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00:13:05 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 00:16:16 *** kais58 [~kais58@cpc2-cwma8-2-0-cust293.7-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:00:00 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-053-002.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [] 01:11:27 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-78-45-94-47.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 01:38:16 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@modemcable133.8-80-70.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #openttd 01:38:29 <drac_boy> hi 01:40:04 <Supercheese> Salutations 01:41:16 <drac_boy> how're you cheesy? heh 01:41:37 <Supercheese> Scandalously cheesy 01:42:01 <drac_boy> heh heh 01:48:03 *** Runner11 [~KByte@c-24-20-56-126.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:16:18 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:4948:e01:b6bb:628] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:30:32 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@modemcable133.8-80-70.mc.videotron.ca] has left #openttd [I'm done being in this room!] 03:20:18 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-99-231.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:10:28 *** roadt [~roadt@114.96.140.250] has joined #openttd 04:18:18 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@78-105-168-146.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 04:25:28 *** Markavian [~Markavian@78-105-168-146.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:31:18 *** jiv223 [~jiv223@38.106.150.109] has joined #openttd 04:51:38 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@i59F6C576.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 04:54:19 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-97-92.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 04:57:33 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D969.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:32:21 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67CF5.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 05:32:35 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD5016.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:38:52 *** jiv223 [~jiv223@38.106.150.109] has quit [] 05:49:23 *** KouDy [~KouDy@231.41.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my] has joined #openttd 05:55:09 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@94.13.8.182] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:12:58 <__ln__> touchdown 06:13:09 <Supercheese> First image is tiny 06:13:11 <Supercheese> 64x64 06:13:33 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [Quit: Mars, we has it] 06:13:46 <Supercheese> Here's the 256x256 06:14:16 <Supercheese> lots of dust on Mars 06:14:34 <__ln__> they should be cleaning it more often 06:18:06 *** telanus [~telanus@196-210-226-47.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #openttd 06:20:00 <Supercheese> Good thing there aren't any cats on mars 06:27:48 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 06:31:06 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has joined #openttd 06:34:26 <NGC3982> Curiosity just landed. 06:34:34 <NGC3982> Oh 06:34:38 <NGC3982> Im way late. 06:34:39 <NGC3982> :D 06:35:32 <telanus> Supercheese: So the Killer Cats of Mars is just a myth? :D 06:36:02 <NGC3982> I watched the stream on the bus. :/ 06:47:17 *** roadt [~roadt@114.96.140.250] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:00:44 *** ludde [~b@c80-217-210-102.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 07:12:02 <Eddi|zuHause> i hope your bus didn't touch down 07:15:46 <NGC3982> It got tangled in the winch wires. 07:23:43 *** MrSikorski [~ferro@190.194.99.117] has quit [] 07:46:08 *** DorpsGek [~dorpsgek@2001:41d0:2:d1dc:3::10] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:52:21 <planetmaker> moin 07:53:09 <NGC3982> planetmaker: morning! 07:53:24 <NGC3982> planetmaker: I do hope you have not missed the morning events. 07:53:42 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 07:53:52 <planetmaker> I did miss them. And missed them well. Sleep was good 07:55:49 <NGC3982> Gosh darnit'. 07:55:57 * NGC3982 shakes the foundation of out PM. 07:58:16 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 08:06:45 <Eddi|zuHause> there's gonna be reruns! 08:11:40 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-105-242.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 08:13:04 <LordAro> http://www.openttd.org is down? 08:14:43 <LordAro> it is: http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/www.openttd.org 08:14:48 <LordAro> ^ TureBrain 08:14:58 <LordAro> TrueBrain 08:15:00 <LordAro> dammit :L 08:15:10 <Supercheese> down for me too 08:15:36 <__ln__> LordAro: watch nasa.gov instead 08:15:46 <LordAro> i am :D 08:16:36 <LordAro> it worked! it worked! 08:16:39 * LordAro dances 08:23:47 <Eddi|zuHause> could watch nasa.de but it won't be nearly as interesting :p 08:24:19 <planetmaker> :-D 08:24:34 <planetmaker> I think there's about 10 orders of magnitude in between 08:25:34 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 14.0.1/20120713134347]] 08:26:27 <__ln__> looks like they are running gnome2. 08:30:39 <LordAro> better than gnome3 :) 08:33:08 <TrueBrain> our whole (physical) server got rebooted 08:35:24 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wirenat2.strw.leidenuniv.nl] has joined #openttd 08:38:14 <TrueBrain> I love OVH 08:38:23 <TrueBrain> they detected the non-responsiveness of the server 08:38:26 <TrueBrain> went down there 08:38:56 <TrueBrain> "No information on the screen. No response to the keyboard. Restarted the server hardware. Boot OK. Ping OK" 08:39:03 <TrueBrain> now that is quality :) 08:41:58 <planetmaker> hm. So action before we noticed it? 08:42:48 <TrueBrain> before _I_ noticed it :P 08:42:52 <TrueBrain> but yes :P 08:43:10 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@wirenat2.strw.leidenuniv.nl] has joined #openttd 08:43:25 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-78-45-94-47.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 08:43:36 <planetmaker> I'll say 'thank you' in my monthly e-mail to them :-) 08:44:00 <NGC3982> I don't understand. How is a freezed server a good quality job? :p 08:44:09 <TrueBrain> hardware freezes 08:44:11 <TrueBrain> that happens 08:44:16 <TrueBrain> like breathing 08:44:21 <TrueBrain> some things you have to accept in life 08:44:30 <TrueBrain> how you go by those things, that defines you 08:44:51 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wirenat2.strw.leidenuniv.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:45:38 <TrueBrain> we have had hosts, where it took 24h and 5 calls before they pressed the darn button on the machine .. so yeah .... ;) 08:46:32 <planetmaker> :-) 08:46:48 <planetmaker> ovh seems to have some good automatism in place 08:52:32 *** KouDy [~KouDy@231.41.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:54:27 *** KouDy [~KouDy@231.41.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my] has joined #openttd 09:02:48 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-040-117.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 09:03:24 *** peter1138 [~peter@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:06:02 <__ln__> lietutenant uhura on nasatv 09:06:27 <__ln__> lieutenant even 09:07:54 <NGC3982> :O 09:08:39 <TrueBrain> hmm, there, fixes the few services that didn't autoboot. Did I miss any service of OpenTTD that is not working atm? 09:09:14 <__ln__> gopher 09:09:57 * peter1138 takes __ln__ outside and leaves him there. 09:11:50 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-105-242.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:13:38 <TrueBrain> come on buddy, where are you ..... 09:13:38 *** DorpsGek [~dorpsgek@178-33-38-239.ovh.net] has joined #openttd 09:13:41 *** mode/#openttd [+o DorpsGek] by ChanServ 09:13:41 <TrueBrain> there you are 09:13:45 <TrueBrain> who is a good boy? 09:13:57 * peter1138 gives DorpsGek a bikkit 09:14:10 * planetmaker hugs TrueBrain "good boy, good boy. Have a cookie :-)" 09:14:26 <DorpsGek> I am a good boy ! ! ! ! See See See ! ! ! 09:14:57 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-105-242.