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00:20:33 *** FLHerne_ has quit IRC 00:44:34 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 00:57:57 *** glx has quit IRC 01:13:09 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 03:48:26 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has joined #openttd 03:55:01 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 04:32:26 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 05:28:55 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 05:37:47 *** Cubey has quit IRC 06:36:37 *** Biolunar has joined #openttd 06:47:43 <Eddi|zuHause> <Alberth> well, newgrf has so much control over displayed graphics, that you need that code to decide what to display <- i think, theoretically, that should be solvable by compiling each action3/2-switch-chain into a shader 06:48:02 <Eddi|zuHause> that still would require updating the game state for every frame 06:48:20 <Eddi|zuHause> but all the resolving could be parallelized 06:51:14 <Eddi|zuHause> mind you, i have no idea how shaders work 07:00:27 *** Speedy has quit IRC 07:18:25 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd 07:18:43 *** Speedy` is now known as Speedy 07:19:55 *** chomwitt has joined #openttd 08:14:14 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 09:46:40 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 09:47:02 <Wolf01> o/ 09:55:31 <crem> о////////о 09:56:58 <Wolf01> Well, today I have a goal I will not reach, but the important thing is to aim it not to reach it, right? 10:00:42 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 10:07:23 <peter1138> Heh, fainting robots. 10:13:58 <crem> well, specialists say you should split the goal into steps until it's doable in 30 minutes, then do! 10:21:43 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 10:28:21 *** gelignite has quit IRC 10:48:34 <Wolf01> crem: it's already split, I'm already stuck at the first part 10:53:02 <andythenorth> moin 10:53:11 <Wolf01> o/ 11:25:12 *** blocage has joined #openttd 11:37:33 *** sim-al2 is now known as Guest4965 11:37:34 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 11:41:32 *** Guest4965 has quit IRC 11:41:55 *** chomwitt has quit IRC 11:49:56 *** APTX has quit IRC 11:53:32 *** APTX has joined #openttd 12:15:35 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 12:38:06 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 12:51:29 <Wolf01> I was about to start my train set with prime number lenghts, then I figured out it's too easy to get 16 12:52:07 <Wolf01> 3+3+3+7, 11+5, 3+3+5+5 12:52:25 <Wolf01> I need something else 12:52:47 <V453000> I wanted to convert nuts vehicles to something like 1+2+2+2+1 for 8/8 12:52:56 <V453000> you can make both 8/8 and 4/4 with it visually properly 12:53:06 <V453000> problem is that it fucks up curve speed limits completely 12:53:54 <Wolf01> I think I'll make only 2 sets of wagons: 7/8 and 11/8 12:54:04 <V453000> wtf :D 12:54:43 <Wolf01> And all the engines 9/8 even if it isn't prime 12:56:07 <Wolf01> So you can only have 1 tile train at best: 9+7, or 2 tiles one with double head 9+7+7+9 12:56:59 <Wolf01> And I'll do it with voxels 12:57:13 <Wolf01> So I can piss off even more people 12:58:55 <V453000> I don't think I understand perfectly :0 12:59:00 <V453000> so how do you make 3 tile train? 12:59:09 <V453000> 9+7 x3? 12:59:25 <Wolf01> 3 engines and 3 wagons 12:59:29 <V453000> WTF? :D 12:59:48 <Wolf01> Why should I make a 3 tile train? 12:59:49 <V453000> is that mandatory or can the player build 9 + 7+7+7+7+7+7... 12:59:52 <V453000> ? 13:00:02 <Wolf01> 9+7+7+7+7+7 is fine 13:00:23 <V453000> yeah but that's 44 total 13:00:37 <Wolf01> Don't confuse me with andythenorth, I don't need fitting trains 13:01:09 <V453000> do you have any good reason to do this? :D 13:01:15 <V453000> or just "fuck the rules" ? XD 13:01:27 <Wolf01> Just fuck the rules 13:01:33 <V453000> cool 13:01:43 <V453000> not a very good concept, but good luck 13:04:39 <Wolf01> Why wouldn't be good? 13:10:13 <V453000> just breaking the tile consistency for no benefit doesn't sound reasonable to me 13:10:23 <V453000> if there is some clear advantage, it's considerable at least 13:15:24 <andythenorth> it has the benefit of trolling andythenorth 13:16:00 <V453000> if that makes andythenorth produce more pixels I'm all for it 13:16:13 <andythenorth> I haz nearly fixed all problems ever 13:19:45 <Wolf01> Meh, if only there was a way to copy the ottd palette automagically... 