Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:04:39 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@62.243.161.39] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:15:44 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 00:18:31 <huma> hmm, here goes the 3rd subsidy :) 00:22:02 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@a62-251-30-68.adsl.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:23:53 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: belugas * r11216 /trunk/src/newgrf_industries.cpp: -Codechange: Protect the callback who would access var 45 against a randomness that could eventually cause desynchs. Instead, use a controlled random value. 00:26:14 *** ThePenguin [~Adam@75-128-224-130.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com] has joined #openttd 00:27:02 *** ThePenguin [~Adam@75-128-224-130.dhcp.mrqt.mi.charter.com] has left #openttd [] 00:44:11 *** Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:56:21 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-108-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 01:06:13 <Phazorx> well since PBI is on the menu now we ened to get sac to do trees for alpine... 01:07:14 <Sacro> ZOMG NEWINDUSTRIES 01:07:19 <Sacro> Born_Acorn! NEWINDUSTRIES! 01:07:42 <Sacro> peter1138! newindustries! 01:07:45 <Sacro> @seen peter1138 01:07:45 <DorpsGek> Sacro: peter1138 was last seen in #openttd 2 weeks, 6 days, 10 hours, 16 minutes, and 40 seconds ago: <peter1138> _minime_, looks good to me 01:08:59 <Phazorx> really tho, default trees look horrable 01:09:33 * Sacro considers starting Sacro's Nightly Server 01:10:32 <huma> what? new industries? 01:11:08 <Sacro> yes 01:11:44 * Belugas thinks Sacro has been sleeping the whole day... 01:11:56 <Sacro> Belugas: no, at uni, then at a mates 01:15:33 <Belugas> :) 01:15:39 <Belugas> looks like a good day :) 01:17:57 <Belugas> 'night 01:18:02 <Sacro> night 01:19:06 <Phazorx> hmm... how do i get brick chain to work? 01:19:19 <glx> load PBI first 01:19:20 <Phazorx> or is it temperate only? 01:19:43 <Phazorx> it is loaded 1st, right before 01:25:12 <Phazorx> so only temperate 01:25:22 <Phazorx> and only one quary on 8x8 01:25:31 <Phazorx> is it "site" based 01:25:37 <Phazorx> have to be particular slope? 01:28:26 <glx> yes quarry need a specific landscape 01:28:44 <Sacro> openttd over x-forwarding sucks :( 01:29:00 <glx> laggy Sacro? 01:29:04 <Sacro> glx: yes 01:31:02 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B778C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:37:29 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B77110.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:39:01 <Phazorx> well 5 quaries on 6 8x8 maps :( 01:39:04 <Phazorx> is there a trick? 01:39:42 *** AntB [~AntB-UK@81.140.71.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:42:29 <Sacro> wtf 01:42:34 <Sacro> where does the nightly store openttd.cfg 01:42:57 <glx> windows? 01:43:01 <Sacro> yes 01:43:09 <Sacro> tell it to GTFO of $HOMEDIR 01:43:13 <glx> mydocs\openttd by default 01:43:45 <glx> but if there is one in exe dir it will use it 01:47:57 <Sacro> ooh, t'works 01:58:29 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498DF73.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 02:01:52 *** nairan_ZZzz [~Maui_key@p5498DF73.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:16:43 *** Ben_ [~Ben@82.152.171.29] has joined #openttd 02:18:03 *** Tefad [~tefad@c-71-63-10-8.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:23:09 *** Ben_1 [~Ben@82.152.171.29] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:34:29 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-84-226-104-165.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:46:59 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:06:23 *** toresbe [~toresbe@201.80-203-102.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 03:06:26 <toresbe> hey :) 03:06:38 <toresbe> I've got a question about path-based signalling 03:07:12 <toresbe> I'm running latest SVN and I'm running a save game now and I've disabled YAPF to try to build some of these signals 03:07:16 <toresbe> but I can't seem to 03:07:18 <toresbe> any hints? 03:08:17 *** TinoDidriksen [~projectjj@users.kollegienet.dk] has joined #openttd 03:08:58 <toresbe> is it a build option, or something...? 03:12:15 <toresbe> shit, it's 5am 03:12:18 * toresbe goes to bed 03:23:01 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB5601.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:00:52 *** nairan_ZZzz [~Maui_key@p5498CE71.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:00:54 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498DF73.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:18:32 *** Rafagd [~kvirc@BHE200150040171.res-com.wayinternet.com.br] has joined #openttd 05:30:27 *** SquireJames [RobertPalf@72.24.197.37] has joined #openttd 05:37:10 <SquireJames> Hello, I was just wondering if anyone knew if anyone had any plans for Restrictive Signalling in OTTD 05:37:22 *** Dephenom [~paul@81-178-15-211.dsl.pipex.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:37:45 *** Dephenom [~paul@81-178-15-211.dsl.pipex.com] has joined #openttd 05:42:32 <De_Ghost> or a always green signal 05:42:32 <De_Ghost> lol 05:50:39 *** Rafagd [~kvirc@BHE200150040171.res-com.wayinternet.com.br] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:00:44 <SquireJames> Okay, i'll ask here ;) 06:01:01 <SquireJames> Does OpenTTD support enhancedtunnels or custombridgeheads? 06:03:00 <DaleStan> toresbe: PBS was removed ages ago. (Before 0.5.0) 06:06:27 *** elmex [~elmex@e180065091.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #openttd 06:31:00 *** Die [~diego@host181.200-117-171.telecom.net.ar] has joined #openttd 06:31:23 <Die> identify 06:34:12 *** Die [~diego@host181.200-117-171.telecom.net.ar] has left #openttd [Ex-Chat] 06:34:12 *** Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-240-088.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 06:34:32 <SquireJames> Right, sorry if i bother people with questions but 06:47:49 *** SquireJames [RobertPalf@72.24.197.37] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!] 06:56:44 *** KouDy [user@85.207.64.178] has joined #openttd 07:08:58 *** gfldex_ [~dex@dslb-084-058-053-167.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 07:15:52 *** gfldex [~dex@dslb-084-058-054-063.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:40:33 *** Gekkko` [~Gekkko@CPE-58-166-116-114.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 07:40:41 *** Gekkko` is now known as Gekz 07:52:21 *** prakti [~prakti@port-213-148-152-8.static.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 08:09:37 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB5601.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 08:21:11 *** FlowaPowa [~Flowa@4va54-4-82-244-103-144.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 08:24:34 *** Gekz [~Gekkko@CPE-58-166-116-114.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Quit: http://bbqsrc.net] 08:36:53 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-130-149.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 08:38:09 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387C0CF.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 08:48:14 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:50:42 *** nairan_ZZzz [~Maui_key@p5498CE71.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:58:19 *** Ailure [Ailure@194.47.44.201] has left #openttd [] 08:58:25 *** Ailure [Ailure@194.47.44.201] has joined #openttd 09:01:03 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 09:03:31 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host240-239-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 09:04:31 <Wolf01> hello 09:10:58 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 09:21:52 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 09:24:39 *** Arpad [~Gali@tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:27:23 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:49:40 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 09:52:10 *** Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:52:14 *** dihedral is now known as Guest1023 09:52:15 *** dihedral [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-237-186.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 09:52:27 <dihedral> morning... :-) 09:58:36 *** mikl [~mikl@0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.broadband.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 09:58:43 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 10:18:09 *** Ben_ [~Ben@82.152.171.29] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:25:34 *** peterbrett [~peter@ptbb2b.girton.cam.ac.uk] has joined #openttd 10:26:47 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D5C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 10:35:42 *** Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-84-226-41-22.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd 10:36:32 *** Tefad [~tefad@c-71-63-10-8.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 10:37:18 *** gfldex_ is now known as gfldex 10:47:54 *** peterbrett [~peter@ptbb2b.girton.cam.ac.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:54:51 <toresbe> DaleStan: ah. The wiki does not reflect this :) 11:02:33 <XeryusTC> <SquireJames> Does OpenTTD support enhancedtunnels or custombridgeheads? <- no, no 11:12:49 *** Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-240-088.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:14:41 <Tefad> i've not known many wiki's to be very reflective 11:14:45 <Tefad> try a mirror instead 11:17:46 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:20:40 *** nairan [~Maui_key@p5498CE71.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:23:12 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 11:25:23 *** TinoM [~Tino@i5387C0CF.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 11:30:55 *** Arpad [~Gali@tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 11:37:37 *** Arpad [~Gali@tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:39:12 *** AntB [~AntB-UK@81.140.71.226] has joined #openttd 11:43:28 *** Arpad [~Gali@tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 12:07:28 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:10:54 *** KouDy [user@85.207.64.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:11:25 *** _Ben_ [~Ben@82.152.249.74] has joined #openttd 12:17:49 *** AntB [~AntB-UK@81.140.71.226] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:19:49 <dihedral> max_ships = 0 a and i was just offered a hovercraft :-) 12:20:54 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 12:20:57 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:22:26 *** Frostregen_ [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-115-105.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 12:24:18 *** prakti [~prakti@port-213-148-152-8.static.qsc.de] has quit [Quit: Quitting .... Hackedi...hackedi...weg.] 12:28:22 *** Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-108-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:28:36 *** Frostregen_ is now known as Frostregen 12:40:17 *** Peakki [antti@cs181247045.pp.htv.fi] has joined #openttd 12:53:58 *** Desolator [Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 12:54:24 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B80428.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:55:55 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B843EB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 12:55:59 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 13:15:37 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@62.243.161.205] has joined #openttd 13:15:39 *** mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ 13:17:44 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:18:01 *** Grey_ [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:19:06 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11217 /trunk/ (Makefile.in readme.txt): -Update: the readme as some things weren't quite right anymore. 13:20:40 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: glx * r11218 /trunk/ (Makefile.in config.lib): -Codechange: remove unused ENABLE_INSTALL in Makefile.in, and add --disable-unicode in configure help 13:21:26 <Betalord> is that autoreplace button working? 13:21:39 <glx> in depots? 13:21:44 <Betalord> I tried dragging a plane to it (in the hangar) to replace it as it was old, but it didn't do anything 13:21:54 <glx> you just need to clic on it 13:21:56 <Betalord> so I had to sell it and buy a new one 13:22:00 <glx> it's a real button 13:22:02 <Bjarni> you press that button and then it will try to replace everything in the depot 13:22:03 <Betalord> I clicked too, nothing happened 13:22:20 <Bjarni> make sure that you have enough money and all that 13:22:28 <glx> and it doesn't renew, but replace 13:22:31 <Bjarni> and that you set up replace for the engine in question 13:22:34 <Betalord> yeah, money's no a problem. 200 million will do? ;) 13:22:58 <Betalord> aha, how do I set up a replacement? 13:23:09 <glx> in vehicle list 13:23:12 <Bjarni> 200 million is not really a useful info as it lacks the info about currency and if you set up some obscene autorenew money setting 13:23:19 <glx> manage list, replace 13:23:23 <Betalord> (I thought it would just replace it with the same model, just that it's new) 13:23:39 <Betalord> let me check 13:23:50 <Bjarni> <Betalord> (I thought it would just replace it with the same model, just that it's new) <-- this is what it will NOT do ;) 13:24:42 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:25:22 <Betalord> ok again, where can I set up a replacement? 13:25:34 <Betalord> can't find any button or anything anywhere 13:25:43 <glx> open vehicle list 13:25:57 <Betalord> in the hanger? 13:26:06 <glx> no in the toolbar 13:26:07 <Betalord> the plane button, bottom right? 13:26:11 <Betalord> ah, moment 13:26:39 <Betalord> ah, found it: manage list -> replace vehicles 13:26:42 <Bjarni> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Autoreplace 13:26:51 *** valhalla1w is now known as valhallasw 13:27:03 <Bjarni> glx: you need to be quicker to point to the wiki 13:27:06 <dihedral> Rubidium: [14:20] <dihedral> max_ships = 0 a and i was just offered a hovercraft :-) 13:27:18 <dihedral> is that normal :-) 13:27:23 <Bjarni> heh 13:27:29 <dihedral> or is that intended? 13:27:42 <Bjarni> a hovercraft is not a ship as it's ON the water, not IN the water :P 13:27:49 <Bjarni> however the game don't know that difference 13:27:50 *** KouDy [user@85.207.64.178] has joined #openttd 13:28:07 <dihedral> and out of which depot does it come 13:28:13 <glx> dihedral: you can't buy it but it's not a problem for the game 13:28:15 <Bjarni> ship depot 13:28:17 <dihedral> and how many can you build if max_ships is set to 0 13:28:22 <Bjarni> 0 13:28:28 <dihedral> :-) 13:28:41 <dihedral> glx: i would not have thought it were a prob to the game 13:28:45 <dihedral> it's just missleading 13:28:51 <dihedral> and not very nice 13:29:07 <glx> well, make a patch to prevent it ;) 13:29:22 <Bjarni> you have an autosave from just before it happened 13:29:25 <Bjarni> keep it 13:29:28 <Bjarni> so you can test 13:29:52 *** Desolator [Desolator@86.126.36.149] has quit [Quit: Leaving FTW!] 13:29:58 <Bjarni> by keeping, I mean move it elsewhere so it's not overwritten 13:30:17 <Betalord> Bjarni, how does this work though? Does it replace all vehicles of that type, or just too old ones, or can you even controle which individual vehicles to replace? 13:30:29 <dihedral> i do ... http://pub.dihedral.de/openttd/FPN/autosave10.sav 13:30:38 <Bjarni> Betalord: all of them 13:30:52 <glx> but you can prevent some groups to be replaced 13:31:07 <Bjarni> globally next time they enter a depot (or if they are already in a depot and you click the button) 13:31:07 <glx> IIRC 13:31:09 <Betalord> Bjarni, that is not very useful though 13:31:16 <Bjarni> o_O 13:31:20 <Betalord> I want to replace just the ones that are too old etc. 13:31:41 <glx> there's autorenew for that 13:31:54 *** gynterk [~gynter@84-50-137-112-dsl.rkv.