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00:16:23 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-015-188.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:35:34 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 00:35:40 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 00:39:22 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6A9FF.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:41:34 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:49:36 *** Celestar [~vici@mnch-5d85515a.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 00:56:34 *** Celestar_ [~vici@mnch-4d04f0ac.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:08:49 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wlan132190.mobiel.utwente.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:19:08 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:19:31 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:a5d4:f276:241c:ca09] has joined #openttd 01:23:52 *** wakou2 [~stephen@host109-145-49-167.range109-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 01:24:17 <wakou2> Hi anybody home? 01:24:53 <wakou2> http://wstaw.org/m/2013/02/26/Kinningville_Transport_30th_May_2035.png 01:26:45 <wakou2> Can someone point me to a simple guide to show me how to build a station with overflow. My trains wait at the last siganl on the entry rail. If I put signals on the platform entries, they jst 'stick a nose in' and bloc the whole line until THAT platform is free 01:38:04 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-253.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 01:51:37 <Eddi|zuHause> you need entry/exit signals for that, it won't work with path signals 01:55:47 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 01:59:56 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 02:07:28 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:40:56 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 02:41:03 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [] 02:43:11 <wakou2> I have tried a few different variants with old stlye siganal, and have given myself a headache! 02:49:51 *** tracerpt [4d566867@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 02:52:18 <tracerpt> aloha :D 03:34:48 *** wakou2 [~stephen@host109-145-49-167.range109-145.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 03:42:55 *** ST2 is now known as xT2 03:46:37 *** wakou2 [~stephen@host109-145-49-167.range109-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 04:04:46 *** Pokka [~Octomom@d58-106-19-54.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 04:28:49 *** Bad_Brett [~bad@78-69-118-27-no42.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 04:32:53 *** wakou2 [~stephen@host109-145-49-167.range109-145.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 04:50:17 *** Bad_Brett [~bad@78-69-118-27-no42.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:13:00 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 05:13:20 *** ST2 [~JrC@bl6-253-218.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 05:18:41 *** xT2 [~JrC@bl6-135-137.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:18:41 *** ST2 is now known as xT2 05:29:14 *** tracerpt [4d566867@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 05:34:53 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye !] 05:53:01 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.73.68] has joined #openttd 05:53:01 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.68] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:53:23 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:53:38 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 05:57:50 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0097ae.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:28:15 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-253.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 06:36:50 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-253.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 06:46:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4080.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 06:46:17 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD5CA2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:48:05 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-070-106.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 07:27:40 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wlan132190.mobiel.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 07:29:08 *** bo-31027_ is now known as bo-31027 07:32:56 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 07:37:41 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 08:04:01 *** Twofish [~Twofish@0001308f.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 08:10:55 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 08:12:46 <andythenorth> not only but also 08:15:28 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has joined #openttd 08:19:31 <andythenorth> Pokka: bonjour 08:27:07 *** bo-31027 [~bco@87.116.34.12] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:33:16 <peter1138> quoi 08:33:41 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:33:58 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 08:34:15 <Supercheese> Soooo, bridges-over-stations, how's that going? Any patch for testing? 08:38:10 *** bo-31027 [~bco@87.116.34.12] has joined #openttd 08:40:49 <oskari89> Bridges over stations, sounds nice :) 08:47:26 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 08:49:33 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 08:56:00 <Pokka> good day gentlemen 08:57:57 <andythenorth> are all of those terms true? :) 08:58:04 <andythenorth> or is it a colloquilsiasdiadasm 09:00:09 <andythenorth> so http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=ubncjVtb 09:00:13 <andythenorth> how do I do that? 09:00:32 <andythenorth> I can probably hack at it and do it in 3 or 4 passes, but that smells 09:00:48 <andythenorth> seems like Eddi|zuHause would be able to tell me one neat recursive function for it? 09:07:00 *** KouDy [~KouDy@188.75.190.58] has joined #openttd 09:08:19 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 09:09:22 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 09:13:29 <Supercheese> "Don't worry about minute grf license details" he says 09:15:18 <Supercheese> anyway, good night 09:15:25 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 19.0/20130215130331]] 09:22:44 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 09:31:55 *** chester_ [~chester@95-24-39-173.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 09:46:06 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d108-180-71-172.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: DDR is not Dance Dance Revolution.] 09:49:18 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6A9FF.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 09:50:00 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@84.40.82.221] has quit [Quit: Tvel] 10:01:32 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.184.141] has joined #openttd 10:04:02 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.184.141] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:04:04 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6A9FF.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:04:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 10:07:34 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 10:11:14 *** chester_1 [~chester@89-178-185-87.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 10:12:27 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 10:14:00 *** chester_ [~chester@95-24-39-173.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:17:40 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.184.141] has joined #openttd 10:29:46 *** tracerpt [4d566867@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 10:29:54 <tracerpt> good morning 10:47:09 <planetmaker> moin 10:53:00 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:53:03 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 10:55:15 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.184.141] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:56:29 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:57:52 <tracerpt> yawn 10:57:59 <tracerpt> think im going back to bed 10:58:03 <tracerpt> :F 11:01:27 <peter1138> good idea 11:01:42 <Eddi|zuHause> so why is andythenorth never here? 11:05:06 <peter1138> well he was an hour ago 11:06:52 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, and yesterday. and both times he asked a question to me and was gone by the tiem i read it 11:13:03 *** tracerpt [4d566867@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 11:15:45 *** andythenorth [~Andy@rubberductions.plus.com] has joined #openttd 11:17:16 <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, the "shortest" result i can come up with for his question: "tmp = flatten(input); for i in range(0,len(tmp): output["%d..%d"%(tmp[i],tmp[i+1]-1)] = [j for j,r in enumerate(input) if tmp[i] in range(r*)]" 11:17:55 <Eddi|zuHause> where "flatten" is something left to implement that transforms a nested list into a single list, with sorting and erasing duplicates 11:19:07 <Eddi|zuHause> then you get a dict out of it with {"x..y": [0,1], "z..a" [1]} etc. 11:19:25 <Eddi|zuHause> or with a slight modification you can get a list of strings 11:19:48 <Eddi|zuHause> oh, there he is :) 11:20:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess it needs to be range(*r) 11:23:46 *** Extrems [borgs@24.157.137.219] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:28:47 *** wakou2 [~stephen@host109-145-49-167.range109-145.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 11:33:07 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: my code is....long http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=fT8gPMun 11:34:06 <andythenorth> input is similar to [[0, 9999], [1900, 1990]] 11:35:58 <Eddi|zuHause> you have a strange way of appending to a list :p 11:38:21 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@212.36.5.170] has joined #openttd 11:52:33 <andythenorth> I could probably have used a comprehension, but my brain is a mess 11:53:00 <andythenorth> I don't like this code 11:53:07 <andythenorth> otoh it probably works :P 11:54:59 <andythenorth> hmm 11:55:09 <andythenorth> dict.keys() might have arbitrary order? 12:14:20 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 12:14:36 <Eddi|zuHause> add .sorted() 12:17:36 <Eddi|zuHause> but you could also use an actual list instead of abusing a dict :p 12:18:50 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wlan132190.mobiel.utwente.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:20:32 *** ST2 [~JrC@bl6-253-218.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd 12:24:24 *** xT2 [~JrC@bl6-253-218.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:25:16 <andythenorth> yes 12:25:18 <andythenorth> or even a set 12:25:28 <andythenorth> I write terrible code when I'm sick :P 12:25:41 <andythenorth> and probably when I'm not sick :P 12:28:46 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: feel free to refactor :) 12:42:33 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:22:40 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@199.255.210.75] has joined #openttd 13:23:58 *** RavingManiac_ [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 13:30:45 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@c7ffd24b.test.dnsbl.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:32:17 *** goodger [~ben@host86-166-165-94.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: goodger] 13:33:38 *** goodger [~ben@host86-166-165-94.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 13:59:01 *** Bad_Brett [~bad@78-69-118-27-no42.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 14:02:04 *** RavingManiac_ [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:02:23 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 14:05:25 *** Twofish [~Twofish@0001308f.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:06:34 *** Extrems [borgs@24.157.137.219] has joined #openttd 14:20:12 *** snorre [~snorre@c4A06BF51.dhcp.as2116.net] has joined #openttd 14:35:27 *** Twofish [~Twofish@0001308f.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 14:42:49 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:43:04 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 14:56:29 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth try: reduce(set.union, input, set()) 14:56:48 <Eddi|zuHause> where input is your list of list 14:57:36 <Eddi|zuHause> this gives you the list of all trigger dates 14:57:44 <Eddi|zuHause> with removed duplicates 15:00:47 <Eddi|zuHause> and then: for date in triggers: for counter. (start, end) in enumerate(input): if date in range(start, end): output[date].append(counter) 15:01:19 <Eddi|zuHause> misses an output[date]=[] 15:06:43 <andythenorth> bah, can't believe I forgot about enumerate :( 15:06:45 <andythenorth> how silly 15:09:31 <Eddi|zuHause> the inner loop could be simplified by a list comprehension 15:10:23 <andythenorth> for counter. ? 15:10:31 <Eddi|zuHause> so: for date in triggers: output[date] = [counter for counter, (start, end) in enumerate(input) if date in range(start, end)] 15:10:45 <andythenorth> nice 15:10:49 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: that should be a comma 15:11:37 <andythenorth> excellent, that's perfect :) 15:12:37 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: ever play python code golf? o_O 15:12:49 <Eddi|zuHause> i've seen people play it 15:13:02 <Eddi|zuHause> but sometimes "short" != "elegant" :) 15:13:07 <andythenorth> no 15:13:15 <andythenorth> there should be python code ballet :P 15:16:18 <Eddi|zuHause> one time in school in a test, my teacher was impressed because my solution was so much shorter and cleaner than his default solution that he used mine instead :) 15:17:04 <Eddi|zuHause> (that was in pascal, and the question was something like "implement a function that applies word wrap at width x") 15:17:47 <andythenorth> did it have split() and join() ? :P 15:18:00 <Eddi|zuHause> no 15:18:19 <Eddi|zuHause> but next(' ') or something 15:29:27 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: pascal did not have dynamic arrays/lists, only arrays with fixed length 15:35:52 <andythenorth> how rare 15:35:58 <andythenorth> that must have been fun 15:36:08 <andythenorth> so to append, did you copy the old array into a new array? 15:43:23 <Eddi|zuHause> back then, if you wanted to "append" things, you used linked lists instead of arrays 15:45:17 <blathijs> Just like now, except that you don't need to implement the linked list yourself nowadays ;-) 15:45:59 <V453000> snow train http://auto.idnes.cz/foto.aspx?server=auto.idnes.cz&r=autokat&c=A130226_001008_auto_testy_fdv&foto=FDV497a0c_fotogalerie_hg_13.jpg 15:47:07 <andythenorth> hagglunds 15:47:15 <andythenorth> V453000 you should do an RV set :P 15:47:42 <andythenorth> V453000: nodwells http://foremost.ca/products/vehicles 15:47:46 <andythenorth> nodwells caused FIRS 15:47:52 <andythenorth> I needed a cargo for them to transport 15:47:55 <andythenorth> so I invented ensp 15:48:02 <andythenorth> then I had to invent the rest of FIRS 15:48:13 <andythenorth> irony: I never added the nodwells to HEQS :P 15:48:22 <V453000> :D 15:48:26 <V453000> rofl 15:48:49 <V453000> http://www.pilsner-urquell.com/in caused NUTS 15:49:24 <Eddi|zuHause> pfft :p 15:49:53 <Eddi|zuHause> should have called it PIVO :p 15:49:53 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3866/nodwells.png 15:50:22 <V453000> :D 15:50:41 <V453000> lol andy :) 15:50:53 <V453000> you can code them as trains? 15:50:55 <V453000> hint hint 15:51:06 <andythenorth> :P 15:51:14 <andythenorth> code everything as trains 15:51:21 <andythenorth> I should stop talking about it, start doing it 15:51:30 <Eddi|zuHause> code them as hovercrafts that go on snow instead of water :p 15:51:34 <andythenorth> then we could drop the other transport types 15:51:43 <andythenorth> V453000: you know your ships can go on sea? 15:52:08 <andythenorth> you just need to use the canals trick 15:52:23 <V453000> if you put water/canal objects around the rails, yes 15:53:05 <V453000> but diagonals are going to be a bit eww 15:55:32 <andythenorth> diagonals will smell 15:55:35 <andythenorth> we need diagonal canals 15:55:57 *** andythenorth [~Andy@rubberductions.plus.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 15:56:02 <V453000> I guess 1 tile cant have a diagonal object and a diagonal rail on the other half 15:56:11 <Eddi|zuHause> for the canal-tracks, you only need to put two diagonal tracks on the tile 15:56:17 <V453000> But what you can have is 2 diagonal water-rails on 1 tile 15:56:28 <V453000> yeah but they include buoys for the "rail" 15:56:28 *** Pukka [~Octomom@d58-106-19-54.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 15:56:59 <V453000> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/20419525/rails_of_mayhem.png 15:57:42 <Eddi|zuHause> i suppose using fences won't work either 15:58:33 <V453000> looks like no fence is created when next co canal 15:58:35 <V453000> to 15:58:35 <Eddi|zuHause> shouldn't the buoys have different colour on the left and right side? 15:58:50 <Eddi|zuHause> fences check who owns the neighbouring tile 15:59:00 <V453000> right 15:59:14 <V453000> different colours, dont know :) 15:59:48 <V453000> felt like r/w and g/y makes the junctions somewhat orientable 16:01:55 *** Pokka [~Octomom@d58-106-19-54.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:02:00 *** Twofish [~Twofish@0001308f.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:03:27 <V453000> but well, the purpose isnt to make these things buildable on water anyway 16:04:10 <Eddi|zuHause> i have no clue what the purpose is anyway :p 16:04:37 <V453000> good question :D 16:04:56 <V453000> just wtf value :P also I am kind of known for hating ships, sooo ... :) 16:05:43 <V453000> this makes "ships" viable 16:06:47 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: so you buy "bays" in the depot, and it constructs and appropriately sized ship out of the bay sprites? :) 16:07:17 <Eddi|zuHause> then use CETS turning magic to keep the sprites together :) 16:07:19 <V453000> sort of 16:07:31 <V453000> it is just a double headed train with wagons 16:07:41 <V453000> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/20419525/mayhem.png 16:07:54 <V453000> 4 wagons in this case 16:08:15 <V453000> sprites very wip :) 16:09:07 <Eddi|zuHause> might want to start with shorter wagons :) 16:09:30 <V453000> hm 16:09:48 <V453000> not sure about that, maybe 16:11:12 *** ntoskrnl [~not@a91-153-231-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 16:27:26 *** kormer [~kormer@c-68-55-166-242.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:43:39 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:43:58 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has joined #openttd 16:44:37 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 16:45:00 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@212.36.5.170] has quit [Quit: Tvel] 16:45:07 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@212.36.5.170] has joined #openttd 16:49:13 <peter1138> crazy 16:49:25 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, you are. 16:49:29 <peter1138> wut 16:49:49 <Eddi|zuHause> as is everybody else who joins here :p 16:50:41 <andythenorth> me no crazy 16:51:46 <Eddi|zuHause> denying you're crazy supports the fact that you are crazy 16:52:28 <V453000> I aint crazy, I iz NUTS 16:52:37 <V453000> difference! 16:54:34 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:55:51 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 16:58:13 <andythenorth> catch 22 17:00:34 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-50dd93-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:01:43 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-50dd93-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 17:04:09 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:07:02 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e0097ae.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 17:09:54 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6D24.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:12:55 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 17:15:54 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has joined #openttd 17:36:43 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.73.68] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:36:55 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.73.68] has joined #openttd 17:41:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.184.141] has joined #openttd 17:42:20 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-253.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 17:42:24 <andythenorth> if date != 9999: # shonky magic special casing for end dates 17:42:24 <andythenorth> 17:42:28 <andythenorth> ho ho 17:42:36 <andythenorth> that's how andythenorth codes :) 17:44:16 <Eddi|zuHause> why have an end date anyway, just use the default clause for infinite? 17:44:22 *** Pukka [~Octomom@d58-106-19-54.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:45:16 *** tracerpt [5766760b@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 17:45:21 <tracerpt> aloha :D 17:56:24 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I'm sure there's a better way, I just can't see it :) 17:57:10 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: anyway, the maximum year is 5000000 17:57:14 *** ZxBiohazardZx [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 17:57:28 <andythenorth> :) 17:57:58 <andythenorth> so anyone playing with vehicles never expire will get default graphics after 9999 17:58:00 <andythenorth> herp 17:58:05 <andythenorth> there must be a better way than this 17:58:07 <Eddi|zuHause> so put in 5000001 17:58:19 <andythenorth> well it just smells all wrong 17:58:20 <jonty-comp> overflow the data type 17:58:25 <andythenorth> I should figure out how to do it 17:58:51 <V453000> andythenorth: note that I often test graphics at 19200 :D 17:59:04 <V453000> ... normally I start game at 1920 17:59:44 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6D24.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:01:17 <andythenorth> hmm 18:01:21 *** tracerpt [5766760b@ircip1.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 18:01:23 <andythenorth> reverse slice last item of list 18:01:24 <andythenorth> should do it 18:03:26 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:09:00 <andythenorth> eliminated 1 of 2 silly max year checks 18:09:28 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 18:11:38 <andythenorth> and 2nd 9999 never shows up in the compiled grf, it's just a config file thing 18:11:42 <andythenorth> that's nicer 18:24:25 *** glx [glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:24:28 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 18:39:45 <andythenorth> hmm 18:40:00 <andythenorth> I have no way to support different kinds of smoke 18:40:15 <andythenorth> varying by date 18:40:28 <Eddi|zuHause> you mean like setting the smoke effect by cb36? 18:41:17 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe you want cb10? 18:43:00 <andythenorth> I mean that I have engineered my config file system with no thought of smoke :) 18:43:15 <andythenorth> ship graphics can vary by date / random 18:43:24 <andythenorth> including steam / diesel variants 18:43:31 <andythenorth> smoke is lame anyway currently :P 18:43:35 *** ntoskrnl [~not@a91-153-231-146.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:44:31 <NGC3982> :e 18:44:54 <andythenorth> ach, I'll just pack more values in to my nested lists, and unpack them :P 18:45:00 <andythenorth> all will be well 18:45:16 <NGC3982> Uh 18:45:17 <NGC3982> What 18:45:20 <NGC3982> What just happend 18:45:23 <Eddi|zuHause> just attach a smoke effect to the graphics? 18:45:27 <NGC3982> http://i.imgur.com/CJTNcwi.jpg 18:45:28 <NGC3982> What is that? 18:45:29 <NGC3982> :E 18:45:56 <Eddi|zuHause> NGC3982: different base graphics set? 18:46:24 <NGC3982> Y..Yes? 18:46:28 *** RavingManiac [~RavingMan@182.55.106.160] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:46:37 <NGC3982> I have no idea. I have never seen that before. 18:46:41 <Eddi|zuHause> NGC3982: so? just change the setting 18:46:52 <NGC3982> When was it changed, and by who? Me? 18:46:52 <NGC3982> :D 18:47:00 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, by you :p 18:47:21 <NGC3982> By NewGRF or something? 18:47:50 <Eddi|zuHause> most likely by downloading it 18:47:55 <NGC3982> It looks amazing. 18:48:13 <NGC3982> Oh, now i know. I downloaded * from Bananas yesterday. 18:48:20 <NGC3982> I guess baseset's turn on by default 18:48:41 <Eddi|zuHause> it picks a random one if you didn't specify a specific one yet 18:48:46 <NGC3982> I see. 18:49:28 <Eddi|zuHause> by "random" i mean the "return 4;" kind of random :) 18:49:49 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 18:49:52 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 18:49:59 <NGC3982> As understood 18:50:12 <Alberth> efenink 18:50:13 <NGC3982> The "nothing can ever be random" discussion is filled with poop. 18:51:19 <Eddi|zuHause> it's better than the "nothing can ever be infinite" discussion at any day :p 18:52:56 <Alberth> not even the disccusion itself? :p 18:54:22 <Eddi|zuHause> i never really understood it, but apparently there are people that say "no (physical) object can be infinite, so you cannot talk about infinity in maths either" 18:55:44 <peter1138> heh 18:56:14 <Alberth> ah, just like the idea of constructive mathematics, where you can only show things to exist by giving an constructive algorithm how to create instances 18:56:15 <NGC3982> The big problem is trying to use things like that in a normal discussion 18:56:46 <NGC3982> If i - on IRC, talking about trains - use the word "random", if of course mean random as in "It's really, really hard to know", and nothing else. 18:56:58 <NGC3982> And simply caring about something else is semantics, wrong or not. 18:57:02 <NGC3982> And i hate that so bad. 18:57:07 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: yes, similar to the "i reject the axiom of choice" debate, which is mostly religious anyway 18:57:23 <NGC3982> Eddi|zuHause: ..And pretentious. 18:57:51 <Alberth> NGC3982: it does depend on what you see as normal :) I have often discussions that use abstract mathematical concepts :) 18:57:57 <Eddi|zuHause> the difference is that without the axiom of choice, there's still plenty of maths you can do 18:58:04 <Eddi|zuHause> but if you reject infinity, ... 18:59:14 <Alberth> you can only do finite things, obviously :D 18:59:18 * NGC3982 fills his stomach with infinities of sharon fruit. 18:59:45 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but you can express infinity in a finite number of axioms :) 19:00:17 <Alberth> :) 19:01:21 <Eddi|zuHause> like "a subset of the natural numbers is called infinite, if there is no upper bound". then "all even numbers" is an infinite set. i said that with a finite number of words. 19:02:42 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 19:02:45 <Alberth> I was already convinced :) 19:03:20 *** oskari892 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 19:03:24 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, almost everybody is convinced, except a handful of zealots who then poison any discussion about cantor's set theory :p 19:05:41 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18EF3.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:10:40 *** Celestar [~vici@mnch-5d85515a.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:11:03 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:13:03 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I could encode the smoke effect in the graphics filename :P 19:13:17 <andythenorth> or I could encode it in the graphics themselves, using colour :o 19:13:17 <Eddi|zuHause> sure :) 19:13:30 <andythenorth> that's actually wholly plausible 19:13:54 <andythenorth> hmm, I had a thought for Alberth and now I've lost it :( 19:13:59 <Eddi|zuHause> make the first pixel in one of the magic pink colours :p 19:14:02 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: So what are those people answering if you tell them that some infinities are more infinite than others? ;) 19:14:32 * Alberth helps looking 19:14:33 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: yes, that is cantor's set theory :p 19:15:15 <andythenorth> Alberth: I did think that bottle could be used as the basis of a newgrf maker, where players edit via their browser, but that wasn't what I wanted to ask you / tell you :P 19:15:23 * andythenorth is not feeling so good today, brain addled 19:15:39 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: but basically it boils down to: "why are you still discussing this? there is no infinity. period." 19:16:55 <andythenorth> Alberth: it wasn't this either, but... "Feature: remove all instances of a string from all lang files" ? 19:17:41 <Alberth> upload a new base language file without the string? 