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00:00:02 * orudge` likes Coke, and Pepsi 00:00:11 <orudge`> and vodka and coke/pepsi 00:00:11 <orudge`> and rum and coke 00:00:11 <orudge`> etc 00:00:14 <Gonozal_VIII> but a lot less sprites 00:00:26 <Rubidium_> mountain dew 00:01:05 <Gonozal_VIII> well... it's not really coke... it's some cheapo thing, freeway cola... and light^^ 00:01:22 <Rubidium_> coke isn't coke anymore either 00:01:48 <Gonozal_VIII> just not the same without drugs... 00:01:51 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@169.222.10.8] has joined #openttd 00:01:52 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 00:02:00 *** ThePizzaKing [~jeff@169.222.10.8] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:02:13 <Chrill> Coke is unhealthy :( 00:02:18 * Chrill throws Coke @ orudge` 00:02:36 <Gonozal_VIII> they keep saying that.. but where's the proof? 00:02:53 <Chrill> USA? 00:02:56 <Bjarni> orudge`: you like mixing rum with stuff and then drink it? 00:03:14 <Gonozal_VIII> rum & mud 00:03:17 <fjb> Who had the bad idea that the backside, the underside and the rail / road of a bridge are one sprite? So every bridge set has to support evry road or railset. 00:03:17 <Chrill> Bjarni, that exlpains his behaviour 00:03:18 <orudge`> Bjarni: occasionally 00:03:30 <Chrill> Vodka and Red Bull <-- Instawin 00:03:32 * orudge` goes to watch something 00:03:32 <orudge`> ta ta 00:03:39 <Chrill> baii rudgie 00:03:43 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: you might also want to allow for a colour-remap-overlay for the trackbase, that way you could use "company colours" in the trackbase to change appearance depending on the ground sprites, for smoother connection 00:03:46 <Bjarni> 400 years ago the buccaneers of Port Royal mixed rum and gunpowder and drank it 00:03:50 <Bjarni> ever tried that? 00:03:55 <Chrill> Yeah sure 00:04:22 <Bjarni> I presume it game them quite a buzz 00:04:28 <GoneWacko> Have you ever had brown-brown? 00:04:34 <Gonozal_VIII> you could eddi but i don't think that would be necessary 00:04:40 <Bjarni> I don't even know what it is? 00:04:52 <Bjarni> -? 00:05:10 <Gonozal_VIII> that's from lord of war, right? 00:05:11 <GoneWacko> Brown-brown is a form of powdered cocaine, cut with gunpowder. Commonly given to child soldiers in West African armed conflicts,[1] the drug gained notoriety after it was used by Nicholas Cage's character, Yuri Orlov, in the 2005 movie Lord of War[2]. Consumed by insufflation, the gunpowder in the drug irritates the bowels which increases aggression. 00:05:55 <Bjarni> o_O 00:06:04 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 00:06:21 <Bjarni> remember what happened to the last person in here speaking of drugs? 00:06:28 <Chrill> yeah, he got op 00:06:31 <GoneWacko> I wasn't here to see it I think 00:06:41 <Chrill> twas DorpsGek 00:07:04 <GoneWacko> What are you getting at Bjarni 00:07:15 <Bjarni> he ended up getting perm banned 00:07:23 <Chrill> ..oh 00:07:26 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 00:07:28 <GoneWacko> for something completely unrelated I'm sure? 00:07:34 <Bjarni> not really 00:07:47 <Bjarni> he started showing pictures of his plants 00:07:51 <GoneWacko> so? 00:07:58 <Bjarni> and how he didn't consider drugs to be an issue 00:08:07 <GoneWacko> apart from it not being on-topic, I don't see the problem 00:08:20 <Bjarni> drugs are banned 00:08:33 <GoneWacko> Not in the Netherlands (softdrugs anyway) 00:08:34 <Bjarni> there is nothing good about drugs at all 00:08:37 <GoneWacko> and alcohol is rarely banned 00:08:39 <Gonozal_VIII> i don't consider them an issue too as long as the people taking them don't put others in danger 00:08:53 <Bjarni> drugs funds terrorists 00:09:07 <GoneWacko> hah. 00:09:10 <Bjarni> so if we kill all drugs we kill a major income for them 00:09:11 <SmatZ> not true 00:09:16 <Gonozal_VIII> that's one of those lame things usa came up with 00:09:22 <GoneWacko> Bjarni: what do you fund? 00:09:34 <Bjarni> as little as possible 00:10:03 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> that's one of those lame things usa came up with <-- no 00:10:33 <Gonozal_VIII> well... then banning them makes it even easier for them 00:10:44 <Bjarni> it's a well known fact that terrorists in South America earn a fortune on cocaine and shit 00:10:53 <GoneWacko> Drugs are not an issue, I don't take them myself but if someone wants to endulge themselves by all means let them go ahead. 00:10:54 <Gonozal_VIII> they should control where they come from and the quality 00:11:10 <SmatZ> Bjarni: if he grows it at home, it doesn't fund terrorist 00:11:16 <Bjarni> I know 00:11:34 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: what do you think american companies earn with drugs in south america? 00:11:51 <Bjarni> I have no idea 00:11:54 <GoneWacko> ah. 00:11:59 <GoneWacko> Finally you tell the truth :] 00:12:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> you don't honestly think they would let such a great money source slip... 00:12:21 <Bjarni> I know that Farc earns a fortune 00:12:30 <Bjarni> enough to arm a whole army 00:12:32 <GoneWacko> I'm not going to say _I_ have an idea, but I'm not overly confident that you do, either. 00:12:59 <GoneWacko> Do you know Farc well enough to know that they are 'evil'? 00:13:12 <GoneWacko> as the saying goes, one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter 00:13:12 <Bjarni> they are on the EU terrorlist 00:13:18 <Bjarni> that should be enough 00:13:18 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:13:39 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: you know the "United Fruit Company"? 00:13:42 <GoneWacko> I've never understood why the EU should even care about militants in another continent. 00:13:45 <Bjarni> besides they shoot and kidnaps civilians 00:14:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> (now called "Chiquita") 00:14:14 <Bjarni> I know them by name 00:14:36 <Eddi|zuHause2> it controlled like 100% of the fruit plantations in south america 00:14:51 <Eddi|zuHause2> and worked together with the CIA to install and remove governments as they pleased 00:15:03 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has joined #openttd 00:15:14 *** Zothar [~Zothar@ppp-70-242-202-109.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox 2.0.0.11/2007112718]] 00:15:37 <Bjarni> they aren't killing us in the process 00:15:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> and i mean that litterally 00:15:57 <Bjarni> I know CIA did a lot of stuff in South America 00:15:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> like if a government wanted to increase minimum payment for the local workes 00:16:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> they'd coup against that government, and install Yet Another Dictatorship 00:17:36 <Bjarni> how is that different from EU gaining more power and money to themselves without elections? 00:17:48 <GoneWacko> huh? 00:17:54 <GoneWacko> I don't even see how you're making the comparison. 00:18:09 <Eddi|zuHause2> that's an awfully long way to come, indeed ;) 00:18:19 <GoneWacko> I know nothing about either but learning about them now I don't see the relationship 00:18:39 <Bjarni> I guess I have to tell you about the Lisbon treaty then 00:20:08 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: i'm not saying that some EU regulations are not suspect, but it's a whole different thing than sending troops to remove democratically elected governments and install a dictator that is more likely to support your company's interest 00:20:29 <Bjarni> basically EU decided to allow a majority to rule instead of getting all countries to agree so according to the Lisbon treaty EU can rule that a country has to do something even if every single person in that country is against it 00:20:41 <Eddi|zuHause2> and with EU treaties, at least the member states' representants must have had to agree 00:20:55 <Bjarni> they did some black magic to avoid having elections about this since France and the Netherlands voted no 00:21:23 <Bjarni> also it means that EU will get a president 00:21:36 <Chrill> and his name will be Owen Rudge 00:22:03 <Eddi|zuHause2> honestly, with the recent growth of the EU, giving each country a veto right cannot possibly work anymore 00:22:10 <Bjarni> actually France talked about Anders Fog Rasmussen but only if Denmark joins the Euro 00:22:24 <Chrill> Denmark sucks if they do 00:22:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> veto rights might be a good idea with 5 or 12 countries, but not with >20 00:22:57 <Chrill> im offz im offz bai im offz 00:23:06 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c80-216-64-31.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [] 00:23:07 <Bjarni> <Eddi|zuHause2> honestly, with the recent growth of the EU, giving each country a veto right cannot possibly work anymore <-- that's a valid argument but the constitution(s?) will not allow it without an election 00:23:28 <Bjarni> the s? is because I only read the Danish one not all of them 00:24:13 <Gonozal_VIII> getting hundreds of millions of people to elect could be quite difficult 00:24:25 <Gonozal_VIII> well... expensive 00:24:33 <Eddi|zuHause2> elections are done all the time... 00:24:49 <Eddi|zuHause2> that can't be an issue 00:25:07 <Bjarni> but in a democracy will you not have an election because it's too expensive even if the law says that you have to? 00:25:10 <GoneWacko> Personally I would love nothing more than see the EU be disbanded and just keep the European Economic Community, I'm not a big fan of a United States of Europe idea 00:25:22 <Bjarni> wouldn't it be dictatorship otherwise? 00:25:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, i think that both the euro and a european constitution are a good idea 00:26:11 <glx> but not the one they wanted to use 00:26:13 <Eddi|zuHause2> "national" states have caused too much trouble in the past 00:26:15 <GoneWacko> I love the Euro, I hate the idea that some guy from another country gets to decide what happens in mine, though :-) 00:26:18 *** LeviathNL [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:26:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> glx: hence i did not say "the" constitution ;) 00:26:33 <Bjarni> looks like Eddi|zuHause2 ate all the German propaganda 00:26:47 <Gonozal_VIII> i've read some science fiction story that had simplyfied elections where people can choose others to represent them in votes and elections... the vote of the representing persons counts multiple times then 00:26:48 <GoneWacko> Like the Italian government, they seem to like criticizing the Dutch government when something unconventional happens :) 00:27:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: you can do that right now, too, you can give a person a "Vollmacht" 00:27:40 <Gonozal_VIII> well bjarni, they are not good for us now... but they will be for future generations 00:28:00 <glx> we always blame Brussels 00:28:02 <GoneWacko> Gonozal_VIII: that's hardly sciencefiction, most government work that way, in a sense 00:28:24 <Bjarni> in order to get the Euro to work then the EUR countries have to keep each other in strict control 00:28:29 <GoneWacko> you pick a party based on how much what they stand for matches with what you stand for, and then the party does all the decisionmaking 00:28:48 <Gonozal_VIII> well.. but what if all parties suck? 00:28:50 <Bjarni> otherwise inflation and stuff will ruin the economy 00:29:01 <glx> Gonozal_VIII: then you create one 00:29:04 <GoneWacko> Gonozal_VIII: then you make your own party that doesn't :) 00:29:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: you can always start your own party 00:29:14 <Bjarni> that's why EU decided that if the economy is bad in a country then they fine it until they get a better economy 00:29:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: or let yourself be elected without party 00:29:44 <Eddi|zuHause2> you just have to convince more than 50% of your local voters 00:29:46 <Gonozal_VIII> i know, i know... but that doesn't work 00:29:52 * Bjarni never understood the idea in "you have too few money. Now you will have to pay me each month until you have plenty again" 00:30:26 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> well bjarni, they are not good for us now... but they will be for future generations <-- and what makes you think future generations will not have the problems? 00:30:34 <Bjarni> presuming EU survives 00:30:59 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: it's not about "bad economy" it's about "unbalanced expenses" 00:31:15 <ln-> let's have Turkey as a member, then all problems will be solved. 00:31:18 <Vikthor> (01:29:52) ***Bjarni never understood the idea in "you have too few money. Now you will have to pay me each month until you have plenty again" -- I always thought its more about you spend too much, so pay a fine 00:31:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> i.e. "you can't spend more than you earn" 00:31:31 <Bjarni> <Eddi|zuHause2> Gonozal_VIII: you can always start your own party <-- somebody here did that 9 months ago with famous politicians and now they are down to 4 people :p 00:31:54 <GoneWacko> it usually is a joke 00:32:00 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: they started a new party here a few years ago 00:32:20 <Bjarni> they meant it as a serious party but they did nothing but internal fights 00:32:36 <Bjarni> and it would appear that i was political suicide to join it 00:32:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> and now they made it into 2 "LÀnderparlamente" 00:32:48 <GoneWacko> some years ago we had Pim Fortuyn who made a party, they did incredibly well during the first elections, but because none of the people in the party had the faintest idea of politics they fucked up and they were never heard of again. 00:33:21 <GoneWacko> Same thing is about to happen with another 'radical' party (led by a neonazi :]) 00:33:26 <Bjarni> Denmark gained a new party like 10-15 years ago or so and now it's the 3rd largest 00:33:29 <Eddi|zuHause2> a 5th force in the parliament really screws the existing system 00:33:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> because none of the previous 2-party-coalitions have a majority anymore 00:33:53 <GoneWacko> and luckily the dutch Paedo Party never managed to get enough finances to make it to the elections -_- 00:34:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's the same with the federal parliament at the last election (where that new party started for the first time) 00:34:20 <Bjarni> GoneWacko: is that the party that wanted to lower the age of consent? 00:34:25 <GoneWacko> yes. 00:34:29 <Bjarni> good :) 00:34:59 *** Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:35:04 <GoneWacko> and the had a bunch of popular points on their agenda because they wanted to lure voters towards them 00:35:21 <GoneWacko> such as legalization of hard drugs, to come back to what started this whole discussion. 00:35:24 <Bjarni> even if the rest of the policies might be good (I don't know them) then nothing could make up for having pedophile policies 00:35:46 <Bjarni> drugs are bad 00:35:52 <Bjarni> they lead to crime 00:35:57 <Bjarni> and crime leads to drugs 00:36:01 <GoneWacko> not if they're legalized -_- 00:36:13 <Bjarni> that is what you think 00:36:21 <GoneWacko> And the opposite is what you think. 00:36:38 <Bjarni> you don't know how many assaults that are due to people being affected by drugs 00:36:44 <Bjarni> or traffic accidents for that matter 00:36:52 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, i can understand the abuse part of "paedophilism" being bad, but there was a time in europe where having sex with 12 year old boys and girls were a commonly accepted action 00:36:55 <GoneWacko> Well the Dutch may be pretty famous for being open minded but we're not stupid enough to allow paedophilia (or in fact hard drugs, which I will agree on that they may not be a very positive force) 00:37:00 <Eddi|zuHause2> just read a book about ancient greece 00:37:21 <GoneWacko> Eddi|zuHause2: well I guess that according to nature it's all good 00:37:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> you'll learn that young men took young boys as "pupils", teach them stuff, and also have sex with them 00:38:00 <Eddi|zuHause2> later they get married to young girls 00:38:10 <Bjarni> people at the age of 12 are still children at heart and unsuited for being parents 00:38:25 <GoneWacko> Nobody here is questioning that >_> (I think :|) 00:38:34 <Bjarni> no 00:38:39 <Bjarni> I just made a statement 00:38:42 <Bjarni> not an argument 00:39:00 <GoneWacko> ok. Go ahead then. 00:39:06 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: having an older and "experienced" (because he previously taught a young boy) husband kinda makes up for that 00:39:16 <Bjarni> so the conclusion to my statement is that if they aren't old enough to be parents then they aren't old enough for sex 00:39:36 <GoneWacko> Heck I don't care about safe sex 00:39:53 <GoneWacko> baby making sex, not until you're mentally mature 00:40:19 <Bjarni> all sex should be considered baby making sex 00:40:28 <Bjarni> nothing is for sure apart from not doing it 00:40:39 <Bjarni> and you should be prepared to deal with the results of your actions 00:40:45 <GoneWacko> Are you terribly christian or something? :-p 00:40:50 <Bjarni> no 00:41:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> granted, in ancient greece, like in most old cultures, women were only considered "baby making machines", and had almost no social or political rigths 00:41:07 <GoneWacko> Well, I just know you're going to argue now but, there's always aftermeasures if you really must 00:41:11 <Bjarni> I expected that question when I wrote what I just wrote 00:41:23 <Bjarni> but there is nothing religious behind it 00:41:31 <GoneWacko> Bjarni: I was going to ask it back when you started about drugs ._> 00:41:41 <Bjarni> there are sanity, morale and logic thinking behind it 00:42:39 <Bjarni> <GoneWacko> Are you terribly christian or something? :-p <-- I tend to disagree with die hard Christians most of the time 00:42:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> but honestly, this raising of "baby making" age to something like 26 (what appears to be current average) is something invented in modern times, ancient cultures couldn't have survived that way 00:42:50 <GoneWacko> Well yes but sanity, morale and logic thinking can sometimes cause pretty boring lives :> 00:42:55 <Bjarni> and even when we agree the arguments aren't the same 00:43:04 <Eddi|zuHause2> girls had to get children when they were biologically able to do so 00:43:15 <Eddi|zuHause2> because the life expectancy was not very high 00:43:44 <Bjarni> but giving birth at the age of 12-13 were dangerous as well 00:43:59 <TinoDidriksen> The prime age was 17. 00:44:11 <Bjarni> how do you know? 00:44:11 <Gonozal_VIII> 17 is still prime 00:44:39 <Bjarni> and there is a huge difference between being 12 and 17 both physically and mentally 00:44:50 <GoneWacko> I don't think girls would start puberty at 12-13 back then, although I have no references to back up that assumption. 00:44:54 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: well i was thinking about between 14 and 18 to be the "best" time to get children 00:45:15 *** Sogard [~Sogard@ip24-251-252-143.ph.ph.cox.net] has quit [Quit: Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 00:45:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> GoneWacko: i don't think the biology of humans changed much in the last 2000 years 00:45:27 <GoneWacko> I know that these the age at which puberty starts is moving forward as of late though 00:45:30 <Bjarni> to have them or to start having them? 00:45:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> except they appear to have got physically larger 00:46:07 <Sacro> [00:45] <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: well i was thinking about between 14 and 18 to be the "best" time to get children <- oh aye ;) 00:46:12 <GoneWacko> Eddi|zuHause2: but hygiene and such has, which has effects on quite a lot of things 00:46:17 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: well, it was not uncommon for women to die when giving birth 00:46:24 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause2: that's the food. The middle ages delivered poor food (for several reasons) so people were shorter 00:46:39 <Gonozal_VIII> i've read that the weight has a high effect on the time when girls start being able to get children 00:46:54 <Bjarni> specially the weight 00:48:10 <Bjarni> <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: well, it was not uncommon for women to die when giving birth <-- I know but giving birth at an age where the body isn't ready for it is a high risk birth 00:48:11 <Sacro> http://jcnemecek.com/grosvenor/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/scrabble.jpg 00:48:20 <Bjarni> besides women still dies giving birth 00:48:30 <Eddi|zuHause2> also, when only 7 of 10 born children reach puberty, you need to get a lot more children 00:48:38 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 00:48:45 <Eddi|zuHause2> er... 00:48:47 <Bjarni> even on modern western hospitals 00:48:50 <Eddi|zuHause2> wrong way around 00:48:54 <Eddi|zuHause2> 3 of 10 reach puberty 00:49:01 <Eddi|zuHause2> 7 of 10 die before puberty 00:49:29 <Bjarni> a hundred years ago it wasn't uncommon for children to die 00:49:35 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: sure, you cannot get risks to 0% 00:49:45 <Bjarni> everybody knew somebody who lost somebody 00:50:42 <Eddi|zuHause2> the culture needs to ensure the 2.1 children for keeping population 00:51:02 <Eddi|zuHause2> meaning children that reach reproductive age 00:51:02 <Bjarni> when I was at a cemetery once I found a grave of around that age. It contained 3 children of the age of 6 to 10 (or something like that) and they all died within two weeks 00:51:48 <Eddi|zuHause2> well, modern "basic" illnesses might very well have been fatal without treatment back then 00:51:56 <Bjarni> I guess they got some disease or something 00:52:06 <Bjarni> but imagine what it must have been like for the parents 00:52:26 <Eddi|zuHause2> excuse me if i won't do that ;) 00:52:36 <Bjarni> good point 00:52:54 <Bjarni> but you already did by giving such a statement 00:52:58 <Bjarni> sort of 00:53:13 <Bjarni> you decided that you don't want to because you presume something about what it would be like 00:53:56 *** KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-140-42.