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00:05:39 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6B1E9.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 00:06:43 <UukGoblin> ok, so my current plan is as follows: 1. Add an array of 16-bit variables called "gs_specific" to each station (one gs_specific value for each cargo type), 2. Have GSs update this array to whatever they like for each cargo type, 3. In the NewGRF cargo_profit_calc callback, set the currently unused extra_callback_info1 to (source_station(gs_specific) << 16) | dest_station(gs_specific) 00:07:58 <UukGoblin> this way the GS could compute some kind of cargo value for each station, in my case the value would depend on how far the station is from a nearest mine 00:08:07 <UukGoblin> and the NewGRF could use that value to alter the profits accordingly 00:13:53 *** shirish [~quassel@117.195.110.71] has joined #openttd 00:18:33 <Eddi|zuHause> when making such interfaces, remember that you cannot force the player to use both the GS and the matching NewGRF at the same time 00:19:30 *** shirish__ [~quassel@117.195.105.248] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:19:32 <UukGoblin> oh... I hoped they could depend on each other or something 00:19:47 <Eddi|zuHause> no 00:19:51 <Samu> omg, this is harder than i anticipated 00:20:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not even sure GS can detect whether a specific NewGRF is loaded 00:20:14 <Eddi|zuHause> Samu: what else is new? 00:21:19 <Samu> must do this for buoys, oilfield station, objects, oil rig industry, dock water tile, lock upper and lower tiles, ship depot north and south tiles. 00:21:35 <Samu> and i hope i'm not forgetting anything 00:22:03 <UukGoblin> Eddi|zuHause, well, I'd put it in a description. If someone used only the NewGRF, then it could detect that because all gs_specifics would be set to zero; if someone only used the GS then all the gs_specific values would simply be ignored 00:22:03 <Samu> i dont know which objects can be built on water 00:22:56 <Eddi|zuHause> UukGoblin: and if someone made a GS which reuses the gs_specific for something entirely unrelated? 00:23:58 <Samu> what are objects other than transmitters and lighthouse? 00:23:58 <UukGoblin> Eddi|zuHause, hm. Well, then the two would be incompatible. 00:24:14 <chillcore> that is 7 patchies an not 1 patch samu? 00:24:53 <Samu> yes, but objects are confusing me, I dont know of any object that can be placed on water 00:24:55 <chillcore> the stuff you forfgot will most likely pop up as you go 00:24:56 <UukGoblin> a good dependency resolution mechanism would be nice to have, but that's currently out of scope for me ;-) This ASOIF scenario I'm playing, for instance, is spouting errors to me already about a missing AI 00:25:14 <Samu> yet they have waterclasses 00:25:25 <chillcore> marico? samu 00:25:33 <Samu> ? 00:25:33 <Eddi|zuHause> Samu: objects can be anything the NewGRF wishes. wind turbines, seashore decorations, fake airport tiles, ... 00:25:48 <Eddi|zuHause> opengfx+landscape has some 00:26:00 <Eddi|zuHause> marico 00:26:02 <Eddi|zuHause> VAST 00:26:09 <Eddi|zuHause> loads of others i'm sure 00:26:32 <Samu> oh, so great, how could i deal with something I don't hae control of 00:27:19 <Eddi|zuHause> you specify the parts that you do have control over 00:29:49 <Samu> i am worried those newgrfs will screw things 00:29:54 <chillcore> also they are all "just" objects with a different look ... don't complicate stuffs more then you have to 00:30:51 <Samu> if you build those objects on canals that were built on rivers, what exactly can i do about it? 00:33:22 *** tulsy [5ec0ed09@107.161.19.109] has quit [Quit: http://www.kiwiirc.com/ - A hand crafted IRC client] 00:34:20 <Samu> let me look at MakeObject, if such thing exists 00:34:50 <chillcore> why would you do anything different then what you do with canals? 00:35:04 *** tulsy [5ec0ed09@107.161.19.109] has joined #openttd 00:35:23 <chillcore> if they do not do that already now ... 00:37:23 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-95-143.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:41:31 <Samu> they don't :( 00:41:58 <Samu> i must be doing this wrong 00:43:05 <Samu> when i build a ship depot on a canal that was built on a river, the information that the canal was built on a river is gone 00:43:22 <Samu> and for everything else, the same 00:43:36 *** alluke [~oftc-webi@62-78-237-171.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 00:45:03 <Sylf> when you build a canal on a river, isn't that same thing as demolishing the river first and building canal in its place? or is that different on some recent patch? 00:45:26 <Eddi|zuHause> so, what exactly have you been doing for the last few months? 00:54:10 <Samu> upon demolishing 00:54:26 <Samu> brb, i must make sure what's happening 00:54:35 <Samu> something is missing in-between 00:55:20 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-180-225.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 00:58:47 <Samu> i built an object from some newgrf on a canal built on river, the information was kept 00:59:00 <Samu> then i demolished the object, the information is gone 00:59:03 <Samu> :( 00:59:22 <Samu> for ship depot and dock it's workign differently 00:59:56 <Samu> i build ship depot or dock on canal built on river, the information is gone already 01:00:21 <Samu> demolishing afterwards won't matter, it's already broken 01:00:41 <Eddi|zuHause> great. now you know the two exact places where you need to fix things 01:02:18 <NGC3982> http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://www.openttd.org/ 01:03:44 <Samu> industry tile behaves the same 01:03:55 <Samu> as ship depot/dock 01:04:05 <Samu> only object appears to be difffernts 01:04:10 *** liq3 [~liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 01:08:37 <chillcore> wiki is up so most likely django out for a walk again? 01:09:02 <chillcore> ^^^ TrueBrain 01:13:42 <Eddi|zuHause> twice in two days of operation? 01:13:58 <Eddi|zuHause> not a good record :p 01:14:25 <Compu> openttd website is down again 01:14:29 <Compu> bleeeeeh 01:14:30 <ST2> django seems outdauted (the movie), and D is mute xD 01:15:01 <ST2> but it's wierd, 2 nights in a row 01:15:03 <ST2> :S 01:15:17 <Compu> is there an android version of openttd? 01:15:17 <Eddi|zuHause> the term is "silent" :p 01:15:22 <ST2> note: night where I am ^^ 01:15:45 <ST2> @Eddi: correct, "silent" :P 01:15:56 <ST2> my mistake ^^ 01:15:57 <Eddi|zuHause> Compu: yes. there is an inofficial port in the forum 01:16:02 <Compu> k 01:16:12 <NGC3982> Do we have any mirror to the latest stable version? 01:16:21 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 01:16:28 * NGC3982 wants to play something while waiting for windows update. 01:16:34 <ST2> http://ftp.snt.utwente.nl/pub/games/openttd/binaries/releases/index.html 01:16:40 <ST2> it's 1.4.4 01:16:59 <NGC3982> Thanks! 01:17:05 <ST2> np :) 01:29:07 *** lobster [~mccrabbym@94.231.249.233] has joined #openttd 01:30:56 *** crabster [~mccrabbym@94.231.249.233] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:39:03 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 01:39:19 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:40:54 <chillcore> nappy time 01:41:01 <chillcore> good nght all o/ 01:41:06 <ST2> so, gn8 time ^^ 01:41:08 <ST2> o/ 01:41:10 *** chillcore [~chillcore@2a02:a03f:1048:5400:4e72:b9ff:feac:5979] has quit [Quit: Only mortals are affected by fame and power.] 01:41:53 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@adsl-68-123-206-90.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #openttd 01:48:07 <UukGoblin> can there only be one active GS? 01:51:01 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 01:51:14 <Eddi|zuHause> otherwise it'd be a compatibility nightmare 01:51:50 <UukGoblin> oh, that solves a lot of the compatibility problems we've talked about earlier ;-) 01:53:00 <Eddi|zuHause> not really, but whatever... 01:53:27 <Eddi|zuHause> if you want your code to be reusable by other scripts, make a library instead 01:53:28 <UukGoblin> so, out of curiosity, what's a scenario? 01:53:37 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 01:54:55 <Eddi|zuHause> basically, a savegame with prebuilt infrastructure 01:55:15 <UukGoblin> ah. 01:58:14 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw2-54faa7-102.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:58:14 *** Oddingar [~Odd@141.0.247.99] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:58:14 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw2-54faa7-102.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 01:58:39 *** Oddingar [~Odd@141.0.247.99] has joined #openttd 02:02:57 <UukGoblin> http://pastebin.com/vymdaKQC <- getting this when trying to compile firs 02:03:08 <UukGoblin> "Unrecognized identifier 'ANIM' encountered" 02:08:03 <UukGoblin> probably nml is too old, I have 0.3.1 02:15:31 <Samu> anyone around? 02:15:47 <Samu> i was able to fix for the lock 02:16:01 <Samu> but i still fail for ship depot 02:16:41 <NGC3982> I'm around, but i don't seem to be able to support you. 02:16:46 <NGC3982> I'm completely stunned at the momen 02:16:48 <NGC3982> +t. 02:17:04 <NGC3982> Just installed my new PC. It's a i5 GTX960 PC with 16GB ram and a SSD. 02:17:18 <NGC3982> I came from HP dual-core laptops with 1GB of RAM 02:17:59 <NGC3982> The difference is so awesome i can barely handle it. 02:18:04 <UukGoblin> ;-] 02:18:19 <Samu> nice system 02:18:37 <UukGoblin> should be pretty fast, yeah :-) 02:18:55 <NGC3982> Simply using explorer is a breeze 02:18:57 <UukGoblin> 1GB of RAM... ouch! 02:19:19 * NGC3982 notices wupdate has taken an hour. 02:21:34 <Samu> grrr why i fail 02:21:48 * ST2 thinks NGC3982 will notice that every 2nd tuesday's... every month 02:22:11 <ST2> it's when MS releases updates 02:23:40 <ST2> Samu, both of our test servers are now on RC1 02:24:05 <ST2> none with code changes you suggested, on server side 02:24:24 <Samu> i can't download rc1 yet 02:24:34 <Samu> 504 Gateway Time-out 02:24:35 <ST2> you can 02:25:10 <ST2> actually, you can download ALL OpenTTD versions 02:25:11 <ST2> http://ftp.snt.utwente.nl/pub/games/openttd/binaries/releases/index.html 02:25:27 <ST2> you need the correct mirror ^^ 02:26:09 <ST2> hope it helps ^^ 02:26:13 <Samu> building a ship depot now maintains the canal on river information 02:26:28 <Samu> but when i remove ship depot... boom, information is gone 02:26:32 <Samu> why 02:26:34 <Samu> what is wrong 02:27:02 <Samu> i have the code there already 02:27:14 <ST2> I understand your view, but look at me as the person that made a patch to have maps with only land 02:27:15 <Samu> if it worked for the lock tiles, why wouldn't it work 02:27:17 <ST2> no water 02:27:25 <Samu> for ship depot :( 02:29:14 <ST2> Samu, link above worked? there you can get any version you want ^^ 02:30:35 <Samu> im a bit busy trying to figure out this thing 02:31:20 <Samu> yes that link works 02:33:44 <Samu> grr why u no work 02:34:48 <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/p0yhrws4t 02:34:53 <Samu> i made this so far 02:35:26 <UukGoblin> gawd I hate python and its whitespace sensitivity 02:35:50 <ST2> well, someone suggested you to make simpliest things - you're trying to touch the core without knowing the basics of C++, never gets easier :S 02:36:29 <ST2> was to Samu ^^ 02:37:07 <ST2> just in case UukGoblin missunderstanding my line :) 02:37:53 <Samu> this code works for building ship depot 02:37:58 <Samu> fails for removing ship depot 02:38:06 <Samu> works for building canal 02:38:09 <Samu> works for removing canal 02:38:17 <Samu> works for building lock 02:38:19 <UukGoblin> ST2, hah. Actually, touching the C++ core is easier for me than faffing around with pypnml ;-) 02:38:20 <Samu> works for removing lock 02:38:39 <Samu> now i don't get why it is failing for removing ship depot :( 02:38:47 <Samu> and i am out of time today 02:38:49 <UukGoblin> but I can totally understand people who feel the opposite ;-) 02:39:15 <ST2> UukGoblin: I guess yes, but my reply appeared right after yours... was only to dnt confuse things xD 02:39:24 <UukGoblin> yeah yeah, I know ;-) 02:39:33 <UukGoblin> confusion avoided. 02:39:46 <ST2> :) 02:40:20 <ST2> because Samu is messing with ttd code without understanding the basics 02:40:34 <UukGoblin> yup, figured. I am too, actually ;-) 02:40:36 <ST2> and that leads to the massive questions arouns 02:41:02 <ST2> well, I'm not a programmer 02:41:08 <Samu> works for building object 02:41:13 <Samu> fails for removing object 02:41:28 <Samu> fails for building dock, fails for removing dock 02:41:48 <Samu> fails for building industry, fails for removing industry 02:41:55 <Samu> because yeah... i haven't finished 02:42:09 <ST2> Samu: keep on trying :) 02:42:11 <Samu> now i'm off to bed, cyas later 02:42:16 <ST2> cya 02:42:23 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-252-157.netvisao.pt] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 02:43:19 <UukGoblin> so it's like python generates python, which then generates pnml, which is then compiled by python to nml, which is finally compiled to grf. I only need to learn all of these steps ;-) 02:44:08 <UukGoblin> or maybe I'll bother some of you guys here: how would I add a 'profit' callback to one of the cargos in firs/src/cargos/ ? 02:44:21 <ST2> personally, I love the person that finds a needle in a haystack and starts asking entire town why was it here ^^ 02:44:36 <ST2> sorry, was describing Samu xD 02:44:42 <UukGoblin> hehe ;-) 02:45:17 <ST2> btw, I'm not a GS expert 02:45:44 <ST2> but saw some chat's - query All industries 02:45:49 <ST2> vehicles 02:45:55 <ST2> of all companies 02:46:08 <UukGoblin> I didn't even get to the GS part yet 02:46:13 <ST2> won't create a GS massive usage 02:46:16 <ST2> oh 02:46:28 <UukGoblin> ST2, nah, my current plan is a bit different 02:47:19 <UukGoblin> I decided the original approach like with CashDrainGS isn't too nice as it won't display per-vehicle profits properly 02:47:39 <ST2> well, my 1st attempt to create a global Cargo server was monitoring that 02:47:49 <UukGoblin> ST2, so now I'll just query all the industries for all cargoes at the beginning, and just update some values whenever a new industry is created, from the GS 02:48:14 <ST2> because NoGo functions only gives you some info quarterly 02:48:43 <UukGoblin> I've just patched the core to provide the extra profit information to the NewGRF callbacks and I'm trying to test that (without knowing much about NewGRFs;-) 02:49:00 <ST2> ah 02:49:15 <ST2> a combination of newgrf's and a GS? 02:49:19 <UukGoblin> yeah 02:49:39 <ST2> but that GS will work with others newgrf's? 02:49:45 <UukGoblin> because I found a NewGRF is the only way I could hook into the income calculation at the right place 02:49:46 <ST2> or vice-versa 02:50:03 <UukGoblin> ST2, like Eddi|zuHause mentioned, compatibility might be a problem 02:50:30 <UukGoblin> so the safe answer for now is "no" :-) 02:51:14 <ST2> well, all servers I created in my community, with GS's I added, created, changed, etc... works in ALL map types and newgrf's 02:51:49 <ST2> and that's the way 02:52:06 <ST2> you can't make them newgrf specific 02:52:21 <UukGoblin> I guess I couuld make the GS part into a library 02:52:52 <UukGoblin> GS code only needs to be run on industry creation, and shouldn't really affect any part of the game, as it'll only update some new fields that aren't used by anyone else [yet] 02:53:13 <UukGoblin> NewGRF code has to be specific, because, well, it depends on the defined cargoes a lot 02:53:29 <ST2> industry creation includes the mapgen? 02:53:33 <UukGoblin> as I'm effectively changing the delivery payment logic 02:54:07 <UukGoblin> ST2, not sure yet how I'll do it... I think I'll leave mapgen alone, and just scan all created industries somewhere near ::Start() or sth 02:54:56 <ST2> many GS's mess with mapgen 02:55:09 <ST2> specially some CB's 02:55:13 <UukGoblin> actually... the new field is per STATION, not industry... so scratch that, I'll only need to run code when a station is created (or an industry changes) 02:55:37 <UukGoblin> so won't do anything at the beginning, when there are no stations 02:56:09 <ST2> if you catch station name, dnt forget the "old" cheat of station walking ^^ 02:57:22 <ST2> hopefully, not new to you, right? 02:57:29 <UukGoblin> hm... 02:57:38 <UukGoblin> new indeed 02:57:44 <UukGoblin> but I think I'll be iterating via ID 02:57:56 <ST2> well, so you'll have a bad time 02:58:15 <ST2> players know how to go around many things 02:58:25 <UukGoblin> damn them ;-) 02:58:32 <ST2> and if you create a new thing... you must be prepared for that 02:58:51 <ST2> and think on how to avoid them 02:58:59 <UukGoblin> we'll see how it goes 02:59:09 <UukGoblin> I don't really have time to do any of this 02:59:12 <UukGoblin> but it's fun! 02:59:12 <ST2> that's the spirit :) 03:00:29 <ST2> "station walking" allows you to deliver water to a town, when a station is 300 tiles away, with a max spread of 7 03:00:55 <ST2> it's tricky :P 03:01:12 <UukGoblin> by building a set of connected stations or sth? 03:01:59 <ST2> well, not knowing the concept of "station walking", means that you must get more time ingames 03:02:15 <ST2> not easy to explain 03:02:32 <ST2> but the cheat name says it all ^^ 03:02:49 <UukGoblin> but the more time I spend in game, the more baffled I get by the profit calculation 03:03:14 <ST2> that's something you have to measure then 03:03:19 <UukGoblin> I see an iron ore next to a steel mill, so what do I do? I try to find another iron ore somewhere on another corner of the map to maximize profit 03:03:48 <UukGoblin> it's... weird 03:04:10 <ST2> well, OpenTTD is a deliver game 03:04:28 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 03:04:32 <ST2> and as all deliver companies, paid by the distance 03:04:48 <ST2> hey luaduck :) 03:04:55 <ST2> morning :) 03:05:40 <UukGoblin> who would pay 000 to buy imported apples from argentina when you can get them locally for ;-) 03:06:02 <ST2> UukGoblin, read above 03:06:04 <UukGoblin> yeah, I think I'm familiar with the station walking concept from in-game, I've used it a couple of times, just didn't call it that 03:06:39 <UukGoblin> ST2, paying by the distance is good, yes 03:07:02 <UukGoblin> ST2, it's just that industries should be reluctant to pay for a long distance transfer when the resource is available for less money locally 03:07:32 <ST2> closer is not always cheaper 03:07:44 <UukGoblin> i.e. it shouldn't be profitable for a transport company to deliver from china when the same thing can be bought in your town 03:07:52 <ST2> hopefully real life told you that too 03:07:55 <ST2> ^ 03:07:58 <UukGoblin> ;-) 03:08:07 <UukGoblin> yeah 03:08:09 <UukGoblin> it's not 03:08:36 <ST2> so, why messing with that in a fucking game? 03:08:39 <UukGoblin> but with the current cost calculation, closer is ALWAYS less profitable 03:09:24 <ST2> OpenTTD already have subsidies, wich are almost on short deliveris 03:09:35 <ST2> that's your idea, right? 03:09:48 <UukGoblin> subsidies only last a year or so, don't they 03:09:58 <ST2> and? 03:10:12 <ST2> want subsidies for a lifetime? 03:10:22 <UukGoblin> not usable when you're designing a transportation network that should last for years 03:10:25 <luaduck> mornin' ST2 03:10:30 <ST2> o/ 03:10:39 <UukGoblin> hrm, not quite ;-) I want the payments to make some more sense ;-) 03:11:01 <UukGoblin> subsidies... are fine as they are, yes, they could be made to last longer perhaps 03:11:06 <ST2> " transportation network" means long distance deliveries 03:11:12 <UukGoblin> yes 03:11:22 <ST2> unless you're trully bad in OpenTTD 03:11:33 <UukGoblin> I want long distance deliveries 03:12:10 <UukGoblin> if the only coal mine is at the other end of the map for a given power plant, then it should be totally as profitable as it is now for that route to pay a lot for the delivery 03:12:24 <ST2> and a 100K GBP allows you to deliver long enough to buy a new train... on 1st delivery 03:12:32 <ST2> loan* 03:13:13 <ST2> even on hard servers (there's some online) 03:13:40 <ST2> so, between "[03:11:36] <UukGoblin> I want long distance deliveries" 03:14:03 <ST2> and your goal of changing GS's and newgrf's 03:14:09 <ST2> what's your idea? 03:15:10 <UukGoblin> ST2, decrease the profit of the delivery by an amount proportional to the distance to the closest resource-producing facility 03:15:28 <UukGoblin> more or less 03:15:45 <UukGoblin> well unless the goods come from that facility 03:15:48 <ST2> that's called CDist 03:15:52 <UukGoblin> I haven't figured out the exact maths yet 03:16:15 <UukGoblin> it will take some testing until I come up with the perfect formula 03:16:15 <ST2> wich is on 1.4.4 03:17:07 <UukGoblin> CDist? tell more, google doesn't get it well 03:17:46 <ST2> check OpenTTD changelogs 03:18:49 <UukGoblin> https://wiki.openttd.org/OpenTTD_1.4.4 ? I only see a bunch of fixes, nothing about CDist 03:19:50 <UukGoblin> https://wiki.openttd.org/CargoDist ? 03:20:19 <ST2> that 03:20:32 <UukGoblin> looks nice, but not what I mean :-) 03:20:42 <ST2> introduced in 1.4.0 03:21:03 <ST2> strange that you didn't knew it 03:21:16 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@adsl-68-123-206-90.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:21:19 <UukGoblin> dude, I'm not some openttd guru 03:21:30 <ST2> neither am I 03:21:33 <ST2> and? 03:21:37 <UukGoblin> I played a bit of original TTD, I played a bit of OpenTTD, I'm good with C and C++, that's all :-) 03:21:52 <ST2> again... and? 03:21:54 <UukGoblin> so don't expect me to know every change in every version ;-) 03:22:16 <ST2> correct 03:22:48 <ST2> so, dnt expect ppl explain each step on public releases 03:22:56 <ST2> is that acceptable too? 03:23:02 <UukGoblin> sure 03:23:14 <UukGoblin> I don't expect people to explain everything 03:23:18 <ST2> so, read them 03:23:44 <UukGoblin> if I have a question I try to find the solution online and if it's problematic I ask here 03:24:01 <ST2> it's the correct place 03:24:18 <ST2> but you need to be aware of the game changes 03:24:22 <UukGoblin> (or sometimes I just ask or bitch about something without really checking, but it's not like I expect an answer) 03:25:24 <UukGoblin> I can't be aware of all the changes that are happening 03:25:35 <ST2> you can 03:25:35 <UukGoblin> I'm not a openttd maintainer 03:25:50 <ST2> check channel topic 03:26:05 <ST2> so, yes, you can 03:26:43 <UukGoblin> well, yes, I theoretically can 03:26:54 <UukGoblin> if I'm interested enough I'll check it 03:28:17 <UukGoblin> (by saying "I can't be aware" I meant more like "don't expect me to be aware") 03:28:38 <ST2> note: I'm not saying this isn't the correct channel to make questions - I only say: make the correct questions, if you're really interested 03:28:53 <ST2> because there's many others solutions 03:29:19 <UukGoblin> right 03:29:24 <ST2> and the "if I'm interested enough I'll check it" says all 03:29:31 <UukGoblin> I should probably mention that I also like hacking things 03:29:39 <ST2> includes the answers you'll get :P 03:30:13 <UukGoblin> nah, python-generated NML docs won't really be in openttd's changelogs ;-) 03:30:48 <ST2> but will be in specific changelogs 03:31:16 <UukGoblin> and that's quite a lot of unstructured text to dig through for a newbie 03:31:45 <ST2> well, someone digging NML, not a newbie 03:32:04 <UukGoblin> I only learned about NML today 03:32:46 <ST2> a newbie not even understands C++ 03:32:59 <UukGoblin> I'm an openttd-newbie, not C++-newbie :-) 03:33:11 <ST2> see? 03:33:37 <UukGoblin> no? what? 03:34:06 <ST2> well, explore how it works around 03:34:46 <UukGoblin> I feel very comfortable exploring the C++ code, it's actually quite good 03:34:57 <UukGoblin> very well written, I would say 03:35:24 <UukGoblin> I didn't really have to ask a single question to figure out how to implement my change 03:35:27 <ST2> I expected that also, unless won't be public ^^ 03:36:05 <ST2> I must say, I'm a misery in C++, Squirrel, C, C# or whatever 03:36:29 <UukGoblin> I just need some help with this pnml stuff that firs uses, it's not as nicely documented and not so straightforward 03:36:40 <ST2> but I'm good on reading ppl intentions :D 03:38:17 <UukGoblin> I think I just came up with an algorithm 03:39:12 <UukGoblin> reduce the profit made when delivering cargo proportionally by the difference of the delivery distance minus the distance of closest alternative supply 03:39:39 <ST2> well, where can I get latest FIRS release 03:39:41 <UukGoblin> so when you're delivering from the closest industry, the reduction will be 0%, so you'll get the full amount 03:40:16 <UukGoblin> surprising you should ask that 03:40:16 <ST2> UukGoblin, can you help me? 03:40:31 <UukGoblin> oh, you're making some sort of point I guess 03:40:40 <ST2> nah 03:41:12 <UukGoblin> ST2, well then, the first google result of 'openttd firs' gives you a page describing how to get it 03:41:18 <ST2> I have 8 FIRS here, no idea what was the last one :S 03:41:24 <UukGoblin> http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/ 03:41:50 <UukGoblin> 1.4.3 is the last one :-] 03:42:16 <ST2> I needed the last one released on bananas 03:42:23 <ST2> is that the one? 03:42:37 <UukGoblin> can't help you there, dunno what bananas are 03:42:56 <UukGoblin> (well unless you mean the fruit, but you don't) 03:43:00 <ST2> http://bananas.openttd.org/ 03:43:06 <ST2> wich is down now 03:43:39 <UukGoblin> ah, now I see 03:43:42 <ST2> hopefully, with time, you'll know how to work with it 03:44:08 <ST2> so, 1.4.3 is used in our FIRS servers 03:44:29 <ST2> what you wanted to chabge there? 03:44:56 <UukGoblin> I want to add a 'profit' callback to all the cargos 03:45:14 <ST2> and? 03:45:37 <ST2> I want many things too, you know?! 03:46:02 <UukGoblin> yeah well then get them 03:46:24 <ST2> backwise 03:46:33 <ST2> :P 03:46:36 <UukGoblin> I'm working on it as we speak ;-) 03:47:24 <ST2> if you make a server to test it, make it compatible with 1.5.0-RC1 03:47:28 <UukGoblin> it's just not as easy for me digging through unfamiliar python code which generates unfamiliar nml code which generates unfamiliar grf code 03:47:43 <UukGoblin> I'm mostly a single-player guy with openttd 03:48:21 <ST2> no words 03:48:28 <UukGoblin> making it work with one version on my one machine will make me happy 03:48:47 <UukGoblin> if I feel nice I might share the stuff with others too :-> 04:21:49 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:22:10 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 04:52:19 <supermop> having trouble accessing openttd.org 05:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC66A8D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 05:56:02 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:56:17 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD5E90.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 06:14:31 <__ln__> http://imgur.com/gallery/WdJim 06:18:36 <Supercheese> Hmm, maybe django is playing hooky again 06:18:42 <Supercheese> more 504 errors 06:19:00 <supermop> yeah 06:19:22 <supermop> also my autocad is acting up 06:19:26 <supermop> unrelated 06:42:32 *** chillcore [~chillcore@2a02:a03f:1048:5400:4e72:b9ff:feac:5979] has joined #openttd 06:42:51 <chillcore> good morning interwebz 06:44:20 * chillcore ponders doing a tgen smoothness light for 1.5 now 06:46:07 <chillcore> peeps have all the convenience to test as much as they want now so I can just provide two arrays with some decent presets for large and small maps 06:46:59 <chillcore> gui stuffs will then be for 1.6 and ;) 06:51:14 <Supercheese> ah, I can access the page again 06:51:40 <Supercheese> not a good time for the webserver to be spazzing 06:51:44 <Supercheese> with the new release candidate 06:55:09 <supermop> i can get it too now 06:56:05 <chillcore> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUuz68zkJu8 06:56:52 <chillcore> ye True*Brain must have woken up :P 06:57:13 <chillcore> pesky europeans and their habit to sleep. 