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Log for #openttd on 26th May 2012:
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00:21:12  <Wolf01> 'night
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02:46:10  <Nat_aS> Hey, if cargo spends a long time waiting for a transfer, does that make the value go down?
02:47:07  <Nat_aS> because I had a bunch of goods waiting at a port because of a botched cargodist experement, and I tried to get rid of it with trucks, but I can't seem to earn any money off of it
02:47:24  <Nat_aS> no matter how fast or cheap the truck is, it loses money with each transfer.
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06:41:00  <Terkhen> good morning
06:42:04  <Terkhen> Nat_aS: yes, the value goes down, see http://wiki.openttd.org/Cargo_income
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07:02:53  <Nat_aS> I eventualy just built an outrigger for the port into the city so it could accept goods
07:03:09  <Nat_aS> and changed the orders from transfer to deliver.
07:03:42  <Nat_aS> so you are saying if I kept up the trucks, when they got all the old cargo out of there, and started delivering new goods, they would have eventualy made money?
07:03:52  <Nat_aS> it's just the batch that was sitting in the wherehouse was too old?
07:04:08  <Nat_aS> there's no way to purge a station is there?
07:04:14  <Nat_aS> dump all the cargo?
07:04:50  <Terkhen> to my knowledge, no
07:05:09  <Nat_aS> could always demolish and rebuild it
07:05:24  <Terkhen> waiting cargo is too tied to the station rating system, you can demolish, build new station, change orders
07:05:44  <Terkhen> if you keep a few groups with shared orders, it is easy
07:05:50  <Terkhen> if not... a pain
07:06:04  <Nat_aS> is transfer income real money?
07:06:17  <Nat_aS> or is it just a loan untill the cargo is delivered for real?
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07:25:08  <Terkhen> Nat_AFK: it is an estimate IIRC, see http://wiki.openttd.org/Negative_income_with_feeder_service
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08:11:48  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24279 /trunk/src/script/api/game/game_window.hpp.sq: -Fix: Someone forgot a call to squirrel_export somewhen.
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09:05:20  <Wolf01> hello
09:05:38  <Terkhen> hi Wolf01
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11:40:23  <hackalittlebit> Does anybody know if it is really necesarry that z == 0 thingy in tunnelbridge_cmd.cpp line 1716 revision 1 you can find here: http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=160483 done by Tron. I was not able to see earlier version.
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11:45:10  <frosch123> unlikely
11:45:19  <frosch123> tunnnels have a flat slope
11:45:23  <frosch123> so z should be 0 all the time
11:46:12  <hackalittlebit> yeah but there are allays surprises :(
11:46:16  <frosch123> hmm, though maybe z refers to the previous tile
11:46:25  <frosch123> then it might distinguish between entering and leaving
11:46:53  <frosch123> though that's what dir does
11:48:13  <Rubidium> what about jumping down the tunnel entrance from a bridge, up from another tunnel, or from someone adding a rail towards the entrance (but from the wrong way)
11:48:47  <Rubidium> similar to jumping onto a bridge head when driving below the bridge into the bridge head
11:50:04  <hackalittlebit> yeah but doesn't line 1661  take care of that?
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11:50:47  <Rubidium> don't know, just guessing
11:51:04  <Rubidium> (without looking at the source)
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11:52:07  <hackalittlebit> ok, I'll test all posibilities and will report
11:52:59  <hackalittlebit> does first ottd code still exist ?
11:54:35  <Alberth> r1 is the first ottd code that exists :)
11:55:14  <hackalittlebit> well it is in there.
11:55:19  <Rubidium> http://binaries.openttd.org/releases/0.1.4/openttd-0.1.4-source.zip might be somewhat earlier
11:55:26  <frosch123> there also exists ottd 0.1
11:55:41  <frosch123> it's linked from the wiki history page or so
11:55:49  <frosch123> some post by *rudge
11:55:57  <hackalittlebit> thanks guys
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12:38:18  <andythenorth> hello
12:39:53  <Alberth> hello
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14:07:56  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24280 /trunk/src/news_gui.cpp: -Cleanup: Remove uselessly duplicated code to set string parameters in company news.
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14:08:04  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24281 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Cleanup: Merge all company news subtypes into a single one; they all behave the same.
14:08:07  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24282 /trunk/src/ (5 files): -Codechange: Add AddVehicleAdviceNewsItem function to preemptively deduplicate code.
14:08:11  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24283 /trunk/src/ (disaster_cmd.cpp industry_cmd.cpp news_func.h town_cmd.cpp): -Codechange: Add AddTileNewsItem function to preemptively deduplicate code.
14:08:18  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24284 /trunk/src/ (18 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: Remove NewsSubtypes and directly use NewsTypes and NewsFlag instead.
14:08:21  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24285 /trunk/src/ (news_func.h news_gui.cpp news_type.h): -Codechange: Add a more explcit NewsFlag to indicate that the first string parameter is a vehicle ID.
14:08:28  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24286 /trunk/src/script/api/ (game/game_news.hpp.sq game_changelog.hpp script_news.hpp): -Add: [GS] Some more GSNews::NewsItem::NewsTypes.
14:08:37  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24287 /trunk/src/ (lang/english.txt town_cmd.cpp): -Feature [FS#2688]: News item for exclusive transport rights. (based on patch by Grantovich)
14:08:41  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24288 /trunk/src/script/api/squirrel_export.awk: -Fix: squirrel_export should match stuff like 'virtual', 'static' and 'const' only as whole words.
14:08:46  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24289 /trunk/src/ (6 files in 6 dirs): -Add: [Script] Base class for script events involving a company and a town.
14:08:54  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24290 /trunk/src/ (12 files in 7 dirs): -Add: [Script] ScriptEventExclusiveTransportRights.
14:08:59  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: frosch * r24291 /trunk/src/ (12 files in 7 dirs): -Add: [Script] ScriptEventRoadReconstruction.
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15:36:14  <frosch123> V453000: does the 1st gen tanker intentionally blink like a lighthouse?
15:36:35  <frosch123> in any other set it would be a bug, here i am not sure :)
15:36:38  <V453000> I am not aware of that
15:37:02  <frosch123> at least when refitted to toyland plastic
15:37:04  <V453000> which cargo?
15:37:06  <V453000> hm
15:38:08  <frosch123> correction, it blinks like a radio tower, not like a lighthouse
15:38:10  <Terkhen> oh, I just triggered that in ogfx-rv too :P
15:38:39  <V453000> oh wow :D thanks
15:38:40  <Terkhen> start a game with ogfx-rv and FIRS in toyland -> the second livestock truck looks like a tanker that blinks
15:38:44  <V453000> wonder how I managed that
15:38:56  <V453000> thank you frosch123
15:39:02  <frosch123> np :)
15:39:30  <frosch123> btw. we need some method to filter the purchase list for engine class
15:39:39  <frosch123> (strong, med, fast, ...)
15:40:40  <V453000> hm
15:40:44  <V453000> just sort it by ID I guess
15:40:47  <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: typically it's an effect of mindlessly converting something from 32bpp to 8bpp, when not disabling the special colours before
15:41:04  <V453000> nah Eddi I just somehow managed to pick wrong color :)
15:41:24  <frosch123> [17:48] <V453000> just sort it by ID I guess <- ooops, did not notice that they are consecutive
15:42:03  <V453000> yeah, but filter would of course do it better
15:42:08  <Eddi|zuHause> maybe nml could warn for magic colours, unless specifically enabled in the spriteblock
15:42:23  <V453000> hehe, perhaps
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15:57:06  <Rubidium> it already does warn for one magic colour ;)
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15:57:58  <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: yes, but it needs some syntax for disabling the warning, if you do want it...
15:58:29  <Eddi|zuHause> preferrably not in the ##pragma style
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16:02:12  <LordAro> Hey all!
16:06:27  <V453000> frosch123: fixed, will be in the next version :P thank you very much!
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16:13:08  <Terkhen> hi LordAro
16:15:56  <LordAro> hi Terkhen
16:16:11  <Alberth> hi
16:16:30  <LordAro> hai Alberth :)
16:19:17  <Alberth> how are you doing? busy with school?
