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00:44:52 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 223:391535d23fe4: Prepare release 8.0-beta1 (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/391535d23fe4 01:44:35 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 224:cd872888baf2: current GRF list (with bananas) (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/cd872888baf2 01:44:35 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 225:1134f10e0574: Ignore export and bananas (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/1134f10e0574 01:44:35 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 226:46147a152a3a: Fix (r223): sprites should be removed (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/46147a152a3a 02:23:09 *** Englanddragon has quit IRC 02:45:31 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 03:57:15 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 04:20:20 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 06:04:36 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 06:27:49 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:04:13 *** PeterT_ has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:06:50 *** PeterT has quit IRC 07:06:50 *** PeterT_ is now known as PeterT 07:22:33 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 367:7a6db6072dcc: Change: set global depot y offset param... (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/7a6db6072dcc 07:22:33 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 368:e0c28193a22c: Change: rail vehicles don't need separa... (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/e0c28193a22c 07:22:38 *** Alberth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 07:28:45 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 227:e8ee579f6b50: Revert: re-add BK tunnels v0.3a (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/e8ee579f6b50 07:30:40 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 369:d4dd58068ea1: Change: removed code for rail version o... (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/d4dd58068ea1 07:49:17 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 228:ddee41407009: Revert: Old CS tramset needed (psg99) (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/ddee41407009 07:52:29 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 229:34a880d6dd16: Revert #1009: German trams needed (psg99) (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/34a880d6dd16 07:55:26 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 230:dce0a5ac5291: Revert #1009: Old Dutch tramset needed (... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/dce0a5ac5291 08:03:47 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 231:2118eb02ed12: Revert #1009: NewMonorailMrHuntW.grf nee... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/2118eb02ed12 08:16:51 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009: removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2913 08:30:18 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 232:08e067dad45a: Revert #1009 #542: Old OpenGFX rail vehi... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/08e067dad45a 08:49:57 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009: removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2913 08:54:50 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009: removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2913 08:57:23 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 233:045680952c17: Fix #1009: Add nhfoundations 0.1 (psg 123) (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/045680952c17 08:57:23 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009 (Closed): removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2914 08:59:14 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009 (Reopened): removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2915 09:01:42 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009: removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2913 09:14:11 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #314 (Closed): errors on a few sprites (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/314#change-2922 09:14:11 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1110 (New): Gmund Mog Road + Rail versions (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1110 09:15:58 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1111 (New): Redraw tractors (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1111 09:17:34 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1112 (New): Convert mining trucks to cpp templates (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1112 09:17:34 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1113 (New): Convert logging trucks to cpp templates (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1113 09:17:34 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1114 (New): Convert bulldozers to cpp templates (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1114 09:17:34 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1115 (New): ETF mining trucks (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1115 09:19:28 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1116 (New): Redraw logging trucks (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1116 09:21:21 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1117 (New): Convert all vehicles to CPP real sprites - as... (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1117 09:21:21 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1118 (New): Template Mining Trucks action 1-2-3 (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1118 09:22:06 <Alberth> making a bit of work for yourself? :) 09:23:26 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1110: Gmund Mog Road + Rail versions (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1110#change-2923 09:23:26 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #1119 (New): No. 9 Crawler is sometimes simply missing from game. (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1119 09:23:26 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 234:d9e54fa28fe7: Change #1009: Re-add old brick foundatio... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/d9e54fa28fe7 09:25:46 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1111 (New): Redraw tractors (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1111 09:25:46 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1120 (New): Redraw standard trailers - too large (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1120 09:39:56 *** ODM has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 09:53:00 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #1121 (New): missing files (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1121 09:56:35 <Brot6> Nutracks - Bug #1122 (New): re-definition of blank (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1122 09:59:30 <Rubidium> planetmaker: already used the new and highly unofficial nforenum/grfcodecs? 09:59:43 <planetmaker> yes 10:00:13 <planetmaker> looks like you put quite a bit work into them :-) 10:00:25 <planetmaker> But... nutracks still has zillions of errors... 10:00:28 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 370:3ce9debc9142: Add: pcx file for light trucks (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/3ce9debc9142 10:01:23 <andythenorth> one day we'll figure out an easy solution to the missing files problem :P 10:01:38 <andythenorth> meanwhile, someone always finds it quite quickly :) 10:01:49 <planetmaker> andythenorth: hg st usually helps :-) 10:02:36 <andythenorth> I put that in the class of solutions called "people need to be better than they are" 10:02:42 * andythenorth afk for the day 10:02:56 <Rubidium> planetmaker: zillions? 10:03:46 <planetmaker> 90% are white pixels. But it it complains about wrong properties in its action0... 10:04:08 <Alberth> Rubidium: more than you care to count :) 10:04:40 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #1121 (Closed): missing files (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1121 10:04:40 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Bug #1121 (Closed): missing files (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1121#change-2924 10:04:42 <planetmaker> http://pastebin.com/D8s8MYyF 10:05:22 <Rubidium> planetmaker: first update nforenum! 10:05:32 <planetmaker> again? 10:05:38 <Rubidium> you're using one of a week or two ago 10:05:43 <planetmaker> hm 10:05:57 <planetmaker> then my symlink failed :S 10:06:52 <andythenorth> I could run my own buildbot locally I suppose, and have it flash my screen red if files are missing :P 10:07:26 <planetmaker> yes... it linked still to the old binary name 10:08:10 *** Yexo has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 10:08:20 <planetmaker> better now :-) 10:11:01 <Rubidium> there's a bunch of action3 warnings that seem valid (to me) and the action0 warnings are definitely correct 10:11:31 <Rubidium> unless \b means byte and it's using duodecimal 10:11:43 <planetmaker> looking at the re-nforenum'ed code I tend to agree. 10:11:53 <planetmaker> \b means that a decimal byte value follows 10:12:06 <Ammler> planetmaker: I hope, you didn't add GRFs again, I removed :-) 10:12:22 <planetmaker> Ammler: I didn't entirely check that. 10:12:34 <planetmaker> I mostly checked loading of savegames :-) 10:12:36 <Ammler> I run fdupes through the pack and bananas 10:12:46 <planetmaker> ? 10:12:46 <Ammler> ok, seems fine 10:13:03 <planetmaker> still, there's a list of missing newgrfs. 10:13:07 <Ammler> fdupes does detect doubles 10:13:07 <Rubidium> but do you have everything from bananas? :) 10:13:23 <planetmaker> Rubidium: maybe not everything, but what I can reasonably get 10:13:33 <planetmaker> everything simply isn't possible 10:13:33 <Ammler> Rubidium: "someone" setup a stupid rule there, so no, I don't :-P 10:13:45 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 10:14:10 <Ammler> I setup a without-personal-dir openttd 10:14:20 <planetmaker> Rubidium: the point should be that anyone with the grfpack and bananas access *should* be able to load our savegames 10:14:22 <Ammler> so I was able to really download every new one 10:14:29 <planetmaker> which currently fails for a number of them 10:14:49 <planetmaker> Ammler: I did the same. I removed the ottd grf dir and then started from there 10:14:56 <planetmaker> and then checked each psg 10:15:09 <planetmaker> after adding trunk grfpack 10:15:27 <Ammler> Rubidium: you could maybe at least publish a list like http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/entry/ottdc_grfpack/md5GRFIDlist 10:16:09 <Ammler> planetmaker: I also added rewrite rules so it isn't possible to download a single grf 10:16:21 <planetmaker> ok 10:17:13 <Ammler> so MB can't complain again and I don't need to have it private 10:17:41 <planetmaker> why do you need to have it private? 10:17:53 <Ammler> it is public now 10:17:56 <Rubidium> http://pastebin.com/RKpUYbvb 10:17:57 <planetmaker> as long as you don't link the grfs 10:18:58 <Rubidium> ^ those are all NewGRFs that are in bananas 10:19:53 <Ammler> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/changes/ottdc_grfpack/0_info.grf <-- link Download 10:20:07 <planetmaker> 305 versions... :-) 10:20:49 <Rubidium> with 133 NewGRFs, that's like 2.5 versions over 1.5 years 10:21:00 <planetmaker> Ammler: before we release a 8.0 beta or RC we should 'fix' the missing newgrfs for our psg savegames 10:21:14 <planetmaker> that's an acceptable advancement IMHO 10:21:18 <Ammler> well, I will setup a build script 10:21:29 <Ammler> so it doesn't need much work anymore 10:21:34 <planetmaker> :-) 10:21:41 <Ammler> it should be quite easy with Mercurial 10:21:48 <planetmaker> those remaining ones become increasingly difficult to find 10:22:04 <Ammler> then we can ask #openttdcoop to help us 10:22:09 <planetmaker> I hope you have *somewhere* the really old grfpacks 10:22:57 <Ammler> http://openttdcoop.org/newgrfs/old/ 10:23:21 <Ammler> but shht :-) 10:23:32 <Ammler> oh 10:23:34 <planetmaker> :x 10:23:37 <Ammler> not really 10:23:54 <Ammler> well, we have the full history in the Mercurial repo 10:24:09 <planetmaker> but only since some version 6 or so 10:24:33 <planetmaker> 6 1:a901b9d9d39d 10:25:21 <Ammler> 4 and 5 have completely different structure 10:25:29 <Ammler> I have those locally 10:25:43 <Ammler> you like a zip? 10:27:41 <Ammler> also don't forget to update http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/GRF_Table_%28Trunk%29 10:28:04 <Ammler> I just changed status to BaNaNaS 10:29:38 <planetmaker> I just got 4. There are zips for those on the link you gave - so it's fine 10:30:45 <Rubidium> oh... tycoonez has written as stupid "custom" license 10:30:58 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 235:8127f635d5aa: Add #1009: Planeset for old games (psg35) (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/8127f635d5aa 10:31:13 <planetmaker> hm... where? 10:31:38 <Ammler> afaik no distribution 10:31:47 <planetmaker> lol 10:31:50 <Rubidium> "archiving it in electronical or any other form ... are strictly forbidden" <- that's invalidated by my fair use law, which invalidates the whole license 10:32:01 <Rubidium> also... 10:32:07 <Rubidium> "t is not permitted to release them as your own work, modify them or distribute for financial gain." 10:32:13 <Rubidium> +I 10:32:20 <Rubidium> now... lawyery reading that 10:32:31 <Rubidium> "It is not permitted to (release them as your own work, modify them or distribute) for financial gain." 10:32:49 <Rubidium> oh... so if I don't gain money, it's not not permitted? 10:33:13 <planetmaker> eh? 10:33:33 <Rubidium> it's just that custom licenses are often so stupid 10:34:04 <Ammler> like pikkas, which is as good as no license 10:34:17 <Rubidium> "If you wish to modify for personal use, or use, any part of this set, please ask for prior permission." <- from canadian trains... is that a request for asking, but not an obligation? Even so, fair use law... 10:34:41 <Rubidium> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/GRF_Table_%28Trunk%29 <- link to "all grf by PikkaBird" == 404 10:35:11 <Rubidium> same for aegir (wonders whether it would be "leet" to write "aoa" instead of "404") 10:36:01 *** Yexo has quit IRC 10:36:06 <Alberth> in terms of readability, definitely 10:36:09 <planetmaker> hehe 10:36:24 <planetmaker> Rubidium: a small odditiy with 'rescan files' I just encountered: 10:36:56 <planetmaker> 'rescan' updated the list in the newgrf list when accessed from the load menu. But when I then exited that screen, it was listed again as missing in the load menu 10:36:59 <planetmaker> itself 10:37:22 <Rubidium> tell that to frosch (i.e. file a bug report) 10:37:25 <planetmaker> and only became visible when I rescaned it again 10:37:27 <planetmaker> ok 10:38:01 <Ammler> fixed... 10:38:12 <Ammler> (license link) 10:40:56 <Rubidium> ever read WTFPL? 10:41:26 <planetmaker> hehe... CS' license = WTFPL? 10:41:34 <Rubidium> nope 10:41:38 <Rubidium> http://sam.zoy.org/wtfpl/ 10:41:40 <Webster> Title: WTFPL - Do What The Fuck You Want To Public License (at sam.zoy.org) 10:42:41 <planetmaker> ah, yes :-) 10:42:50 <Ammler> "as long as the name changes" is not really wtf 10:42:50 <Rubidium> especially the part about "Can’t you change the wording? It’s inappropriate / childish / not corporate-compliant." :) 10:43:53 <Rubidium> Ammler: but *that* you can easily work around 10:44:03 <Ammler> :-) 10:44:18 <Ammler> with 2 releases :-P 10:44:20 <Rubidium> just remove all knowledge of the old name, release that (possibly under the same license) 10:44:30 <Rubidium> yep, exacly 10:44:32 <Rubidium> +t 10:44:41 <planetmaker> Rubidium: you should add it to bananas pre-selected ones 10:45:26 <Rubidium> nah, it might be offensive to people 10:45:36 <Ammler> you should add a "source link" to bananas, if someone uses GPL 10:45:53 <Rubidium> s/you/TrueBrain/ 10:45:58 <Rubidium> yes, I totally agree with that 10:46:40 <Ammler> but maybe we should simply start making a source package beside :-) 10:46:42 <Rubidium> and I've already requested that (http://bugs.openttd.org/task/2795) 10:47:51 <planetmaker> you want to store all grf sources in bananas? 10:49:01 <Rubidium> I'm not that sure that a link would be that useful, but that might suffice as well; it would definitely be a lot easier 10:50:07 <Ammler> this was btw. my "big" bananas cleanup commit: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/7e4b6d8c692d 10:51:39 <planetmaker> well. A link is easily faked. But those who don't want to... 10:51:54 <planetmaker> I agree it'd make it A LOT easier to obtain source 10:52:16 <Ammler> Rubidium: suggested upload of the source bundle 10:53:08 <Rubidium> though... asking for a link is much much easier to accomplish 10:56:39 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #544 (Closed): Remove (e)GRVTS (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/544#change-2925 10:56:39 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 236:78ec56e6d546: Add #1009: CS rails needed by old savega... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/78ec56e6d546 10:56:39 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #542 (Closed): Remove OpenGFX newgrfs (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/542#change-2926 10:56:40 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #547: Remove Pikka's NewGRFs (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/547#change-2927 10:56:43 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #547 (Closed): Remove Pikka's NewGRFs (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/547#change-2928 10:56:46 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 237:71d75ec20ff3: Add #1009: Old metro tracks required by ... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/71d75ec20ff3 10:57:54 <Ammler> there are still some GRFs which can be moved to obsolete 10:59:01 <planetmaker> yes. But I first want to fix the missing ones 11:03:01 <Ammler> well, for me, it was fine enough, if the game was loadable 11:03:12 <Ammler> I didn't care that much about missing grfs 11:03:29 <planetmaker> Well... I don't like missing. 11:03:34 <planetmaker> hm 11:03:35 <Ammler> only those which crashed 11:03:56 <Ammler> yeah, all fine, just like to explain me ;-) 11:04:21 <planetmaker> :-) 11:04:58 *** KenjiE20 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 11:06:56 <planetmaker> it looks so much like an error :-) 11:07:21 <planetmaker> I was thinking of providing empty dummy newgrfs :-P 11:07:34 <Ammler> hehe 11:07:36 <planetmaker> hm... can the grfID be changed via grf parameter? 11:07:45 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 238:8d88c7411111: Add #1009: Old Japanese trees required b... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/8d88c7411111 11:07:48 <Ammler> why did we remove cs-rails? 11:07:50 <planetmaker> like actionD, action6, action8? 11:07:55 <planetmaker> I don't know+ 11:08:11 <Rubidium> planetmaker: I don't think OpenTTD supports doing that 11:08:26 <planetmaker> :-) Sounds like a big hack anyway 11:08:33 <Rubidium> *but* I'm far from certain 11:08:55 <planetmaker> would be nearly worth a try :-) 11:10:20 *** Yexo has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 11:29:42 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 239:6bbceb38c61b: Add #1009: Old canset needed by old save... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/6bbceb38c61b 11:36:50 <Ammler> I usually kept the z_obsolete without any docs 11:36:57 <Ammler> only plain grf 11:37:18 <Ammler> so people don't get the idea, they could use it for new games 11:38:19 <planetmaker> hm 11:39:07 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 240:df449d2ea79d: Add #1009: DutchTramSet r20 needed by ol... (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/df449d2ea79d 11:39:16 <Ammler> well 11:39:32 <Ammler> if the grf is in the obsolete only, we might need it 11:40:33 <planetmaker> I didn't consider that we make a distinction when to distribute the readme and when not. 11:40:44 <planetmaker> IMHO it should be sufficient to place them in z_obsolete 11:40:55 <Ammler> yes, might be better 11:41:00 <planetmaker> Providing the readme is IMHO a curtosy to the authors and sometimes might be even required 11:42:35 <Ammler> we might need to distinguish between bananas obosletes and pack obsoletes 11:55:07 *** Yexo has quit IRC 12:11:23 <Ammler> planetmaker: I guess, we don't need update and legacy packs anymore 12:11:43 <Ammler> we just keep the old version for some time to support legacy 12:11:44 <planetmaker> I agree 12:11:59 <planetmaker> Well. Old versions are kept in z_obsolete. Forever 12:12:12 <Ammler> and for updateing, just download the whole package 12:12:50 <Ammler> planetmaker: they legacy package was never meant for old saves :-P 12:13:06 <Ammler> hmm, I told you that for sure 10 times already ;-) 12:13:17 <planetmaker> yes. For servers or so 12:13:19 <planetmaker> but still 12:13:36 <Ammler> the legacy packs had grfs, which are removed or updated 12:16:01 <Ammler> "hg archive -Iottdc_grfpack" should make the pack 12:16:10 <planetmaker> I never understood the difference :-P 12:17:35 <Ammler> tar.gz, tar.bz2, zip, 7zip and rar 12:23:17 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1123 (New): Bananas GRFs (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1123 12:26:21 <planetmaker> Ammler: I wonder whether we should create two versions, though: one with all currently needed newgrfs (default) and one which only as an add-on contains the z_obsolete folder 12:30:01 <Ammler> well, we could make 2 splitted packs and a "full" pack 12:30:47 <Ammler> but then we will get questions, "which pack do I need?" 12:31:51 <Ammler> "hg archive -Iottdc_grfpack -Xottdc_grfpack/z_obsolete" should be possible 12:32:57 <Ammler> I more wonder, how we should continue maintain our GRF_Table 12:36:25 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 12:36:29 <planetmaker> Ammler: I'd actually propose to make two packs. 12:36:36 <planetmaker> The normal one without z_obsolete 12:36:49 <Ammler> for who? 12:37:04 <planetmaker> and an add-on which has just that. Named 'old_savegames' or whatever 12:37:14 <Ammler> hmm 12:37:54 <planetmaker> I mean... new games shall now use them. And... I don't know how many use old savegames ;-) 12:38:04 <Ammler> the normal one should become empty ;-) 12:38:14 <planetmaker> yes 12:38:26 <planetmaker> that's why everything move to z_obsolete, no? 12:38:53 <Ammler> everything except bananas 12:39:02 <planetmaker> well. Bananas is removed completely 12:39:15 <planetmaker> if it's not needed for pre-bananas versions. 12:41:55 <Ammler> what about the GRF_Table? 12:42:13 <planetmaker> in what respect? 12:42:24 <Ammler> trash it or what? 12:43:00 <planetmaker> why trashing it? 12:43:15 <Ammler> because you didn't make any single update :-P 12:43:23 <planetmaker> :-P 12:43:58 <Ammler> I would like to keep it, specially the links to guides 12:44:09 <planetmaker> yes, I want that, too :-) 12:44:33 <Ammler> and sometimes, our entries are more up2date then grfcrawler or whatever 12:47:04 <Ammler> the readme needs also a overhaul 12:48:01 <planetmaker> Question is: should all the obsolete newgrfs really be documented there? 12:48:22 <planetmaker> That'd make them very much visible which we don't really want. Or? 12:49:59 <Ammler> not obsolete 12:50:02 <Ammler> but bananas 12:50:18 <Ammler> well, I would like to change it to a NewGRF index 12:50:35 <Ammler> since we don't have every NewGRF anymore in our package 12:50:35 <planetmaker> oh, that's something different :-) 12:51:22 <planetmaker> I think that should be a separate thing. Or at least a separate file, if you like 12:51:33 <Ammler> then not by me 12:51:37 <planetmaker> It should be clear which files are part of this pack (the grf table) 12:51:52 <Ammler> the md5list 12:51:54 <planetmaker> but the newgrf index then would need to be a separate one 12:52:05 <planetmaker> which can have both, this pack and bananas listed 12:52:06 <Ammler> the list is not just a list 12:52:17 <Ammler> it does also hold links or other additional infos 12:52:43 <planetmaker> well. yes. 12:52:53 <planetmaker> But still I think it should be separate 12:53:03 <Ammler> yes 12:53:10 <planetmaker> Or no-one will know what is part of the pack, if it is covered in 90% bananas 12:53:19 <Ammler> but then we don't need a wiki page for the packa anymore 12:53:29 <planetmaker> possibly 12:53:48 <planetmaker> the wiki page could then be superseeded by the general newgrf list 12:54:01 <planetmaker> but it'll be a pain to maintain that 12:54:05 <Ammler> I guess, we could remove the license columns 12:54:17 <planetmaker> hm. I wouldn't like to tbh 12:54:48 <Ammler> those are outdated anyway 12:55:08 <Ammler> and you still have it in the history 12:55:20 <Ammler> but there is no need to "hunt" licences anymore 12:55:26 <planetmaker> true 12:55:36 <planetmaker> though it's a nice quick overview 12:56:01 <Ammler> I meant those 2 colors columns 12:56:01 <planetmaker> maybe just the license icon; not as verbose as now 12:56:06 <Ammler> not the one with the authr 12:56:08 <planetmaker> oh. yes. they're not needed 12:58:22 <Ammler> hg rename ottdc_grfpack/z_obsolete ottdc_grfpack_old ? 13:01:41 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 241:99fecd40e5fc: Remove: outdated GRFList (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/99fecd40e5fc 13:02:37 <planetmaker> I still think that z_obsolete is a good name 13:02:40 <planetmaker> No need to change that 13:02:52 <planetmaker> Those newgrfs are indeed obsolete after all 13:03:44 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Bug #1009: removed too many obsolete newgrfs (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1009#change-2929 13:05:51 <Ammler> planetmaker: did you try to load the save with the grfpack from that time? 13:06:10 <planetmaker> which? #62? 13:06:17 <Ammler> yes 13:06:27 <planetmaker> Not quite. 13:06:33 <Ammler> hg up 6 13:06:39 <planetmaker> But I had all newgrfs which reference vehicles 13:07:25 <Ammler> hmm, might be 4 or 5 13:09:56 <planetmaker> hm, could you add a zip of v5 to the old pack link you gave? 13:13:15 <Ammler> planetmaker: should be there 13:14:37 <planetmaker> thx, Ammler 13:32:26 <Alberth> andythenorth: is sand that expensive? http://devs.openttd.org/~alberth/expensive_sand.png 13:33:33 <Ammler> lol 14:17:35 <planetmaker> Alberth: I guess that's a matter of the rail newgrf, not of FIRS ;-) 14:17:41 <planetmaker> But a nice LOOL indeed :-) 14:18:07 <planetmaker> But I recall having come up with similar oddities when I started with OpenGFX+ wagons and cargo classes only 14:19:12 <Alberth> they may be more common than I think perhaps 14:20:44 <Alberth> but does an armoured van not have a flag 'valuable stuff in here please' ? 14:23:47 <planetmaker> ARMOURED is a cargo class on its own 14:24:00 <planetmaker> but a newgrf author may assigne also other classes to that wagon 14:24:17 <planetmaker> maybe in order to allow some kind of important express goods or so 14:24:41 <planetmaker> and if one is not careful... voila, you end up with a bulk material there. 14:24:56 <planetmaker> It definitely is a glitch in the respective rail set, though 14:25:08 <planetmaker> is it old wagons new cargos? 14:26:10 <planetmaker> it's easy to mix things up if tested with one industry newgrf and then used with another, not entirely compatible cargo definitions 14:26:23 <planetmaker> might even come out this way, if no cargo classes, but only cargo slots are used 14:27:29 <planetmaker> In any case from my experience so far from the wagons of 2cctrainset v1.x: one can spend an incredible amount of time to adjust the cargos for wagons so that they transport only sensible cargos for the various possible cases 14:28:38 <planetmaker> so yes: it's possible to set that flag. But it's easy to do more (or less) than wanted, too 14:28:48 <planetmaker> cargo classes are not unambigeous 14:32:15 <Ammler> planetmaker: why would you like to split the packs? 14:32:22 <Ammler> it isn't the size? 14:33:44 <Ammler> the pack is 22MB only anymore 14:34:19 <planetmaker> well. The reason is rather weak: not distribute the obsolete package needlessly 14:34:23 *** welshdragon has quit IRC 14:34:33 <planetmaker> Size probably as you show is no argument 14:34:57 <Ammler> the question is then, who does use the "normal" package only? 14:35:00 <planetmaker> if you prefer one pack (and it's easier to maintain anyway), it's good enough reason to keep it as one 14:35:10 <planetmaker> yes, valid question. I'm not sure 14:35:17 <planetmaker> The 'usual' PS players might. 14:35:23 <planetmaker> But at some stage they might not... 14:35:25 <planetmaker> dunno 14:35:40 <Ammler> you like quite soon to try a archive game 14:35:47 <Ammler> maybe rather than playing on ps 14:37:01 <Ammler> if we split, would you move the obsolete to its own main directory 14:37:10 <Ammler> or keep it in ottdc_grfpack? 14:38:05 <Ammler> hmm, yes, it would also mean maintain a own readme etc. 14:38:35 <planetmaker> well. Probably best to keep it together 14:40:03 <planetmaker> I only fear that people might then use those in maps they'll provide 14:40:19 <planetmaker> we really, really should make sure they're not used without need 14:40:21 <Ammler> yeah, but that would also happen else 14:40:28 <planetmaker> yes 14:40:47 <Ammler> if you once have the grfs in the data, it is up to openttd 14:43:14 <Ammler> I mean, that is the whole versioning, also the reason, openttd needs to list every version 14:43:22 <Ammler> there should be flag, show only newest 14:47:33 <Ammler> currently the biggest issue is when someone uses a bananas grf for preparing the game, then we load that game a month later and between, there was a bananas update 14:47:54 <Ammler> so you have to fix again the save locally until you can load it on the server 14:49:32 <Ammler> cleanup bananas is deleting all bananas and download again 14:49:55 <Ammler> if you don't have luck, this can get a pain 14:55:21 *** Seberoth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 14:56:41 <planetmaker> hu? I don't get that. 14:57:01 <Ammler> what? 14:57:03 <planetmaker> Using the 2nd newest version on bananas is not a really bad thing. 14:57:08 <planetmaker> Though not nice, it's ok 14:57:13 <Ammler> how to download that? 14:57:23 <planetmaker> on a server? Dunno 14:57:27 <planetmaker> On a client: easy 14:57:49 <Ammler> yeah, I know, nbodoy cares about server :-P 14:57:54 <planetmaker> :-P 14:58:15 <planetmaker> that 'just' needs an additional rcon command 14:58:27 <planetmaker> or an improved handling for loading on a server 14:59:06 <planetmaker> or better an additional adv. setting (default=false): auto-download missing newgrfs 14:59:07 <Ammler> --autodownload :-) 14:59:19 <planetmaker> or like that 14:59:43 *** Seberoth2 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 14:59:48 <Ammler> I guess, I setup a cron, which does in hourly base sync with binaries.openttd.org 15:00:37 <Ammler> he, that might be easier then download with console 15:00:43 <planetmaker> :-) 15:00:49 <planetmaker> hourly might be too much. 15:00:53 <planetmaker> Just daily 15:01:04 <Ammler> whatever 15:01:08 *** Seber^03 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 15:01:14 *** Seberoth2 has quit IRC 15:01:27 <Ammler> Seber^03: fix the connection ;-) 15:03:13 *** Seberoth2 has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 15:03:26 *** Seberoth has quit IRC 15:04:56 *** Seberoth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 15:07:29 *** Seberoth has quit IRC 15:10:11 *** Seber^03 has quit IRC 15:12:39 <planetmaker> btw... now that the grfpack works for me for all games I tested (10%) and has compatible for all psg (100% tested, I hope), IMHO it's fit to go for a beta stage 15:12:41 *** Seberoth2 has quit IRC 15:12:48 <planetmaker> (after changelog and readme updates) 15:13:55 <Ammler> he, indeed, we could add the changelog to the source 15:14:30 <Ammler> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/GRF_History 15:14:55 <Ammler> would you like to update the readme a bit? 15:15:01 <Ammler> :-) 15:17:13 <Ammler> for the list, we point to the wiki 15:17:27 <Ammler> and the md5GRFIDlist 15:18:25 <Ammler> planetmaker: can you join current server with the pack? 15:18:48 <planetmaker> http://pastebin.com/xa1sPyvE <-- readme? 15:19:58 <planetmaker> yes, I can join 15:21:23 <Ammler> did you change everything? 15:21:35 <planetmaker> what 'everything'? 15:21:43 <planetmaker> in the readme? 15:21:55 <planetmaker> No, but I rewrote a bit the paragraph about re-distribution 15:22:07 <Ammler> hmm, maybe s/GRF/NewGRF/g 15:23:19 <planetmaker> yes 15:23:59 <Ammler> I guess, we can also remove the part about other users 15:24:11 <Ammler> other servers 15:24:12 <planetmaker> you mean other servers? 15:24:24 <Ammler> yes 15:24:26 <planetmaker> yes. removed 15:24:55 <Ammler> also s/www.openttdcoop.org/openttdcoop.org/ 15:25:10 <Ammler> as we might use bundles for it 15:25:15 <planetmaker> why? 15:25:27 <Ammler> what why? 15:25:31 <planetmaker> you mean direct openttdcoop.org -> bundles.openttdcoop.org? 15:25:39 <planetmaker> I meant why use not www 15:26:08 <Ammler> well, the location might change from www.openttdcoop.org/newgrfs/ to bundles.openttdcoop.org/grfpack 15:26:09 <planetmaker> No, I actually think that it should either directly give the download link or refer to the (general) web page 15:26:22 <planetmaker> yes, but we can link it in the wiki 15:28:45 <Ammler> we have no new grfs in yet? 15:30:16 <Ammler> then version 7.3 an 8.0 should work parallel 15:30:17 <planetmaker> Dunno, but I didn't add any recently 15:30:24 <Ammler> hmm 15:30:36 <planetmaker> the changelog should tell ;-) 15:30:37 <Ammler> maybe there are newer after the 7.3 release 15:31:33 <planetmaker> http://pastebin.com/qq7Yx39t 15:31:45 * planetmaker like the make_changelog.sh ;-) 15:32:50 <planetmaker> though... if not the standard prefixes are used it might miss things... 15:33:16 <Ammler> I see non in the commit log 15:33:21 <Ammler> none* 15:33:57 <planetmaker> http://pastebin.com/fAysUiKD 15:34:02 <planetmaker> ^ full 15:34:23 <Ammler> the readme stills point to the HTML list 15:34:43 <Rubidium> might that be too-much-information? 15:34:43 <Ammler> should point to the wiki or the md5GRFIDlist 15:35:01 <Rubidium> and... so many different styles 15:35:31 <planetmaker> yes. Too many different styles. 15:35:38 <Rubidium> and... is it needed to mention each and every NewGRF? If so, mention the bananas NewGRFs explicitly too 15:35:58 <Rubidium> and... is the revision / issue number more important than the action data? 15:36:27 <planetmaker> Rubidium: that's not the changelog as it's bound to be shipped 15:36:33 <planetmaker> it's plain output from hg log 15:36:50 <planetmaker> unedited 15:37:10 <Ammler> you like to ship a changelog? 15:37:24 <planetmaker> didn't you? 15:37:39 <Ammler> only http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/GRF_History 15:37:49 <planetmaker> Though the changelog will be: delete <various newgrf> 15:37:55 <Ammler> we could move that to a txt file 15:38:05 <Ammler> and for version 8 15:38:29 <planetmaker> I don't mind either way actually. 15:38:31 <Ammler> - Deleted a bunch of newgrfs as available from BaNaNaS 15:39:06 <Ammler> - Changed VCS to Mercurial 15:39:32 <Ammler> - Still compatible with pack 7.3 15:39:56 <planetmaker> Probably 15:40:14 <planetmaker> then add that to the website :-) 15:40:17 <Ammler> - A lot Bugfixes to keep compatiblity with old savegames 15:40:42 <Ammler> 4 lines should be fine :-) 15:45:01 <Ammler> planetmaker: pls commit the readme changes 15:45:10 <planetmaker> then go for it and call it RC-1 for a start. I'll do so. yes 15:45:11 <Ammler> then I add the release 15:45:37 <planetmaker> I'll keep www.openttdcoop.org? 15:46:10 <Ammler> yes 15:46:26 <Ammler> hmm, maybe a note about the bugtracker? 15:46:58 <planetmaker> hm. Maybe 15:48:12 <Ammler> fdupes is also happy: http://pastebin.com/iwsZdrLL 15:48:27 <planetmaker> RC-1? 15:48:39 <Ammler> beta1 :-) 15:49:09 <Ammler> well, I don't care, then you need to run ./makeinfogrf 8.0-RC1 15:49:31 <planetmaker> pushed 15:50:12 <Brot6> #openttdcoop NewGRF package - Revision 242:12bd88c066aa: Doc: Update readme for 8.0-beta1 (planetmaker) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfpack/repository/revisions/12bd88c066aa 15:52:08 <Ammler> You can find an HTML page included in this package providing you with an overview <-- still? :-) 15:53:35 <Ammler> I add a bananas list with newest versions only 15:55:14 <planetmaker> gah. Why didn't you tell before? 