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:54:06 <Bjarni> why is it that IRC starts with a topic (like here drugs) and then it ends up with people dying from lack of medicine 00:54:06 <Sacro> http://buzzblogging.com/tweaks/force-windows-to-load-the-kernel-in-memory/ 00:54:23 <Bjarni> and in between we talked about ancient Greece, EU and politics 00:54:51 <GoneWacko> Sacro: are you just spamming random links or what D: 00:55:03 <Sacro> GoneWacko: yaah, kinda ;p 00:55:08 <Sacro> but only decent ones 00:55:09 <Gonozal_VIII> as usual 00:55:15 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm no 00:55:19 <Gonozal_VIII> not the decent thing 00:55:34 <Sacro> i mean i have ones i could spam, but they;'d probably get me kicked 00:55:50 <Gonozal_VIII> you already lead the kick count 00:55:59 <GoneWacko> I'm willing to bet that keeping the current behaviour is going to get you kicked as well :p 00:56:05 <Bjarni> Sacro: pictures of your rice cooker? 00:56:15 <Sacro> Bjarni: she's gone back to china 00:56:21 <Sacro> she got caught up in the snow 00:56:34 <Bjarni> you know for sure or do you just presume? 00:57:03 <Gonozal_VIII> froze to death in the snow... btw who? 00:57:37 <Bjarni> the Chinese girl Sacro used to live with 00:57:51 <Bjarni> she went back to China recently 00:57:57 <Bjarni> or so he claims 00:58:10 <Bjarni> all I know is that she is not around Sacro anymore 00:58:21 <Bjarni> I don't know that for sure either 00:58:29 <Bjarni> she could be in the closet or under the floor 00:58:43 <Gonozal_VIII> he's probably keeping her in the basement and just tells everybody she left 00:58:48 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 00:58:56 <Bjarni> that's the first thing I said 00:59:01 <Bjarni> when he told that she left 00:59:31 <Bjarni> "why didn't you just hide your Asian girl in the basement like everybody else?" or something like that 00:59:43 <Bjarni> Sacro: you never answered that one 01:00:06 <Bjarni> Sacro: that XP RAM trick... did you test it yourself? 01:00:16 <Gonozal_VIII> yes... there are so many asian girls and they all looke almost the same... nobody notices if some of them are missing 01:00:34 <Bjarni> except the parents but they are too far away 01:00:36 <fjb> Can somebody please give me a hint what action I have to look for so that newstations grf uses the right sprites instead of always the maglev ones? 01:01:09 <Gonozal_VIII> that's a bug 01:01:54 <Gonozal_VIII> maglev tracks shouldn't even be accessible 01:02:16 <fjb> I guessed that it is a bug. There should be a way to fix it. But a hint which action is responsible for that bug would be great. 01:02:33 <Gonozal_VIII> i don't think it's a bug in the grf 01:02:46 <fjb> All other station sets are using the replacement tracks. 01:02:50 <Gonozal_VIII> unless it comes with its own maglev tracks... 01:03:29 <fjb> Oh, hm looks like it has some maglev track sprites in that grf. 01:03:47 <fjb> How was that with the copyright? :-) 01:03:57 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 01:04:12 <Gonozal_VIII> he always talks about copyright issues 01:04:20 <Bjarni> Sacro: you are avoiding the questions 01:04:30 <Gonozal_VIII> he went feeding her 01:04:49 <Bjarni> really? 01:04:56 <Bjarni> that's the 2nd time today 01:05:01 <Gonozal_VIII> some rotten fish, asian chicks dig that 01:05:10 <fjb> We should avoid Sacro and get back to grf questions. 01:08:32 *** thepalm [thepalm@CPE-121-210-80-224.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 01:09:09 *** thepalm [thepalm@CPE-121-210-80-224.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has left #openttd [] 01:09:36 <Gonozal_VIII> now you broke the channel again 01:10:13 <fjb> Sacro broke it. 01:10:23 <Bjarni> but he is not even here 01:10:28 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: afaik it's a known problem that station graphics need the track hardcoded in it 01:10:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> same as bridge graphics 01:10:48 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm no 01:10:54 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: I don't think so. 01:11:01 <Gonozal_VIII> most don't have that 01:11:12 <Gonozal_VIII> like industrial stations 01:11:33 <fjb> newstations is the only grf that I know about having that bug. 01:11:42 <Eddi|zuHause2> anyway, MB talked about that problem somewhere 01:12:05 <Gonozal_VIII> well... newstations is from mb 01:12:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> geee... who'd have thunk :p 01:13:01 <Gonozal_VIII> stations are stacked sprites first track then station 01:13:20 <Gonozal_VIII> he would just have to add some blue 01:13:45 <fjb> The question is now if there is an easy fix. Most of the station sprites don't have track graphics, they have transparent sections. So there should be no problem to display the right track graphics. 01:14:18 <fjb> It looks pink, I think that are transparent parts. 01:14:19 <Gonozal_VIII> did you decode it? 01:14:22 <fjb> Yes. 01:14:24 <Gonozal_VIII> no 01:14:33 <Gonozal_VIII> blue is transparent 01:14:44 <fjb> What is pink then? 01:14:55 <Gonozal_VIII> special stuff 01:15:25 <fjb> The question is what special stuff that is. 01:15:26 <Gonozal_VIII> try to change the pink to blue ;-) 01:15:48 *** Korenn [~blaat@78-27-14-50.dsl.alice.nl] has quit [] 01:16:20 <fjb> Hm, does ImageMagic have a filter for things like that? 01:16:29 <Gonozal_VIII> gimp does 01:16:31 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: pink usually means wrong pallete 01:16:40 <Eddi|zuHause2> try unpacking with -p 2 01:17:56 <Gonozal_VIII> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=35310&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=692 01:17:56 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause2: It is the windows grf. 01:18:07 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: exactly 01:18:21 <Eddi|zuHause2> -p 2 means windows palette 01:18:34 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Thank you. I also made a palette for gimp already. 01:19:18 <Gonozal_VIII> i even named the colours ;-) 01:20:25 <fjb> Hm, ok, I didn't do that. 01:20:34 <Bjarni> you named it Bob? 01:20:48 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 01:21:16 <Gonozal_VIII> the action colours like transparent, water cycle, company... 01:21:48 <Gonozal_VIII> fire cylce :D 01:22:02 <Gonozal_VIII> i'll have to use that some time^^ 01:22:06 <Bjarni> hehe... I get your point 01:22:13 <Bjarni> nobody names colours Bob 01:22:18 <Bjarni> you named it Fred 01:22:24 <Gonozal_VIII> yep :D 01:22:35 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm 01:22:36 <Gonozal_VIII> ! 01:22:40 <Gonozal_VIII> bob is robert! 01:22:44 <Gonozal_VIII> that's my name! 01:23:22 <Bjarni> so naturally a colour named Bob could only be yellow? 01:24:07 <Gonozal_VIII> :S 01:24:19 <Bjarni> :P 01:24:19 <Gonozal_VIII> yellow? 01:24:32 <Gonozal_VIII> i named magenta telecom :-) 01:24:57 * Bjarni scratches his head 01:25:04 <fjb> Ok, there is less pink in the sprites now. 01:25:05 <Bjarni> telecom? 01:25:10 <Gonozal_VIII> they copyrighted it 01:25:23 <Bjarni> heh 01:25:31 <Bjarni> how can you copyright a colour? 01:25:36 <Bjarni> it's a wavelength 01:25:36 <Gonozal_VIII> they can 01:25:57 <Gonozal_VIII> but only for use in advertising... 01:26:18 <Eddi|zuHause2> they didn't copyright it, they trademarked it 01:26:26 <Eddi|zuHause2> it's a difference 01:26:30 <Gonozal_VIII> ok? 01:26:32 <glx> like orange 01:26:38 <fjb> The problem seams to be that he provided sprites for all track types with snow and without snow. So I guess he doesn't use the track sprites that the game provides but always his own. 01:26:43 <Bjarni> here the railroad company got asked for the RGB values in their signs and they said that it's a secret and copyrighted to them so he were not allowed to use that info anyway 01:26:53 <Bjarni> they copyrighted blue? 01:27:03 <Gonozal_VIII> they should do that with all colours, then there would be much less ads everywhere^^ 01:27:09 <fjb> They didn't trademark it, but they tried to do it and failed. 01:27:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> fjb: honestly, i have no information about wether they failed or not 01:28:20 <Bjarni> what would happen if you watch a commercial on your TV and the colours on your TV is wrong so it's in the colour copyrighted to some other company? 01:28:38 <Eddi|zuHause2> Bjarni: different thing, art, i.e. the composition of colours, is bound to copyright 01:28:40 *** orudge` [~orudge@201.39.95.8] has quit [Quit: be back later] 01:28:52 <Gonozal_VIII> the advertising company would have to buy you a new tv then 01:30:05 <Bjarni> cool 01:30:20 <Bjarni> right now the colours are way off 01:30:23 <Bjarni> they are gone 01:30:38 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 01:30:55 <Bjarni> transformer started burning :o 01:31:10 <Bjarni> so I'm without a TV 01:31:17 <Gonozal_VIII> your tv is a transformer? :O 01:31:28 <Bjarni> yeah 01:31:34 <Gonozal_VIII> i thought they were only cars and trucks 01:31:37 <glx> like all CRT 01:31:44 <Bjarni> 230V->whatever voltage the tube used 01:32:19 <Bjarni> TVs tend to die in the high voltage part 01:32:24 <Eddi|zuHause2> i like your usage of the word "used" ;) 01:32:30 <Bjarni> well the dangerous versions of dying anyway 01:32:46 <fjb> I hate hexcode. 01:32:47 <Gonozal_VIII> so it transformed into a robot, walked away and got shot by some guys with flamethrowers? 01:33:00 <glx> "modern" TV have a safety stuff to prevent implosion 01:33:20 <Bjarni> actually it transformed into something foul smelling and smoking and I unplugged it and ran outside with it 01:33:40 <Gonozal_VIII> the glass at the front is much thicker than at the back, if something goes wrong, it's at the back 01:33:57 <Eddi|zuHause2> honestly, the only TV that we threw away did not die, the brightness reduced after like 15 years of use, so it became unwatchable during daytime 01:34:07 <Bjarni> actually I'm not scared of explosions but flames would be bad 01:34:08 <Eddi|zuHause2> so we bought a new one 01:34:21 <Eddi|zuHause2> but computer monitors appear to die much faster 01:34:26 <Gonozal_VIII> never had any dying tvs either 01:34:32 <Eddi|zuHause2> usually in the power supply part 01:34:34 <Gonozal_VIII> only suffering.. 01:34:38 <glx> higher refresh rate 01:35:27 <Bjarni> I(if you include the family TV when I was younger) have had 3 TVs that started burning 01:35:46 <Bjarni> all of them by just a foul smell and then nothing because it was unplugged 01:35:52 <Bjarni> became unplugged 01:35:53 *** Eddi|zuHause3 [~johekr@p54B77CF7.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:35:56 <Gonozal_VIII> i would blame your wiring or the power company for that 01:35:59 <Bjarni> I think I'm unlucky :( 01:36:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have like 4 broken monitors around here 01:36:01 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:36:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> where one is not really broken, only when it was switched off, it sometimes needs an hour to switch on 01:36:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> so it just sits around in suspend instead 01:36:29 <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII: not all of them died in the same building 01:36:32 <Gonozal_VIII> shy 01:36:35 <Bjarni> let alone the same town 01:36:53 <ln-> Bjarni: do you have a cat? 01:37:12 *** De_Ghost [~s@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:37:18 <Bjarni> no 01:37:19 <Gonozal_VIII> don't blame it on cats, cats rock! 01:37:23 <ln-> ok 01:37:27 <Bjarni> it's not a pet issue 01:37:59 <glx> next time use an UPC ;) 01:38:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> my guinea pigs used to chew on the wire-isolations ;) 01:38:16 <Bjarni> UPC? 01:38:22 <Gonozal_VIII> do you have long hair and a long beard and happen to lay your head onto the air intakes a lot? 01:38:32 <Bjarni> lol 01:38:36 <Bjarni> no :) 01:39:02 <glx> hmm ups (I failed to remember the name) 01:39:16 <Gonozal_VIII> cupply :-) 01:39:18 <Bjarni> oh you mean power surge protection? 01:39:37 <Bjarni> I have that NOW 01:39:40 <Gonozal_VIII> that too i guess 01:40:00 <Bjarni> UPS is surge protection+battery power 01:40:11 <Bjarni> surge protection is spike protection only 01:40:17 <Bjarni> the latter is much cheaper 01:40:40 <Gonozal_VIII> i know, i know 01:41:01 <Gonozal_VIII> but it could bypass the battery if there is energy available or something like that^^ 01:41:16 <Bjarni> yeah 01:41:35 <Bjarni> the power supply is usually a perfect sine curve 01:41:43 <Bjarni> the output from the battery is not 01:42:00 <Bjarni> it makes the computer CPU buzz :s 01:42:07 <ln-> UPSes aren't exactly expensive either 01:42:10 *** orudge` [~orudge@201.39.95.8] has joined #openttd 01:42:13 *** mode/#openttd [+o orudge`] by ChanServ 01:42:30 <Bjarni> a single UPS for common use is way cheaper than even a cheap computer 01:42:33 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B77DAA.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:42:37 *** DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-98-88-121.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:42:48 <Bjarni> and when you upgrade your computer you can keep the UPS 01:43:01 <Gonozal_VIII> remove the transformer from the pc and attach the battery directly... 01:43:05 <Bjarni> the battery usually lasts 6 years if you aren't using it much 01:43:34 <Bjarni> Gonozal_VIII: I wondered about that but it would void the warranty 01:43:43 <Bjarni> there is no DC output on the UPS either 01:43:59 <ln-> and considering how short most power outages are -- only 1 to 2 seconds -- even an old battery does fine. 01:44:09 <Gonozal_VIII> or use a laptop... 01:44:14 <Bjarni> having an UPS rocks. I got so tired of disconnecting the computer every time we had thunder 01:44:33 <Gonozal_VIII> i never do that... 01:44:56 <Bjarni> I know a guy who lost a computer due to lightning 01:45:06 <Gonozal_VIII> i would attach the modem and router to the ups^^ 01:45:10 <Bjarni> the lightning hit the power cables and travelled into the computer and fried everything 01:45:26 <Gonozal_VIII> all power cables are underground in my town 01:45:27 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> i would attach the modem and router to the ups^^ <-- I already did that 01:45:36 <Bjarni> and used it to contact the power company when the power died 01:45:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, wood output reduced drastically, i had to take 3 trains out of the cycle 01:45:58 <Gonozal_VIII> we have a telephone that works without power 01:46:01 <Gonozal_VIII> just in case^^ 01:46:24 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> all power cables are underground in my town <-- but not the transformer. You aren't 100% secured 01:46:58 <Bjarni> besides I bought the UPS before they put the cables into the ground here 01:47:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> we thought about putting up a diesel powered generator 01:47:08 <Bjarni> me too 01:47:13 <Gonozal_VIII> transformer is 5km away... i don't think the lightning would travel that far and end up in our house 01:47:16 <Bjarni> I even looked at one 01:47:30 <Bjarni> and decided that it shouldn't be that one 01:47:51 <glx> <Gonozal_VIII> we have a telephone that works without power <-- we had that, but now we have IP-Phone 01:47:52 <Bjarni> it was brand new but I couldn't tell who made it so I asked the shop and guess what: 01:47:58 <Bjarni> it was a trading secret 01:48:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, we have the fuel for the heating anyway 01:48:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> we wouldn't need another tank, just the generator next to the boiler 01:48:32 <Gonozal_VIII> it's one of those phones where you have to put your finger through a hole in a wheel and spin it :-) 01:48:56 <Bjarni> ohh... you would use the light oil (used for heating) for the generator? 01:49:01 <Bjarni> that's banned here 01:49:14 <glx> I still have this kind of phone, but can't use it now 01:49:17 <Bjarni> you are allowed to use diesel for heating though 01:49:39 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> it's one of those phones where you have to put your finger through a hole in a wheel and spin it :-) <-- I have some of those too 01:49:48 <Gonozal_VIII> some? 01:50:05 <Bjarni> and I know one who stopped using one because it generated so much noise that it killed the ADSL 01:50:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> i'm not sure what you call "light oil", but it's the same consistence as diesel, except the colour 01:50:09 <Bjarni> well... two I think 01:50:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> i know it's forbidden to power cars with heating oil, but i don't know about generators 01:50:49 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause3: it's light oil considering the alternative is fuel oil and you can use a shovel to move that. It's tar like 01:51:16 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause3: I think they included all stuff that's officially diesel powered 01:51:51 <Bjarni> you see the difference between the heating oil and diesel is that the heating oil is not as pure and not taxed that hard 01:51:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> shovel? no, that's not what we have in the basement 01:52:20 <Gonozal_VIII> fuel oil 01:52:54 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:52:59 <Gonozal_VIII> btw you can move water with a shovel too... 01:53:05 <Bjarni> there is an oil powered steam locomotive in Germany that is brought to pressure by burning wood. Then it uses the steam to heat up the oil and once the oil is at least 50°C they can start pumping it to the firebox 01:53:06 <Gonozal_VIII> i have to do that a lot 01:53:09 <orudge`> Over here in Britain, you get "red diesel", which is basically the same as normal diesel, but is used for agricultural things (and is not taxed so highly). I think something similar is done for heating oil 01:53:10 <Gonozal_VIII> it sucks 01:53:10 <Bjarni> they have to heat it first 01:53:21 <Bjarni> or else it's too thick for pumping 01:53:48 <Gonozal_VIII> they do that with salt 01:54:00 <Bjarni> heat it with steam? 01:54:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> orudge`: "heating oil" is coloured red here, "diesel" is coloured green 01:54:09 <Bjarni> or colour it? 01:54:13 <Gonozal_VIII> they put iron oxide in to make it red and sell it cheaper for ice removal on roads 01:54:27 <Bjarni> heating oil is coloured green here and diesel isn't coloured 01:54:42 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 01:54:50 <Bjarni> I think 01:54:52 <Gonozal_VIII> diesel is green? 01:55:00 <Gonozal_VIII> didn't know that 01:55:01 <orudge`> I learned the other day that diesel is banned in Brazil in cars. It's allowed in trucks, etc, though 01:55:15 <Bjarni> that's interesting 01:55:21 <Gonozal_VIII> and no, i won't put diesel in my car just to see if it's green 01:55:38 <orudge`> I think there's some EU directive that wants to harmonise colourings in diesel, etc 01:55:51 <orudge`> or so wikipedia told me, if memory serves correctly 01:55:57 <Bjarni> if diesel is green in Germany and heating oil is green in Denmark because if they think you are cheating they will check the tank on your car for green liquid 01:56:08 <Bjarni> and if they find any then you are considered a cheater 01:56:35 <Gonozal_VIII> solution: don't drive to denmark 01:56:42 <Bjarni> sounds like it 01:56:52 <Bjarni> but that's stupid that they picked colours like that 01:57:07 <orudge`> as long as none of you dye regular car diesel red, I guess 01:57:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> i guess it's a different kind of green 01:57:14 <orudge`> :p 01:57:27 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause3: hopefully 01:57:48 <Gonozal_VIII> black :-) 01:57:55 <Bjarni> liquid coal 01:57:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> i learned that one liter of red heating oil can dye thousands of liters of diesel red 01:58:15 <Bjarni> some Australian once designed a steam locomotive to use liquid coal 01:58:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> so when you cheated once with heating oil, you can see that even after several regular refills 01:58:28 <Gonozal_VIII> liquid coal wtf 01:58:29 <Bjarni> it was never built because nobody could figure out how to produce liquid coal 01:58:36 <Gonozal_VIII> hehehe 01:58:42 <Gonozal_VIII> that sucks^^ 01:58:50 <Eddi|zuHause3> i learned that coal sublimes 01:59:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> i.e goes directly from solid to gas when you heat it 01:59:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> (without ability to burn) 01:59:29 <Bjarni> sounds right 01:59:40 <Bjarni> you heat it up and burn the gasses that escapes from it 01:59:44 <Gonozal_VIII> and when you cool it down you get coal crystals? 01:59:45 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 01:59:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: coal crystals = diamonds 02:00:06 <Bjarni> cool 02:00:08 <Bjarni> I got to try that 02:00:09 <Gonozal_VIII> different structure... 02:00:16 <Gonozal_VIII> sp3 hybrid :-) 02:00:20 <Bjarni> damn 02:00:46 <Bjarni> btw you really burn the gasses in the coal 02:01:00 <Gonozal_VIII> but usually stuff that goes directly from gas to solid forms crystals 02:01:11 <Bjarni> if you dig up coal and let it lie on the ground for a while before using it then the gasses will escape and you can't get the expected heat from it 02:01:34 <Bjarni> I know of two cases where steam locomotives got problems burning old coal 02:01:48 <Gonozal_VIII> [03:00:46] Bjarni: btw you really burn the gasses in the coal <-- you make it sound like you ONLY burn the gasses... carbon burns fine too 02:02:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: but not solid carbon, you have to break out the carbon from the structure 02:03:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> the main problem here is the initial energy it takes to get the coal structure to break up 02:03:13 <Gonozal_VIII> yes... i guess if the engine design bases on those gasses to start the fire it's a bad thing 02:03:31 <Eddi|zuHause3> which is the old coal problem bjarni mentioned 02:03:33 <Bjarni> I saw an locomotive (I think it was called ACE3000). It was designed to burn the coal to CO and then at a different place in the firebox it added more oxygen and burned the CO to CO2 02:03:35 <Gonozal_VIII> that's the reason for the 15% gas in e85 02:03:40 <Bjarni> that's another engine they never built 02:04:14 <Gonozal_VIII> what would be the use of that? 02:04:17 <Eddi|zuHause3> Bjarni: trucks used that method to get fuel from wood after WWII 02:04:25 <Bjarni> after? 02:04:30 <Bjarni> we used it during the war 02:04:38 <Bjarni> even for trains :) 02:04:47 <Gonozal_VIII> why for trains? 02:04:53 <Gonozal_VIII> doesn't matter how it burns there 02:04:54 <Bjarni> also for trains 02:04:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, during times of lack of regular fuel ;) 02:05:24 <Bjarni> the big trains used coal and the small ones that used oil could be converted 02:06:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: problem is that you can't get wood or coal into engines built for burning oil 02:06:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> where oil= diesel or gasoline 02:06:36 <Bjarni> the principle is pretty simple. You have a fire with a lot of air that heats up some wood that burns with very little air (those two chambers are not connected but heat can move between them) and then you get CO from the low air fire 02:06:50 <Eddi|zuHause3> so you fire up the wood in a separate place, with lack of oxygen, get CO which you can compress and feed the engine 02:06:51 <Bjarni> it cuts the engine max output in half compared to if it uses petrol 02:07:23 <Bjarni> Eddi|zuHause3: basically yes 02:08:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, the effectivity gradient can't be very good ;) 02:08:16 <Bjarni> when burning C to CO it releases 30% of the energy and the remaining 70% are released when burning CO to CO2 02:08:23 <Gonozal_VIII> i guess how much the output is reduced depends on how much of the heat can escape 02:09:18 <Gonozal_VIII> at least 30% then... 02:09:33 *** Osai^zZz is now known as Osai^zZz`off 02:09:39 <Bjarni> <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, the effectivity gradient can't be very good ;) <-- it got nothing to do with the effectivity gradient. The engine can't supply more than half it's power when supplied with enough CO simply because CO is a worse fuel than petrol 02:10:10 <Bjarni> the engine don't care how much energy you waste when producing CO 02:10:19 <Gonozal_VIII> should have used alcohol instead :-) 02:11:46 <fjb> Ups, action 0 with a size of 25k. 02:12:08 <Gonozal_VIII> wtf? 02:12:24 <fjb> In newstations grf. 02:12:52 <fjb> 26 * 20509 00 04 01 01 05 09 FF E0 ... 02:13:04 <Gonozal_VIII> now that's some coding style^^ 02:13:24 <Gonozal_VIII> btw it's 20,5k 02:13:46 <fjb> Oh, ok. Then it looks much easier. 02:14:21 <Bjarni> <Gonozal_VIII> should have used alcohol instead :-) <-- but alcohol were in short supply as well 02:14:47 <fjb> Even better: 34 * 58269 00 04 01 01 11 09 02:14:54 <Gonozal_VIII> wtf 02:15:41 <Gonozal_VIII> sure you didn't do something wrong with the decoding? 02:16:13 <fjb> grfcodec -t -p 2 -d newstatsw.grf 02:16:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> why -t? 02:16:29 <Gonozal_VIII> what's -t? 02:16:55 <fjb> Because it gave me lots of strange characters without. 02:16:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> if -t does what i think it does, it is bad 02:17:06 <Bjarni> http://www.toyota.co.jp/Museum/data_e/images/a03_14_2_11.jpg <-- finally found a picture of a generator. It's the horizontal metal thingie. The lower part were the fire with the high supply of air. The top were the low supply of air. Every 30 km (or less) they had to add more wood to the top and once they opened it a whole lot of smoke and CO went strait into their faces 02:17:18 <fjb> -t Disable decoding of plain text characters as strings. 02:17:18 <Gonozal_VIII> strange characters are norma 02:17:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> -t prevents the conversion of strings into readable format 02:17:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> fjb: try nforenum 02:18:20 <Gonozal_VIII> yay, co is healthy 02:19:02 <Gonozal_VIII> attaches itself to the blood and keeps it from transporting oxygen 02:19:39 <Gonozal_VIII> and everybody knows that oxygen plays a key role in aging 02:19:59 <fjb> But the action 0s stay that big, even if I don't use -t... 02:20:25 <Gonozal_VIII> i guess there's a lot of text in them 02:20:40 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm 02:20:48 <Gonozal_VIII> or not.. 02:20:53 <fjb> That doesn't look like text. 02:21:10 <fjb> Looks like ordinary nfo code. 02:21:19 <Bjarni> goodnight 02:21:21 *** Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46c2b.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:21:25 <Gonozal_VIII> night 02:21:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, it just contains a lot of data 02:21:30 <Gonozal_VIII> 2l8 02:21:40 <Eddi|zuHause3> i don't see the problem in that... 02:21:41 <fjb> Oh, that was too much for Bjarni. 02:21:44 <Gonozal_VIII> he should have splitted that... 02:21:53 <Gonozal_VIII> buuuut 02:21:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> why would he? 02:22:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's not meant for anyone to read 02:22:21 <fjb> So what action puts the sprites together? 02:22:31 <Gonozal_VIII> my idea for the map array that i talked about having earlier today goes in the same direction 02:22:42 <fjb> I think he is using some macros. 02:22:48 <Gonozal_VIII> some nfo in the map^^ 02:23:30 <Gonozal_VIII> number of things in that tile... and then it reads them 02:23:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: variable sized data doesn't fit into arrays very well... 02:24:03 <Gonozal_VIII> the array has only a pointer for every tile 02:24:23 <fjb> Oh, it must be somewhere in that action 00s... 02:24:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> of course, but having pointers defeats most of the advantages of having an array 02:24:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> fjb: i would suggest reading http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action0Stations 02:24:52 <Gonozal_VIII> you have to keep those pointers somewhere^^ 02:25:34 <Gonozal_VIII> and then that pointer leads somewhere telling that the tile contains x things 02:25:49 <Gonozal_VIII> and it starts reading those x things 02:26:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: the biggest advantage of having arrays is allocating in one step and caching big areas of continuous data, that is likely to influence your local calculations 02:26:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> pointers remove both these advantages 02:27:19 <Tefad> rawr why'd those jalapenos have to be so fresh on my sandwich 02:27:22 <Tefad> my mouth, it burns. 02:27:30 <Gonozal_VIII> i don't know enough about the data types available in c++ 02:27:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: it doesn't have much to do with C++ 02:27:54 <Tefad> STL has vectors queues deques... 02:29:23 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: I'm already reading it. Understanding everything and mathing it with the hexcode in the grf is the problem. 02:30:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> fjb: inserting newlines and comments usually helps 02:31:15 <fjb> And I should really try to make an own grf to understand more about it. 02:31:29 <Gonozal_VIII> anyways... the pointer of each tile in the array would point to a array for that tile, those arrays consist of 1 - x fields with 8 bit each 02:32:08 <Gonozal_VIII> how many fields depends on how many "things" are stacked there and the type of those 02:33:06 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Did you think about how much memory one pointer requires? 02:33:13 *** Wilberforce [ad@hoinarylup.boodydaahh.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 02:33:51 <Gonozal_VIII> so you have 4 million pointers in a 2*2k map then... who cares? 02:34:09 <Tefad> 8-16MB 02:34:19 <Tefad> wait i'm off by a factor of two 02:34:24 <Tefad> 16-32MB 02:34:27 <fjb> Each pointer is 4 to 8 bytes long. 02:34:55 <Gonozal_VIII> memory is really not a problem... 02:35:05 <Tefad> depends on the platform 02:35:34 <fjb> Too much for embedded platforms. 02:35:42 <Gonozal_VIII> can't run such a big map anyways 02:36:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> the problem is not memory 02:36:30 <Eddi|zuHause3> the problem is that the data the pointers point to are fractioned all across the memory 02:36:37 <fjb> And you always have to derefence each pointer. 02:36:40 <Eddi|zuHause3> so the caching effects go "flöten" 02:36:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> and caching can easily make a speed factor of 20-100 02:37:34 <Gonozal_VIII> what always fjb? 02:37:44 <Gonozal_VIII> you don't change the map all the time 02:37:57 <Gonozal_VIII> most of the time it's only read 02:38:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> imagine a tileloop like the ones used for station catchment area 02:38:42 <fjb> Even each time you read a tile you have to follow that pointer. 02:38:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> you have like a 20x20 area of tiles that you walk each time 02:39:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> in a normal array, you can get these cached 02:39:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> so you have one big memory access 02:39:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> and all the others only access the fast cache 02:39:26 <Gonozal_VIII> why can't you cache pointers? 02:39:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> if you have pointers, the data the pointers point to is completely randomly distributed 02:39:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> so in the worst case, each pointer access causes a cache miss 02:40:18 <fjb> You can cache the pointer, but not all the memory regoins where the data is located that the pointer is pointing at. 02:40:48 <Gonozal_VIII> that's only one array... that shouldn't be scattered all around 02:41:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> the array is not scattered 02:41:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> but you have to malloc each pointer individually 02:41:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> and each of these mallocs can return a random memory location 02:42:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> you have no guarantee that the data of tile x is in close proximity of the data of tile x+1 02:42:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> especially if you realloc space in case the tile changes 02:42:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> like if the tile was empty, and used few memory, then there is a house built, and it uses much memory 02:42:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> you need to realloc for the larger memory space 02:43:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> but that new data doesn't fit in the old memory "window" 02:43:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> so you need a place where you have big memory free 02:43:19 <Gonozal_VIII> yes then it's somewhere else... but does it really take so long to access a pointer? 02:43:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> at completely different location of the previous 02:43:24 *** zrah_ [~zakrahman@88-107-244-13.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:43:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, like i said 02:43:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> cache misses take often 20 to 100 times longer 02:43:55 *** helb_ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd 02:43:56 *** helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:44:09 <fjb> Going from 4GHz to 400Mhz. :-) 02:44:41 <fjb> And additional overhead. 02:44:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> you not only have to fetch the data from the slow memory 02:45:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> but also the cache will get a whole cache line (like 64kb) instead of that 10 byte you ordered 02:45:48 <Gonozal_VIII> hardware sucks... 02:46:01 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Invent something better. 02:46:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> it gets worse if you hit virtual memory 02:46:44 <Eddi|zuHause3> that makes a speed loss of like factor 1000000 ;) 02:46:47 <fjb> Oh yeah... 02:47:11 <fjb> Swapping is fun. 02:47:26 <Gonozal_VIII> so basically the map array is stuck at being an array? 02:47:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, two arrays actually ;) 02:47:47 <fjb> It has some advantages if it stays an array. 02:47:48 <Gonozal_VIII> lots of arrays... 02:48:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: it is feasible if you divide the map into "supertiles" of like 16x16 or so 02:48:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> and then have pointers between these 02:48:35 <fjb> And I'm giving up on tht newstations grf. 02:49:58 <Gonozal_VIII> abuse array space of different tiles^^ 02:50:34 <Gonozal_VIII> tiles that get too long store part of their information in other tiles^^ 02:51:05 <fjb> And if that tile changes? 02:51:09 <Gonozal_VIII> gets messy if the other... 02:51:12 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 02:51:40 <Gonozal_VIII> hashing^^ 02:52:16 <fjb> Then you end up with pointers again. 02:52:21 <Gonozal_VIII> nah 02:52:27 <Gonozal_VIII> just some rules where to look 02:52:36 <Gonozal_VIII> inside the same array 02:52:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> you can get cache misses inside the same array 02:53:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> not the whole array fits into the cache 02:53:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> the whole point of a cache is LOCAL access 02:53:29 *** planetmaker [~chatzilla@Fd164.f.ppp-pool.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox 2.0.0.11/2007112718]] 02:53:38 <Gonozal_VIII> doesn't have to split the stuff through the whole array 02:53:51 <Gonozal_VIII> like your 64*64 thing 02:54:03 <Gonozal_VIII> 16*16^^ 02:54:41 <Eddi|zuHause3> the problem with your attempt is that if you e.g. have a house in a tile, and want to swap data to near tiles, the near tiles are most likely houses, too 02:55:08 <Gonozal_VIII> houses are no problem, houses fit in 02:55:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> houses are currently the biggest tiles 02:55:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> so instead you should have a 16x16 array of basic data 02:55:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> and if you have a house you create a new 16x16 array of house specific data 02:56:14 <Gonozal_VIII> but a tile that has for example a maglev track with owner 1 on one corner, monorail with owner 2 on second, different signal on each tile, a tunnel with signals below and a bridge with signals above won't fit^^ 02:56:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> or if you have a subway layer, you are likely to have subway tiles in the near area, too 02:57:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> so you open a new 16x16 array of subway tiles, which are the same as rail tiles 02:57:50 <Gonozal_VIII> and that's not inefficient? pointer again... 02:58:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's only 1/256 amount of pointers 02:58:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> you only need one pointer per 16x16 area 02:58:31 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm yes... 02:58:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's a tradeoff, less pointers, for possibly more "unused" memory space 02:59:20 <Gonozal_VIII> you should make that a compile option :-) 02:59:31 <Gonozal_VIII> big or small base array 02:59:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> the main point is to keep the locality principle 02:59:36 *** De_Ghost [~s@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd 02:59:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> if you want to cycle nearby tiles, you need to stay in the same cache row 03:00:14 <Gonozal_VIII> i don't know anything about cache rows 03:00:35 <De_Ghost> they are like magical elfs 03:00:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> 16x16 supertiles possibly do that even better than the whole map, because the map has that locality only in one dimension 03:00:54 <Gonozal_VIII> i know 03:01:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> but it complicates memory management 03:02:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> because for a tile access you can't have a simple arithmetics anymore (start+index*itemsize) 03:02:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> but you have to find out, in which supertile your tile is, and then also which layer of that supertile 03:03:42 <Gonozal_VIII> shouldn't be too hard to calculate that 03:03:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> not, hard, but slower 03:08:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: it is quite probable that smatz already did such a thing with his tunnel patch 03:09:00 *** orudge` [~orudge@201.39.95.8] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 03:09:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> i didn't actually look at it 03:09:52 <Gonozal_VIII> with dynamic space you could do all kinds of fancy things... 03:10:37 <Gonozal_VIII> can't even imagine all the possibilities 03:11:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, everything that assumes distribution is sparsely over the map, but dense locally 03:11:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> it is entirely feasible that you have a map layer for each company 03:12:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> which means you can reduce the saving of "owner" bits in the map 03:12:12 <Gonozal_VIII> :-) 03:12:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> as this is done implicitly 03:12:37 *** orudge` [~orudge@201.39.95.8] has joined #openttd 03:12:37 *** mode/#openttd [+o orudge`] by ChanServ 03:13:40 <Gonozal_VIII> would be no problem to have for example crossings with tracks of a different company... and different tracktype even 03:14:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, it will complicate "compatibility" checks 03:14:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> as you have to cycle all defined layers for this tile 03:15:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> to get an idea what is actually currently on this tile 03:15:15 <Gonozal_VIII> only for placing rail... you do that once 03:15:31 <Eddi|zuHause3> also for drawing 03:15:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> you do that often 03:15:49 <Gonozal_VIII> drawing has to access all layers anyways 03:16:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> or for pathfinder access, which gives penalties for road crossings 03:17:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> but honestly, i would suggest you to read smatz's patch first 03:17:47 <Gonozal_VIII> all that pointers are bad stuff makes me a sad gono 03:18:45 <Gonozal_VIII> also i have a test in about 6h.... 03:18:51 <Gonozal_VIII> software engineering 03:19:02 <Gonozal_VIII> should probably be sleeping 03:19:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> software engineering does not teach much about the efficiency of pointers ;) 03:19:58 <Gonozal_VIII> nope 03:20:14 <orudge`> hm, my last exam was software engineering. Went better than I expected 03:20:22 <fjb> But you should be sleeping anyway. 03:20:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> all you need to know is the waterfall model and the V model, and one or two design patterns 03:21:49 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 03:22:03 <Gonozal_VIII> not to forget the spiral model... 03:22:13 * Belugas congrats orudge 03:22:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> only if you want to get 1.0 and impress the professor ;) 03:22:32 <Gonozal_VIII> our professors improved that one... so i'm quite sure that will come... 03:23:07 <orudge`> well, have to wait for the results now :p 03:23:30 <Gonozal_VIII> i should have learned instead of coding... 03:23:41 <Eddi|zuHause3> you have seveal proffessors working on the same subject? 03:23:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> +r-f 03:24:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> or rather s/al prof/ral pro/ 03:24:48 <Gonozal_VIII> two... 03:27:37 <Gonozal_VIII> night.... 03:27:56 <Belugas> orudge: 1) you performed 2) you were prepared enough to find it easier 03:28:05 <Belugas> makes it a pretty good sing in my book :) 03:28:09 <Belugas> sign 03:31:33 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:34:47 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r12018 /trunk/src/ (main_gui.cpp transparency_gui.cpp tree_cmd.cpp): -Fix(FS#1721,r9563): Restore initial intent on the invisible tree while transparent building patch setting 03:36:23 *** Gonozal_VIII [user@cm56-182-132.liwest.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:36:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have a diesel/electric mismatch 03:37:08 <orudge`> Belugas: true, we'll just have to see ;) 03:37:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have around the same electric local trains as diesel local trains 03:37:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have around half electric long distance trains as diesel long distance trains 03:37:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> but i have twice as many electric freight trains as diesel freight trains 03:39:08 *** TinoM| [~Tino@i59F5737D.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:43:50 * Belugas is gone sleeping 03:43:51 <Belugas> see you 03:47:19 <orudge`> ta at 03:47:21 <orudge`> *ta 03:55:00 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: Why do you care for that? 03:55:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> care for what? 03:55:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's a statistical oddity 03:57:07 <fjb> Electric trains are often more powerful. 03:57:23 <fjb> What train set are you using? 03:58:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> DBSetXL 04:00:08 <fjb> I guess I would have even more electric locomotives with that set. 04:01:30 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, it's kind of a problem that diesels do not have as much diversity 04:02:36 <fjb> I don't see that as a problem. Diesels are for branch lines and not yet electrified main lines. 04:03:05 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 04:03:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, but at almost any time there is a differentiation for local electrics, long distance electrics and freight electrics 04:03:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> but only one diesel engine 04:04:34 <fjb> In which year is your game? 04:04:39 <Eddi|zuHause3> and "realistically" only a small part of the system should be electrified in the early times 04:04:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> i am 1967 right now 04:05:12 <fjb> Then you should have the V100 and V200. 04:05:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, i know which engines i have ;) 04:05:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> but V100 is only suitible for slightly used branch lines 04:06:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> i hardly have any of those 04:06:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> (very few towns, very few industries) 04:06:15 <fjb> There were not that more diesels in reality beside the shunters. 04:07:10 <fjb> V200 for fast trains, V100 for local service. 04:07:44 <fjb> Heavy freight trains were still hauled by steam engines. 04:08:03 <fjb> Or electric engines ofcourse. 04:08:10 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F552D3.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 04:08:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> i got rid of all steam engines by now 04:08:38 <fjb> They are expensive to use. 04:08:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> i use V100 for "collecting" freight trains, and a few side line local passenger trains 04:09:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> V200 for local trains on main lines, express passenger trains and "delivering" freight trains on main lines 04:09:34 <fjb> I tried to talk MB into adding some more diesels or BR 23 for the 50s and early 60s. 04:10:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> i think i read that 04:10:22 <fjb> There is a gap for branch lines before the V100 comes out. 04:10:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, i noticed that 04:10:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> the V140 disappears very fast 04:11:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> and has very short lifetime 04:11:32 <fjb> V80 would be nice. Or even starting earlier V36. That could be used in double traktion. 04:11:44 <Eddi|zuHause3> only like 15 years compared to the ~45 years of most other engines 04:12:01 <fjb> V140 is crap. It was only experimental and not used in reality. 04:12:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, but it is a diesel engine, and it is available ;) 04:12:22 <fjb> It was a proof of concept, only one build. 04:12:40 <fjb> But it is not that useful in the game. 04:12:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> to my understanding, only the war stopped a series ordering of that engine 04:13:50 <fjb> Yes, but the V140 would have to be modified for the big orders. And it would have been longer availlable in the set then. 04:14:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> and, not everything must be 100% realistic, there are also gameplay issues to balance 04:14:26 <fjb> There could be a better usable machine with that few ids that TTD has. 04:15:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> but V140 could be used on branch lines until V100 comes out 04:15:01 <fjb> V140 was not production ready in real and it is too short availlable in game. 04:15:37 *** GoneWacko [~gonewacko@dhcp-077-249-197-241.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: You just lost the game] 04:15:37 <fjb> But you can not buy one when you need one. Try to buy a machine for branch lines 1960. 04:15:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> and i have no real use for VT 95, because passenger amounts even in villages is too big 04:16:28 <fjb> VT 95 is nice to get a line started, or for the passenger destinations patch. 04:16:40 <fjb> And you can buy it longer. 04:17:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> but the physics engine does not like VT 95 + undriven Trailer 04:17:09 <fjb> But what du you use on a branch line when you have to pull a freight train in 1960? 04:17:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> it can't even get to max speed 04:17:40 <fjb> Start downhill. :-) 04:18:27 <fjb> Did the V95 have an undriven trailer? Hm, maybe it had one. Or was that also driven? 04:19:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> MB's site says traditionally it had one driven and one undriven part 04:19:44 <Eddi|zuHause3> and the later series could be steered from the undriven wagon 04:20:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> anyway, i have a branch line featuring VT 95 in quadruple-traction ;) 04:21:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> (replaced BR 38 + 2-axle wagons) 04:21:28 <fjb> Don't let MB catch you. 04:22:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> why? i have seen such trains 04:22:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> trains consisting of 4 or more "railbusses" 04:22:28 <fjb> I would vote for V80 and BR 23 to add to the set. 04:22:40 <fjb> But that were not VT95. 04:22:59 <Eddi|zuHause3> unlikely, yes, as they were in east germany ;) 04:23:01 <fjb> VT98 maybe. 04:23:10 <fjb> :-) 04:25:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> VT 11 is available very short... 04:26:02 <fjb> MB said they are availlable longer in TTDP. 04:27:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, i have a feeling that OTTD has shorter availability times than are stated in the readme 04:27:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> my oldest engines i have are some ET 87 and E 16 04:28:15 <fjb> Frosch said that OpenTTD follows the specs. So the specs are wrong or TTDP has a bug. 04:28:24 <fjb> E16 is nice. 04:29:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> E 16 is nice, but it doesn't have nice liveries for long distance trains, not even mitropa wagons 04:29:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> and there isn't E 18 to make up for that 04:30:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> so E 10 is the first real long distance electric engine 04:30:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> and that's a damn long time 04:30:38 <fjb> E18 is in version 0.9 of that set. 04:30:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, but do you have version 0.9 of that set? ;) 04:31:15 <fjb> E16 is also for long distance. And the trains at that time were green, at every distance. 04:31:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, green, sure, but that red wagon inbetween makes the difference ;) 04:31:57 <fjb> No, only a few betatesters have. And I have the feeling we don't see version 0.9 this year. 04:34:08 <fjb> Coding that hex codes lasts ages. I don't know if MB uses some preprozessor and macros. But I almost doubt it so fluent how he is in nfo. 04:35:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> i think i have more E 94 than E 50 04:35:53 <fjb> Hm, takes ages. 04:36:07 <fjb> E94 are cheaper. 04:36:28 <fjb> I tried to talk MB into BR151. 04:36:55 <Eddi|zuHause3> what is that? 04:37:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> apart from a freigt engine ;) 04:37:53 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498DF4A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:38:42 *** mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498D64C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 04:39:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> i only know the east german 251, which was a 25kV/50Hz engine for the RÃŒbelandbahn 04:40:17 <fjb> It is the successor of BR 150. 04:40:25 <fjb> It is still in wide use. 04:40:57 <fjb> Kind of a freight version of BR 103. 04:41:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> the RÃŒbelandbahn stopped using electric traction 04:41:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> i guess mainly because of the decline of the industry in the area 04:41:21 <fjb> I know, I read about it. 04:41:57 <Eddi|zuHause3> the last thing i heard was that the engines should be sold to romania or something 04:43:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> there is not much use for a 25kV engine in germany ;) 04:43:57 <fjb> They have an unsual electric system as far as I know. 04:44:02 <fjb> :-) 04:45:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, the RÃŒbelandbahn was very far away from the usual electric rail system, so it couldn't be fed with 15kV and 16 2/3 Hz, so they took 25kV/50Hz from the local power station 04:46:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> i think i went once with that train 04:46:46 <fjb> That was the easy part. But all locomotives had to be modified. 04:47:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> not modified, they built new engines 04:47:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> they used steam engines before 04:49:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> i think they still have one such steam engine in RÃŒbeland 04:49:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> and they kept two electric engines in Blankenburg 04:49:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> (other end of that track) 04:50:15 <fjb> But they didn't make a completely new engine design. 04:51:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, i don't know the specifics 04:51:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> but it would be a stupid thing to do ;) 04:52:01 <Eddi|zuHause3> besides, other countries built 25kV/50Hz engines previously 04:52:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's not like it's a new technology 04:53:02 <Eddi|zuHause3> 16 2/3 Hz was originally used to reduce sparks in the engines 04:53:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> with newer technology, that was unnecessary 04:53:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> only by then it was too late to switch all existing engines to 50Hz 04:54:04 *** orudge` [~orudge@201.39.95.8] has quit [Quit: zzz] 04:59:14 <fjb> 16 2/3 Hz technology is kind of a problem today. 05:01:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> there was kind of a funny issue, the phase-modificators wouldn't work when they got too close to 16 2/3, so it was changed to 16,7 instead ;) 05:01:55 <fjb> :-) 05:02:26 <fjb> There is no processor with 666 MHz. 05:03:13 *** gfldex_ [~dex@dslb-088-074-163-084.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 05:04:20 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 05:05:03 *** gfldex [~dex@dslb-088-074-164-053.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:05:55 <fjb> Hm, I'm unable to paint isometric graphics in gimp. 05:06:45 <Eddi|zuHause3> i'd use vector graphics and export them 05:07:39 <fjb> I'm trying now. That looks mouch easier. But how will it loke like in TTD size? 05:07:46 <fjb> look 05:09:38 <fjb> Inkskape uses Gimp palettes. That saves some work. 05:10:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> downscaling will cause problems, i am pretty sure of that ;) 05:11:17 <fjb> How big is a tile? 64 x 32 pixels? 05:11:44 <Eddi|zuHause3> might be 05:14:28 <fjb> So I could take a pictures all vour sides of a nice building, apply them to some rectagles, transform them to the isometric view and then scale them down to 50 x 25 pixels. :-) 05:14:34 <fjb> four 05:15:27 *** Osai^zZz`off is now known as Osai 05:23:00 <fjb> Good night. 05:23:25 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F96B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:33:08 *** Sogard [~Sogard@ip24-251-252-143.ph.ph.cox.net] has joined #openttd 05:46:03 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-184-90-23.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:49:33 *** DJ-Nekk|d [~DJNekkid@static128-249.adsl.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:00:48 *** Osai is now known as Osai`off 06:32:50 *** svippery [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 06:32:50 *** svippy [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:39:06 *** DaleStan [~Dale@pool-71-98-88-121.ipslin.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 06:40:04 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 06:41:27 *** roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 06:46:22 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: The ending changes tone & is actually quite sad - 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but it involves a scene of necrophilia, so that's just another plus in my book.....] 10:48:04 *** nzvip [~svip@192.38.109.188] has joined #openttd 10:48:18 *** muty-bg [~yassen@85.95.64.30] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:53:58 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489BBFE.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:55:16 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 11:11:37 *** muty-bg [~yassen@85.95.64.30] has joined #openttd 11:12:40 *** Hendikins|QLD is now known as Hendikins 11:28:44 *** Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-048-142.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:34:12 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:34:20 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:36:50 *** CyrusDK [~CyrusDK@2104ds1-ryv.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 11:38:10 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 11:39:06 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489EA93.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 11:39:57 *** Gekz [~brendan@124.184.90.23] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:40:12 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-184-90-23.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 11:45:53 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489F058.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:55:23 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:58:02 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has quit [Quit: The ending changes tone & is actually quite sad - but it involves a scene of necrophilia, so that's just another plus in my book.....] 12:02:46 *** Korenn [~blaat@78-27-14-50.dsl.alice.nl] has joined #openttd 12:03:17 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489D072.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:03:33 *** a1270 [~Cheese@24-117-88-79.cpe.cableone.net] has joined #openttd 12:10:27 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489EA93.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:26:44 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCB2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:27:54 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:30:38 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:31:01 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489DF1E.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:38:28 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489D072.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:40:29 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 12:40:59 <yorick> hello 12:41:07 <SmatZ> hello yorick 12:41:48 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 12:42:17 <yorick> hello brianetta 12:43:28 *** TX [~pIRCuser6@hard-soft--121.colo2.kv.wnet.ua] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:46:47 *** raimar2 [~hawk@p5489C1EE.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 12:50:30 *** shodan [user@xerxes.foocode.net] has quit [Quit: Client Exiting] 12:53:33 <Brianetta> yorick 12:53:41 <yorick> ? 12:53:51 <Brianetta> [12:42] <yorick> hello brianetta 12:54:13 <Brianetta> Simply acknowledging your presence (: 12:54:20 *** raimar3 [~hawk@p5489DF1E.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:54:37 <yorick> I just joined and you joined the next minute 12:55:35 <keyweed> hello everyone. 12:56:27 * yorick is trying to find out what the connection to mylinuxsys.net:6697 is 12:57:12 <a1270> 6697 is a common ssl IRC port. 12:57:43 <yorick> but why is stunnel connecting to it 12:58:29 <a1270> maybe for bnc? 12:58:38 <yorick> for what? 12:58:56 <SmatZ> hello keyweed 12:59:16 <SmatZ> yorick: maybe IRC server is testing your computer 12:59:28 <a1270> an IRC bouncer. Basically allows you to use a stable server as an IRC proxy. 12:59:31 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:59:53 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 13:00:03 *** nzvip [~svip@192.38.109.188] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 13:01:34 <yorick> I cant connect to it...[14:01] *** Socket Error (10053: The connection was terminated due to a time-out or other failure) 13:02:04 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:02:23 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 13:03:29 <yorick> it seems to connect to another server each time 13:03:58 <hylje> trojans!! 13:04:16 <a1270> yeah, probably just BNC(irc bouncer). 13:04:23 <yorick> k 13:04:47 <yorick> dunno why, because it isn't used only for irc 13:05:08 <yorick> used for pop3s, smtps and https 13:05:27 <a1270> yeah 13:05:34 <yorick> I have lunch now 13:05:36 <yorick> bye 13:05:46 *** yorick is now known as Yorick|AFK 13:06:16 <SmatZ> maybe open proxy check from IRC server 13:06:17 <SmatZ> http://www.quakenet.org/faq/faq.php?c=4&f=116#116 13:07:43 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 13:15:43 <a1270> mysyslinux.net is a node on oftc. Time for me to sleep. 13:22:50 *** GoneWacko [~gonewacko@dhcp-077-249-197-241.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 13:23:31 *** mindlesstux [~mindlesst@2001:470:1f07:16c:240:f4ff:fe52:a74e] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:33:10 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has joined #openttd 13:33:46 <LA[lord]> hmm.. Anyone to comment this? http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14549&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=3640#p660997 13:34:20 *** orudge` [~orudge@201.39.95.8] has joined #openttd 13:34:21 *** mode/#openttd [+o orudge`] by ChanServ 13:38:25 *** NukeBuster [~wouter@a62-251-21-79.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 13:47:12 *** glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 13:47:15 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:47:55 *** Yorick|AFK is now known as Yorick 13:55:46 *** Greysc[a]le is now known as Greyscale 13:57:22 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 13:57:43 <Gonozal_VIII> it's me! 13:57:47 <Gonozal_VIII> run! 13:57:48 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 13:58:19 * hylje sens Gonozal_VIII running 13:58:22 *** neli [micha@h8441250184.dsl.speedlinq.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:58:23 <hylje> sends* 13:59:08 <Gonozal_VIII> nooooo sports kill! 14:01:25 <Gonozal_VIII> i should rename my make.bat to break.bat.... 14:01:45 <Tefad> : D 14:03:22 <Gonozal_VIII> yay unmovables with halfdesert :D 14:03:39 <hylje> :o ? 14:04:08 <Gonozal_VIII> my patch works for all ground types now, including halfdesert :-) 14:04:55 *** neli [micha@h8441250184.dsl.speedlinq.nl] has joined #openttd 14:05:16 <Gonozal_VIII> well ok... not all, hilly and rocky get changed to flat... 14:05:26 <hylje> so 14:05:30 <hylje> what have you done 14:05:40 <Gonozal_VIII> a lot :-) 14:05:49 <Gonozal_VIII> i'll upload new patch 14:06:12 <Gonozal_VIII> yesterdays version without halfdesert is on flyspray 14:09:30 *** Tefad_ [~tefad@c-71-63-30-72.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 14:10:09 *** zrah_ [~zakrahman@88-107-244-13.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 14:11:55 <Gonozal_VIII> and new version is on flyspray too 14:12:09 <Gonozal_VIII> http://bugs.openttd.org/task/1724 14:14:26 <Eddi|zuHause3> i should start replacing those i Wagons... 14:14:36 <Gonozal_VIII> i wagons? 14:14:47 <keyweed> Apple iWagons! 14:14:48 *** Tefad [~tefad@c-71-63-30-72.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:14:48 <Gonozal_VIII> apple builds wagons now? 14:14:51 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 14:15:35 <Gonozal_VIII> i was at a train station today... 14:15:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> as opposed to ÃŒ wagons, i wagons have no protection at the connection between two wagons 14:15:46 <Gonozal_VIII> and they had two trains on the same platform! 14:15:52 <Gonozal_VIII> with signals in between! 14:16:17 <Eddi|zuHause3> signals in between? i have not seen that 14:16:20 *** ben_goodger [~ben@86.156.58.184] has joined #openttd 14:16:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> although i do have seen multiple trains per station 14:16:39 <Gonozal_VIII> platform 1a and 1b and signals 14:17:00 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, i did not specifically look for signals 14:18:14 <Eddi|zuHause3> DRG Bi Personenzugwagen braungrÃŒn 1925 40 Pass. 8 140 Typ "DonnerbÃŒchse" 14:18:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> as opposed to 14:18:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> DRG AB4ÃŒ-26 Schnellzugwagen Fernverkehr 56 Pass. 7 160 Typ "Hecht" 14:18:55 <Gonozal_VIII> and the name is related to the noise level inside? 14:19:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> A is first class 14:19:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> B is second class 14:19:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> C is third class 14:19:25 <Eddi|zuHause3> ÃŒ means "Ãbergang" 14:19:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> 26 is the building series 14:19:39 <zrah_> what does ubergang mean? 14:19:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> 4 is the number of axles 14:19:44 <Gonozal_VIII> "DonnerbÃŒchse" <-- that^^ 14:20:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> zrah_: Ãbergan means that you can go from one wagon to the next 14:20:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> +g 14:20:12 *** zrah_ is now known as zrah 14:20:32 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-124-184-90-23.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:20:36 <Gonozal_VIII> it sucks when people do that a lot in very full trains 14:20:54 <Gonozal_VIII> and you stand next to the door and have to let them pass all the time... 14:21:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> it sucks when people write in bold 14:21:26 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm? 14:21:37 <Gonozal_VIII> i write bold? 14:22:12 <Gonozal_VIII> or who? 14:22:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> "Ãbergang" as opposed to very old segmented wagons, where you could not even go from one segment to the next except when stopped at a station 14:22:14 <Yorick> [b]?[/b] 14:22:21 <Yorick> how did you write bold? 14:22:22 <glx> bold is bad 14:22:36 <Gonozal_VIII> whoooo writes bold 14:22:52 *** Ballard [~Ballard@chello062178232133.1.klafu.surfer.at] has joined #openttd 14:22:52 <Eddi|zuHause3> which was dangerous for the conductors, because they had to go outside of the wagon, while the train was driving 14:23:12 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 14:23:22 <murray> <div style="font-weight: bold;">?</div> 14:23:41 <glx> it's worse like this 14:23:55 <Gonozal_VIII> that's just two squares for me^^ 14:24:32 <Ballard> Hello i seach a howto to create a server on linux. anyone can help me?! 14:24:49 <glx> wiki is your friend :) 14:25:07 <Yorick> tell me how to write bold :) 14:25:11 <Gonozal_VIII> http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Dedicated_Servers 14:25:26 <glx> Yorick: ctrl-b 14:25:37 <Ballard> ah Thanks :) 14:25:51 <Gonozal_VIII> ctrl-k for kolour :D 14:26:50 <glx> colour is not allowed here 14:27:14 <keyweed> bah. colour. *spits* 14:27:56 <Yorick> ? 14:28:06 <Yorick> yaay 14:28:14 <Yorick> ? 14:28:19 <Gonozal_VIII> look at what i ceated people! look! http://bugs.openttd.org/task/1724 14:28:22 <Yorick> no color 14:28:23 <Forked> hide_colors = ON .. mmm irssi 14:29:18 <murray> bell_beps = ON 14:29:41 <Gonozal_VIII> for me, everything is arial bold font size 10 and black 14:30:06 <blathijs> Forked: Yeah, that's a wonderful feature. Wonder if you can hide boldness and inverted stuff as well, it's nearly as annoying.. 14:30:19 <Tefad_> client strips out color codes for me 14:30:27 <Tefad_> some IRCd can strip color with +S 14:30:35 <Tefad_> dunno if this one supports that 14:30:36 *** Tefad_ is now known as Tefad 14:30:43 <Forked> others can just deny you using colours on a channel :) 14:30:51 *** Ballard [~Ballard@chello062178232133.1.klafu.surfer.at] has quit [Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com] 14:30:54 <Tefad> +c sometimes 14:31:01 <glx> blathijs: and underline ? 14:31:10 <Yorick> works:) 14:31:10 <Gonozal_VIII> oh, i see underline 14:31:25 <Gonozal_VIII> underline 14:31:30 <Yorick> .? 14:31:38 <Yorick> italic? 14:32:05 <hylje> . 14:32:13 <Gonozal_VIII> what's italic? 14:32:21 <Tefad> weeblarghohnoeswtfer?AHH! 14:32:35 <Tefad> hmm apparently that isn't the right control code : x 14:32:40 <Tefad> 14:32:43 <Tefad> ruuuugha 14:32:44 <Yorick> bold italic underline 14:32:50 <Yorick> ctrl-I 14:32:52 <Tefad> isn't ital 14:33:00 <blathijs> Ah, hide_text_style does the trick 14:33:05 <Tefad> hehe 14:33:12 <Gonozal_VIII> how did you write that ohnoes? that's not bold for me... everything should be bold for me 14:33:13 <Eddi|zuHause3> italic isn't officially supported, afaic 14:33:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> as ^I is also the <TAB> character 14:33:43 <Tefad> hows this Gonozal_VIII? 14:33:52 * Forked puts channel on mental ignore for 30 minutes 14:33:57 <Gonozal_VIII> square followed by normal text 14:34:02 <glx> :* 14:34:11 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 14:34:12 <Tefad> that control code is rather common for IRC.. 14:34:17 <Tefad> and now? 14:34:23 <Gonozal_VIII> stop messing with fonts, look at my patch :P 14:34:26 <Eddi|zuHause3> stop it, please? 14:34:29 <Gonozal_VIII> all of you 14:34:37 <Yorick> weeblarghoh noes wtfer? 14:34:42 <Yorick> ok 14:34:54 <Yorick> nice patch? 14:34:55 <Tefad> i see ctrl+] there 14:35:07 <Gonozal_VIII> :P 14:35:12 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm5.epsilon122.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 14:35:33 <glx> <Gonozal_VIII> stop messing with fonts, look at my patch :P <-- you started it 14:35:40 <Gonozal_VIII> did not! 14:35:55 <Yorick> [15:20] <Gonozal_VIII> it sucks when people do that a lot in very full trains 14:36:02 <Yorick> 15:21] <Gonozal_VIII> i write bold? 14:36:07 <Yorick> so you did 14:36:15 <glx> [15:19:45] <Gonozal_VIII> "DonnerbÃŒchse" <-- that^^ 14:36:21 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... weird... it's 1968 and the E 10 carries TEE wagons, but the V200 cannot refit its wagons to TEE... 14:36:23 <glx> was the first line 14:36:25 <Gonozal_VIII> i still can't see that any different to the other text i wrote 14:36:37 <Gonozal_VIII> am i still writing bold? 14:36:38 <Yorick> [15:36] <+glx> [15:19:45] <Gonozal_VIII> "DonnerbÃŒchse" <-- that^^ 14:36:40 <Yorick> no 14:36:42 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: that is due to your inferior client 14:36:51 <glx> Yorick: it is bold here 14:37:09 <Yorick> Gonozal_VIII stopped writing bold... 14:38:30 * Yorick is using HydraIRC v0.3.160 (4/May/2007) - Grab it from www.HydraIRC.com 14:39:03 <Yorick> [15:36] <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: that is due to your inferior client 14:39:23 <Gonozal_VIII> he was talking to me 14:39:35 <Gonozal_VIII> i use trillian and that sucks for irc 14:39:45 <Yorick> good you know that... 14:39:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> yay for totally useless highlight (again) 14:39:59 <Andel> I use mirc 14:40:01 <Gonozal_VIII> but i don't want to use a second program just for one channel 14:40:46 <Yorick> I'm on more servers than 1... 14:41:44 * Yorick has 6 channels open :) 14:41:53 <Gonozal_VIII> i used to be too, had mirc then but now i'm only on oftc and only in this channel, no need to use seperate program (i use trillian for msn messenger and icq) 14:43:52 *** Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: Hendikins, Fujitsu 14:44:16 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F96B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 14:44:20 <fjb> Hi 14:44:25 <Gonozal_VIII> hi 14:44:50 *** Netsplit over, joins: Fujitsu, Hendikins 14:46:38 <fjb> How big is the 2D projection of a tile? 64 x 32 pixels? 14:47:14 <Tefad> 31 i think 14:47:17 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm that function getunmovableground has nothing to with unmovables... i should probably rename it to getground and move it somewhere more accessible 14:47:45 <Gonozal_VIII> then it could be used for other stuff too :-) 14:48:10 <Yorick> 64x37, I think 14:48:10 <fjb> Tefad: Is that documented anywhere? 14:48:22 <Gonozal_VIII> i wrote that function 14:48:23 <Tefad> no idea 14:48:36 <Gonozal_VIII> ah tefad^^ 14:48:59 <fjb> The projection doesn't use the mathematical correct 30°. It is more like 27°. 14:49:28 <Gonozal_VIII> you don't have any halfpixels... 14:49:46 <Gonozal_VIII> so it's probably 22,5° 14:49:57 <fjb> Or maybe that. 14:50:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's not 22,5° 14:50:28 <Gonozal_VIII> well, i don't know^^ 14:50:29 <fjb> But how many pixels heigh and wide is a tile then? 14:51:02 <Gonozal_VIII> look at a sprite.. 14:51:13 <Gonozal_VIII> btw what do you want to do? 14:51:21 *** Osai`off is now known as Osai 14:51:24 <fjb> I want to paint some things. 14:51:41 <Gonozal_VIII> use existing sprites for the dimensions 14:52:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> 26.56505118° 14:52:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> arctan(1/2) 14:52:34 <Gonozal_VIII> ok^^ 14:52:59 <Gonozal_VIII> i never liked that sin cos tan stuff 14:53:13 *** lekro [~lekro@S01060014513484ae.ss.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 14:53:19 <Gonozal_VIII> would have to remember what to use where... and my memory sucks 14:54:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> well it's 2 pixels to the side and 1 up 14:54:17 <Gonozal_VIII> i know 14:54:30 <Eddi|zuHause3> gegenkatete/ankatete -> tangens 14:54:43 <Gonozal_VIII> see... that's the stuff i can't remember 14:54:45 <fjb> So 27° wasn't that bad. 14:54:55 <Eddi|zuHause3> but isometric view uses 2 along the diagonal, and 1 up 14:55:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> gegenkatete/hypotenuse -> sin 14:55:35 <Eddi|zuHause3> makes 30° 14:55:47 <hylje> memory triangle 14:55:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> just that is bad on pixel rasters 14:57:33 <fjb> And I'm counting 64 x 32 pixels again. 14:57:49 <Gonozal_VIII> there's no perspective either, tiles are same size everywhere on the screen but that doesn't matter 14:58:28 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: That is still a king of perspective. 14:58:32 <fjb> kind 14:58:45 <ben_goodger> isometric perspective is a kind of perspective 14:58:55 <ben_goodger> you're thinking of vanishing point perspective 14:59:10 <Eddi|zuHause3> isometric is a parallel perspective 14:59:37 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's a vanishing point perspective where the "horizon" is infinitely far away 14:59:46 <Gonozal_VIII> yes yes, i've learned and drawn that... 15:00:03 <Gonozal_VIII> i'm just saying that the view is not realistic 15:00:13 <ben_goodger> of course it's not, it's isometric 15:00:14 <Gonozal_VIII> and it doesn't matter 15:00:49 <Gonozal_VIII> you would need flat eyes as big as the map to see it like that^^ 15:00:57 <fjb> But it matters how big things are if you try to paint them. 15:01:00 <ben_goodger> if it were realistic it'd have to be done with realtime-rendered polygons, and I doubt even chris sawyer could have written that sort of thing 15:01:25 <Belugas> fick realism 15:01:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> if you want "real" perspective, you need a sophisticated 3D rendering engine 15:01:44 <ben_goodger> precisely 15:02:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> afaik there was like a PS2 version that did that 15:02:12 <ben_goodger> the new 32 bit graphics are quite realistic in their way 15:02:37 <Gonozal_VIII> now i'll try to get coast grapics :-) 15:02:52 <fjb> Gonozal_VIII: Paint them. 15:03:09 <Gonozal_VIII> not get them in that sense 15:03:18 <Gonozal_VIII> get them to be drawn under unmovables 15:03:39 <fjb> Ah 15:04:06 <Gonozal_VIII> there's no desert coast and no snowy coast, right? 15:04:15 <fjb> And I'm trying to paint a building. Thought that wouls be easiest to begin with. 15:04:48 <LA[lord]> Gonozal_VIII: right 15:04:59 <ben_goodger> does anyone actually play the desert/snowy climates? 15:06:25 * fjb did. 15:06:29 <LA[lord]> arghh.. maybe I shouldn't have picked the combined roadset to code for opengfx+ right now.. I havent't made any actionA nor realsprites yet and it is already as big as this http://pastebin.com/m3d40cc20 Only skipping sprites engine there :P 15:06:38 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5DB92.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:06:51 <fjb> Desert gets me psychedelic. 15:06:51 <LA[lord]> and defining parameters and action08 15:07:28 <ben_goodger> fjb: if only it were that simple for the rest of humankind 15:07:55 *** Netsplit resistance.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: Hendikins, Fujitsu 15:07:58 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5DB92.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 15:08:00 <fjb> ben_goodger: Tell everybody to play TTD. :-) 15:08:23 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm no coasts defined in sprites.h 15:08:37 <ben_goodger> I used to play that big preestablished scenario quite a lot in my youth, I never achieved any kind of altered mental state.. :( 15:08:44 <fjb> LA[lord]: Are you writing in hex codes or do you have some kind of macros? 15:08:48 <LA[lord]> hmm.. actually, if two grfs are loaded which modify the same things then the last defined will get priority? 15:09:24 <LA[lord]> fjb: copy-paste and modify 15:09:25 <LA[lord]> :P 15:09:29 <fjb> ben_goodger: Just stare long enough at that orange wasteland. 15:09:43 <Gonozal_VIII> there's no priority... it just gets overwritten 15:09:43 <LA[lord]> although it took me a while to think of the solution too :P 15:10:46 <LA[lord]> so I even if road sprites get defined twice (by opengfx AND opengfx+) then the last grf in list overwrites the first one? 15:11:29 <Yorick> yes 15:11:36 <LA[lord]> ok.. that's good 15:11:47 <Gonozal_VIII> no that's not good 15:11:52 <LA[lord]> why? 15:11:53 <Gonozal_VIII> bad style :P 15:11:59 <ben_goodger> fjb: heh 15:12:29 *** Leviath [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:12:38 <LA[lord]> I should then add action07 to opengfx grf to skip some sprites if + version is avilable? 15:12:46 <Yorick> yes 15:13:02 <LA[lord]> but that can be done later too 15:13:29 <LA[lord]> because currently Zephyris has all sources of opengfx grfs 15:13:40 <Gonozal_VIII> + version has everything that the other has too? 15:14:15 <LA[lord]> umm.. yes I guess.. or it extends it.. I dunno. Currently it is a separate grf 15:14:27 <LA[lord]> because I define more road sprites 15:15:09 <Gonozal_VIII> you could merge that and add a parameter to activate + stuff 15:15:25 <LA[lord]> http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=85103 15:16:03 <LA[lord]> I think separate is better 15:16:09 *** Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-048-142.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 15:16:09 <Gonozal_VIII> or just deactivate the normal grf is + is or will be loaded... action 7 can do that 15:17:11 <LA[lord]> yes, but then the extended grf has to offer EVERYTHING 15:17:31 <LA[lord]> but currently it changes road sprites 15:17:57 <Gonozal_VIII> ah... then just skip the road stuff in the normal if + is active 15:18:00 <LA[lord]> currently the opengfx infrasturcture has tunnels and rails etc. 15:18:09 <Gonozal_VIII> same action 7 but with number of sprites set instead of 00 15:18:30 <LA[lord]> yes 15:18:37 *** gfldex_ is now known as gfldex 15:18:56 <LA[lord]> but then I would need to change the opengfx grf. 15:19:06 * LA[lord] wrote: "but that can be done later too" 15:19:29 <Gonozal_VIII> it's a single line, can't be too hard^^ 15:19:39 * LA[lord] wrote: "because currently Zephyris has all sources of opengfx grfs" 15:19:42 <Eddi|zuHause3> <ben_goodger> does anyone actually play the desert/snowy climates? <- i play alpine climate 15:20:04 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmmm 15:20:22 <Gonozal_VIII> did you test my patch in alpine eddi? 15:20:43 *** Netsplit over, joins: Fujitsu, Hendikins 15:21:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> no 15:22:24 <Gonozal_VIII> if i can include the coast sprites i can move it to a different place and use it for placing rail too :-) then you get rail with snow and halfdesert and stuff 15:23:10 <Gonozal_VIII> not just snow... the right ammount of snow 15:24:58 *** Farden [~jk3farden@amontsouris-156-1-36-114.w90-24.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.de :: NoNameScript 4.02 :: www.XLhost.de )] 15:25:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> i dislike how the E 10 changes livery unconditionally, no matter what colour/build year wagon i attach to it... 15:26:24 <Eddi|zuHause3> livery for engines should be done as refit options, just without cargo 15:26:50 *** Netsplit synthon.oftc.net <-> scorpio.oftc.net quits: Hendikins, Fujitsu 15:27:11 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmm some set has that 15:27:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> so i can choose "High Speed Electric", "Rheingold II", "TEE" and stuff manually 15:27:57 <LA[lord]> ok.. I changed the 'engine' once more.. Now I'm sure I don't have to define duplicate sprites :) And I hope this is the most optimized way :) 15:28:07 <LA[lord]> http://pastebin.com/f76d79fa 15:28:23 <Eddi|zuHause3> the refit options for wagons are bad anyway, they look at build year of the wagons, not year that the refit is done 15:28:44 <Eddi|zuHause3> so i cannot just recolour wagons, i need to sell and rebuild them 15:29:21 <Gonozal_VIII> what's up with that -1 * 00 stuff? 15:29:50 *** Netsplit over, joins: Fujitsu, Hendikins 15:29:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> "-1 * 00" means "let grfcodec figure this out" 15:30:23 <Gonozal_VIII> hard to find stuff without spritenumbers... 15:30:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> you have comments ;) 15:30:37 <Gonozal_VIII> i put the nfo through renum from time to time 15:30:43 <Gonozal_VIII> i don't do comments^^ 15:31:33 <Gonozal_VIII> no need for comments, that's what i use grf2html for 15:32:09 <peter1138> :o 15:32:13 <peter1138> ukts is full of comments 15:32:21 <Belugas> -t+r 15:32:28 <peter1138> ukts 15:32:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> and i still can't get my V200 driven trains TEE coloured 15:32:38 <Belugas> -?? 15:32:45 <peter1138> uk tram set 15:32:50 <Gonozal_VIII> ah 15:32:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> but the readme says i can 15:32:52 <Belugas> arghhh 15:33:01 * Belugas flees the scene 15:33:19 <Gonozal_VIII> then the readme is a filthy liar 15:33:53 <Belugas> and so does ECS, but in another way (commented) 15:33:57 <Gonozal_VIII> now you made me forget what i wanted to do 15:33:59 *** Yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- It'll be on slashdot one day...] 15:34:07 <peter1138> ecs' comments are... *urgh* 15:34:17 <peter1138> i see no point in action ... C is it? 15:34:37 <Gonozal_VIII> i wouldn't dare trying to modify anything in the ecs grfs... 15:34:37 <peter1138> it probably makes the grf twice as big ;) 15:34:38 <LA[lord]> Eddi|zuHause3" -1 * 00" means "let grfcodec figure this out" >> let nforenum figure this out :P 15:35:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> action 0C is like compiling with debug symbols... 15:35:28 *** Osai is now known as Osai`off 15:35:34 <Gonozal_VIII> just put it through renum from time to time and you have linenumbers that make sense instead of that -1 stuff 15:36:00 <LA[lord]> "it probably makes the grf twice as big" that's why it's good to have commented source, but not commented grf 15:36:31 <LA[lord]> Gonozal_VIII: I have still ** comments.. I'm afraid renum will give hundred errors on that.. 15:36:52 <LA[lord]> and I orientate by comments :P 15:37:02 <Gonozal_VIII> again, no need for comments, grf2html does a better job at commenting 15:37:19 <Belugas> [10:38] <@peter1138> ecs' comments are... *urgh* <--- totally agree. And not really relevant, only more like separators 15:37:23 <Belugas> or even reminders 15:37:26 <Belugas> not for us 15:37:30 <Belugas> the real parts are... 15:37:41 <Belugas> too evident to be commented ;) 15:37:43 <Belugas> yeah right... 15:38:09 *** divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd 15:38:11 <LA[lord]> Gonozal_VIII: Then I need to have grf, but I can't compile/put through grf2html all the time 15:38:18 <LA[lord]> I'm coding it.."live" 15:38:34 <Gonozal_VIII> why can't you do that? 15:38:41 <Gonozal_VIII> i have my bats for that 15:39:21 <Belugas> wonderfull creatures indeed 15:39:22 <Gonozal_VIII> from time to time i start it, it compiles and generates html, i refresh tha browser page and look 15:39:27 <Belugas> but so delicate wings.. 15:39:30 <Gonozal_VIII> hehe 15:39:33 <Gonozal_VIII> .bat^^ 15:40:15 <ben_goodger> posixscript ftw 15:40:19 <LA[lord]> because I can't modify it from html 15:40:35 <LA[lord]> and to know what I'm doing I need comments 15:40:41 <LA[lord]> so I know where I am 15:40:48 <Gonozal_VIII> i have the browser and the texteditor open at the same time 15:41:19 <Gonozal_VIII> there are sprite numbers to see where you are.. 15:42:52 *** Roujin [~Manuel300@mnch-4d04d50d.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:43:24 <Gonozal_VIII> btw you do a lot of skipping based on climate there... 15:43:30 <Gonozal_VIII> you could combine that 15:43:43 <Roujin> hello there 15:43:49 <Gonozal_VIII> a block for temperate, block for arctic... 15:43:51 <Gonozal_VIII> hi 15:44:23 <Gonozal_VIII> and no need to use labels there :-) 15:44:42 <LA[lord]> I want to 15:46:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> I CAN HAS LABEL PLZ? 15:46:20 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 15:46:33 <LA[lord]> If I would connect climate specific ones then I would need duplicates of parameter specific ones 15:47:40 <LA[lord]> Eddi|zuHause3: And if I have set label 01 for example skipping to end in case of toyland then I could not skip 1 sprite with action07? 15:47:53 <Roujin> question - how many different cargos could a town tile produce? 15:48:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> how should i know? 15:48:05 <LA[lord]> pax/mail 15:48:07 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd 15:48:09 <LA[lord]> more? 15:48:19 <Roujin> nah, newGrf houses can produce what they want 15:48:36 <Roujin> (i think tourist is the only one actually used by a newgrf tho) 15:49:06 <Roujin> question is, how many different cargos is the maximum... 15:49:11 <Gonozal_VIII> rumors are mb is working on houses producing other stuff 15:49:56 <SmatZ> like trash 15:49:57 <Roujin> because some functions are currently still assuming houses only produce max two cargoes.. 15:50:16 <Gonozal_VIII> they should stockpile 15:50:19 <Roujin> i stumbled over this while working on a patch of mine.. 15:51:01 <Gonozal_VIII> no dropping all passengers into a single house... 15:51:17 <Roujin> namely GetProductionAroundTiles if any dev is interested *cough* 15:51:21 <Roujin> ;) 15:51:42 *** helb_ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:51:51 <SmatZ> :) 15:52:01 *** helb_ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd 15:52:04 <mcbane> 15:52:09 <Gonozal_VIII> ah i remember what i wanted to do.... coasts! 15:52:33 <Gonozal_VIII> wrote it down now :-) 15:52:43 *** Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@fw.dormnet.his.se] has joined #openttd 15:52:53 <Roujin> only no one would ever notice it ingame because the player doesn't have a display for supplied cargo (that's where i'm making my patch) and the AI works only with pax/mail acceptance when building town routes 15:53:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, i have at least 16 unconnected stubs along my tracks 15:53:40 <Gonozal_VIII> then remove them 15:53:52 <Roujin> with my patch and activated TTRS+ECS town vector, the hotels caused gibberish output, so i started investigating and finally found the issue in the code - sooo 15:54:35 <Gonozal_VIII> sooooo fix it ;-) 15:55:32 *** Amis [~IceChat7@dsl51B6552A.pool.t-online.hu] has joined #openttd 15:55:58 <Amis> hey, can anybody tell me whats the Close All Window hotkey? 15:56:07 <Gonozal_VIII> esc 15:56:10 <Roujin> del 15:56:12 <Amis> and where can i see the list of hotkeys 15:56:14 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm 15:56:18 <LA[lord]> wiki? 15:56:22 <Amis> ingame? 15:56:24 <Gonozal_VIII> i use it all the time but got it wrong^^ 15:56:35 <Amis> so del 15:56:38 <Amis> thx 15:57:08 <glx> with shift or ctrl to close sticky windows 15:57:45 <Roujin> well dirty fix = just increase number to something higher 15:58:15 <Roujin> proper fix = make the whole thing flexible like acceptedcargo 15:58:59 <Amis> and: is there any option where i can turn off the setting that make the new vehichles's window appear at duplicating? its annoying when i make 6 aircraft than i have 6 new window (and some other what i dont want to close right now but not sticky) 15:59:47 <Roujin> none that i know of.. 16:00:21 <Roujin> and i cloned roadvehs like 40 times in my last game so.. i know what you mean :D 16:00:45 *** HerzogDeXtE1 [~Flex@i59F7EF46.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:01:03 <Amis> and any chance that this will be added to next patch? where can i post it, wheres the wishlist 16:03:42 <Digitalfox> I hate all this Windows live stuff.. It used to be so simple to download MSN messenger until 8.1, now 8.5 brings all that crap of live services that i don't care or need and it doesn't work for windows server 2003 :( 16:04:28 <Digitalfox> It's like you're on Internet 2 or you're out of the game :( 16:04:44 <Belugas> [11:05] <Amis> and any chance that this will be added to next patch? <-- patch? what next patch? 16:05:00 <Gonozal_VIII> digitalfox... use trillian 16:05:53 <Digitalfox> Gonozal_VIII: But i love MSN and all my friends also use it.. Portugal is one of the most MSN users of the world.. 16:06:06 <LA[lord]> use some other client 16:06:08 <Gonozal_VIII> trillian supports msn 16:06:14 <Gonozal_VIII> and icq 16:06:16 <Gonozal_VIII> and irc... 16:06:19 <Gonozal_VIII> and lots of stuff 16:06:30 <Digitalfox> didn't know about that o_O 16:07:08 <Digitalfox> And does it fully support msn network or only text part? 16:07:08 <Gonozal_VIII> and no annoying crap from msn all the time... 16:07:11 <LA[lord]> Gonozal_VIII: I notuÃced some mistakes, commented properly the ** comments and ran it through linter.. And I got only one error.. http://pastebin.com/f76b7ef95 16:07:18 *** mikl [~mikl@0x5733cec6.boanxx22.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 16:07:20 <Amis> Belugas> i ment the next version :), so where is the wishlist if there is any? 16:07:41 <LA[lord]> suggestions forum 16:07:53 <LA[lord]> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewforum.php?f=32 16:07:57 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F7DEAC.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:08:29 <Gonozal_VIII> well, you don't have any sprites there 16:09:00 <LA[lord]> I know 16:09:04 <LA[lord]> it's intentional 16:09:19 <Gonozal_VIII> that's where the error comes from... 16:09:22 <LA[lord]> now you see why I can't codec it? 16:09:26 <LA[lord]> I KNOW 16:09:28 <LA[lord]> ! 16:09:39 <Amis> so... i have to open a suggestion... then members will suggest it... and if it happens that a dev click on the thread and understand what i want... whats the chance it will be added? 16:09:52 <Belugas> Amis: indeed forum is the wishlist, or a feature request in bugs.openttd.org 16:10:00 <LA[lord]> depends on the feature 16:10:02 <Amis> whichone is better 16:10:06 <Belugas> and of the mood the devs 16:10:17 <LA[lord]> or other patch-makers 16:10:18 <Belugas> and th pertinence and ease to do 16:10:23 <Belugas> that too :) 16:10:31 *** Osai`off is now known as Osai 16:10:32 <LA[lord]> lot's of patched have started from suggestions forum 16:10:50 <Amis> its easy easy im sure, just an if (turned off) i wont add window, something like that :) 16:10:51 <Gonozal_VIII> bah, forgot what i wanted to do again... good thin that i wrote it down 16:11:05 <Roujin> sooo my question from before remains.. how many cargoes could a newgrf house produce? 16:11:08 <keyweed> and when jupiter is in sagittarius, does that help? 16:11:31 <LA[lord]> nope 16:11:42 <LA[lord]> that has NO effect on (what?) 16:12:02 <Gonozal_VIII> doesn't matter, that has no effect on anything 16:12:05 <Roujin> if its limited to some number (say 3 or 4 or even 10) i won't bother making the whole stuff flexible like accepted_cargo 16:12:16 <Roujin> but just make it static to that number 16:12:21 <Gonozal_VIII> well, max is 32 16:12:36 <Gonozal_VIII> maxmax... 16:12:36 <Gonozal_VIII> ^^ 16:12:43 <keyweed> as a last resort you can try sending beer and/or sushi to devs. that usually helps. 16:12:56 <peter1138> beer? 16:13:00 <peter1138> where? 16:13:15 <Gonozal_VIII> sending sushi per mail? i don't think they would be happy about some rotten fish 16:13:46 <Tefad> sushi credit? 16:13:51 <Belugas> [11:15] <Amis> its easy easy im sure, just an if (turned off) i wont add window, something like that :) <-- can you show me your diff? 16:13:55 <Tefad> if i were a dev i wouldn't accept either of those "payments" 16:14:30 <Belugas> [11:15] <Roujin> sooo my question from before remains.. how many cargoes could a newgrf house produce? M<- as many as the specs specify 16:19:21 <Roujin> well i seem to be unable to find where this is specified - a friendly hint would be much appreciated 16:20:37 <Roujin> i delved into the ttdpatch wiki and found which callback and which action and so on is used for custom cargo production, but no word about how many custom cargoes it can produce _/ 16:21:45 <Belugas> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Action0Houses#Cargo_acceptance_watch_list_20_ 16:22:15 *** frosch123 [~mtce@kolmogoroff.math.tu-clausthal.de] has joined #openttd 16:23:23 <Belugas> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Callbacks#Watched_cargo_accepted_148_ 16:24:16 <Roujin> thanks - erm isn't that about acceptance of the house? i'm looking for the production tho... 16:25:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> i know nobody who uses MSN 16:26:12 <LA[lord]> What is SIGSEV signal in linux?...Well that just happened with kwrite... 16:26:14 <Gonozal_VIII> i do 16:26:29 <LA[lord]> and I lost some work 16:26:34 <Eddi|zuHause3> LA[lord]: SIGnal SEgmentation Violation 16:26:49 <LA[lord]> ok 16:27:09 * LA[lord] didn't understand, but tries to make a smart face 16:27:18 <Roujin> i think i found it.. the hardcoded limit seems to be 256 16:27:43 <Roujin> thanks for the link belugas 16:27:47 <Belugas> http://wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=Callbacks#Custom_cargo_production_2E_ 16:28:03 <Belugas> you really do not know how to search :( 16:28:04 <Roujin> yep, in that section i just found it 16:28:22 <Belugas> it's that or you do not understood what the specs are saying 16:28:54 <Belugas> twon_cmd.cpp:436 16:29:05 <hylje> :o 16:30:14 <LA[lord]> :o @ hylje 16:30:14 <LA[lord]> what happened? 16:30:35 <hylje> wut? 16:30:57 <hylje> i resumed being lazy 16:31:08 <LA[lord]> ok 16:31:23 *** UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@168.226.105.1] has joined #openttd 16:32:05 <UnderBuilder> war tycoon anyone? lol 16:32:10 <hylje> haha 16:32:17 <hylje> support the war effort! 16:37:40 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm... rebuilding signals from semaphore to electric is a bitch... 16:38:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> the signal gui helps, but you still get insane by clicking on each signal individually 16:38:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> you can't drag and drop it, like the railtype conversion 16:39:27 <UnderBuilder> hmmm... what about trains that when they reach a certain speed they warp to some railways near the other station 16:39:50 *** Singaporekid [~notme@cm5.epsilon122.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [] 16:40:05 <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: I do it like in reality. I'm only replacing old signals when the signals or tracks are changing. 16:40:18 <Eddi|zuHause3> that is called "tunnel" 16:40:42 <Gonozal_VIII> signal convert tool should be dragable... 16:41:03 *** anhedral [~dih@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:42:16 <Eddi|zuHause3> is that not what i said? 16:42:25 *** Osai [~Osai@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:43:30 *** Ammler [~Ammler@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:43:42 *** XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:43:56 <LA[lord]> baaaaaah!!! :( 16:44:13 *** Mucht [~Mucht@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:44:13 *** hylje [~hylje@members.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:44:15 <LA[lord]> Zephyris wrote: "You don't need to use parameters for the driving side, there is is an action7 variable for that (86)., but apart from that looks good" 16:44:15 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F552D3.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 16:44:22 <LA[lord]> Few hours gone waste 16:44:48 <LA[lord]> The ironic thing is that I was aware of that var 16:45:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> <fjb> Eddi|zuHause3: I do it like in reality. I'm only replacing old signals when the signals or tracks are changing. <- yeah, but i was like "hey, let's electrify this track, and while here, electrify the signals as well" 16:46:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> hey, now i can make TEE wagons! 16:48:27 * fjb is still in the steam aera. 16:48:39 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F552D3.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:50:12 <fjb> I want to have an european passenger stations set with narrow gauge support. 16:51:17 <peter1138> TEE wagons? what? 16:52:13 <fjb> peter1138: Trans Europe Express 16:53:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, what is a V160 useful for? 16:54:21 *** hylje [hylje@c214.myrootshell.com] has joined #openttd 16:55:13 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6522.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:55:39 <peter1138> fjb, but wagons? 16:56:04 * peter1138 is British, where wagon is freight and carriage is passenger... 16:56:49 <peter1138> dbsetxl's engines are frustrating 16:57:01 <peter1138> there's little obvious improvement over time 16:57:19 <peter1138> but that's "realism" over game-play :o 16:57:23 <hylje> ze german got it right first time in 16:57:55 <peter1138> well, ukrs addons has a 90mph electric loco at the start 16:58:07 <peter1138> hence being in the addons 16:58:16 <hylje> what's ze point 16:58:20 <peter1138> YES! 16:58:24 <peter1138> we need to start slow :) 16:58:49 <Gonozal_VIII> wtf ze? 16:59:11 <Eddi|zuHause3> well, improvement is there pretty obvious from 1920 until ~1960, but then it stops somehow 16:59:20 <hylje> physics 16:59:55 *** tneo [~tneo@ip124-67-58-81.adsl.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 16:59:58 <Gonozal_VIII> efficiency of electric engines can't be improved much more and stronger engines are not needed in europe... 16:59:59 <Eddi|zuHause3> in the beginning there should be more differentiation between freight and passenger engines 17:00:00 *** tneo [~tneo@ip124-67-58-81.adsl.versatel.nl] has left #openttd [] 17:00:12 *** tneo [~tneo@ip124-67-58-81.adsl.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 17:00:15 <fjb> peter1138: dbset has E16 early in the game (but not at the beginning). 17:00:35 *** tneo [~tneo@ip124-67-58-81.adsl.versatel.nl] has left #openttd [] 17:01:04 <Eddi|zuHause3> dbset is leaving out E18 17:01:43 <fjb> MB thought E18 would be out of balance for the set. But it will be in v0.9 of the set. 17:02:15 <fjb> There are already screen shots of it on his website. 17:02:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, i have seen those 17:03:12 <Eddi|zuHause3> but V160 looks like a step back from the V200 17:03:14 <fjb> I'm more missing the cheap and slow engines in the 50s and 60s. 17:04:05 <fjb> V160 is replaced by BR 218 in the new set. 17:04:51 <fjb> I'm missing V80 or even V60. 17:05:08 <fjb> And the set gets ab bit boring after 2000. 17:06:05 <fjb> But the new version of the set will have a new EMU after year 2000. 17:06:33 <hylje> in the year two thousaaaaand 17:08:54 <fjb> BR425 17:09:25 *** pm [~chatzilla@devera.geophys.nat.tu-bs.de] has joined #openttd 17:09:39 * Eddi|zuHause3 holds a flashlight under his chin 17:10:04 <LA[lord]> Eddi|zuHause3 is a weirdo 17:10:21 <LA[lord]> ^^ 17:10:22 <Eddi|zuHause3> LA[lord]: you just don't know it ;) 17:10:53 <LA[lord]> hmm.. who attacked pastebin? it's down atm :P ^^ 17:11:24 <LA[lord]> it that case I had to remake it so... http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=35310&p=661086#p661086 the code 17:11:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> there is paste.openttd.org 17:12:45 *** Zahl [~Zahl@p549F1E3D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 17:14:22 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 17:14:59 <LA[lord]> hmm... seems EXACTLY the same as pastebin.. just different design 17:15:08 <LA[lord]> or colours 17:16:10 *** dih [~nathanael@212.126.210.122] has joined #openttd 17:20:58 <Eddi|zuHause3> hm, i just had E 10 in 3 different liveries at the same station... 17:21:12 <hylje> lots of acquisitions 17:21:16 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@77.60.199.139] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/] 17:22:33 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r12020 /trunk/src/ (landscape.cpp terraform_gui.cpp tile_type.h tree_cmd.cpp): -Documentation: Correct description of TropicZone. 17:22:42 <yorick> Gonozal_VIII :) 17:22:43 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B814AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: icebears... take care of them!] 17:27:28 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host91-239-dynamic.11-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 17:27:34 <Wolf01> hello 17:31:14 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 17:31:51 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: skidd13 * r12021 /trunk/src/town_cmd.cpp: 17:31:51 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Cleanup: Make some parts of the town growth a bit more descriptive 17:31:51 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: Remove some needless checks 17:32:55 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A6B7D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:32:59 <skidd13> Hi folks 17:35:22 <Gonozal_VIII> hi 17:36:40 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: belugas * r12022 /trunk/src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 17:36:40 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Revert(r12018): Invisible trees are now separate from the building concept. 17:36:40 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: So when you want invisible trees, just select the option of the same name in the Patch Options and toggle transparency of trees. 17:36:40 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: More to come on the saga of Invisibility. So stay tuned. 17:37:06 *** divoafx [~asd@x1-6-00-18-39-d3-e9-f6.k899.webspeed.dk] has joined #openttd 17:39:15 <Roujin> ooo :D 17:39:37 <hylje> don't leave us hanging! 17:40:53 *** Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-048-142.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:41:03 *** skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A6B7D.dip.t-dialin.net] has left #openttd [Ping timeout: Hmm ping sucks :D] 17:42:23 <dih> Belugas: you are funny :-P 17:42:48 <Roujin> is there a way to initialize an array with a specific value in ALL positions? 17:43:49 <Roujin> and i don't mean array[x] = { a, a, a, a, a, a, a} because that is not nice for x=256 17:43:55 *** divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:44:00 * Belugas watches silently hylje, going from right to left on his rope. Not a word spreads out. Will the wind bring the answer? Who knows... Only TIME will tell 17:44:01 <ln-> memset 17:44:28 <Eddi|zuHause3> you can initialise an array with any value you want, as long as you want that value to be 0 17:44:42 <ln-> that's true 17:44:45 <Roujin> heh ^^ 17:44:49 <fjb> Roujin: Use a loop over the array. 17:45:28 <Roujin> fjb: that's what i would do, i just thought there might be a "nicer" way.. 17:45:33 <ln-> fjb: and that's better than memset because ________________? 17:45:44 <Roujin> ln-: how does this memset work? 17:45:47 <Gonozal_VIII> wtf is memset 17:46:17 <Eddi|zuHause3> memset sets mem, what else would it do? 17:46:41 <Gonozal_VIII> of course.... 17:46:50 <Roujin> please be nice to a noob like me and elaborate a bit on how to use it ;) 17:47:42 <Eddi|zuHause3> arr=[] 17:47:46 <Eddi|zuHause3> for i in range(0, n): 17:47:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> arr.append(value) 17:47:54 <LA[lord]> how do I set bit 4 in action07 variable 86? and how do I not set it? 86 B Road traffic side: bit 4 clear=left, set=right 17:47:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> grr... it eats the indentation 17:48:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> why would you SET it? 17:48:37 <dih> my server won't boot 17:48:40 <dih> kernel panic 17:48:41 <dih> :-( 17:48:58 <Roujin> currently i have now in my code what i wrote above: array[x] = {a, a, a, ..., a} [x times] where x = 256 and a = something longer - and that's not nice and i know it ;) 17:49:07 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's in the game options, the user sets that 17:49:20 <glx> LA[lord]: you only check it 17:49:40 <Belugas> http://www.cppreference.com/stdstring/memset.html 17:49:46 <Belugas> mem set 17:49:48 <Belugas> easy 17:49:48 <LA[lord]> whatever :P How do I check it? 17:49:52 <Belugas> google 17:50:19 <LA[lord]> just var 86? 17:50:28 <Gonozal_VIII> you can append stuff to an array :O 17:50:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> Gonozal_VIII: that depends on your language ;) 17:51:05 <Eddi|zuHause3> python does not have arrays 17:51:08 <Eddi|zuHause3> it has lists 17:51:15 <Eddi|zuHause3> and subscriptable objects 17:51:28 <Gonozal_VIII> lists have pointers 17:51:34 <Gonozal_VIII> you said pointers are bad 17:51:34 <Roujin> thanks, and sorry for getting on your nerves again T_T 17:51:36 <Belugas> and fengs 17:51:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> only the wrong lists ;) 17:52:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> "right" lists work like this: 17:52:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> def append(self, value): 17:52:38 <Eddi|zuHause3> if self.is_full(): 17:52:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> self.double_size() 17:52:52 <glx> LA[lord]: -1 * 0 07 86 01 00/01 04 xx 17:53:09 <Eddi|zuHause3> self[self.last_index()+1] = value 17:53:36 <hylje> Eddi|zuHause3: i thought the actual list implementation did more magic than that 17:53:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> yeah, it's just the concept 17:55:53 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 17:56:31 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r12023 /trunk/src/lang/english.txt: -Fix [FS#1690]: Put a better suited text in the quit-dialog. 17:57:15 <LA[lord]> thanks glx 18:00:57 <LA[lord]> amd 18:01:24 <LA[lord]> and* now as I looked at specs, I totally understood that line, so thanks again 18:03:26 *** Osai is now known as Osai^Kendo 18:04:50 *** Maedhros [~jc@host86-145-214-168.range86-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:14:35 *** Neverhood [~Neverhood@123.118.1.182] has joined #openttd 18:16:08 <Amis> what the "remove absurc road elements during the road construction" option does? 18:16:14 <Amis> absurd* 18:17:07 <yorick> exectly that 18:17:19 <Amis> explain 18:17:32 <Amis> what an absurd road element is? 18:17:37 <yorick> it removes road crossings that cant be connected 18:18:19 <Amis> i dont really understand 18:18:38 <yorick> if you turn it off, road crossings that lead to houses/water appear 18:18:45 <Amis> ahh 18:18:46 *** Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-167-141.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 18:18:50 <Amis> now i understand 18:19:17 <Amis> so it does nothing special only make the game look better 18:19:21 *** peter1138 [~petern@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 18:19:25 *** aagdgf [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 18:19:25 *** Gonozal_VIII is now known as Guest1062 18:19:25 *** Guest1062 is now known as Guest1063 18:19:26 *** aagdgf is now known as Gonozal_VIII 18:19:40 <yorick> erm...huh? 18:20:05 <Neverhood> where can i get a sample openttd.cfg? I dont have any in my install dir 18:20:23 <yorick> try making a empty one ;) 18:20:23 <Roujin> start game, exit game 18:20:34 <yorick> it usually is in My Documents/OpenTTD in windows 18:20:43 <Roujin> then look again in install dir and my documents/openttd or similar dir 18:20:46 <yorick> @0.6.* 18:20:53 <Roujin> it is in one of the two places 18:21:37 <yorick> if openttd.cfg is in the install dir, it will be done there 18:21:51 <yorick> else, it will use the My Documents/OpenTTD folder 18:22:09 <Roujin> btw if you don't want the openttd stuff in your documents folder, just move it to the install dir, it will work and leave it there from then on ;) 18:22:43 <Roujin> i'm off for today, cu 18:22:44 *** Roujin [~Manuel300@mnch-4d04d50d.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [] 18:23:48 *** Zr40 [~zr40@2001:960:786:0:21b:63ff:fe9e:ab24] has joined #openttd 18:24:02 <yorick> IPv6 :O 18:24:10 <Neverhood> ahh thanks Roujin, you are a life saver 18:25:02 <Amis> ipv6 means that the world is out of ipv4 :) so it happened 18:25:26 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/] 18:25:27 <Neverhood> if anyone is doing a poll on weather the openttd.cfg file and so on should be in My Documents or in the OpenTTD install dir, then count me as being for the install folder. 18:25:50 <yorick> it is done because of the user-indepentancy 18:26:02 *** Guest1063 [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:26:22 <Neverhood> well, im against both My Documents and user-indepentancy... :P 18:26:44 <yorick> go complaining to Rubidium :-P 18:27:11 <glx> go complaining at MS instead 18:27:36 <glx> a limited user can't write in install dir if it is in program files 18:27:49 <Neverhood> naa.. it's not worth complaining about... It works, im sure the developpers have better things to do than listen to endless ramblings about this. 18:27:58 <Belugas> indeed... 18:28:11 <Belugas> just... endless ? not really... 18:28:20 <yorick> whats wrong to %appdata%? 