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00:02:41 <KittenKoder> Okay, time to learn breaking the nml files into sections. :p 00:14:42 <Eddi|zuHause> ask planetmaker to help you set up the "standard" makefile? 00:15:23 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.183.216] has quit [Quit: Sleep.] 00:15:39 <KittenKoder> I'm going to have to. >.< I'm getting lost in other people's code and I'm not good at reading other people's code. 00:15:48 * KittenKoder thus why not a good team player normally. 00:25:59 *** Sc00by22 [~IceChat77@host-2-99-46-90.as13285.net] has quit [Quit: IceChat - Keeping PC's cool since 2000] 00:58:53 <KittenKoder> I found a copy of it. 01:01:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75F89.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:01:45 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75F89.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:08:17 *** mos|work [~mos@217.22.80.138] has joined #openttd 01:09:50 *** pjpe [~pjpe@173-230-161-25.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 01:10:20 *** perk11 [~perk11@broadband-77-37-203-211.nationalcablenetworks.ru] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 01:15:37 *** mosi|work [~mos@217.22.80.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:17:02 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFE7F2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:22:35 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75F89.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:23:07 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75F89.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 01:40:56 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 01:55:23 <KittenKoder> planetmaker, are you active now? 02:03:12 *** lessthanthree [lt3@d64-180-56-242.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Connection reset by queer] 02:03:22 *** lessthanthree [lt3@d64-180-56-242.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 02:13:57 *** lessthanthree [lt3@d64-180-56-242.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: Connection reset by queer] 02:14:06 *** lessthanthree [lt3@d64-180-56-242.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 02:26:03 *** rhaeder1 [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-155-077.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 02:30:57 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-156-032.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:32:50 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:a45b:2837:7fb6:bbc8] has quit [Quit: bye] 03:22:01 *** mattt_ [~m@24-246-2-147.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 04:10:29 *** mattt_ [~m@24-246-2-147.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: mattt_] 04:48:11 <pjpe> is it just me or does the openttd web server through a 502 every night at around this time 04:56:18 *** Eddi|zuHause2 [~johekr@p54B75F06.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:01:21 <KittenKoder> Probably system maintenance or something. 05:01:48 <KittenKoder> Though not on the OTTD web server, necessarily. 05:03:31 <pjpe> lessthanthree it's back up 05:03:33 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p54B75F89.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:07:49 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-233-43.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 05:21:57 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-233-43.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:37:32 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has joined #openttd 05:46:26 *** JVassie [b26dd3c5@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 05:57:08 *** JVassie [b26dd3c5@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [Quit: http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client] 06:04:19 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 06:12:06 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A21C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 06:18:53 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e090e25.bb.sky.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:22:42 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has joined #openttd 06:37:40 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 06:47:54 <planetmaker> moin 06:54:12 <KittenKoder> hihi 06:54:36 <KittenKoder> I was needing you a while ago ... but now I think I have a solution that works better for me. :p 06:55:31 <KittenKoder> Now, I just need to figure out the custom tags part. 06:56:57 <planetmaker> "my" makefile framework has the advantage that it it understood by the DevZone's compile farm, should you want to host and (nightly) build your NewGRFs there 06:58:04 <planetmaker> and it automatically takes care of versioning of NewGRFs. Which IMHO is the most important part 06:58:35 <planetmaker> using the repo's version as newgrf's version, but allowing a tag to act as displayed release version 06:59:00 <KittenKoder> Yeah, but I have problems with it, primarily, it doesn't work for me. 06:59:07 <planetmaker> and adding install and bundle targets for easy use 06:59:16 <planetmaker> wow, that's a good error description 06:59:20 <KittenKoder> LOL 06:59:34 <KittenKoder> Well, I bumble around, get one thing to work, then I get another problem. 06:59:42 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 07:00:03 <KittenKoder> Last one "no rule definition for some.png file" 07:00:36 <KittenKoder> I don't like editing or modifying another person's source, thus why I have never been a great team player. 07:01:18 <planetmaker> either you're mixing case or that shouldn't happen 07:01:39 <KittenKoder> Not mixing cases, checked all that. 07:02:12 <KittenKoder> The file I am using as a test case is really the first NML I wrote, just broken into a few files so I can test it. 07:02:36 <planetmaker> that's what the framework with the makefile is made for 07:02:43 <planetmaker> it expects *.nml and *.pnml files 07:02:48 <dihedral> morning :-) 07:02:55 <planetmaker> and searches their includes for further deps 07:02:58 <planetmaker> moin dih 07:03:15 <dihedral> hey ho planetmaker 07:03:17 <KittenKoder> Other than that, almost no changes to it were made. The Makefile.config I modified for it, had to change a lot of other values before I got that far, then the png rule error hit and I just got annoyed. 07:03:27 <KittenKoder> It's all *.pnml. 07:04:29 <KittenKoder> So, I'm just making a simple Makefile. ;) It's not you, just other people's source code has never worked right for me unless I use it unchanged, and I mean completely unchanged. 07:04:59 <planetmaker> sucks to be you then ;-) 07:05:03 <KittenKoder> Meh. 07:05:24 <KittenKoder> I can copy-pasta bits, or use it as examples, so it's still good. 07:05:56 <dihedral> copy-pasta ? :-) 07:06:00 <planetmaker> I still would like to see why it failed for you... do you have a zip of the dir? 07:06:48 <KittenKoder> Not the one that was causing the error anymore, sorry, it's just such a common event for me I just started over on reflex. 07:07:59 <KittenKoder> The swedish rails original file works almost perfectly, but it's outdated compared to the new nmlc and has a few errors in it from that, but the Makefile works fine as long as I don't change anything for that. 07:08:31 <KittenKoder> The problem with make that has always bothered me, the very useless error reporting. 07:09:20 <appe> swedish rails? 07:09:22 <planetmaker> you can change all code in it... 07:09:24 <appe> that sounds interesting 07:09:32 <planetmaker> appe: it's a trackset 07:09:49 <KittenKoder> I see where you write to the tag file, but I don't see where you create it .... but I'm REALLY behind in makefile code, too many years of IDEs. 07:09:59 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 07:10:23 <planetmaker> replacing the two default rail tracks with "better" tracks, thus that they better work with all kinds of ground 07:10:27 <planetmaker> and snow 07:10:38 <planetmaker> and roads and so on :-) 07:10:47 <appe> oh 07:10:54 * appe is swedish and would like to compare it. 07:11:11 <KittenKoder> It's nice .... not my personal favorite, but the source archive is a great learning tool. 07:11:16 <planetmaker> it's all drawn by a Swede ;-) 07:11:27 <Markk> appe: Are you sure about that? :o 07:11:34 <Markk> appe: You're from SmÃ¥land you know. 07:11:47 <KittenKoder> Bah! 07:11:54 <appe> Markk: smÃ¥land = sverige. 07:11:54 <planetmaker> KittenKoder: it was the first NML NewGRF ever ;-) 07:11:59 <appe> Markk: skÃ¥ne = germania. 