07:00:54 <supermop> why are airports not snow aware 07:01:01 <supermop> the default ones 07:01:33 <chillcore> no sprites so not coded? 07:01:33 <supermop> couldn't it be fixed by having the grass parts be transparent to show ground below? 07:02:10 <chillcore> you can pick the order of the above words yourself 07:02:32 <chillcore> hmm for airports? not sure if that would come out nice 07:02:49 <chillcore> the snow is an overlay of tiles itself 07:03:46 <chillcore> read: there is always a hidden tile underneath no matter the kind you actually get to see 07:04:37 <chillcore> avoids ugly glithes that may occur when (custom and not custom) tiles are not pixelperfect drawn or coded 07:05:23 <chillcore> think the effect you get when flying outside the map in HL (and other games) 07:06:56 <chillcore> but yeah code needs sprites and sprites need code 07:07:32 <Supercheese> OGFX+ airports should be snow aware 07:07:42 <chillcore> could* 07:07:44 <Supercheese> could check how they do it 07:07:49 <chillcore> and ye would look better 07:08:04 <chillcore> they are? 07:09:04 <chillcore> then maybe opengfx could use some but but ... hystery 07:09:21 <chillcore> you can not add sprites to the orgnall graphics and they are supported 07:09:48 <supermop> i just mean for title game 07:09:49 <chillcore> original* ... wakie wakie fingers 07:10:30 <chillcore> ye you can have original sprites there too but not NewGRF 07:11:43 <Supercheese> could load static newgrf 07:12:11 <chillcore> sure but you can not expect other peeps to have installed what you have 07:13:09 <chillcore> as it is now vanilla OpenTTD weighs about 10 MB 07:13:48 <chillcore> including eg. 'just' zBase by default would mean 300+ at least 07:15:22 <chillcore> hosting is kindly sponsered by various entities free of charge 07:15:42 <chillcore> for us users that is 07:39:04 *** Celestar [~Celestar@fire3.tngtech.com] has joined #openttd 07:45:06 <chillcore> Hmm ... my freshly cloned hg source is not at default tip (r27193) but instead at r27185 07:45:34 <chillcore> ^^^ TrueBrain 07:45:48 <chillcore> no big drama but yeah 07:47:58 <chillcore> to be more correct: default is r27185 instead of tip 08:26:16 *** shirish [~quassel@59.88.98.17] has joined #openttd 09:39:51 <Eddi|zuHause> <chillcore> you can not add sprites to the orgnall graphics <-- sure you can. it's done all the time 09:43:58 <chillcore> moin eddi 09:45:03 <chillcore> ye now that you mention it there is that 'extra' grf I conveniently forgot about ... what would I do without you? ;) 09:47:18 <chillcore> so provided sprites and proper coding airports could be snowy in vanilla. or is there still something else I am 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KouDy [~koudy@188.75.190.58] has joined #openttd 12:03:39 <LordAro> is it working now? 12:03:44 <Pikka> nope 12:03:51 <LordAro> aw 12:04:14 *** Sylf [~sylf@c-71-199-78-95.hsd1.mo.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 12:04:18 *** guru3 [~guru3@90-230-86-71-no225.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 12:06:17 *** nikow [nikow@i.am-a.cat] has joined #openttd 12:06:23 *** Hmmmmm [~oftc-webi@36.100.199.146.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:06:25 *** orudge [~orudge@owenrudge.net] has joined #openttd 12:06:31 *** Rubidium [~Rubidium@noiv.net] has joined #openttd 12:08:37 *** UukGoblin [~jaa@yatima.uukgoblin.net] has joined #openttd 12:09:25 *** OsteHovel [~OsteHovel@90.149.87.140] has joined #openttd 12:14:36 *** sla_ro|master [~sla.ro@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 12:17:01 *** shirish_ [~quassel@59.97.98.24] has joined #openttd 12:20:19 <supermop> more houses to do 12:21:37 *** Defaultti [defaultti@lakka.kapsi.fi] has joined #openttd 12:22:22 *** shirish [~quassel@59.88.98.17] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:22:45 <NGC3982> I love my computer. 12:22:48 <NGC3982> So much. 12:28:49 *** mode/#openttd [+o Rubidium] by ChanServ 12:28:49 *** mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by ChanServ 12:28:49 *** mode/#openttd [+v michi_cc] by ChanServ 12:28:52 *** mode/#openttd [+v peter1138] by ChanServ 12:29:04 *** Prof_Frink is now known as Guest211 12:29:04 *** Xaroth|Work is now known as Guest119 12:29:08 *** Guest211 is now known as Prof_Frink 12:29:22 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 12:30:51 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 12:32:14 *** Supercheese_ [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 12:32:20 *** Supercheese is now known as Guest255 12:32:24 *** Supercheese_ is now known as Supercheese 12:36:33 *** DanMacK [~3fee8a84@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 12:36:42 *** Guest255 [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:36:48 <DanMacK> Hey all 12:37:39 <Pikka> hello DanMacK 12:39:47 <supermop> hi 12:39:57 <_dp__> Did anyone ever bothered testing double/quad size interface? 12:40:05 <_dp__> especially with custom fonts 12:40:20 <_dp__> like half of elements are not being resized properly 12:42:55 <chillcore> please compile a list of things to fix and someone, if not you, will get to it eventually; most likely. ;) 12:46:43 <chillcore> @seen someone 12:46:43 <DorpsGek> chillcore: someone was last seen in #openttd 4 years, 22 weeks, 0 days, 19 hours, 6 minutes, and 20 seconds ago: <Someone> indeed 12:46:48 <chillcore> damn 12:47:23 <Eddi|zuHause> @seen nobody 12:47:24 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: I have not seen nobody. 12:47:44 <Eddi|zuHause> your grandma sucks... 12:48:02 <chillcore> @seen grandma 12:48:02 <DorpsGek> chillcore: I have not seen grandma. 12:48:06 <chillcore> lol 12:48:30 <Eddi|zuHause> what have you got these giant eyes for, then? 12:53:44 <chillcore> I need them for better seeing these small gui elements my munchie :P 12:56:51 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6B1E9.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 12:57:51 <UukGoblin> a new day, and a new idea. Rather than moving the cost calculation between GS, NewGRF and the changes to the codebase, I'd just add a new core game setting and do everything in C++ 12:58:17 <UukGoblin> I think it'd be way cleaner and easier, both to write and to use 12:58:26 <UukGoblin> insta-compatibility with everything 12:58:53 <DanMacK> @seen andythenorth 12:58:54 <DorpsGek> DanMacK: andythenorth was last seen in #openttd 15 hours, 30 minutes, and 12 seconds ago: * andythenorth to bed 13:00:56 <_dp__> I added some bugs to tracker, but almost everywhere some thing or other doesn't look right 13:01:07 <_dp__> Mostly it is due to icons being too big 13:01:35 <chillcore> hmm too big? 13:01:55 <_dp__> Also standalone buttons that resize to text boundary look weird when compared to smth like buttons in window footers that resize independently 13:02:03 <chillcore> are you using the big gui NewGRF? 13:03:37 <_dp__> Not sure actually) I don't use newgrf but when I downloaded opengfx in game it also got smth with big ui 13:03:48 <chillcore> ye that is a feature of resizable fonts .... the gui resizes to fit everything in proportion 13:04:10 <chillcore> but sprites do not resize that way 13:04:34 <chillcore> try removing it from the newgrf config and test again? 13:04:55 <chillcore> what platform are you playing on and what is your screenres? 13:05:46 <_dp__> you mean [newgrf*] sections in openttd.cfg? they are empty 13:06:38 <chillcore> form main menu click on newgrf settings 13:06:43 <_dp__> linux (sdl), 1680x1050 13:07:21 <chillcore> to change newgrfs in running games is a bad idea most of the times 13:07:38 <chillcore> the config file is overwritten with current values on game exit 13:07:59 <chillcore> during gameplay it does not change unless forced to do so 13:09:00 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-187-164.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:09:19 <_dp__> checked newgrfs, don't use any 13:09:46 <_dp__> I have OpenGFX BigGUI grf downloaded but it is not active 13:10:31 <chillcore> same desktop res as me ... 13:11:11 <chillcore> running games might have a different newgrf config as the one in main menu ... 13:14:48 <_dp__> I know, nothing ui related in any savegames, also checked in new game without any grfs 13:16:44 <chillcore> well the thing is that the closebox and such use graphics which do not resize ... 13:17:15 <chillcore> try activating the big gui newgrf to see if that s better for you then? 13:17:44 <chillcore> best is new game ^^^ 13:24:46 <chillcore> uh that is a really bad glitch you have there 13:25:18 <_dp__> tried biggui, it's different, but can't say it's better) only makes some icons bigger 13:26:56 <chillcore> to me it seems as if you are using the big gui in the game you took screenshots of ... 13:27:50 <chillcore> did you check ingame? under the cogwheel there is a newgrf settings button 13:27:59 <chillcore> just saying ^^^ 13:28:05 <_dp__> you mean hires icons? I think new opengfs is providing them 13:28:40 <_dp__> *gfx 13:28:47 <chillcore> hi-res? there is 8bpp 32bpp and there is size which s something xompletely different 13:29:12 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has joined #openttd 13:29:28 <_dp__> also all screenshots were made on double size interface, but it only matters for error message 13:29:39 <chillcore> I am using opengfx too but my icons ore smaller ... 13:29:45 <chillcore> ah that must be it then 13:30:39 <chillcore> anyhoo the three entries you made are valid bugs. thank you 13:33:53 <_dp__> yw 13:34:04 <_dp__> but I'm not sure what to do with the rest 13:34:42 <_dp__> try using constom font of like size 12 and double or quad interface size 13:34:53 <_dp__> I think you'll see what I'm talking about 13:35:26 <chillcore> #6258 is something for opengf to fix actually 13:35:52 <chillcore> it will be fixed in all guis with fixing 1 sprite 13:36:06 <chillcore> no need to repeat those as bugreports 13:36:20 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@5751e87a.skybroadband.com] has quit [] 13:36:58 <chillcore> #6257 is a matter of forgetting the townpop label in smallmap 13:37:20 <chillcore> #6259 not sure what happened there ... 13:37:56 <chillcore> I am not sure why I would want to quadsize my interface size? 13:37:59 <_dp__> sprite size changed with interface size, but window wasn't resized to accomodate it 13:38:20 <chillcore> is that a bug in openttd or your distro? 13:38:46 <_dp__> in ttd I think 13:38:54 <_dp__> probably some OnResize missing ;) 13:39:26 <ST2> cooooooooookies!!!! Good morning ;) 13:39:27 <ST2> o/ 13:39:35 <_dp__> hi) 13:39:44 <chillcore> why? openttd does not resize interfase for as far as I am aware 13:39:59 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@5751e87a.skybroadband.com] has joined #openttd 13:40:06 <peter1138> Sure it does. 13:40:23 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:40:28 <chillcore> k 13:40:31 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:41:19 <UukGoblin> trying to load a savegame from 1.4.4 in a recent version (svn r27193) results "Broken savegame - Invalid chunk size", did I forget to set some compile-time setting? 13:41:45 <chillcore> o/ ST2 13:42:25 <Eddi|zuHause> UukGoblin: typically you get this message when the savegame is from some patched version 13:42:52 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 13:43:05 <Eddi|zuHause> or if you patched the new version, and didn't apply savegame conversion correctly 13:43:10 <UukGoblin> Eddi|zuHause, oh, ok, I guess that comes from me playing a patched svn version instead 13:43:15 <UukGoblin> that's it :-) 13:46:12 <UukGoblin> kinda makes sense, I added a new setting which has to be saved in games, so the chunk size is expected to change ;-) 13:54:25 *** Suicyder [~Suicyder@86.92.59.88] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:57:01 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc20-stap11-2-0-cust392.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: JacobD88] 14:02:28 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@D97BA869.cm-3-4c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 14:03:09 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-252-157.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd 14:03:55 <Samu> 504 Gateway Time-out 14:04:00 <Samu> http://www.openttd.org/en/ 14:09:40 <chillcore> lol @ the Atari https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=72791 14:09:47 <chillcore> I bet they tested much 14:12:05 *** Dr0ppy [~oftc-webi@109.98.195.67] has joined #openttd 14:12:08 <Dr0ppy> hi 14:12:13 <Dr0ppy> can i get some help please? 14:12:39 <chillcore> just ask instead of asking to ask ;) 14:12:39 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 14:12:42 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:13:03 <Dr0ppy> well 14:13:07 <Dr0ppy> so it says it cant open a file 14:13:28 <Dr0ppy> also it says gateway timed out 504 14:13:45 <Dr0ppy> file is c program files open ttd data sample.cat 14:18:08 <chillcore> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=44316 14:18:14 <chillcore> this helps? 14:18:50 <Samu> those colors 14:19:00 <Samu> reminds me of starcraft brood war 14:19:32 <Samu> there was a fix for starcraft brood war which involved in editing windows registry 14:20:51 <Samu> something like [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\DirectDraw\Compatibility\Starcraft116] 14:21:05 <Samu> probably a similar fix is needed for locomotion 14:22:12 <Samu> or if using 64 bits windows 14:22:13 <Samu> [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Microsoft\DirectDraw\Compatibility\Starcraft116] 14:22:37 <chillcore> I doubt he/she is reading her samu 14:22:40 <chillcore> here* 14:23:11 <Samu> seems to be a palette conversion 14:23:18 <Samu> "Flags"=hex:00,08,00,00 14:23:22 <Samu> "Name"="Starcraft.exe" 14:23:27 <Samu> "ID"=hex:ca,89,65,49 14:23:35 <Samu> ok, sorry 14:31:10 <chillcore> fine for me but helps noone ;) 14:31:33 <chillcore> but ye pallete conversion or screensaver kicking in 14:32:38 <Samu> i hear it's windows aero interfering, explorer.exe running in the background and so on 14:32:53 <Samu> messes with the colors 14:33:08 <chillcore> quite possible yes and nothing new 14:36:33 <Samu> https://kruckenberg1.wordpress.com/2010/04/11/starcraft-colors-in-windows-7-and-vista/ 14:37:46 <UukGoblin> so if I want to find all industries producing a given cargo type, is there really nothin more efficient than iterating through them all and checking every industry's all produced cargos? 14:37:50 *** TheMask96 [martijn@pride.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:38:12 <Samu> http://www.sevenforums.com/gaming/100379-how-i-fixed-corrupt-color-palette-some-old-games-windows-7-a.html 14:39:59 <chillcore> Uukgoblin: click an industry and display chain, form there link to smallmap 14:40:09 <chillcore> not sure what info you are after ... 14:40:22 <UukGoblin> chillcore, sorry, I should've said: in the C++ code ;-) 14:40:51 <UukGoblin> I mean that's what ScriptIndustryList_CargoProducing does so I guess there are no better indices to use 14:41:23 <Eddi|zuHause> UukGoblin: what more efficient method do you expect other than looking at each one? 14:41:34 <UukGoblin> just thinking that iterating through a few hundred industries on each cargo delivery might hurt 14:41:36 <Eddi|zuHause> UukGoblin: there's no indexing on output cargo or something going on 14:41:50 <UukGoblin> Eddi|zuHause, yeah, maybe some nice cargo-type index 14:42:10 <Eddi|zuHause> you need to make that on your own, then 14:42:16 *** TheMask96 [martijn@envy.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 14:42:18 <UukGoblin> Eddi|zuHause, nodnod, thank you :-) 14:42:21 <Eddi|zuHause> and keep it updated on opening/closing industries 14:42:28 <UukGoblin> yup 14:42:35 <Eddi|zuHause> including magic bulldozer and stuff 14:42:52 <UukGoblin> I assume industries are created fairly rarely, compared to the number of times a cargo gets delivered 14:43:00 <UukGoblin> created/closed/bulldozed 14:43:05 <Eddi|zuHause> probably 14:44:52 <chillcore> ye samu ... but that is not something a player should ever be expected to fix ... it is Atari being lazy and just looking for a quick money grab 14:45:06 <_dp__> mb filtering by industry type first can speed up things a bit, not sure tho 14:45:18 <chillcore> Chris should sell his Transport Tycoon on steam and using the diff as selling point :P 14:45:19 *** roidal [~roland@cm140-210.liwest.at] has joined #openttd 14:49:17 <UukGoblin> hmm, actually, all industries are iterated on each tick anyway.. maybe I overestimated the iteration cost 14:52:05 <Eddi|zuHause> usual iterations are every 256 ticks (called "the tile loop") 14:52:15 <_dp__> not all as far as I can tell, each is ticked every INDUSTRY_PRODUCE_TICKS 14:52:21 <chillcore> ohoh moki did post some values while back and I totally missed them ... :blushes: 14:52:43 <UukGoblin> ah yeah, industry ticks 14:53:57 <UukGoblin> should be fine.. :-) 15:04:49 *** Suicyder [~Suicyder@86.92.59.88] has joined #openttd 15:11:05 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-180-225.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Quit: c('~' )o] 15:11:21 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:11:24 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 15:17:07 *** Pikka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:20:18 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-67-211.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 15:25:37 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:26:04 <Samu> oh yesh, i just fixed ship depot demolishing 15:27:31 <chillcore> nice ... maybe keep the fixes as seperate patches for now? makes it easier to debug as you go; if needed 15:28:01 <Samu> that MakeWaterKeepingClass must be doing something 15:28:14 <Samu> i don't know what it really do yet, i have to investigate 15:29:28 <Samu> (but not now!) - ok i know 15:29:32 <Samu> i always get lost in details 15:29:36 <Samu> skip 15:30:07 *** zeknurn` [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 15:30:23 <chillcore> it is okay to take a break from time to time and investigate something else to have a change of mind 15:30:38 <chillcore> just when fixing stuffs one thing at atime works better ;) 15:32:22 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:33:18 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00d064.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:43:35 *** Dr0ppy [~oftc-webi@109.98.195.67] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 15:51:05 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:51:08 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 15:57:20 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-67-211.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:19:24 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 16:27:04 *** Alberth [~alberth@a82-95-140-173.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 16:27:07 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 16:36:50 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 16:39:22 *** BouncingHitman [~BouncingH@d24-150-4-188.home.cgocable.net] has joined #openttd 16:40:46 *** BouncingHitman [~BouncingH@d24-150-4-188.home.cgocable.net] has quit [] 16:41:22 *** BouncingHitman [~BouncingH@d24-150-4-188.home.cgocable.net] has joined #openttd 16:43:17 *** BouncingHitman [~BouncingH@d24-150-4-188.home.cgocable.net] has quit [] 16:46:14 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18C31.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:47:10 *** Compu is now known as CompuDesktop 16:48:06 <Alberth> o/ 16:48:46 <V453000> watup 16:49:40 <Samu> this DoCommand is annoying 16:50:33 <Samu> isn't there a more elegant way to prevent it from changing 16:50:41 <Samu> that bit information? 16:50:48 <Samu> the canal on river 16:52:41 <Alberth> dinner is coming 16:53:12 *** asdw [~oftc-webi@rrcs-98-100-250-234.central.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 16:53:25 <asdw> Hello all 16:53:32 <Alberth> o/ 16:53:33 <Samu> DoCommandFlag 16:53:41 <Samu> what are these flags for 16:53:47 <asdw> Having issue getting to Openttd.org 16:54:26 <Alberth> me has that too, apparently 16:55:03 <asdw> you can ping the website but not actually ge to it 16:55:13 <asdw> i didnt know who to report it too 16:55:21 <Alberth> here was fine :) 16:55:23 <asdw> found this on the wiki 16:55:40 <asdw> I wanted to download the new RC 16:55:47 <Alberth> forwarded it to our sysadmin 16:55:54 <asdw> Thanks 16:56:11 <asdw> ill be looking forward to getting the new RC 16:56:21 <asdw> have a good day 16:56:21 <Alberth> try binaries.openttd.org 16:56:29 <asdw> will do 16:56:31 *** liq3 [~liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 16:57:24 *** asdw [~oftc-webi@rrcs-98-100-250-234.central.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 16:57:51 <Samu> delete i; 16:58:20 <Samu> delete industry, how exactly does it delete it? 16:58:38 <Alberth> just like any c++ object gets deleted 16:58:55 <Samu> :( 17:00:12 <Alberth> I don't see how it's special, everything is c++, so it follows c++ rules 17:01:34 <Samu> when i bulldoze an industry in scenario editor, where in the code does that happen? 17:01:40 <Samu> i have to find this 17:01:56 <Samu> especially the tiles 17:02:24 <Samu> how does it remove the tiles 17:04:29 <Alberth> inside delete i, I'd say 17:04:54 <Eddi|zuHause> Samu: "delete" calls the destructor 17:04:55 <Alberth> ie some destructor 17:07:34 <V453000> me 17:10:17 <Samu> hmm i think i found it 17:10:44 <Samu> MakeWaterKeepingClass again being the culprit 17:14:02 <Alberth> yeah, we like to have the least amount of code for handling things, so you'll run into the same code all the time within one topic 17:14:27 <Samu> DoClearSquare(tile); 17:14:35 <Samu> inside MakeWaterKeepingClass 17:14:41 <Samu> that's the problem 17:14:55 *** JayMayer [~JayMayer@81.130.2.22] has joined #openttd 17:15:03 <Samu> gonna try to fix this thing 17:29:56 <Samu> damn MSE really slows down my system 17:35:43 *** flipFLOPS [~aardvark@cpe-107-185-75-97.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 17:37:14 *** roidal [~roland@cm140-210.liwest.at] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 17:37:41 *** roidal [~roland@cm140-210.liwest.at] has joined #openttd 17:39:15 *** JayMayer [~JayMayer@81.130.2.22] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:43:27 <Samu> grr, dumb MSE hogs my HDD 17:43:53 <Samu> it becomes so unresponsive that nothing reacts on the screen 17:44:36 <Terkhen> hello 17:45:11 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27197 trunk/src/lang/swedish.txt (2015-03-19 18:45:05 +0100 ) 17:45:12 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:13 <DorpsGek> swedish - 3 changes by Joel_A 17:45:24 <Samu> i really need a SSD 17:45:45 <Samu> stupid antiviruses don't know how to use a HDD 17:45:52 <Alberth> more memory is easier ? 17:46:23 <Samu> queue depth is more than this drive can handle 17:47:04 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C33E3.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 17:47:42 <Samu> RAM usage is at 4.57 17:47:47 <Samu> GB 17:48:00 <Samu> 57% 17:48:54 <Samu> cpu usage 2%~ 17:48:57 <Alberth> machine isn't using its resources very well then 17:49:00 <Samu> hdd usage 100% 17:49:50 <Alberth> yeah, windows is horribly inefficient 17:49:59 <Samu> queue depth between 4.6 and 8 17:50:06 <Samu> horrible 17:50:32 <UukGoblin> this Xorg client number limit is annoying 17:50:47 <UukGoblin> someone should fix that already, 256 clients is totally not enough for 16 desktops 17:51:26 <UukGoblin> I'll have to work around this and route all my rxvts via tmux :-S 17:51:52 <Samu> disk speed 2 MB/s 17:52:00 <Alberth> run a second server :) 17:53:21 <Samu> access time for some files are in 1000 ms 17:53:25 <Samu> :( 17:53:59 *** flipFLOPS [~aardvark@cpe-107-185-75-97.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:54:24 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_zzz 17:54:32 <Samu> Is there a way to lower priority? 17:54:42 <Samu> io priority 17:54:56 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:54:59 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 17:55:39 <Alberth> it sounds more like some program is doing insane things 17:57:27 <UukGoblin> it's probably the (anti)virus 17:58:01 <Samu> MsMpEng.exe 17:58:11 <Samu> doing funny things with my HDD 17:58:16 <UukGoblin> think about it - viruses steal your computer's resources to perform tasks that they feel beneficial to their security. Antiviruses do basically the same... 17:58:26 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18C31.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:59:56 <Samu> it seems to be extracting archives 18:00:01 <Samu> to a temporary folder 18:00:34 <Samu> extracting multiple archives extracting at the same time while scanning them 18:01:11 <Samu> then some archives have other archives inside them, they are also extracted to be scanned 18:01:14 <Samu> bah 18:01:16 <Samu> no wonder 18:03:12 <Samu> cpu usage for MsMpEng.exe averaging 3% 18:03:16 <Samu> that's so funny 18:04:47 <Samu> limit scanning to a max of 10% cpu usage, does nothing 18:04:54 <Samu> what a useless feature 18:06:13 <UukGoblin> that's because the scanner doesn't use CPU 18:06:16 <UukGoblin> the kernel does 18:07:03 <Samu> i can't set a lower value than 10% 18:07:25 <UukGoblin> uninstall that antivirus 18:07:32 <Samu> averaging 3% turns this unresponsive 18:07:34 <UukGoblin> and get a linux machine 18:09:15 *** ASDW [~oftc-webi@rrcs-98-100-250-234.central.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 18:09:34 <ASDW> Thanks guys its back up at www.openttd.org/en 18:09:53 *** ASDW [~oftc-webi@rrcs-98-100-250-234.central.biz.rr.com] has quit [] 18:10:04 <glx> I won't call MSE an antivirus 18:10:34 <Eddi|zuHause> Samu: what you're hitting is not the CPU limit, but the disk I/O limit 18:11:03 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r27198 trunk/src/lang/swedish.txt (2015-03-19 19:11:00 +0100 ) 18:11:04 <DorpsGek> -Revert (r27197): WT3 being rude. 18:11:07 <Samu> I see, how do I remove priority to that 18:11:38 <Eddi|zuHause> a mitigation technique could be moving the temporary folder to a ramdrive 18:12:09 <Eddi|zuHause> also, annoy the hell out of the product support... 18:12:22 <Samu> hmm needs to be a big ramdrive, some archives are giant 18:12:28 <Samu> 7 GB 18:12:31 <Samu> 4 Gb 18:12:39 <Samu> and i only got 8 GB RAM 18:12:49 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm sure you can tell it to ignore archives 18:13:10 <Samu> I can, but... 18:13:24 <Samu> ... makes no sense when I need to scan everything 18:15:46 <Samu> windows10technicalpreview .iso -> install .wim -> blabla .cab 18:16:05 <Samu> these archiving methods slow down so much 18:18:59 <Samu> MakeWaterKeepingClass appears to be the solution after all 18:19:08 <Samu> if I put the bool stuff here 18:19:19 <Samu> I won't have to put in many other cases 18:28:30 <Samu> Windows XP / Vista / 7 (64bit) (installer) - you don't mention Windows 8 there 18:32:10 <Samu> heh, SmartScreen Filter is telling me this program is not transferred very often and that it's not signed by it's author -> openttd-1.5.0-RC1-windows-win64.exe 18:32:17 <Samu> mucho secure 18:32:56 <Samu> recommends me not to execute it, hmm :) 18:33:10 <Samu> lel 18:33:43 <peter1138> Well, it's new. 18:34:23 <Samu> i have a weird feeling microsoft is spying 18:34:30 <Samu> what is downloaded and what is not 18:34:55 <glx> only for MSE users 18:35:03 <peter1138> If you're using IE, you get what you deserve. 18:35:05 <Samu> :) 18:35:12 <Samu> it's IE11 18:36:09 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:36:43 <Wolf01> o/ o/ 18:52:52 <frosch123> @services op 18:53:57 <V453000> @saynotofrog 18:55:34 <Alberth> @services op 18:57:42 <TrueBrain> @services op 18:57:45 *** mode/#openttd [+o DorpsGek] by ChanServ 18:57:45 <TrueBrain> thar, I fixed him 18:59:16 <V453000> @do_mayhem 18:59:24 <V453000> Doesnt seem to work 18:59:28 <TrueBrain> @kick V453000 1 mayhem coming up 18:59:29 *** V453000 was kicked from #openttd by DorpsGek [1 mayhem coming up] 18:59:55 *** V453000 [~V453000@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:00:14 <V453000> Was just pointing at flaws! 19:00:27 <TrueBrain> I pointed back :D 19:01:06 <V453000> :D I accept the feedback 19:01:36 <DorpsGek> you're welcome 19:02:10 <TrueBrain> too many people with say right .... :D 19:02:53 <glx> (and with client shortcuts so it's hidden) 19:05:38 <V453000> :) 19:08:06 <Samu> woah, im impressed 19:08:37 <Samu> editing MakeWaterKeepingClass alone fixed many things at once 19:08:54 <Samu> dock water tile is still failing 19:19:58 <Samu> so nice, everything is fixed, except for docks 19:19:58 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 19:20:03 <Samu> upon building 19:20:09 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 19:20:13 <andythenorth> o/ 19:20:49 <Alberth> o/ 19:22:55 <andythenorth> cat is bee 19:26:37 <andythenorth> cat is not horse 19:29:14 <andythenorth> he has a point http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1145169#p1145169 19:31:37 <Samu> wow dock is confusing 19:32:48 *** roidal [~roland@cm140-210.liwest.at] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 19:35:10 *** Guest119 [~XarothAtW@194.1.204.204] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 19:35:38 *** Xaroth|Work [~XarothAtW@194.1.204.204] has joined #openttd 19:53:34 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: except it's all pointless 19:55:22 <andythenorth> I wondered 19:55:34 * andythenorth tries to reproduce a really odd Road Hog bug 19:55:44 <andythenorth> earlier I had two trucks, same model 19:56:01 <andythenorth> for the same direction (they were following each other), one failed to recolour the 2CC parts 19:56:08 <andythenorth> the other recoloured them correctly 19:56:14 <andythenorth> I didnât screenshot :( 19:56:30 <andythenorth> I changed the newgrf on running game, so all bets are off 19:57:12 *** Celestar [~Celestar@fire3.tngtech.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:57:31 <andythenorth> nvm 19:58:06 <andythenorth> do we have any way to calculate fps, or equivalent? 19:58:10 <andythenorth> and log it? 19:58:27 <Eddi|zuHause> not really 19:58:42 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe if you put TIC/TOC in the right places 19:58:52 *** chillcore [~chillcore@2a02:a03f:1048:5400:4e72:b9ff:feac:5979] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:59:01 <andythenorth> Iâd like some numbers to evidence that double-size UI makes ffwd quantitatively slower 19:59:13 <Eddi|zuHause> probably not 19:59:17 <andythenorth> I could screenshot a vehicle over fixed distance, with my system clock showing in seconds :P 19:59:32 <Eddi|zuHause> amount of sprites has way more impact than size of sprites 19:59:36 <andythenorth> anyway, ffwd on OS X currently isnât 19:59:51 <glx> ffwd depends on many things 20:00:06 <peter1138> Sure it is. It's not the game's fault your PC is too slow... :p 20:00:26 <andythenorth> I suspect Apple 20:01:22 <andythenorth> on my last mac, ffwd was (ridiculously) fast for a sensible map / game 20:01:34 <andythenorth> on this one, itâs a slug 20:01:41 <Samu> woah 20:01:49 <Samu> i can't seem to do this for dock 20:02:11 <Samu> there's a hidden 3rd tile which gets the information about it being built on river 20:02:21 <Samu> that's wrong 20:02:46 <Samu> can i get some help 20:03:04 <andythenorth> something has changed in OS X compiling / blitters / something 20:03:34 <andythenorth> eh who knows, too many things I donât understand :) 20:03:53 <Samu> what I'm doing for the 3rd tile is to be done on the 2nd tile, the middle one instead 20:04:03 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you can change blitters from command line 20:04:20 <Samu> CommandCost CmdBuildDock(TileIndex tile, DoCommandFlag flags, uint32 p1, uint32 p2, const char *text) 20:04:30 <Samu> in station_cmd.cpp file 20:05:25 * andythenorth looks in wiki 20:06:03 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: openttd config, or .configure? 20:06:08 <andythenorth> ./configure * 20:06:12 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: no 20:06:21 <Eddi|zuHause> ./openttd -blah 20:06:33 <andythenorth> run time 20:06:56 <Eddi|zuHause> well, config could do as well 20:07:21 <Eddi|zuHause> http://9gag.com/gag/a9LqwZ1 20:09:09 <andythenorth> -b, no space? 20:09:11 <andythenorth> -b8bpp-optimized 20:09:52 *** Klanticus [~quassel@179.234.179.109] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:10:20 <Alberth> works with space too 20:10:56 <andythenorth> this is outdated wrt gui size :D https://wiki.openttd.org/FAQ_troubleshooting 20:11:15 <Alberth> wiki is out of date at many places :( 20:11:21 <andythenorth> nature of wikis 20:11:42 <andythenorth> assuming Iâve done it correctly none of the blitters Iâve tried make any difference to ffwd 20:11:42 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-162.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 20:12:34 <andythenorth> as thereâs no animation with some of the blitters, Iâm assuming Iâve done it correctly :P 20:13:16 <andythenorth> on 1x GUI zoom, the 32bpp-optimized blitter has acceptable ffwd with âfull animation' off 20:13:34 <andythenorth> is it time to get a virtualbox to play OpenTTD in? 20:13:45 <andythenorth> OS X port might be dead 20:14:44 <andythenorth> which of these would I hate least? http://virtualboxes.org/images/ 20:15:16 <andythenorth> I am low on HD space :P 20:15:25 <Supercheese> aren't we all... 20:17:14 <Samu> if (river) SB(_me[tile + TileOffsByDiagDir(direction)].m6, 0, 1, 1); 20:17:25 <Samu> i hope this do what i think it does 20:19:14 <andythenorth> hmm 20:19:21 <andythenorth> 500MB of openttd saves 20:19:25 <andythenorth> that can mostly go :P 20:19:40 <Samu> oh yes! ox29 20:19:43 <Samu> 0x29 20:19:47 <Samu> correct! 20:20:29 <Wolf01> 12TB of OTTD grfs 20:20:41 <Samu> and MakeWaterKeepingClass is doing it's magic correctly as well 20:20:47 <Samu> after I fixed it 20:20:57 <Samu> guys, I think my patch is complete now 20:21:50 <Wolf01> http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2015/03/04/and-its-done/ <- 20:21:56 <Samu> let me show you 20:23:23 <Alberth> Wolf01: :D 20:23:31 <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/phsigderr 20:23:39 <Samu> tell me 20:23:42 <Samu> what u trhink 20:24:21 <Alberth> I wonder what other Pathing_TryNode calls I have 20:27:20 <Samu> and objects didn't need to be edited 20:27:27 <Samu> kind of surprised me 20:28:38 *** flipFLOPS [~aardvark@cpe-107-185-75-97.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 20:32:16 <Supercheese> oh neat, potential fix for the "ahshite I blew up the river by mistake" eh? 20:32:40 <Samu> ye 20:35:56 <Supercheese> think I can test that, lemme compile and get back to ya 20:36:34 <Samu> you can still destroy rivers 20:36:51 <Samu> what I did was for the canal being built on rivers 20:37:00 *** sla_ro|master [~sla.ro@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 20:37:16 <Supercheese> hm? 20:37:28 <Supercheese> So, build canal on river, blow up canal, river restored? 20:37:31 <Samu> yes 20:37:37 <Supercheese> ah, I see 20:37:42 <Samu> if you destroy a 2nd time, river is then gone 20:38:00 <Supercheese> well, I can still test that then 20:38:24 <Samu> I'm just worried about those NewGRFs 20:38:53 <Samu> I have a bad feeling about those which use different stations or industries 20:38:57 <Samu> but 20:40:24 <Samu> I dunno what i could do about that 20:42:51 <Supercheese> Hm, compile errors, wonder what went wrong 20:43:06 <Samu> is it my fault? 20:43:16 <Supercheese> I do not yet know 20:44:29 <Supercheese> It seems there's an instance where you try and use the "delta" variable where it hasn't been declared 20:45:01 <Supercheese> either that or there is weird interaction 20:45:19 <andythenorth> hmm 20:45:20 <Supercheese> between my source, I had commented out a few lines in water_cmd already 20:45:26 <andythenorth> does he know that cdist is predictive? 20:45:27 <Supercheese> should really try with clean source bleh 20:45:41 * andythenorth is really puzzled how it could work 20:46:28 <Samu> HasBit(_me[tile - delta].m6, 0); 20:46:34 <Samu> delta is only mentioned for locks 20:46:40 <Samu> declared or whatever 20:47:02 <andythenorth> last time I check, cargo wonât be moved to a station anyway, unless a vehicle with valid refit has been there 20:47:21 <andythenorth> and ârefit availableâ wonât meet that criteria 20:47:27 <andythenorth> checked * 20:47:28 *** Mek [~quassel@marijnalexwedding.com] has joined #openttd 20:47:31 <Supercheese> yeah I think my previous edits messed with your patch 20:47:36 <Supercheese> blah 20:47:39 * andythenorth grumble grumble 20:47:51 <andythenorth> will I play openttd, or fix this datepicker widget? 20:47:56 <andythenorth> or go to bed? 20:53:23 <Supercheese> ok, it's compiling now, serves me right for dropping a patch on top of another patch 20:53:29 *** flipFLOPS [~aardvark@cpe-107-185-75-97.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:53:55 <Supercheese> it may have been helpful to create a patch with more lines of context around the diff areas, hmm 20:54:03 <Supercheese> should be a setting for that somewhere 20:55:29 <Samu> what's that? 20:56:30 <Supercheese> in *.diff files, you see â3 lines above and below your changes, increasing those lines of context would be helpful in several instances 20:56:43 <Supercheese> dunno if you can change that in TortoiseSVN though 20:57:11 <Samu> oh, I think i know what you mean, let me check if there's an option 20:57:39 <Supercheese> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/tortoisesvn/LqD5KRm3EtI 20:57:50 <Supercheese> seems like it's actually not configurable 20:58:17 <Alberth> plain svn doesn't have it 20:58:30 <Supercheese> would have to call your own diff program in that case 20:59:14 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: your 4. is just a variation of 3. 21:00:14 <Alberth> svn cat file.txt | diff -u -C10 - file.txt or so :) 21:00:16 <Supercheese> well, the patch seems to work 21:00:47 <Supercheese> build canal on river -> blow up canal -> river restored 21:00:56 <Supercheese> which does not happen in vanilla 21:01:05 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6BD31.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 21:01:22 <Supercheese> however, build canal on ocean -> blow up canal -> bare ground appears 21:01:31 <Supercheese> this patch didn't change anything regarding that 21:01:44 <Supercheese> but it now seems incongruous behavior 21:02:25 <Alberth> I wonder whether the latter has a function 21:02:43 <Supercheese> build canal on ocean you mean? 21:02:52 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00d064.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 21:02:58 <Supercheese> that's used to hack together the seaplane airport 21:03:01 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6B1E9.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:03:19 <Alberth> hmm, you should be able to build a canal there, perhaps :p 21:03:23 <Supercheese> or other sealevel structures 21:03:23 <Alberth> +not 21:03:24 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18C31.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 21:03:36 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: fair point 21:03:41 <andythenorth> I read change as âmodifyâ 21:03:43 <andythenorth> but eh 21:03:48 <Supercheese> and the water tiles are animated differently, which looks really weird 21:05:24 <Supercheese> although you can create some neat effects with a 0-height island by using canals on ocean 21:06:40 <Samu> build canal on sea, I didn't do anything aobut that 21:07:23 <Supercheese> yeah, but it now sticks out as opposite the new river behavior 21:07:34 <Supercheese> whereas before it was the same for both 21:08:03 <Samu> it's because I don't think it's needed 21:08:23 <Supercheese> a valid design decision :) 21:08:40 <Samu> becomes bareland, then it's flooded a second later, so it's sea again 21:09:05 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: it can be used to open strips of land e.g. to build rails on sealevel, because the canals prevent flooding 21:09:55 <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: preventing building canal on ocean just means you need to blow up the ocean and then build a canal 21:10:05 <Eddi|zuHause> there's really no point in why that should be preferable 21:10:18 <Alberth> it should flood then :p 21:10:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i disagree. 21:10:33 <andythenorth> canal on sea is essential 21:11:31 <Samu> ah i see what you mean 21:11:48 <Samu> better not restore sea then 21:12:25 <Eddi|zuHause> Samu: well, restoring the sea might mitigate an effort to cheat 21:12:41 <Eddi|zuHause> Samu: blowing up water is very expensive. building canal and blowing up the canal may be cheaper 21:14:28 *** DanMacK [~3fee8a84@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 21:14:42 <Samu> or maybe I don't see what you mean 21:17:39 <Samu> an island protected by canals at level 0 21:18:02 <Supercheese> Eddi|zuHause: It is indeed cheaper 21:18:24 <andythenorth> bye 21:18:24 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has left #openttd [] 21:18:32 <Samu> sorry, I am confused about airports on water, which grf uses that 21:20:37 <Supercheese> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=57133 21:21:39 <Supercheese> Av8 has seaplanes 21:27:11 *** Alberth [~alberth@a82-95-140-173.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 21:32:57 <Samu> which model is a seaplane, im new to this 21:34:34 <Supercheese> you have to enable them via parameter 21:34:39 <Supercheese> Seaplane Preview 21:44:20 <Samu> i don't understand the point of that 21:44:37 <Supercheese> well, seaplanes shouldn't really be able to land on regular tarmac 21:44:45 <Supercheese> but OTTD has yet to distinguish runway types 21:45:02 <Samu> i can't build the airport on water 21:47:49 <peter1138> Someone⢠should make it do that... 21:48:12 <Supercheese> you don't build it on water, as the thread indicated 21:48:31 <Supercheese> you clear land, optionally surround it with canals, then build the airport on the bare land 21:48:49 <Samu> if i dont surround it with canals, it's flooded 21:48:50 <Supercheese> you'll need the canals if you build it on cleared ocean 21:48:59 <Supercheese> or newobjects I suppose 21:49:14 <Samu> i can't place the water object 21:49:19 <Samu> it's 0x0 size 21:50:35 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-162.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:51:53 <Samu> well, technically, this is not an airport built on a canal 21:52:18 <Samu> which could have been built on river 21:52:25 <Samu> so... i'm safe from this 21:52:56 <Samu> it's an airport built on bareland tiles 21:53:04 <Samu> but it looks like water 22:03:27 <Supercheese> yeah, you don't need to worry much about it, I mentioned in regarding the utility of building canals on ocean 22:16:07 <Samu> there's something missing on the patch, the landscape html files 22:16:18 <Samu> gah 22:16:24 <Samu> i dont have a decent html editor 22:20:14 <Supercheese> Notepad++? 22:21:29 <Samu> i can't see the results immediately, or can i? 22:21:37 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18C31.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:24:16 <Supercheese> Well, ctrl+s, open the .html in browser, not necessarily immediate but close 22:24:28 <Supercheese> I don't do much html though 22:28:38 *** Taede [~T@2a02:348:94:6571::1] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 22:29:45 *** Taede [~T@neuron.nurionis.co.uk] has joined #openttd 22:32:23 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-187-164.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 22:33:31 <supermop> yo 22:42:47 <Wolf01> 'night 22:42:53 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 22:43:11 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 22:44:57 <Samu> <li>m6 bit 0: river restoration flag for canals</li> 22:45:04 <Samu> is this clear enough? 22:45:20 <Samu> maybe not 22:45:24 <Samu> for when a canal is removed 22:45:50 <Samu> help me at english 22:46:29 <Samu> <li>m6 bit 0: river restoration flag for whenever a canal is removed</li> 22:52:21 *** Suicyder [~Suicyder@86.92.59.88] has quit [Quit: Try HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <-] 23:03:03 <Samu> hmm 23:06:39 <Samu> notepad++ is awesome 23:06:47 <Samu> here's a new patch revision 23:06:49 <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pqijtcywx 23:12:49 <Samu> or here http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=72691&p=1145186#p1145186 23:33:26 <supermop> i know this is antithetical to the idea of iron horse, but i find myself missing multiple units 23:33:57 <supermop> i've made a train of three slammers and two passenger cars, but it's quite expensive and looks odd 23:42:14 *** Pikka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 23:50:02 *** BobDendry [~lachlan@14.200.248.59] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:54:47 <Samu> chat looks silent 23:55:07 <Samu> in your opinion, what you think it's easier to do? 23:55:31 <Samu> terraformable rivers or 2 owners for canals?