18:28:32 <glx> hard to find 18:28:50 <yorick> :O 18:29:10 <yorick> %appdata%/OpenTTD/openttd.cfg , hard to find eh? 18:29:29 <glx> many users even don't know its existence 18:29:36 <Digitalfox> The fun part of ipv6 is that more 90% of world routers and modems don't support it, at least in the client side of a ISP 18:29:37 <yorick> so? 18:29:38 <glx> no direct access to it 18:29:46 <yorick> does it need to 18:30:20 <glx> and most games put stuff in mydocs 18:30:34 <Amis> start? / documents? / Openttd? its easy to acces the folder 18:30:37 <yorick> yes, but somewhere in My Games 18:31:06 <Amis> and anyway: 18:31:06 <yorick> Amis, but I want multiple versions of ottd next to eachother 18:31:17 <glx> I have only one installed game with files in my games 18:31:27 <yorick> I have 2 18:31:27 <glx> all other just created a dir in mydocs 18:31:31 <dih> my server is over the ocean 18:31:36 <yorick> both from microsoft 18:31:36 <dih> my server is over the sea 18:31:46 <glx> bring back... ? 18:31:49 <dih> laters 18:31:50 *** dih [~nathanael@212.126.210.122] has quit [Quit: leaving] 18:31:51 <yorick> just bring back your server to me :) 18:32:05 *** blathijs [~matthijs@katherina.student.utwente.nl] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 18:32:06 *** blathijs [~matthijs@katherina.student.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 18:32:34 *** blathijs [~matthijs@katherina.student.utwente.nl] has quit [] 18:32:39 *** blathijs [~matthijs@katherina.student.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 18:34:14 *** blathijs [~matthijs@katherina.student.utwente.nl] has quit [] 18:34:16 *** blathijs [~matthijs@katherina.student.ipv6.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 18:34:34 <yorick> another one that is pimping with ipv6 18:34:36 <blathijs> woohoo, ipv6 :-) 18:34:50 <blathijs> Took a few tries to convince irssi, though 18:35:12 <fjb> ipv6 is nice. 18:35:19 <yorick> I dont have :( 18:35:26 <hylje> :-) 18:35:39 <blathijs> yorick: Use 6to4 tunneling, it's brilliantly clever :-) 18:35:51 <yorick> my provider doesn't have 18:35:52 <glx> I can do that 18:37:17 <blathijs> yorick: In theory, you can use any 6to4 tunnel, not just your provider's 18:37:25 <blathijs> Not sure how it works in practice, though 18:37:30 <yorick> yes, but where do I get one? 18:37:38 <Diabolic-Angel> yorick: sixxs.net 18:38:32 <Diabolic-Angel> They give them away for free, just need to tell them why you want one. "Student that is curious about new technology bla" is all you need. 18:39:47 <hylje> "*incoherent blabber*" 18:40:21 <yorick> "Don't try to fill in false, incomplete or invalid data as you will be rejected." 18:41:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r12024 /trunk/src/tree_cmd.cpp: 18:41:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Codechange: Reduce code duplication inside tree_cmd. 18:41:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -CodeChange: When rocks get removed while planting trees, barren the ground. 18:41:04 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Fix: In one case trees could spread under bridges. 18:41:20 <yorick> far too complicated 18:41:23 *** zrah [~zakrahman@88-107-244-13.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:41:29 * yorick is not going to do it 18:41:34 <yorick> why should I? 18:41:43 <blathijs> Because it's fun! :-p 18:41:48 <blathijs> Is it complicated? 18:42:09 <blathijs> It sounds simple in (network) theory 18:42:12 <yorick> I dont like giving name, adress, email and other personal data to sixxs 18:42:24 <Neverhood> is there a commandline switch to stop the dedicated server from opening in a new window? 18:43:00 <glx> using -D under windows? 18:43:20 <yorick> no 18:43:24 <yorick> you have to patch it 18:43:33 *** tokai [~tokai@p54B814AB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 18:43:35 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 18:43:41 <yorick> there is a patch for using windows console @openttd 18:43:50 <glx> no need to patch it, just convert it using http://devs.openttd.org/~glx/convert.zip 18:44:04 <yorick> yes, thats what I mean 18:44:16 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: miham * r12025 /trunk/src/lang/ (czech.txt estonian.txt french.txt korean.txt spanish.txt): 18:44:16 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2008-01-30 19:43:26 18:44:16 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: czech - 1 fixed by Hadez (1) 18:44:16 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: estonian - 11 changed by kristjans (11) 18:44:16 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: french - 2 changed by belugas (2) 18:44:18 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: korean - 1 changed by darkttd (1) 18:44:18 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: spanish - 5 fixed by eusebio (5) 18:44:42 <Amis> hungarian? :P 18:44:50 <yorick> still the "vliegtuig is in the lucht" has to be fixed in dutch... 18:45:10 <Maedhros> heh, nice 18:45:44 <Neverhood> Im trying to write a frontend for the dedicated server, and right now im just getting a black OpenTTD Dedicated Server window next to my frontend. I would like other ppl to be able to use my frontend without patching, is this not possible at all? 18:46:15 <glx> it's not possible without converting it (that's how windows works) 18:46:32 <yorick> no glx, you could be using the windows console 18:46:51 <yorick> make it a console app 18:46:54 <yorick> hmm...wait 18:47:03 <yorick> dedicated only for windows? 18:47:09 <MiHaMeK> Amis: hi 18:47:25 <glx> yorick: openttd is a windows app, not a console app 18:47:42 <yorick> yes, but you could make a dedicated version? 18:47:48 <glx> why? 18:48:07 <Neverhood> so i could write a frontend to it :) 18:48:36 <yorick> all other builds have dedicated versions 18:48:55 <Amis> whats the adress of the grf page? 18:49:07 <glx> they are just compiled without video drivers 18:49:13 <yorick> yes 18:49:15 <glx> on windows it needs more work 18:49:44 <Amis> somebody, grfcrawler.com? or what 18:49:45 <Maedhros> Amis: which grf page? i can think of two off the top of my head - grfcrawler.tt-forums.net and wiki.ttdpatch.net/tiki-index.php?page=NewGraphicsSpecs 18:49:54 <Amis> .net! 18:50:03 <yorick> what? 18:50:14 *** frosch123 [~mtce@kolmogoroff.math.tu-clausthal.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:51:20 <glx> and IIRC mingw doesn't have "unicode" entry point for console apps 18:52:28 <yorick> converting everything is not an option 18:53:40 <Neverhood> is it very hard just to make a commandline switch that makes the dedicated server just not show the new window? 18:53:48 <glx> yes 18:53:57 <Neverhood> ok :) 18:54:13 <glx> the console creation is determined by windows, not by openttd 18:54:18 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d51A47061.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 18:54:18 <Belugas> the switch is not hard. the code implementing waht the switch should do is 18:54:41 <Neverhood> i understand 18:56:09 <yorick> hmm...I think I get the piglatin now 18:56:34 <yorick> first char is moved to the back, -ay is added 18:56:59 <Amis> im off, bye 18:57:02 *** Tlustoch [~last_evol@r6al232.net.upc.cz] has joined #openttd 18:57:07 <yorick> bye 18:57:15 *** Amis [~IceChat7@dsl51B6552A.pool.t-online.hu] has left #openttd [] 18:58:01 <yorick> any translators needed for dutch or piglatin? 18:58:15 <Maedhros> piglatin's done by a script 18:58:28 <Maedhros> or it was when it was created, anyway 18:58:52 <yorick> 74 bad strings, up-to-date, 2 translators assigned 18:58:52 <Maedhros> but i have no idea about dutch - why not apply anyway? 18:59:21 <hylje> shut up or ill write a shell script to replace you! 18:59:37 <yorick> didn't you already do that? 18:59:52 <SmatZ> piglatin = put first word to the end of word and append ay? 19:00:05 <LA[lord]> hmm.. I just rerendered my tropical bank for higher resolution (GeekToo's patch).. You'll get it as soon in forums as soon smb comments the oil tank at blender thread :P... 19:00:14 <SmatZ> hmm no, sometimes it moves more letters :) 19:00:24 <yorick> or way if you word starts with a,e,u,i,o 19:00:27 <SmatZ> until 19:00:28 <SmatZ> yeah 19:00:52 <SmatZ> STR_8019_T_I_M_ELECTRIC :'Tay.Iway.May.' (Electricway) 19:00:52 <yorick> there are 97 strings not done in piglatin 19:00:53 <SmatZ> :D 19:02:21 <yorick> no = onay 19:02:50 <SmatZ> "_ 19:02:51 <SmatZ> :) 19:03:46 <yorick> etslay tartsay openttdWAY 19:04:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> oh neee.... 19:05:13 * yorick isway onnagay alktay inway iglatinpay odaytay 19:05:54 * yorick isway iddingkay 19:06:17 <yorick> ):ay 19:07:54 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: orudge * r12026 /trunk/src/lang/ (english.txt english_US.txt): -Update: 'exit' is consistent with UK English in OpenTTD, 'quit' with US English 19:10:37 <SpComb> language police! 19:11:19 *** Neverhood [~Neverhood@123.118.1.182] has quit [Quit: Good news everyone!] 19:11:24 <yorick> yljehay ashay otay riteway emay inway igpay atinlay ownay 19:11:45 <Gonozal_VIII> !kick yorick 19:12:05 <LA[lord]> !kick orickyay 19:12:10 <yorick> ouyay antcay ickkay emay 19:12:25 *** yorick was kicked from #openttd by Belugas [i can :D] 19:12:36 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 19:12:38 <LA[lord]> !kick orick...YAAY!! 19:12:44 <LA[lord]> ^^ 19:12:47 <yorick> aw 19:12:54 <yorick> -ay 19:13:03 <Gonozal_VIII> away?^^ 19:13:07 <LA[lord]> ^ay^ay 19:13:08 <yorick> :D 19:14:38 <yorick> asway IWAY ancay eesay, elugasbay ancay understandway igpayatinlay }) 19:14:51 <yorick> back to normal talking :) 19:15:37 <LA[lord]> ooahway, owhay omecay?ay 19:16:17 <yorick> okway, IWAY illway otnay 19:17:17 * LA[lord] is wants replies to http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14549&start=3640#p660997 19:17:32 <LA[lord]> /Yorick is kinda weird/ 19:17:52 * yorick nowskay 19:18:24 <yorick> icenay oilrifineryway :) 19:18:52 *** Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-167-141.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:20:00 <LA[lord]> I've got some problems... At little zoom, the bank seemed normal, but now at full zoom, I can see all the flaws.. :( 19:20:10 * LA[lord] is speaking of his tropical bank 19:20:59 <yorick> ookedlay ikelay ouyay ereway alkingtay aboutway omesay aircraft... 19:21:22 <yorick> -way 19:21:36 <Belugas> yorick, please, stick to english 19:21:39 <Belugas> it's getting boring 19:21:59 <yorick> actually, it is understandable for everyone that speaks english 19:22:01 <yorick> but ok 19:22:12 <Gonozal_VIII> is not 19:22:28 <Belugas> i know it is, but it's not pleasant to decipher it 19:22:40 <Belugas> plus, we are not all english speakers natively 19:22:42 <LA[lord]> Yorick: I can speak english but I still have to read all your words one by one if you use that 19:22:46 <Belugas> which means a new layer of transaltion 19:24:15 <LA[lord]> Yorick: Next thing you try is this? http://www.mrc-cbu.cam.ac.uk/~mattd/Cmabrigde/ 19:24:18 <LA[lord]> don't :P 19:24:27 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-242-078.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:24:53 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-13-231.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:25:14 <HMage> ÐŒÑÐŒÑ. вÑеЌ пÑОвеÑ. 19:25:34 <yorick> and, did the server want to go out of the rack?(andway, idday hetay erversay antway otay ogay outway ofway hetay ackray?) 19:26:23 <dih> wtf? 19:28:15 <yorick> I'm trying to talk in piglatit, but because elugasbay didn't find it pleasant to decipher it, I'll put english translation with it :) 19:28:38 <yorick> pignatin* 19:28:49 <LA[lord]> iglatinpay 19:29:05 <yorick> LA[rol]d: tnahks for taht lnik :) 19:29:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> give up ;) 19:29:28 <HMage> enoyreve oleh 19:30:51 <LA[lord]> HMage: What? 19:31:03 <yorick> mirrored, "helo everyone" 19:31:03 <LA[lord]> Yorick: I said, DON'T 19:31:13 <yorick> hmm...too late :) 19:32:01 * LA[lord] is bored 19:32:26 <yorick> go writing iglatinpay, it's fun! 19:32:30 * HMage is not 19:32:48 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:32:58 *** Sacro is now known as acroSay 19:33:47 <dih> i think i can save my servers data :-) 19:34:04 <SpComb> what did you manage to do to your server this time? 19:34:21 <dih> we had a power cut 19:34:26 <dih> all of karlsruhe was out 19:34:27 <yorick> the power company did 19:34:29 <SpComb> and it corrupted itself? 19:34:38 <yorick> linux eh ;) 19:34:47 <dih> and then the ups failed us 19:34:54 <yorick> how can that be? 19:34:58 * SpComb has yet to succeed in corrupting his disks due to unexpected power-killing 19:35:03 <SpComb> (in windows or linux) 19:35:20 <dih> anyhow - kernel panic at boot time 19:35:24 <HMage> dih: use reiserfs or xfs :) 19:35:31 <yorick> with NFTS, it isn't very possible.... 19:35:36 <dih> i _am_ using reiserfs 19:35:40 <HMage> doh 19:35:44 <dih> yes 19:35:48 <dih> thank you 19:35:59 <dih> the only partition that is not using reiser is /boot 19:36:01 <HMage> dih: I didn't mean any offense 19:36:02 <dih> and that is extw 19:36:05 <dih> *ext2 19:36:10 <dih> no 19:36:13 <yorick> I tried corrupting nfts soo much 19:36:13 <dih> no offence take 19:36:14 <HMage> but I'm using reiser for /boot too 19:36:14 <dih> n 19:36:39 <dih> i am not using reiserfs for /boot because i dont need journaling on /boot 19:36:48 <yorick> hmm...good plan to make your primary disk ext2... 19:36:52 <dih> and that was the only partition the server was able to read :-D 19:37:12 <HMage> dih: you think partition table is borked? 19:37:16 <dih> no 19:37:40 <dih> if that were the case i could not mount all the partitions on my workstation 19:37:47 <HMage> does dd give any read errors? 19:37:59 <dih> yes - i dd a disk that could possibly be duff 19:38:16 <dih> well - i could 19:38:24 <dih> and then mount the images in loopback 19:38:56 <dih> but then i only want images of the data - not the entire partitions 19:39:46 <yorick> how come the ups failed? 19:40:06 <yorick> brb 19:40:06 <dih> the bateries seem duff 19:41:45 <dih> if they were not duff the ups would have powerd all 30 servers 19:41:57 <dih> but prob not as long as the outage lasted 19:42:06 <yorick> back 19:42:11 <dih> none the less - it would have had a chance to send the shutdown commands 19:42:16 <yorick> but long enough to shutd-yes 19:42:35 <dih> but 3 seconds after power cut the ups was out too 19:42:36 <yorick> if you would have known, and if your network conn wasnt down 19:43:02 <dih> my desk at work is right next to the server room ;-) 19:43:14 <dih> i would have noticed :-) 19:43:28 <dih> i notice if just one of the servers beeps 19:43:44 <yorick> how could I know that? 19:43:58 <yorick> ;) 19:44:50 <Eddi|zuHause3> you should have 19:45:26 <yorick> its a good idea to test the ups regularly... 19:45:49 <yorick> or buy one that doesn't get duff 19:45:55 *** ben_goodger [~ben@86.156.58.184] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 19:46:00 <yorick> :) 19:46:06 <Eddi|zuHause3> do it at the same time as testing the circuit breaker ;) 19:47:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> my main line is kinda crowded with long distance trains now... 19:47:49 <SpComb> my UPS self-tests every now and then 19:48:04 <yorick> try not-saving and try to test your non-existent UPS, Eddi ;) 19:48:38 <yorick> SpComb: and if it isn't ok, is it going to beep in the middle of the night? 19:49:03 <yorick> things that can beep have the tendency to break in the middle of the night 19:49:10 <LA[lord]> ok.. before I go to sleep, I'll give you one magnificent link... http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=14549&p=661116#p661116 19:49:14 <SpComb> no, it'll send a message to the host computer over USB, which will get logged and an alert sent 19:49:41 <yorick> :>) 19:50:29 <LA[lord]> good night 19:50:47 <yorick> night 19:50:51 *** LA[lord] [~LAlord]@ip101.cab22.ltln.starman.ee] has left #openttd [Kopete 0.12.5 : http://kopete.kde.org] 19:50:54 <acroSay> oodgay ightnay 19:50:59 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host81-153-26-226.range81-153.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 19:51:09 <glx> <HMage> ÐŒÑÐŒÑ. вÑеЌ пÑОвеÑ. <-- I don't get the first word 19:51:19 <yorick> I dont gett anything 19:51:29 <yorick> only some strange things 19:52:00 *** ben_goodger [~ben@host81-153-26-226.range81-153.btcentralplus.com] has quit [] 19:52:03 <yorick> but that could have to do with the char encoding... 19:52:13 <glx> yorick: it's russian 19:52:16 <yorick> oh 19:52:32 <yorick> it doesn't look like russian 19:52:36 <yorick> [20:52] <yorick> but that could have to do with the char encoding... 19:53:25 <ln-> yorick: see topic; UTF-8 is mandatory 19:53:47 <glx> utf8 is not enough, the right font may help too 19:53:48 <yorick> dunno how to set in HydraIRC... 19:54:32 <dih> [20:47] <SpComb> my UPS self-tests every now and then <-- ours did 19:54:40 <dih> and claimed the batteries were ok 19:54:44 <SpComb> huh 19:54:56 <dih> it's a cubic thingy from apc 19:55:14 <dih> costs a good 10K euros 19:57:55 * SpComb has a refurbished 3kVA SmartUPS that he got for teh cheaps 19:58:07 <dih> :-) 19:58:29 <dih> well - the really nasty thing is that all colocated servers sitting in our racks were on that ups :-P 19:58:37 <dih> but seeing as there was a power cut 19:58:46 <dih> guess who was not able to give us a call :-D 19:59:14 <yorick> ? 19:59:23 <dih> clients...? 19:59:33 <yorick> are you sure the ups was sufficient for all of the servers? 19:59:44 <Belugas> customers? 19:59:45 <Belugas> mothers? 19:59:55 <dih> yorick: yes 19:59:55 <Belugas> the babysitters? 20:00:11 * Belugas runs away yelling 20:00:29 * dih ties Belugas to a lamp post 20:00:30 *** peter1138 [~petern@217.151.109.242] has joined #openttd 20:00:30 *** mode/#openttd [+o peter1138] by ChanServ 20:00:33 <dih> hello peter 20:00:44 <yorick> eter1138pay! 20:00:56 <yorick> :) 20:03:24 *** acroSay is now known as Sacro 20:03:42 <peter1138> Pig Latin is pointless. 20:03:55 <yorick> but fun 20:04:00 <yorick> +. 20:04:26 <fjb> Sacro is still at that age. 20:04:34 <Sacro> :( 20:05:14 <dih> yorick is too - but then we dont know him any different, nor do we expect him to be anywhere else 20:05:36 <Tefad> eterpay? 20:05:43 <yorick> do you know Sacro any different? 20:07:29 <dih> no - but i expect more from soneone i believe to be older :-) 20:07:50 <dih> "older" = older than he/she/it behaves 20:07:53 <Prof_Frink> dih: Now now, remember that Sacro has a terrible affliction. 20:08:09 <dih> not older in the sense of "Belugas" older 20:08:14 <dih> :-P 20:08:23 <peter1138> Hullitis? 20:08:28 <Prof_Frink> He's /Northern/. 20:08:32 <peter1138> Oh, that one. 20:08:44 <peter1138> I bet he speaks all funny. 20:08:57 <dih> phone... 20:09:36 <Prof_Frink> It's weird having #openttd on 3. 20:10:02 <yorick> <very old quote from dih>"a sentence about telephone with the colors green, pink and yellow" 20:10:55 * yorick hates remembering everything 20:11:44 <peter1138> @openttd commit r14 20:11:44 <DorpsGek> peter1138: Invalid arguments for _commit. 20:11:47 <peter1138> @openttd commit 14 20:11:47 <DorpsGek> peter1138: Commit by dominik :: r14 /trunk (rail_cmd.c road_cmd.c) (2004-08-10 18:35:43 UTC) 20:11:49 <DorpsGek> peter1138: Fix: railroad crossings on slopes are now possible 20:12:08 <peter1138> :o 20:12:16 <yorick> what's with that? 20:12:29 <yorick> @openttd commit 2 20:12:29 <DorpsGek> yorick: Commit by darkvater :: r2 /trunk (9 files) (2004-08-10 14:14:00 UTC) 20:12:30 <DorpsGek> yorick: -Fix [993829] UDP Fixes (lucaspiller) 20:12:31 <DorpsGek> yorick: -Fix change 255/0xFF to OWNER_SPECTATOR for 20:12:32 <DorpsGek> yorick: spectator stuff (TrueLight) 20:12:59 <peter1138> railroad crossings... on slopes...? 20:13:02 <dih> yorick: answer: "the phone goes green green, i pink it up and say 'yellow?'" 20:13:18 <yorick> :O 20:13:35 <dih> i like that one :-P 20:13:38 *** helb_ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 20:14:04 <yorick> <another very old quote from dih that came after it>"LOL!" 20:14:18 *** helb_ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd 20:16:54 *** asdgdf [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 20:16:54 *** Gonozal_VIII is now known as Guest1075 20:16:54 *** Guest1075 is now known as Guest1076 20:16:55 *** asdgdf is now known as Gonozal_VIII 20:17:11 <Gonozal_VIII> 30 Kilo Kalium Nitraat Vuurwerkbom Vuurzee Vuurwerk <-- what does that mean? 20:17:21 <yorick> why? 20:17:34 <Gonozal_VIII> because i want to know?^^ 20:18:22 *** Guest1076 [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:18:25 <yorick> 30 Kilo ... Nitrate Fireworkbomb much flames(lit:flamesea) Firework 20:18:43 <yorick> wait, more like firesea 20:18:44 <Gonozal_VIII> much flames indeed^^ 20:19:14 <yorick> and now, why? 20:19:26 <Gonozal_VIII> youtoube 20:19:31 <Gonozal_VIII> -o 20:19:57 <yorick> Kalium = Potassium 20:20:22 <yorick> comes from latin 20:20:25 <Sacro> oh hell :\ 20:20:36 *** planetmaker [~chatzilla@Fd089.f.ppp-pool.de] has joined #openttd 20:20:36 <Gonozal_VIII> i don't know potassium but i know kalium 20:20:43 <yorick> yes, I had to look for it :) 20:20:49 <Eddi|zuHause3> <peter1138> railroad crossings... on slopes...? <- maybe he meant on foundations? 20:20:51 <Sacro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Oj2DiNWNU0 20:20:57 <Gonozal_VIII> it's spelled with 'u' sacro 20:21:07 <yorick> I think it is the same word in german 20:21:33 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, Kalium is Kalium in german ;) 20:21:47 <Eddi|zuHause3> i have no idea what Potassium is though... 20:22:21 <yorick> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potassium 20:22:32 <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause3, ah, possible 20:22:56 <planetmaker> hi 20:23:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> why would somebody call the element that has "K" as symbol call "Potassium", which does not even closely resemble a "K"? 20:23:52 <yorick> because it comes from latin 20:23:58 <yorick> and is Kalium in latin 20:24:00 <hylje> i think there's three different "Potassium" elements 20:24:01 * Maedhros spent half an hour today grinding up potassium hydroxide to make it into a "fine powder" 20:24:04 <hylje> depending on the language used 20:24:04 <Maedhros> it wasn't fun... 20:24:09 <fjb> I saw a diagonal road / railroad crossing in the forum some days ago. Was that a mock up or is there a patch for that? 20:24:13 <hylje> and the languages are also interchangeable i recall 20:24:19 <Maedhros> Eddi|zuHause3: ditto lead (= Pb) 20:24:40 <Sacro> fjb: was a patch 20:24:43 <Eddi|zuHause3> ok, lead is called something entirely different in german also... 20:24:54 <yorick> yeah? 20:24:56 <yorick> tellme 20:25:00 <Gonozal_VIII> blei 20:25:03 <yorick> :O 20:25:08 <Sacro> plumbum! 20:25:09 <yorick> its "lood" in dutch 20:25:18 <orudge`> plomb! 20:25:21 <planetmaker> There are many where languages differ :) 20:25:30 <Gonozal_VIII> hmm lood... like lot :-) 20:25:58 <planetmaker> For hydrogen it's where the English is matching the chemical symbol - and the German "Wasserstoff" - well - only hints at its contribution to water (Wasser) 20:26:04 <peter1138> Pb 20:26:16 <Gonozal_VIII> lot in german is a piece of metal (like lead) on a string to see if something is right below something else.... 20:26:35 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 20:26:36 <yorick> planetmaker: "Waterstof" in dutch :) 20:26:41 <peter1138> that's a plumb-bob 20:26:51 <Eddi|zuHause3> "Wasserstoff" is pretty much a literal translation of "Hydrogen" (or the other way round) 20:27:06 <yorick> same ^^ 20:27:21 <planetmaker> sure. :) 20:28:53 <Sacro> Gonozal_VIII: a plumb(line) 20:29:35 <planetmaker> And how do we explain then "Sauerstoff" (=oxygen). Oxygen doesn't even make anything sour - rather OH is a base(?)... 20:29:37 <Gonozal_VIII> yes, that stuff 20:30:29 <Eddi|zuHause3> planetmaker: basically, it's a misnomer ;) 20:31:00 <Gonozal_VIII> [21:30:28] Bartleby: weils frÃŒher dachten das zeug machtr, dass sÀure sauer 20:31:00 <Gonozal_VIII> [21:30:38] Bartleby: dabei wars das Hzeuch 20:31:05 <Gonozal_VIII> :-) 20:31:36 <yorick> zuurstof in dutch :)^^ 20:32:21 <Gonozal_VIII> so... they thought oxygen was the reason for the acidity of acids... 20:34:03 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:40:29 *** |Bastiaan| [~Bastiaan@ip87-205-173-82.adsl2.versatel.nl] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/] 20:43:33 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has joined #openttd 20:46:21 <Gonozal_VIII> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=80IRA-8rXcM <-- nice landing^^ 20:46:31 <yorick> no youtube links 20:46:38 <Gonozal_VIII> offtopic... 20:46:43 <Gonozal_VIII> planes are ontopic :P 20:47:22 <yorick> /quit I'm not }), goodbye! WinBot: If a packet hits a pocket on a socket on a port, and the bus is interrupted as a very last resort, and the address of the memory makes your floppy disk abort, then the socket packet pocket has an error to report! If your cursor finds a menu item followed by a dash, and the double-clicking icon puts your window in the trash, and your data is corrupted 'cause the index doesn't hash, then your 20:47:22 <yorick> situation's hopeless, and your system's gonna crash! If the label on the cable on the table at your house, says the network is connected to the button on your mouse, but your packets want to tunnel on another protocol, that's repeatedly rejected by the printer down the hall, and your screen is all distorted by the side effects of gauss so your icons in the window are as wavy as a souse, then you m 20:47:22 <yorick> ay as well reboot and go out with a bang, 'Cause as sure as I'm a poet, the sucker's gonna hang! When the copy of your floppy's getting sloppy on the disk, and the microcode instructions cause unnecessary risc, then you have to flash your memory and you'll want to RAM your ROM. Quickly turn off the computer and be sure to tell your mom! 20:47:27 <yorick> aw 20:47:31 *** yorick [~yorick@s55924da0.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Quit: well then] 20:48:31 <fjb> What was that? 20:48:50 *** llugo [~lugo@p4FD5FB66.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:50:11 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-255-112.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 20:50:34 <fjb> I like narrow gauge railways: http://www.myimg.de/?img=RST12Jul194768eff.png 20:50:42 *** Gekz [~brendan@CPE-121-216-53-146.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:51:18 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d51A47061.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 20:53:35 <Gonozal_VIII> start a game in 1875 with daylength 30, then after some hours of watchin them crawl around with 16km/h tell me again how much you like them ;-) 20:53:37 * Maedhros resists the urge to attempt right-click scrolling on that screenshot 20:54:30 <fjb> My trains are a bit faster. :-) 20:55:19 *** Sogard [~Sogard@ip24-251-252-143.ph.ph.cox.net] has left #openttd [] 20:55:20 <fjb> Maedhros: Put the screenshot in the background of your desktop. :-) 20:55:26 *** Greyscale is now known as Greysc[a]le 20:55:40 *** Greysc[a]le is now known as Greyscale 20:55:43 *** lugo [~lugo@p4FD5DB92.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:56:27 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-242-078.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:00:42 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-253-029.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 21:00:57 <Gonozal_VIII> that other guy was downloading again... connection so busy that i couldn't even establish ftp connection 21:01:11 <Gonozal_VIII> http://gonozalviii.go.funpic.de/OpenTTD/titled.png 21:01:49 <Gonozal_VIII> some 16km/h choo choo trains 21:02:34 <SpComb> ugly theme alert 21:02:44 <Gonozal_VIII> hmmmm? 21:02:54 <Eddi|zuHause3> too many signals 21:03:17 <Gonozal_VIII> yes... bartleby spammed them 21:03:20 <SpComb> the task bar/window list/whatever it is bubbles/ovals 21:03:31 <Gonozal_VIII> ah... 21:03:35 <Gonozal_VIII> stealth os skin 21:03:41 <fjb> Cute. But why that many signals? 21:03:44 <Gonozal_VIII> not ugly :P 21:03:47 <SpComb> yeah, the ovals look bad 21:04:17 <Prof_Frink> I'm with SpComb on this one 21:04:18 *** Greyscale [bnc@81.171.136.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:34 <Gonozal_VIII> the line on the top left needs those signals... always full of trains 21:04:43 * Prof_Frink intends to have no panel at all when plasma's more configurable 21:05:06 <Gonozal_VIII> they are so slow that a full line can't move the production of a single industry 21:06:11 <fjb> Try to use horses instead. :-) 21:06:20 <Eddi|zuHause3> industry capacity should change over time 21:06:34 <Gonozal_VIII> couldn't get the powerplant to increase production btw... how can one do that? 21:06:45 <fjb> Looks like somebody solved that problem with "station walking". 21:06:47 <Gonozal_VIII> it has lots of coal and oil 21:06:56 <Eddi|zuHause3> is that ECS stuff? 21:07:02 <Gonozal_VIII> yes 21:07:12 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-255-112.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:07:52 <SpComb> http://www.trekking-mahlzeiten.de/trekking-mahlzeiten-online-shop/produkte/Zwischenmahlzeiten_507/Cheeseburger_in_der_Dose_4641.html 21:08:07 <Gonozal_VIII> those two little one tile stations are there to pick up and dump sulphur in an attempt to get the powe production to rise... but it doesn't produce any sulphur 21:08:57 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-253-029.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:11:52 <peter1138> landscape: blurgh 21:11:55 <peter1138> ecs: blurgh 21:11:59 <peter1138> signals: blurgh 21:12:11 <Gonozal_VIII> those are default signals^^ 21:12:18 <peter1138> quite 21:12:23 <peter1138> and indeed, way too many 21:12:41 <peter1138> also, vehicles: blurgh 21:12:45 <peter1138> (they're not aligned properly) 21:12:46 <Gonozal_VIII> one of the lines needs that many 21:13:21 <Gonozal_VIII> and the signals are not quite default, they are default^^ 21:13:31 <peter1138> lies 21:13:43 <peter1138> you need longer trains, that's all 21:13:51 <Gonozal_VIII> impossible 21:13:56 <Gonozal_VIII> that's max length 21:14:05 <Gonozal_VIII> deactivated the patch option 21:14:40 <peter1138> silly :o 21:14:59 <Gonozal_VIII> and those engines have 150 hp... 21:15:11 <Gonozal_VIII> they have a hard enough time pulling those wagons 21:15:27 <Gonozal_VIII> look at the date 21:16:00 *** divoafx [~asd@x1-6-00-18-39-d3-e9-f6.k899.webspeed.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:16:00 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:16:10 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 21:16:17 *** divo [~asd@x1-6-00-18-39-d3-e9-f6.k899.webspeed.dk] has joined #openttd 21:16:57 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-057-254-174.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 21:17:04 <Gonozal_VIII> and what's wrong with ecs? ecs rocks! wouldn't play without that anymore 21:17:43 <ln-> are you talking about eComStation, sir? 21:17:48 <Eddi|zuHause3> the terrain causes eye cancer 21:18:04 <Gonozal_VIII> :S 21:18:16 <Gonozal_VIII> why oh why? 21:18:41 <HMage> ÑÐŒÑÐŒ 21:18:44 <Gonozal_VIII> that's newterrain grf 21:18:52 <Gonozal_VIII> combined with newwater 21:18:57 <ln-> HMage: yum-yum? 21:19:12 <HMage> ln-: going to bed :) 21:22:00 <fjb> Hm, the trains have an alignment problem. Is that the serbian narrow gauge set? 21:22:19 <Gonozal_VIII> yes it is 21:22:25 <Gonozal_VIII> didn't change any alignment 21:22:50 <fjb> I didn't notice any problem yet. I have to take a closer look. 21:23:01 <Gonozal_VIII> and... where is it wrong? 21:23:09 <Gonozal_VIII> can't see it 21:23:30 <fjb> The gras look kind of fluffy. Like plÃŒsch (what is the english word?). 21:23:46 <Gonozal_VIII> grass is fluffy... 21:24:01 <fjb> Look at the trains coming from the bottom right. 21:24:08 <Gonozal_VIII> it's not a flat rubber mat on the ground^^ 21:24:43 <fjb> Looks like nicely cleaned grass. 21:25:18 <Gonozal_VIII> nicely cleaned grass? 21:25:28 <Tefad> plush is an english word 21:25:47 <Tefad> some couches fit the description 21:25:48 <fjb> Too green, no spots of dirt. The original grass tiles have more brown spots. 21:26:01 <Tefad> looks like cotton candy? 21:26:08 <fjb> Tefad: The is the word I was looking for. Thank you. 21:26:27 <Gonozal_VIII> cotton candy is not plÃŒsch^^ 21:27:00 <Tefad> it looks as if it would be though ; ) 21:27:14 <Gonozal_VIII> i didn't draw that terrain and i don't think i could do it any better... 21:27:24 <fjb> The grass look way too clean green in contrast to the ecs industries. 21:28:40 <Gonozal_VIII> is there better grass? 21:28:49 <Gonozal_VIII> without borders, don't like them 21:29:01 *** Osai^Kendo is now known as Osai 21:30:34 *** Zavior [~zavior@d195-237-7-167.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:32:23 <Wolf01> 'night 21:32:29 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host91-239-dynamic.11-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:32:31 <fjb> Hm, some of the wogons of the serbian set look a bit small in contrast to the rails. Maybe that is the cause for the alignment problem. 21:36:48 <fjb> And you could use more than one locomotion to pull a train. That would look much better than that many signals. 21:37:17 <Gonozal_VIII> but wouldn't help anything 21:37:28 <Gonozal_VIII> 16 km/h is top spee 21:37:29 <Gonozal_VIII> d 21:38:27 <Eddi|zuHause3> like i said, industry capacity must start very low, and then rise as train capacities rise 21:38:44 <fjb> But with longer trains you can transport more per train. 21:39:03 <Eddi|zuHause3> yes, but still less than with later trains 21:39:36 <Eddi|zuHause3> like in the DBSetXL, when you get the 4 axle wagons, you can almost doulbe the capacity of the trains with the same length 21:39:54 <fjb> I don't think George asumed somebody would start a game in 1875 when he made the industries. :-) 21:41:14 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F7EF46.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 21:41:41 <Eddi|zuHause3> it's not a problem with the grf itself, the whole industrial system is not designed for this kind of growth 21:44:12 *** Greyscale [bnc@81.171.136.146] has joined #openttd 21:44:12 *** svippery [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:44:16 *** svippery [~svip@cpe.atm2-0-78233.0x535a2072.boanxx18.customer.tele.dk] has joined #openttd 21:47:02 *** HerzogDeXtE1 [~Flex@i59F7EF46.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:47:03 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 21:47:46 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: Trillian (http://www.ceruleanstudios.com] 21:48:29 *** Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:48:59 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-240-115.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 21:50:12 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 21:50:39 *** dih is now known as Guest1082 21:50:39 *** dih_ is now known as dih 21:55:08 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has joined #openttd 21:55:28 *** Guest1082 [~dihedral@dslb-084-057-254-174.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:57:41 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-223-101.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 21:58:00 *** dih is now known as Guest1083 21:58:00 *** dih_ is now known as dih 21:59:54 <fjb> I wish PBS for christmas. 22:00:40 <Eddi|zuHause3> you didn't specify which christmas... 22:02:19 *** Guest1083 [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-240-115.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:02:39 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c80-216-64-31.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 22:03:12 <fjb> That was intended... 22:03:19 <Eddi|zuHause3> i love the "smooth" foundations 22:03:31 <Chrill> Are there any cool logs here? 22:03:32 <Eddi|zuHause3> but i hate the drag-terraforming tool 22:03:33 <SpComb> Logs: http://spbot.marttila.de:8120/logs/oftc-ottd (old: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd ) 22:03:33 <Chrill> !logs 22:03:35 <Chrill> think so.. 22:04:18 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N926P028.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:08:00 <fjb> What are smooth foundations? 22:08:28 <GoneWacko> I'm wondering the same 22:08:31 <GoneWacko> thing. 22:08:57 <fjb> Fluffy foundations with plush? 22:10:15 <fjb> I would vote for fluffy plush foundations in pink to attract more girls to the game. 22:11:53 <Eddi|zuHause3> "smooth" as in "less zig-zag" 22:12:27 <fjb> Ah, ok. 22:13:13 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-221-067.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:19:42 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-223-101.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:23:17 *** jp [~Miranda@dslb-084-057-226-126.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:26:07 *** Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N793P012.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 22:27:08 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-227-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:29:31 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6522.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: will return at 31st december] 22:29:38 <fjb> Stupid towns. I'm connecting them to the wide world and they get mad at me. 22:29:45 *** Osai [~Osai@pD9EB6522.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:29:53 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-231-144.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:30:03 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F552D3.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:31:34 *** fjb_ [~frank@p5485E835.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 22:33:28 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-221-067.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:34:08 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-221-220.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:34:23 *** Chrill [~chrischri@c80-216-64-31.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Quit: An Eye for an Eye Makes the whole world one-eyed] 22:35:11 *** Tlustoch [~last_evol@r6al232.net.upc.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:36:08 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-227-146.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:38:32 *** dih| [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-231-144.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:38:34 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-221-220.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [] 22:38:56 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-221-220.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:39:12 *** fjb [~frank@p5485F96B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:39:32 *** dih is now known as Guest1086 22:39:48 *** Guest1086 is now known as dih 22:40:52 *** fjb_ is now known as fjb 22:40:53 *** Jortuny is now known as Jortuny-away 22:41:10 *** divo [~asd@x1-6-00-18-39-d3-e9-f6.k899.webspeed.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:42:09 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-234-181.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:43:57 *** dih__ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-234-242.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:44:19 *** dih is now known as Guest1087 22:44:19 *** dih__ is now known as dih 22:47:53 *** Guest1087 [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-221-220.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:50:32 *** dih_ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-234-181.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:51:10 *** dih__ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-225-021.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 22:55:53 <UnderBuilder> one question... I set initial size of the cities to 10 and when I start a new game, they start like if the setting were in 1 22:56:47 <Gonozal_VIII> not every town is a city 22:56:52 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-234-242.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:57:06 *** dih__ is now known as dih 22:57:42 *** dih is now known as Guest1089 22:58:32 *** Diabolic-Angel [~dia@ip-62-143-77-44.1311A-CUD12K-02.ish.de] has quit [Quit: leaving] 22:59:01 *** Guest1089 is now known as dih 23:00:22 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-225-021.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:01:15 *** dih__ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-241-016.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 23:01:25 *** dih__ is now known as dih 23:02:03 *** dih is now known as Guest1090 23:02:21 *** Guest1090 is now known as dih 23:03:49 <planetmaker> good night then all 23:04:11 <Gonozal_VIII> night 23:04:16 *** planetmaker [~chatzilla@Fd089.f.ppp-pool.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.80 [Firefox 2.0.0.11/2007112718]] 23:06:18 *** stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-136-225-75.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:07:32 *** TinoM [~Tino@i59F552D3.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 23:08:21 *** SmatZ [~smatz@a40-prg1-5-107.static.adsl.vol.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:09:43 *** the_palm [thepalm@CPE-121-210-81-124.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 23:09:47 <the_palm> !password 23:09:48 *** the_palm was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [Wrong channel. Retry in #openttdcoop.] 23:10:10 *** the_palm [thepalm@CPE-121-210-81-124.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 23:10:10 *** Greyscale [bnc@81.171.136.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:10:13 <Prof_Frink> Wahey! 23:10:22 <Prof_Frink> Sacro will be happy. 23:10:25 *** the_palm [thepalm@CPE-121-210-81-124.nsw.bigpond.net.au] has left #openttd [] 23:11:39 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has joined #openttd 23:19:42 *** Osai is now known as Osai^zZz 23:20:19 *** peter1138 [~petern@217.151.109.242] has quit [Quit: bwaaahahaha, te eeeh eeehee boingk!] 23:22:57 *** asfsdfd [~Gonozal_V@N793P012.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 23:22:57 *** Gonozal_VIII is now known as Guest1092 23:22:57 *** Guest1092 is now known as Guest1093 23:22:57 *** asfsdfd is now known as Gonozal_VIII 23:24:40 *** dih__ [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-217-017.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 23:25:15 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:25:59 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has joined #openttd 23:28:52 *** Guest1093 [~Gonozal_V@N793P012.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:30:21 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:30:24 *** Maedhros [~jc@host86-145-214-168.range86-145.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: leaving] 23:30:47 *** dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-241-016.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:30:51 *** dih__ is now known as dih 23:31:17 <fjb> We should make a bot that generates a random password. :-) 23:31:18 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has joined #openttd 23:34:31 <Gonozal_VIII> that joins every gameserver and creates companies with random password until limit is reached? 23:35:49 *** jp [~Miranda@dslb-084-057-226-126.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: jp] 23:37:11 <fjb> No, just a random answer to the password request, instead of kicking the one asking. 23:43:29 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:44:13 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has joined #openttd 23:46:35 *** Aerandir [magic.powe@90-230-201-111-no37.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:46:57 <murray> now why would you do that Gonozal_VIII? 23:47:00 <murray> that's just evil 23:47:43 <Gonozal_VIII> fjb wants! 23:48:17 <murray> yeah blame it on everyone else 23:48:34 <Gonozal_VIII> everyone else did it! 23:48:49 <murray> would that include me? 23:48:51 *** Brianetta [~brian@77-103-231-158.cable.ubr05.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 23:49:12 <Gonozal_VIII> are you everyone? 23:49:26 <murray> in some sense, yes 23:49:27 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:49:38 <Gonozal_VIII> O_o 23:49:45 <murray> seeing as if i'm not included, it wouldn't be everyone 23:49:47 <Gonozal_VIII> you are everyone? 23:50:08 *** Greysc[a]le [bnc@81.171.136.146] has joined #openttd 23:50:49 <murray> i feel we're going in circles here 23:51:17 <Gonozal_VIII> everyone's going in circles 23:52:33 *** Greysc[a]le is now known as Greyscale 23:53:02 <murray> oh noes, INFINITE LOOPS 23:53:06 *** helb__ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd 23:53:16 *** helb_ [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:53:21 <murray> in linux, infinite loops take about 6 seconds to complete 23:53:24 <Gonozal_VIII> break; 23:53:39 <murray> cheater 23:53:55 <glx> murray: only if the infinite loop allocates memory 23:54:30 <Gonozal_VIII> bool true = false;