07:12:03 <Markk> appe: :D 07:12:03 <appe> Markk: (not germany) 07:12:04 <appe> :D 07:12:04 <KittenKoder> That explains it. 07:12:33 <KittenKoder> Gathering it was also a testing ground. 07:12:50 <planetmaker> yes. It needs indeed some code updates 07:13:01 <planetmaker> maybe when I come around to re-touching tunnels 07:13:13 <planetmaker> my graphics artist vanished :-( 07:15:11 <KittenKoder> Aaw. 07:15:24 <KittenKoder> I'm more of a code explorer than anything. 07:15:29 <KittenKoder> Any chance to learn something new. 07:16:15 <KittenKoder> Ironically, the code I use for work most often now was only because I was "oooh, new languages to play with." 07:17:47 <KittenKoder> Why can't I find where you invoked the rule for tags!?!?!?! >.< LOL 07:19:19 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Juo] 07:20:54 <KittenKoder> Wait, I see it now. 07:21:00 * KittenKoder headesks. 07:22:22 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 07:23:04 <planetmaker> patches in principle are welcome 07:25:04 <KittenKoder> I've been up too long again. 07:26:10 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 07:28:09 <KittenKoder> My neighbors I think are having a noise war ... and it's starting to grate my nerves. 07:41:08 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:41:29 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has joined #openttd 07:41:32 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 07:45:04 <KittenKoder> Trying to think how I will do the maglev for Fantasy Rails. 07:46:27 <KittenKoder> My favorite idea would make a lot of the other maglevs not quite fit in with the set. 07:47:06 <KittenKoder> Using two different tracks for the three different propulsion systems (like in reality) .... 07:47:51 <KittenKoder> But then I'd have to define one as a "default" for the levs not defined in such a manner. 07:55:10 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 08:10:33 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFEF79.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:13:10 *** Eddi|zuHause2 is now known as Eddi|zuHause 08:24:39 <KittenKoder> Anyone know where I can find the stats for the maglev tracks used in OGFX? 08:25:46 <planetmaker> what stats? 08:27:05 <KittenKoder> Price, speeds, multipliers, etc. 08:28:04 <Pinkbeast> Tracks don't have much in the way of stats as a rule 08:28:16 <planetmaker> I guess openttd source... src/table/... 08:28:43 <KittenKoder> I want to make the original tracks I designed as a secondary type instead of replacing the default ones. 08:29:01 <Pinkbeast> You might try looking at what NuTracks does 08:29:22 <KittenKoder> There's speed limit, curve multiplier, and cost. 08:29:24 <Pinkbeast> ... but the total number of track types is absurdly small (why?) so it would be hard not to be incompatible with them. 08:29:54 <KittenKoder> I think NuTracks is over board on types, personally. >.< 08:30:06 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-185-118.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 08:30:47 <Pinkbeast> Well, I appreciate them representing the different electrical systems for simulationists. 08:30:48 <pjpe> i don't get what the nutracks subway tracks are supposed to do 08:31:01 <Pinkbeast> pjpe> IIRC, look like houses. 08:31:28 <pjpe> last time i tried it just made parts that look like a city 08:31:28 <KittenKoder> But for my fantasy rail set, I want two types of maglev tracks. 08:31:30 <pjpe> isn't that what a city is for 08:31:48 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> And the "fast-expensive" or "slow-cheap" choice is a meaningful one, but it's too discrete, but can it not be without excessive simulatonism 08:32:16 <Pinkbeast> pjpe> Well, not after you build tracks through it, given OTTD's... lacking... support for underground railways. 08:32:40 <pjpe> oh trains can still go on it? 08:32:45 <KittenKoder> The maglev track idea is that one of the tracks will be specifically for fantasy only trains. 08:32:46 <pjpe> did not know that 08:32:51 <pjpe> looks like it would just stop a train 08:32:59 <Pinkbeast> pjpe> Yeah, that's the idea. It's a bodge at best. 08:33:43 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> At least I and others talked the NuTracks guy out of having the not-totally-slow track start in 1920. 08:34:09 <KittenKoder> Or I could make a real maglev set that distinguishes between them ... but that may be a lot of extra work. >.< 08:34:53 <Pinkbeast> Really it would be nice if whatever limits the binary to 16 track types was fixed # ahem but I am not fixing it, I am presently trying to comprehend YAPF 08:35:12 <KittenKoder> LOL 08:35:36 <KittenKoder> I have dealt little with pathfinders. 08:35:59 <Pinkbeast> I'm not joking, the thing I most want fixed is in YAPF. However, I'm a Perl programmer and my understanding of C++ is limited. :-( 08:36:16 <pjpe> what do you want fixed 08:36:23 <KittenKoder> I'm also really bad at understanding other people's code. 08:36:45 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> so am I when it has template programming in, that stuff is deep magic 08:36:49 <KittenKoder> I think YAPF is actually awesome, myself, I have yet to confuse it ... and I have tried. 08:37:07 <Pinkbeast> pjpe> Presently when a train wants automatic servicing it goes to the nearest depot. 08:37:21 <Yexo> Pinkbeast: that has nothing to do with YAPF 08:37:33 <Pinkbeast> Yexo> hang on... 08:37:37 <KittenKoder> Isn't that part of the core? 08:37:40 <Yexo> and if you want to prevent that just use at least one "service at depot" order 08:37:43 <KittenKoder> OTTD itself. 08:37:48 <Yexo> it's part of the core, yes, but not of yapf 08:37:53 <Yexo> yapf being only the pathfinder part 08:38:08 <KittenKoder> Yeah, OTTD can use other pathfinder programs. 08:38:18 <KittenKoder> Just that there really is no need with YAPF. 08:38:20 <Pinkbeast> It should instead consider both the train->depot and the depot->next destination issue 08:39:12 <KittenKoder> Aha! 08:39:33 <Pinkbeast> Yexo> "service at depot" orders are kind of a reflection of the way automatic servicing leads to comedy # and some timetable separation patches are broken with it although yes that is their bug to fix 08:40:08 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> So ideally some kind person would implement in every pathfinder "find depot with net lowest total journey" but I'd settle for doing it in YAPF 08:40:24 <KittenKoder> >.< Pooh, that doesn't have it either. 08:41:02 <Yexo> Pinkbeast: that is not a complete solution, since when a slow train requires servicing "now" it should travel another 1000 tiles just because it'll make the total journey a few tiles shorter 08:41:17 <Pinkbeast> Yexo> Aha, I thought of that. :-) 08:41:18 <Yexo> it needs servicing say within 50 tiles, and than again after another 500, and again after 1000 etc. 08:41:22 <KittenKoder> Sorry, trying to find the defaults for the maglev track still. 08:41:50 <Pinkbeast> You would add a weighting factor to make the pre-depot journey cost more than the post-depot journey... 08:42:17 <planetmaker> KittenKoder: "no need" might be a bit strong. Actually a path finder which is both deterministic, threadable and efficient would be nice ;-) 08:42:35 <Pinkbeast> ... and also appreciate that, yes, things can go wrong with this setup, but presently they go wrong with a train taking a journey up the one-way line to arseendofnowhereville. 08:42:44 <KittenKoder> Okay, no pressure then? :p 08:42:56 <Pinkbeast> In particular in my proposed approach adding depots can never make things worse, whereas now it can. 08:43:22 <KittenKoder> Pinkbeast, I have found a few track techniques that actually help out with that. 08:43:41 <KittenKoder> One is forced depot stops, just after a full load command. 08:43:50 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> Yes, so have I! That is part of why I am so frustrated as to want to learn C++ just to fix it! 08:44:04 <pjpe> c++ ain't that bad 08:44:15 <KittenKoder> The other is putting a reversible PBS facing the "wrong" way, which discourages trains not needing that track from going there. 08:44:29 <KittenKoder> Pshaw ... c++ is easy. 08:44:39 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> Indeed. But wouldn't it be nice not to have to do these things? 08:44:42 <KittenKoder> You can complain when you have to learn Java. :p 08:44:50 <Pinkbeast> Or Python. 08:45:01 <dihedral> what's wrong with coding java? 08:45:02 <KittenKoder> *shudder* I loath Python's syntax. 08:45:13 <KittenKoder> Java is the least forgiving language ever. 08:45:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i love python's syntax :p 08:45:19 <SpComb> what I'd like would be lookahead for routing on station orders 08:45:27 <dihedral> and why should a language be 'forgiving' 08:45:29 <KittenKoder> One bad call and the compiler spits it out saying "what's wrong with you?" :p 08:45:33 <dihedral> you are telling a machine what to do 08:45:40 <SpComb> i.e. if you have a station with different platforms that have different routing, pick a platform that lets the train continue on to its next destination 08:45:42 <KittenKoder> I like Java, just saying, it's hard for beginners. 08:45:44 <dihedral> and you expect the machine to forgive faulty syntax? 08:45:44 <dihedral> pfft 08:45:57 <Pinkbeast> SpComb> Well, waypoints, but yes. 08:46:00 <KittenKoder> Well, actually I LOVE Java, it's my preferred language. 08:46:00 <pjpe> java ain't hard for beginners 08:46:06 <SpComb> waypoints can be hard to fit in 08:46:11 <dihedral> i dont think java is hard for beginners either 08:46:13 <SpComb> if you have cramped layouts 08:46:20 <Pinkbeast> SpComb> I don't disagree with you! 08:46:36 <pjpe> then again i can't think of anything i'd think is hard for beginners 08:46:42 <Pinkbeast> That there is a workaround doesn't mean I don't wish it wasn't necessary (as with servicing) 08:46:50 <SpComb> of course, you could have asinine counterexamples where you'd need more than one step of lookahead 08:46:55 <KittenKoder> pjpe, when you are an old school coder who used c and c++ for too long ... it can be. 08:47:02 <SpComb> but it would be useful in places! 08:47:10 <Pinkbeast> Particularly if you combine it with conditional orders. 08:47:17 <dihedral> KittenKoder, that's just because the person is thinking in too small a box ;-) 08:47:25 <KittenKoder> LOL 08:47:27 <SpComb> s/asinine/pathological/ 08:47:28 <KittenKoder> Can't argue that. 08:47:53 <KittenKoder> Gotta say though, this is nice, no language elitists here. 08:48:02 <pjpe> fuck erlang 08:48:03 <Pinkbeast> Well, Perl is best, obviously. # joke 08:48:13 <KittenKoder> LOL 08:48:13 <SpComb> QML! 08:48:48 <Pinkbeast> I mean, I love Perl programming, but it's like Frank Cooper's, I don't expect everyone else to like it. :-) 08:49:22 <KittenKoder> I was in one programming channel where if you mentioned anything but ansi-c ... you got attacked. 08:50:01 * Pinkbeast occasionally still reports bugs in NetHack. _ANSI_ C? New-fangled nonsense. :-) 08:50:13 <KittenKoder> LOL 08:50:23 <KittenKoder> You still play NetHack? 08:50:41 <Pinkbeast> Well, these days, Derek Ray's "SporkHack" variant, but yes. 08:51:23 <Eddi|zuHause> "you still play Transport Tycoon?" 08:51:34 <Pinkbeast> Not so much, though. I play a lot of Kornel Kzhardtospell's marvellous DoomRL 08:51:56 <Pinkbeast> And Jeff Lait's POWDER (and any roguelike by Lait is worth a look) 08:52:35 <KittenKoder> I was joking. 08:52:47 <KittenKoder> >.> Sheesh, get to a hospital, you have a broken bone. 08:53:16 <KittenKoder> <.< 08:53:18 <KittenKoder> >.> 08:53:28 <KittenKoder> Can't find it. >.< 08:58:45 <KittenKoder> NuTrack has it at 26667 ... isn't that a bit high since it's a multiplier? 08:59:33 * Pinkbeast assumes his trademark blank look. :-O # sorry, I don't understand 09:00:01 <KittenKoder> The cost multiplier for the maglev track. 09:00:26 <Pinkbeast> NuTrack does like to make high speed tracks _very_ expensive, dunno if they mean that. 09:01:03 <KittenKoder> Because the example track in the NML says 32 is "steep" for the costs. 09:01:35 *** pjpe [~pjpe@173-230-161-25.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 09:01:59 <Pinkbeast> Not to be Captain Obvious, but seen if NuTracks does actually charge a million a mile for maglev? 09:03:00 <KittenKoder> That's where I'm lost, the math in my head doesn't coincide. 09:03:34 <Pinkbeast> Well, while I'm being the cardboard programmer, what are the multipliers for other track? 09:03:43 <KittenKoder> Lowest is 47. 09:03:52 <planetmaker> Pinkbeast: nutracks means to be very expensive 09:04:37 <KittenKoder> Okay, test is 46 per mile of maglev .... see ... math doesn't add up. >.< 09:04:47 <Pinkbeast> planet> yabbut nutracks slowest ain't 47 times the cost in vanilla, which I think is key to Kitten's issue 09:05:12 <KittenKoder> Exactly! 09:05:30 <KittenKoder> The highest speed electric comes to 9,346. 09:07:49 <KittenKoder> I think another of my GRFs is interfering with NuTracks, because the highest rail seems correct. 09:08:08 <KittenKoder> 9364 with a cost value of 9334. 09:09:51 * KittenKoder is actually more confused now really. 09:11:37 <KittenKoder> Okay ... maybe I'll just ditch this whole line of thought, 09:12:19 <KittenKoder> Some aspects I just can't find enough information on .... 09:12:42 <KittenKoder> Though ... come to think of it, I could just make a NML file and play with values there. 09:12:48 <Pinkbeast> It's struck me as one of the odd things about OTTD, as free games go 09:13:25 <KittenKoder> Not really, Open Source devs have a VERY hard task when it comes to documentation maintenance. 09:13:41 <KittenKoder> It's not easy with a lot of contributions to keep everything in full detail and up to date. 09:14:00 <Pinkbeast> Even so, OTTD is unusually full of magic. 09:14:26 <KittenKoder> The program devs do a great job at what they do. 09:14:49 <Terkhen> svn log | grep -i Magic 09:14:50 <Terkhen> :) 09:14:50 <SpComb> you can set the base cost that the multiplier applies to 09:14:53 <KittenKoder> ... and with the NewGRF ... almost impossible to expect that to be complete. 09:15:00 <Pinkbeast> I think you're responding to a criticism I wasn't making. 09:15:06 <KittenKoder> Probably. 09:15:07 <KittenKoder> LOL 09:15:11 <KittenKoder> It's late. 09:16:04 <KittenKoder> SpComb, I almost figured it out, but it slipped out of my brain for some reason. 09:16:10 <KittenKoder> The math is just not working for me. 09:17:16 <KittenKoder> Is there a conversion between pounds and dollars? 09:17:51 <Terkhen> in OpenTTD? 1£ == 2$ IIRC 09:17:53 <Pinkbeast> Er... yes, all the other currencies have hard-configured conversions to pounds. # perhaps that was not your question 09:18:22 <KittenKoder> Okay .... that's part of my problem. 09:18:30 <KittenKoder> I thought it just changed the display. >.< 09:18:51 <Pinkbeast> Er, I think it does - the internal game arithmetic is always in pounds. 09:19:04 <Yexo> internal game is always in pounds, yes 09:19:31 <KittenKoder> There's a lot of my confusion's source, I didn't think of that until just now. 09:20:59 <KittenKoder> Even then, I'm still thinking of ditching the idea of adding another track type anyway. LOL 09:21:41 <KittenKoder> Unless I make one monorail+maglev compatible ... but that may unbalance things a lot. 09:22:58 <KittenKoder> ... as well as complicate matters .... forgot about acceleration. 09:41:13 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFEF79.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:42:07 *** Biolunar [mahdi@blfd-4db18db3.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 09:43:18 *** Sc00by22 [~IceChat77@host-2-97-36-18.as13285.net] has joined #openttd 09:51:50 <KittenKoder> Not going too high on the detail for 3D modeling is hard when you're use to high res. 09:52:10 *** fjb [~frank@p5DDFEF79.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:52:29 <Pinkbeast> You should tell that to the P1SIM guy # sorry 09:52:45 <KittenKoder> LOL 09:53:19 <KittenKoder> I am trying to remember that when taking the 3D model down to an 8bbp sprite, detail becomes dots. 09:53:36 <Pinkbeast> Someone should tell that to the P1SIM guy # oh oops again 09:54:26 <KittenKoder> Okay, gotta ask, who? 09:54:56 <peter1138> p1sim is awesome 09:55:11 <Pinkbeast> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=45685&start=0 09:55:52 <Pinkbeast> He wants to implement something - alone - that will be 80000 times better than OTTD by simulating EVERYTHING 09:56:42 <Pinkbeast> Now admittedly that worked for the Dwarf Fortress guy but 1) he's very unusual 2) he worked for ages before releasing anything 3) he did have to live on instant ramen for years after that before the money came in 09:57:48 <blathijs> He does draw pretty pictures 09:58:01 <blathijs> and actually has code already, it seems 09:58:40 <KittenKoder> LOL 09:58:49 <Pinkbeast> blathijs> Some code, yes, but I have code to make an @ walk round the screen and I ain't claiming to have written a roguelike yet 09:59:18 <Pinkbeast> As some OTTD dev put it in the thread, OTTD's interface code alone is a pretty awesome one-man job. 09:59:27 <blathijs> Lots of pretty pictures, even 10:00:04 <KittenKoder> Well, I'm a bit of a realist. 10:00:30 <blathijs> heh, "It would take many years to make a fork of ottd so that it will work like the concept i decribed." 10:00:41 <blathijs> At least he has some realism on his side as well 10:00:51 <KittenKoder> Granted. 10:00:54 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> I do, around page 38, try and encourage him to do something one man can do 10:01:15 <KittenKoder> I didn't read that far. :p 10:01:35 <blathijs> And looking at the vast amount of detailed pictures he drew up, he does have plenty of time on his hands :-) 10:01:35 <Pinkbeast> I don't blame you 10:01:37 <KittenKoder> Kinda busy trying to make a low res version of the Ghost of Mars train right now. 10:01:37 * peter1138 ponders attempting to migrate stuff from vserver to lxc 10:02:00 <blathijs> peter1138: I'm in the middle of that right now, so feel free to shoot questions 10:02:29 <peter1138> network setup seems vastly more complicated :S 10:02:30 <KittenKoder> Which is better, long or tall engines? 10:02:47 <blathijs> peter1138: Also, realize that lxc is not as foolproof as vserver right now (it does isolation, but there are still parts that are not isolated or secured) 10:03:10 <KittenKoder> I have seen some long engines, but they don't look right taking turns, though they are nice otherwise. 10:03:25 <peter1138> blathijs, hmmmmmmm 10:03:34 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> er if they are fictional why have too much of either 10:03:47 <blathijs> I like the track layout idea of p1sim, though. I once designed something like it for ottd :-) 10:03:49 <peter1138> well, they're all for service separation rather than dishing out to untrusted customers etc... 10:04:15 <blathijs> peter1138: If you have a functioning vserver system right now, you might want to stick with that for a while (though it's fun playing with lxc, of course) 10:04:28 <KittenKoder> Pinkbeast, I am trying to work out balance .... it's just sometimes it's hard. 10:04:49 <blathijs> peter1138: I'm setting up a new server right now, so I thought to save me the migration trouble later on by using lxc right now 10:05:04 <peter1138> yeah, i'm setting up a new server 10:05:30 <peter1138> basically i installed it as vserver 10:05:41 <peter1138> *then* read that vserver's being deprecated :S 10:05:43 <blathijs> peter1138: And indeed, my goal is mostly separation to make management more easy and slightly reduce the impact of a security breach, not give root to untrusted people 10:05:55 <blathijs> peter1138: Same here 10:06:15 <blathijs> peter1138: Or rather, I knew vserver was to be deprecated, but only found out later that lxc was somewhat usable already 10:06:47 <blathijs> peter1138: Though I think that the vserver kernal patch will be deprecated by Debian, but it's likely that the vserver userspace tools will end up using lxc kernel utils eventually 10:06:49 <Pinkbeast> I like many of the ideas in P1SIM (although not the "simulate everything and see what drops out" idea, that worked once for Dwarf Fortress) but he'd do better hacking on OTTD 10:06:56 <blathijs> peter1138: Not sure about the timeframe, though 10:07:45 <peter1138> lxc seems to be lacking in the shutdown procedure 10:14:22 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-001-024.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 10:17:59 <blathijs> peter1138: I've wondered about that. shutdown -h now seems to work, but I usually use lxc-stop to stop a container. I suppose that just sigterms all processes or something 10:18:17 *** AlexLivingstone [~alex@ppp-93-104-60-170.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #openttd 10:18:28 <peter1138> yeah, lxc-stop doesn't do a clean shutdown 10:18:42 <blathijs> peter1138: And you can't seem to run a single command within a container if it's already running, so not sure how to script the shutdown -h now 10:18:45 <blathijs> perhaps over SSH ;-) 10:19:21 <blathijs> I wonder if something like "echo ctrl-alt-del | lxc-console" exists 10:19:38 <blathijs> or sending an ACPI power button signal :-) 10:19:41 <peter1138> single command? 10:19:59 <peter1138> right 10:20:04 <peter1138> http://blog.foaa.de/2010/05/lxc-on-debian-squeeze/#how-to-safely-stop-a-container :S 10:20:12 <peter1138> (that's a year ago mind you) 10:20:46 <blathijs> seems the lxc-stop is no longer neede right now 10:22:40 <peter1138> i wonder how libvirt handles it 10:23:42 <blathijs> "chroot /var/lib/lxc/vm0/rootfs telinit 0" seems to do the trick 10:24:06 <peter1138> interesting 10:24:15 <blathijs> (which is a bit of a hack, but takes advantage of the fact that telinit just dumps something in /dev/initctl I think) 10:24:21 <peter1138> yeah 10:24:38 <peter1138> and /dev/initctl isn't actually a device node 10:25:03 <blathijs> I was just wondering about that, yes 10:25:05 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 10:25:08 <blathijs> just a FIFO created by init I guess? 10:25:13 <peter1138> yeah 10:25:18 <peter1138> should be in /var/run ;) 10:25:27 <AlexLivingstone> moin 10:25:30 <blathijs> hysterical raisins, I guess 10:25:45 <peter1138> now... can you do lxc without the network bridge 10:26:02 <peter1138> i find promiscuous mode disconcerting, heh 10:26:16 <blathijs> Yup, see http://j.9souldier.org/trunk/lxc/net/ 10:26:39 <blathijs> though I had a look at that and then eventually just went for the bridge configuration 10:27:09 <blathijs> since that static approach requires configuring a (possibly identical) address for every veth pair on the host side 10:27:29 <peter1138> hmm, i see. painful 10:27:38 <blathijs> peter1138: Just using a veth pair and putting that in a host-side bridge seems to work 10:28:12 <blathijs> peter1138: I also coded up a patch for lxc-start to setup the default gateway inside the guest (autodetected from the bridge address), so the guest doesn't need to do any networking configuration anymore 10:30:21 <KittenKoder> Okay, this is the 32bpp version, any comments? http://rpgcn.com/backups/Engine.png 10:30:35 <KittenKoder> Pink = CC1, green = CC2 10:31:12 <Pinkbeast> I think it would be more helpful to show it in a variety of CC, frankly # or at any rate less alarming ones 10:31:20 <Pinkbeast> But it looks basically good 10:31:52 <KittenKoder> Well, that's the rough render, and the CCs change to the defaults when I do my palette trick. 10:32:17 <KittenKoder> It's based on this one: http://i423.photobucket.com/albums/pp313/TheBufoon/Future%20Trains/train.jpg 10:32:25 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:33:27 <Pinkbeast> Kitten> It's an awkward shape. In the future I hope we can expect trains to be either super streamlined (like the new shinkansens) or bluff freight full of brute force. 10:33:54 <Pinkbeast> But I don't think that design is bad # but I'd like to see it in more CC 10:33:58 <KittenKoder> Thus why I'm calling this "Fantasy" instead of sci-fi. 10:34:14 <KittenKoder> Not all sci-fi is realistic, and most is pretty fugly. :p 10:34:52 <Pinkbeast> Well, in fantasy, we could have designs like UKRS1's 7AT steam locomotive # ahem sorry 10:34:53 <KittenKoder> But hmm ... lost a little more detail than I expected ... need to tone down the shading stuffs or use less variation in shading colors. 10:35:29 <KittenKoder> LOL 10:35:33 <Pinkbeast> But more seriously, in fantasy, it should exude power, with grilles over vast engines # inasmuch as we can do in so few pixels 10:36:09 <KittenKoder> Yeah, that's the balance I'm trying to work out, the detail levels, right now. 10:36:16 <Pinkbeast> LOL> I dunno, if I won umpteen million pounds I would build the 5at 10:36:47 <Pinkbeast> Well, again, I dunno about the CC, but that design does seem to have a certain brute something. 10:36:51 <KittenKoder> I need to choose a better base color. 10:37:24 <KittenKoder> It's a long distance passenger transport in the movie. 10:37:53 <KittenKoder> Maglev, but slower than most diesel. >.< LOL 10:38:26 <KittenKoder> I think I need to put more red in the texture so it converts better, it goes all grey. 10:40:20 <KittenKoder> Ooops, figured out why the CC amount was so low. 10:40:30 <KittenKoder> Forgot to change the specular values. 10:40:32 <KittenKoder> >.< 10:42:24 <KittenKoder> Aha! 10:42:48 <KittenKoder> http://rpgcn.com/backups/Engine.png <- With the corrected palette 10:44:12 <KittenKoder> Thinking of doing the unit style. 10:45:38 <Pinkbeast> No, that looks much worse. 10:46:16 <KittenKoder> ??? 10:46:50 <Pinkbeast> The grey with 2CC stripes one looked better. 10:47:32 <KittenKoder> Really? 10:48:02 <KittenKoder> Well, the grey would fit other sets better. 10:50:54 <KittenKoder> How about darker grey? 10:52:24 <KittenKoder> Refresh it, I think this time I got it. 10:59:21 *** Sc00by22 [~IceChat77@host-2-97-36-18.as13285.net] has quit [Quit: Always try to be modest, and be proud about it!] 11:00:33 <peter1138> just freed up 1.7GB of ram 11:00:35 <peter1138> by closing chrome :S 11:03:32 <KittenKoder> LOL 11:04:46 <KittenKoder> Frell .... 11:07:20 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 11:36:53 <KittenKoder> Okay, honest opinion of my sprite ability: http://rpgcn.com/backups/martian.png 11:38:27 <Noldo> too much blue 11:38:29 * Noldo hides 11:38:49 <KittenKoder> LOL 11:38:59 <KittenKoder> The blue on the train itself is CC1. 12:07:56 <Eddi|zuHause> sprites are difficult to judge on their own 12:10:13 <KittenKoder> The problem is that all the others I have seen everything looks longer from the side angles than the diagonal ones 12:11:00 <Eddi|zuHause> yep, that's a general problem 12:11:00 <KittenKoder> But mine keep winding up the same. 12:11:09 <KittenKoder> Is it because of using a 3D rendering? 12:11:18 <Eddi|zuHause> the - view must be stretched about 40% 12:12:09 <KittenKoder> Wow, that's a lot. >.< 12:14:22 <Eddi|zuHause> total width should be 32px 12:15:15 <Eddi|zuHause> yours looks more like 24px 12:15:26 <KittenKoder> About that. 12:15:40 <Eddi|zuHause> @calc 32/24 12:15:40 <DorpsGek> Eddi|zuHause: 1.33333333333 12:15:54 <Eddi|zuHause> 33% stretch needed 12:16:17 <KittenKoder> I'll have to figure it out tomorrow, 12:17:03 <Eddi|zuHause> it's difficult to recognize any kind of shape in your images though 12:17:18 <KittenKoder> Yeah, 12:17:25 <KittenKoder> I was thinking that to. 12:18:17 <KittenKoder> I still need a lot more practice. 12:18:29 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:6972:c460:71ca:c44b] has joined #openttd 12:18:33 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 12:19:23 <Eddi|zuHause> this stretch is actually very annoying, but it's kinda deep inside the game mechanics 12:19:54 <KittenKoder> Working with isometric is a pain no matter what game. 12:20:21 <peter1138> would be better if it was proper isometric ;p 12:20:27 <KittenKoder> Hexagonal is the only way to solve it really. 12:20:38 <Eddi|zuHause> hexagonal has other problems 12:21:09 <KittenKoder> With square the angles won't fit, but yeah, hexagonal is VERY hard to code for. 12:21:11 <Eddi|zuHause> like you cannot do proper 90° crossings 12:21:48 <KittenKoder> Something like TT ... it'd be virtually impossible to use hexagonal. 12:22:09 <Eddi|zuHause> actually, the idea is very intriguing, but probably not worth the effort 12:22:25 <KittenKoder> ... and if the isometric as it is was fixed, it'd be a lot of trouble with having to remake everything. 12:23:43 <KittenKoder> That's why I said I need practice. :p 12:26:17 <Pinkbeast> What would Gresley do? 12:30:06 *** Br33z4hSlut5 [~static.kp@92.68.154.34] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:47:17 *** georg [~annih@188-192-191-57-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 12:47:48 <georg> hi 12:48:38 <georg> i just downloaded openttd-1.1.2-linux-generic-amd64 and started a dedicated server, it keeps changing the version number to 1.0.3/10384F2B in the config file and returns me a "version mismatch" in my 1.1.2 win64 client 12:50:56 <glx> are you sure you start the right one ? 12:51:02 <georg> nevermind, my fault ofc, openttd != ./openttd, had an old version installed via apt 12:58:30 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-243-254.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 13:01:43 <Belugas> hello 13:04:47 *** avdg [~avdg@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:04:47 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:04:48 *** Osai [~Osai@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:05:57 *** TheMask96 [martijn@gluttony.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:05:58 *** SmatZ [~smatz@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:06:22 *** tneo [~tneo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:06:23 *** V453000 [~V453000@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:06:33 *** Hirundo [~Hirundo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:48 *** Ammler [~ammler@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:48 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:52 *** Yexo [~Yexo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:53 *** planetmaker [~planetmak@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:53 *** XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:58 *** ^Spike^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:11:44 *** TheMask96 [martijn@gluttony.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 13:15:08 *** tneo [~tneo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:15:25 *** Hirundo [~Hirundo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:15:33 *** Ammler [~ammler@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:16:09 *** SmatZ [~smatz@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:16:09 *** Osai [~Osai@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:16:39 *** planetmaker [~planetmak@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:16:42 *** mode/#openttd [+o planetmaker] by ChanServ 13:16:52 *** ^Spike^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:17:06 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:17:09 *** mode/#openttd [+o Terkhen] by ChanServ 13:17:39 *** V453000 [~V453000@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:17:39 *** XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:18:09 *** avdg [~avdg@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:18:09 *** Yexo [~Yexo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:18:12 *** mode/#openttd [+o Yexo] by ChanServ 13:18:39 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 13:23:55 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-30-222.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 13:29:11 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has joined #openttd 13:34:41 *** douknoukem [~KEM@78.166.118.29] has joined #openttd 13:37:27 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 13:37:28 <andythenorth> http://www.edutopia.org/serious-games-computer-simulations-study 13:40:40 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has joined #openttd 13:43:24 *** douknoukem [~KEM@78.166.118.29] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:47:49 *** lessthanthree [lt3@d64-180-56-242.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:50:51 *** Sacro_ is now known as Sacro 13:55:21 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 14:10:09 <Hirundo> Eddi|zuHause: Is a NML var that captures vehicle var 45 in its entirety still useful to you? 14:10:48 <Eddi|zuHause> haven't changed much in the last days 14:11:37 <Eddi|zuHause> so i still check those same 4 cases... and i still have not checked the behaviour in 90° turns 14:11:50 *** Devroush [~dennis@178-119-81-33.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 14:12:29 <Eddi|zuHause> and the actual plan was to replace that with 60+ vars 14:12:45 <Eddi|zuHause> so var45 possibly won't be used at all in the end 14:14:02 <Hirundo> At least for now, NML has a var equivalent to var45 14:14:31 <Hirundo> I found an old patch in my stack which I just finished + committed 14:14:46 <Eddi|zuHause> ah, ok 14:15:02 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-30-222.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:15:05 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 14:15:16 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe i check it out later 14:15:18 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-30-222.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 14:15:21 <Eddi|zuHause> not in the mood right now 14:19:11 *** georg [~annih@188-192-191-57-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: www.stfu.de] 14:45:19 *** douknoukem [~KEM@78.166.118.29] has joined #openttd 14:50:59 <planetmaker> http://imagebin.org/168365 <-- better or worse? 14:52:02 <Terkhen> it looks better IMO 14:52:32 <planetmaker> hm... maybe I should borrow FIRS' ground tile? 14:52:37 * planetmaker looks 14:59:27 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has joined #openttd 15:13:30 *** keoz [~keikoz@141.2.96.19] has joined #openttd 15:19:04 <peter1138> http://hackedirl.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/epic-win-photos-mother-nature-ftw-green-tunnel.jpg 15:19:12 <peter1138> ^ new railtype ! 15:19:29 *** keoz [~keikoz@141.2.96.19] has quit [Quit: keoz] 15:19:42 <planetmaker> jungle style? 15:23:24 <__ln__> is that real? 15:23:47 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-243-254.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:27:23 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-243-254.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has joined #openttd 15:28:04 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc14-linl7-2-0-cust28.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 15:37:27 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008ceb.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:37:54 *** AlexLivingstone [~alex@ppp-93-104-60-170.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:45:27 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@5e090e25.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 15:45:57 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 15:46:19 <andythenorth> never add last minute ponies to releases: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/telepathy/2011-August/005679.html 15:46:29 * andythenorth has been burnt by that :P 15:49:52 <Pinkbeast> Oooh, ponies 15:52:25 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D892.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 15:53:53 *** Xrufuian [~xrufuian_@pool-98-119-100-203.lsanca.btas.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 15:55:13 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@rrcs-208-105-82-238.nyc.biz.rr.com] has joined #openttd 16:01:24 *** ar3k [~ident@ecb9.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 16:01:30 *** ar3k is now known as ar3kaw 16:18:16 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe93dd00-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #openttd 16:22:09 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-185-118.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [Quit: I reject your reality and substitute my own] 16:22:37 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:24:58 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: TschÃŒÃ] 16:29:19 <planetmaker> andythenorth: can you explain me the need for tile 226 (basetiles.pnml:59ff) vs. tile 225 (basetiles.pnml:47ff)? 16:29:41 * andythenorth checks 16:29:47 <andythenorth> basetiles got crufty 16:29:53 <andythenorth> it was a nice idea, but impossible in practice 16:30:09 <andythenorth> it failed on Proper Separation of Concerns 16:30:29 <andythenorth> basically shared items + necessary variation = bad code smell 16:30:54 <planetmaker> err, what? 16:30:55 <andythenorth> but to answer the question... 16:31:37 <andythenorth> I don't know :P 16:31:38 <andythenorth> sorry 16:31:40 <andythenorth> I'm at work 16:31:43 <andythenorth> bug me later? 16:31:47 <andythenorth> I'd have to read the nfo 16:32:05 <planetmaker> k 16:32:42 <andythenorth> planetmaker: if they're tiles shared by multiple industries, they should probably be unshared 16:32:46 <andythenorth> and moved into the industry 16:32:55 <andythenorth> the shared basetiles gain almost nothing 16:44:04 <Terkhen> I did not touch the shared industry tiles either 16:44:17 <planetmaker> I'm on them right now 16:44:21 <Terkhen> ok :) 16:49:51 <planetmaker> Terkhen: the building_zextend: what units is that? 16:50:10 <Terkhen> pixels 16:50:16 <planetmaker> sprite height? 16:50:25 <planetmaker> thus 31 for a building of height 0? 16:50:48 <planetmaker> or 8 for a one height level building? 16:51:10 <planetmaker> thus (sprite height - 31) ? 16:51:35 <Terkhen> I don't know, I have not been touching them at all 16:51:55 <planetmaker> oh... nvm. There's an zextend given in the layout :-) 16:52:04 <Terkhen> http://hg.openttdcoop.org/nml/raw-file/tip/docs/nml-language.html#block-spritelayout <--- check zextent 16:52:23 <Terkhen> I know it is in pixels and that it marks the size of the bounding box but nothing more 16:52:26 <Terkhen> I did not have to change them 16:52:53 <planetmaker> ok. thanks 16:53:48 <Terkhen> what are you planning? :P 16:53:57 <supermop_> bridges? 16:54:00 <planetmaker> basetile.pnml? 16:54:25 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 16:54:27 <planetmaker> it has the tanks for plastics plant 17:02:16 <Terkhen> I have been thinking about a file for defining common spritesets / spritelayouts 17:02:29 <Terkhen> for example, most of the industries use the same ground tiles 17:02:39 <Terkhen> the spriteset defining them is duplicated all over 17:02:52 <planetmaker> that might make sense 17:03:07 <Terkhen> the sprites for those common industry tiles could be converted into one of the shared spriteset 17:03:19 <planetmaker> :-D 17:03:25 <planetmaker> One spritelayout for all industries ;-) 17:04:07 <Terkhen> there was an animation particularly nasty in which I had to duplicate the ground sprite in the ground sprite set like 7 times 17:04:16 <Terkhen> so unless you want to define all sprites 7 times... nope :P 17:04:23 *** Juo [~Juo@87-194-64-202.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Juo] 17:04:57 <planetmaker> you haven't reached the industry with the 14 animation frames then? 17:05:36 <Terkhen> there are others with 48 animation frames 17:05:42 <Terkhen> just not 48 sprites :) 17:05:50 <Terkhen> I don't know if there is one with 14 sprites 17:06:02 <Terkhen> 14 of "our" sprites, not ttdsprites 17:06:30 <planetmaker> I don't recall and probably didn't even look at the layouts referenced ;-) 17:07:08 <Terkhen> :P 17:11:48 *** TheMask96 [martijn@gluttony.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:16:00 *** Brianetta [~brian@188-220-91-30.zone11.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:17:38 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-001-024.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:18:41 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 17:18:48 <andythenorth> one spriteset? controversially logical... 17:19:44 <Terkhen> too confusing imo :P 17:21:13 <planetmaker> oh.... how boring :-( 17:21:26 <planetmaker> And I thought it would be on the same line as reducing cargos to "stuff" 17:23:19 <Terkhen> it would be simpler if we didn't have to deal with the "all spritesets have the same size" spritelayout restriction 17:23:34 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 17:23:38 <Terkhen> but I still don't see the point to unify all spritesets in one 17:24:05 <planetmaker> :-) 17:24:44 <planetmaker> nmlc: "sprites/nml/basetiles.pnml", line 10: All parts of the ternary operator (?:) must be integers. <-- nice 17:25:17 <planetmaker> sprite: (terrain_type == TILETYPE_SNOW) ? spriteset_plain_concrete_snow : spriteset_plain_concrete; doesn't work for spritesets, I learnt (again) ;-) 17:26:03 <Terkhen> yes 17:26:14 <Terkhen> that's why the spritelayout templates have two/three fields for ground sprites 17:26:31 <Terkhen> if they only use ttdsprites, you can use the ternary operator 17:26:44 <Terkhen> if they only use spritesets, we can use an index to the spritesets 17:26:46 <planetmaker> both is custom in this case 17:26:50 <Terkhen> but if they use both... 17:27:29 <Terkhen> you can use spriteset_common(terrain_type == TILETYPE_SNOW) then 17:27:38 <Terkhen> but then... your ground spriteset must have two entries too :) 17:27:49 <planetmaker> that can be arranged 17:27:55 <planetmaker> it's a groundsprite only layout 17:28:04 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:28:06 <planetmaker> concrete or snow. No otherfrills 17:28:37 <Terkhen> ok :) 17:28:44 <planetmaker> thus I'll just make a short custom thingy for it 17:29:01 <planetmaker> as no such template seems to exist nor is it worth templating that, I think 17:31:00 <planetmaker> as it probably will be removed anyway ;-) 17:32:01 <Terkhen> I had to do a lot of custom stuff 17:32:12 <Terkhen> not worth templating :) 17:33:13 <planetmaker> if everything would be templated, the template would be toooooooo complicated 17:34:09 <Terkhen> yes, the current templates are relatively simple and cover most of the cases 17:35:05 <planetmaker> which is how it should be IMHO 17:36:07 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host178-232-dynamic.1-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 17:36:31 <Wolf01> o/ 17:37:05 <__ln__> \o 17:45:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: translators * r22756 /trunk/src/lang/ (danish.txt korean.txt unfinished/persian.txt): 17:45:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:45:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: danish - 2 changes by zyx 17:45:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: korean - 2 changes by telk5093 17:45:27 <CIA-2> OpenTTD: persian - 18 changes by Peymanpn 17:47:49 *** andythenorth [~Andy@78-86-194-127.zone2.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 17:58:11 <Zuu> Cool, my new computer compiles OpenTTD in 37 seconds for debug build and 1:38 for release builds. So now there is no excuse for making awsome patches :-p 17:59:35 <__ln__> Zuu: the carbon footprint? 18:00:43 <Zuu> Haven't checked that. 18:01:02 <planetmaker> :-) 18:01:07 <Terkhen> nice :) 18:02:09 <Zuu> But I have a green energy contract and Sweden got most electricity from water and nuclear plants. 18:03:53 <Terkhen> IIRC I managed 20 seconds... with ccache :P 18:03:59 <Zuu> But actually, the main issue with my old computer was not compile time, but that word/excel was too slow to bother open documents. 18:04:54 <frosch123> Zuu: with disk cache or without? 18:05:10 <frosch123> i.e. is the second full compile faster? 18:05:34 <Zuu> frosch123: Compile time after a "clean solution". 18:06:07 <Zuu> I should add that I haven't added direct X yet which might impact things. 18:06:11 *** DDR [~DDR@d142-179-78-88.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 18:07:56 *** DDR [~DDR@d142-179-78-88.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [] 18:08:18 * planetmaker would not compile w/o ccache if it can be avoided :-) 18:09:27 <__ln__> are the danes bothered by BarsebÀck? 18:09:37 <Rubidium> I seldomly seen much compile time improvements from ccache 18:09:53 <Rubidium> except for the make && make clean && make case 18:10:04 <Zuu> BasrsebÀck has been shut down, although it will take long time to complete the shuting down operation. 18:10:05 <Rubidium> but that's unfair 18:10:44 <Rubidium> generally you change something in a header and everything that includes that header changes, so the ccache is pointless 18:11:44 <Zuu> IIRC in VS 2008 they added some detection of changes that doesn't affect other parts or some other reduction of re-compilation. 18:12:37 <Zuu> Not sure if VS 2010 have any such boosts. Have not yet learned how to work with the new way of adding global include dirs to 2010. 18:13:49 <Rubidium> I doubt they'd remove them 18:22:25 <Zuu> It's not all bad. It looks like I can create a OpenTTD property sheet that is not global but that I add to all OpenTTD projects. That way the OpenTTD includes are stored in one place but does not affect other builds. 18:23:25 <Zuu> Currently I don't have problem with having the OpenTTD includes global, but if I would, this would be a useful improvement. 18:23:58 <Terkhen> IIRC someone did a tutorial on how to add the global folders to MSVC 2010 already 18:24:14 <Terkhen> ah, you don't want that :) 18:24:47 <Zuu> I also remember seeing something like a 2010 guide, but it has not been added to the compiling category. 18:25:08 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:28:14 <Terkhen> he probably never got around to finish it 18:28:28 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:32:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 18:33:41 <andythenorth> efening 18:36:47 *** |Jeroen| [~jeroen@d5152B25B.access.telenet.be] has quit [Quit: oO] 18:37:39 <Terkhen> hi andythenorth 18:37:56 <andythenorth> buenes noches 18:37:58 <andythenorth> or some such 18:38:01 <andythenorth> my spanish is rusty 18:40:07 <andythenorth> oh 18:40:10 <andythenorth> you broke my FIRS again :P 18:41:39 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.183.216] has joined #openttd 18:42:02 <andythenorth> fixed :P 18:42:03 <andythenorth> hmm 18:42:17 <andythenorth> so my opengfx+ food processor didn't go down well :| 18:44:16 <Terkhen> hmm... why? 18:44:28 <andythenorth> I drew too much shadow on the walls 18:44:38 <andythenorth> forum feedback :P 18:46:38 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 18:47:15 *** supermop_ [~daniel_er@rrcs-208-105-82-238.nyc.biz.rr.com] has quit [Quit: supermop_] 18:47:28 <Terkhen> it is quite better than the old one IMO 18:47:36 * Terkhen updates opengfx 18:47:40 *** kasuga_ [~osaka@broadband-46-188-1-176.2kom.ru] has joined #openttd 18:48:07 *** kasuga_ is now known as kasuga 18:50:12 *** kasuga [~osaka@broadband-46-188-1-176.2kom.ru] has left #openttd [] 18:52:11 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-185-118.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 18:52:32 *** Hirundo [~Hirundo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Bye - http.//dev.openttdcoop.org] 18:52:32 *** V453000 [~V453000@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: You must construct additional PYLONS to get me back!] 18:52:32 *** avdg [~avdg@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: bye - http://dev.openttdcoop.org - never quits] 18:52:32 *** tneo [~tneo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: bye - http://www.openttdcoop.org] 18:52:32 *** XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: So long, and thank's for all the fish] 18:52:32 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: bye - http://www.openttdcoop.org] 18:52:53 *** luckz [~lkz@luckz.de] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.] 18:53:11 *** Ammler [~ammler@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:53:11 *** SmatZ [~smatz@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:53:12 *** ^Spike^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Ehm.. Quit? What's That?] 18:53:12 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:53:23 *** luckz [~lkz@luckz.de] has joined #openttd 18:53:30 *** osaka` [~osaka@broadband-46-188-1-176.2kom.ru] has joined #openttd 18:53:41 *** Hirundo [~Hirundo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 18:57:25 *** dihedral [~dih@znc.noaddedsugar.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:57:38 *** welterde [welterde@thinkbase.srv.welterde.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:57:52 *** Yexo [~Yexo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:59:26 *** dihedral [~dih@znc.noaddedsugar.net] has joined #openttd 19:04:37 *** Kurimus [~stabbity@dsl-tkubrasgw3-fe93dd00-34.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [] 19:04:54 * andythenorth broke the rules 19:05:01 <andythenorth> and went in suggestions forum :| 19:05:23 <Rubidium> oh darn... too late to suggest rivers then :( 19:06:13 <andythenorth> let me see 19:06:22 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@tunnel3304.ipv6.xs4all.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:06:32 <andythenorth> oh frick 19:06:38 <andythenorth> I have to lay those sprite sheets out 19:06:41 <andythenorth> or change the nfo 19:07:02 <andythenorth> would anyone fancy amending the nfo in this grf? http://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/water-features 19:07:18 *** SmatZ [~smatz@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:07:21 *** mode/#openttd [+o SmatZ] by ChanServ 19:07:22 <andythenorth> so that tropic and arctic use 100% identical sprite layout to temperate? 19:07:51 <andythenorth> (copy + rename temperate png for tropic green, tropic desert, arctic brown, arctic snow) 19:08:12 *** V453000 [~V453000@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:08:36 *** welterde [welterde@thinkbase.srv.welterde.de] has joined #openttd 19:08:41 *** Ammler [~ammler@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:08:45 <andythenorth> I'd do it but I have to take apart a three wheel truck :P 19:09:57 <andythenorth> I'll happily (grumpily) do the graphics, but the layout is just one step too much right now 19:10:59 <Rubidium> let me see 19:13:30 <Wolf01> I'll happiny (grumpig) do the refactoring of my website php code 19:13:33 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-001-024.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:22:43 <Rubidium> http://rbijker.net/openttd/temperate.png <- they look so tiny 19:25:12 *** ^Spike^ [~Spike@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:26:42 *** XeryusTC [~XeryusTC@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:26:42 *** tneo- [~tneo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:27:42 *** avdg [~avdg@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:27:54 *** tneo- is now known as tneo 19:33:21 *** ar3kaw [~ident@ecb9.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:33:39 *** ar3k [~ident@ecb9.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #openttd 19:33:41 *** ar3k is now known as ar3kaw 19:33:49 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-26-133-181.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 19:34:12 *** Terkhen [~Terkhen@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:34:15 *** mode/#openttd [+o Terkhen] by ChanServ 19:34:48 <Rubidium> andythenorth: what did you mean by copying? Just copy the temperate one to the arctic etc ones? 19:36:13 <Rubidium> http://rbijker.net/openttd/temperate.pnfo <- the sprite sizes and such seem somewhat random to me 19:37:20 <andythenorth> they are :P 19:37:36 <andythenorth> even if it made sense once, I think it's decomped grfcodec output 19:37:54 <andythenorth> and yes, just duplicate the temperate png and rename for arctic-snow etc 19:38:04 <andythenorth> then I'll fill / replace / tweak for colours 19:38:50 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:39:59 *** pjpe [~pjpe@173-230-161-25.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 19:40:12 *** Yexo [~Yexo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:40:15 *** mode/#openttd [+o Yexo] by ChanServ 19:40:42 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:44:00 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 19:45:12 *** Yexo- [~Yexo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 19:48:48 *** Yexo [~Yexo@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:52:13 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: bye - http://www.openttdcoop.org] 19:55:12 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 20:08:58 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:12:41 *** Adamos [~Adam_Pods@213.210.185.118.adsl.nextra.cz] has joined #openttd 20:14:16 <frosch123> night 20:14:21 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008ceb.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:15:33 <Adamos> hi everybody, is this right place to find players tonight? 20:16:22 <Terkhen> hi 20:16:29 <Terkhen> you can try if someone wants to :P 20:17:45 <Adamos> what about you? :) 20:18:04 <Terkhen> no thanks, playing is not my thing :) 20:19:00 *** Juo [~Juo@cpc11-acto2-2-0-cust244.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Juo] 20:20:33 <Adamos> ok, thanks for info... anyway, some recommandations about settings? i.e. Town cargo limitations, prizes simulating real bussiness etc.? 20:20:54 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:21:57 <Adamos> there is lot of possibilites, i would appreciate some pre-set settings - which would simulate reality event with it's high difficulty 20:23:21 <Adamos> btw. i really admire work on openttd by all of developers - it's really great to see this game not just being alive, but also living 20:25:04 <planetmaker> Adamos: everybody has his or her own preference settings and might have different view on what constitute 'difficult' or 'realistic' or whatever 20:25:15 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 20:25:23 <planetmaker> try a few servers and check which you like, I'd recommend 20:25:43 <planetmaker> save the game where you like the settings and find out which are the interesting ones 20:26:10 <Adamos> thanks for recommendation 20:26:38 *** KouDy [~KouDy@ip-89-176-30-222.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:29:34 <Adamos> this variability is in one way really great - because of such many possibilities, but on the other hand - it lacks any "standard" - maybe some level you want to compete at... you know, something like general conditions you have to fit to if you want to success... when you make your own conditions, you are losing some quite important feeling of the game 20:30:48 *** jpx_ [jpx_@a91-156-243-254.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:33:06 <planetmaker> if you want to compete, do that on one map with other players. Then it's the same for all 20:33:21 <planetmaker> and the different maps are just different 'levels' 20:35:43 <Adamos> you are right... and what about scenarios - it is possible to create them with specially adjusted advanced settings? 20:36:02 <Terkhen> settings are saved for each scenario, yes 20:36:51 <Adamos> cool, thanks for informations, gyus! 20:37:10 *** DayDreamer [~DayDreame@94.142.234.1] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:38:04 <Adamos> if i find some oldies i made for TTD, i'll put them to right place to download.. but i am afraid, that they are already lost 20:44:23 *** WMP [~oftc@auburn.sored.pl] has left #openttd [Konversation terminated!] 20:54:17 *** Adamos [~Adam_Pods@213.210.185.118.adsl.nextra.cz] has left #openttd [] 20:58:08 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A21C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:04:31 <Terkhen> good night 21:09:24 <__ln__> too early to say 21:09:50 <Eddi|zuHause> i think it's usually "too early to tell" 21:10:18 <__ln__> quite possible 21:10:38 <__ln__> in fact, in a monty python sketch they say "too early to say, too early to tell" 21:14:52 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: bye - http://www.openttdcoop.org] 21:15:16 *** DJNekkid [~djnekkid@101.haydn.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 21:23:34 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@home.deboom.biz] has joined #openttd 21:27:48 *** Pulec [~pulec@static-cl093181068250.unet.cz] has quit [] 21:28:08 *** Yexo- is now known as Yexo 21:28:55 *** Neon [~Neon@dslb-094-219-001-024.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Python is way too complicated... I prefer doing it quickly in C.] 21:29:35 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@95.76.27.160] has quit [] 21:36:12 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:37:34 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc15-aztw25-2-0-cust3.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [] 21:44:05 <Wolf01> 'night 21:44:09 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host178-232-dynamic.1-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:51:36 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6D892.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:57:22 *** DDR [~DDR@d142-179-78-88.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 21:59:02 *** Nowaker [~nowaker@geozone.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:01:59 *** Lakie [~Lakie@91.84.183.216] has quit [Quit: Sleep.] 22:08:05 *** Nowaker [~nowaker@geozone.pl] has joined #openttd 22:08:27 *** Nowaker [~nowaker@geozone.pl] has quit [] 22:08:27 *** Nowaker [~nowaker@geozone.pl] has joined #openttd 22:16:54 *** Nowaker [~nowaker@geozone.pl] has left #openttd [] 22:18:41 *** mattt_ [~m@24-246-2-147.cable.teksavvy.com] has joined #openttd 23:09:43 *** Adambean [AdamR@82.hosts.reece-eu.net] has quit [Quit: Gone fishing] 23:17:10 *** lessthanthree [lt3@d64-180-56-242.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 23:35:02 *** Devroush [~dennis@178-119-81-33.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 23:37:41 *** Pikka [~Figgy@d114-78-11-238.rdl800.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 23:37:52 <Pikka> ridiculous 23:45:04 *** mattt_ [~m@24-246-2-147.cable.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: mattt_] 23:45:14 <Sacro> Pikka: your wiki is le broked 23:45:21 <Pikka> I know 23:45:41 <Pikka> it needs upgrading, orudge is possibly maybe going to do it when he has time 23:45:51 <Sacro> Sigh 23:45:56 <Pikka> he updated le php on the server you see 23:45:57 <Sacro> :( but I need the knowledge that it holds 23:46:02 <Pikka> which one? 23:46:03 <Sacro> Indeed 23:46:09 <Sacro> All the UKRS info 23:46:19 <Sacro> me and my friends are having a very enjoyable game 23:46:27 <Sacro> but we refer to the wiki for info 23:46:36 <Pikka> anything in particular you want to know? 23:46:59 <Pikka> you can usually just wiki the real vehicle for stats and usage and suchlike 23:48:13 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A21C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 23:48:44 <Pikka> also, is it a private game? :P I'm always interested to see how people are using my grfs (and often disappointed, for example with UKRS1 where most players just put A4s and deltics on everything) 23:49:27 <Sacro> errm, it's a CHPP game, Coop's server 23:49:53 <Pikka> oh 23:50:02 <Sacro> heh, we are quite realistic 23:50:12 <Pikka> I guess I should download CHPP some time then 23:50:14 <Sacro> can't afford to run a4s and deltics 23:50:29 <Sacro> tbh we've had a daylength of between 3 and 5, this game has gone on for weeks 23:50:41 <Sacro> started in 1920 and we've only just got to HSTs 23:50:48 <Sacro> 1024x1024 map 23:54:59 *** rhaeder [~quix0r@dslb-094-221-129-045.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd