Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:17:10 *** Thedarkb-T60 has joined #openttd 00:22:15 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 00:22:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 00:24:01 *** mikegrb has joined #openttd 00:29:13 *** tokai has quit IRC 00:42:58 *** Wormnest_ has quit IRC 00:56:55 *** Wormnest_ has joined #openttd 01:30:55 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 01:33:23 *** Wormnest_ has quit IRC 02:14:46 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 02:15:30 *** D-HUND has joined #openttd 02:16:40 *** glx has quit IRC 02:18:56 *** debdog has quit IRC 04:11:43 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 04:12:33 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 04:45:08 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 04:45:41 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 05:38:23 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 05:41:49 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 05:47:10 *** arikover has joined #openttd 06:01:22 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 06:13:06 *** Etua has joined #openttd 06:37:55 *** AquaFiX has joined #openttd 06:40:48 <AquaFiX> in regards to Running soap with supybot i have getting issues regarding Error: No module named enums and Error: cannot import name IntFlag, I have installed libottdadmin2, and OFS correctlys, libottdadmin2 shows in pip freeze i am not sure the issue. Python -V Python 2.7.13 06:41:42 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 06:50:08 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 06:50:19 <nielsm> that's probably because the enum module was introduced in python 3.4 06:50:48 <nielsm> IntFlag is even from python 3.6 06:53:39 <AquaFiX> so force to 3.6.4 and should resolve issues. 06:54:35 <nielsm> yes 07:48:21 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 08:04:23 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 08:08:00 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 08:29:37 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 08:30:00 <andythenorth_> So how about a new industry cb, “town wants to grow” 08:30:23 <andythenorth_> Results: allow | disallow | neutral 08:30:28 <andythenorth_> ?? 08:31:11 <nielsm> maybe town growth effect -16 to +16 08:31:20 * andythenorth_ continues quest to improve town cargos like building materials, vehicles etc 08:32:29 * andythenorth_ going on a plane ride now, but the idea is interesting 08:34:58 *** Progman has joined #openttd 08:35:39 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 08:41:53 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 08:44:04 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 08:58:06 *** Xaroth has quit IRC 09:03:18 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 09:09:49 *** Samu has joined #openttd 09:16:36 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 09:28:49 *** Etua has quit IRC 09:31:02 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 09:32:41 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 09:35:19 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 09:36:05 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 09:37:45 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 10:04:39 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 10:11:56 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 10:32:08 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 11:00:57 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 11:02:35 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 11:13:46 *** Thedarkb-T60 has quit IRC 11:18:07 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 11:33:53 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 11:37:41 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZE 11:41:01 *** gnu_jj has joined #openttd 11:43:30 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 11:46:22 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso updated pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZw 11:50:00 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZK 11:50:21 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZi 12:01:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZ9 12:01:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc approved pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZH 12:01:55 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc merged pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZw 12:01:55 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc closed issue #7704: Crash on MacOS when server has invalid UTF8 name string https://git.io/fjpZQ 12:02:39 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZ7 12:05:50 <nielsm> so, 1.9.3 or begin preparing 1.10 ? 12:06:25 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjpZb 12:13:30 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 12:14:03 *** Progman has quit IRC 12:23:32 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 12:34:20 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 12:35:53 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 12:44:06 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 12:46:00 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 12:49:07 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 12:49:32 <AquaFiX> Ok if anyone has any experience with SOAP for supybot/Limnoria 12:49:38 <AquaFiX> i am interested to talk to you 12:50:22 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 12:53:14 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 12:55:43 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 12:57:00 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 12:58:07 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 12:58:41 <Eddi|zuHause> what happened to "we might go for a more frequent release schedule"? 12:59:45 <frosch123> maybe there is a dependency on cets 13:00:08 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 13:01:45 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 13:03:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 13:05:16 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 13:05:55 <Eddi|zuHause> that would have been a risky tactical decision 13:35:15 *** glx has joined #openttd 13:35:15 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 13:39:57 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7651: Too many statues/fountains are built in town centers. https://git.io/fjXfH 13:40:23 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #7659: Railway construction menu disappears https://git.io/fj1Q3 13:42:13 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 13:42:28 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh closed issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected https://git.io/fjP8d 13:42:29 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7645: Bug? Train Depots not working as expected https://git.io/fjP8d 13:42:30 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 13:46:16 <nielsm> I'm going through the issues and adding any I think ought to be fixed before 1.10 to the milestone 13:49:25 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 13:55:11 *** Thedarkb-X40 has joined #openttd 13:55:49 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7624: Changing rolling stock reverts on next visit to depot https://git.io/fj2MW 13:57:14 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7525: Autorenew vehicle option to Basic settings https://git.io/fjOmN 13:59:47 <Samu> autorenew defaulted to on? 13:59:58 <Samu> that will break my AI at least 14:00:00 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 14:00:00 *** gelignite has quit IRC 14:00:05 <Samu> maybe others 14:00:38 <nielsm> who said autorenew should default to on? 14:01:55 <glx> and AI can change the setting anyway 14:02:57 <Samu> autorenew / autoreplace should be able to maintain vehicle IDs 14:03:18 <glx> Samu: AICompany::SetAutoRenewStatus(false); in your AI init should be enough 14:03:33 <Samu> oki 14:03:37 <glx> especially if you explicitely don't want it 14:03:58 <glx> never trust default settings of the user ;) 14:06:11 <glx> and you can also check GetAutoRenewStatus() before 14:07:20 <glx> anyway autorenew/autoreplace can't maintain vehicle IDs 14:07:39 <glx> as a new vehicle always get a new ID 14:13:55 <Samu> unable to keep track of vehicleIDs is the biggest threat during vehicle management 14:16:13 <glx> maybe a new AIEvent can be added 14:20:35 <nielsm> the scourge of having MS symbol servers enabled in visual studio... 14:20:48 <nielsm> taking forever to start a debugging session after windows update 14:21:05 <glx> luckily it's cached 14:21:12 <nielsm> yeah 14:21:25 <nielsm> it's just that updates tend to touch way too many files in minor ways 14:21:39 <nielsm> meaning 90% of the dlls need to have their symbols re-downloaded 14:21:57 <glx> hmm yeah my next debug session will be a pain, I just upgraded to 1903 from 1803 14:22:13 <Samu> create new vehicle, move statistics or infos from old vehicle to new vehicle, then delete old vehicle, create another new vehicle, move statistics from the new vehicle to the another new vehicle 14:22:23 <Samu> will it get the same id? 14:22:29 <glx> no 14:22:39 <glx> a new vehicle is new, so new ID 14:22:52 <nielsm> IDs get reused don't they? 14:22:57 <Samu> yes 14:23:05 <nielsm> it's not like slots in the vehicle array are left empty forever 14:23:10 <nielsm> (that would be a memory leak) 14:23:12 <glx> but as I said, a new AIEvent can help 14:23:25 <nielsm> the new vehicle _might_ get the ID of the deleted one 14:23:33 <nielsm> but another company might have built a vehicle in the meantime 14:23:43 <nielsm> or there might be a different ID free earlier in the list 14:24:11 * glx goes looking in the code 14:25:37 <frosch123> the new vehicle never gets the same id 14:25:47 <frosch123> the new vehicle is created before the old one is deleted 14:26:00 <nielsm> yes 14:26:23 <nielsm> the question is if you then create another new vehicle after deleting the replaced one, will the second new vehicle get the ID of the replaced one 14:26:32 <nielsm> and the answer is "maybe, in some cases" 14:26:55 <frosch123> ok, i should have guessed that the question is even more arcane :) 14:28:59 <Samu> I still remember my AI sending aircraft to bus stations 14:29:07 <Samu> thx to autorenew 14:30:09 <Samu> or that randomly lost aircraft with no orders for no reason whatsoever 14:31:40 <nielsm> slightly more sensible, and yet not... https://0x0.st/z4EW.jpg 14:32:50 <glx> maybe always use 3 lines per entry 14:33:25 <glx> name\ncompany\nqualification 14:34:38 <nielsm> ugh okay yeah I tried sprinkling ScaleGUITrad all over the code and the results just don't get good 14:34:58 <nielsm> I'll probably have to rework the layout to depend on actual font sizes and such 14:35:05 <nielsm> instead of magical numbers 14:36:03 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/z4Et.jpg broken in a different way! 14:36:06 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 14:37:06 <nielsm> or maybe... 14:37:31 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/z4Ew.jpg yeah this looks (mostly) right 14:37:59 <nielsm> the 5 overlapping the border $ is a shame 14:38:28 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/z4Ex.png it's the same in 1x gui and font scale 14:38:59 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/z4E3.png wrong in 1x gui with 2x font 14:39:29 <nielsm> https://0x0.st/z4EY.jpg and dumb in 2x gui with 1x font 14:40:41 <nielsm> is there a way to get the background image drawn in a custom scale not dependent on the user GUI scale... 14:41:15 <nielsm> would be nice if it could scale it to fit screen (nearest integer scale factor smaller than actual resolution) 14:41:23 <nielsm> and then dynamically position the text based on font size 14:42:05 <nielsm> hm okay DrawSprite and GetSpriteSize do take a zoom parameter 14:42:11 <nielsm> so could do some magic with that 14:42:24 <frosch123> the scaling is not done while drawing 14:42:41 <frosch123> all images are prescaled when loading the sprites and then stored scaled 14:43:48 <frosch123> anyway, whenever the highscore or the win screen is broken, i wonder whether to delete them :p 14:45:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh opened pull request #7714: Fix #7702: Scaling for highscore screen https://git.io/fjpc1 14:51:55 *** Flygon has quit IRC 14:52:54 *** Wormnest_ has joined #openttd 15:01:34 *** Progman has joined #openttd 15:02:59 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 15:08:27 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] j-pet updated pull request #7699: Fix: Possible double path separator in FiosMakeFilename https://git.io/fjddy 15:11:19 *** Etua has joined #openttd 15:34:37 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] j-pet commented on pull request #7699: Fix: Possible double path separator in FiosMakeFilename https://git.io/fjpCE 15:38:38 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] j-pet commented on pull request #7699: Fix: Possible double path separator in FiosMakeFilename https://git.io/fjpCo 15:50:41 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] j-pet commented on pull request #7699: Fix: Possible double path separator in FiosMakeFilename https://git.io/fjpCh 15:51:16 *** Etua has quit IRC 16:29:20 *** Etua has joined #openttd 16:41:47 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #7715: Fix b870596: forgotten squirrel_export run https://git.io/fjpWw 16:47:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #7715: Fix b870596: forgotten squirrel_export run https://git.io/fjpWP 16:54:04 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 merged pull request #7715: Fix b870596: forgotten squirrel_export run https://git.io/fjpWw 17:10:30 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 17:10:37 <andythenorth> hurrah 17:10:47 <andythenorth> holidays are nice, but so is proper internet 17:10:52 <andythenorth> and a proper irc cliet 17:10:58 <andythenorth> or client 17:11:36 *** andersd has quit IRC 17:14:08 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #7716: Add: [Script] ScriptEventVehicleAutoReplaced. https://git.io/fjplU 17:15:06 <glx> it's totally not tested 17:16:25 *** Etua has quit IRC 17:18:26 <Samu> uhm... hardly useful 17:18:46 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7716: Add: [Script] ScriptEventVehicleAutoReplaced. https://git.io/fjplq 17:19:29 <glx> Samu: why ? 17:19:40 <nielsm> Samu what else could it be? It's an event that indicates that a vehicle has been automatically replaced with a new one, and gives you the old and new ID 17:20:03 <nielsm> it's exactly what's necessary to keep track of vehicles internally by a script 17:20:40 <Samu> the problem is difficult to describe 17:20:52 <nielsm> then you are not understanding it 17:21:29 <Samu> i am iterating vehicleids in a for loop, doing the usual management stuff, iterating over a list of vehicles 17:22:05 <Samu> suddenly, one of the vehicles in that list is autorenewed, while im still executing the for loop 17:22:41 <Samu> when the for loop iterates the old vehicle id, it may already belong to another vehicle 17:22:50 <Samu> it could be an aircraft 17:23:01 <Samu> while the list was supposedly only road vehicles 17:23:07 <nielsm> oh so the entire structure of your code is bad 17:23:30 <nielsm> it sticks inside long operations without handling events 17:24:04 <Wormnest_> iirc it´s not guaranteed that you always receive all events, which means you can´t count on the event to update your vehicle ids 17:24:12 <nielsm> what Windows would call "application is not responding" (and fade out the entire application window) 17:24:37 <nielsm> seriously, events can be lost? is there a length limit on the queue? 17:24:53 <nielsm> (if then, the answer is still "process events more often") 17:25:12 <Wormnest_> I might remember it wrong, haven´t looked into it in a long time 17:25:49 <Samu> i'd propose a vehicle list function 17:26:20 <Samu> something that could re-route to the correct vehicle 17:26:27 <Samu> when it's updated 17:26:48 <glx> that's up to the AI writer 17:26:50 <Samu> as long as that list exists 17:27:59 <Samu> something that auto corrects veh ids in vehicle lists 17:28:14 <Samu> without me constantly checking for events 17:28:31 *** Etua has joined #openttd 17:29:13 <glx> and how the game is supposed to know about existing lists in the AI VM ? 17:29:25 <Samu> there's AITileLists 17:29:32 <Samu> for tiles 17:29:44 <Samu> i thought there could be another specific for vehicles 17:31:07 <glx> lists created by AIs are not readable by the game engine 17:31:27 <glx> and they never will be 17:32:35 <Samu> I'm unsure about the event, I'd have to check for that event thoroughly 17:32:51 <Samu> even perhaps inside for loops 17:32:53 *** Etua is now known as Guest1372 17:32:57 *** Etua has joined #openttd 17:33:04 <Samu> i don't think that's too useful 17:33:31 <Samu> autorenew can happen in a matter of 1 frame 17:33:42 <glx> like a vehicle crash 17:33:49 <glx> there's an event for that too 17:34:24 <nielsm> well a crashed vehicle stays around for a while 17:34:40 <nielsm> so it's less likely to cause a problem 17:35:18 <glx> but it can if the list loop is time consuming 17:35:35 <nielsm> yep 17:35:43 <Samu> it usually is 17:35:45 <nielsm> coming back to the core problem: not handling events 17:36:32 <Samu> handling 500 road vehicles for my AI takes about 3 days 17:36:48 <nielsm> instead of having a simple loop over all vehicles, check a few vehicles at a time, then go back to handle events, then check some more vehicles (but without keeping state from the previous check round) 17:37:09 <nielsm> that's more than 200 ticks, lots of things can happen in 200 ticks 17:38:33 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 17:39:21 *** Etua is now known as Guest1373 17:39:25 *** Etua has joined #openttd 17:40:28 *** Guest1372 has quit IRC 17:44:58 *** Guest1373 has quit IRC 17:45:18 *** Etua is now known as Guest1376 17:45:22 *** Etua has joined #openttd 17:45:45 <Samu> so... the better solution is ... fix autorenew/autoreplace to make it keep the same veh id 17:45:59 <glx> that's not possible 17:46:22 <glx> because the new vehicle is created before the old one is removed 17:46:54 <Samu> is the new vehicle really needed to be created? 17:47:14 <Samu> can't just change data of the vehicle instead? 17:48:54 <nielsm> that would be a big source of potential bugs 17:49:25 <nielsm> properties forgotten or mishandled in subtle ways 17:49:27 <glx> while creation and deletion use existing commands 17:50:00 <glx> with cargo transfert between old and new 17:52:48 *** Guest1376 has quit IRC 17:52:54 <glx> and using existing commands takes care of all checks 17:53:40 <glx> without duplicating them (another source of potential bugs) 17:55:04 <glx> and if you don't want to rely on events, you still have the option to disable autorenew for the company 18:12:58 *** Etua is now known as Guest1382 18:13:02 *** Etua has joined #openttd 18:13:58 <andythenorth> industry town growth then? o_O 18:14:40 <nielsm> sure but it needs some specifications :D 18:15:01 <nielsm> like what happens if one industry wants town to grow and another wants it to stagnate? 18:15:38 <nielsm> are town growth effects queried via a cb? how often? 18:16:08 <nielsm> should town window show something about the cumulative effect of industries on its growth? 18:16:23 <andythenorth> AIUI there's some 'town wants to grow' game event currently 18:16:59 <nielsm> can industries cause towns to grow faster than normal, or just discourage or prevent growth? 18:17:47 * andythenorth had better read how towns grow in src :) 18:18:05 <andythenorth> my preferred solution is to inject something into what we've got 18:18:50 <andythenorth> although...sometimes people with more vision have better ideas :) 18:18:53 <nielsm> and if multiple industries pull in the same direction positive/negative growth effect, is it summed, multiplied, root of sum of squares, min/max, or something else 18:19:55 <andythenorth> ok so I am a bad person to design specs, because I only have FIRS cases 18:20:11 <andythenorth> my case goes something like 18:20:18 *** Guest1382 has quit IRC 18:20:41 <andythenorth> IF a town doesn't have a certain type of industry, let town handle growth 18:20:46 <nielsm> but yes some concrete use cases would be a useful basis for designing a spec :) 18:20:59 <andythenorth> IF a town does have industry of type x, let industries influence town growth 18:21:16 <andythenorth> there might be more than one industry of type x 18:21:30 <andythenorth> and there might also be types y, z, a, b, c etc 18:21:53 <andythenorth> I want to be able to (1) prevent all growth 18:22:06 <andythenorth> (2) make growth happen faster than default 18:22:22 <andythenorth> hmm, can towns shrink? :P 18:23:22 <nielsm> they don't really have a procedure for it no 18:23:52 <andythenorth> they do actually shrink if playing before 1930, but that's a bug :) 18:24:15 * andythenorth ignores that 18:24:20 <nielsm> but bugs can cause thw town zones to break in weird ways and cause a town to build low-density all the way through 18:24:33 <nielsm> at least I've seen that happen once with the UK town replacement set 18:24:49 <andythenorth> with base set, theatres, statues 18:24:54 <andythenorth> fountains 18:24:55 <nielsm> yeah 18:24:58 <andythenorth> population collapse 18:25:51 <andythenorth> so for basic rationale, I just want to give player a reason to deliver cargos like building materials and vehicles 18:26:18 <nielsm> town buildings probably ought to have an "is a park/plaza" flag and avoid building too many of those relative to population and/or radius 18:26:29 <andythenorth> probably 18:26:50 <andythenorth> I don't know how industry influence would interact with, e.g. requirements for food, water etc 18:26:53 <andythenorth> or with GS 18:27:12 <nielsm> I haven't checked how GS town growth control works either 18:27:18 <andythenorth> I'm not looking for "industry controls all town behaviour", that would be wrong 18:27:47 <andythenorth> I don't even want to talk about GS route, it seems to cause rage quits and arguments :) 18:28:36 * andythenorth wonders if it would only be industries in town catchments 18:28:44 <andythenorth> power plants are an interesting case 18:28:54 <andythenorth> what if towns didn't grow unless nearby power plant is serviced 18:29:01 <andythenorth> what's 'nearby' in that case? 18:29:20 <nielsm> nearest industry of type to town center? 18:29:34 <nielsm> then every town would need to keep track of various types of industries 18:30:11 <andythenorth> interesting 18:35:08 <frosch123> you can probably write a gs which makes towns require oil to grow, but lowers the requirement when powerplants are serviced 18:39:14 <milek7> there is GS that assign industries to cities 18:39:25 <milek7> and increases growth dependent on cargo tyeps 18:39:29 <milek7> and increases growth dependent on cargo types 18:44:01 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjp8R 18:48:55 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjp8z 18:52:58 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjp8a 19:00:35 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjp8X 19:02:23 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjp81 19:06:02 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] uvealonso commented on pull request #7705: Fix #7704: [OSX] Handle malformed UTF8 strings https://git.io/fjp8y 19:08:34 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest1388 19:08:34 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 19:08:35 *** andythenorth_ is now known as andythenorth 19:11:38 *** Guest1388 has quit IRC 19:21:48 <Samu> GS'es are evil 19:22:08 <Samu> imagine a FIRS GS 19:23:19 <Samu> there can be only one GS :( 19:23:26 <Samu> main drawback 19:24:16 <nielsm> because lots of things GS can do are of the category "imagine if two attempted doing this at the same time" 19:24:57 <nielsm> i.e. things that don't have a good resolution if separate actors are pulling in each their direction 19:25:06 <nielsm> they'll pull the rug out from under each other 19:25:14 <andythenorth> the GS route is old ground :) 19:25:25 * andythenorth doesn't want to retread it 19:26:35 <andythenorth> an alternative route I could pursue is to delete town cargos 19:26:41 <andythenorth> and just ignore towns in the game 19:26:46 <nielsm> but really the entire execution model for both AI and GS are wrong: AI ought to run entirely asynchronously as its own process, observing the game, and GS ought to run synchronously and not have events but callbacks 19:26:59 <andythenorth> hindsight :) 19:27:39 