19:17:52 <michi_cc> Eddi|zuHause: I'm an engineer, not an mathematicing. I have no clue at all how all those axioms are called, we just use them and are done :) 19:17:54 <andythenorth> good idea, might be worth documenting :) 19:18:24 <Alberth> but yeah, I have not really considered what type of changes you might want to do on the strings 19:18:25 <andythenorth> Alberth: I did improve the string edit layout on Sunday night, and add error class handling 19:18:35 <andythenorth> I also solved, sufficiently, the passing template message 19:18:43 <Alberth> \o/ 19:19:26 <andythenorth> it smells of a hack, but I think it's a valid hack 19:19:29 <Eddi|zuHause> michi_cc: well cantor's set theory starts with "is there a set of all sets?" and then "is the set of all sets element of itself?" resulting in "there can't be a set of all sets, so there must be a nested hierarchy of sets" 19:19:46 <andythenorth> also there are error classes available for success / warning / info / failure 19:20:27 <Eddi|zuHause> and from that on you get a hierarchy of infinities, by starting with the natural numbers as the base infinity, and the power-sets as the hierarchy 19:20:33 <andythenorth> herp, it's annoying to forget a thought :| 19:20:56 <Eddi|zuHause> and to decide whether there are more kinds of infinity than in this hierarchy, you need the axiom of choice 19:22:00 *** goodger [~ben@host86-166-165-94.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: goodger] 19:23:30 <Alberth> oh, if it's any good, it'll come back. Otherwise, it was not good enough anyway :) 19:23:38 *** goodger [~ben@host86-166-165-94.range86-166.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 19:24:05 <andythenorth> yeah that 19:24:10 <Eddi|zuHause> that's the worst answer to a forgotten thought ever :p 19:24:16 <andythenorth> yes but no 19:24:18 <andythenorth> it's true 19:24:24 <andythenorth> but it doesn't stop the annoyance 19:24:40 <Eddi|zuHause> it's like "i had a proof of fermat's last theorem, but i forgot it" - "then it wasn't any good" :p 19:24:48 <andythenorth> Alberth: I was wondering how close WT was to done 19:26:39 <Alberth> I have 3 points to do. 1) fix doing a translation (coded but not tested) 2) cleanup old changes (currently they are kept infinitely, if you believe such a thing exists) 3) some form of user admin 19:26:56 <Alberth> where the 3rd one is a bit of a problem 19:27:32 <Alberth> then you need some documentation for authors and translators 19:27:51 <Alberth> then it is time to look around what else is missing 19:28:24 <Alberth> probably stuff is missing from a practical use point of view 19:28:44 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008889.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 19:28:47 <Alberth> quak 19:28:55 <frosch123> moin :) 19:29:54 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:35:21 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25049 /trunk/src/lang (lithuanian.txt unfinished/thai.txt) (2013-02-26 18:45:13 UTC) 19:35:22 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 19:35:23 <DorpsGek> lithuanian - 13 changes by Stabilitronas 19:35:24 <DorpsGek> thai - 12 changes by angelix 19:43:08 *** pjpe [b8af1d68@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 19:44:06 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6D24.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 19:44:46 *** Supercheese [~Password4@76.178.163.204] has joined #openttd 19:45:30 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 19:46:41 <Terkhen> hello 19:49:15 *** Tvel [~Thunderbi@212.36.5.170] has quit [Quit: Tvel] 19:49:58 *** oskari892 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:51:52 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 19:53:31 *** supermop [~daniel_er@rrcs-208-105-82-227.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 19:56:12 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:56:28 <andythenorth> Alberth: I'm thinking maybe we let it loose on other people? 19:56:40 <andythenorth> either they run it themselves...or we ask about devzone hosting 19:57:16 <andythenorth> assuming anyone is interested :) 20:00:04 <Alberth> yes, after 1 + 2, imho 20:02:15 <andythenorth> also the project overview screen sucks right now, layout wise :) 20:02:19 <andythenorth> I should fix that 20:04:52 <andythenorth> also the language view - might benefit from an explicit 'start' fixing button for each status group 20:05:42 <planetmaker> well, of course the devzone offers hosting :-) 20:05:55 <planetmaker> or rather: also using :D 20:06:21 <andythenorth> planetmaker: want to try setting up WT there? o_O 20:06:29 <andythenorth> it appears to have little or no deps 20:06:37 <andythenorth> but I'd run it in a vm, it might be insecure :) 20:07:55 <andythenorth> Alberth: the idea I lost earlier - the ability to mark some strings in base lang as 'do not translate' 20:08:10 <andythenorth> there may be other better ways to do that 20:08:19 <andythenorth> it's not a common case, but occasionally comes up 20:08:22 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:08:24 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:08:29 <Alberth> quickly, make a feature request :) 20:09:20 <Alberth> hmm, I had a discussion with y3xo about this, iirc he was not so happy adding such a feature to the file format, but I need to look that up 20:09:34 *** mseidl [~aaa@p5DCE6D24.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:09:51 <andythenorth> not sure it's valid yet 20:10:27 <Alberth> there is a route to /fix/<proj_name>/<lname> to select a random string to fix 20:10:38 <andythenorth> I'm not convinced by translating this for example STR_GRF_URL http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/firs 20:11:04 <Alberth> it does have fix priorities internally, but these are constant currently 20:12:11 <Alberth> isn't that a custom_tag thingie? 20:12:47 <Alberth> or do you use planetmakers type of custom_tags, entirely generated ? 20:14:46 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: iirc the conclusion was to put that in custom_tags.txt 20:15:29 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: but potentially a website could have a language parameter or something :) 20:15:39 <andythenorth> I don't mind moving strings 20:15:51 <andythenorth> I hadn't understood the purpose of custom tags 20:16:17 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: the makefile autogenerates custom_tags.txt to include the version/revision number 20:23:24 <andythenorth> so what do we think the right thing to do is? 20:23:43 <andythenorth> I could just leave these strings in place, and let translators do whatever 20:23:47 <andythenorth> it would be a nice hack btw 20:24:03 <andythenorth> I don't review translations, so just put the url to goatse or porn or something 20:24:07 <andythenorth> what larks 20:24:54 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:24:56 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:25:47 <peter1138> LARKS! 20:26:20 <Eddi|zuHause> no, you mean LCARS! 20:26:39 <peter1138> well... no 20:29:30 <ZxBiohazardZx> LARCS? 20:30:39 <oskari89> Light Almighty Rail Car Set? 20:30:55 <oskari89> That would be nice, generic cars on rails 20:31:08 <Belugas> Larks Tongues In Aspic 20:31:36 <Supercheese> No one got the Star Trek reference? :< 20:32:02 <ZxBiohazardZx> didnt want to mention 20:33:42 <peter1138> that's not really a reference 20:33:45 <andythenorth> Supercheese: too busy not talking about licensing to think about your Star Trek obsession 20:34:11 <peter1138> it's like saying "no, you mean DARTH VADER" and calling that a starwars reference... 20:34:27 <Supercheese> well, it is, isn't it? 20:34:46 <Supercheese> tad more subtle I suppose 20:34:55 <Eddi|zuHause> Supercheese: you expect people to shout out "YES I GOT THE REFERENCE"? 20:37:48 <Supercheese> http://shirt.woot.com/offers/i-understood-that-reference 20:39:27 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 20:39:48 <Supercheese> When it doubt, put it on a shirt and sell it 20:39:53 <Supercheese> in doubt* 20:41:01 <andythenorth> I GOT THE REFERENCE 20:41:01 <andythenorth> not 20:41:02 <andythenorth> :) 20:41:54 <Eddi|zuHause> i really don't think there are a lot of people here who never heard of LCARS before 20:44:54 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:44:54 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:47:37 <andythenorth> Alberth: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3869/wt_overview.png <- actions at the bottom: download and remove could be links in the table? 20:47:41 <andythenorth> per language? 20:49:14 <Alberth> good idea 20:55:03 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-253.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 20:59:23 *** Nat_aS [~nat@00179a279bbd.click-network.com] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 20:59:23 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:59:39 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:00:23 <andythenorth> wtf, I can actually use a valid definition list 21:00:28 <andythenorth> never done that before, in 15 years 21:01:23 <Alberth> valid definition of what? 21:02:00 <Alberth> btw shall we disable the reloader? 21:02:08 <andythenorth> module reloader yes 21:02:19 <andythenorth> definition is of string statuses 21:02:30 <andythenorth> I can use <dl><dt><dd> for the first time ever 21:03:00 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:03:11 <andythenorth> Alberth: pull? 21:03:59 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:05:04 <Alberth> ah, 'download' is like the download button at a language page of course 21:05:11 <andythenorth> I guessed 21:05:54 <andythenorth> we should store those definition strings as content somewhere 21:05:56 <andythenorth> and make them available 21:06:01 <andythenorth> anywhere in the app 21:07:02 <Alberth> why? they don't need to be translated, or are you talking about other definitions than custom_tags now? 21:07:40 <andythenorth> other definitions 21:07:48 <andythenorth> "Unknown: means the state of the translation was not decidable" 21:07:49 <andythenorth> etc 21:07:59 <andythenorth> that is reusable copy within the web translator 21:08:05 <Alberth> oh :) 21:08:06 <andythenorth> could be used as help text in any page 21:08:18 <andythenorth> I'll probably just stuff it in a dict somewhere 21:08:20 <andythenorth> hmm 21:08:28 <andythenorth> there is a bad pattern, called: 21:08:33 <Alberth> make a help page? 21:08:41 <andythenorth> "andy puts everything in utils.py because he doesn't know where it should go" 21:09:55 <Alberth> looks good as temporary storage :) 21:10:57 <Alberth> datetime stuff fits better near Stamp, but there are some other pieces to add there as well 21:12:43 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:12:53 <planetmaker> so... you need a VM for that stuff? 21:13:00 <andythenorth> I reckon it's safer 21:13:06 <andythenorth> I wouldn't run it on the bare OS 21:13:30 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:13:31 <andythenorth> it offers file upload to the filesystem, and could be full of vulnerabilities :) 21:13:39 <planetmaker> well. nothing on the devzone except the HV runs on "the bare OS" ;-) 21:14:05 <planetmaker> but yes... neither the DevZone VM might be best choice. So new one 21:14:20 <planetmaker> they're cheap :D 21:14:24 <Alberth> planetmaker: it needs some form of user authentication first, imho 21:15:01 <planetmaker> Alberth, yes... likely sensible :-) 21:15:13 <planetmaker> so you don't need it now... but soon 21:17:06 *** swissfan91 [5e091e04@ircip4.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 21:17:16 *** swissfan91 [5e091e04@ircip4.mibbit.com] has quit [] 21:17:48 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:21:38 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:21:59 <andythenorth> Alberth: can you pull, then tell me where to find the correct identifiers for statuses (keys for dict rendered in project overview)? 21:23:14 <Alberth> webtranslate.data.STATE_MAP 21:23:58 <andythenorth> thanks 21:24:12 <Alberth> pull is going to be tricky atm :) 21:24:32 <andythenorth> ho, some of them have dashes 21:24:32 <andythenorth> up-to-date 21:24:41 <andythenorth> it freaks me out that this is never a problem :) 21:24:57 <andythenorth> I got habituated to underscores everywhere in variable names etc 21:25:17 <andythenorth> or 21:25:19 <andythenorth> hmm 21:25:31 <andythenorth> for a key, am I better using UP_TO_DATE or up-to-date? 21:25:52 <CornishPasty> andythenorth: Use up_TO-datE 21:25:56 <andythenorth> lovely 21:26:07 <CornishPasty> Make sure it's case-sensitive too 21:26:10 <andythenorth> mixed bulgarian-latvian-genoan notation 21:26:15 <CornishPasty> Oh wait 21:26:20 <CornishPasty> doesn't it need to be like 21:26:27 <CornishPasty> boolUp_to-DATE 21:26:32 <Eddi|zuHause> and then have different cases mean different variables :p 21:26:35 <andythenorth> ideal 21:26:38 <CornishPasty> Eddi|zuHause: Yup 21:26:42 <andythenorth> or have some mean objs 21:26:44 <andythenorth> others mean vars 21:26:49 <andythenorth> others are methods 21:26:53 <CornishPasty> booThatCouldBeAnIntUp-TO_DatE 21:27:11 <CornishPasty> boolUp_TO-_D-Ate = 6 21:27:33 <peter1138> true/false/yes/no/file_not_found 21:28:32 *** ZxBiohazardZx [~IceChat77@5ED05D6D.cm-7-1b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has left #openttd [] 21:28:42 <CornishPasty> peter1138: What about the edge case? file_was_found? 21:28:59 <CornishPasty> Which actually returns when the filesystem is corrupted 21:29:52 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:29:52 <Alberth> andythenorth: those are strings, not variables 21:30:01 *** Elukka [Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 21:30:30 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm always amazed at the totally constructive error message windows gives when there's a ':' in the filename :p 21:30:32 <andythenorth> ok, so I was reading the code that returns state to string_edit for exmple 21:30:34 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 21:30:52 <andythenorth> seems like what I'm doing should be reused elsewhere 21:30:53 <Eddi|zuHause> you can neither open the file nor rename it then :p 21:31:14 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:31:25 <Eddi|zuHause> but it fails to explain why 21:31:36 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:31:37 <Alberth> Eddi|zuHause: you must truly love such a system :p 21:32:12 <andythenorth> Alberth: I'm going to do what I think is right, and hope you can help fix later ;) 21:32:16 <peter1138> file_might_be_there_but_good_luck_getting_to_it 21:33:28 <Eddi|zuHause> and because this error appears only every odd year, you search for a few minutes where the problem actually is, before you remember 21:37:13 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:38:57 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r25050 trunk/Makefile.grf.in (2013-02-26 20:48:50 UTC) 21:38:58 <DorpsGek> -Fix: use the CC_BUILD compiler for preprocessing the extra GRF's source instead of a hardcoded gcc 21:38:59 <DorpsGek> -Fix: do not let gcc include files from the "standard C" include directories; newer gcc/libc seem to otherwise automatically include some header files at the top of the preprocessed nfo files which causes NFOrenum/GRFcodec to make invalid assumptions about the NFO version 21:39:14 <Rubidium> ... or in other words, effectively an one line fix 21:40:37 <Kjetil> the commit message is longer than the diff ? :P 21:40:59 <Eddi|zuHause> that's more common than you think :p 21:41:19 <frosch123> yay, we are approaching a symmetric revision number 21:41:52 <Rubidium> really? I'd reckon we already passed it 25 revisions ago 21:41:54 <Kjetil> I guess I should't speak to loudly. Commited changes to code comments earlier today 21:42:16 <Kjetil> 2 commits to go 21:43:13 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i really hoped i wouldn't need to save/load anything :/ 21:43:18 <frosch123> 25252 will be fun :) 21:43:39 <Eddi|zuHause> but yes, i didn't consider base grfs 21:44:15 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: breaking savegames by disabling grfs is already fun, breaking savegames by changing the order of grfs even more 21:44:43 <Rubidium> frosch123: IMHO 25025 is more symmetric than 25052 ;) 21:44:47 <frosch123> i would expect grfs to use the random seed for quite troublesome stuff, so it should not change unexpectedly 21:44:49 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: i don't understand the difference between patch vars and global vars 21:45:18 <frosch123> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/GlobalVariables http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/ReadingPatchVariables 21:45:30 <Kjetil> In the year 2525 if man is still alive 21:46:01 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: if you have a 7-segment digital display, 25025 would be both even and odd symmetric :) 21:46:26 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: exactly what I was thinking about 21:46:47 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:48:08 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: but wouldn't that mean you first have to copy it to a parameter to use it in an action2? 21:48:18 <frosch123> yes 21:48:26 <Eddi|zuHause> how is that better then? 21:48:27 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has joined #openttd 21:48:55 <frosch123> i have no idea what you want to do with that var. but other vars of that type are patchvars 21:48:59 <frosch123> e.g. mapsize 21:49:12 <frosch123> and i think in nml it makes no difference 21:50:54 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: btw. ais ans gs have the option to request random values in their parameters 21:51:08 <frosch123> so, you can also make it an a14 feature, and store the values in the grfconfig 21:51:10 *** chester_1 [~chester@89-178-185-87.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 21:51:23 <frosch123> then a grf can take multiple random values just as it likes 21:51:27 <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds interesting 21:51:37 <frosch123> and i like the idea of unifying ais, gss and grfs 21:52:08 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess that means ditch this, and go back to the drawing board 21:52:12 <frosch123> http://noai.openttd.org/api/trunk/classAIInfo.html#390926c8e631a628510f0bcb0fa5ad29 21:54:04 <Eddi|zuHause> so a new setting type "random", which will not be displayed in the gui, but fill the associated parameter bits with random values? 21:54:28 *** Flygon [~Flygon@218-214-18-147.people.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:55:46 <Eddi|zuHause> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Action14#Setting_type_.28.22INFO.22_-.3E_.22PARA.22_-.3E_.3Csetting-number.3E_-.3E_.22TYPE.22.29 <-- i mean here 22:01:41 <andythenorth> Alberth: can the base language have errors? 22:01:45 <andythenorth> or are all strings 'correct' 22:01:46 <andythenorth> ? 22:02:30 <andythenorth> I assume always correct 22:02:37 <Alberth> normally they are correct 22:02:53 <andythenorth> I can't think how they are 'uncorrect' 22:02:58 <andythenorth> what would you compare against? 22:03:31 <Alberth> you can have problems in the form of adding illegal strings, like "{BLECK" but they should get blocked from being uploaded 22:03:44 <andythenorth> ok 22:04:01 <Alberth> or stuff like "{P x y}" 22:04:16 <Alberth> ie no command to derive plural from 22:04:48 <Alberth> or doing that in a language without plurals :p 22:11:04 <andythenorth> Alberth: http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3872/more_more_more.png 22:11:30 <frosch123> he, suddenly looks professional :o 22:11:31 <andythenorth> I suspect that using this to detect if a language has errors (or not) is very silly: if counts[1] == bcounts[1]: 22:11:46 <andythenorth> would be nice to have a flag for errors / not 22:11:51 <Alberth> pretty :) 22:12:07 <andythenorth> not my work 22:12:16 <andythenorth> I just build on the shoulders of giants :) 22:12:29 <frosch123> i have no idea about that stuff, so i am probably impressed by a few lines of css :p 22:12:35 <Alberth> every giant does :) 22:12:50 <andythenorth> frosch123: http://twitter.github.com/bootstrap/base-css.html 22:12:56 <andythenorth> ^ I just apply styles from there :P 22:12:58 <frosch123> though i wonder what happened the the srif project 22:13:00 <andythenorth> and maybe a bit of brain 22:13:10 <andythenorth> this web translator needs to be finished :) 22:13:18 <andythenorth> FIRS translations are becoming a PITA 22:15:10 <andythenorth> hmm table row colouring for success / not :P 22:15:14 <andythenorth> probly not needed 22:16:13 <Rubidium> andythenorth: a nice 'progress' bar per language could give a clue about the language's state 22:16:19 <andythenorth> that's intriguing 22:17:05 <Rubidium> or rather, a 90 degree rotated stacked bar chart 22:18:17 <frosch123> better make the table sortable :p 22:18:28 <Rubidium> and filterable 22:18:44 <frosch123> oh yeah, filter for > 50% or so to fake statistics :) 22:18:53 <andythenorth> sortable and filterable can be done 22:18:58 <andythenorth> fake statistics I delegae 22:19:01 <andythenorth> delegate * 22:20:05 <frosch123> anyway, don't express the completion state with 5 digits precision, or i'll flame you like i did tb back then :p 22:20:47 <Rubidium> anyhow, isn't "fake statistics" a tautology? 22:21:08 <frosch123> no, it's an emphasis 22:21:29 <frosch123> "the statistic is faked" would be a tautology 22:21:29 <Rubidium> like "real statistics" exist ;) 22:27:06 <Alberth> andythenorth: the order of the explanations is weird compared to the order of the columns ? 22:27:38 <andythenorth> oh :P 22:27:47 <andythenorth> now you want a pony? 22:28:03 <andythenorth> can you make python dicts return in a predictable order? o_O 22:29:10 <Eddi|zuHause> sorted(dict.values) 22:29:19 <andythenorth> yes, that's predictable :) 22:29:29 <andythenorth> I should ask better questions 22:31:10 <Eddi|zuHause> well you can provide an ordering function, to change the order 22:31:22 <peter1138> 8~9999999999999999999999999900000000000000000000000000000000000000000-=69o99999998i8888888888888887778888 22:31:25 <peter1138> oops 22:31:33 <SpComb> how's that new keyboard going? 22:31:39 <Eddi|zuHause> is that a password? :p 22:31:40 <peter1138> well 22:31:50 <peter1138> 8 was physically sticking down 22:31:52 <peter1138> just solved that 22:32:02 <peter1138> i striped it all and cleaned it up 22:32:04 <peter1138> it's working now 22:32:05 <SpComb> my 0 key is sticky :( 22:32:08 <peter1138> plus it's nice & clean 22:32:15 <SpComb> need to yank it off and clean it out 22:32:33 <peter1138> i soaked the plastic parts for a couple of hours 22:32:39 <peter1138> all came out nice 22:32:53 <frosch123> oh, at my university there was a keyboard in some computer pool.... when you pressed the 5 on the numpad, all nine keys went down :s 22:32:55 <Eddi|zuHause> one day when i came into an office, the person said "my computer behaves woird when it starts up, it asks me something about harddisks and stuff" 22:33:02 <peter1138> nah, 8 is still a bit dodgy :S 22:33:08 <Eddi|zuHause> turned out the F12 key was stuck :p 22:33:18 <Eddi|zuHause> so it displayed the boot menu 22:33:43 <andythenorth> Alberth: https://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3875/pony.png 22:34:14 <frosch123> what changed? 22:34:16 <Alberth> thanks 22:34:40 <andythenorth> I really like this templating language btw 22:35:57 <andythenorth> it would be good for templating nml 22:36:04 <Eddi|zuHause> # 22:36:09 <Eddi|zuHause> REWRITE IT 22:37:07 <Alberth> sshhh! 22:38:30 <andythenorth> "Do not render untrusted templates! They may contain and execute harmful python code." 22:38:32 <andythenorth> :) 22:38:42 <andythenorth> not good for a web translator :) 22:38:50 <andythenorth> nvm 22:39:12 <frosch123> night 22:39:15 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008889.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:41:52 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: nah, it can't be worse than SQL injection :p 22:42:05 <andythenorth> probly about the same :) 22:42:24 <andythenorth> but I think we'd have to do something stupid 22:42:34 <andythenorth> like eval(input_from_untrusted_user) 22:43:30 <andythenorth> anyway, it looks nice for nml templating http://bottlepy.org/docs/dev/stpl.html 22:43:42 <andythenorth> more powerful than python's Template module 22:43:56 <andythenorth> but doesn't leave xml crap everywhere like chameleon 22:45:01 <andythenorth> and it has a simple %include syntax 22:46:07 <Eddi|zuHause> and you find a new templating language every other week, so what? 22:46:49 <andythenorth> so nothing in my case 22:47:01 <andythenorth> I wouldn't recommend chameleon to most people though 22:47:13 <andythenorth> not for templating nml anyway :P 22:47:22 <andythenorth> I used it because I know it 22:47:50 <Alberth> andythenorth: get_status_definition_strings() looks wrong, dicts have random order, giving you no chance to match the order of columns. Also, it looks SOOOO python2-ish, we have http://docs.python.org/3/library/collections.html?highlight=collections.namedtuple#collections.namedtuple now :) 22:48:08 <andythenorth> oh we do do we? :) 22:48:27 <andythenorth> I had to add an order-control list, which I hate as a pattern 22:48:39 <andythenorth> could have done one of those weird mult-dict constructs 22:48:42 <andythenorth> but they're odd 22:48:43 <Alberth> I used it in newgrf/language_file 22:48:57 <Alberth> why not use a list? 22:49:06 <Alberth> or are they used elsewhere too? 22:49:12 <andythenorth> I want to use them elsewhere 22:49:29 <andythenorth> you use STATE_MAP to provide mappings to strings? 22:49:39 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@wlan132190.mobiel.utwente.nl] has joined #openttd 22:49:41 <andythenorth> I think that should be replaced or unified with what I've done 22:49:43 <Alberth> yes 22:49:57 <andythenorth> not urgent 22:50:01 <Alberth> sounds like a good idea :) 22:50:14 <andythenorth> then I can use the Title attribute for display 22:50:22 <andythenorth> and I can set a tooltip which shows the description 22:50:26 <andythenorth> everywhere they are used 22:50:36 <andythenorth> and I can call .lower() on them if they are in a sentence :P 22:50:40 <Alberth> I changed string editing, it needs adding a message 22:50:50 <andythenorth> is it committed? 22:50:55 <Alberth> yep 22:51:17 <Alberth> and you have a 'needs_fixing' flag in the project page :) 22:51:34 <andythenorth> neat 22:51:49 <andythenorth> so what message is needed? 22:53:07 <Alberth> at line 385 of pages/string_edit.py, you are thrown back onto the same string page as you still have errors in that string 22:54:04 <Alberth> line 304 is the other call of that function, which is when you start editing a string for the first time 22:54:42 <Alberth> you also had a comment on the language page, didn't you? 22:55:06 <andythenorth> hmm 22:55:09 <andythenorth> I don't recall :) 22:55:18 <andythenorth> it was a long day :) 22:56:40 <Alberth> k 22:56:57 <andythenorth> hmm 22:56:59 <Alberth> I think the actual current text should be added there 22:57:13 <andythenorth> where has my nasty hack with request.query['message'] = foo gone? 22:57:20 <andythenorth> did you find a better way? 22:57:37 <Alberth> not that I know 22:58:06 <andythenorth> ho :) 22:58:08 <Alberth> where did you put that? 22:58:11 <andythenorth> I forget 22:58:19 <andythenorth> not helpful :) 23:03:35 <andythenorth> maybe I imagined it 23:04:25 <Alberth> I hope so :) 23:05:20 <andythenorth> oops 23:05:23 <andythenorth> forgot reload is off :) 23:06:12 <andythenorth> Alberth: so to add a message when returning a template 23:06:13 <andythenorth> request.query['message'] = 'blah' 23:06:16 <andythenorth> before the return 23:06:32 <andythenorth> I'll test it for string edit 23:06:44 <Alberth> sounds good 23:07:12 <Alberth> Added 4 bugs for eints that need being done 23:08:05 <Alberth> but not tonight :) 23:10:22 <andythenorth> one more commit from me 23:10:23 <andythenorth> then bed 23:10:39 <peter1138> isn't it way past? 23:12:13 *** Nat_aS [~nat@00179a279bbd.click-network.com] has joined #openttd 23:12:16 <andythenorth> 22:22, so probably 23:12:17 <Eddi|zuHause> just... one... more... commit 23:12:37 <andythenorth> no more nice numbers today, so bedtime 23:12:50 <Eddi|zuHause> what about 23:45? 23:12:54 <andythenorth> oh 23:12:58 <andythenorth> yes 23:13:03 <andythenorth> but I'm not staying up for it :P 23:13:13 <andythenorth> Alberth: l385-6 show a quick hack for error 23:13:19 <andythenorth> I'm not sure it's a good method still 23:13:42 <andythenorth> I would rather pass it to a method somewhere, so we can replace easily in future if wrong 23:13:58 <andythenorth> or pass an error object around when calling a template 23:14:13 <andythenorth> error / message /s 23:14:44 <Alberth> it does look a bit fishy indeed 23:15:04 <andythenorth> especially if you read the bottle source, where request.query is ReadOnly :P 23:15:10 <andythenorth> assuming I understand it correctly 23:15:36 <andythenorth> create a message class, pass instances of it 23:15:44 <andythenorth> bit heavyweight, could use a dict, but... 23:15:50 <andythenorth> ...seems more robust 23:15:57 <andythenorth> problem for not-today ;) 23:16:18 <Alberth> Mark it with # XXX Needs a better solution ? 23:16:34 <andythenorth> k 23:17:15 <andythenorth> done 23:17:17 <andythenorth> bed 23:17:24 <andythenorth> might be here tomorrow, otherwise thursday 23:20:10 <Alberth> good night :) 23:20:49 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 23:22:26 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 23:22:34 *** KritiK_ [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 23:25:26 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d173-183-156-148.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:28:11 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:31:35 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@2001:828:405:30:83:96:177:42] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:32:39 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d173-183-156-148.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 23:32:45 *** KritiK_ [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:36:08 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@2001:828:405:30:83:96:177:42] has joined #openttd