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 09:15:05 <LordAro> "... 24h and 5 calls" <-- was that the last time? http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=51632 09:16:14 <TrueBrain> okay, I cannot find a service that doesn't reply to my queries, so I guess that is all :) 09:16:29 <TrueBrain> only 1 VPS did not boot correctly, which I didn't expect it to :P 09:16:37 <TrueBrain> the rest survived the reboot flawless :D :D :) 09:16:49 <planetmaker> good job in setup, I say :-) 09:16:55 <TrueBrain> its getting there 09:17:02 <peter1138> FLAWLESS VICTORY 09:19:43 <TrueBrain> hmm ... as last thing, I thought, lets see if MySQL has any damage 09:19:44 <TrueBrain> bad move .. 09:21:22 <TrueBrain> some bugs never get solved in software I am afraid 09:23:15 <peter1138> Yeah, journalling wasn't the holy grail... 09:23:20 <TrueBrain> owh, now even the recovery tool crashes ... 09:23:21 <peter1138> Although I guess it helps a lot, heh. 09:25:21 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 09:29:21 <TrueBrain> bascailly, the bananas_download table always crashes (its an ARCHIVE) 09:29:27 <TrueBrain> when MySQL is not nicely closed, it totally fucks up 09:29:33 <TrueBrain> the recovery tools are ..... sad 09:29:49 <TrueBrain> for example, the archive is now 10 GiB in size 09:31:01 <Warod> *ahem* psql *ahem* 09:32:39 <TrueBrain> really useful feedback atm, tnx :P 09:32:40 <TrueBrain> lolz 09:32:48 <LordAro> i guess that's related to the fact that the content download list is empty :L 09:33:14 <TrueBrain> LordAro: the MySQL is not running; depends how you define relation ;) 09:33:27 <Warod> TrueBrain: But one always has to twist the knife when it hurts most or it'll get ignored! 09:37:29 <Eddi|zuHause> a relation is a set of tuples :) 09:43:10 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-28-241.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 09:44:32 <NGC3982> "A relation is a set of couples". 09:44:49 <NGC3982> A Feynman quote, if i recall. 09:44:50 <NGC3982> :3 09:48:11 <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't learned this stuff in english, so this kind of wordplay usually eludes me... 09:50:12 <TrueBrain> right, the recovery tool segfaults, leaving the recovered table as useless as the original 09:50:17 <TrueBrain> random memory reads ftw 09:50:23 <TrueBrain> seriously, so lovely .... can I kill it? 09:51:06 <planetmaker> lovely 10:01:20 <Warod> TrueBrain: If everything else fails, you might want to check if MariaDB has more useful recovery tools available. 10:01:40 <TrueBrain> we should never have used ARCHIVE table 10:01:44 <TrueBrain> it has so many bad reviews 10:01:50 <TrueBrain> meh 10:01:52 <TrueBrain> c'est la vie 10:02:34 <Eddi|zuHause> tel aviv 10:02:59 <TrueBrain> okay, everything should be back on its feet 10:03:03 <TrueBrain> lemme know if there are any issues 10:03:10 <TrueBrain> I am unavailable for the next few hours, so MWHAHAHAHAHA :P 10:03:43 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 10:04:52 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d0835ee.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:07:57 <Terkhen> good morning 10:08:21 *** roadt [~roadt@114.96.140.250] has joined #openttd 10:17:20 <planetmaker> moin Terkhen 10:55:39 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.65] has joined #openttd 11:02:49 *** roadt [~roadt@114.96.140.250] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:39:16 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@wirenat2.strw.leidenuniv.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:45:07 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:5916:411c:7f93:8757] has joined #openttd 12:45:10 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:53:01 *** KouDy [~KouDy@231.41.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:03:40 *** KouDy [~KouDy@231.41.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my] has joined #openttd 13:21:30 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has joined #openttd 13:24:57 <Eddi|zuHause> "ReallyDoDrawString" who the hell named this function? :p 13:26:04 <Eddi|zuHause> bwhah... the SETX handling scares me... 13:34:22 <glx> <Eddi|zuHause> "ReallyDoDrawString" who the hell named this function? :p <-- svn blame ;) 13:35:01 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think i will be coding the "ignore setx" part of the purchase list task... 13:54:23 *** roadt [~roadt@114.96.130.25] has joined #openttd 13:56:52 <LordAro> is wikipedia down for anyone else? 13:57:34 <Eddi|zuHause> who needs wikipedia anyway... 13:58:00 <Eddi|zuHause> "Our servers are currently experiencing a technical problem. This is probably temporary and should be fixed soon. Please try again in a few minutes." 13:58:15 <LordAro> yeah... 13:58:58 <LordAro> the whole lot is down - wikimedia.org is down also 14:06:29 <Warod> uuu 14:11:39 <TrueBrain> it wasn't me this time :P 14:11:40 <TrueBrain> I promise :) 14:25:07 <Ammler> TrueBrain: please fix the internet 14:34:34 <TrueBrain> I am sorry, it is fundementally broken :( 14:49:16 *** orudge` [~orudge@owenrudge.net] has joined #openttd 14:50:03 *** avdg [~avdg@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:50:22 *** avdg [~avdg@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 14:51:13 *** orudge [~orudge@owenrudge.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:51:24 *** orudge` is now known as orudge 14:53:28 *** dlr365 [~Doug@d75-159-143-33.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 14:57:51 *** CornishPasty [users.158@brockwell.irccloud.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:58:06 *** CornishPasty [users.158@brockwell.irccloud.com] has joined #openttd 14:58:10 <LordAro> hmmm... it's back, but it's still a bit broken... 14:59:49 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 15:05:31 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 15:06:44 <andythenorth> FLHerne: no scaled buy menu sprites ;) 15:06:51 <andythenorth> very very wrong ;) 15:08:20 *** dlr365 [~Doug@d75-159-143-33.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:13:50 <Eddi|zuHause> "HEQS 1.1.0: invalid CB 23 result 0xCB4" 15:13:57 <Eddi|zuHause> when opening the tram menu 15:14:02 <Eddi|zuHause> purchase menu 15:15:02 *** M1zera [~Miranda@ip-78-102-217-126.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 15:15:07 <andythenorth> meh 15:15:15 <andythenorth> thought that was solved :P 15:15:53 <andythenorth> it's buy menu text cb 15:17:16 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not sure if my HEQS is the newest 15:19:30 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.65] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 15:20:32 <Eddi|zuHause> www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Unbenannt,%201.%20Jan%201999_1.png <-- i doubt those truck sprite offsets wrong because of my patch... 15:21:36 <andythenorth> probably pre-existing 15:21:50 *** peter1138 [~peter@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:29:50 <Eddi|zuHause> that does not look right: http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1628/ 15:30:19 *** peter1138 [~peter@176-35-84-218.xdsl.murphx.net] has joined #openttd 15:31:35 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... so i have two options: make the road depot wider, or make the road purchase list narrower 15:31:58 <Eddi|zuHause> (by default) 15:34:26 <andythenorth> wider depot 15:36:41 <Eddi|zuHause> www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Quigley%20Co.,%202.%20Jan%201999.png <-- something fails here 15:36:53 <Eddi|zuHause> i suspect newgrf confusion 15:37:18 <Ammler> TrueBrain: thanks, internet seems to work again 15:38:05 <Eddi|zuHause> how do i output the vehicle name through a printf? 15:38:10 <NGC3982> Seriosly. 15:38:14 <NGC3982> "umrÃŒstbar". 15:38:36 <Eddi|zuHause> what's wrong with that word? 15:42:43 <NGC3982> Nothing. 15:42:46 <NGC3982> Absolutely nothing. 15:43:04 <Eddi|zuHause> i sense sarcasm... 15:43:17 <NGC3982> Not really. 15:43:30 <NGC3982> I really, really love the poetry of German and Dutch 15:44:06 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-105-242.