs atm? 20:26:22 <TrueBrain> currently latest upload is new-games, all others are savegames-only 20:26:22 <frosch123> yes, that's what i noticed :p 20:26:25 <TrueBrain> :D 20:26:28 <TrueBrain> but nice :D 20:26:50 <TrueBrain> I will give it a look tomorrow, see if I can put it in a docker and on staging 20:26:57 <TrueBrain> maybe that motivates some other peoplle to write some CSS :D 20:27:06 <TrueBrain> and I will check out tus-javascript I guess :) 20:32:11 <frosch123> TrueBrain: oh, and validation of "compatibility" can trigger https://pastebin.com/5z3bXJt6 20:32:43 <TrueBrain> I need a bit more information :) Like the request that was triggering it or something :) 20:33:37 <frosch123> 'http://localhost:8080/package/game-script/53495659/2016-04-26T20%3A51%3A13%2B00%3A00': {'compatibility': [{'name': 'master', 'conditions': ['>= 1.3.0', '< 1.5.0']}]} 20:35:52 <TrueBrain> ah, I see, yes 20:36:07 <TrueBrain> some as with dependencies, I am sure 20:36:50 <TrueBrain> easy fix, but I will also add a regression-test :) 20:37:04 <TrueBrain> well, not today, but .. tomorrow :) 20:38:03 <TrueBrain> that is the only bug you manage to trigger? Awh :( :P 20:39:15 <frosch123> PUT new-package/token is a bit weird 20:39:26 <frosch123> i think it rejects all data as long as no file is uploaded 20:39:41 <frosch123> but since i can't upload files yet, that may also be a myth 20:40:01 <TrueBrain> no, it doesn't care if you have files or not 20:41:00 <frosch123> ah, nvm, it's again about the "availability" 20:41:07 <TrueBrain> but I see the regression-suite is not validating that, so let me see what happens 20:41:30 <frosch123> is editing of "availability" easy to add, or shall i remove the entries for that? 20:41:48 <TrueBrain> the technical implementation is not that difficult, just the implications are 20:41:50 <TrueBrain> so lets remove it for now 20:42:51 <TrueBrain> I guess the biggest problem to solve there is the OpenTTD client btw :P 20:43:07 <TrueBrain> I wrote it in the wishlist :) 20:44:07 <TrueBrain> that earlier issue you found I fixed for new-package, but not for package :D Silly :P 20:45:18 <debdog> sometimes I wish https://wiki.openttd.org/File:Convert_rail.png would mean ctrl-z 20:46:32 <nielsm> again, the oil rig pickle https://0x0.st/iQN0.png 20:46:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-api] TrueBrain updated pull request #3: Add: first version of bananas-api https://git.io/JvhXb 20:46:53 <nielsm> (and I can't serve them with ships because the world has forgotten how to build ships) 20:47:08 <TrueBrain> frosch123: bug-fixes are now pushed; I have not yet pushed it to staging. Also a job for tomorrow :D 20:48:59 <TrueBrain> frosch123: and can I suggest you look into the click module? It is awesome for argument parsing. Might solve your TODOs around endpoints :D Feel free to look at bananas-frontend-cli how I did that there :) 20:49:20 <TrueBrain> (I am going to need that for AWS anyway, so I can take a look at it too :) ) 20:50:01 <frosch123> currently i run it though the flask-runner 20:50:11 <frosch123> that is cool since it autoreloads stuff when files change 20:50:19 <frosch123> but it does not pass parameters through 20:50:29 <TrueBrain> that is ... odd 20:50:34 <TrueBrain> not what you would expect from flask :) 20:51:03 <frosch123> it thinks all parameters are for itself, and reports unknown ones 20:51:28 <TrueBrain> normally applications support --, where everything after is for the application, not for the runner 20:51:34 <TrueBrain> no clue if flask knows about that :P 20:52:04 <frosch123> hmm, now i am unsure whether i tried that :) 20:57:28 <TrueBrain> hmm, I wonder what happens if you make a change and revert it 20:57:34 <TrueBrain> I think it will try to commit an empty commit in that case 20:57:37 <TrueBrain> and fail :P 20:58:05 <frosch123> you consider empty name/version valid? 20:58:15 <frosch123> you only reject None 20:58:18 <TrueBrain> empty name only if the package already exists 20:58:27 <TrueBrain> owh, yes, currently "" is valid 20:58:29 <TrueBrain> for everything 20:58:37 <TrueBrain> guess I should put a min-length on the schema 20:58:56 <frosch123> for edtiing versions "" means info from package 20:59:00 <TrueBrain> it had a max :) Not a min :) 20:59:06 <LordAro> hmm, the new news post hasn't appeared 20:59:27 <LordAro> wait, yes it has 20:59:30 <LordAro> silly caching 20:59:35 <TrueBrain> robert[m]1: you want that, or it is doing that? 20:59:41 <TrueBrain> huh? 20:59:53 <TrueBrain> frosch123: that was meant for you 20:59:57 <TrueBrain> no clue what happened there 21:00:08 <TrueBrain> I would consider it a bug, if "" reverts the value 21:00:18 <frosch123> TrueBrain: the frontend does that 21:00:23 <TrueBrain> ah, yes, HTML 21:00:38 <frosch123> if the api reports "" for version.name, i display package.name 21:00:53 <frosch123> so i also expect that version.name can be set to "" 21:01:03 <TrueBrain> I have to check what happens with "", tbh. I don't know :) 21:01:11 <frosch123> it works so far 21:01:25 <TrueBrain> name should not be set in the dict if you should use package.name 21:01:41 <TrueBrain> and "" should be refused 21:01:49 <TrueBrain> but that gives the question: how to unset it once you set it 21:01:55 <TrueBrain> JSON has null, so I guess 21:03:05 <TrueBrain> weird that I did add "max" to schema validations, but not "min" 21:03:51 <TrueBrain> now I wonder what the to-disk writer does :D 21:04:14 <TrueBrain> yeah, that is going to write an empty string 21:04:20 <TrueBrain> that should not be happening :D 21:04:43 <frosch123> "" is way more convenient than nul for me 21:04:53 <TrueBrain> problem is that they have two different meanings 21:05:02 <TrueBrain> but I understand your point there :) 21:05:18 <TrueBrain> I don't mind if we make "" to: set to package.NNN 21:05:27 <frosch123> i put the package stuff into "placeholder", so "" looks cool in the gui 21:05:32 <TrueBrain> but the API should never return a `name: ""` 21:05:54 <frosch123> yes, GET can skip the entry in the dict, that is fine 21:05:59 <frosch123> i only need "" for PUT 21:06:08 <TrueBrain> it already should; but I am pretty sure it doesn't after you did a PUT of "" :) 21:06:13 <TrueBrain> yeah, that is fine 21:06:25 <TrueBrain> I need to fix some code, but that is easy 21:07:39 <TrueBrain> wrote it down so I won't forget :D 21:08:00 <TrueBrain> and off to bed for me; nn! 21:09:08 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/bananas-frontend-web] frosch123 updated pull request #2: Add: first version of the web front-end to new BaNaNaS server. https://git.io/Jvh5V 21:09:39 <TrueBrain> Owh, and LordAro, the website has a cache value of 1 hour; so you need a force-reload before it picks up the new version :) 21:09:46 <TrueBrain> Guess that is what you noticed ;) 21:09:59 <LordAro> yeah, could've sworn i did that already 21:10:01 <LordAro> but eh 21:10:20 <frosch123> oh, twitter 21:12:21 <_dp_> is that the smallest diff between openttd releases ever? xD 21:12:55 <glx> hmm I think we did smaller than that 21:13:36 <frosch123> don't mention 0.4.0.1 21:16:21 <frosch123> i always wonder whether people have set-up auto-retweets, or whether they are staring at their phones all the time 21:18:45 <glx> I do it manually when I remember to do it :) 21:24:01 *** Samu has quit IRC 21:25:29 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:31:38 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:42:18 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 21:48:37 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:18:39 *** nielsm has quit IRC 22:22:29 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/JfeqT 22:37:05 *** gelignite has quit IRC 22:58:45 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbqc 23:16:56 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code) https://git.io/fhbqc 23:22:28 *** epoll has quit IRC 23:23:01 *** syr has joined #openttd