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc opened pull request #7717: Codechange: [OSX] Use std::unique_ptr with a custom deleter to simply… https://git.io/fjp43 19:27:43 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc commented on pull request #7717: Codechange: [OSX] Use std::unique_ptr with a custom deleter to simply… https://git.io/fjp4s 19:27:50 <andythenorth> there's a new version of Steeltown in dev, where town cargos are pretty much non-existent 19:27:55 <andythenorth> it's much bette 19:27:57 <andythenorth> better * 19:28:41 <andythenorth> imho, town growth mechanic is the only major flaw in original TTD 19:29:09 <nielsm> someone should have a scriptedclient video driver, headless client that runs a script and connects to a multiplayer server :) 19:29:17 <nielsm> s/have/make/ 19:30:37 <nielsm> towns don't really have an economy of their own, you don't have rich and poor towns, industrial and commercial towns, etc. 19:31:07 <andythenorth> somebody (ahem TB) made a spec for this 19:31:19 <andythenorth> unifying GS and newgrf 19:31:39 <andythenorth> but it fell in the rage quit hole :) 19:33:15 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7717: Codechange: [OSX] Use std::unique_ptr with a custom deleter to simply… https://git.io/fjp4C 19:33:22 <nielsm> bikeshedding a bit here 19:39:14 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 19:40:27 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] andythenorth commented on issue #7651: Too many statues/fountains are built in town centers. https://git.io/fjXfH 19:47:02 <michi_cc> nielsm: LLVM uses CFReleaser somewhere in the internals, but that's not exactly a strong argument either. 19:47:53 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 19:49:13 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 19:51:21 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 19:52:57 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 19:56:15 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 19:56:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 19:58:55 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 19:59:10 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 20:07:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 20:09:10 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:09:56 *** Progman has quit IRC 21:19:12 <FLHerne> "imagine if two attempted doing this at the same time" 21:19:58 <FLHerne> nielsm: But that's the case for newgrfs already, and no-one cares that you can totally break the game 21:20:31 <FLHerne> Industries are probably the best example there 21:22:28 <FLHerne> Also anything that modifies base vehicles or graphics 21:23:00 <FLHerne> Or sets trying to define railtypes in incompatible ways 21:23:32 <andythenorth> MultiGS? :P 21:23:42 * andythenorth wonders why 21:23:43 <FLHerne> We just shrug and say "don't do that" 21:26:17 <FLHerne> Because GSes can do a lot of orthogonal things and it would be nice to pick-and-choose a bit more 21:28:34 <FLHerne> e.g. there's a GS that allows limiting companies to one rail depot, to avoid the random point-to-point sprawl 21:29:28 <andythenorth> hmm 21:29:32 <FLHerne> But you can't use it with a goal-setting GS, or an improved-town-growth GS, because only one 21:29:50 <andythenorth> universal modding framework! 21:30:02 * andythenorth should stick to horses 21:30:09 <FLHerne> Currently, most GSes are intrusive game-dominating frameworks 21:31:08 <FLHerne> But I think there'd be more niche tweak-this-one-behaviour ones if it was actually practical to use them 21:32:59 <andythenorth> it's an appealing thought 21:33:04 * andythenorth wondered about scriptable UI :P 21:35:15 *** Samu has quit IRC 21:37:52 <nielsm> mii! 21:38:04 <nielsm> wrong window :P 21:45:22 *** gelignite has quit IRC 21:55:34 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 22:00:16 *** sushibear has joined #openttd 22:01:26 *** nielsm has quit IRC 22:01:58 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 22:02:55 *** sushibear has quit IRC 22:22:48 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 22:26:16 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 22:26:38 *** Etua has quit IRC 22:30:16 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 22:38:00 *** arikover has quit IRC 22:38:21 *** nielsm has quit IRC 22:45:05 *** iarp[m] has quit IRC 22:48:56 *** grag[m] has quit IRC 22:51:28 *** iarp[m] has joined #openttd 22:51:51 *** nolep[m] has quit IRC 22:54:56 *** ciet[m] has quit IRC 23:02:54 *** nolep[m] has joined #openttd 23:04:58 *** grag[m] has joined #openttd 23:12:09 <DorpsGek_III> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JMcKiern updated pull request #7710: WIP: Fix bugs in airport finite state machines https://git.io/fjp0Y 23:12:55 *** ciet[m] has joined #openttd 23:12:58 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 23:13:28 *** Wormnest_ has quit IRC 23:29:56 *** jeeg[m] has quit IRC 23:39:24 *** jeeg[m] has joined #openttd