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:45:09 <Eddi|zuHause> i once read this article about an english comedy writer, who spent some time in germany, and totally fell on his face in the early days, because none of his jokes were funny when translated to german 15:45:27 <Eddi|zuHause> because they focused too much on english language features like grammar or vocabulary 15:45:40 <Eddi|zuHause> instead of things that are universally funny across languages 15:45:44 <NGC3982> Indeed. 15:46:30 <NGC3982> I just love how the German and Dutch (do i spell linguistic definitions with a capital letter?) have such a ..panáche. 15:46:54 <NGC3982> At least when compared to Swedish, wich is a bit similar but SO boring in comparison. 15:47:01 <Eddi|zuHause> in english, you capitalize things that are derived from names (persons or locations) 15:47:43 <Eddi|zuHause> which is actually "strange", because that means in english you sometimes capitalize things that are not capitalized in german 15:48:24 <NGC3982> It's like 15:48:31 <NGC3982> "föroreing" 15:48:44 <NGC3982> == "umweltverschmutzung". 15:49:16 <Eddi|zuHause> how do you mean? 15:49:55 <NGC3982> The swedish word is made up by two definitions that makes a somewhat logical explanation to what the word means. 15:50:41 <Eddi|zuHause> need more context. 15:50:56 <NGC3982> The german word is fantasticly beautiful, and doesn't care if it's 30 letters long as long as it explains what on earth the person refers to. 15:51:31 <NGC3982> For me, as a Swede, german sounds like poetry with some sort of jaw handicap. 15:51:56 <Eddi|zuHause> there are way longer words than that :) 15:52:10 <NGC3982> hehe, i know. 15:52:14 <NGC3982> H* 15:52:50 * NGC3982 named his business server 'Schadenfreude' 15:53:38 <NGC3982> "RindfleischetikettierungsÃŒberwachungsaufgabenÃŒbertragungsgesetz" 15:53:54 <NGC3982> For Pete' sake! It's like William Blake fell into a dictionary. 15:53:59 *** peter_ [~peter@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has joined #openttd 15:54:38 <Eddi|zuHause> ok. law-german is a seriously special case :p 15:55:08 <Eddi|zuHause> PS: that is the "short form" of the law name :) 15:56:52 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d0096af.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:57:55 <Super_Random> HOLY MUTHER TRUCKER 16:01:20 *** peter1138 [~peter@176-35-84-218.xdsl.murphx.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:02:55 *** flaa [~flaa@cable-roi-ff30c000-246.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 16:05:19 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@94.13.8.182] has joined #openttd 16:13:45 <Eddi|zuHause> "This is the official short title of the law; its full name is Gesetz zur Ãbertragung der Aufgaben fÃŒr die Ãberwachung der Rinderkennzeichnung und Rindfleischetikettierung" (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rinderkennzeichnungs-_und_RindfleischetikettierungsÃŒberwachungsaufgabenÃŒbertragungsgesetz) 16:16:24 *** MNIM [~mBuntu@ip5452ffad.adsl-surfen.hetnet.nl] has joined #openttd 16:17:34 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: other authors will disagree, but if I have to tweak sets to deal with adjusted buy menu, it's not the end of the world 16:17:53 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: yes, but here it actually fails to widen the buy menu 16:18:00 <andythenorth> so I see :) 16:18:05 <andythenorth> can't help with that right now 16:18:15 <andythenorth> although I could test your patch later this evening if that helps 16:21:50 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the latest version is here: www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/resize_purchase_list.diff 16:22:20 <Eddi|zuHause> the only changes so far since the previous version are removal of outcommented lines, and reducing the lower limit from 60 to 32 16:48:15 *** flaa [~flaa@cable-roi-ff30c000-246.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:54:50 *** TheDude [~Miranda@ip-86-49-102-148.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:01:29 <NGC3982> "I can be reached on this e-mail most hours of the day. Though, for more acute inquiries, please refer to my private phone:" 17:01:35 <NGC3982> Does that sound correct? 17:01:48 <NGC3982> It's been a while since i made business mails in english. 17:10:21 <FLHerne> andythenorth: So what's wrong with scaled sprites (with consistent scaling for all ships)? 17:10:43 <FLHerne> Sorry for very late reply, was a bit distracted gaming :P 17:12:11 <NGC3982> "We are about to set up the first mystery calls, and i will make sure to contact you with questions, if any as such arise. Though, i see most of the information regarding the calls is already well defined in the attached documents." 17:12:15 <NGC3982> Sound like crpa. 17:12:15 <FLHerne> At in-game size, there's no way you'll get enough ship in-frame to be informative :P 17:13:53 <andythenorth> FLHerne: scaled buy menu sprites just isn't done 17:14:19 <Eddi|zuHause> NGC3982: that sounds like a spam mail 17:14:26 <FLHerne> andythenorth: But why not? :P 17:14:36 <andythenorth> it just isn't 17:14:39 <andythenorth> there's no why 17:14:50 <andythenorth> it's like asking "why isn't English actually French" 17:14:54 <FLHerne> Stupidly huge vehicles isn't done either, except in FISH :P 17:15:07 <andythenorth> potato / potato 17:15:21 <Eddi|zuHause> FLHerne: AV8 has oversized aircraft 17:15:28 <andythenorth> why is a scaled sprite more informative? 17:15:37 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: Ah, the airships :P 17:15:44 <andythenorth> a scaled sprite is 100% a lie in one dimension 17:15:52 <andythenorth> and a lie isn't very informative 17:16:35 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Because looking at the first 1/3rd of a ship - the bit which often looks identical anyway - is totally uninformative 17:16:43 <andythenorth> [shrug] 17:17:02 <andythenorth> this is a known issue 17:17:05 <FLHerne> At least with scaled ones, you can see how the ship's size compares to other FISH ships 17:17:19 <andythenorth> oh, scale them all consistently? 17:17:26 <andythenorth> rather than to fit the space? 17:17:32 * FLHerne looks at 17:34 17:17:44 <FLHerne> :P 17:17:45 <andythenorth> yeah sorry 17:17:49 <andythenorth> missed that 17:18:56 <FLHerne> Cropping uninteresting bits out (as I suggested on the forum) would break that again though :P 17:19:13 <FLHerne> Perhaps that's a stupid idea... 17:21:31 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 17:21:51 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:21:57 <andythenorth> stupid irc client crashed 17:22:32 <FLHerne> Which one? :P 17:23:08 <andythenorth> colloquy 17:23:24 <andythenorth> scaling sprites large enough to fit the largest ships 17:23:31 <andythenorth> leaves the smallest ships as blobs of pixels 17:23:43 <andythenorth> and it's ugly 17:24:18 <FLHerne> That's why I wanted to squash them horizontally by removing the uninteresting bits of hold :P 17:24:29 <FLHerne> That would then break the scaling again though :P 17:26:30 <FLHerne> Given the quite noticeable size jump (Tyskebuska - Island Trader) you could have two scales. That would also be confusing... 17:26:37 <andythenorth> yup 17:27:29 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-040-117.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [] 17:27:57 <FLHerne> You could squash the real sprites as well, which would reduce clipping... :P 17:56:01 *** M1zera [~Miranda@ip-78-102-217-126.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 17:59:10 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has joined #openttd 18:03:51 *** Alberth [~hat3@2001:980:272e:1:21a:92ff:fe55:fc8d] has joined #openttd 18:03:54 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 18:04:24 <Alberth> hi hi 18:05:32 <Terkhen> hi Alberth 18:05:37 <andythenorth> buena serra Alberth 18:06:43 <andythenorth> Terkhen: any FISH 2 bugs found? :) 18:21:48 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: translators * r24459 /trunk/src/lang/ (dutch.txt hungarian.txt korean.txt luxembourgish.txt): 18:21:48 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 18:21:48 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: dutch - 4 changes by Parody 18:21:48 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: hungarian - 4 changes by IPG 18:21:48 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: korean - 19 changes by telk5093 18:21:49 <CIA-4> OpenTTD: luxembourgish - 19 changes by Phreeze 18:23:42 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has joined #openttd 18:24:17 <Wolf01> evenink 18:26:32 <Alberth> hi andy, wolf 18:28:41 *** prooz [prooz@eddie.slaskete.net] has left #openttd [] 18:33:40 *** telanus1 [~telanus@196-210-226-47.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #openttd 18:37:06 *** telanus [~telanus@196-210-226-47.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:44:29 <Terkhen> andythenorth: nope 18:44:35 <Terkhen> I only ran some AI tests though 18:45:12 <andythenorth> anyone else got FISH 2 feedback? 18:45:25 * andythenorth has to figure out where to insert the ferries from WSF set 18:57:58 *** Chris_Booth[ph] [~chrisboot@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:58:35 <V453000> andythenorth: that isnt on bananas or is it? 18:58:41 <andythenorth> V453000: no 18:58:46 <andythenorth> it's on the bundle server 18:58:47 <Terkhen> what ferries? 18:58:50 <V453000> oh right 18:58:57 <V453000> I will have a look 18:59:15 <FLHerne> andythenorth: I've played with FISH 2 quite a bit, it seems to work :P 18:59:45 <V453000> ^ big feedback :D 18:59:48 <andythenorth> Terkhen: going to add the ferries from this set http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=59499 18:59:59 <andythenorth> FLHerne: useful :) 19:00:19 <FLHerne> Refitting to multiple cargos would be convenient though :P 19:00:59 <andythenorth> not a newgrf thing :P 19:03:08 <Terkhen> they look nice 19:03:32 <andythenorth> the smaller car ferry is about 1947-?? 19:03:40 <andythenorth> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV_Rhododendron 19:08:08 *** Chris_Booth[ph] [~chrisboot@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:08:08 *** Chris_Booth[ph] [~chrisboot@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 19:08:25 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:08:58 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 19:08:59 *** Chris_Booth[ph]_ [~chrisboot@213.205.225.248] has joined #openttd 19:09:33 *** Chris_Booth[ph]_ [~chrisboot@213.205.225.248] has quit [] 19:10:07 <andythenorth> hmm 19:10:17 <andythenorth> that one doesn't have an obvious replacement in current FISH :P 19:16:20 *** Chris_Booth[ph] [~chrisboot@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:16:48 *** telanus1 [~telanus@196-210-226-47.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 19:20:18 <FLHerne> Do townsets count as 'safe'(ish) to add to a running game? 19:20:55 <andythenorth> they can do very odd things 19:20:57 <andythenorth> I wouldn't 19:23:38 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 19:24:03 <frosch123> as long as they do not add cargos, housesets are fine to add 19:24:15 <andythenorth> -0.5 :P 19:24:26 <andythenorth> some house sets will cause your cities to implode 19:24:33 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [] 19:24:40 <andythenorth> and your station acceptance might be screwed 19:24:49 * andythenorth has done it 19:25:05 <frosch123> then that's the fault of the house set :p 19:25:18 <frosch123> not of the adding 19:25:19 <FLHerne> UK Townset doesn't add cargoes, does it? 19:28:21 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 19:28:48 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [] 19:28:53 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 19:30:15 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [] 19:33:52 *** Chris_Booth is now known as Guest2061 19:33:58 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 19:36:40 *** Guest2061 [~chatzilla@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:40:09 *** drac_boy [~drac_boy@bas1-ottawa08-1176113041.dsl.bell.ca] has joined #openttd 19:40:20 <drac_boy> hi 19:40:46 <FLHerne> drac_boy: Hi :-) 19:41:49 <drac_boy> how're you FLHerne? 19:47:10 <FLHerne> Ok thanks :-) 19:48:08 <drac_boy> so what doing tho? 19:51:26 <FLHerne> Trying to redraw andy's CHIPS groundtiles onto slopes :P 19:51:48 * FLHerne is rather useless at pixel art :-( 19:51:58 <drac_boy> heh 19:52:02 <drac_boy> have fun? :) 19:52:17 <FLHerne> :P 19:53:07 * drac_boy is atm trying to find two particular swizterland rail names with no luck yet :-| 19:55:08 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 19:56:04 <drac_boy> 1. that circular viaduct and 2. at least one (and only I think) station that was laid out in a U shape which sorta looked model-ish if you think about it 19:56:06 <drac_boy> :) 19:56:30 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A29B.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:56:49 <Eddi|zuHause> there's a "circular" viaduct in the Bernina railway, i think 19:58:01 <drac_boy> mm that was it thanks a lot for the name 19:58:05 <Eddi|zuHause> http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Datei:Bernina_Brusio.jpg&filetimestamp=20081218195305 19:58:19 <drac_boy> http://images.gadmin.st.s3.amazonaws.com/25078/images/buehne/RHB_5421_orig-1-1.jpg 19:58:22 <drac_boy> oh heh 19:58:41 <drac_boy> guess your link's better :) 20:00:03 <drac_boy> well thats one less thing to find online 20:04:19 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 20:04:27 <drac_boy> hi cheesy again :p heh 20:06:11 <frosch123> hmm... 20:06:32 <frosch123> do americans really consider baking a cake as "cooking" 20:06:59 <frosch123> "the cake was cooked" is weird :p 20:07:18 <drac_boy> not me but I'm not american tho :) 20:07:39 <frosch123> could you care less? :p 20:09:31 <drac_boy> btw Eddi|zuHause this is another interesting thing about rhb/sbb to me .. http://3.bp.blogspot.com/__SEHRiee7ys/S-58-D4-RhI/AAAAAAAAARY/104SrRzfXKU/s1600/4602421018_9377ffc304.jpg 20:09:40 <drac_boy> thats no tram .. thats an actual mainline train :) 20:09:58 <Eddi|zuHause> well, it's a narrow gauge train... 20:09:58 <FLHerne> Do I have the shading etc right? http://i.imgur.com/wInVY.png 20:10:24 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause mm thats true, I don't know if the standard gauge sbb even has any or it was always built outside of towns 20:11:14 <drac_boy> I do know that there is at least one amtrak/freight station in either florida or calfornia (forgot now) that had the station accessible from a long road running stretch that has always caused lot of fender benders 20:16:24 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:18:42 *** glx is now known as Guest2067 20:18:42 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:5916:411c:7f93:8757] has joined #openttd 20:18:45 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 20:20:40 <drac_boy> FLHerne I'll have to try get back into a bit of pixel drawing again one day anyhow ;) 20:21:32 *** Alberth [~hat3@2001:980:272e:1:21a:92ff:fe55:fc8d] has left #openttd [] 20:22:25 <frosch123> night 20:22:28 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d0096af.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:24:54 *** Guest2067 [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:5916:411c:7f93:8757] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:27:37 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: that's the closest thing to a street running train i have experienced: http://img210.imageshack.us/img210/8417/img0437r.jpg 20:29:26 <FLHerne> Weymouth Harbour line looks interesting on videos - I wish I could go back 20 years to see it :-( 20:29:46 <drac_boy> aha I think I know that railroad ... thats their biggest locomotive excluding the several 0-4-0+0-4-0 mallets they had .. some still carrying their old mechanical cable braking systems 20:29:48 <Eddi|zuHause> a more modern view of that spot: http://www.lasergang-shop.de/Grafik_LP/Eselskrug.jpg 20:30:03 <drac_boy> and btw did you know that one of their steam locomotive was actually only a few years old? 20:30:43 <Pinkbeast> I think arriving at Bonaduz in Switzerland and getting off the train, er, onto a railway line was quite alarming enough. 20:31:22 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 20:31:39 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [] 20:32:09 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2612/5729537946_2c40c8dcf8_z.jpg you can see the cablings for the mechanical brake cables 20:32:26 <drac_boy> I still don't really know how these worked tbh, but apparently it did work well after all 20:32:41 <Eddi|zuHause> no, that's a different line. 20:33:01 <Eddi|zuHause> and i think i read they recently stopped using the mechanical brake 20:33:14 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 20:33:29 <drac_boy> yeah they got airbrake on everything, the reofit is noticeable but at least it doesn't take away from their shape :) 20:33:38 <Pinkbeast> Coo, they built such odd-looking locomotives on the Continent 20:33:47 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: if you look carefully, you notice it's more narrow gauge (750m would place it in saxony, while 1m is in the Harz mountains) 20:33:48 <drac_boy> Pinkbeast heh heh 20:34:10 <Eddi|zuHause> mm, of course 20:34:55 * Pinkbeast was in the transport museum in Berlin reading about some German Pacific "noted for its clean lines", or "covered in sticky-out bits" as we say. :-) 20:35:02 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause I forgot which two it was but one of these got a bit 'shortened' due to the berlin wall. at least it still survived obviously 20:36:12 <Pinkbeast> Obviously this is mostly down to our teeny-tiny loading gauge but there you go. 20:36:45 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: neither of those is anywhere close to berlin 20:37:09 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause I know...point was the whole west/east thing affected a bit of the railroad's network 20:37:29 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: however, the Harz was part of the "inner german border" 20:37:34 <drac_boy> either way someone was kind...I finally know the name of the station.. and heres a good photo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2011-08-02_13-05-17_Switzerland_Alp_GrÃŒm.jpg 20:37:47 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: as thus, the railway to the Brocken (highest mountain) was cut 20:37:50 <Pinkbeast> There was a lovely article in _Steam Railway 20:37:52 <drac_boy> thats for real .. no excuse to not say that a U shaped layout is not realistic :) 20:37:52 <Eddi|zuHause> as in not serviced 20:38:26 <Pinkbeast> _ about a locomotive crew who escaped the DDR by chugging up to one of the remaining railway border crossings and opening the regulator at the last station 20:38:43 <Pinkbeast> ... having used up all the air so the guard, who wasn't in on it, couldn't put the brake on 20:39:58 <Eddi|zuHause> i haven't heard about that particular one 20:40:56 <drac_boy> Pinkbeast if that interests you then find some WWII stories...rail-based escapes were quite something. eg steam locomotive with so-so fuel heading to another station to get a new train but...twist is that the tender water was a bit lower on purpose as theres a few people sitting inside there clearly out of view 20:41:13 <Pinkbeast> If you're really interested I've probably still got that issue. 20:41:32 <Pinkbeast> drac: A hidden downside to tank locomotives. :-) 20:41:51 <drac_boy> Pinkbeast not just tank ... a larger tender could quite hold several :p 20:42:16 <drac_boy> but for tanks...maybe 1-2 if really needed 20:42:40 <Eddi|zuHause> Pinkbeast: if it's this one, they made a movie about it: http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durchbruch_Lok_234 20:42:44 <Pinkbeast> I mean, from the point of view of the escapees - lot more room inside a big tender 20:43:29 <drac_boy> Pinkbeast mm either way a good way to delay reinforcements is to take any locomotive train or not .. and derail it on purpose on the busy line 20:43:45 <drac_boy> the french resistance did that..and that one famous movie showed at least one scene too 20:43:54 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: yes, french resistance used the "wait in the tender" thing a lot 20:44:00 <Pinkbeast> Eddi: from my minimal german that looks familiar 20:44:27 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause what you think of that swiss photo anyhow? 20:44:57 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 20:45:37 *** Sacro [~ben@150.237.48.99] has joined #openttd 20:47:03 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p5DC67F25.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 20:47:23 <Eddi|zuHause2> why would i have a particular opinion about a photo? 20:49:54 <V453000> why not? :) 20:52:55 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD5016.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:01:06 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Rhamphoryncus] 21:05:51 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 21:11:27 <drac_boy> btw http://www.railfaneurope.net/pix/ch/SBB_CFF_FFS/diesel/Am4_4/SBB18467.jpg does that look too much like a german locomotive to anyone? :) 21:12:07 <Pinkbeast> I can never get over the "SBB CFF, for fuck's sake" on the side of those. 21:12:12 <Pinkbeast> (Yeah, I know really) 21:12:33 <drac_boy> heh....hm why? 21:12:33 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: yes, those are former german engines which were bought by swiss railways 21:13:17 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause yeah not sure if thats a V200 or just something else similar to it tho 21:13:26 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: it is 21:13:43 <drac_boy> ah... diesel-hydraulic on sbb ... wonder what the mechanics might have thought of it 21:14:02 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think this was a success :) 21:14:31 <Eddi|zuHause> german railways got rid of them for a reason :) 21:14:40 <Pinkbeast> Didn't the Swiss at one point have some mad steam shunters converted to use electrical power to heat the boiler? 21:14:57 <drac_boy> Pinkbeast that was due to lot of hydro power but some coal shortage during war 21:15:11 <drac_boy> they still retained coal firing mind you 21:19:05 <Pinkbeast> It's clever in a mad sort of way, I admire it. 21:19:52 <drac_boy> pinkbeast btw there is something you might like..give me a moment to find a good photo :p 21:23:44 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.wanadoo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:33:12 * Pinkbeast is offline to mangle dinner in five minutes, be warned... 21:34:11 *** ben1066 [~quassel@2a00:dcc0:eda:89:14:179:e28f:960d] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:38:18 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #openttd 21:39:03 <drac_boy> Pinkbeast took me a while to find a good photo since there were quite few but anyhow http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6080/6109964956_df7fc3b9dd_b.jpg 21:39:18 <drac_boy> and nope its not you .. it really is ontario aka canada :) 21:39:38 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 21:40:04 <drac_boy> too bad the locomotives themself just couldn't last well in the canada winters .. replaced by alike-painted modified F7 units instead for another few years then finally even the coaches were gone as well 21:41:33 <Pinkbeast> That's quite elegant for North American railways, isn't it? 21:41:36 <drac_boy> and heres the F7am unit (I assume the rear is a cab-only "locomotive" probably) in toronto which was its southmost station (so the via train probably is heading for ottawa or montreal) 21:41:39 <drac_boy> http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7035/6427370543_743d4c7282_z.jpg 21:42:03 *** ben1066 [~quassel@2a00:dcc0:eda:89:14:179:e28f:960d] has joined #openttd 21:43:09 <drac_boy> pinkbeast not everything were bad tho, try this ex-sweden ex-'hidden away during cold war in case of electrification collapse' steam locomotive http://www.lowdownonline.com/wp-content/uploads/the-wakefield-steam-train-scott-fiander.jpg 21:43:19 <drac_boy> and thats a sweden diesel behind it for shunting purpose as well :) 21:43:44 <drac_boy> but for at least 2 years now they have not ran due to line issues etc etc 21:43:48 *** Vadtec [~Vadtec@2001:470:1f06:13e0::1337] has joined #openttd 21:44:53 <drac_boy> pinkbeast it was more or less an isolated line (although one unused link still exist) so thats why they could retain their original couplers etc 21:48:37 <drac_boy> and if you still want to go on about foreign trains try this http://farm1.staticflickr.com/226/480959276_342ab9abea.jpg sweden electric .. it resulted in the AEM-7 :p 21:48:55 *** ben1066 [~quassel@2a00:dcc0:eda:89:14:179:e28f:960d] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:49:33 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-040-117.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 21:50:51 <drac_boy> too bad nothing actually happened from these two for some reason tho http://www.trainweb.org/railpix/x2w1.jpg http://www.polar.sunynassau.edu/~fanellis/amtrak_ice_on_test_run.jpg 21:51:08 <drac_boy> Acela doesn't really 'match' anyway :) 21:51:30 <drac_boy> and pinkbeast...yes..that *is* an ICE-1 for the latter 21:51:41 <drac_boy> :) 21:54:50 <Elukka> america hates passenger rail 21:55:03 <Elukka> they used to have a very comprehensive light rail network too 21:55:44 <Elukka> the burgeoning car industry killed it and implanted the idea that one must always use their own car in the american popular consciousness 21:55:49 <Elukka> mass transit is for poor people 21:55:50 <drac_boy> elukka heh 1971 was a bit of mess but what else could be really done when too many railroads wanted out of this big red expense? 21:56:10 <drac_boy> only a few smaller railroads still wanted to stick to their own passenger trains one way or another 21:56:42 <Elukka> well, suburban rail was already dead and buried by that time... 21:56:57 <drac_boy> elukka tell that to toronto :p 21:57:09 <Elukka> not because it wasn't profitable 21:57:26 <Elukka> but because GM & co literally bought out the light rail and tram companies and shut them down 21:57:52 <Elukka> they were convicted and fined 00 for permanently sabotaging america's infrastructure 21:58:23 <Elukka> the chief architect of the plot was also fined :D 21:58:57 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A29B.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:58:58 <Eddi|zuHause> that's better than the banking crisis, where nobody was convicted of anything 21:59:30 <Elukka> you can thank GM for LA being a smoggy, gridlocked mess, among other things 21:59:43 <Elukka> it's not an accident 21:59:45 <drac_boy> elukka its pretty much coming to a slowdown whether anyone likes it or not.. political movements wouldn't do anything for ever-dwindling oil sources no matter how hard they try :P 22:00:12 <drac_boy> and that bailout for the "big three" has always been questioned hard for a long time yet as well 22:02:35 <drac_boy> elukka what you think of the usual problem of most americans having a rather bad ego? :P 22:03:11 <Elukka> well, that depends on the particular american in question :P 22:03:27 <Elukka> they're not all terrible! 22:03:54 <drac_boy> elukka...how about the one that buys a fullsize suv that runs on gas .. and all they do is downtown driving with no passengers or anything? 22:04:10 <Elukka> well they're stupid 22:04:16 <drac_boy> heh :p 22:05:10 <drac_boy> anyway that reminds me of something else tho... 22:05:20 <Eddi|zuHause> generalisations are always bad! 22:06:07 <Eddi|zuHause> (that is a generalisation, btw.) 22:06:12 *** roadt [~roadt@114.96.130.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:06:22 <Supercheese> I've always wanted a car that runs on natural gas. I mean, it's piped to my house and everything, all I'd need is a compressor 22:06:31 <Supercheese> Figure it burns cleaner too 22:06:36 <drac_boy> I know germany and switzerland share borders but do anyone think its ever plausible to have some overnight train from denmark or poland end up at a switzerland border station? 22:06:42 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 22:06:50 <drac_boy> in theory that is..doesn't have to be a real example 22:07:08 <Eddi|zuHause> there's an overnight train from Berlin to Basel 22:08:15 <Elukka> i like electric cars on principle 22:08:20 <Elukka> just gotta work on the practicality a tad... 22:08:32 <Elukka> tesla's working on that 22:08:41 <Eddi|zuHause> electric cars are a dead end 22:08:49 <Elukka> they're going down from expensive sports cars to more normal cars as the technology develops 22:08:51 <Elukka> why? 22:08:59 <Eddi|zuHause> there's not enough lithium in the world to put a battery in every car 22:09:05 <glx> autonomy is way too low 22:09:07 <drac_boy> mm I was thinking more about like eg a dsb electric locomotive ending up within photo-sharing distance of a sbb locomotive 22:09:22 <Eddi|zuHause> and a battery dies after ~5 years 22:09:42 <drac_boy> but if it doesn't sound too plausible thats ok..it was just an afterthought :) 22:09:45 <Eddi|zuHause> so you need an extensive recycling infrastructure 22:10:03 <Elukka> i'm not sure that's an inherent limitation of the technology 22:10:10 <Elukka> better batteries are worked on all the time 22:10:21 <Eddi|zuHause> fuel cells would be interesting 22:10:43 <Elukka> supercheese: i've heard you can get kits to convert pretty much any car to burn natural gas 22:10:44 <Eddi|zuHause> (hydrogen-based combustion) 22:10:48 <Elukka> for... a couple thousand euros? 22:11:13 * Supercheese lives in the United States 22:11:21 <Eddi|zuHause> if you can figure out the distribution of hydrogen through a fuel station system 22:11:22 <Elukka> a couple thousand dollars probably, then :P 22:11:25 <Supercheese> :P 22:11:33 <Elukka> it pays itself back pretty fast if you happen to have a station that sells the stuff where you live 22:11:58 <glx> Elukka: doesn't work on diesel engine I think 22:12:01 <Eddi|zuHause> you can then create the hydrogen at the energy source, like near the offshore wind parks or in the norwegian mountains 22:12:07 <Elukka> i think BMW built cars that run on straight liquid hydrogen rather than fuel cells too 22:12:14 <Supercheese> Depending on the extractable energy available in natural gas vs. gasoline, it could be quite cheaper 22:12:25 <Supercheese> I haven't run the calculations, though 22:12:27 <Eddi|zuHause> without having to worry about distributing the short-lived electricity across europe 22:12:30 <Elukka> thorium reactors could generate hydrogen as a byproduct for essentially free... 22:12:38 <Eddi|zuHause> but instead the more long term hydrogen-based fuel 22:13:21 <Supercheese> Or even better, distill your own alcohol and run your car on that 22:13:38 <Supercheese> Problem is the government regulates the $#%& out of distillation 22:13:48 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: that doesn't sound particularly energy-efficient 22:14:27 <Supercheese> the Model A was a dual-fuel car, alcohol and gasoline 22:14:34 <Supercheese> Ford thought it was fine :) 22:14:44 <Elukka> hm. the tesla model s has a range of 426 kilometers and a battery guarantee of 8 years 22:14:48 <Elukka> not quite there yet, but they're getting better 22:15:10 <glx> and how long for a charge ? 22:15:12 <Supercheese> then Prohibition hit in the States, and alcohol as a fuel died rather fast 22:15:13 <Elukka> too long 22:15:33 <Elukka> i vaguely recall something about some technology that would allow charging in a few minutes but i suspect that would require different battery technology 22:15:50 <Elukka> and the power grid couldn't take it, but a gas station could probably build something to deal with it 22:16:05 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: that's one of the main problems with electric cars 22:16:20 <Elukka> it's a solvable problem 22:16:30 <Eddi|zuHause> electricity is bad for one-time burst energy transfers 22:16:58 <Eddi|zuHause> you're better off refitting every (major) road with induction circuits 22:17:16 <Eddi|zuHause> and have the battery only for short distance travels 22:17:36 <Elukka> that sounds way more expensive and maintenance-intensive 22:18:32 <Elukka> the model s apparently has a charging mode where it fills up in a bit less than an hour 22:18:42 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-133-9-237.range86-133.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 15.0/20120731150526]] 22:19:41 *** TheDude [~Miranda@ip-86-49-102-148.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 22:20:26 <drac_boy> http://19891130.de/1969.05.14 Muggendorf/03 280 007 2021 Mugg 14.5.69.jpg huh this is a first ... railbus leading train 22:21:06 <glx> spaces in links is not a good idea 22:21:27 <drac_boy> mm what you mean? I don't see any space her 22:21:44 <TrueBrain> I almost kicked him for being a spambot :P It was that I somehow linked the name as being here earlier in time :P 22:22:01 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-213-79.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 22:22:13 <drac_boy> truebrain...there was a mugg here? 22:22:47 *** michi_cc [~michi@dude.icosahedron.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:23:07 <TrueBrain> random numeric domain with an invalid URL (spaces are not valid in an URL, should be %20) .. so close :D 22:23:23 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: the railbusses (VT98, not the earlier VT95) were designed so they could pull regular wagons 22:23:47 <drac_boy> truebrain hm must be your client as its already %20 here 22:24:01 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause well theres a locomotive in the middle if you can notice its cab hump 22:24:02 <TrueBrain> drac_boy: mine, and glx', and everyone else in this channel, sure :) 22:24:09 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: no, it must be your client that is converting the %20 upon send 22:24:38 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause its only konversation straight from cd .. so theres no plugin or anything 22:25:10 <glx> http://19891130.de/1969.05.14%20Muggendorf/03%20280%20007%202021%20Mugg%2014.5.69.jpg 22:25:22 <drac_boy> either way what was with vt98 vs vt95 anyway? 22:25:22 <Elukka> that is a pretty weird train 22:25:22 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: Konversation usually disables the %-expansion in urls 22:25:23 <glx> that's how it should be 22:25:27 *** ben1066 [~quassel@2a00:dcc0:eda:89:14:179:e28f:960d] has joined #openttd 22:26:19 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: VT95 is the first version of the (post-war) DB railcar, VT98 is a few years later with stronger motor and the possibility to couple with normal wagons 22:27:14 <drac_boy> ah, so the vt95 only had a small drawbar rather than full couplers? 22:28:18 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, something like that. the VT95 could only be coupled with a railcar-wagon (no steering wagon, so it had to run around at the end) 22:28:19 <drac_boy> I still think the non-red colour used on them looks a bit weird to me but what can I say tho :) 22:28:42 <Eddi|zuHause> what non-red? 22:29:31 <drac_boy> hmm maybe it wasn't the vt98 ... might be thinking of a different railbus somewhere else that did not look so nice in newer colours 22:30:24 <drac_boy> and btw funny enough a quick look turned up this http://www.woernitz-franken.de/vt98un1.jpg apparently theres always a big chance something has derailed at least once in their life :p 22:30:36 <Eddi|zuHause> there are some private railways that have different colours 22:30:46 <drac_boy> for that kind of plowing it must had been going at full throttle 22:30:51 <Eddi|zuHause> and some railcars were painted mint-green in later years 22:31:24 <Eddi|zuHause> not sure if the oceanblue/beige livery was applied to railcars 22:31:57 <drac_boy> mm tbh I sometimes think certain diesel shunters looked better in red than that navy blue .. especially V100 for one 22:32:00 <Elukka> interestingly there are still V200 running under differnet companies 22:32:01 <drac_boy> but thats just my own view 22:32:03 <Elukka> some of them have godawful color schemes 22:32:09 <Elukka> like a mess of colors with a huge URL on the side 22:32:29 *** michi_cc [~michi@dude.icosahedron.de] has joined #openttd 22:32:32 *** mode/#openttd [+v michi_cc] by ChanServ 22:32:44 <drac_boy> oh about passengers I do have something I've wondered about 22:32:50 <Elukka> http://www.richardkrol.nl/fotos/v200/rollout/221136neustrelitzb.jpg 22:32:52 <Elukka> this one is excellent though 22:33:15 <Elukka> just as good as the original red 22:33:20 <drac_boy> exactly what was with the name 'thunderbox' for these numerous 2-axle coaches? 22:33:36 <Elukka> noisy steel bodies 22:33:55 <drac_boy> oh, really? hm had not thought you could get that noisy 22:34:06 <drac_boy> interesting 22:35:19 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 22:35:39 *** ludde [~b@c80-217-210-102.bredband.comhem.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:35:49 <Eddi|zuHause> "Der Name beruht auf dem starken Dröhnen dieser Fahrzeuge aufgrund der nicht vorhandenen DÀmmung" 22:36:06 <Eddi|zuHause> http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/DonnerbÃŒchse_(Personenwagen) 22:36:40 <drac_boy> elukka well noise or not .. I sorta liked some of the older train makeups ... eg ET87 with 6+ thunderboxes on the mountain route .. or a V36 with one baggage and 2 or more thunderboxes on branchline 22:36:58 <Elukka> old german trains are the best trains 22:36:59 <drac_boy> I always thought the V36 was a bit unusual for passenger power but I guess whatever worked for them 22:37:16 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: you sure that wasn't an ET89? 22:37:45 <Elukka> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/Railway/IMG_2725-1.jpg 22:37:45 <Elukka> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/Railway/IMG_3475-1.jpg 22:37:47 <Elukka> related :P 22:38:04 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: V36 are military (WWII) engines that were repurposed after the war 22:38:10 <drac_boy> oh ... sorry yeah Eddi|zuHause ET89 ... I never can remember the right numberings sometimes 22:38:27 <drac_boy> ET87 must be that odd cabcar+loco+cabcar set then was it? 22:38:40 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 22:39:09 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause I always found the ET87 sorta weird yet interesting 22:39:46 <drac_boy> 2+1, 2+1, 1+2 axles arrangement 22:40:15 <drac_boy> of course I do wonder if they ever used extra coaches with the ET87 or not 22:40:20 <Eddi|zuHause> well, 2'1+B'1+1'2 22:41:03 <drac_boy> elukka...mm ... C tracks .. a bit too modern for me .. but heh .. how large's your collection/layout seriously? :) 22:41:03 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: i've seen a photo where it had an additional steering car, but i find it unlikely that it regularly had other coaches attached 22:41:46 *** michi_cc [~michi@dude.icosahedron.de] has left #openttd [] 22:41:46 *** michi_cc [~michi@dude.icosahedron.de] has joined #openttd 22:41:49 *** mode/#openttd [+v michi_cc] by ChanServ 22:41:50 <Elukka> not very 22:41:50 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: it was already fairly underpowered for the mountain-track it was used on 22:41:56 <Elukka> i need to find some motivation to work on it 22:41:57 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause mm sounds like it usually ran on its own then .. just like with the uk autorails .. it was always only autocoach+loco or autocoach+loco+autocoach .. very rare to have a intermidate coach in 22:42:08 <Elukka> i've been working on weathering the track a bit 22:42:41 <Elukka> not happy with the ballast yet though 22:42:41 <Elukka> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/Railway/track1.jpg 22:42:46 <Eddi|zuHause> drac_boy: during (touristical) peak-times, you could combine up to 3 3-part sets, though 22:42:51 <Elukka> but hey it's better than plain c track 22:43:05 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause mm makes sense, MU is MU after all 22:43:50 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause btw the ET89 interestingly enough only had 2 powered axles, not four .. yet it didn't have a problem with hauling several many coaches at times if needed 22:44:17 <drac_boy> of course it ran alone many other times as the later-reofitted red laterns at both ends showed 22:46:50 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d0835ee.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us] 22:47:42 <drac_boy> elukka .. so what sort of layout is it... an oval with station or well you know :) 22:49:27 <Eddi|zuHause> a dig in the log says http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/Railway/trackplan.png 22:49:38 <Elukka> sneaky :P 22:49:43 <Elukka> i don't have an awful lot of space 22:49:48 <Elukka> and honestly most of it isn't done :/ 22:49:53 <Elukka> i have the central mountain's basic shape down 22:49:59 <Elukka> and the tunnels are... functional 22:50:07 <Elukka> the spiral down probably won't exist :D 22:50:41 <drac_boy> actually thats rather interesting abit I'll sorta question two locomotive sheds? 22:51:26 <Elukka> i couldn't fit a roundhouse anywhere so i put a couple smaller sheds 22:51:44 <Elukka> well i could fit a roundhouse in the big bulging part but it'd fill up the table too bad 22:51:51 <Elukka> gotta strike a balance between amount of track and scenery 22:52:15 <drac_boy> elukka... well can I suggest an optional alternative? 