Log for #openttd on 10th July 2019:
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02:12:09  <Eddi|zuHause> <Wolf01> I should put a limit on playtime <-- whenever i try that i just get anxious about the thing i'm not allowed to do right now, and not get anything else done either
02:12:43  <Eddi|zuHause> i need to finish a thing, get it out of my mind, and then i can start to do other stuff
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07:17:38  <Eddi|zuHause> i still haven't figured out how to keep the system responsive during high/borderline swapping behaviour
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12:06:57  <andythenorth> hmm
12:07:04  <andythenorth> some kind of way of settting liveries?  o_O
12:07:24  <andythenorth> (sprites, not CC)
12:22:46  <andythenorth> but as there isn't...which is better?
12:22:46  <andythenorth>
12:22:49  <andythenorth>
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13:01:43  <peter1138> It's okay but your pixels are still too big.
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13:11:22  <andythenorth> yes
13:11:24  <andythenorth> it's my compute
13:11:28  <andythenorth> r
13:11:30  <andythenorth> it's too big
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13:19:56  <supermop_work> hi
13:25:54  <nakki> hello
13:28:12  <andythenorth> supermop_work: or ??
13:28:57  <supermop_work> well
13:29:30  <supermop_work> 1 didn't exist anymore when i lived in the UK, but i always loved the big yellow 'chin'
13:30:07  <andythenorth> maybe I should do liveries on cargo subtypes :P
13:30:14  <andythenorth> like all the other popular sets
13:30:32  <supermop_work> eh
13:30:33  <andythenorth> rail blue & white version?
13:30:44  <supermop_work> GNER
13:30:48  <andythenorth> I can't flip these, articulated vehicle
13:30:52  <andythenorth> so no livery tricks
13:30:58  <andythenorth> random? :P
13:30:59  <supermop_work> all hst liveries are good
13:31:12  <supermop_work> you don't need to give everyone all the toys though
13:31:32  <andythenorth> Horse 88%
13:31:37  <andythenorth> I need to draw more stuff :P
13:31:53  <andythenorth> tried it recently supermop_work? o_O
13:31:56  <andythenorth> it's nearly good
13:32:04  <andythenorth> (Horse, not drawing)
13:32:10  <supermop_work> id either use the livery you liked most as a kid, or whatever is most different from other trains in the set
13:32:21  <supermop_work> not in 1-2 months
13:32:35  <supermop_work> new job has been like 50-60 hours a week
13:32:57  <andythenorth> oof
13:37:19  <supermop_work> waste of a summer so far!
13:37:26  <andythenorth> new york summer?
13:38:12  <andythenorth> oh
13:38:17  <andythenorth> I can't bridge over locks :P
13:38:18  <andythenorth> nvm
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14:52:39  <planetmaker> a supermop! Long time no see
15:01:07  <andythenorth> a planetmaker! Long time no see :)
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15:11:41  <planetmaker> :) Summer time...
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15:17:58  <peter1138> MTB night!
15:30:15  <andythenorth> does nml magically convert {POWER}
15:30:16  <andythenorth> ?
15:30:18  * andythenorth wonders
15:30:26  <andythenorth> if I give it 1000hp, what it does :P
15:32:56  <andythenorth> "Provided a static argument for string command 'POWER' which is invalid"
15:32:56  <andythenorth> oof
15:32:57  <andythenorth> nvm
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17:09:12  <andythenorth> it's easier to draw fast trains
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17:17:42  <Wolf01> I bet at least 2 people downloaded OTTD from M$ store yesterday, but none of them played it :P
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17:50:50  <Eddi|zuHause> is there a more reliable way to find what's using memory? because according to top, memory runs out, but memory usage by programs is about 30%
17:54:12  <nielsm> systemwide?
17:54:41  <nielsm> maybe /tmp or similar on ramdisk? (/dev/shm or whatever)
17:54:56  <nielsm> or other shared memory that can perhaps not be attributed to a single process
17:54:58  <Eddi|zuHause> not significant
18:03:46  <milek7> 'runs out' means no free or no available?
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18:06:35  <Eddi|zuHause>
18:06:39  <Eddi|zuHause> no available
18:09:04  <Eddi|zuHause> note this paste, where res/shr of the process grew by about 4G (30%), but avail mem dropped by about 7G
18:10:00  <andythenorth> Horse 89%
18:11:09  <nielsm> I see your time machine is still functional
18:11:24  <Eddi|zuHause> i wouldn't call it that
18:11:31  <Eddi|zuHause> i just got lucky :p
18:11:49  <Eddi|zuHause> it was unresponsive for like half an hour in my earlier tests
18:12:43  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, this memory-usage makes the game barely playable
18:21:23  <LordAro> remove swap, see what happens
18:25:33  <Eddi|zuHause> why would i do that?
18:26:57  <Eddi|zuHause> "your memory is low" -> "try to put the 1.8G used swap into the 1G remaining mem"?!?
18:35:44  <LordAro> you'd be surprised, memory allocation, and how it is counted is quite hard
18:36:00  <LordAro> there are various different types of memory allocation
18:38:09  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i can tell you what happens, the avail mem goes near zero, and the system is drowning in i/o
18:38:16  <Eddi|zuHause> being unresponsive for hours
18:41:42  <milek7> there should be a way to set OOM-killer threshold to max-50mib or something
18:41:46  <milek7> i have to do sysrq magic to unlock system after something eats memory
18:44:05  <Eddi|zuHause> which sysrq magic do you do?
18:45:36  <milek7> invoke oom-killer
18:48:05  <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but which button is that?
18:48:35  <supermop_work> hi planetmaker
18:48:55  <milek7> f
18:49:47  <supermop_work> Eddi|zuHause: ram usage on my work computer never makes sense to me
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18:53:34  <Eddi|zuHause> <andythenorth> if I give it 1000hp, what it does :P <-- units like "hp" only work in specific contexts. too much magic involved to make it generic
18:55:44  <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: pmap 29359
18:56:13  <frosch123> will tell you how much heap alloced, swapped, mmapped, ....
19:03:22  <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i have the suspicion that the other 3G are buried in the graphics driver or something
19:06:34  <andythenorth> can I read the setting for power unit and perform my own conversion?
19:07:13  <andythenorth>  I only use imperial hp, so my interest in doing that is minimal :P
19:10:08  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: power unit should be findable in the nml source code, or the wiki
19:11:26  <andythenorth> can't see a setting for it here
19:11:55  <Eddi|zuHause> you can't read display settings
19:12:00  <Eddi|zuHause> would desync
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19:17:17  <_moep_> hello people!
19:17:59  <nielsm> hi
19:18:22  <_moep_> how can I apply at the gameplay for subsidies? In the wiki I just see where I find it.
19:18:55  <_moep_> and how can I disable e.g. trees when I want to build something
19:19:10  <nielsm> you mean how to obtain the subsidy after it has been offered?
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19:19:22  <nielsm> you just complete one transport of the type the subsidy wants
19:19:43  <_moep_> nielsm: so I just do it?
19:19:47  <nielsm> yep
19:19:53  <_moep_> ah ok
19:20:12  <frosch123> _moep_: Ctrl+X to open transparency options
19:20:31  <_moep_> thx
19:20:35  <frosch123> there you can set trees to somewhat transparent or completely invisible
19:21:10  <nielsm> and pressing just X alone will toggle transparency
19:21:27  <nielsm> between everything visible and the defaults set in the transparency options window
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19:26:18  <frosch123> my brother just requested a tool+sources i wrote in 1999
19:26:24  <frosch123> i wrote funny things back then
19:27:25  <frosch123> actually, it's from 1997
19:31:30  <andythenorth> wow
19:32:00  <frosch123> yeah, i actually found it :p
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19:33:16  <supermop_work> breaker tripped
19:34:18  <frosch123> coffee machine broken?
19:37:19  <andythenorth> supermop_work: made you a large logo train
19:37:31  <andythenorth> no actual logo, won't look good :P
19:37:44  <supermop_work> nice
19:37:59  <supermop_work> put an ottd logo on it
19:39:28  <andythenorth> o_O
19:40:09  <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: the numbers in pmap only differ insignificantly from the ones in top
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21:08:40  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Brandonlk opened issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected
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21:25:34  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected
21:30:46  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Brandonlk commented on issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected
21:38:32  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected
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21:41:06  <tuuktuuk> Hey there! How do I tell OpenTTD where to look for libraries on Mac?
21:42:05  <tuuktuuk> It requires liblzma 8.0.0. It looks for it in a place where I have 6.0.0, but I do have the 8.0.0 as well.
21:42:16  <Eddi|zuHause> compile time or runtime?
21:43:25  <tuuktuuk> Runtime.
21:45:17  <Eddi|zuHause> i have no experience with mac, but probably something to do with LD_LIBRARY_PATH?
21:46:04  <Eddi|zuHause> but your installation of liblzma 8 should have done that for you
21:46:27  <Eddi|zuHause> it's not really a problem with openttd itself
21:47:59  <tuuktuuk> True. I'm using MacPorts, which is in many manners outdated, because this computer is aeons old and it was the best option back then. Switching to Homebrew would now cause even more trouble, so I'm kinda stuck with MacPorts, even though it does this kind of crap.
21:49:08  <Eddi|zuHause> still, i'd play with LD_LIBRARY_PATH first, and see what happens
21:49:57  <tuuktuuk> export DYLD_LIBRARY_PATH="/opt/local/lib"
21:50:00  <tuuktuuk> That did it.
21:50:17  <tuuktuuk> Knew what to google for after your tip! Thanks :)
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22:00:30  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Brandonlk commented on issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected
22:15:47  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected
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22:36:56  <Eddi|zuHause> are there still mainboards with a PCI slot?
22:42:10  <debdog> Eddi|zuHause:
22:44:04  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #7613: Generating too many news messages at once crashes the game.
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22:45:30  <Eddi|zuHause> debdog: i take that as a "no"
22:46:04  <Eddi|zuHause> debdog: can't find any among those that support modern processors
22:48:41  <debdog> hmm
22:50:52  <Eddi|zuHause> i mean, it says AM4, but: "Um auch neueste Prozessorkerne zu unterst├╝tzen, ist evtl. ein BIOS-Update erforderlich." <- not sure i should put up with that
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22:54:58  <milek7>
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22:56:33  <milek7> why most motherboards try to look like christmas trees?
22:57:06  <Eddi|zuHause> because of RGB!!1!
22:59:09  <Eddi|zuHause> milek7: still conflicting information on X370 mainboard...
23:02:10  <milek7> look at bios changelog for specific motherboard
23:02:34  <Eddi|zuHause> still, how do you get the bios update on the board?
23:03:36  <milek7> update it with old gen cpu..
23:03:50  <milek7> at least here stores typically offer to upgrade it when ordering
23:16:54  <debdog> Eddi|zuHause: put up with that? that usually is the first step when getting a new board
23:17:47  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 opened issue #7646: Random map generation failure crashes the game (dedicated server).
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23:26:11  <Eddi|zuHause> debdog: there is a difference between installing a bios update after you got the system to run and installing a bios update so you can get the system to run

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