13:20:08 <V453000> kind of is :P 13:20:25 <Wolf01> I still need to put it in line 13:21:03 <daenerys> Hey everyone and everything (the robots). 13:22:18 <Wolf01> V453000: I need a palette like these https://imgur.com/a/0EyDN 13:22:59 <V453000> you mean all colours in a line? 13:23:18 <Wolf01> Yes 13:23:20 <V453000> because 2 dimensional array is too high tech and you need 1D? :D 13:23:27 <Wolf01> Yes 13:23:28 <V453000> or is that another fuck andythenorth thing? 13:23:33 <Wolf01> No 13:23:49 <V453000> well you can generate this thing with python easy? :P 13:23:50 <Wolf01> I can only load that thing 13:24:02 <Wolf01> I first need to learn python 13:26:17 <V453000> or you know, making that line thing in gimp is a matter of a few minutes 13:27:13 <andythenorth> might as well do it in python 13:27:17 <andythenorth> or imagemagick 13:27:38 <V453000> well yeah but if you need to do it once... 13:31:00 <supermop> yo 13:31:19 <V453000> andythenorth: I'm going to generate the fuck out of NML with python with my train set 13:31:23 <V453000> it's happening right after trees 13:31:24 <V453000> fuck yeah 13:31:36 <V453000> there, it's been said 13:33:44 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 13:33:55 <andythenorth> V453000: you’ll want a templating language 13:33:58 <andythenorth> don’t invent your own 13:34:09 <V453000> templating language? 13:34:17 <V453000> but don't you generate stuff with firs and stuff? 13:34:19 <andythenorth> yes 13:34:22 <andythenorth> I use chameleon 13:34:31 <V453000> oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo 13:34:33 <V453000> well 13:34:37 <V453000> let's see :D 13:34:40 *** blocage has quit IRC 13:34:40 <andythenorth> there are other choices 13:34:52 <andythenorth> python has Template built in, but it can’t do loops and shit 13:35:00 <andythenorth> although Eddi probably can make it do that with trees 13:35:14 <andythenorth> recursive lamdbas :P 13:35:35 <V453000> the fact alone that I have no idea what you are talking about isn't very reassuring :D 13:35:42 <andythenorth> you used CPP shit? 13:35:56 <V453000> no 13:35:57 <andythenorth> oh 13:35:58 <andythenorth> nvm 13:36:07 <andythenorth> NUTS is all written out by hand? 13:36:11 <V453000> yes :) 13:36:14 <andythenorth> fuck that :) 13:36:18 <andythenorth> that’s for peasants 13:36:19 <V453000> was 100k lines at one point 13:36:30 *** blocage has joined #openttd 13:36:34 <V453000> and with my next train set I want serious switch insanity, doing it by hand would be utter retardation 13:36:47 <andythenorth> all my train properties, ever http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/templates/train_properties.pynml 13:36:52 <andythenorth> 86 lines 13:37:10 <V453000> right 13:37:16 <V453000> that's something I imagined 13:37:18 <andythenorth> ${some_shit} 13:37:21 <andythenorth> mostly 13:37:23 <andythenorth> and loops 13:37:28 <andythenorth> [ends] 13:38:50 <V453000> hmmm 13:38:56 <V453000> this might be a lot more complicated than I imagined 13:39:08 <peter1138> Damn, deliveroo don't deliver here :( 13:39:12 <V453000> still intrigued to give it a try though 13:39:22 <V453000> will probably be hard but good practice 13:40:20 <andythenorth> peter1138: it’s probably worth moving house to get deliveroo 13:40:44 <andythenorth> V453000: I wrote even a tutorial for basic templating 13:40:54 <V453000> o_O 13:41:15 <V453000> where can I find it? :D 13:41:20 <andythenorth> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=58390&hilit=templating+python 13:41:26 <andythenorth> bit blah blah words 13:41:29 <andythenorth> words and more words 13:42:33 <V453000> oh yeah I am pretty sure I saw that page at some point :D 13:42:36 <V453000> I'll check it out :) 13:42:38 <V453000> thanks 13:42:43 <andythenorth> lacks swearing 13:42:48 <V453000> oh 13:42:48 <V453000> damn 13:43:41 <peter1138> andythenorth, they deliver to my house. I'm at work though. 13:43:53 <andythenorth> reason to work at home 13:43:56 <andythenorth> new job? 13:43:56 <andythenorth> o_O 13:46:58 <peter1138> If I worked at home I could just pop round to the big Tesco :p 13:52:57 <andythenorth> ‘Box Car’, ‘Big Box Car’ 13:52:58 <andythenorth> stupid? 13:53:09 <V453000> Ultimately Big Box Car 13:53:15 <andythenorth> MOAR Box Car 13:53:19 <V453000> I dont see a problem andy 13:53:30 <andythenorth> is this ‘short buy menu’ fetish 13:53:39 <andythenorth> but Road Hog has shitload of trucks and trams 13:53:42 <V453000> haha 13:53:42 <andythenorth> all look good 13:53:44 <andythenorth> problem solved 13:53:54 <andythenorth> long buy menu, all looks good = winning 13:54:02 <andythenorth> short buy menu, looks shit = losing 13:54:03 <andythenorth> basics 13:54:08 <V453000> :D 13:54:11 <V453000> logics is strong today 13:54:25 <andythenorth> should write a book 13:54:26 <V453000> wait when you witness my ultimate train set purchase menu 13:54:28 *** Lejving has quit IRC 13:54:28 <V453000> it will be over 9000 13:54:31 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 13:54:44 * andythenorth looking at UKRS 2 with all extras turned on 13:54:49 <V453000> haha 13:58:37 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 13:58:37 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 14:01:04 *** tokai has quit IRC 14:14:34 <Wolf01> Ok, palette copied 14:14:47 <V453000> ez 14:16:37 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:20:13 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 14:24:04 * andythenorth adds NUTS to game 14:25:39 <andythenorth> V453000: too many wagons in NUTS 14:25:43 <andythenorth> buy menu totally spammed 14:26:37 <V453000> I know right 14:26:41 <V453000> is why ULTIMATE TRAIN SET 14:27:05 <V453000> NUTS Ultimate Train Set 14:27:06 <V453000> haha 14:27:07 <V453000> GG 14:27:21 <V453000> duplicite recursive acronyms 14:27:24 <V453000> world ends 14:27:59 <andythenorth> wtf caboose? 14:28:17 <V453000> haha 14:28:20 <V453000> I win 14:28:29 <andythenorth> such different 14:28:30 <V453000> try to build it :P 14:31:29 <andythenorth> ‘Big Box Car' 14:31:33 <andythenorth> ‘Big Hopper' 14:31:36 <andythenorth> ‘Big Dump' 14:32:26 <Wolf01> Mmmh, I don't think I can paint the voxel faces of different colour :( 14:33:44 <V453000> wot 14:33:52 <V453000> oh, some obscure voxel editor 14:33:55 <V453000> not master race 3D :P 14:35:53 <Wolf01> Ok, my editor doesn't generate a texture 14:36:42 <V453000> probably just incompatible with the 11/8 14:36:45 <V453000> GG 14:47:21 <Wolf01> Wait, there is a new update wich also support selections \o/ 14:47:45 <V453000> what are you using? 14:48:41 <Wolf01> https://ephtracy.github.io/index.html?page=mv_main 14:49:19 <Wolf01> I use this for the models of my game 14:49:27 <V453000> interesting 14:49:53 <V453000> how big is 1 voxel in translation to openttd? 14:50:35 <andythenorth> such voxels :) 14:50:54 <Wolf01> Dunno, 1px I think, in my game 1 voxel is Vector3(1,1,1) 14:52:33 <V453000> quite intrigued how is that going to translate 14:52:48 <V453000> isometric voxel isn't exactly a square :P 14:53:48 <Wolf01> I can set the isometric camera and the angle and render with that 14:54:38 <V453000> well yeah but the only angle in which a voxel is a square is a side/top/etc view :P 14:59:34 <V453000> off I fuck 14:59:35 <V453000> laterz 15:18:04 *** blocage has quit IRC 15:35:16 <peter1138> Wolf01, what game? 15:35:58 <peter1138> "A free lightweight 8-bit voxel editor" 15:36:05 <Wolf01> The one with tanks where I'm stuck 15:36:09 <peter1138> So only 256 colours? 15:36:13 <Wolf01> Yes 15:36:24 <peter1138> That'll be 8bpp then. 15:38:15 <peter1138> There's a load of people who call low resolution graphics "8 bit" :S 15:38:39 <peter1138> And it winds me up. We were there man! 15:46:34 <andythenorth> this is not 40/8 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forty-and-eights 15:46:38 <andythenorth> clearly 3/8 15:49:25 *** Gja has joined #openttd 16:19:46 *** Gja has quit IRC 16:27:31 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 16:30:31 *** Cubey has joined #openttd 16:32:46 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 16:37:22 *** Gja has joined #openttd 16:37:52 <Wolf01> https://imgur.com/a/ChyuD 16:42:15 *** glx has joined #openttd 16:42:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 16:54:48 *** Lejving has quit IRC 17:03:46 <andythenorth> “Big Caboose" 17:03:50 <andythenorth> Big Horse 17:05:39 <peter1138> Hmm, I've been invited to someone's holiday slide show... 17:07:35 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 17:07:44 <andythenorth> run away 17:07:50 <Eddi|zuHause> how exciting 17:08:45 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 17:12:27 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 17:15:37 *** Progman has joined #openttd 17:27:01 <supermop> very few people selling braun amplifiers will ship them to the US 17:31:30 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 17:35:34 *** Biolunar has quit IRC 17:43:34 *** Gja has quit IRC 18:09:26 *** Lejving has quit IRC 18:12:11 *** Gja has joined #openttd 18:18:55 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 18:35:34 <V453000> hmm 18:35:39 <V453000> the trees don't seem to be doing themselves 18:35:41 * V453000 goes help 18:36:29 <frosch123> i had the impressions some of the hugging ones tried to reproduce 18:36:37 <V453000> XD 18:36:50 <V453000> yeah but they just produced growth stages not new species 18:37:14 <V453000> I was playing diablo for the last 20 minutes and they produced literally zero new trees 18:37:19 <V453000> like wtf 18:41:16 <Wolf01> Did you see my voxel-lego engines? 18:41:48 <V453000> yes 18:41:57 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 18:42:07 <V453000> the one on the right is dark as fuck 18:42:15 <V453000> the one on the left lacks contrast 18:42:23 <V453000> only thoughts I have for now, but I guess it is work in progress 18:42:26 <Wolf01> I wanted to do it brown, but was darker 18:42:49 <andythenorth> o/ 18:42:56 <Wolf01> Yes it's WIP, I'll add some other engines and wagons 18:44:03 <andythenorth> meh 18:44:09 <andythenorth> in a grf with speed limits 18:44:16 <andythenorth> engines that haul freight and pax are a PITA 18:44:25 <andythenorth> they bridge two linkgraphs 18:45:39 <V453000> haha 18:45:49 <V453000> self imposed problems :P 18:46:21 <Eddi|zuHause> andy seems masochistic enough to enjoy those 18:46:46 <andythenorth> I guess I just need MOAR 18:47:45 <andythenorth> creating a tiny set is easy 18:47:52 <Wolf01> Also not sure the freight engine should have 4 bogeys 18:47:54 <andythenorth> ‘one super awesome train at all times' 18:48:02 <andythenorth> creating a big set is easy 18:48:20 <andythenorth> ‘bazillions of trains, with arbitrary useless stats variations' 18:48:42 <Eddi|zuHause> you mean like the 2ccset? 18:48:46 <andythenorth> maybe :P 18:48:55 <andythenorth> creating a set where there’s one-and-only-one train for each common use case.... 18:48:59 <andythenorth> is hard 18:49:25 <V453000> is nuts :P 18:49:31 <andythenorth> also that 18:49:47 <andythenorth> also trying to go from 1870 to 2020 in fewest possible generations 18:49:50 <andythenorth> hard 18:49:58 <V453000> might not necessarily be a good thing 18:50:06 <V453000> getting new engines often is nice 18:50:17 <andythenorth> I do them every 30 years or so 18:50:25 <V453000> 10 generations of nuts is a good amount but having 20 wouldn't hurt either 18:50:31 <V453000> 30 years is like 8 hours of game time? 18:50:32 <V453000> is insane 18:50:35 <andythenorth> 1870, 1900, 1930, 1960, 1990, 2020 18:50:47 <andythenorth> is 6.5 hours or so 18:50:52 <V453000> yeah that's shitload 18:51:10 <andythenorth> shitload of hours, or trains? o_O 18:52:51 <V453000> hours 18:53:00 <V453000> when did you play the game for 8 hours last time? 18:53:10 <andythenorth> errr 18:53:12 <andythenorth> almost never 18:53:16 <V453000> see 18:53:27 <V453000> for servers it's ok since you often log off and see it later 18:53:35 <andythenorth> I usually play the change across one generation of vehicles 18:53:43 <V453000> but for nonstop playing I will even have a parameter for "fast game" where all engines come out in a span of a few hours 18:53:47 <andythenorth> most I get to is 70 years or so 18:54:11 <V453000> so you can customize the grf for BB or other goal servers etc 18:54:19 <andythenorth> so eh, trying to 6 generations of engines, with only 3 generations of wagons 18:54:25 <andythenorth> and also speed limits bollocks 18:55:39 <V453000> speaking of which, is there a way to parametrize release dates of vehicles? 18:55:54 <V453000> as in have a parameter int of range 1950-2000 so the user can choose when a specific vehicle is released? 18:56:09 <V453000> other than if parameter == 1951 then item{ release_date = 1951} 18:56:10 <V453000> ? 18:56:30 <V453000> or do I just need to do thise 50 times with each of the possible values? 18:56:43 <V453000> I mean I will just do it with each of them, it just feels slightly unelegant 18:56:52 <V453000> I'll have about 12 engines so it's no big deal 18:57:00 <frosch123> you can use grf parameters in properties just fine 18:57:08 <frosch123> you just cannot disable the randomisation 18:57:12 <V453000> right 18:57:16 <V453000> randomisation I am aware of 18:57:22 <V453000> so I can just put it into the date directly? 18:57:30 <frosch123> but "date(1900,0,0)+365*parameter" is just fine 18:57:49 <V453000> okay! :) 18:57:52 <frosch123> putting it into the "date"... no idea :) 18:57:53 <V453000> thanks, noting 18:58:07 <frosch123> depends on whether nml tries to do the leap year stuff for parameters, or whether it just calls you stupid to try 18:58:26 <V453000> introduction_date: date(1945, 1, 1)+365*intro_date_vehicle1; 18:58:28 <V453000> so this should work? 18:58:34 <frosch123> yes 18:58:38 <V453000> holy shit :) thanks 18:58:41 <V453000> will use 18:58:58 <V453000> this set will wreck shit, I sez 18:59:01 <V453000> am hyped 18:59:13 <frosch123> you can also divide some interval between two parameters 18:59:27 <V453000> what? 18:59:35 <V453000> I don't understand 18:59:45 <V453000> divide interval between two parameters? which two parameters? 19:00:21 <frosch123> like you set param_year_first_engine, param_year_last_engine 19:00:28 <frosch123> and then define all vehicle dates based on those 19:01:01 <V453000> OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO 19:01:10 <V453000> holy shit that would be even better 19:02:02 <frosch123> you can also use the difference of those two parameters to adjust model life 19:02:23 <V453000> right, that's less important but can be useful 19:02:43 <andythenorth> V453000: you doing daylength-in-newgrf? o_O 19:03:44 <V453000> you can put it that way yes 19:03:57 <V453000> it's just for universal convenience 19:04:50 <frosch123> param_steam_era, param_diesel_era, param_electric_era, param_maglev_era, param_slug_era 19:05:05 <V453000> nah will be just param_start and param_finish :) 19:05:38 <Wolf01> Could I compose an engine from 3 parts? 19:05:44 <V453000> articulate? 19:05:47 <Wolf01> Yes 19:05:53 <V453000> Yes? :) 19:06:22 <andythenorth> what’s wrong with a large buy menu? 19:06:26 * andythenorth has forgotten 19:07:08 <frosch123> pikka flu? 19:07:10 <V453000> the fact that it's large :) nothing else 19:07:12 <andythenorth> think so 19:07:25 <V453000> railtypes are actually super helpful with this, you can effectively split it 19:07:35 <V453000> so you always see just a selection 19:07:49 <V453000> rail, mono, mglv, slugrail, catrail 19:08:31 <Eddi|zuHause> you clearly forgot wetrail 19:08:38 <V453000> iz not in new set 19:08:46 <Eddi|zuHause> how dare you!! 19:08:50 <Eddi|zuHause> :p 19:09:16 <V453000> don't want to make NUTS2 :) yet 19:09:38 <andythenorth> http://pikkarail.com/openttd/state-of-the-onion-a-history-and-future-of-my-newgrfs/ 19:09:42 <andythenorth> ‘survey sets' 19:10:41 <andythenorth> meh, ultimately V453000 is right :( 19:10:42 <andythenorth> ass 19:10:50 <V453000> ? XD 19:10:57 <andythenorth> well 19:11:11 <andythenorth> the problem with big train sets is mostly that foamers only draw the engines 19:11:24 <andythenorth> so 900 almost-identical engines, and unfinished range of wagons 19:11:39 <andythenorth> then they have to introduce fake ‘balancing’ reasons to choose one engine instead of another 19:12:16 <frosch123> are you talking about one-wagon-to-rule-them-all-V ? 19:12:19 <V453000> I never thought about it as a disparity between wagons and engines, but yeah 19:12:27 <andythenorth> frosch123: exactly 19:12:37 <V453000> but I don't think any of the sets are making any balancing reasons 19:12:44 <V453000> they just ignore gameplay 19:12:48 <andythenorth> V453000 has same goal as me: almost unique wagons per cargo 19:12:55 <V453000> NO 19:12:57 <andythenorth> but has a more nuclear route to achieve it :P 19:13:10 <V453000> V453000 has one goal in taht direction, ALWAYS unique wagons per cargo 19:13:11 <V453000> not almost 19:13:16 <V453000> nuclear as fuck 19:13:55 <V453000> now I'm going to even make a better maintainable system for asses who add 666 obscure cargoes with each industry set release 19:13:59 <V453000> gg 19:14:01 <V453000> fired 19:14:59 <frosch123> well, without firs i would have never learned about cassava 19:15:11 <V453000> XD 19:15:16 <V453000> yeah and how does it look in NUTS 19:15:20 <frosch123> they kind of make it interesting :) 19:15:35 <V453000> I like them frosch123 19:15:43 <V453000> but the system of NUTS makes it a total pain to add more cargoes 19:15:54 <V453000> not necessarily because of some system flaw, but because it's simply a shitload of work 19:16:04 <V453000> needs something smart to make it maintainable 19:17:21 <andythenorth> AUTOMATION 19:17:28 <V453000> kind of 19:17:45 <frosch123> <insert obligatory xkcd> 19:17:49 <V453000> for example I want to make extensive use of index recolours for same shape cargoes 19:17:49 <Eddi|zuHause> tbh, i never really bought into the minimalistic 10cc approach 19:18:00 <andythenorth> it was an over-shoot 19:18:02 <V453000> which means adding new colours for hotfix FIRS cargoes will be just a few lines of code 19:18:23 <V453000> wtf is 10cc 19:18:37 <andythenorth> pikka minimal set, became pineapple 19:18:44 <V453000> right 19:18:45 <andythenorth> 10 engines only 19:18:50 <Eddi|zuHause> in CETS i tried to resolve the "duplicate engines with near-identical stats" by putting them into different companies 19:18:55 <andythenorth> yeah 19:18:57 <V453000> just arbitrary bollocks 19:19:05 <andythenorth> I just don’t have engines with near identical stats 19:19:41 <andythenorth> I’m still playing ‘my favourite childhood train' 19:19:51 <andythenorth> but I just dibble the stats 19:20:32 <V453000> just define a bunch of classes and make some progressing models inside them 19:20:35 <Eddi|zuHause> that would still make lots of duplicates, but i also tried to sort them into categories of local pax/long distant pax/light freight/fast freight/heavy freight 19:20:37 <V453000> easiest way to do it right 19:20:40 *** daenerys has left #openttd 19:20:42 <V453000> and you can add hybrids after 19:21:00 <Eddi|zuHause> and then have enough reasons to leave out further duplicates 19:21:22 <andythenorth> I have ‘small + fast’, ‘freight’, ‘heavy freight’, ‘pax’ ‘electric powerful but low TE’ 19:21:26 <V453000> I can say that balancing them in a way so that each of the classes is actually perfectly viable is not a short process and requires a lot of testing and observation of people playing 19:21:53 <andythenorth> so I will end up with 666 wagons, one per cargo 19:22:00 <andythenorth> V will have one wagon 19:22:10 <V453000> how does electric powerful compare to freight or heavy freight? 19:22:16 <V453000> V will have several wagons actually 19:22:22 <V453000> but they will be kind of the same 19:22:43 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't know what electric powerful is 19:22:49 <andythenorth> too much realism 19:23:01 <andythenorth> same HP as heavy freight, as fast as fastest pax 19:23:11 <andythenorth> it’s nearly ultimate, if you’re prepared to build wires 19:23:14 <Eddi|zuHause> but usually there are duplicates in electric/non-electric 19:23:56 <andythenorth> yeah, duplicates across railtypes seems acceptable 19:24:06 <V453000> you mean ready to press C and drag over whole map? :P 19:24:07 <V453000> damn 19:24:23 <andythenorth> also that 19:25:22 <Eddi|zuHause> there are electric hybrids that are both strong and fast, but usually freight is limited by wagon speed 19:25:34 <V453000> XD 19:26:10 <Eddi|zuHause> there's really no other reason to distinguish freight and pax 19:26:26 <andythenorth> it’s just an arbitrary bit of realism 19:26:38 <andythenorth> and low-speed freight messes up your high-speed networks 19:26:56 <V453000> even nuts has that part of realism :P 19:27:03 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, but you need some kind of challenge :p 19:27:08 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 has quit IRC 19:27:25 <V453000> it's just nice to see civilized trains in towns and industrial trains in freight lines 19:27:26 * andythenorth drew a train http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/8628/shoebox.png 19:27:33 <andythenorth> ‘Shoebox' 19:27:41 <V453000> very nice 19:27:57 <V453000> seems inconsistent style with boxcar though 19:28:05 <frosch123> civilized trains in towns? and barbarian trains for freight? 19:28:08 <V453000> contrazt 19:28:16 <andythenorth> such realism 19:28:34 <V453000> yeah frosch123, slugs everywhere 19:28:35 <frosch123> sounds like the attillery rain will instead feature a big battle axe :p 19:28:41 <frosch123> +t 19:28:47 <V453000> XD 19:28:54 <V453000> not impossible :P 19:28:58 <andythenorth> this https://hattonsimages.blob.core.windows.net/products/ND000BR_29335_Qty1_2.jpg + this http://www.kernowmodelrailcentre.com/images/product/OO71-099%20final%20low%20res1480515427.jpg.jpg 19:29:10 <V453000> is shoes 19:30:14 <Wolf01> https://imgur.com/a/ChyuD better? 19:30:19 <andythenorth> so if I add one more generation pax coaches? 19:30:26 <andythenorth> will be 4 total, kittens all dead? 19:31:45 <V453000> if I was doing that I'd go apeshit on colour shades Wolf01 19:31:56 <V453000> basically trying to almost never have 2 same neighbouring colours 19:31:57 <Wolf01> I cannot shade 19:32:06 <V453000> you can, it's just puzzle 19:32:25 <V453000> andythenorth: catpocalypse 19:32:27 <V453000> do it 19:32:48 <V453000> I'll have 1 wagon generation, they'll just automatically adjust to the leading engine 19:32:54 <V453000> modern leading engine, modern wagons 19:33:04 <V453000> sick shit eh 19:33:18 <V453000> aye aye sir, fecal sick is 19:34:14 <andythenorth> has to be 1 or 666 19:34:17 <andythenorth> no other valid choices 19:34:43 <V453000> well having 1 cargo for 1 wagon is a nice move for new players who aren't aware of refit button 19:34:54 <andythenorth> 64 cargos in FIRS currently 19:34:57 <andythenorth> 5 generations 19:35:02 <V453000> but making a batshit insane train set which exploits game mechanics through the roof doesn't need to worry about that I guess 19:35:02 <V453000> yeah 19:35:03 <andythenorth> 320 wagons? 19:35:06 <V453000> sure 19:35:09 <V453000> 10 engines 19:35:11 <andythenorth> also need big + small versions of each 19:35:13 <andythenorth> for reasons 19:35:15 <V453000> ah sure 19:35:21 <andythenorth> 640 19:35:22 <V453000> close to 666 19:35:25 <andythenorth> not bad 19:35:28 <V453000> just add 26 cabeese 19:35:36 <andythenorth> 2 cabeese only 19:35:42 <V453000> no 26 19:35:43 <V453000> big reasons 19:35:48 <V453000> like really big 19:35:51 <andythenorth> no I add more cargos to FIRS 19:35:55 <V453000> XD ok 19:36:04 <andythenorth> @65 * 5 * 2 19:36:06 <andythenorth> oops 19:36:12 <andythenorth> @calc 65 * 5 * 2 19:36:12 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 650 19:36:17 <andythenorth> 16 cabeese 19:36:48 <andythenorth> unique wagon per cargo 19:36:51 <V453000> ok enough reasons 19:36:52 <andythenorth> also 1 universal wagon type 19:36:56 <andythenorth> 6 cabeese 19:36:57 <V453000> XD 19:37:04 <andythenorth> solved 19:37:08 <V453000> nice 19:37:17 <andythenorth> no more refit bollocks, just scroll lots, build needed wagon 19:37:17 <V453000> full retard mode confirmed 19:37:19 <andythenorth> much scroll 19:37:25 <V453000> well you can filter it :P 19:37:33 <andythenorth> refit buggy anyway 19:37:40 <andythenorth> has weird subtypes feature 19:37:46 <V453000> oh wait user who isn't aware of refit button isn't aware of a filter button either :P 19:37:56 <V453000> subtypes are cool for colour refit 19:38:09 <V453000> for rainbow-powered networks 19:38:16 <V453000> critically important obviously 19:38:42 <V453000> h 19:38:43 <V453000> m 19:39:02 <andythenorth> and liveries 19:39:06 <V453000> good that I started with temperate and end with toyland because my trees are getting more and more fucked up in the head 19:39:10 <andythenorth> dunno why they were called subtypes ever 19:39:18 <V453000> colours = liveries in my world 19:39:27 <andythenorth> nuff authors think that subtypes are actually called liveries 19:39:29 <andythenorth> according to FS 19:39:31 <V453000> well you can refit to steel planks or steel pipes 19:39:35 <andythenorth> such 19:39:42 <V453000> iz subtype 19:39:44 <andythenorth> that’s just texture map :P 19:39:53 <andythenorth> IS NOT REAL CARGO 19:39:56 <andythenorth> just pixels 19:40:03 <V453000> pixel lives matter 19:40:21 <andythenorth> pixels are for life, not just christmas 19:40:31 <V453000> also selecting goods refit to beer is the most important feature of db set 19:40:50 <V453000> rest is disposable 19:42:53 <andythenorth> too many different wagon types here http://www.railpictures.net/photo/630925/ 19:42:59 <andythenorth> lacks consistent schema 19:43:48 <V453000> picture has cows, 10/10 19:44:03 <frosch123> andythenorth: i always liked randomised wagons 19:44:09 <andythenorth> yetis are hiding though V453000 19:44:24 <andythenorth> frosch123: random on build? Or building alternatives yourself? 19:44:34 <frosch123> random on build 19:44:42 <andythenorth> is random lengths a stupid idea? 19:44:46 <frosch123> yes 19:44:51 <andythenorth> irritating eh 19:44:59 <frosch123> i just mean random color 19:45:07 <andythenorth> horse does that 19:45:10 <frosch123> only minimal shape changes 19:45:36 <frosch123> no random tanker vs flat car :p 19:45:38 <andythenorth> I just flip 2cc and 1cc over 19:45:56 <andythenorth> then player can 'disable' random by setting both colours same 19:46:23 <V453000> random wagon graphics are the top feature to make a nice looking train set in my opinion 19:46:28 <V453000> nothing makes that much impact 19:59:21 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 20:02:28 <andythenorth> ha ha 20:02:34 <andythenorth> shoebox tiny engine can do 110 mph 20:02:38 <andythenorth> is almost realism also 20:05:07 <V453000> ._. 20:05:11 <V453000> 300kmh or go home 20:07:23 <andythenorth> meh 20:07:28 <andythenorth> maglev 20:09:02 <frosch123> randomised railtype? 20:10:51 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 20:11:17 *** Gja has quit IRC 20:17:25 <V453000> gnight 20:19:16 <Wolf01> https://imgur.com/a/ChyuD short trains added 20:20:03 <Wolf01> Enough for today 20:20:26 <andythenorth> 8-wide? o_O 20:20:40 <Wolf01> Why not? 20:22:47 <supermop> Wolf01: cute 20:23:10 <supermop> andythenorth: if 6 wide how would lego dudes fit inside 20:23:14 <V453000> this with some attempt at shading could be really nice 20:23:29 <andythenorth> supermop: you have to have the right windowas 20:23:32 <andythenorth> windows * 20:23:43 <Wolf01> Maybe I could make them 7-wide, so I could draw a thin divider on the front window 20:24:16 <supermop> what track do they run on? 20:24:52 <andythenorth> L-gauge 20:25:49 <supermop> what is the gauge in bumps? 20:26:01 <Wolf01> Or I can make them 15-wide and render as 7-wide so I can add more detail everywhere 20:26:40 <supermop> extra zoom whereby granularity increases? 20:28:17 <Wolf01> Or I can do them with some 3d design software directly 20:28:58 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:41:16 *** Progman has quit IRC 21:43:24 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 22:05:02 *** tokai has joined #openttd 22:05:02 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 22:11:51 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 22:31:18 *** ToBeFree has joined #openttd 22:39:56 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 22:46:27 *** gelignite has quit IRC 22:52:52 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 23:50:43 <Wolf01> 'night 23:50:45 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC