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10:25:31 <andythenorth> Yodel lost it 10:34:13 <petern> My heating has lost it. 10:36:34 <andythenorth> was it Yodel's fault? 10:38:01 <petern> Probably. 10:44:08 <petern> I always love it when the docs for a project tell you how to build it, but not what it does or how to set it up. 12:01:36 <petern> Hmm, should I try Docker containers for deployment? 12:02:21 <petern> Seems a bit wasteful for each deployment to have its own dotnet runtime etc. 12:10:44 <andythenorth> /me watching Big Clive 12:10:57 <andythenorth> rona -> bed -> youtube 12:11:13 <petern> OIh 12:28:31 *** keikoz has joined #openttd 12:34:56 <petern> These trousers have shrunk, they are not longer enough :/ 12:39:49 <andythenorth> have your legs adjusted to suit? 12:42:51 <Pruple> it's not the whole suit, just the trousers 12:46:16 <andythenorth> fair point 13:15:26 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] clienthax commented on pull request #10234: Update: emsdk and related patches / readme https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10234#issuecomment-1351335658 14:43:34 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 14:57:39 *** ag has quit IRC 15:35:20 <Eddi|zuHause> well... package didn't contain a bobcat. 15:46:59 <Pruple> was it supposed to? 15:47:49 <Eddi|zuHause> probably not 15:48:55 *** matematysek has joined #openttd 15:48:55 <matematysek> Eddi|zuHause: bobcat? you mean animal or construction machine? 15:49:13 <Eddi|zuHause> well... neither 15:49:54 <Eddi|zuHause> https://xkcd.com/325/ 15:52:34 <matematysek> lol 17:13:11 *** supermop_toil has quit IRC 17:13:21 *** Flygon has quit IRC 17:13:29 <pickpacket> I was hoping all the specs for the base industries would be available as nml files in one of the repos. Are they? 17:15:16 <petern> I messed up my pipeline. I forgot about the .scss files that need to be compiled. I don't know how š¦ 17:20:53 <pickpacket> petern: do you know where I can find the specs for the base industries? 17:21:36 <LordAro> as nml? unlikely 17:21:52 *** birdjj has quit IRC 17:22:51 <LordAro> though i'm not actually sure where those specs are... i'd expect them to be in the baseset grf... which would mean they should be in ogfx somewhere 17:23:31 <LordAro> but perhaps the actual logic is within the game itself 17:23:32 <pickpacket> LordAro: well, in any format would be better than not at all :D 17:23:36 <Pruple> the baseset grf is just realsprites 17:23:53 <pickpacket> yeah, I've already checked there 17:24:22 <Pruple> there's https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/IndustryDefaultProps 17:25:34 <LordAro> in which case i am also curious about where they're defined 17:25:35 <Pruple> cf https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/Action0/Industries 17:26:28 <pickpacket> Pruple: thanks! 17:30:47 <LordAro> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/table/build_industry.h#L1128 aha. 17:30:59 <LordAro> that is some horrifying code 17:36:40 *** birdjj has joined #openttd 17:46:30 <glx[d]> imagine without the macro 17:50:50 <andythenorth> it's kind of beautiful 18:02:33 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 18:03:20 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 18:05:50 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 18:42:29 <petern> What was I doing? 18:45:30 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] DorpsGek pushed 1 commits to master https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/commit/ac120282784991384097e60c9e63a0e2e501bbdc 18:45:31 <DorpsGek> - Update: Translations from eints (by translators) 19:00:12 <petern> Is it bed time yet? 19:10:02 <LordAro> yes 19:11:24 <andythenorth> I've been in bed for 2 days 19:11:26 <andythenorth> getting bored 19:11:34 <andythenorth> is it PR approval and merging time yet? 19:12:05 <andythenorth> think of the bandwidth reduction from cutting out all those Horse action 1s 19:12:12 <andythenorth> 36 MB - > 18 MB 19:13:09 <petern> That would require my change to work properly first š 19:16:12 <andythenorth> well, Horse has at least 10 users, so it would be as much as 180 MB saved 19:16:23 <andythenorth> the reductions in the AWS bill will be huge 19:21:17 <petern> Well yes 19:22:55 <pickpacket> the AWS bill? What's running there? 19:30:14 <andythenorth> EVERYTHING 19:30:24 <pickpacket> O.o 19:30:31 <andythenorth> except aBase 19:33:06 <pickpacket> I still don't get it. Are build agents running there? 19:34:13 <andythenorth> binary distribution, website, in-game content, multiplayer discovery service 19:34:27 <andythenorth> builds are github actions far as I understand 19:34:33 <pickpacket> oh shit. That is a lot 19:34:41 <pickpacket> who foots the bill and how big is it? 19:35:27 <andythenorth> (1) historical community donations built up an operating fund, also there were some AWS open source credits (2) no idea 19:35:34 <andythenorth> TrueBrain knows 19:36:19 <petern> > Sorry we had to remove zBase/aBase due to costs 19:37:13 * pickpacket doesn't know what zBase/aBase is, nor what Horse refers to 19:37:51 <petern> They're the hideous 32bpp extra zoom basesets that new players seem to love. 19:40:45 <pickpacket> ugh 19:40:55 <pickpacket> kill them. Kill them with fire! 19:44:38 <dP> btw, newgrf format could use some better image compression 19:44:45 <dP> like webp or smth 19:44:57 <LordAro> jpeg 19:45:41 <dP> jpeg is lossy and I'm not sure about licensing 19:45:48 <LordAro> :p 19:45:59 <petern> Lots of tiny little high-entropy sprites are not great for compression. 19:46:05 <LordAro> is webp noticably different to png? 19:46:05 <dP> though there seems to be something called jpeg xl nowadays 19:47:18 <dP> LordAro: seems to be slightly better 19:47:22 <petern> The one that Chrome has removed? 19:47:35 <dP> but I guess it needs testing on real sprites 19:48:49 <dP> oh, there is a new kid on the block: https://flif.info/ 19:49:37 <petern> Might help for 32bpp EZ but not much on standard sprites. 19:53:39 <andythenorth> petern: I thought that PNG would have compressed as much it can, but 36 MB of Horse grf compresses to 4 MB of zip 19:53:43 <andythenorth> bit weird 19:56:01 <dP> grf isn't using png 19:56:10 <dP> just lz77 iirc 19:56:15 <andythenorth> explains a lot 19:56:45 <LordAro> what are we using libpng for then? 19:56:46 <andythenorth> I don't know much about compression formats, but .tar seems to be just an archive wrapper, compression is minimal 19:56:59 <LordAro> that is exactly what a tape-archive is :) 19:56:59 <dP> LordAro: screenshots? 19:57:00 <andythenorth> (Horse uses .tar which is 36 MB) 19:57:05 <LordAro> dP: oh, lol 19:57:15 <Eddi|zuHause> there's lots of redundance in the pseudosprites, which aren't compressed at all 19:58:12 <Eddi|zuHause> and .tar isn't compression either, it's just "put these files together" 19:58:22 <andythenorth> so I have learnt š 19:58:33 <petern> PNG is your source files š 19:58:52 <Eddi|zuHause> which is why you usually combine tar with a compressor that takes a single file, like gz, xz, bzip2, ... 19:59:03 <andythenorth> ok so 36 MB -> 4.4 MB is 87%? Remind me how to do basic school level maths 19:59:25 <LordAro> @calc 4.4 / 36 19:59:25 <DorpsGek> LordAro: 0.12222222222222223 19:59:26 <petern> So we already do .tar, can we do compression on top? 19:59:31 <petern> At least for transfer. 19:59:36 <andythenorth> maybe we do? 19:59:38 <LordAro> 87 and a bit. 20:00:39 <pickpacket> petern: how are they transferred? Are we talking about when clients download them? Iām guessing the game uses libcurl? 20:01:06 <petern> I doubt that š 20:01:26 <LordAro> nope 20:01:33 <pickpacket> a web server can easily be configured to compress before transmit so that side is easy at least 20:02:11 <petern> These could be compressed as rest to be honest. 20:02:38 <LordAro> pickpacket: raw TCP, generally 20:02:41 <andythenorth> if I could upload as zip, they would go up the wire faster also š 20:02:55 <LordAro> i'm not sure if downloads are compressed, i think they are... 20:02:59 <dP> btw, I feel like openttd is somehow downloading stuff much slower than it could 20:02:59 <andythenorth> oh I can 20:03:48 <andythenorth> hmm the zip I have doesn't work with bananas 20:03:50 <LordAro> looks like they are 20:04:01 <andythenorth> it uncompresses the individual files, but reports they're incompatible 20:04:02 <andythenorth> nvm 20:04:12 <LordAro> https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/src/network/network_content.cpp#L569 20:04:32 *** garlic_bread42 has quit IRC 20:05:30 <andythenorth> I would have been super shocked if TB hadn't looked at compression stuff š 20:06:32 * andythenorth wonders what the best image input format for grfs would be 20:06:39 <andythenorth> the one that compiles fastest š 20:08:51 <LordAro> :D 20:09:08 <petern> The one with half the number of sprites due to not duplicating act1s? 20:09:17 <andythenorth> that 20:09:33 <andythenorth> I wonder if one giant spritesheet would be better than many 20:09:55 <andythenorth> then again, if someone could figure out how to unfuck this, Horse would be 10% faster https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/pull/254 20:10:13 <andythenorth> the patch I wrote is just leaving a hand grenade behind 20:10:25 <andythenorth> well 20:10:41 <andythenorth> actually the whole automated palette guessing shenanigans in NMLC are the hand grenade 20:10:46 <andythenorth> I just pulled the pin 20:11:01 <LordAro> there's a lot of changes in there that don't seem relevant to the diff 20:11:12 <LordAro> is your black out of date, perhaps? 20:11:17 <LordAro> or even too new 20:11:47 <andythenorth> I never quite figured that out 20:12:05 <andythenorth> that xkcd about time saved suddenly applied š 20:12:54 <LordAro> only if you only apply the calculation to yourself :p 20:13:05 <Eddi|zuHause> src/fileio.cpp: Debug(misc, 1, "Scanning for tars"); 20:13:07 <Eddi|zuHause> src/fileio.cpp: Debug(misc, 3, "{} found as config directory", config_dir); 20:13:07 <LordAro> definitely not too new, mine shows no changes 20:13:17 <Eddi|zuHause> the debuglevels on these two might be flipped 20:13:25 <Eddi|zuHause> it's awfully spammy on level 1 20:13:37 <LordAro> you know where the PR button is :p 20:14:11 <Eddi|zuHause> let me see... 20:14:19 <andythenorth> yeah running black locally over the nml repo produces a huge diff 20:15:35 <andythenorth> rona brain is not wanting to figure that out š 20:16:11 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/nml] andythenorth updated pull request #272: Feature: support for variant_group action 0 prop for vehicles https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/pull/272 20:16:24 <andythenorth> ignore ^ just a rebase to master 20:16:33 <andythenorth> thought we'd renamed master to main, but eh, maybe I misread 20:22:23 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 20:23:36 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z opened pull request #10240: Codechange: Reshuffle debuglevels in fileio to address spammyness https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10240 20:24:08 <Eddi|zuHause> objections? 21:00:10 <glx[d]> andythenorth: only some repos 21:04:53 *** Samu has joined #openttd 21:09:17 *** Samu has quit IRC 21:27:28 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 21:27:44 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 21:48:59 <andythenorth> hmm more variants for Horse then? 21:51:32 *** keikoz has quit IRC 21:54:06 <petern> All the variants? 22:02:53 <andythenorth> maybe not all of them 22:02:58 <andythenorth> "most of the variants" 22:06:06 <petern> Randomize the variant parents. 22:08:12 <andythenorth> at compile time? or run time? š 22:08:23 <andythenorth> make it a callback not a property š 22:09:06 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] glx22 opened pull request #10241: Fix #10206: Disable scripts in intro game https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10241 22:29:37 *** _aD has joined #openttd 22:41:05 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 22:45:42 *** nielsm has quit IRC 23:11:52 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 23:13:01 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 23:40:38 *** WormnestAndroid has quit IRC 23:40:38 *** WormnestAndroid has joined #openttd 23:42:34 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 23:51:08 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LC-Zorg commented on issue #10239: Roads built on foundations at the minimum snow level height have inconsistent snowiness https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/10239 23:57:01 <petern> Do I need 24 thin-client computers? 23:57:19 <petern> Set up some kind of cluster... ;p 23:58:50 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LC-Zorg commented on issue #10238: One-way road arrows don't look good on slopes https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/10238