15:55:33 <planetmaker> well. Remove that then with your other preparatory commits :-) 15:57:40 <Ammler> [17:57] <Ammler> [17:34:23] the readme stills point to the HTML list 16:00:37 <planetmaker> :-) missed that, sorry 16:04:48 * planetmaker is off for a bit. Shopping 16:18:17 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 16:18:30 <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 2cctrainset (r573), 32bpp-extra (r36), airportsplus (r52), comic-houses (r71), firs (r1074), fish (r386), grfcodec (r177), newgrf_makefile (r124), nforenum (r405), nml (r563), nutracks (r86), ogfxplus (r40), opengfx (r469), openmsx (r91), opensfx (r97), snowlinemod (r15), swedishrails (r140), worldairlinersset (r659) 16:18:43 <Brot6> 32bpp-extra: compile of r36 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/32bpp-extra/nightlies/ERROR/r36 16:19:31 <planetmaker> ^ Ammler links are 404 16:19:57 <planetmaker> or ... only the heqs one 16:20:15 <Ammler> hmm 16:21:20 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 16:21:54 <Ammler> it doesn't build at all 16:22:36 <Ammler> Server returned an error: HTTP Error 400: Bad Request 16:22:43 <Ammler> OBS seems down 16:23:02 <Ammler> I might need to catch that error 16:28:30 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 16:35:35 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 16:36:53 <andythenorth> ^ 16:37:07 <andythenorth> Ammler: I'd fix that, but I get a 404 so I don't know what the error is :P 16:37:17 <Ammler> :-P 16:37:41 <Ammler> the package repository isn't reachable 16:38:02 <Ammler> I should be able to run it "offline" then 16:38:54 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 16:39:33 <Ammler> andythenorth: why do you notice failed compiles so fast, if you didn't cause it 16:39:49 <andythenorth> just luck I guess :P 16:39:58 <Ammler> but you need hours and highlight to notice your own faults :-P 16:40:32 <andythenorth> everyone is blind to their own failures no? 16:40:41 <andythenorth> but we are acutely sensitive to the failures of others :P 16:40:46 <Ammler> easier life ;-) 16:48:51 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 16:49:14 <Ammler> something is broken 16:52:44 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 17:01:20 <Brot6> heqs: compile of r370 failed - http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/heqs/nightlies/ERROR/r370 17:04:56 <Alberth> the bot repeats the last message too often :p 17:07:00 * andythenorth considers un-highilighting HEQS :P 17:17:02 <Ammler> sorry, something broke it, I have no idea, what 17:26:07 <Rubidium> out of memory? 17:27:38 <Ammler> no 17:27:51 <Ammler> something with --local-package 19:12:03 <Ammler> andythenorth: you don't need the nightly today? 19:51:41 *** Alberth has left #openttdcoop.devzone 20:52:36 <Ammler> I will investigate tomorrow, currently it isn't possible to build soemthing with local packages 21:38:06 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1124 (New): Setup RV offsets for Pikka templates (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1124 21:41:08 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1125 (New): Mining truck inspired by Mack Pack (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1125 21:41:08 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1126 (New): ADT (refittable to multiple cargos) (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1126 21:41:08 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1127 (New): Set purchase and running costs (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1127 21:45:14 <Brot6> 2cc train set - Bug #1128 (New): Rename train vehicle type (Muzzy) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1128 22:04:17 *** welshdragon has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 22:14:19 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Revision 371:51ae7b43e9be: Change: amber beacons for rail mog (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/heqs/repository/revisions/51ae7b43e9be 22:27:16 *** ODM has quit IRC 22:31:25 *** Webster has joined #openttdcoop.devzone 22:35:03 *** Guest1083 has quit IRC 22:44:48 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1129 (New): Remove Fourtrac (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1129 22:46:25 <Brot6> HEQS "Heavy Equipment" Set - Feature #1130 (New): Generic small and large tractors (andythenorth) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/issues/1130 23:09:37 <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Revision 106:8322045683d4: Feature: make script localizeable, use compiler.conf to... (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/home/repository/revisions/8322045683d4 23:11:37 <Brot6> NFORenum - Revision 406:57d2f7fac4bf: Change: arch should depend on the building host (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/nforenum/repository/revisions/57d2f7fac4bf 23:13:52 <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 178:043b8a913e09: Change: arch should depend on the building host (Ammler) @ http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/grfcodec/repository/revisions/043b8a913e09 23:58:28 *** KenjiE20 has quit IRC