16:22:43  <LordAro> almost finished exams now :) only 2 left
16:23:26  <Terkhen> good luck :P
16:24:35  <LordAro> thanks :) should be ok - computing  - "programming fundamentals" - so easy :P
16:24:49  <LordAro> and further pure maths, which is (reasonably) easy :)
16:25:15  <Alberth> hmm, fundamentals.  That's questions like "what's a variable" ? :)
16:25:35  <LordAro> exactly so :D
16:26:13  <Alberth> for a sufficiently limited set of languages, that's an easy question indeed :D
16:27:34  <LordAro> indeed so
16:28:25  <LordAro> the 'main' language used is 'psuedocode' which is fairly similar to BASIC
16:28:59  <Alberth> haha :)
16:29:21  <Alberth> my pseudo-language is way more abstract, it does not have variables, usually :p
16:29:54  <LordAro> http://pdf.ocr.org.uk/download/pp_11_jun/ocr_66316_pp_11_jun_gce_uf452.pdf <-- page 8 for an example
16:30:14  <Eddi|zuHause> that's difficult... how do you answer a question like "why do you write $ in front of variables in PHP?" without insulting your professor?
16:30:36  <frosch123> euh... haha... is the non-fixed-distance signal-autocomplete also supposed to alter the distance if trains are in the way?
16:31:16  <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: the whole "vehicle is in the way" thing is annoying most of the time...
16:31:40  <Eddi|zuHause> e.g. rebuilding a busy road/tram junction
16:32:47  <Alberth> pseudo language with keywords and "keyword violation errors", that's a new one :)
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16:34:28  <Eddi|zuHause> "an app for identifying ladybirds"... i'd specify that as "takes a photo as input"...
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16:34:43  <frosch123> haha, yeah, so did i :)
16:34:53  <Eddi|zuHause> (and use an OCR lib to count the dots)
16:35:29  <frosch123> anyway, i have only seen two types anyway: red with black dots, either 2 or 7
16:35:33  <frosch123> s/2/3
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16:35:39  <frosch123> hmm, no, 2 :s
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16:36:12  <frosch123> so, i think two big buttons labeled "2" and "7"
16:36:29  <frosch123> which print "ladybird with 2 resp. 7 dots"
16:36:30  <LordAro> ha, wouldn't get you the marks though i'm afraid: http://pdf.ocr.org.uk/download/ms_11/ocr_65250_ms_11_gce_uf452_jun.pdf
16:36:38  <frosch123> alternatively the "7" button could be labeled "many"
16:36:57  <frosch123> LordAro: i always fail in thse kind of tests
16:37:41  <LordAro> thats because you fail to remember that these tests are _not_ set by people who code for a living ;)
16:39:01  <frosch123> i already failed in them before i made money with it
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16:40:07  <Eddi|zuHause> "indexed sequential file" ... just use a database damnit...
16:40:23  <LordAro> yeah, hate those questions :)
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16:40:34  <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: wrong answer
16:40:37  <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i've seen yellow ladybirds
16:40:55  <Eddi|zuHause> with a lot more dots
16:42:45  <Eddi|zuHause> "11 digit phone number" -- that totally fails for international numbers...
16:43:38  <LordAro> shhh!
16:44:20  <Eddi|zuHause> "reset the file" <-- that is a totally wrong question... file handling by default resets the file
16:46:30  <LordAro> stop finding flaws in my exam paper :P
16:47:01  <frosch123> the test is liked most was the c programming exam
16:47:07  <frosch123> s/is/i/
16:47:52  <frosch123> it was supposed to be two hours in front of a pc to write one program out of three cases
16:48:24  <Eddi|zuHause> no exam of ours ever involved "write a program"
16:48:31  <frosch123> unfortunatelly the fileserver had hdd failture the night before, and as you expect from a cs institute, they did not manage to restore it
16:48:59  <Eddi|zuHause> because those are impossible to check
16:49:08  <Eddi|zuHause> so nobody wants to review them
16:49:15  <Eddi|zuHause> thus nobody asks this kind of question
16:49:31  <frosch123> so, we first waited 2 hours, then they allowed us to start on paper to fight the boredom
16:49:44  <LordAro> why can i not write a program in whitespace? :D
16:50:08  <frosch123> well, those who were able to program, could also solve them on paper without compiler for syntax checking :p
16:50:33  <Eddi|zuHause> i never write correct syntax ...