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd 13:31:59 <Betalord> oh, where's that? :) 13:32:10 <glx> in patches option 13:32:56 <Betalord> aha found that option. How does it work? When vehicle gets old is gets to hangar automatically and new one is bought? 13:33:01 <glx> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Autorenew 13:33:56 <Betalord> ok this is not what I'm looking for either, I don't want some old outdated models to get replaced by the same outdated models, I want to have some control over it 13:34:41 <glx> use autoreplace for outdated->newer 13:34:52 <Bjarni> updated that wiki page 13:35:00 <Bjarni> somebody wrote something incorrectly :( 13:35:04 <glx> autorenew for old->new (same type) 13:35:10 <Bjarni> please reload 13:35:14 <Betalord> ok 13:36:34 <Betalord> ok, I still don't get it - how can I make use of the "Autoreplace all aircraft in the hangar" button? 13:36:55 <Bjarni> say you have a plane of type A in the hangar 13:37:04 <Bjarni> and you want it to be type B 13:37:15 <Bjarni> then you set up autoreplace so A->B 13:37:28 <Betalord> in vehicles list, you mean? 13:37:30 <Bjarni> and then you press the button to activate that replace rule on all aircraft in the hangar 13:37:50 <Bjarni> <Bjarni> then you set up autoreplace so A->B <-- in the autoreplace window, which is opened from the vehicle list 13:38:09 <Betalord> yes I've got that set up, but the button in hangar still doesn't do anything 13:38:28 <Bjarni> then you did something wrong :P 13:38:38 <Betalord> should I enable "Start replacing vehicles" in that vehicle list? 13:38:46 <Bjarni> YES 13:38:53 <Bjarni> do as the wiki tell you to do 13:38:54 <Betalord> because last time that I clicked that, it replaced ALL of myy planes of that type, which is NOT what I want 13:39:26 <Bjarni> autoreplace is a tool to use when you want to replace a whole lot of one type to another one 13:39:40 <Bjarni> it's actually not really designed to replace just a single vehicle 13:39:46 <glx> it's a global replacement but using groups you can prevent unwanted replacements 13:40:15 <glx> (nightly feature) 13:40:21 <Betalord> ok I guess I'm doing something wrong 13:40:35 <Betalord> my goal: to replace aircrafts in the hanger with new ones 13:40:39 <Betalord> what I did: 13:40:56 <Betalord> went to vehicle list, then manage list -> replace vehicles 13:41:10 <Betalord> selected the type that I want to replace on left pane, selected type B on right pane 13:41:12 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A47EC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 13:41:20 <Betalord> now 2 different scenarios: 13:41:43 <Betalord> a) I clicked "start replacing vehicles". That replaced ALL of my planes of that type, which is not what I want at all 13:42:17 <glx> that is how it is supposed to work 13:42:31 <Betalord> b) I didn't click the replace button, but I did set up type B on the right pane. I went to hangar where I had a plane of type A parked, and clicked "Autoreplace all aircraft in hangar". Nothing happened 13:42:53 <Bjarni> this is how it's supposed to work 13:43:00 <Betalord> now my question is, how do I replace that plane in the hangar with new plane?* 13:43:06 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:43:09 <Bjarni> as I said: it's designed to work on a whole lot of vehicles, not just a single one 13:43:21 <Betalord> (withouth selling it and buying a new one) 13:43:36 <Bjarni> you can't, unless you mess with vehicle groups 13:43:45 <Bjarni> selling and buying a new one is likely faster 13:43:47 <glx> in nightlies you can group vehicules and protect them against global replacements 13:44:03 <Betalord> ok, then tell me what does the "Autoreplace all vehicles in hangar" button do? Beceuse it doesn't do anything in my case 13:44:52 <glx> autoreplace is done when vehicle enter in depot 13:44:55 <Bjarni> normally autoreplace trigger one vehicles once they enter a depot. If your depot is full of that type of vehicle when you start to replace, you can hit that button to replace everything inside 13:45:07 <Bjarni> otherwise you would have to make all of them leave and return to replace them 13:45:53 <Betalord> hm I don't understand 13:45:54 <Bjarni> that's basically the only use I can find for this button, but people requested it, so I made it 13:46:20 <Betalord> why would such a button be needed if autoreplacement is done automatically anyway? 13:46:43 <Bjarni> most of the time it's not needed 13:46:45 <glx> because autoreplacement is not done if the vehicle is already stopped in depot 13:46:47 <Bjarni> but imagine this 13:47:04 <Betalord> ok anyway, my suggestion is this: make it so that upon clicking on this button all the planes parked in the hanger are replaced with new ones, according to rules set in "autoreplace list" 13:47:08 <skidd13> My current openttd binary segfaults sometimes when autosave :( 13:47:21 <Bjarni> you stopped say 10 vehicles in the depot, then you set replace for them, hit the replace button and stop the replace setting in the autoreplace window 13:47:24 <skidd13> s/when/during/ 13:47:32 <Bjarni> skidd13: that's bad 13:47:34 <Bjarni> what OS? 13:47:40 <glx> bad chars? 13:47:59 <skidd13> Bjarni: Debian Linux 13:48:37 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-164-234.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ThePizzaKing] 13:48:38 <Bjarni> the OSX port had an autosave issue. It was due to letters like À, but I think unicode got rid of this for good 13:49:06 <skidd13> The problem is that the autosave works as normal quite a long time and then suddenly bang. 13:49:10 *** Grey_ [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:49:12 <glx> maybe a NULL dereference in saveload code 13:49:19 <Bjarni> btw À is a bad letter not to be able to use as the savegame by default also includes the name of the month 13:49:41 <Bjarni> skidd13: play in a debugger to figure out why it dies 13:50:05 <Bjarni> would be nice to know which line it dies in 13:55:10 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 13:55:53 <Phazorx> are there any NI crucial changes since last nighty? 13:56:12 *** orudge [orudge@78.32.42.132] has quit [Quit: Goodbye.] 13:56:30 *** Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-214-055.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 13:56:57 *** orudge [orudge@78.32.42.132] has joined #openttd 13:56:58 *** mode/#openttd [+o orudge] by ChanServ 13:56:59 <skidd13> The stange thing is, it happens from time to time, I noticed it after the NewIndustries got in, but I can't really reproduce. 13:56:59 <skidd13> That's what I got in the console. 13:56:59 <skidd13> "Laden des Spieles fehlgeschlagen" = "Savegame loading aborted" 13:56:59 <skidd13> "Spielstandsdatei defekt" = "savegame corrupted" - Invalid chunk size 13:57:19 <TrueBrain> out of diskspace? 13:57:41 <skidd13> Hmm, still 3,8 GB free 14:01:26 <skidd13> If I notice it again I'll tell you 14:02:08 *** Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:02:31 *** Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 14:03:28 <TrueBrain> idiotic Windows Media Encoder... it doesn't output a thing :s 14:03:41 *** Mark [~Mark@86.84.7.53] has joined #openttd 14:03:45 <Phazorx> hmm... 11218 doesnt want to compile with AI bug 14:03:56 <Phazorx> In file included from /home/ottdcoop/svn-devserver/src/ai/ai.cpp:5: 14:03:56 <Phazorx> /home/ottdcoop/svn-devserver/src/ai/../variables.h:243: error: expected unqualified-id before '<<' token 14:04:04 <glx> conflict 14:04:33 <glx> search for <<<< and >>>> in this file 14:04:51 *** Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:05:21 <Phazorx> $ cat src/variables.h | grep "<<<" 14:05:21 <Phazorx> <<<<<<< .mine 14:05:39 <glx> that is a conflict marker 14:05:47 <Phazorx> hmm 14:06:07 *** Nitehawk [~nitehawk@c-98-200-106-108.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 14:06:41 <Phazorx> and what do i do with that? 14:06:49 <glx> opent the file 14:07:27 *** _Bastiaan_ [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 14:07:34 <glx> compare the lines in conflict and fix it 14:08:07 <Phazorx> oh... some ancient patch i guess 14:09:45 <Phazorx> thanks 14:17:12 <Bjarni> you will also get src/variables.h.* where * is rxxxx or mine... those should be deleted once you solved the conflict or svn will think that you still have it 14:17:51 <glx> just use "svn resolved src/variables.h" 14:25:04 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 14:27:05 <Phazorx> glx: there was a few patches i didnt know about applied 14:27:17 <glx> your problem ;) 14:27:23 <Phazorx> i just cleaned them since theya re really outdated 14:27:24 <Phazorx> yes 14:28:01 *** nStensen [noway@host-81-191-136-209.bluecom.no] has joined #openttd 14:30:33 <nStensen> hi all, im trying to start a dedicated server on a machine running gentoo, but I get this in the log: "dbg: [NET] Server could not start network: bind() failed" 14:31:20 *** _Bastiaan_ [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:31:45 *** _Bastiaan_ [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 14:31:45 *** _Bastiaan_ [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:32:09 <glx> nStensen: what did you set in server_bind_ip ? 14:32:51 <nStensen> server_bind_ip = 91.189.124.72 14:32:51 <nStensen> server_port = 3979 14:33:52 <glx> use 0.0.0.0 14:34:01 <nStensen> wont that make it bind to all IPs? 14:34:16 <glx> yes 14:34:23 <glx> you can use a local ip too 14:34:50 <nStensen> hmm, it works now .. but I need it to bind to 91.189.124.72 14:34:52 <nStensen> ;) 14:35:10 <nStensen> I want to run several openttd servers running on different IPs instead of different ports 14:35:11 *** _Bastiaan_ [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 14:35:14 <glx> why do you need it to bind to the external one? 14:35:26 *** _Bastiaan_ [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:36:55 <nStensen> i'm not sure I follow .. could you define "external"? I have 18 IPs on this server, and I only openttd to listen on one of these atm 14:39:46 <gfldex> nStensen: do you use any virtualization software on that machine? 14:41:17 <nStensen> yes, it's running openvz (openttd is in a vps) .. but I dont see why it wouldnt work, because it works when running on a VPS running debian 14:42:31 <gfldex> does openvz support linux capabilities? 14:48:18 <nStensen> think I found it ;) 14:48:34 <nStensen> after you found what's wrong with capabilities you can add missing capability to your VE with vzctl command. 14:50:08 <nStensen> guess I need to add "NET_BIND_SERVICE" ? 14:50:23 <gfldex> i dont know 14:50:33 <gfldex> but you could try http://wari.mckay.com/~rm/bindhack.c.txt as well 14:50:35 <Ailure> do we really need four diffrent newindustries threads in general? :) 14:51:15 *** Amix [Michal@cm-84.208.152.166.chello.no] has joined #openttd 14:51:20 <Amix> hey 14:52:01 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Little2032.png 14:52:04 <Amix> ;) 14:52:19 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Little2033.png 14:52:39 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/LittleBronnwell2036.png 14:52:42 <Amix> ;) 14:53:22 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Winninghall1976.png 14:53:25 <glx> Amix: no need to put one way on all tiles 14:53:27 <Amix> trams are cooool 14:53:30 <Amix> :) 14:53:37 <Amix> glx: i know 14:53:40 <Amix> but if i dont 14:53:49 <Amix> the city will destroy the design 14:53:52 <Amix> :) 14:54:07 <glx> disable city growth 14:54:10 <Amix> it will make crosses which i dont want it to make ;=) 14:54:31 <Amix> glx: ? i want the city to grow 14:54:46 <glx> ha ok 14:55:08 <nStensen> ahh:) now it works :) 14:55:13 *** |Bastiaan| [~kvirc@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/] 14:55:15 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Winninghall1977.png 14:55:15 <nStensen> thanks for you help folks ;) 14:55:16 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has joined #openttd 14:55:29 <Amix> thats tram with its own track allmost 14:55:32 <Amix> ;D 15:07:11 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:07:25 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 15:13:13 <Sionide> neat 15:13:26 <Sionide> but why? 15:13:33 <Sionide> Amix, why not just use the existing road and lay the tram on top of it? 15:14:07 *** De_Ghost [~De_Ghost@99.237.68.239] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:19:02 *** De_Ghost [~De_Ghost@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 15:23:48 *** Zr40 [~zr40@2001:960:786:0:21b:63ff:fe9e:ab24] has joined #openttd 15:26:58 <Ailure> [16:54] <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Winninghall1977.png 15:27:10 <Ailure> this reminds me so about my Simcity 4 sessions := 15:27:17 <Ailure> with one-way roads, avenues and highways 15:28:13 <Amix> hehe 15:28:16 <Amix> :) 15:28:31 <Ailure> http://194.47.44.201/simcity4/Nuclear%20city-5%20Jul.,%202141191485463.png 15:28:34 <Ailure> http://194.47.44.201/simcity4/Nuclear%20city-5%20Jul.,%202141191485384.png 15:28:37 <Amix> Sionide: because tram isnt a good tram on roads 15:28:38 <Ailure> I use them alot in Simcity4 15:28:40 <Amix> :) 15:28:41 <Ailure> but hardly in openTTD 15:28:43 <hylje> imma gonna open a bunch of tickets for sc4 features on ottd 15:28:57 <Ailure> lol 15:29:05 <hylje> Ailure: ottd revolves around trains and tracks, simcity around roads and vehicles 15:29:10 <Ailure> some dosen't translate as well to ottd 15:29:11 <Ailure> though 15:29:15 <Ailure> well yeah 15:29:17 <Ailure> obviously 15:29:27 <Amix> Ailure: nice 15:29:28 <Ailure> roads have no traffic other than trucks and buses 15:29:34 <Ailure> in OTTD 15:29:40 <hylje> ottd needs private traffic 15:29:42 <Ailure> but in Simcity4 there's all kind of automobiles 15:30:03 <Ailure> hm 15:30:09 <Ailure> there's a lack of cars on thoose pictures 15:30:17 <Amix> hehe 15:30:19 <Ailure> probably becuse I paused the game right away and then zoomed in 15:30:20 <Amix> i know 15:30:28 <Ailure> there's usually tons of cars there 15:30:37 <Ailure> it's high-traffic parts of my road network :P 15:30:48 <hylje> how does one build arbitrary bridges on sc? 15:30:55 <Ailure> mods 15:31:02 <Ailure> the ones on the screenshot 15:31:05 <hylje> yeh 15:31:09 <Ailure> was built with the help of a networkaddonmod 15:31:13 <hylje> do they really work? 15:31:15 <Ailure> yes 15:31:23 <Ailure> even in somewhat sucky u-drive-it mode 15:31:26 <hylje> :o 15:31:39 <Amix> Ailure: http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Gronningley1974.png 15:31:43 <Amix> now i create this 15:31:46 <Amix> ;) 15:32:04 <Ailure> hah 15:32:13 <Ailure> ...oh yeah there's a avenue with a tram track in the middle for that mod too 15:32:26 <hylje> trams in my simcity? 15:32:27 <hylje> what 15:32:30 <Ailure> in this mod 15:32:36 <Ailure> also called lightrail 15:32:46 <Ailure> says lightrail/tram in the game :P 15:33:09 <hylje> when i get around to my ttd clone 15:33:22 <hylje> ill do that and go towards simcity when it comes to cities 15:33:37 <SpComb> forget your TTD clone and svn co myottd :( 15:33:41 <hylje> :< 15:33:46 <SpComb> it's the new SpBot 15:34:02 <SpComb> SpBot was out of #tycoon for a week before anyone noticed 15:34:08 <hylje> :o 15:34:09 <SpComb> or at least before anyone bothered to tell me 15:34:23 <hylje> so what does myottd need 15:34:34 <hylje> for development and features 15:34:44 <Amix> Ailure: i am running openttd on morphos 15:34:51 <Amix> so i dont have simcity4 here 15:34:54 <Amix> ;) 15:34:54 <SpComb> something along the lines of a feature-set compareable to autopilot 15:35:07 <SpComb> and then other things as needed 15:35:31 <SpComb> e.g. I got eis_os to create an XML-based API for GRF Crawler which I plan on using for some kind of NewGRF thing 15:35:40 <hylje> well 15:36:11 <hylje> svn: Client error in parsing arguments 15:36:24 <SpComb> svn co svn://svn.martila.de/myottd/trunk 15:36:27 <Ailure> [17:33] <Amix> Ailure: i am running openttd on morphos 15:36:27 <Ailure> [17:33] <Amix> so i dont have simcity4 here 15:36:27 <Ailure> [17:33] <Amix> ;) 15:36:29 <Ailure> heh shame 15:36:39 <Ailure> Simcity 4 is limited for Windows and any platform that Wine runs on 15:36:43 *** Tobin [~tobin@c58-107-50-36.eburwd7.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 15:36:48 <Ailure> it runs faster in Wine than Windows according to most reports xD 15:37:51 <hylje> SpComb: so what else do i need? 15:37:58 <SpComb> marttila.de, that is 15:38:05 <hylje> figured 15:38:06 <SpComb> in terms of dependancies, now? 15:38:09 <hylje> yes 15:38:23 <Amix> Ailure: simcity4 exsists for osx 15:38:38 <Ailure> I heard that version is rather quirky though 15:38:41 <Ailure> with addons 15:38:56 <hylje> mac ports of games fail when it comes to modding 15:38:58 <hylje> in general 15:39:15 <Ailure> well it works 15:39:21 <Ailure> but any added buildings 15:39:23 <Ammller> we have set up a NewIndustrie Server with PBI, if someone like to join: #openttdcoop.dev 15:39:25 <Ailure> won't have nightlits working 15:39:31 <Ailure> *nightlights 15:39:31 <hylje> heh 15:39:35 <Ailure> since the game have a day->night shift 15:39:42 <hylje> ive played the game 15:39:48 <SpComb> well, python, twisted, pylons/paster, sqlalchemy should get you quite far along 15:40:30 <hylje> 20 MB of new packages 15:40:55 <hylje> oh, just 2MB 15:41:23 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A47EC.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [] 15:44:24 <SpComb> I can't really help very much at the moment, we're preparing to start an Empire Earth game 15:44:32 <hylje> haha 15:44:51 <hylje> i have that game somewhere but heard it doesnt quite work on wine 15:45:21 * SpComb just commited a typo fix 15:47:56 *** mikegrb_ [~michael@mail.thegrebs.com] has joined #openttd 15:49:40 *** Arpad [~Gali@tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:49:50 *** plaes_ [~plaes@ns.store20.com] has joined #openttd 15:50:02 *** Arpad [~Gali@tor-irc.dnsbl.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:50:05 *** Tefad_ [~tefad@c-71-63-10-8.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 15:51:09 *** CIA-5 [cia@208.69.182.149] has joined #openttd 15:51:34 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> larich.oftc.net quits: Phazorx, mikegrb, CIA-4, Wolf01, Tefad, izhirahider, plaes 15:51:48 *** Netsplit over, joins: Wolf01 15:52:05 *** izhirahider [~izhirahid@squareroot.divisionbyzero.net] has joined #openttd 15:55:51 <Amix> a nice game would be GTA:Norway 15:55:54 <Amix> ;) 15:56:04 * SpComb is now afk 15:56:37 <Ailure> haha 15:59:27 <SpComb> not actually 16:00:10 <SpComb> hylje: oh, and postgresql as well, including psycopg2 and pypgsql (yes, both :P), I just commited a database dump as db_2.sql 16:00:27 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:00:29 <SpComb> we're still waiting for one player to join... 16:01:16 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 16:01:36 <SpComb> right 16:01:53 <hylje> left 16:04:07 <hylje> oh god these dependencies 16:04:25 <hylje> now does this thing come with a server? 16:05:42 *** mikegrb_ is now known as mikegrb 16:10:15 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-84-44-130-149.netcologne.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:12:53 <Sacro> rail_cmd.cpp doesn't appear in solution explorer 16:13:02 <hylje> submit a patch 16:13:11 <Sacro> no :p 16:13:13 * Sacro prods glx 16:13:30 <glx> msvc? 16:13:40 <Sacro> yep 16:13:59 <Sacro> 441MB download D: 16:14:53 <glx> look in Landscape subsection 16:15:41 <Sacro> so it is :) 16:15:56 <Sacro> 23 mins on dx_sdk... 16:15:58 <Sacro> twiddles thumbs 16:16:05 <Sacro> and MSDNAA is down :( 16:17:42 <Sacro> only 7 warnings 16:17:50 <Sacro> not bad considering i don't have DXSDK or usefil.zip 16:20:40 <Sacro> *starts ripping the signalling section to shreds* 16:25:35 <SpComb> hylje: a server for what? 16:26:03 <SpComb> and yes, it does have a fair amount of dependancies, it's really meant to be run centrally... 16:26:25 <hylje> am i supposed to run apache to poke on it? 16:26:37 <SpComb> paster serve --reload development.ini 16:26:41 <SpComb> http://localhost:9160/ 16:27:14 <SpComb> and daemon/main.py 16:27:31 <SpComb> but the game continues --> 16:29:27 *** Peakki [antti@cs181247045.pp.htv.fi] has quit [Quit: LÀhdössÀ] 16:38:44 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:46:07 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd 16:51:22 *** nairan is now known as mcbane 16:56:53 *** orudge [orudge@78.32.42.132] has quit [Quit: Goodbye.] 16:58:11 <Sacro> :o 16:58:14 <Sacro> norudge :( 17:00:55 *** orudge [orudge@78.32.42.132] has joined #openttd 17:00:56 *** mode/#openttd [+o orudge] by ChanServ 17:03:15 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D5C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:08:34 *** Wolf01 is now known as Wolf01|AWAY 17:12:16 <Sacro> glx: getting freetype errors :( 17:12:30 <glx> using useful.zip? 17:12:39 <Sacro> err... 17:12:42 <Sacro> no gnuwin32 17:12:58 <glx> gnuwin32 libs are mingw ones 17:13:08 <Sacro> hmmm 17:13:14 <Sacro> and that probably won't work :p 17:13:25 <Sacro> someone should remove the link to them from the wiki page 17:13:37 <glx> gcc can use .lib from msvc but the opposite fails ;) 17:13:47 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/tramroutes.png 17:13:51 <Sacro> nope 17:13:52 <Amix> my tramroutes :) 17:13:56 <Sacro> still 8 unresolved externals 17:14:00 <Sacro> fontcache.obj 17:14:28 <glx> what are the missing symbols? 17:15:43 <Sacro> __imp_@FT_{Done_Face@4, LOAD_CHAR@12, Init_FreeType@4, Select_Charmap@8, New_Face@16, Render_Glyph@8, Set_Pixel_Sizes@12} 17:17:58 <glx> with useful-1.2 ? 17:19:09 <Sacro> yeah 17:19:15 <Sacro> extracted include and lib 17:19:19 <glx> where? 17:19:33 <Sacro> into a folder which i then pointed VS at 17:20:24 <glx> I don't know then 17:22:05 <Sacro> do i need to compile anything for freetype 17:22:08 <Sacro> i see a lsn 17:22:10 <Sacro> *sln 17:25:34 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 17:25:35 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has quit [] 17:25:51 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 17:26:13 <Sacro> glx: it works fine when you paste them into the VC folder :s 17:26:40 <glx> I have them in VC folder :) 17:27:59 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:28:45 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:33:36 *** SquireJames [RobertPalf@72.24.197.37] has joined #openttd 17:33:43 <SquireJames> hello people 17:34:57 <SquireJames> looking for a kind soul who can help me solve some of my compiling woes 17:35:34 <SquireJames> I'm using BuildOTTD and I'm trying to add the routemarkers patch to the latest nightly, so I can Pikkas Industries and routemarkers 17:35:52 <SquireJames> but, it just complains that the compile has failed, I can't seem to find any logs of why 17:36:55 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has quit [Quit: I'm out for now] 17:43:19 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 17:43:25 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has quit [] 17:43:37 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 17:44:25 <SquireJames> right, okay, no answer, okay go simpler. Firstly, does the latest nightly r11208 hve newhouses support 17:44:47 <glx> yes 17:45:01 <Sacro> most people tend to use a proper compiler 17:45:05 <Ailure> newhouses been in for a long long time now 17:45:06 <Ailure> :) 17:45:12 <SquireJames> Hmm, I wonder why TTRS is having trouble then 17:45:31 <SquireJames> it seems to function, the new houses and roads appear, but in the newgrf menu it says disabled 17:45:53 <SquireJames> and as soon as i click apply or try and add any new grf, it seems to realise that its disabled and the towns return to normal 17:46:16 <Sacro> hmm 17:46:24 <Sacro> i have a PPC2003 emulator :\ 17:46:54 *** Phazorx [PACO@CPE0011d8690c25-CM001225db7ae8.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 17:47:32 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:47:42 <Ammller> SquireJames: just did a screen with newindustries: http://openttdcoop.ppcis.org/blog/files/blog/2007/10/meaworth-transport-28th-jul-1957.png 17:47:57 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:48:35 <toresbe> heh 17:48:43 <toresbe> I like how the mines are over the tunnel 17:48:48 *** SquireJames [RobertPalf@72.24.197.37] has quit [Quit: Bye for now!] 17:48:54 *** SquireJames [RobertPalf@72.24.197.37] has joined #openttd 17:48:58 <Ailure> bahaha 17:49:02 <Sacro> oops :) 17:49:05 <SquireJames> Whoops, i clicked the link and it logged me out 17:49:08 <Ammller> yeah, hopefully, they don't dig more there 17:49:14 <Sacro> Belugas: you around? 17:49:15 <SquireJames> Could you perchance repost it? 17:49:34 <SquireJames> and do we have any idea why TTRS is suddenly throwing a fit? 17:49:49 <Ammller> http://openttdcoop.ppcis.org/blog/files/blog/2007/10/meaworth-transport-28th-jul-1957.png 17:51:07 <SquireJames> I see from the screenie, you have TTRS working 17:51:39 <Desolator> SquireJames 17:52:03 <SquireJames> yes? 17:52:13 <Desolator> I queried you 17:52:53 *** Desolator [~Desolator@86.126.36.149] has quit [Quit: I'm out for now] 17:55:23 <Sacro> i need to find out how to convert blender to grf 17:55:29 <Sacro> or ldraw to grf 17:55:31 *** Desolator [Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 17:55:35 <Sacro> or maybe pov-ray to grf 17:57:07 * Desolator slaps SquireJames around a bit with a large trout 17:57:40 <TrueBrain> Sacro: good luck :) 17:57:55 <Sacro> TrueBrain: why? 17:58:00 <Sacro> i have all the rails done 17:58:01 <SquireJames> sorry bck 17:58:02 <Sacro> and the roads 17:58:47 <glx> Desolator: did you see my post in ChrisIN thread? 17:59:09 <Desolator> no 17:59:24 <glx> your win9x build is not a win9x build 17:59:33 <Desolator> blame that on MinGW 17:59:53 <glx> no you didn't configure correctly 18:00:24 <Desolator> I followed the wiki article 18:00:41 <glx> it is not up to date 18:00:53 <Desolator> ahh 18:01:12 <glx> you should do "configure --disable-unicode" 18:01:18 <Desolator> ok, i'll compile againb 18:03:11 <Desolator> btw what's CLI? 18:03:30 <Ailure> command line interface 18:03:42 <Ailure> compare it with GUI 18:03:50 <Sacro> heh 18:03:53 <Desolator> "or directly "make bundle_zip" (if you have zip CLI installed)" 18:03:54 <Ailure> which is graphical user interface 18:03:57 <Sacro> we got asked "What is a CLE" 18:04:21 <Desolator> well glx, what do you mean there? 18:04:36 <TrueBrain> that WinZip doesn't do it 18:04:45 <Sacro> http://www.google.co.uk/search?q=define%3Aecstatic&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&client=firefox-a hehe 18:05:30 <TrueBrain> lol @ Sacro 18:05:30 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:05:32 <Desolator> TrueBrain: ok you confused me even more 18:05:56 <TrueBrain> Desolator: WinZip == GUI 18:05:58 <TrueBrain> zip.exe == CLI 18:05:59 <Desolator> LMAO @ Sacro 18:06:12 <Desolator> oh 18:06:24 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:06:26 <Sacro> pkunzip! 18:06:28 <Desolator> I guess I'll zip up it myself 18:07:09 <Desolator> (using IzArc, who wants to pay for something that's worse than a freeware app?) 18:07:31 <Sacro> windows users? 18:07:35 <Desolator> yea 18:07:42 <Desolator> and linux too 18:08:14 <Desolator> (though I'm starting to kill Windoze & M$) 18:10:29 <Ailure> http://194.47.44.201/openttd/newIndustries/Presworth%20Transport,%2024th%20Aug%201933.png :) 18:10:33 <Ailure> I love the mess I wind up with sometimes 18:10:52 <Amix> http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/Gronningley1986.png 18:10:55 <Amix> :))) 18:10:58 <Amix> growing now 18:11:27 <Ailure> http://194.47.44.201/openttd/newIndustries/Presworth%20Transport,%2029th%20Jan%201929.png the way the steel mill works in PBI made things quite more challanging 18:11:39 <Ailure> ah yeah 18:11:44 <Ailure> that town form earlier 18:12:24 <Amix> yea 18:12:27 <Amix> :) 18:14:46 <SquireJames> I have to say, all of Pikkas work really makes OTTD for me 18:15:08 <SquireJames> UKRS, PBI, Brickchain, all brilliant and very British feeling 18:16:05 <Ailure> they go together well with the rest of the graphics too :P 18:16:17 <SquireJames> indeed 18:16:36 <SquireJames> my only wish is that the roads on the industries could somehow be overidden with the TTRS roads 18:16:54 <SquireJames> but i can overlook them :) hmm i wonder if i can override the roads on TTRS with the UK Roadset? 18:17:09 <Ailure> heh I usually use TTRS 18:17:14 <Ailure> but I skipped TTRS this game for some reason 18:18:04 <dihedral> i want a newIndu game 18:18:13 <dihedral> :-) 18:18:29 <SquireJames> hmm no luck overriding, ah well 18:19:04 *** simon_ [~simon@awork119071.netvigator.com] has joined #openttd 18:19:16 <simon_> hello punks 18:19:55 <simon_> the music is blasting crazy here at Tsim Sha Tsui 18:19:59 <TrueBrain> @kick simon_ bye 18:19:59 *** simon_ was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [bye] 18:20:12 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:20:15 *** simon_ [~simon@awork119071.netvigator.com] has joined #openttd 18:20:16 <SquireJames> this may sound odd 18:20:16 <mcbane> heh 18:20:27 <SquireJames> but why kick him? Is he a troublemaker? 18:20:34 <simon_> hmm, what was that for? 18:20:35 <dihedral> how do i make use of newindustries ? 18:20:45 <mcbane> never greet someone with hello punks. =D 18:20:46 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-81-173-255-132.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd 18:20:47 <SquireJames> dihedral, you will need some grf sets 18:20:50 <Desolator> you download a nightly and use a newindustries grf 18:20:52 <simon_> lol 18:20:52 <TrueBrain> at least mcbane gets it 18:21:01 <dihedral> thansk 18:21:06 <SquireJames> either ECS, or if your a brit or like british things, go for PBI 18:21:19 *** toresbe [~toresbe@201.80-203-102.nextgentel.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:21:23 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:21:25 <SquireJames> they may work together, i'm not sure if they cause some interesting conflictions 18:21:45 <simon_> I got too many wifi networks here 18:21:48 <mcbane> ecs is fun 18:21:54 <Ailure> Probably try ECS after I played with PBI 18:22:01 <simon_> I am in the main nightclub area of tsim sha tsui 18:22:07 <Desolator> We need 0.6! 18:22:19 <simon_> this place is awake all night 18:22:25 <Desolator> so? 18:22:31 <mcbane> but use low industries as there will be a lot on the map (high = colorful map) 18:22:40 <simon_> the only time it is quiet is in between 6:30-9AM 18:22:52 <Desolator> simon_: so? 18:23:12 <mcbane> its 20:23 here =) 18:23:23 <simon_> its 2:23AM here 18:23:41 <simon_> and there is a traffic jam outside 18:23:57 <simon_> through out the whole day there is not traffic jams 18:24:04 <simon_> only after 1AM do they start 18:24:09 <simon_> they end around 4AM 18:24:29 <Ailure> [20:21] <mcbane> but use low industries as there will be a lot on the map (high = colorful map) 18:24:40 <simon_> I got some labels I need to remove from boxes 18:24:41 <Ailure> heh I forgot to do this for PBI, and ECS seems to have more industries 18:24:50 <simon_> any one got any ideas? 18:24:56 <Ailure> it got little cluttered around some towns 18:25:01 <Desolator> what labels & what boxes? 18:25:06 <Ailure> but the industries close down on their own after awhile so oh well :p 18:25:20 <simon_> Desolator: cardboard boxes and paper labels 18:25:35 <Desolator> good luck 18:26:30 <mcbane> ailure: a lot more =P 18:26:34 <simon_> Desolator: you don't know of any magic alcohol that will not ruin the box but get the paper off? 18:27:20 <simon_> I am using a pocket knife to get under the paper and left it up but it is very slow and I poked a hole in the box once already 18:27:51 <Desolator> nope 18:29:11 <Desolator> glx: ok done 18:29:44 <Amix> OTTD is so cool 18:29:47 <Amix> i love it 18:29:47 <Amix> :) 18:29:56 <TrueBrain> we glad you do Amix :) 18:30:23 <Desolator> We'd love it more if you could announce an estimated release date of 0.6 RC1 ;) 18:30:38 <TrueBrain> @kick Desolator When It Is Done 18:30:38 *** Desolator was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [When It Is Done] 18:30:47 <TrueBrain> damn, that felt good 18:30:52 *** Desolator [Desolator@86.126.36.149] has joined #openttd 18:30:54 <Desolator> HEY! 18:30:59 <TrueBrain> ;) 18:31:02 * TrueBrain hugs Desolator 18:31:10 <Desolator> I said *estimated*... 18:31:51 * Desolator warns TrueBrain that he doesn't really love stupid kicks 18:32:06 <TrueBrain> Desolator: it wasn't stupid, so that is a plus 18:32:17 <Desolator> ... 18:32:22 <Desolator> it was 18:32:29 <TrueBrain> you are free to have your opinion :) 18:32:38 <simon_> TrueBrain: come on... don't do that to people 18:32:40 <Prof_Frink> Desolator: Between a minute and a century. 18:32:44 <simon_> I know it is fun 18:32:57 <Desolator> it would have been easier to type it directly and less annoying for me 18:33:00 <simon_> but you miss out on the channel which gets annoying 18:33:11 <TrueBrain> Desolator: but don't worry, it isn't personal: I kcik everyone asking for a release date, with that very same message 18:33:11 <Desolator> Prof_Frink: kinda...long... 18:33:15 <TrueBrain> I should add it to DorpsGek... 18:33:22 <Desolator> LOL 18:33:29 <Amix> also thank for morphos support :) as osnews person wrote. its something special with amigaos thats so different from other operating systems which is necessary to bring on into the future. 18:33:37 <TrueBrain> Amix: you use MorphOS?!?!?! :P 18:33:44 <Amix> yes 18:33:49 <Desolator> never heard of it 18:33:54 <TrueBrain> wow, that I experience that in my life... 18:34:06 <TrueBrain> a person who really uses the MorphOS version... 18:34:08 <Amix> ? 18:34:15 <Amix> there are some 18:34:23 <Amix> but not as active as me telling that 18:34:29 <TrueBrain> Clearly :) 18:34:33 * TrueBrain hugs Amix :) 18:34:38 <Amix> ;) 18:35:24 <simon_> I use much more than morphos 18:37:02 <TrueBrain> Amix: does the nightly also still work on MorphOS? 18:37:33 <Amix> yes 18:37:40 <TrueBrain> amazing.. 18:38:06 <Amix> TrueBrain: http://home.powertech.no/micbergs/OpenTTD/openttdmos.png 18:38:15 <Amix> this is nightly with trams ;) 18:38:24 <Desolator> TrueBrain, why did you left "mainstrea" dev? 18:38:27 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:38:31 <TrueBrain> Amix: cool :) 18:38:34 <Desolator> *maindtream 18:38:39 <Desolator> **mainstream 18:38:41 <TrueBrain> Desolator: keep trying :p 18:39:14 <TrueBrain> Desolator: and I did? I can't remember if I did ot nor did, I confuse myself :( 18:39:42 <Desolator> well I barely see you commiting to SVN 18:39:57 *** Wolf01|AWAY is now known as Wolf01 18:40:26 <Desolator> btw, any dev on Windoze here? 18:40:53 *** toresbe [~toresbe@201.80-203-102.nextgentel.com] has joined #openttd 18:41:11 <TrueBrain> Desolator: last commit was just 21 days ago... didn't know you are degreded that fast in this community :p 18:41:49 <Desolator> ... 18:43:54 *** Desolator [Desolator@86.126.36.149] has quit [Quit: out to do homework] 18:44:26 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 18:45:23 <Amix> TrueBrain: i am using morphos, macosx, win2k and symbian daily 18:45:26 <Amix> love all of them 18:45:35 <Amix> openttd on mos and osx 18:45:37 <TrueBrain> hehe :) Good choices ;) 18:45:51 <Amix> win2k only at work 18:45:56 <Noldo> I don't love this XP I'm forced to use 18:46:32 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:46:40 <Amix> if BeOS did well, BeOS could be a hero os :) 18:48:08 <Bjarni> maybe it is a hero OS 18:48:20 <TrueBrain> now I need to remember my Steam password :( 18:48:21 <Bjarni> after all there are very few heroes and very few BeOS users 18:49:41 <Bjarni> TrueBrain: the key (or password if you like) is to add coal in an even load (not a pile in the middle) and you will do fine ;) 18:52:48 <Amix> Bjarni: well.. BeOS had potential 18:53:45 <Bjarni> that's likely, but odds that it will get though today are... well not in the BeOS favour 18:55:47 <Amix> its kinda ironic that the slowest oses survive 18:56:00 <toresbe> no it isn't... they're harder to shut down 18:56:10 <Amix> lol 18:56:11 <toresbe> "oh, screw it, I'll just stick with Windows..." 18:56:50 <Noldo> the OS race has never been about technical superiority 18:57:05 <Amix> correct 18:57:12 *** Rafagd [~kvirc@200.196.39.5] has joined #openttd 18:57:16 <Amix> its the gamers that have pushed hardware producers 18:57:19 <Noldo> but I wonder how much resources does it take to "keep an OS alive" 18:57:39 <TrueBrain> MorphOS is still alive 18:57:44 <Amix> Noldo: you need a community, a trusted company etc 18:58:02 <Amix> community can survive without company though 18:58:05 <Amix> but its hard 18:58:07 <Bjarni> you don't need a trusted company 18:58:20 <Bjarni> look at some linux distributions 18:58:32 <Amix> well, linux is open sourced 18:58:44 <Amix> i thought we talked about commercial oses 18:58:47 <Amix> ;p 18:58:48 <Sacro> osen 18:59:49 <Rafagd> anyone has a link to the video of that dude who drives a box? o.o 19:00:38 <Amix> TrueBrain: MorphOS is alive because there are bunch of hardcore Amiga fanatics which loves it. Its only alive because of its community thru forum, irc and the web. I bet that without the net, AmigaOS, MorphOS and all minor oses would die much quicker. So you could say that Internet is pretty much a hero for small oses :) 19:00:55 <TrueBrain> yup :) 19:01:35 <Amix> just look at www.amigaworld.net 19:01:42 <Bjarni> I don't think OpenTTD would be anything without the internet either 19:01:44 <Amix> how many hates Amiga Inc. 19:01:57 <Amix> but they stick to their oses, because thats what others have 19:02:10 <mcbane> i hate them for beeing sold to stupid ppls. 19:03:27 <Amix> mcbane: http://www.amiga.org/modules/news/article.php?storyid=7468 19:03:30 <Amix> read this 19:03:34 <Amix> its for amiga community 19:03:38 <Amix> and then you read the comments 19:03:58 <Amix> from the CEO of Amiga Inc. 19:04:39 *** Greyscale [~Grey@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:08:30 <Amix> updated the system 19:08:33 <Amix> brb 19:08:33 *** Amix [Michal@cm-84.208.152.166.chello.no] has quit [Quit: Shake it, .. sjokoladedrikk ;D] 19:10:03 *** Amix [Michal@cm-84.208.152.166.chello.no] has joined #openttd 19:14:17 <TrueBrain> \ 19:17:47 <Amix> yes? 19:17:54 <Amix> :) 19:19:49 <TrueBrain> Today sucks 19:19:52 <TrueBrain> I tried like 10 things 19:19:54 <TrueBrain> and they all failed 19:19:54 <TrueBrain> grr 19:20:13 <TrueBrain> I wanted to convert a x264 to wmv3(VC1), but it failed to do what it was supposed to do (Windows Media Encoder) 19:20:24 <TrueBrain> I am trying to install Steam, but both Cedega as Wine don't feel like it 19:20:36 <TrueBrain> I am trying to disassemble a DOS application and recompile it 19:20:39 <TrueBrain> but it doesn't let me 19:20:42 <TrueBrain> grrr 19:32:56 <huma> use the force 19:33:42 <TrueBrain> yeah! 19:33:56 <Rubidium> TrueBrain: could ofcourse break the negative thingy... 19:34:04 <Rubidium> you could try to get kicked from #openttd ;) 19:34:17 <TrueBrain> @kick TrueBrain be kicked 19:34:17 *** TrueBrain was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [be kicked] 19:34:20 *** TrueBrain [truelight@81.171.98.110] has joined #openttd 19:34:29 <TrueBrain> and, deos it help? 19:34:48 <Rubidium> don't know, the negative spiral has at least been broken ;) 19:34:51 <TrueBrain> :) 19:34:54 <Rubidium> now you've tried 11 things and not all failed 19:35:10 <SmatZ> TrueBrain: what DOS app are you trying to disassemble? 19:35:40 <TrueBrain> Populous 19:35:58 <SmatZ> :) 19:36:11 <Bjarni> hehe 19:37:04 <Bjarni> TrueBrain: why would you disassemble populous and then recompile it? 19:37:12 <Rafagd> hm... 19:37:18 <Bjarni> are you gaining anything that DosBox can't do? 19:37:21 <TrueBrain> Bjarni: because I want to 19:37:24 <Rafagd> where you've find it? 19:37:28 <Bjarni> fair enough 19:37:33 <Bjarni> that's reason enough 19:37:33 <TrueBrain> Rafagd: abandonware of course 19:37:49 <Rafagd> i've only seen that game 1 time 19:38:18 <Rafagd> i've ever wanted to play that game =( 19:38:35 <Bjarni> it rocks 19:39:20 <Bjarni> I still have it for my Amiga 500 19:39:25 <SmatZ> Rafagd: http://abandonia.com/genre.php?search=populous 19:39:29 <Bjarni> that is, if the disk still works 19:41:08 <Sacro> :o 19:41:12 <Sacro> another 500 owner 19:41:35 <Bjarni> networking with Amiga 500 was kind of cool, but not really useful 19:41:51 <Bjarni> I can't remember anything good MP networking games 19:42:03 <Bjarni> stuntcar racer worked on network, but besides that 19:44:40 <TrueBrain> grr, stupid cedega 19:52:28 *** De_Ghost [~De_Ghost@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:52:43 <simon_> what new features have been added to the nightly in the past month and half that I have been away partying? 19:53:02 <glx> newindustries 19:53:14 *** De_Ghost [~De_Ghost@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 19:53:15 <simon_> any info about what that is? 19:53:22 <simon_> wiki page? 19:53:48 <Rubidium> hmm, glx must be talking to someone I'm ignoring 19:53:54 <glx> lol 19:54:06 <Rubidium> or that is at least the most logical explanation of his sudden "newindustries" 19:58:03 <Bjarni> yeah 19:58:10 <Bjarni> the question is who 19:58:23 <Bjarni> because I also only see the "newindustries" line 19:58:30 <simon_> Rubidium: you still remember who I am! 19:58:42 <simon_> It has been more than a month! 19:58:45 <glx> he can't see what you say 19:59:00 <simon_> I am back in Hong Kong now 19:59:12 <Bjarni> one can only imagine this conversation based on what glx says 19:59:20 <simon_> glx: yes he can... he just pretends he can't. 19:59:36 <Bjarni> ok, cleared the ignore list 19:59:41 <Bjarni> what's going on? 19:59:48 <simon_> nothing 19:59:52 <Bjarni> ok 20:00:15 <SpComb> Logs: http://spbot.marttila.de:8120/logs/oftc-ottd (old: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd ) 20:00:15 <Bjarni> !logs 20:00:32 * Bjarni wonders why simon_ was on ignore 20:00:46 <TrueBrain> Bjarni: I suggest you put him on ignore again 20:00:48 <TrueBrain> really, a good idea 20:01:12 <simon_> Bjarni: I don't know... I haven't been here for months 20:01:20 <simon_> maybe someone else uses this nick 20:01:29 <Bjarni> oh now I remember you 20:01:41 * Bjarni reenables ignore 20:02:00 <Bjarni> we are being nice to him, right :P 20:02:52 <simon_> wtf... 20:03:21 <simon_> you never ignored me all those months ago when we were friends 20:03:33 <simon_> you people are cruel 20:04:42 <hylje> :< 20:04:46 <hylje> bjarni is 20:04:52 <Bjarni> is what? 20:04:57 <Sacro> how would i go from a rending to a grf :( 20:04:57 <TrueBrain> Bjarni: just: you are 20:05:20 <Bjarni> fair enough 20:05:27 <Bjarni> I am something :D 20:05:34 <Bjarni> I just don't know what it is 20:05:40 * hylje snickers 20:06:14 <Bjarni> I bet simon_ said something stupid again 20:06:41 * Bjarni disables ignore 20:06:50 <simon_> I have said nothing 20:06:57 <simon_> I am trying to work 20:07:02 <TrueBrain> Bjarni: please spear us the details of your ignore-list 20:07:03 <Bjarni> right 20:07:16 *** simon_ [~simon@awork119071.netvigator.com] has left #openttd [] 20:07:18 <Bjarni> simon_: why did I put you on ignore ages ago? 20:07:23 <hylje> TrueBrain, s/ear/are/ 20:07:44 <Bjarni> I guess he won't answer me 20:07:49 <glx> oh he's gone :( 20:07:59 <Bjarni> looks like it 20:08:05 <Bjarni> PARTY TIME 20:09:47 <hylje> i'm reading pbf and seeing the sillyness here 20:09:52 <hylje> what a great night 20:10:25 <Bjarni> what is pbf? 20:10:32 <Bjarni> some sort of mirror plane of pdf? 20:11:06 <SmatZ> Bjarni: http://pbfcomics.com/ 20:11:24 <Amix> i see there are demonstrations in Denmark again Bjarni 20:11:27 <Amix> ;) 20:11:31 <hylje> ungdomshuset 20:11:47 <Amix> it will never end 20:11:48 <Bjarni> I'm at home 20:11:52 <Bjarni> I'm not there 20:11:59 <Bjarni> and I never will be 20:12:25 <Bjarni> last I heard on the news was that they arrested 300 people 20:12:51 <Bjarni> and a political party encouraged the bullies to move on even when told to stop 20:13:00 <Bjarni> so it will be interesting to see what happens next 20:13:21 <Bjarni> political parties aren't allowed to tell people to ignore direct orders from the police 20:16:50 <toresbe> idiots... 20:19:16 *** Grey [~Greyscale@host86-131-42-136.range86-131.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 20:20:37 <Bjarni> you said that 20:20:40 <Bjarni> I didn't 20:20:50 <Bjarni> I just thought it ;) 20:24:29 <Amix> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NkSh6KP7igs&mode=related&search= 20:24:35 <Amix> this is so cool :))) 20:24:43 <Amix> ASTRA promovideo from 1990 20:24:49 <Amix> love the music ;) 20:28:00 <Sacro> hmm 20:28:06 <Sacro> we can do ottd models with lightwave? 20:33:23 <huma> yes, make pretty models 20:34:39 <Sacro> i can do em in ldraw 20:34:46 <Sacro> just no way of rendering them into the game 20:34:58 <Sacro> cos i dunno how to use blender, povray or lightwave 20:35:35 <huma> eh.. 90s 20:35:47 <huma> i want time machine 20:35:57 <Bjarni> yeah 20:36:18 <Bjarni> back then you could build your own decoder without any problems 20:36:55 <Bjarni> now those bastards use digital encryption so a simple setup of capacitors and resistors can't fix signal anymore 20:37:38 <Bjarni> I once saw schematics for a circuit that could break any encoding (at that time) 20:38:10 <Bjarni> it had a variable resistor and all you had to do was to turn it until it cleared up the signal 20:38:33 <Bjarni> and then you hit the frequency they used to scramble the signal and you could watch all the stuff you like 20:38:52 <Bjarni> go figure why they changed that system :P 20:38:58 <huma> i wish i was good at this stuff 20:39:08 <Bjarni> why? 20:39:13 <Bjarni> it's a thing of the past 20:39:25 <huma> sounds fascinating 20:39:32 <Bjarni> well, that decoder is 20:39:41 <TrueBrain> wow, djgpp seems to be able to cmopile for dos :) 20:39:44 <TrueBrain> let's see.. 20:40:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> <Bjarni> simon_: why did I put you on ignore ages ago? <- i have logs of "ages ago", are you really that interested? 20:40:07 <huma> Bjarni: so you never touch your soldering iron now? 20:40:51 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: I remember now.. he is the guy, who claimed to be in Hong Kong using an .au domain and he didn't know shit about Hong Kong 20:41:02 <Bjarni> and he said all sorts of other silly stuff like that 20:41:11 <Bjarni> didn't know shit about Hong Kong either 20:41:33 <huma> em.. you repeat yourself :) 20:41:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, i remembered from his line "<simon_> I am back in Hong Kong now" 20:41:44 <Bjarni> huma: you do and you can make stuff that works... you just can't use it to break the modern ways of encoding pay channels 20:42:11 <huma> maybe he was using the aussie proxy? :) 20:42:35 <Bjarni> <huma> em.. you repeat yourself :) <-- that's on purpose. I use repetition to make sure that you remember what I try to tell you 20:42:56 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: no, now you go to the next best forum and get a key there 20:42:56 <huma> Bjarni: well, at least you can still mock up useful or funny things 20:43:05 <Bjarni> <huma> maybe he was using the aussie proxy? :) <-- no... he wasn't. He wasn't using is brain either 20:43:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> to use with your player plugin 20:43:14 <huma> Bjarni: ok, just don't use recursion :) 20:43:37 <Bjarni> huh 20:43:42 <Bjarni> player plugin? 20:44:10 <huma> Bjarni: is there a good book on soldering simple stuff? 20:44:18 <Bjarni> I guess so 20:44:22 <huma> Bjarni: guess it's never late to start 20:44:40 <Bjarni> but I have no need to read it... you see, I already know how to do this ;) 20:44:54 <huma> Bjarni: you could be like a.. inspiration :) 20:45:09 * Bjarni is an engineer in the field of electronics 20:45:17 <huma> Bjarni: i suppose you haven't known it all your life :) 20:45:33 <huma> Bjarni: recommend me some book :) 20:45:42 <Bjarni> hmm 20:45:58 <Bjarni> that's tricky 20:46:01 <Bjarni> because... 20:46:07 <Bjarni> what do you want to make? :) 20:46:20 <huma> yes, it is when you know too much about the field :) 20:46:53 <huma> well.. something like this for a start.. wait, let me find the link.. 20:47:22 <Bjarni> if you want to say make a device to check if all windows are closed in your house, then you wouldn't need to know about how to handle frequency filtering 20:47:36 <huma> http://mr-lee-catcam.de/pe_catcam.htm 20:47:39 <huma> meow :) 20:47:52 <Bjarni> that is, unless you decide to actually use a certain frequency to avoid problems with static electricity and 50 Hz noise 20:48:13 *** svippery is now known as svip 20:48:35 <Bjarni> LOL 20:51:07 <huma> i think he's gone to make one for his cat :) 20:51:43 <Bjarni> but... 20:51:48 <Bjarni> I don't have a cat 20:52:00 <Bjarni> you need a really quick shutter speed if this should work 20:52:04 <huma> a dog will do 20:52:09 <huma> or.. yourself :) 20:52:12 <Bjarni> you see, it's kind of hard to tell the cat to stand still while taking pictures 20:52:34 <Bjarni> <huma> or.. yourself :) <-- why would I want a whole lot of pictures of IRC? 20:52:42 <huma> i'm not sure this tiny camera has any means to control shutter speed :) 20:52:50 <huma> haha 20:52:52 <huma> yes, indeed 20:53:35 <huma> you could call it a scrotcam though :) 20:56:25 <huma> this cam makes good pictures: http://mr-lee-catcam.de/pe_catcam1.htm 20:56:46 <Bjarni> this camera is perfect 20:56:51 <Bjarni> really really great 20:56:57 <huma> some even resemble loko - like this one: http://mr-lee-catcam.de/PICS/CCTRIP1_03.JPG :) 20:57:23 <huma> er.. lomo 20:57:26 <Eddi|zuHause2> on trip 2, there's a "on the run" picture 20:58:00 <huma> neat 20:58:00 <Bjarni> I can place it under the frame and record bogie movements while driving and it's not a big loss if the camera is lost 20:58:51 <huma> yea, try it :) 20:58:51 <Bjarni> but it's too dangerous to place yourself at that location while driving ;) 21:01:26 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:06:23 <Bjarni> Big moment no. 1: attach the collar with the camera to the cat. The reaction was not very happy but finally accepted. Reality check passed :-) 21:06:24 <Bjarni> :D 21:08:32 *** nStensen [noway@host-81-191-136-209.bluecom.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:10:29 <huma> yea, the guy is funny :) 21:11:20 <Ammller> Cannot find user-level thread for LWP 32465: generic error 21:11:28 <Ammller> thats the output of my dbg 21:11:45 <Ammller> just continue? 21:14:13 *** Greyscale [~Greyscale@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 21:14:26 <Bjarni> dammit, can't find any local dealer of VistaQuest 21:16:47 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: rubidium * r11219 /branches/NewGRF_ports/ (199 files in 17 dirs): [NewGRF_ports] -Sync: with trunk r11035:11218. 21:16:57 <huma> Bjarni: try ebay 21:17:31 <Bjarni> nahh, I guess I will make somebody in Germany or UK send it to me 21:17:53 <Bjarni> I just need to find some fool... err... naive person with a visa card 21:22:51 <ln-> why don't you have one? 21:23:30 <Bjarni> I could 21:23:37 <Bjarni> but I'm too cheap to pay for getting one 21:23:55 <Bjarni> you see, I really rarely need it and they charge you an arm and a leg for just having it 21:24:31 <Bjarni> buying anything on the net inside the country allows me to use my debit card, which is almost free of fees (unlike visa) 21:24:47 <ln-> but how do you pay on itunes? 21:25:15 <Bjarni> also using a local card gives me better protection against fraught, both in the sense that it can only be used in Denmark and in the law 21:25:55 <Bjarni> <ln-> but how do you pay on itunes? <-- I don't use iTune store. I rarely buy music anyway (which results in me listening to the same music again and again) 21:25:55 <huma> ln-: there's soulseek for that :) 21:26:03 <Bjarni> soulseek? 21:26:07 <huma> idd 21:26:13 <Bjarni> is that some p2p? 21:26:23 <huma> yep 21:26:37 <Bjarni> I don't use p2p to get music either 21:26:41 <huma> music oriented 21:27:28 <Wolf01> 'night 21:27:31 <Bjarni> it takes me say 10 minutes to get to a real music store and then I will avoid all that DMA crap 21:27:31 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host240-239-dynamic.15-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:27:44 <Bjarni> ok, maybe it can take 15 minutes, but still 21:27:51 <Eddi|zuHause2> you mean DRM? 21:27:56 <Bjarni> err 21:27:57 <Bjarni> yeah 21:28:00 <ln-> Bjarni: just for comparison; i pay 20⬠per year for a Visa. 21:28:01 <Bjarni> whatever 21:28:48 <Bjarni> 20... I think that's a bit cheaper than what I can get 21:29:49 <Bjarni> but if I only use it say twice a year, it will be an extra â¬10 on each purchase and if the purchases are like â¬16 each, then it's a fee that really matters 21:30:10 <ln-> with 20⬠the per-month limit for purchases is 1000â¬. 21:30:16 *** Tefad_ is now known as Tefad 21:30:45 <ln-> Bjarni: don't worry, when you have one, you just happen to order all fancy stuff from amazon.com and others a lot more frequently. 21:30:51 <Bjarni> the limit isn't 1000⬠if you don't have 1000⬠:P 21:31:30 <Bjarni> I better not buy amazon.com or anything else that fancy 21:31:53 <Bjarni> you see I don't have a job, so whenever I spend money I have to consider how to get more :( 21:32:29 <Rubidium> the idea of a credit card is that you pay afterwards, so you don't need money at the moment of actually paying 21:32:55 <Bjarni> newsflash: if I don't have the money afterwards, then the problem is still there 21:33:03 <ln-> Bjarni: wrong, the limit _is_ 1000⬠even if i don't have that much. 21:33:15 <Bjarni> besides they add fees for using money you don't have 21:33:16 <Rubidium> Bjarni: true-ish 21:33:28 *** Rafagd [~kvirc@200.196.39.5] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:33:29 <Rubidium> you can delay all paying with about a month 21:33:45 <Bjarni> wouldn't do me any good 21:33:46 <Rubidium> effectively leaving you with the "pay" of month 21:33:55 <Rubidium> *a month 21:34:13 <Bjarni> I would still need to find the cash somehow 21:34:27 <Rubidium> get a proper job for a few hours in the week 21:34:35 <ln-> Bjarni: you can withdraw cash from an ATM with the credit card. 21:34:52 <ln-> problem solved. 21:34:57 <Bjarni> guys, you are missing the point 21:35:22 <Bjarni> if I don't have a visa card, then I don't have to spend money on it and I don't NEED the stuff it offers 21:36:01 <ln-> same applies for money. 21:36:36 <Bjarni> if I don't have [money], then I don't have to spend money on it and I don't NEED the stuff it offers? 21:36:47 <Bjarni> I guess I don't really need money as it is now 21:37:01 <Bjarni> but it does leave me without buying new stuff 21:38:30 *** Amix [Michal@cm-84.208.152.166.chello.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:40:43 <ln-> when are you switching to euros? 21:40:50 <Bjarni> NEVER 21:41:11 <Bjarni> we have a financial benefit from not using euros 21:41:21 <Rubidium> he's still using pebbles 21:42:14 <toresbe> Bjarni: Swede, or Brit? I'm guessing Swede... 21:42:15 <Bjarni> also technically our constitution prevents us from giving other countries the option of making certain financial decisions like the interest and inflation of our currency 21:42:23 <toresbe> swede. 21:42:29 <ln-> Bjarni: it's not about the financial benefit, it's about the treaties you have already signed. 21:42:48 <ln-> toresbe: don't insult him. 21:42:53 <Bjarni> we didn't sign anything telling us to use euro 21:43:10 <toresbe> Sweden is in no way committed to switching to the Euro. 21:43:17 <Bjarni> we added an exception to the treaty telling that the euro part (and 3 other parts) don't include Denmark 21:43:28 <ln-> Bjarni: the finnish constitution stated that the monetary unit in finland is markka, and how much did that matter? 21:43:38 <toresbe> Bjarni: Oh, Danish? 21:43:38 *** mikl_ [~mikl@0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.broadband.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 21:43:46 <toresbe> ln-: Constitutions can change. 21:43:57 <toresbe> Here in Norway, ours just did, quite significantly 21:44:42 <Bjarni> besides it can be rather hard to find a qualified majority of the politicians to enable it when the population is against it 21:44:49 <Bjarni> qualified is like 5/6 21:45:12 <Bjarni> toresbe: what new stupid law did you add? 21:45:18 <gfldex> you mean those 2 other contries that found a nice lumb of oil in north sea? 21:45:27 <gfldex> no wonder why they dont want to be part of euro land 21:45:30 <Sacro> ooh the north sea! 21:45:39 <gfldex> oil prices are made in $ 21:45:44 <toresbe> Bjarni: didn't add anything. A deprecated law was removed. 21:45:50 <Bjarni> which one? 21:46:22 <toresbe> it's a technicality referring to the separation of two houses of parliament that had been equivalent for near a century. 21:46:33 <Bjarni> <gfldex> oil prices are made in $ <-- I'm not talking about oil prices, though our oil reserves aren't any bad at the current prices 21:47:37 <gfldex> you use nearly as much as you drig from the ground and it's getting less already 21:47:45 <gfldex> you will have the euro very soonish :) 21:47:59 <SquireJames> Question: 21:48:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> in Hessen, they are afraid to try to remove the death penalty from the constitution 21:48:05 <Bjarni> it's more like if it goes bad in Germany, then Germany will have to use their financial tools to recover (the euro prohibits most of those tools, leaving in this case Germany in a poor situation). Being outside of the euro, the big countries to the south will not pull us down 21:48:08 <toresbe> basically, the party representatives would decide on a law in one room, then cross the hallway and put the law into the Norwegian Law in a different "House" which hasn't been a different house since 1866 21:48:14 <SquireJames> Can you have multiple track waypoints in OpenTTD 21:48:20 <Eddi|zuHause2> because of the possibility that the attempt might fail 21:48:20 <Bjarni> well, not as much. Germany is still a great export market 21:48:24 *** mikl_ [~mikl@0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.broadband.tele.dk] has quit [] 21:48:33 <ln-> Eddi|zuHause2: hessen has death penalty? 21:48:45 <toresbe> Bjarni: The entire point of the EU was to fuse the European governments to such an extent that another European war was impossible. 21:48:50 <Bjarni> DKK is a stronger currency than EUR 21:48:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> ln-: federal law overrides that 21:48:53 <SquireJames> at the moment i am using stations with non-stop, but it would be easier if i could have a multi-track waypoint 21:49:03 <Eddi|zuHause2> but technically, it's still in their constitution 21:49:07 <ln-> btw, the king of finland was the prince of hessen. 21:49:22 <toresbe> Bjarni: that's a relatively absurd claim. The EUR is far stronger by force of inertia and versatility of commerce. 21:49:34 <Bjarni> <toresbe> Bjarni: The entire point of the EU was to fuse the European governments to such an extent that another European war was impossible. <-- I think this is an odd argument. Everywhere else somebody tried to do that it ended in civil war 21:49:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> yeah, and the king of england was the duke of hannover 21:49:51 <gfldex> a stronger currency is bad if you are an export oriented country, what germany is 21:50:05 <gfldex> our economy dont really want a strong currency 21:50:06 <SquireJames> heeelooo? 21:50:13 <toresbe> Hell, Germany is a larger exporter than China. 21:50:15 <gfldex> yes you can have more then one SquireJames 21:50:26 <Eddi|zuHause2> in the 17th/18th century was very common for people to have titles in multiple countries 21:50:29 <Bjarni> <toresbe> Bjarni: that's a relatively absurd claim. The EUR is far stronger by force of inertia and versatility of commerce. <-- stronger in the sense of being more stable and presumed stable in the future 21:50:40 <toresbe> yes 21:50:46 <ln-> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_Karl_von_Hessen#K.C3.B6nig_von_Finnland 21:50:54 <toresbe> Bjarni: it's working quite well. The EU is a decent idea, and the world could do with Europe as a superpower. 21:51:31 <SpComb> There's Amixii in the channel 21:51:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> that's why in the early days, it was called "King in Prussia", instead of "King of Prussia" 21:51:45 <Bjarni> the main problem is that EU is used for absurd ideas like making a law that prohibits selling cucumbers if they are too curved 21:51:52 <gfldex> we dont want to be a super power. it would mean we would have to fuck up other ppl 21:51:58 <gfldex> that is not our intent 21:52:04 <SquireJames> How do I make one gfldex 21:52:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> because the guy had titles in a dozen more countries 21:52:30 <gfldex> you should have a button for creating waypoints in the track toolbar 21:52:33 <Bjarni> the problem is that the EU structure isn't stable 21:52:40 <toresbe> Bjarni: consumer interest laws are a Good Thing, even though their minutae are debatable. 21:52:41 <Bjarni> specially not after adding even more countries 21:52:45 <SquireJames> Everytime I place a waypoint next to another it becomes a new waypoint, regardless as to whether there join stations is on 21:52:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> e.g he was "KurfÃŒrst in Brandenburg" 21:52:53 <gfldex> it seams to work out quite well Bjarni 21:53:00 <SquireJames> What I am after is making a waypoint go across multiple tracks 21:53:05 <toresbe> Bjarni: We Norwegians are very happy about Poland being added. We are starved for a workforce. 21:53:11 <gfldex> the problems of low price markets in the east solved itself 21:53:27 <gfldex> they got the same prices and payments as we do now 21:53:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> they then agglomerated more and more territories through titles 21:53:46 <Bjarni> <toresbe> Bjarni: consumer interest laws are a Good Thing, even though their minutae are debatable. <-- didn't help us at all. In fact if leaves people in Denmark in a bit worse position if something breaks after say 8 months and you want warranty to fix it 21:53:51 <gfldex> i think you cant do that SquireJames 21:54:07 <toresbe> gfldex: the hell they do 21:54:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> (including east prussia, which was a very outer territory) 21:54:21 <SquireJames> ah, well okays, i'll stick to my non-stop station method then 21:54:23 <toresbe> gfldex: which is why we can hire construction workers for pennies to the building here in Norway 21:54:25 <Eddi|zuHause2> only much later the called the whole country prussia 21:54:33 <Eddi|zuHause2> then it was changed to "King of Prussia" 21:54:51 <Bjarni> <gfldex> it seams to work out quite well Bjarni <-- not really... whenever something important comes up, then they can't agree 21:55:31 <gfldex> that was that constitution problem with poland and that was a press problem. that does not apply to day by day business 21:55:40 <gfldex> hot air doenst count even in the EU :) 21:56:10 <Eddi|zuHause2> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Friedrich_I._(PreuÃen) 21:56:20 <gfldex> toresbe: that's true but the money is leaving your country and get's exchanged into their currency and thus your whole economy get's a los 21:56:37 <Bjarni> btw EU is trying to force Denmark to change a law that says that only people who worked in Denmark can get a retirement paid by the government in Denmark. EU wants all citizens to be equal so all retired people can move to Denmark and get a pension from the government even if they never paid any taxes in Denmark 21:57:02 <gfldex> Eddi, may it be that wikipedia is your start page in mozilla? :-> 21:57:06 <toresbe> gfldex: not really 21:57:06 <huma> how about localized town styles in openttd? like italian, french, swedish, etc? 21:57:25 <Bjarni> naturally we object because all countries would break from such a condition and go bankrupt and then EU will fine us for not listening 21:57:34 <toresbe> gfldex: the money we are paying them is going toward lowering property prices (because we simply cannot find construction workers enough) 21:57:43 <glx> huma: building style? 21:57:48 <huma> yes 21:57:55 <glx> make a newgrf :) 21:58:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> gfldex: why would i do either of those things? (wikipedia as startpage, or use mozilla) 21:58:02 <huma> is there any? 21:58:10 <toresbe> property prices for commerce is a major problem in Oslo, and there are tons of constructions underway. 21:58:18 <toresbe> we have the money, but not the builders :) 21:58:26 <gfldex> Eddi|zuHause2: to be able to post even more wikipedia links? 21:58:43 <Bjarni> toresbe: we have the same issue. Poland has the same issue, xxx has the same issue 21:58:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> i posted exactly one wikipedia link today... 21:58:57 <Bjarni> I don't see how Poland joining EU helped preventing this case 21:59:01 <huma> glx: ? 21:59:02 <gfldex> you are below your rate then. shame on you! 21:59:08 <SquireJames> If you ask me, we brits have the right idea, I just wish we were less influenced by the US 21:59:35 <toresbe> Bjarni: it helped because otherwise it would not be feasible for the Polacks to enter Norway to work. 21:59:53 <toresbe> the leaking of money into Poland isn't a problem in the long term, as the European economies fuse ever closer. 21:59:56 <SquireJames> but with Brown as PM now, maybe we will be, Blair was so far up GW Bush's backside you couldn't tell where one began and the other ended 22:00:00 <huma> glx: found :) 22:01:52 <Bjarni> <toresbe> the leaking of money into Poland isn't a problem in the long term, as the European economies fuse ever closer. <-- this is never going to work. ALL financial experts claims that EU is not built on solid financial ground. In fact it's bound to fail, but the politicians moves on anyway and for some reason the media doesn't really investigate why the financial experts warns about this 22:02:43 <toresbe> "ALL financial experts" is so biased it barely warrants a response. 22:03:01 <gfldex> if you got a lot forein workes they are going to exchange into their currency you create (artificial) need for your own currency. that means relative price to other currency goes up. that means it gets more expensive to buy foreign currency what you need to import stuff. ATM that's not a problem because you can keep it in balance with selling oil. But that will change. 22:03:17 <Bjarni> <toresbe> "ALL financial experts" is so biased it barely warrants a response. <-- well, prove me wrong then :) 22:03:49 <toresbe> No. Do you really think that the EU would even begin to happen if as you say, everyone with a clue about finance opposed it? 22:03:57 <Bjarni> and I mean a real expert, not just a self proclaimed expert 22:04:00 <gfldex> Bjarni: they dont do worry much because it works for the US since decades 22:04:21 <toresbe> In fact, when it comes to political parties, the more traditionally financially oriented the parties become, the stronger they favour EU membership, in most cases. 22:04:37 <toresbe> Of course, in Norway it's a no-brainer: Joining EU would be truly disasterous. 22:04:50 <toresbe> for the economy, and for the environment. 22:05:06 <huma> politics is boring.. 22:05:11 * huma yawns 22:05:14 <toresbe> It is in the EUs short-term interest that oil and gas prices be low. The interests of Norway, and the environment, are the opposite. 22:05:17 <Bjarni> the US has problems as well due to this. They are transmitting a whole lot of money between the states in order not to bankrupt states and close most jobs in them 22:05:20 <toresbe> huma: I find it to be truly fascinating. 22:05:31 <huma> someone has to :) 22:05:42 <toresbe> Bjarni: not so. The US system is idiotic for entirely different reasons. 22:05:56 <Bjarni> also the US has a fundamental difference. It allows bigger difference between the states than EU will allow between the countries 22:06:15 <gfldex> the US is in trouble because their currency is not covered anymore. It wasn't with gold and it isnt with economics growth 22:06:39 <gfldex> but they dont care because so many other contries have so much $s that they simply dont know where to put them 22:06:45 <gfldex> so they end up in the US 22:07:13 <gfldex> in the end they will let their currency crash and make anybody else a long nose 22:07:15 <Bjarni> <huma> politics is boring.. <-- idiot :P 22:07:45 <huma> Bjarni: you're biased :) 22:08:01 <gfldex> being biased is what politics is all about 22:08:16 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: truelight * r11220 /trunk/Makefile.in: -Fix r11217: not all gmakes allow "" in ifeq (go figure) 22:08:19 <huma> that's why it's boring :) 22:08:20 <Bjarni> idiot: word originates from ancient Greek and means a man, who do not pay interest in politics 22:08:39 * huma googles 22:08:43 *** FlowaPowa [~Flowa@4va54-4-82-244-103-144.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: FlowaPowa] 22:08:43 * Sacro is fed up 22:08:57 <Bjarni> so I will claim by rights to call huma an idiot if he claims politics to be boring 22:09:09 <Sacro> politics are boring 22:09:15 <Sacro> from the latin "poly" meaning many 22:09:23 <Sacro> and "tics" meaning blood sucking leeches 22:09:28 <huma> "Idiot is a word derived from the Greek ???????, idi?t?s ("person lacking professional skill," "a private citizen," "individual")" 22:09:38 <huma> told you, biased :) 22:09:55 <Bjarni> interesting 22:10:08 <gfldex> you got that wrong Bjarni. Idiots where not allowed to vote or getting elected. What put them at the same level with women and foreigners. What is a bit mean. 22:10:25 <huma> etymology is fascinating though 22:10:26 <Bjarni> I read the other thing... 22:10:38 <Bjarni> I wonder if the book got it wrong 22:11:02 <Bjarni> but if a person had no rights to vote, he was likely not very interested in politics, at least not as interested as the voters 22:11:05 <huma> or you did :) 22:11:12 <Bjarni> no I didn't 22:11:21 <Bjarni> it was pretty clear 22:11:30 <Bjarni> not to mention the teacher said the same thing 22:11:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> huma: your client is broken 22:12:05 <Bjarni> anyway 22:12:13 <huma> gfldex: from that point of view it's funny how feminism and idiotism turned out 22:12:17 <huma> Eddi|zuHause2: huh? 22:12:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> huma: more specifically, your utf8 characters are replaced by '?' 22:12:46 <Sacro> facebook is good for stalking 22:12:57 <huma> oh.. 22:13:02 <Bjarni> <huma> gfldex: from that point of view it's funny how feminism and idiotism turned out <-- yeah... the US idiotists even elected one of their own as president 22:13:22 *** Rubidium_ [rubidium@rbijker.net] has joined #openttd 22:13:39 <huma> damn, you got me into it after all! :) 22:13:41 <gfldex> do you call religious ppl idiots nowadays? 22:13:50 <Bjarni> that depends 22:13:53 <Bjarni> on the religion 22:13:57 *** Zr40 [~zr40@2001:960:786:0:21b:63ff:fe9e:ab24] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:13:59 *** Rubidium [~rubidium@rubidium.student.utwente.nl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:14:06 *** Rubidium_ is now known as Rubidium 22:14:11 <Sacro> you stupid danish person 22:14:14 <huma> i try to not label anyone 22:14:14 <gfldex> with what kind of religion would you be cool with? 22:14:23 <Sacro> *coughs* not muslim 22:14:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> but you do know that the majority of the gene pool in america is from poor immigrants who were often low peasants in their homecountry 22:14:31 <huma> Sacro: :) 22:14:47 <Bjarni> Sacro: I didn't say anything about what religion I referred to 22:15:07 <huma> Eddi|zuHause2: how about the australian gene pool? :) 22:15:07 <Bjarni> in fact I was thinking about Jehovah's witnesses and stuff like that 22:15:19 <gfldex> like the ppl from Hessen that got sold to fight for england? 22:15:25 <Sacro> System.Console.WriteLine("Bored"); 22:15:27 <Eddi|zuHause2> it was only in the mid 19th century when lots of highly decorated scientists went there 22:15:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> (usually jewish people expelled from germany) 22:15:41 <huma> c# attack! 22:16:13 <gfldex> that came later Eddi 22:16:26 <Bjarni> oh Sacro is bored 22:16:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> er, i mean the 20th century 22:16:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> 19xx 22:16:42 <Bjarni> I will upload a pic to prevent him from getting even more bored 22:16:43 <Bjarni> one sec 22:16:46 <gfldex> and most ppl left europe because their religion got them at trouble at home 22:16:46 <huma> Bjarni: i told you, politics is.. :) 22:16:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> that's why the two politically important groups in america are idiots and jews 22:16:59 <gfldex> that's at least true for germany and england 22:17:18 * huma waits for a nsfw picture from Bjarni 22:17:58 <Eddi|zuHause2> actually, in germany, the religion thing was fought out 22:17:59 <huma> i hope the latter will come to power next term :) 22:18:08 <Bjarni> wtf 22:18:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> 30 years war, 1618-1648 22:18:20 <Bjarni> there are two pictures on my camera that I don't recall taking 22:18:26 <gfldex> that you declare the war to be over after 30 years does not mean that you agree with each other 22:18:33 <huma> Bjarni: you're getting old :) 22:18:35 <gfldex> it just means you are out of ammo 22:18:39 <Eddi|zuHause2> in the end, neither side won, and the country was totally devastated 22:19:05 <Bjarni> <huma> Bjarni: you're getting old :) <-- I'm more thinking like "who took my camera while I was elsewhere" 22:19:19 <huma> what cam is that? 22:19:22 <gfldex> a lot land switched hands and preussen got a good head start 22:19:27 <gfldex> wasnt all the bad in the end 22:19:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> also, a pretty large group of german immigrants were soldiers, who were forced to fight on the english side in the independence war 22:19:33 <Bjarni> I presume asking the person in the picture would solve this :) 22:22:16 *** Greyscale_ [~Grey@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 22:22:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> gfldex: yeah, the father of the guy in the wikipedia link was a major agitator in the "WestfÀlischer Frieden", he got quite a lot of land through diplomacy that way 22:22:53 <Bjarni> Sacro: http://www.student.dtu.dk/~s991088/kystbanen.jpg <-- look at real life simsig and drool :D 22:23:04 <Bjarni> I took this picture earlier this week 22:23:17 <Sacro> :o nice 22:24:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> they use Windows?!? 22:24:02 <Bjarni> I didn't really figure out why they prefer to sit in the dark. When I asked they replied that they just want to do so 22:24:08 *** KouDy [user@85.207.64.178] has quit [Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com] 22:24:47 <Bjarni> <Eddi|zuHause2> they use Windows?!? <-- it sure looks like it. Makes you wonder why more than 80% of the delays are caused by signal issues 22:24:57 <Bjarni> I think that's delays more than 3 or 5 minutes 22:25:31 <Sacro> hheh 22:25:32 <Sacro> rebooting 22:25:36 <Bjarni> a train being delayed 1 or 2 minutes in departure due to a child carriage or something is not included in those statistics 22:25:50 <gfldex> the invention of LCD displays is the salvation of such work places i bet 22:26:20 <gfldex> think of that in terms of CRTs. what would be 1kW heating for each work place 22:27:05 *** Amix [Michal@cm-84.208.152.166.chello.no] has joined #openttd 22:27:05 <Bjarni> actually I was once in an EMU and two guys went from the cab to the middle of the train, opened a closet like device and pressed a few buttons. The lights and all sounds died and then they pressed a few more buttons and everything started to come back. One of them then said "now it will be ready in 3 minutes" 22:27:13 <Bjarni> they really rebooted the train o_O 22:28:07 <gfldex> in some regional trains in germany you can see voltage displays of the train as a passanger 22:28:29 <gfldex> if you had the right key you even could switch the train off :) 22:28:41 <Bjarni> I have seen voltage gauges and pressure gauges in passengers cars... it's not like it's odd 22:28:50 *** Amix [Michal@cm-84.208.152.166.chello.no] has quit [] 22:29:43 <Bjarni> I once saw some settings for a car (I think it's scrapped now). It was behind a glass cover so the staff could see the setup without opening, but it also meant that everybody else could see it 22:29:59 <Bjarni> it had interesting switches, like turning taillights on and off 22:30:07 <Bjarni> switching between steam and electrical heating 22:30:15 <Bjarni> turn the indoor lights on and off 22:30:18 <Bjarni> stuff like that 22:30:36 <Bjarni> I don't think they maintained the steam part of it anymore though 22:31:05 <CIA-5> OpenTTD: glx * r11221 /branches/noai/ (118 files in 10 dirs): [NoAI] -Sync: with trunk r11145:11220 22:31:34 <gfldex> that's why they dont use steam engines in the winter anymore :) 22:32:33 <Bjarni> the diesel engines used to have a boiler to produce steam to heat up the cars 22:32:55 <Bjarni> I think the last "normal" train using this system in Denmark drove it's last trip in 1989 22:33:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> most german diesel engines were equipped with electrical heating 22:33:25 <gfldex> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bild:Bahnhof-Hasserode.jpg 22:33:25 *** Greyscale_ [~Grey@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:33:36 <gfldex> that one is still going with 2 steam trains in the middle of germany 22:33:54 <Bjarni> the issue is not to produce the electricity. It was that when DSB moved from steam to diesel (starting in 1954) they had a whole lot of cars that had steam heating only 22:33:55 <Eddi|zuHause2> that's narrow gauge :p 22:33:57 <gfldex> it narrow track tho 22:34:19 <Bjarni> looks like the Harzen guys 22:34:23 <gfldex> that Harzquerbahn Eddi 22:34:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> i know where hasserode is :p 22:34:35 <gfldex> you ever used that one? 22:34:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> only the beer tastes crap :p 22:34:44 <Bjarni> they have narrow gauge tracks all over that funny mountain thingie 22:35:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, my mother is from that region 22:35:12 <Bjarni> those guys master a special skill 22:35:14 <Eddi|zuHause2> and my grandparents still live there 22:35:15 <gfldex> i went there as a child a few times 22:35:29 <gfldex> lovely place but the steam engine is not as funny as one may think 22:35:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> but it is a while ago since i actually used it 22:35:42 <gfldex> you are breathing smoke when it's moving slowly 22:36:16 <Eddi|zuHause2> the last time i can remember was around 1989-1990 22:36:17 <Bjarni> whenever they make wheelslip, they add sand to stop the wheels from spinning really fast. The wheels are then slowed to the correct RPM, but since the pistons are at high speed, they are likely to crack and they produce a breakdown :s 22:36:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> when they opened the Brocken for the public 22:36:53 <Bjarni> I don't know why they don't just reduce steam until it catches the rails again (like the rest of us) 22:36:55 <Eddi|zuHause2> it didn't drive up there yet, so we walked from schierke to the peak 22:37:12 <Bjarni> it really is the only way to stop wheelslip on a steam locomotive 22:37:17 <gfldex> that's a good walk 22:37:51 <Eddi|zuHause2> yes, it is ;) 22:38:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> it was winter, but not a hard one 22:38:40 <gfldex> i grow up in Leipzig, so they send me to that place to change the color of my lungs from black to something more healthy 22:38:46 <Bjarni> hehe... I think this is an interesting channel. One guy posts an image and the two other active guys in the channel can tell where it's from :D 22:38:54 <Eddi|zuHause2> not like the 1988/89 winter, which we spent in neuhaus 22:39:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> with like 2m snow in one night 22:39:15 <Bjarni> gfldex: they sent you to the steam locomotives to ensure that your lungs didn't turn black? 22:39:36 <gfldex> that's how polluted my home town was 22:40:04 * Bjarni notes not to go to Leipzig 22:40:04 <gfldex> if you dig in your nose what color do you get out of it? 22:40:18 <Bjarni> that depends 22:40:22 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: it has way improved since they closed down all the industries 22:40:25 <Bjarni> if I have been on the railroad, then black 22:40:29 <Bjarni> well, sometimes 22:40:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> i mean literally _all_ the industries 22:40:40 <Bjarni> specially if I have been on top of the enigne 22:40:55 <gfldex> my bogeys where all black in that time 22:41:02 <gfldex> because anybody was heating with coal 22:41:17 <gfldex> that crappy stuff we digged out of the ground nearby 22:41:26 <Bjarni> that brown coal from Eastern Germany? 22:41:38 <Bjarni> or black coal from Poland/Ruhr? 22:41:40 <gfldex> yes 22:41:47 <huma> eh.. still the same 22:41:52 <Bjarni> first or latter? 22:42:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: leipzig is in east germany, and when he says "nearby"... 22:42:10 <gfldex> the brown one with that nice level of sulfur in it 22:42:15 <Bjarni> ahh 22:42:35 <Eddi|zuHause2> actually, leipzig is not far away from here... 22:42:40 <Bjarni> sulfur isn't bad when it comes to creating black smoke... all the other impurities in the coal are though 22:42:52 <Vikthor> Eddi|zuHause2: You say it was bad in Leipzig, but it was even worse on the other side of Erzgebirge 22:43:35 <gfldex> in Leipig it depends where the wind came from 22:43:48 <gfldex> so we had good and bad days. other places where not so lucky 22:43:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> Vikthor: that may be, but tschechia has much lower unemployment rates than east germany 22:43:52 <Bjarni> we could stop a whole lot of pollution if Germany would stop using their poor coal in the powerplants 22:44:06 <Bjarni> switching to coal from Ruhr would actually improve conditions 22:44:09 <gfldex> we dont use it anymore 22:44:10 <Bjarni> and power output 22:44:22 <Bjarni> you finally got rid of it? 22:44:31 <gfldex> the mines are nearly empty anyway 22:44:44 <gfldex> we would have to open new mines and remove a few cities 22:44:48 <Bjarni> when did you stop using it? 22:44:50 <Vikthor> Eddi|zuHause2: You know not only we had our brown coal-powerplants, due to prevailing winds we have been getting your pollution 22:45:08 *** mikl [~mikl@0x57372ee2.mrbnqu1.broadband.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Connection reset by Peer Gynt] 22:45:27 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's funny, near Bitterfeld they wanted to flood a "Tagebau" [= open mine], it was projected to be filled in 10 years 22:45:28 <gfldex> we stopped in the end of the '90s 22:45:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> then there came the big flood 22:45:54 <Eddi|zuHause2> and it filled up in 5 days 22:46:03 <gfldex> there are 3 new sees near leipzig. they where not there 10 years ago 22:46:37 <gfldex> that flood was indeed not planned :) 22:46:38 <Vikthor> You should see the landscape around Most, its the same 22:46:43 <Bjarni> strip mining is bad for the environment and actually dangerous even after the mining stops 22:47:05 <gfldex> but if those who felt victim would have listened to their grandpas it would not have hit them that hard 22:47:19 <gfldex> the older ppl knew why they didnt build houses there for ages 22:47:54 <gfldex> it's bad for ground water levels Bjarni 22:48:07 <gfldex> but if you stop the pumps at gets better real quick 22:48:12 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, the housing business boomed in the past ~15 years 22:48:20 <gfldex> the parts of Leipzig that are close to that 3 sees even got problems now 22:48:28 <gfldex> some basements are getting quite wet 22:48:41 <Eddi|zuHause2> of course there come along greedy guys who buy cheap land, not considering the reasons why it's so cheap 22:49:10 <Bjarni> DSB found a nice empty spot near the tracks and built a depot to prepare the EMUs for service... then they figured out why it was vacant. They had problems making a stable foundation (really soft) and they have to use a pump at all times or they will have 50 cm of water on the floor 22:49:32 <Bjarni> there are certain places where it's just not meant to build anything 22:49:52 <gfldex> like the subway in newyork? :) 22:49:55 <Bjarni> <gfldex> it's bad for ground water levels Bjarni <-- that too 22:50:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> new york is funny, after 50cm of digging, all you find is rock :p 22:50:56 <Bjarni> during the war Denmark did some strip mining for brown coal as well. Now the area is sealed off because it's dangerous and it's full of lakes 22:51:26 <gfldex> luckyly we dont got that problem in germany 22:51:37 <gfldex> the coal was compareable close the surface 22:51:40 <Bjarni> there is a small museum there on one of the relatively safe spots, though they have signs everywhere telling people not to leave the trails 22:51:40 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D5C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:52:36 <Bjarni> one of the lakes (at least the one they told about) makes a chemical reaction with something underneath so it's an acid lake without anything living in it 22:52:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> there are still more areas to be flooded here 22:52:58 <Bjarni> too strong acid for just being pure carbon acid 22:53:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> like one "Tagebau" west of Merseburg 22:53:14 <Bjarni> it had a pretty colour though 22:53:22 <Eddi|zuHause2> that's an area which was not affected by the big flood 22:53:26 <gfldex> where do you live Eddi? 22:53:46 <Eddi|zuHause2> i live west of Halle 22:54:16 <gfldex> is halle a ghost town allready? 22:54:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> not really ;) 22:54:32 <Vikthor> Bjarni: Here(Well not exactly here, around Teplice) they flooded one mine and now it is open for swimming 22:54:48 <Bjarni> without any acid burns? 22:55:03 <gfldex> a friend of mine is teacher in leipzig and he got friends in halle. 22:55:14 <gfldex> teachers aswell and they say there is not much to do for them 22:55:16 <Eddi|zuHause2> don't believe _all_ stories on www.hoelle-saale.de.tt 22:55:23 <gfldex> quite scary 22:55:32 <Bjarni> well, I wouldn't go swimming in any of the lakes I saw. The reason is that the ground in the area was basically sand, so all the shorelines were really unstable 22:56:13 <Vikthor> I am not sure but there should be no acid if you have not been refilling the mine with ash from the coal 22:56:19 <TrueBrain> does the extension .tt exist? 22:56:25 <Vikthor> and this mine was closed for rother long time 22:56:33 <TrueBrain> we should get www.open.tt :p 22:56:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> apparently :p 22:57:20 <gfldex> .tt is trinidat and tabogo 22:57:30 <gfldex> so they are basicly voodoo domains :D 22:57:46 <huma> open.tt is available, btw 22:57:54 <Bjarni> it's called Trinidad and Tobago 22:58:13 <Bjarni> yeah, we should get that one :D 22:58:24 <huma> glx could do that 22:58:34 <Bjarni> why glx? 22:58:37 <Bjarni> why not TrueBrain? 22:58:42 <huma> he has a cool nick 22:58:55 * glx slaps huma 22:58:58 <huma> :) 22:59:00 <Bjarni> that's the rest reason if they ever was one :D 22:59:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> getting such a top level domain might get tricky if you do not own a server in that country 22:59:06 <glx> not a valid reason :) 22:59:11 <TrueBrain> 0 for 2 years 22:59:12 <TrueBrain> lol! 22:59:21 <Bjarni> o_O 22:59:21 <TrueBrain> wait, even worse 22:59:24 <TrueBrain> 00 for 2 years 22:59:33 <TrueBrain> else you need to take open.co.tt 22:59:37 <TrueBrain> but that spoils it :p 22:59:37 <Bjarni> I think we will stick to openttd.org 22:59:53 <huma> TrueBrain: 1000? 23:00:04 <huma> where did you get that? 23:00:07 <TrueBrain> http://www.nic.tt/fee.html 23:00:15 <TrueBrain> Registration Fee, FOREIGN, 2nd level domain 23:00:27 <huma> damn 23:00:45 <gfldex> if you got a .tv domain you are in trouble btw 23:00:45 *** svip [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:00:50 <huma> it's a ripoff! 23:00:56 <gfldex> because you need a state to get a top level domain 23:01:04 <gfldex> and they will be gone in 50 years 23:01:12 *** svip [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 23:01:20 <huma> a state? 23:01:28 <TrueBrain> I once requested if I could have my own TLD :p 23:01:31 <TrueBrain> I got a very nice response :) 23:01:33 <gfldex> at least for that kind of TLD 23:01:37 <Bjarni> the domain called sex.tv was once for rent for .000.000/year 23:01:46 <Bjarni> all of a sudden it contained a porn site 23:02:26 <Bjarni> <huma> a state? <-- it's a whole island in the Pacific and it's a country of it's own 23:02:46 <gfldex> it is a island for now ... 23:02:58 <Bjarni> they are like 25k people and some US company offered them million a year for the rights to all .tv domains 23:02:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> .tv belongs to the country of tuvalu 23:03:07 *** Jaywizzle [James@ip68-100-236-126.dc.dc.cox.net] has joined #openttd 23:03:18 <gfldex> the first country to get disbanded because they will run out of land in history 23:03:25 <Bjarni> 4 million a year is a lot for 25k people in a poor country 23:03:27 <huma> their whole economy is based on cybersquatting? 23:03:39 <Bjarni> looks like it 23:03:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> 4 million? they can get better deals than that 23:03:52 <Jaywizzle> Ok this may be a horribly stupid question, but i was playing a randomly generated game and its 2020 and i see all the aval trains but i cant build any, how do i gain access to build them?? 23:03:52 <Bjarni> most likely 23:03:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> selling all domains individually 23:04:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> Jaywizzle: build a depot, click on it 23:04:25 <Bjarni> yeah, but it looked like they wanted to sell them all for a steady income without any work 23:04:25 <huma> i wonder how many of those 25k have internet access 23:04:32 <TrueBrain> I am so bored... what to do... 23:04:33 <Bjarni> then the buyer sells them individually 23:04:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> Jaywizzle: you cannot build vehicles from the vehicle list 23:04:40 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB75A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:04:42 <Bjarni> TrueBrain: code something really cool 23:04:55 <huma> TrueBrain: yes please :) 23:05:00 <Bjarni> TrueBrain: like an air condition controller 23:05:03 <Bjarni> that would be cool 23:05:04 <gfldex> if they sell them by themself they need the infrastructure to run a registry 23:05:04 <TrueBrain> Bjarni: I already made a server for EaB in Stackless Python 23:05:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: exactly, and make a gazillion of extra money 23:05:06 <TrueBrain> it was really cool 23:05:11 <Eddi|zuHause2> for very little work 23:05:14 <gfldex> that way they simply rent the right to have a registry out 23:05:17 <Jaywizzle> yup did so i have plenty of trains but i want the new engines i dont see them aval on my list at depots 23:05:24 <huma> for what? 23:05:40 <huma> eab? 23:05:45 <TrueBrain> Earth and Beyond 23:05:46 <Eddi|zuHause2> Jaywizzle: then build a depot of the proper railtype 23:05:51 <TrueBrain> a cool game that closed down some years ago 23:06:01 <Jaywizzle> i see them as being aval and they should be bwecause of the year, but when i click a depot and build a new train all i have aval is two engines 23:06:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> electric/monorail/maglev 23:06:18 <Jaywizzle> mmm kay 23:06:38 <huma> why stackless? 23:06:43 <Bjarni> huh 23:06:50 * Bjarni was just attacked by a bug 23:07:00 <Bjarni> it flew right into my face 23:07:01 <TrueBrain> huma: proof of concept more than anything else, but also because it is the right language for that job 23:07:12 <TrueBrain> as example: EVE: Online switched to it too, for a good reason 23:07:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: here you have sex tv :p http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hIkPPCMW0Fg 23:07:21 <Bjarni> I guess it's payback for all the bug hunting and bug killing I have done 23:07:21 <huma> python is sweet 23:07:27 <gfldex> you need stackless python because of the stack limitations on windows 23:07:33 <gfldex> that's why eve is using it too 23:07:41 <TrueBrain> gfldex: euh, like: wrong! 23:07:50 <TrueBrain> stack limitations is not related to Windows, to start 23:08:00 <TrueBrain> second, it is a 'cheap' way for threading, the reason EVE uses it 23:08:11 <huma> haha! stacks flame war! :) 23:08:11 <gfldex> true but they are more ugly on windows then anywhere else 23:08:20 <TrueBrain> gfldex: it is not related to Windows 23:08:22 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: hehe 23:08:23 <TrueBrain> C uses stacks 23:08:30 <TrueBrain> that is why in C, and all languages based on C, you have a stack limit 23:08:42 <TrueBrain> Python is made in C 23:08:46 <gfldex> i know, you got problems with the stack anywhere if you have lots and lots of small functions that call each other 23:08:57 <TrueBrain> 2 functions 23:09:02 <TrueBrain> and we call it recursion 23:09:11 <gfldex> C got (at least in theory) an endless stack 23:09:16 <TrueBrain> no, it does not 23:09:22 <gfldex> the heap starts to grow from one end and the stack at the other 23:09:25 <TrueBrain> in theory even, the stack is the size of the memory 23:09:36 <Bjarni> I found another youtube video today. Some candid camera in Japanese trains and they filmed the reaction when famous people started telling stories (or something) though the speaker system 23:09:50 <TrueBrain> @op 23:09:53 *** mode/#openttd [+o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek 23:09:58 *** TrueBrain changed the topic of #openttd to: 0.5.3 | Website: *.openttd.org (DevBlog: blog, Translator: translator2, Gameservers: servers, Nightly-builds: nightly, WIKI: wiki, SVN mailinglist: maillist, Dev-docs: docs, Patches & Bug-reports: bugs) | #openttd.notice for FS + SVN notices | YouTube link == Ban 23:10:01 <TrueBrain> @deop 23:10:04 *** mode/#openttd [-o TrueBrain] by DorpsGek 23:10:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> err... 23:10:10 <huma> bummer 23:10:10 <Bjarni> it was in Japanese and with Japanese subtitles, so I think it could be really funny, but I didn't get it :( 23:10:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> we tried that with bash links previously, it did not exactly work out :p 23:10:30 <Bjarni> TrueBrain: why? 23:10:36 <huma> Bjarni: hint: use tinyurl :) 23:10:49 <TrueBrain> Bjarni: for the same reason as bash-links == ban 23:11:01 <TrueBrain> gfldex: anyway, the stackless part of stackless python isn't real, and not the main advantage 23:11:02 <Bjarni> no, that's the result 23:11:04 <TrueBrain> the microthreads are 23:11:07 <Bjarni> I asked for the reason 23:11:20 <huma> TrueBrain doesn't have flash to watch videos :) 23:11:20 <TrueBrain> and I refered you to the reason which states that bash links result in a ban 23:11:27 <TrueBrain> huma: ssstttt 23:11:33 <huma> :) 23:11:38 <Bjarni> :P 23:11:58 <Bjarni> TrueBrain: the link was bad anyway 23:12:05 <gfldex> CCP seam not to be that happy then them tho 23:12:07 <TrueBrain> gfldex: in fact, there is a microthread lib for C, but it is rather ugly :s 23:12:15 <Bjarni> it's some gay looking guy in leather talking German 23:12:22 <Bjarni> didn't bother to finish watching it 23:12:28 <huma> what's cool is when flash has a link to skip it inside the flash :) 23:12:37 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's actually a german comedy show 23:12:41 <TrueBrain> downside of Python, it is rather memory inefficient for jobs like MMO servers 23:12:45 <huma> or even better - has a link to download flash :) 23:12:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> and moreover, a crossover between two comedy shows :p 23:13:03 <TrueBrain> and after working for 2 weeks in python now, I have to say: I don't like Python-syntax 23:13:05 <Eddi|zuHause2> although it is pretty old 23:13:30 <huma> 2 years? as the main language? 23:13:46 <gfldex> i read the syntax of python and i decided to stick with perl when it comes to scripting 23:13:57 <TrueBrain> python is good for scripting 23:14:00 <TrueBrain> really good 23:14:09 <gfldex> javascript (1.7 and later) is a true beauty tho 23:14:09 <TrueBrain> not so 'hackish' as Perl 23:14:13 <gfldex> rather slow sadly 23:14:22 <TrueBrain> but... the mistakes I make 2 weeks ago, I still do 23:14:24 <TrueBrain> which annoys me 23:14:27 <gfldex> i like the hackish part in perl :) 23:14:28 <TrueBrain> as it means that the language sucks 23:14:37 <TrueBrain> $@, $_, $^ 23:14:38 <TrueBrain> I hate it 23:14:48 <TrueBrain> @var, $var 23:14:49 <TrueBrain> grr 23:15:02 <TrueBrain> but then again, implicit decleration sucks too 23:15:10 <TrueBrain> in Python: buf = len("abc") 23:15:11 <huma> my $TrueBrain :) 23:15:11 <TrueBrain> len = 2 23:15:14 <TrueBrain> buf = len("abc") 23:15:17 <TrueBrain> 3rd line fails 23:15:18 <gfldex> $_ together with destructuring arrays is quite nice 23:15:20 <TrueBrain> not the 2nd, the 3rd 23:15:37 <gfldex> and you solve the problem with variable parameter count in function quite elegant 23:15:45 <gfldex> because it's the default :) 23:16:07 <TrueBrain> my biggest problem with Python are the error messages 23:16:12 <TrueBrain> gcc is unclear in its messages 23:16:14 <TrueBrain> but Python tops it 23:16:26 <gfldex> and they can be like a mile long :) 23:16:33 <TrueBrain> that too 23:16:49 <TrueBrain> bah, it is tempting to start playing EVE: Online 23:16:54 <TrueBrain> lucky for me cedega doesn't work here at the moment :p 23:16:55 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: the most funny part is, the original "sex tv" sketches were part of the "Wochenschau", which was broadcast on Sat.1, but the guy walking in greets the "Pro 7 viewers" (knowing that he would later broadcast this sketch on his show on the other channel) 23:17:09 <gfldex> i stopped playing eve. did it for more then 4 years 23:17:30 <TrueBrain> last time I played it (2 years ago or so), I found it boring 23:17:31 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: heh 23:17:39 <gfldex> then we moved shit worth 35B from lower tash to deep 0.0 and nobody really nobody could cause us a problem 23:17:41 <TrueBrain> the reason I started to work on the EaB server :p 23:17:46 <gfldex> and that's plain wrong 23:18:24 <TrueBrain> but now I have a nice stackless python server for EaB, but several packages take 80ms to build 23:18:29 <TrueBrain> which is just too long 23:18:44 <TrueBrain> and that is because I can't allocate N bytes of memory, and roll a struct over it 23:18:53 <Eddi|zuHause2> if you browse through youtube, you can probably find either more "sex tv" sketches, or more "rabigramm" sketches 23:19:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> like the rabigramm with the klitschko brothers... that one is great :p 23:19:49 <Eddi|zuHause2> (that was in the show "Wetten, daÃ..?!" (on ZDF)) 23:20:20 <gfldex> are discussions about youtube links allowed? 23:20:38 <TrueBrain> gfldex: Eddi|zuHause2 knows he is pushing it ;) 23:20:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> probably not :p 23:20:51 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@snat1.spoje.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:21:04 *** Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-214-055.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:22:55 <gfldex> what exactly do you need the microthreads for in that server TrueBrain? 23:23:03 <TrueBrain> anyway, I now wonder if I should try to increase the speed of my server, but... I think I should pick an other language and try again :s 23:23:15 <TrueBrain> gfldex: simple: every connection goes in its own thread 23:23:20 <TrueBrain> if you do this via, say, pthread 23:23:23 <TrueBrain> there is a BIG overhead 23:23:26 <TrueBrain> and a max of, what, 1200? 23:23:36 <TrueBrain> (most systems drop out when you try to create 1000+ threads) 23:23:50 <gfldex> linux should be fine with that 23:23:55 <TrueBrain> microthreads aren't 'real' threads, as in that they don't push and pop the stack 23:24:01 <TrueBrain> gfldex: no, even linux drops out at 1200 23:24:03 <TrueBrain> Windows sooner 23:24:42 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB75A1.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Osai] 23:24:50 <gfldex> you have to iterate of those connections, right? 23:24:59 <TrueBrain> not via this way :) 23:25:01 <gfldex> so you end up with polluting the CPU cache quite a lot 23:25:32 <TrueBrain> http://members.verizon.net/olsongt/stackless/why_stackless.html <- this tells most things :) 23:25:48 <TrueBrain> Anyway, you can also put timers in threads like this 23:25:53 <TrueBrain> so you say: wait(3) 23:25:55 <TrueBrain> and it waits 3 seconds 23:26:00 <TrueBrain> without holding the rest of the application 23:26:12 <TrueBrain> 1 thing you really have to keep in mind, is that all local variables are gone when it returns 23:26:19 <TrueBrain> but that is just a matter of coding correctly :) 23:28:00 *** Greyscale_ [~Grey@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 23:28:30 <TrueBrain> wow, CCP helped with a lot of improvements in Python I didn't know about.. 23:28:36 <TrueBrain> most of them are exactly what I need :) 23:28:47 <gfldex> if you would have to serve that many connections in c++ you would try to handle all connections in one process 23:28:50 <blathijs> CCP? 23:28:56 <TrueBrain> blathijs: EVE: Online creators 23:29:05 <blathijs> ah 23:29:06 <TrueBrain> gfldex: yes, which overcomplicates things 23:29:18 <gfldex> depends on your implementation 23:29:22 <TrueBrain> gfldex: simple example: I read 4 bytes of the network, indicating a length of the packet 23:29:35 <TrueBrain> with microthreads I just do: while True: socket.read(). tasklett.suspend() 23:29:36 <TrueBrain> or what ever 23:29:43 <TrueBrain> till the length is read 23:29:46 <gfldex> stackless p. has to be written in some language and my bet is it's c++ 23:29:48 <TrueBrain> in your case, it would be much more complicated 23:29:50 <TrueBrain> and in fact: slower 23:29:58 <gfldex> you will type yourself bloody fingers tho 23:29:59 <TrueBrain> gfldex: it is a small patch over Python, so it is C 23:30:06 <Sacro> TrueBrain: how did you get my lego train into ottd? 23:30:12 <TrueBrain> Sacro: via Blender 23:30:25 <TrueBrain> "ordered dictionary" 23:30:30 <TrueBrain> haha, I love how CCP things :) 23:30:57 <gfldex> you could use trolltechs Qt 23:31:10 <gfldex> very easy and nice to write as well 23:31:16 <gfldex> and you dont need threads 23:31:27 <TrueBrain> you don't get it :) 23:31:27 <TrueBrain> hehe 23:31:42 <TrueBrain> without microthreads, a server of this magnitude == slow 23:31:48 <TrueBrain> in which ever langugage 23:31:51 <TrueBrain> -g :p 23:31:57 <gfldex> you ever used Qt? 23:32:05 <TrueBrain> only for some simple GUI 23:34:00 <gfldex> TrueBrain: you know that CCP is switching from stackless to C++ bit by bit? 23:34:05 <gfldex> at least for the server part 23:34:17 <gfldex> the client will stay in stackless for some time 23:34:18 <TrueBrain> at the 17th of August they claimed something else 23:34:48 <TrueBrain> gfldex: anyway, CCP doesn't use microthreads (yet) 23:35:06 <gfldex> they sayed they do 23:35:19 <Sacro> TrueBrain: thats too complex for stupid little me 23:35:20 <gfldex> did you see the vids from last fanfest? 23:36:05 <TrueBrain> "We will start experimenting in the use of Python threads in conjunction with tasklets to try to reduce client side lag." 23:36:20 <TrueBrain> gfldex: no, I didn't 23:36:24 <gfldex> client != server 23:36:37 <gfldex> they had some good interviews with quite a lot ppl 23:37:06 <gfldex> and oveur sayed they replace python on server side bit by bit with c++ 23:37:11 <TrueBrain> "On the server side, we have found that increased responsiveness reduces lag" 23:37:23 <TrueBrain> (talking about replacing C++ with Python) 23:37:25 <TrueBrain> hehe, confusing times :p 23:37:27 <TrueBrain> but okay 23:37:31 <TrueBrain> not that important, I guess :) 23:38:24 <gfldex> they more or less pay the development of stackless python 23:38:34 <gfldex> so they wont say anything bad about it 23:38:44 <TrueBrain> true :p 23:39:09 <gfldex> or better stay spend money to that uni where the guy got a position that is doing it 23:39:53 <TrueBrain> anyway, normal threads are just too slow, and without threads, servers like this are a complete mess 23:39:58 *** Greyscale_ [~Grey@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:40:30 <gfldex> that's what C++ is for. hide the mess behind classes (that happen to be messy then :) 23:40:42 <TrueBrain> :) It is not only that 23:40:54 <TrueBrain> take the EaB servers, there are 2 other versions: Java and C++ 23:40:59 <TrueBrain> Java I don't know, didn't look into 23:41:04 <TrueBrain> but the C++ is done via pthreads 23:41:11 <TrueBrain> each connection gets a thread 23:41:22 <TrueBrain> that server will be slow with a high amount of clients connected 23:41:30 <gfldex> maybe they wantet to run it on spark? :) 23:41:49 <TrueBrain> spark? 23:42:02 <gfldex> that sun processors 23:42:04 <glx> I think it's sparc 23:42:06 <TrueBrain> sparc :) 23:42:08 <TrueBrain> ah, k :p 23:42:15 <gfldex> it's getting late 23:42:20 <TrueBrain> I forgive you ;) 23:42:36 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1D5C7.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:42:38 <TrueBrain> but okay.. I like Python Stackless concept, I dislike Python :p 23:43:19 <gfldex> is there any language that is actually good all around? 23:43:25 <TrueBrain> of course not 23:43:33 <gfldex> a good project for you then :-> 23:43:43 <TrueBrain> hehe, I ahve been thinking about it ;) 23:43:57 <TrueBrain> but no, if you are a good programmer, you will never find a language that is perfect all around 23:44:04 <TrueBrain> there is always something :p 23:44:04 *** Greyscale_ [~Grey@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 23:44:19 *** gynterk [~gynter@84-50-137-112-dsl.rkv.estpak.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:44:27 <gfldex> i missplaced a & in c++ code a few days back 23:44:35 <gfldex> took me 2 days to find out whats wrong 23:44:56 <glx> , instead ; is nice too 23:45:17 <gfldex> that gives you a compiler error on most cases 23:45:46 <gfldex> i got a iterator that refused to stop to iterate 23:46:37 <gfldex> resulting in a segfault 23:47:53 <TrueBrain> :) 23:47:59 <TrueBrain> and C++ is one of the best languages ;) 23:48:00 <TrueBrain> hehe :p 23:48:07 <gfldex> i ended up with comparing memory positions of pointers (that's what's left of iterators after optimizations) 23:48:30 <gfldex> and i got to pointers that where different where they had to be the same 23:48:40 <gfldex> i still could not see what was going wrong 23:48:43 <TrueBrain> gfldex: btw, one other advantage about Python, you can reload parts of it without shutting down ;) 23:48:59 <ln-> an ottd rewrite in python?= 23:49:04 <TrueBrain> hahaha :) 23:49:06 <TrueBrain> good luck :p 23:49:19 <glx> have fun with the gui ;) 23:49:27 <TrueBrain> I wonder if you can make a convertor... 23:49:36 <gfldex> at first you would have to abond the grf and savegame void* deep deep black magic 23:49:48 <ln-> i do have the python book, but i'm approximately at the "hello world" page.. 23:49:48 <gfldex> and all those nice grfs are the point of that game 23:50:11 <TrueBrain> lol, the memorypools would be a cool one too :p 23:50:31 <gfldex> you would have to change anything 23:50:41 * SpComb is a Python addict 23:50:42 <TrueBrain> so basicly: a rewrite :p 23:51:11 <gfldex> wouldn't be the worst move tho 23:51:20 <SpComb> Python asynchronous networking/IO <3 23:51:23 <gfldex> you would release earth from a source of pain 23:51:40 <TrueBrain> OpenTTD in Python, interesting concept :) 23:52:08 <gfldex> there are bindings for SDL and kairo 23:52:14 <gfldex> *cairo 23:52:15 <TrueBrain> cairo 23:52:16 <TrueBrain> ;) 23:52:33 <SpComb> OpenTTD server in python... 23:52:37 <gfldex> so you could build a fully zoomable gui fairly easy :) 23:52:50 <TrueBrain> SpComb: sadly enough, impossible 23:52:55 <TrueBrain> as the server needs to know the gamelogic 23:52:59 <Sacro> http://www.glumbert.com/media/bbcgoatse :D 23:53:02 <TrueBrain> and as the gamelogic is equal to the whole game 23:53:02 <TrueBrain> ... 23:53:03 *** Greyscale_ [~Grey@host86-147-168-145.range86-147.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:53:37 <TrueBrain> @kick Sacro nice try, but it still is a youtube to me 23:53:37 *** Sacro was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [nice try, but it still is a youtube to me] 23:53:46 *** Sacro [~Sacro@adsl-87-102-80-216.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd 23:53:50 <Sacro> aww :( 23:53:52 <gfldex> you could give the grf (or better mod) writers a lot more freedom 23:54:12 <TrueBrain> gfldex: we can also just take Squirrel from NoAI branch, and allow that for grfs :) 23:54:26 <gfldex> i would prefere javascript tbh 23:54:40 <gfldex> i looked over the squirrel syntax and it got a lot stuff you dont really need 23:54:42 <TrueBrain> we picked Squirrel, and for a simple reason: it is light 23:54:54 <TrueBrain> 6000 lines of source-code to compile Squirrel 23:54:59 <TrueBrain> JavaScript is a bit... bigger :p 23:55:04 <gfldex> not much 23:55:14 <gfldex> and you can load scripts in unicode 23:55:15 <TrueBrain> the last time I checked, you needed a lot of files :p 23:55:20 <TrueBrain> Squirrel too :p 23:55:34 <gfldex> and that means you could implement the gui description completely in javascript 23:55:55 <gfldex> translaters could translate the gui then instead of to short strings :) 23:55:56 <TrueBrain> gfldex: any scripting language can do that 23:56:19 <TrueBrain> http://construct.wikispaces.com/tut-basics <- argh, I have made that in the last week myself! :( 23:56:26 <TrueBrain> only a bit slower, but okay :p 23:58:14 <Sacro> http://www.makezine.com/blog/archive/2007/03/gummy_bear_chandelier.html 23:58:35 <TrueBrain> Sacro: pretty :)