22:52:21 <Elukka> sure 22:52:38 <Elukka> apparently i've changed the town names and some other small stuff since that pic 22:52:41 <Elukka> but it's mostly the same 22:53:21 <drac_boy> take the green-located locomotive sheds out .. move the mainline switch a bit further to right .. then plop a mostly-homemade four tracks transfer table? (2 sheds facing west .. one east .. and the one eastward access track) 22:53:29 <drac_boy> don't know if it'll clash with the steam locomotives tho :) 22:54:12 <Elukka> i think it'd be a bit out of period plus i'd have trouble fitting it in 22:54:23 <drac_boy> heh allright np 22:54:33 <Elukka> i'm going for a 60's setting 22:54:37 <drac_boy> some transfer tables did actually see steam locomotives but thats country-specific after all 22:54:38 <Elukka> (like everyone else) 22:55:17 <drac_boy> and on the opposite side: in usa, finding geeps sharing the same roundhouse turntable as steam locomotives wasn't too rare :p 22:55:42 <drac_boy> even GP40's as well 22:55:53 <Elukka> early 20th century would be interesting too 22:55:58 <Elukka> but i like some of the diesels too much 22:56:21 <Elukka> modern i don't like that much 22:56:23 <drac_boy> elukka there is one thing I had been thinking about scratchbuilding for fun tho... 22:56:30 <Elukka> plus in the 60's i can still get away with shorter wagons 22:56:55 <Elukka> modern 4 axle coaches and such are just too long for my layout's curves 22:56:59 <Elukka> they'd work but they look bad 22:57:32 <drac_boy> what I want to try build ... is one of the two classes of battery trainsets that operated light but long branchline routes 22:57:35 <Elukka> you know i actually changed the main curve in the lower right of the main part of the layout to have gentler curves 22:57:46 <drac_boy> quite simple..they had a boxy shape .. the only curves would be a bit in the roof itself but thats easy to work with 22:58:03 <drac_boy> I never EVER can remember the class # for these tho :| 22:58:48 <Elukka> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/Railway/trackplan-1.png 22:59:00 <Elukka> moved the switches off the curve, moved the locomotive depot, added some extra sidings 22:59:27 <drac_boy> and elukka...btw ... a battery train in the midst of steam/diesel would be rather amusing to say the least .. I mean could you imagine if you had a sound system for your layout? :P 22:59:29 <Elukka> the change in the curve doesn't look so significant from a topdown view but those switches were 360 mm radius 22:59:32 <Elukka> the current curve looks much better 22:59:40 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Hugs to all] 22:59:49 <Elukka> the outer line is 515 mm at the tightest 22:59:53 <drac_boy> the steam would chuff off .. diesel making their usual grumbling .. but that one odd trainset just zoom off too quietly without much of a sound? :P 22:59:54 <Elukka> still tighter than i'd like but i just don't have the space 23:00:17 <Wolf01> 'night all 23:00:20 <Elukka> my locomotives do have sound :P 23:00:23 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:00:48 <drac_boy> elukka well a battery powered train only has the flange and motor humm noise .. and these are barely audible in real life? :P 23:02:31 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.65.26] has joined #openttd 23:04:05 <drac_boy> elukka so .. you like to weather your trains? 23:04:14 <Elukka> yeah 23:04:20 <drac_boy> just curious from the dirt I noticed in that closeup photo 23:04:36 <drac_boy> any more train photos you can share? :) 23:04:57 <Elukka> http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z113/Elucca/Railway/IMG_34261.jpg 23:05:02 <Elukka> closeup on the cab, that was before i weathered the rest 23:05:44 <Elukka> watercolor makes nice rust/worn paint patterns 23:07:49 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.78.36] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:09:48 <drac_boy> or no? :p 23:10:07 *** Chrill [Chrill@c83-253-89-11.bredband.comhem.se] has joined #openttd 23:13:11 <Terkhen> good night 23:13:19 <drac_boy> bye Terkhen 23:17:00 <drac_boy> elukka either way I've got a bit of mix of marklins here too.. still working on ordering some more this month ... aside to clearing out the last major box of older usa trains I just hadn't liked anymore :) 23:17:20 <drac_boy> still thinking about one bemo order too.... or not...hard to say yet :) 23:17:31 <Elukka> i decided i'm gonna stop buying stuff until i get off my ass and actually work on the layout :P 23:18:26 <drac_boy> elukka heh well tbh I can't really do much when I have one steam locomotive, a small freight shunter, one old 2-car doubledeck wagonset, one restaurant car, and a few random freight wagons 23:18:37 <drac_boy> not really anything to make up a 'decent' train with at all :) 23:20:48 <drac_boy> elukka.. the one bemo train would be interesting tho.... 23:22:32 <drac_boy> http://www.bemo-modellbahn.de/fileadmin/bemo/img/illus/produkte/7255100.jpg 23:22:56 <drac_boy> might be the only electric locomotive I'll have ... but still has siderods :) 23:23:21 <drac_boy> of course I might have to add a few more coaches tho .. one just seem silly 23:25:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that looks swiss 23:25:19 <drac_boy> Eddi|zuHause its rhb, what else :) 23:25:35 <Eddi|zuHause> so narrow gauge, how do you fit that in anywhere? 23:26:22 <drac_boy> I was already planning a semi-mountain layout ... so the marklin trains get most of the land and a bit of slope .. then theres a short (whether oval or point-to-point I still have to decide on yet) metre gauge section on the mountain 23:27:16 <drac_boy> going to have everything a bit covered in snow .. would save me having to do grass/rocks because its just all varying height of snow everywhere instead :P 23:27:26 <Eddi|zuHause> if i were to fit in narrow gauge in a layout, it would probably be a tram 23:27:41 <drac_boy> would still have to find out how to do some molds for the mountain rock faces tho but at least thats a much smaller thing to do 23:28:01 <drac_boy> mm I've thought a bit about towns but not too inclined 23:28:11 <drac_boy> it'll mostly be countrysides 23:29:52 <drac_boy> btw its more or less freelanced so I'm not too worried about if theres no real example of drg-served standard gauge platform sharing with metre gauge platform 23:30:15 <drac_boy> just as long as its not something too crazy such as a BR.05 showing up next to a lone BDe 23:30:31 * drac_boy wouldn't want to afford such a large express steam loco anyway 23:31:31 <drac_boy> they go for over 0 used ... don't know what new would cost :P 23:32:40 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.69.5] has joined #openttd 23:32:59 <drac_boy> a smaller express 2-6-0 with short bogie coaches meeting a rhb crocodile with 3-5 of its own coaches seem ok to me if its just for fun :) 23:33:19 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@5070A0D5.static.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:35:46 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-70-165.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 23:37:34 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.65.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:41:34 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-1-45.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:42:44 <Eddi|zuHause> btw, if there ever were a {Copenhagen,Warszaw}-Berlin-{Bern,ZÃŒrich} train, it would likely have a DB engine pulling it 23:44:07 <drac_boy> mm 23:44:35 <drac_boy> btw I had actually thought a bit about berlin-zurich trains but I'm not sure if I want to find some sleepers or not .... for now I'll just more or less consider 'local' trains 23:45:07 <Eddi|zuHause> like i said, the overnight trains are Berlin-Bern 23:45:31 <Eddi|zuHause> er, i meant Basel 23:47:43 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.76.193] has joined #openttd 23:52:44 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.69.5] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:57:23 <drac_boy> mm 23:57:40 <drac_boy> either way the reason I was ending up with marklin is because I just like the simplification that comes from the 3-rail ac system 23:57:50 <drac_boy> not to mention no polarity issues 23:58:02 <drac_boy> of course other buyers have their own ideas too