16:50:37  <frosch123> LordAro: you may with an editor that visualises whitespace
16:51:55  <LordAro> how about when written on paper? :P
16:52:13  <Alberth> LordAro: use Piet: http://www.dangermouse.net/esoteric/piet/samples.html
16:52:16  <frosch123> you are allowed to write the unicode numbers
16:52:51  <Eddi|zuHause> LordAro: you can write in Ook! instead
16:53:00  <LordAro> i came across that when roaming wikipedia :)
16:53:01  <Eddi|zuHause> it's equally powerful
16:53:14  <LordAro> (piet) bitmaps for programs sounds fun :)
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16:54:09  <frosch123> Alberth: considering the hello world programs on that page, it gives "nice code" a quite different meaning :)
16:54:30  <Alberth> it's one of the few languages where "visual language" actually means something :p
16:54:50  <Alberth> Ook!  looks like fun too :)
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16:55:22  <LordAro> brainfuck always looked amusing :)
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17:02:32  * Alberth ponders the game of life in piet :p
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17:19:33  <frosch123> hmm, does av8 not support toyland?
17:19:41  <frosch123> it's 1944 and still no planes :(
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17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: translators * r24292 /trunk/src/lang/ (9 files): (log message trimmed)
17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: belarusian - 15 changes by Wowanxm
17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: catalan - 6 changes by arnau
17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: english_US - 2 changes by Rubidium
17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: finnish - 6 changes by jpx_
17:38:00  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: italian - 14 changes by lorenzodv
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18:52:20  <michi_cc> Let the yearly madness begin! :p
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19:00:22  <Eddi|zuHause> that looks like lord of the dance, just with eastern music
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19:15:34  <michi_cc> I'm awake, you can stop now.
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19:16:01  <Eddi|zuHause> haha :p
19:16:04  <Rubidium> at least the NL has defended its record succesfully ;)
19:21:19  <Eddi|zuHause> what record was that?
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19:21:37  <frosch123> having the most orange dresses on stage
19:22:10  <Rubidium> consecutive successfull attempts at not making the final
19:22:38  <Eddi|zuHause> well, germany can't have that problem (anymore) :p
19:23:45  <frosch123> anymore?
19:23:56  <frosch123> could it ever have?
19:24:07  <michi_cc> I think we always payed enough :)
19:24:41  <michi_cc> Oh god, Russia now. Run!
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19:46:23  <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: iirc, the "big five" rule was introduced because germany didn't make the finals once
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19:50:06  <frosch123> really? that would make it even more silly :)
19:52:52  <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: If I haven't read anything wrong, semi-finals are since 2004 (and Germany was in the final then) and since 2005 the big five rule is in action.
19:56:53  <Rubidium> they didn't make it in 1996
20:04:23  <michi_cc> Ah, indeed. I didn't check so far back seeing that there was no real semi-final then.
20:04:46  <michi_cc> So, yes, that rule was caused by us :)
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20:12:30  <Eddi|zuHause> that swedish song is the first one that i'd say it has victory potential
20:22:31  <michi_cc> Might not be a winner, but I thought Italy wasn't bad either.
20:23:40  <michi_cc> But yes, according to bookmakers and others it's either Sweden or the russian grannies.
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20:54:25  <Eddi|zuHause> i found nothing particularly "interesting" about the russian song...
20:54:41  <michi_cc> Me neither.
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21:23:01  <CIA-17> OpenTTD: alberth * r24293 /trunk/src/misc_gui.cpp: -Fix: Increase the left and right margins of the text in the yes/no query window.
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21:30:13  <Terkhen> good nght
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22:21:59  <Wolf01> 'night
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