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00:04:56 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-250-2-219.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 00:17:30 *** kkb110__ [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 00:19:17 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-207.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 00:19:58 *** KritiK [~Maxim@128-68-119-117.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:34:01 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db0e1e6.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us] 00:48:11 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:51:36 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 00:59:54 *** Maoman [47cbaab5@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 01:01:02 <Maoman> Hey everyone. I'm new to the forums with a question about train efficiency. I actually posted a topic on the forums, but I didn't notice the chat function until after I posted it. 01:01:37 <Maoman> Hopefully everyone isn't just afk. :/ 01:05:30 <Maoman> I've been browsing the wiki (mainly) and a bit on the forums to try and find a list of different ways to merge multiple train lines together, like the lists for stations (http://wiki.openttd.org/Railway_Stations) and junctions (which is spread over multiple pages). Unfortunately, I can't seem to find any. Out of room... 01:05:46 <Maoman> Before I continue, i'll ask: IS there such a list of ways to merge multiple lines efficiently? 01:07:44 <planetmaker> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Junctionary_-_All <-- maybe you find some interesting stuff there, Maoman 01:08:54 <Maoman> >:I Hit the wrong damn key and refreshed the page. Can I have that link again? Sorry. 01:09:48 <planetmaker> http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Junctionary_-_All <-- maybe you find some interesting stuff there, Maoman 01:10:22 <Maoman> Thanks, I'll look around there for a bit 01:10:45 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d99-199-11-52.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:11:52 <planetmaker> you also may find interesting to look at some of the savegames in the public server archive found on that page 01:13:20 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d99-199-11-52.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 01:15:42 <Maoman> Alrighty. My main issue right now is trying to get multiple lanes (six or so), each with 2 or 3 trains each (starting small) to go smoothly into a hub station, so i don't need dedicated stations for each and every line, at the hub (six trains, six stations, etc?) 01:19:04 <Maoman> :/ All these merges are wayyy bigger than anything I can do, yet. As such, the screenshots make little sense to me. 01:20:02 <planetmaker> the get some games form the public server archive. Have a look at them. Play around with the designs 01:20:13 <planetmaker> join servers. play. Look how others do stuff 01:20:17 <planetmaker> experiment 01:20:36 <planetmaker> I'm biased, but I'll recommend the #openttdcoop welcome server 01:21:05 <Maoman> I haven't tried any kind of multiplayer. Tycoon games have always been a single player thing to me, so when I heard about multiplayer in openttd, it kinda put me off. lol 01:21:38 <planetmaker> well. That's where the _coop_ part can come in :-P 01:22:06 <Maoman> True. Thanks for your help 01:24:36 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:27:27 <Ricaz> It feels like - in a 'competitive' game - that the first company to establish tons of airports is the one to quickly take a massive lead. 01:27:39 <Ricaz> (I only just started playing this game today) 01:33:09 <planetmaker> unless planes are forbidden, limited, not yet available or prohibitively expensive 01:34:16 <Ricaz> We've been running for about 30 years soon, and my company has an income of about .000.000 because of planes ._. 01:36:57 <planetmaker> oh, and depends on the aircraft newgrf used (if any) 01:37:11 <planetmaker> and airport newgrf (if any) 01:37:16 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 01:37:23 <planetmaker> and the infrastructure maintenance costs for airports (if any) 01:37:27 <Maoman> lol make a couple air ports and send a train all the way across the map, and you're gold. 01:37:38 <planetmaker> thus: complain to your host, Ricaz 01:37:53 <planetmaker> Maoman: yes. usually 01:38:37 <Pikka> it's also about town growth, but I usually get ignored or shushed when I say that :) 01:39:04 * planetmaker hugs Pikka 01:39:46 <Pikka> hello planetmaker 01:39:53 <Pikka> what's cookin'? 01:40:12 <planetmaker> a night with little sleep it seems ;-) 01:40:23 <Pikka> what watch? 01:41:36 <planetmaker> my clock tells me it's about 2:43 01:41:42 <Pikka> such watch! 01:42:00 <planetmaker> maybe even a swatch 01:42:28 <Pikka> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Th0G8rkhBqg 01:43:11 <Maoman> People never seem to know about the Swatch's Croatian brother 01:43:22 <planetmaker> oh, I fear I have a gap in my education there 01:45:25 <planetmaker> but I see you enjoy excitement journeys through the English language "varieties" ;-) 01:46:03 *** brambles [brambles@79.133.200.49] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:56:30 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip1.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 02:04:57 <Maoman> After trying several saves that all told me they wouldn't work, for various reasons, I found one that loaded, but the trains never move, they just stay in the same spot, reversing direction rapidly. 02:10:04 <planetmaker> which? 02:10:56 <Maoman> One of the really old games, number 10. http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_01_-_10 02:11:14 <Maoman> Any newer ones tell me files are missing, and online content can't seem to find the files 02:24:32 <planetmaker> hm, not all files are in the online content, indeed 02:24:58 <planetmaker> http://www.openttdcoop.org/wiki/GRF (Version 8.0) 02:25:45 <planetmaker> but which of the games do you mean (they all have a direct link) 02:30:10 <Maoman> Heres the link http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_01_-_10#gameid_10 02:30:30 <Maoman> I figured saying "number 10" was enough. lol 02:31:38 <Maoman> And I had already tried installing that file you linked to. It doesn't seem to make a difference, but then, I wouldn't be surprised if I'm doing something wrong. Took me like half an hour to figure out how to install the 32bpp mod. 02:43:39 <planetmaker> well. The 32bpp (as in 1.1.x) is also ... not user friendly. That zip file just needs unpacking. in the data folder of openttd. that's all 02:48:52 <Maoman> That's what I did, and It didn't seem to help. :s 02:50:11 <Maoman> Game number 19 (http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/PublicServer:Archive_-_Games_11_-_20#gameid_19) almost works.... some of the trains work, some of them still sit there in the same spot, reversing direction rapidly. All other vehicles work. 02:57:15 <planetmaker> I really suggest to rather use the newer saves... 02:57:40 <planetmaker> and there seem to be jams in some 03:00:21 *** jazzyjaffa [~jazzyjaff@94-193-52-238.zone7.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:25:00 <Pikka> mmm, jam 03:30:59 *** Ricaz [~Ricaz@nobelnet.dk] has quit [] 03:55:33 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:5449:79ca:7ed7:e442] has quit [Quit: bye] 04:09:49 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 04:11:04 *** Pikka [~chatzilla@d58-111-74-170.rdl800.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.1 [Firefox 10.0.2/20120215223356]] 04:13:30 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has joined #openttd 04:28:20 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! 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#openttd 10:30:26 <Carlos> hi, does anyone know if chill's patch pack will be made ready for r24xxx ? 10:30:44 <Carlos> the most recent version seems to be for r22555 or something 10:40:41 <Pikka> I imagine it will be updated at some point, Carlos 10:44:10 *** cypher [~Miranda@wced-90-219-32-147.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd 10:44:37 *** Mark is now known as Guest6459 10:44:37 *** [1]Mark is now known as Mark 10:44:39 <Carlos> thanks, would be nice to have the full pack ready again 10:45:16 <Eddi|zuHause> i imagine it either gets updated or dies in the next few months 10:47:21 <Carlos> cargodist and the current trunk might be running away faster than the patchpack can keep up, right ? 10:47:30 <MNIM> the latter would be really sad. 10:48:20 <Ammler> cargodist? is that sill maintained? 10:48:43 <Eddi|zuHause> my estimate is that, if Chill has enough time on its hand, he will throw everything away, and start over with a new set of patches 10:48:49 <Carlos> i tried to apply it to a r24xxx but there where a lot of failed hunks, including completely missing or redundant source files 10:48:56 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, cargodist is still actively developed 10:49:16 <Ammler> so it "survived" yacd :-) 10:49:17 <Carlos> cargodist is the most important piece of the pack anyway, imo 10:49:36 <Carlos> is there a big difference between cargodist and yacd ? 10:50:13 <Ammler> yacd was "stable" 10:50:57 <Pikka> stables are for horses, I say 10:51:19 <Carlos> ah I just read it, yacd is for cargo with specific destinations 10:51:20 <Ammler> but the gameplay difference was that yacd was indpendent from network 10:51:25 <Eddi|zuHause> each one has its own shortcomings. they had fundamental design differences 10:53:40 *** LordPixaII is now known as Pixa 10:57:09 <Carlos> need to go, thanks for the info 10:57:11 *** Carlos [~me@dslb-188-097-233-099.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Carlos] 11:02:08 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 11:03:38 *** Guest6459 is now known as Markk 11:20:20 *** cypher [~Miranda@wced-90-219-32-147.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 11:28:12 *** Firartix [~artixds@181.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:37:32 *** chester_ [~chester@128-72-23-182.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 11:43:32 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-44-234.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 11:43:35 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 11:44:34 <fonsinchen> Yes, I'm still working on cargodist. 11:44:54 *** mkv` [~Markavian@j616s.co.uk] has joined #openttd 11:45:05 <V453000> been a while o_O 11:45:17 <fonsinchen> And I think the approach with "offline" calculation of the routing scheme is actually better than YACD's "inline" routing. 11:46:12 *** chester_ [~chester@128-72-23-182.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 11:46:25 <Eddi|zuHause> i do think that a mixture between "industry-based" and "network-based" destinations would be preferable 11:46:26 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:46:44 <fonsinchen> How would you mix those concepts? 11:47:50 <Eddi|zuHause> like YACD did, drop (a part of) the production if the predetermined destination is not connected 11:47:52 <fonsinchen> It's been a while since I wrote anything here, but I was on IRC sometimes. 11:48:20 <Eddi|zuHause> better spend your time developing, not talking on irc :p 11:49:14 <fonsinchen> That wouldn't be a mix, but the "industry-based" approach ... 11:49:19 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-223-249.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:49:19 <Ammler> but he first needs to know in which direction :-P 11:49:32 <fonsinchen> There are a lot of people who like the network-based approach. 11:50:01 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, you make predetermined destinations for 50% of the produced cargo, and network-based for the other 50% 11:50:19 <Eddi|zuHause> not sure if that could ever work in cargodist 11:51:38 <fonsinchen> Well, I could somehow integrate the destination selection of YACD and "reserve" some cargo for predetermined destination. Only if the linkgraph finds that those are connected, the cargo is "unlocked" 11:51:43 <fonsinchen> Would be possible. 11:51:54 <fonsinchen> However, first I have some other things to do. 11:51:57 *** Markavian` [~Markavian@j616s.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:52:00 <Eddi|zuHause> different topic: one of the biggest criticisms about cargodist i heard was that the "water flowing" approach doesn't have any way to prevent cargo from going in circles 11:52:29 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 11:52:32 <fonsinchen> Cargo doesn't go in circles. The routing algorithm prevents that. 11:52:34 <Eddi|zuHause> especially in overcrowded networks (which is kinda the default) 11:53:06 <fonsinchen> If you see a circular routing somewhere please send me the save (and hurry up, as the station GUI will crash immediately then). 11:53:33 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't mean the routes, but the individual cargo packets 11:53:39 <fonsinchen> (there is one exception: illogical transfer orders as in my "quiz") 11:53:49 <Eddi|zuHause> assuming you don't store the destination in the packet 11:53:58 <fonsinchen> also the cargopackets cannot go in circles as long as the routes are fairly stable. 11:55:46 <fonsinchen> I don't store the destinations in the packets, but the flow plans are set up in a way that there cannot be any circles. 11:57:28 <fonsinchen> My plan of action at the moment is 1. Support "no loading" and 2. Make linkgraph calculation time depend on the size of the component and the accuracy being requested. 11:57:54 <fonsinchen> With 2. I'll considerably shorten the delay between changes in the game and changes in the routing scheme. 11:58:11 <fonsinchen> However those things will keep me busy for some months. 11:58:37 <Eddi|zuHause> just get it to trunk by next christmas :) 11:59:17 <fonsinchen> I actually think the stuff in the stable branch is ready for trunk. 11:59:35 <fonsinchen> Those optimizations can also be implemented later on. 12:03:08 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:08:55 *** George [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 12:12:25 *** Scuddles [~notme@cm85.epsilon82.maxonline.com.sg] has joined #openttd 12:21:32 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-15-139.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 12:27:18 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-44-234.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:42:09 <Scuddles> http://i.imgur.com/bN9iw.png 12:42:35 <Eddi|zuHause> "honey, i shrinked the tender"? 12:42:48 <Scuddles> yis 12:43:19 <planetmaker> shrink shrank shrunk ;-) 12:44:25 <Eddi|zuHause> whatever :p 12:45:04 <Eddi|zuHause> leo also gives "shrunken" 12:45:18 <Pikka> adjective 12:45:41 <Eddi|zuHause> "to shrink | shrank/shrunk, shrunk/shrunken |" 12:45:41 *** Arafangion [~Arafangio@220-244-108-23.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #openttd 12:45:46 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-178-008-217-176.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:45:57 <Pikka> I guess 12:46:02 <Pikka> sounds odd to my dialect though 12:46:37 <Scuddles> these are going in pj1k pikka said so 12:46:52 <Pikka> so... 12:47:04 <Scuddles> there he said it 12:54:17 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-178-008-217-176.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 13:04:15 <Belugas> hello 13:10:32 <Scuddles> hi im scuddles and I have an unhealthy attraction to bubblecars, smoke deflectors, belpaire fireboxes, dual ended single unit locos and 0-8-0T european tank locos and mallets 13:13:46 *** Prof_Frink [~proffrink@02dc0652.bb.sky.com] has joined #openttd 13:16:44 <Belugas> good for you 13:17:31 <Eddi|zuHause> i offer these then: http://www.saechsische-schmalspurfahrzeuge.de/loks/ivk/ivk-132.jpg 13:22:20 <dihedral> hello 13:27:41 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:3caf:1614:5f76:1f4f] has joined #openttd 13:27:44 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 13:30:28 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 13:38:03 *** fonsinchen [~fonsinche@dslb-178-008-217-176.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:40:35 <Scuddles> Eddi|zuHause: That is pretty fancy 14:05:38 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:06:15 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.237] has joined #openttd 14:06:18 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 14:26:10 *** jazzyjaffa [~jazzyjaff@213.123.113.33] has joined #openttd 14:30:05 *** ffpp [~me@dslb-188-097-238-088.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 14:31:53 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-207.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 14:38:53 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:40:18 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 14:44:57 <NGC3982> cute photo. 14:48:35 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 14:53:46 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 14:59:51 <Pikka> cool, can't update UKRS2+ on bananas either. :) 15:01:44 <Scuddles> BONONOS 15:01:53 <Pikka> oui 15:02:18 <Scuddles> Pense à ranger tes tripes je passe dans ton dos mais je ne suis pas ta bonne 15:05:35 <planetmaker> na toll. und wenn jetzt jeder irgendwelchen Blödsinn in irgendeiner Sprach brabbelt können wir Babylon Konkurenz machen. 15:05:39 <planetmaker> Thus: English only 15:05:53 * Rhamphoryncus is playing UKRS2 right now :D 15:09:30 <Pikka> there's an update, but not a major one. 15:17:01 *** KouDy1 [~KouDy@115.133.15.195] has joined #openttd 15:18:19 <Scuddles> ukrs2 is so 2011 15:19:26 <Rhamphoryncus> It's 1834 here ;) 15:19:54 <Scuddles> wat 15:20:14 <Pikka> 1834 choo choos 15:20:18 <Pikka> I hope you have inflation turned off 15:20:26 <Scuddles> enjoy quadrapleheaded locos and such, har har 15:20:37 <Scuddles> and horses 15:21:25 <Rhamphoryncus> Yeah, I did remember this time 15:21:38 *** KouDy [~KouDy@167.40.49.60.kmr01-home.tm.net.my] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:21:48 <Rhamphoryncus> I'm pondering quadrupleheaded right now.. it would give me more throughput 15:21:58 <Scuddles> throughpoot 15:22:30 <Rhamphoryncus> My wee little pax line is very close to saturation. I'm having to tweak signal positions to avoid trains jamming on the hills 15:22:32 <Scuddles> enjoy 12kN cramptons D: 15:22:50 <Pikka> do you? 15:22:58 <Scuddles> that happens to me often, especially with breakdowns on and when they break down right before a gradient 15:23:28 <Rhamphoryncus> realistic acceleration has nasty worst-case behaviour there :/ 15:23:29 <Scuddles> never building on hills again expecting trains to clear it just because they have inertia 15:26:41 * Rhamphoryncus builds a 4 consist train just to see how it performs.. and on a fluke perfectly fits the stations he's built 15:26:57 <Rhamphoryncus> oh, fits *one* of the stations, heh 15:30:08 * Rhamphoryncus watches it laugh at a puny hill 15:30:26 <Rhamphoryncus> Once again proving: BIGGER. IS. BETTER. 15:32:25 <MNIM> heh. only built one quadrupelheaded once. was 28 long and it had its' own special line. 15:32:26 <Pikka> or at least that more powerful is more powerful 15:33:17 <Pikka> MNIM: probably wasn't quadruple headed http://users.tt-forums.net/pikka/wiki/index.php?title=2-2-0_Planet though, was it? 15:34:24 <MNIM> yeah, it was. carried a freight train full of wood. 15:34:42 <Pikka> oh :) and 28 long? 15:34:46 <Rhamphoryncus> Pikka: power to weight is the same. I'm literally just gluing 4 trains together. The advantage is it averages across hills 15:34:52 <Pikka> I see 15:34:57 <MNIM> yeah. why, too many locs? 15:35:09 <Rhamphoryncus> Rather than 1 in 2 tiles being a hill it's 2 in 8 tiles 15:35:20 <Pikka> well, I initially thought you meant a 28 tile long train 15:35:34 <Pikka> which would be a bit much for 4 planets. 15:35:36 <MNIM> yeah, that's what a meant, 28 tiles 15:36:49 <Eddi|zuHause> was that before openttd's acceleration model got tweaked? 15:37:28 <Pikka> flatland and original acceleration? :) 15:38:35 <Pikka> any road up 15:38:38 * Pikka should to bed 15:38:40 <MNIM> no, realistic accelleration and four centennials from the 2cc. 15:38:44 <Pikka> oh 15:39:00 <Pikka> well it wasn't quadruple headed planets then. :) 15:39:05 <Pikka> which is what I said. 15:39:12 <Pikka> goodnight gentlemens. 15:39:20 <MNIM> planets? 0-o 15:39:45 <Pikka> "probably wasn't quadruple headed http://users.tt-forums.net/pikka/wiki/index.php?title=2-2-0_Planet though, was it?" 15:39:46 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess MNIM completely ignored the link 15:39:48 <Pikka> link? 15:40:03 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4d086091.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:40:05 <MNIM> oooh. I thought you meant locs 15:40:25 <MNIM> yeah, no ancient steam locs. :P 15:40:42 *** Pikka [~chatzilla@d58-111-74-170.rdl800.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.1 [Firefox 10.0.2/20120215223356]] 15:41:38 <Eddi|zuHause> who built 1A locomotives? around here, early locomotives were either 1A1 or B 15:42:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 15:47:33 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 15:50:42 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.185.115] has joined #openttd 15:51:35 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 15:53:11 *** Twofish [~Twofish@77-95-76-210.bb.cust.hknett.no] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:53:37 <Rubidium> lovely... pikka's gone again... why does he always leave before I return from work ;) 15:53:49 <Eddi|zuHause> i blame timezones :p 15:54:22 <Eddi|zuHause> i never remember: does summertime make the difference bigger or smaller? 15:54:40 <Rubidium> it increases for us w.r.t. UTC 15:54:53 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker had a *wrong language* mode 15:55:00 <Eddi|zuHause> in the forum 15:55:23 <Rubidium> but then for them it'd decrease w.r.t UTC as they goto winter time 15:55:35 <Rubidium> so the difference should decrease 15:55:55 <Scuddles> such is how a pikkaman works 15:56:13 <andythenorth> pikka pikka boo 15:56:36 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth spent too much time around kids lately 15:56:36 <Scuddles> once in a while he stays up until later than this though, if you come around at here often enough you'll probably see him one day 15:56:42 <Rubidium> then pikkaman shouldn't complain that he can't upload UKRS to bananas yet ;) 15:56:57 <Scuddles> such is life in the pikkazone 16:00:01 <planetmaker> Eddi|zuHause, it was a deliberate mode switch 16:05:12 <ffpp> hi, the templatebased train replacement patch is up in a first version 16:05:30 <Eddi|zuHause> planetmaker: this one? http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=29&t=58906&p=1001471#p1001471 16:05:35 <ffpp> I dug up the old thread about it and realized that I actually forgot about some suggestions made there :> 16:07:03 *** George|2 [~George@212.113.107.39] has joined #openttd 16:07:03 *** George is now known as Guest6481 16:07:03 *** George|2 is now known as George 16:07:11 <planetmaker> oh, indeed not, Eddi|zuHause . Thx 16:09:30 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: a rule for remembering it: both in the spring and autumn, the clocks are adjusted toward the summer. 16:10:01 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: that was not what i meant 16:12:02 <__ln__> i see 16:12:23 *** Guest6481 [~George@212.113.107.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:15:41 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.169.95] has joined #openttd 16:18:54 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 16:20:13 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-20-14.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 16:20:17 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 16:21:13 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@88.130.185.115] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:23:41 *** _maddy [~plaiho@182.21.240.77.static.louhi.net] has joined #openttd 16:25:43 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-15-139.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:38:30 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A26A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 16:39:39 *** ffpp [~me@dslb-188-097-238-088.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:41:32 <Eddi|zuHause> soo... anybody "excited" about the presidential election? 16:42:05 <glx> which one ? 16:42:25 <Eddi|zuHause> pick one :) 16:42:48 <Eddi|zuHause> germany pseudo-elects theirs on sunday 16:43:27 <glx> the campaign for ours starts on monday 16:43:32 <Eddi|zuHause> just more than a thousand people eligible to vote 16:43:41 <Eddi|zuHause> and the winner is already predetermined 16:44:51 <Eddi|zuHause> glx: is that the one where the major european leaders have decided to boycott the opposition candidate? 16:45:08 <glx> yup 16:45:42 <glx> but recently the other one said something with similar effects :) 16:48:40 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 16:52:49 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has joined #openttd 16:54:58 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 17:02:36 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-79-226.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 17:07:58 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-20-14.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:10:29 *** lmergen [~lmergen@5352EA70.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 17:23:50 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 17:27:10 <andythenorth> projectile sick 17:32:35 *** lmergen [~lmergen@5352EA70.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:38:03 <__ln__> would someone be very upset if shift+mousewheel panned the map, without enabling any settings first? 17:38:47 <Zuu> do you mean shift + third button or shift + scrolling? 17:40:02 <__ln__> shift + scrolling 17:40:37 <Zuu> To move north/south by spinning the wheel? 17:41:18 *** _maddy [~plaiho@182.21.240.77.static.louhi.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 17:41:24 <Zuu> That wouldn't upset me as I usually play OpenTTD with a device that doesn't have a scroll wheel. :-) 17:41:26 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has joined #openttd 17:41:44 <__ln__> and east/west by scrolling horizontally 17:42:28 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: better to figure out how to specify that in hotkeys.cfg 17:42:54 <Zuu> Reminds me of my patch to allow zooming in out by holding the middle mouse button and moving the mouse. 17:43:18 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: are you saying the user should manually edit a config file in order to pan the map? 17:43:32 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: no 17:46:54 <Zuu> For new users the default hotkey.cfg settings could have it enabled. 17:55:58 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:58:39 <__ln__> and for old users not? 17:58:51 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: i mean figure out how to query mouse actions as "key", and then allow the user to decide whether he wants to pan the map with scrollwheel, 5-finger-movement, asdw or whatever 17:59:31 <Eddi|zuHause> what to use as default, and how to achieve gui-modification of hotkeys is then a separate discussion 18:00:52 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@193.52.24.37] has joined #openttd 18:03:21 <__ln__> i can't say that's a bad idea, but adding the one extra layer of abstraction for a feature that nobody actively wants probably means nobody will implement it that way. 18:03:22 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-207.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 18:18:06 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d99-199-11-52.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 18:20:10 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-158-149-6.range86-158.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:32:48 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host242-239-dynamic.16-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 18:35:29 <Wolf01> hello 18:38:47 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 18:38:50 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 18:39:21 <Alberth> moin 18:39:52 *** Ricaz [~Ricaz@nobelnet.dk] has joined #openttd 18:40:14 <Ricaz> If coal and a power station can reach eachother, then what? 18:40:46 <Ricaz> how do you transport the coal to the powerstation? 18:41:05 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:41:38 <Alberth> build a station out of reach of the power station 18:42:08 <Alberth> however, you won't make much money, so probably not worth the trouble 18:43:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r24032 /trunk/src/lang/ (4 files in 2 dirs): 18:43:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 18:43:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frisian - 13 changes by Fopper 18:43:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: korean - 1 changes by junho2813 18:43:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: norwegian_nynorsk - 1 changes by mantaray 18:43:59 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: welsh - 15 changes by kazzie 18:44:21 *** TheMask96 [martijn@polaris.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 18:53:53 <Terkhen> hello 19:02:19 *** pjpe [ade6a119@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 19:04:27 <Rhamphoryncus> Ricaz: distances are based on the stations, not the industries 19:05:14 <Ricaz> Ah, you make more money depending on the distance? 19:05:38 <Belugas> the bigger the distance. the more money indeed 19:05:49 <Belugas> up to a certain point 19:05:52 <Belugas> of course 19:06:03 <Rhamphoryncus> It's linear to distance (twice as far gets twice as much), but is reduced by time spent in a more complicated way 19:06:04 <Belugas> speed of delivery is also to be considered 19:08:37 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:08:49 *** JVassie [~James@2.27.104.165] has joined #openttd 19:10:17 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6495 19:10:17 *** Guest6495 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:10:17 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:12:32 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:13:58 * andythenorth ponders pondering 19:14:30 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-207.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 19:15:07 * andythenorth ponders the sad death of 8bpp :( 19:16:05 <Rhamphoryncus> sad? 19:17:04 <V453000> death? 19:17:33 <andythenorth> perhaps reports of its death are exagerated 19:18:02 <V453000> the artists who like pixel art will probably not abandon the "limited" palette so quickly 19:18:20 *** smoovi [~smoovi@e178198239.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 19:18:27 <V453000> at least for me the point of pixel art is to do wonders with limited possibilities as resolution and colour depth 19:18:59 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6497 19:18:59 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 19:19:25 <Rhamphoryncus> Yeah, you can do wonders, but I've also come to realize that most of my complaints about graphics can be traced to the 8bit palette 19:19:29 *** Guest6497 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:19:33 <Alberth> if you do anything tron-like, you don't even need the full 8bpp :) 19:19:47 <andythenorth> yeah, but 32bpp will become de-facto, because it's more realistic 19:20:02 *** welshdragon [~mark-oftc@welshdragon.zernebok.net] has quit [Killed (NickServ (Too many failed password attempts.))] 19:20:03 <andythenorth> and many of our so-called artists seem to value realism 19:20:10 *** welshdragon [~mark-oftc@welshdragon.zernebok.net] has joined #openttd 19:20:13 <andythenorth> perhaps they have not had magritte 101 19:20:17 <V453000> their problem tbh 19:20:40 <Alberth> andythenorth: but can you make nice pixel art other than by rendering for 32bpp? 19:21:07 <andythenorth> voxels! 19:21:10 <V453000> :D 19:21:13 <Rhamphoryncus> ooh voxels 19:21:16 <andythenorth> qubicals! 19:21:19 <andythenorth> blearch 19:21:35 <Alberth> I have voxels too, but they are invisible :p 19:21:43 <andythenorth> toys look better with limited palettes 19:21:45 <Alberth> and quite big :) 19:22:47 <V453000> im staying with the true pixel art. Definitely not drawing in higher resolutions, neither with more colours 19:24:19 <Alberth> V453000: many people will play the game in higher resolution, I suspect, to compensate for the high resolution of their monitor 19:24:34 <andythenorth> how many colours are needed anyway? http://www.bricklink.com/catalogColors.asp 19:24:44 <V453000> they can, not my problem :) 19:27:01 <andythenorth> also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Treachery_of_Images 19:28:02 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 19:31:16 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 19:39:45 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@79-68-107-37.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 19:40:16 *** __mj [~me@dslb-188-107-130-111.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 19:40:20 *** __mj is now known as ffpp 19:41:34 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-087-064.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 19:43:02 *** AD [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 19:44:09 <andythenorth> roadtypes! 19:44:14 <andythenorth> multi-stop docks! 19:45:54 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.78.224] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:46:14 <Wolf01> does anybody of you have a buffalo nas and knows how to tweak the httpd.conf to add some aliases and activate at least the rewrite module? 19:48:48 *** AD [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has joined #openttd 19:49:26 *** AD is now known as Guest6499 19:55:24 *** kkb110 [~kkb110@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-02.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 19:56:52 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:58:10 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6501 19:58:10 *** Guest6501 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:58:11 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:01:24 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fc0f0.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 20:01:42 <Alberth> quak 20:02:09 <frosch123> hai albert :) 20:04:08 <Wolf01> hi frosch 20:05:30 <frosch123> Ciao Wolf :) 20:09:37 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6503 20:09:37 *** Guest6503 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:09:38 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:11:18 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6504 20:11:18 *** Guest6504 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:11:19 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:19:36 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6506 20:19:36 *** Guest6506 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:19:36 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:21:10 *** ffpp [~me@dslb-188-107-130-111.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: ffpp] 20:21:32 *** KritiK [~Maxim@95-24-170-139.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 20:22:09 *** cypher [~Miranda@ip-86-49-67-207.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 20:31:09 *** peteris [~peteris@78.84.97.170] has joined #openttd 20:34:46 <andythenorth> bibble bobble 20:34:48 <andythenorth> and booble 20:34:58 <andythenorth> is it April 1st yet? 20:35:27 <Alberth> almost 20:39:46 *** thgergo [~thiering@2E6B2A8B.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #openttd 20:39:50 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-20-91.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 20:44:42 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6510 20:44:42 *** Guest6510 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:44:42 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 20:44:55 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-108-82.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:46:17 <rane> what's a good resource if i want to learn to build a mainline that has 2 railroads to both directions 20:46:59 <rane> i'm sure you have to account for balancing them somehow 20:47:34 <TWerkhoven2[l]> wiki.openttdcoo.org 20:47:43 <TWerkhoven2[l]> mind they play without breakdowns enabled 20:47:48 <rane> disabled 20:47:50 <rane> oh 20:47:53 <rane> yeah 20:47:54 <rane> i know that 20:48:01 *** thgergo [~thiering@2E6B2A8B.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 20:48:01 <TWerkhoven2[l]> duh, yes 20:48:03 <rane> i got some convincing arguments why breakdowns disabled makes sense 20:48:28 *** th_gergo [~thiering@2E6B2A8B.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #openttd 20:58:59 *** Scuddles [~notme@cm85.epsilon82.maxonline.com.sg] has quit [] 20:59:33 <Eddi|zuHause> breakdowsns are probably an even more broken feature than inflation 21:00:06 <andythenorth> broken breakdowns :o 21:00:24 <Eddi|zuHause> exactly :) 21:01:06 <andythenorth> what will you fix about them? 21:01:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i won't fix breakdowns 21:01:49 <rane> not all broken features can be fixed without removing them 21:01:54 <Rubidium> pff... breakdowns aren't broken 21:02:28 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: have you heard a horse break down yet? :p 21:02:45 <Rubidium> spontanious combustion 21:03:41 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6512 21:03:41 *** Guest6512 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:03:41 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:06:26 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6513 21:06:26 *** Guest6513 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:06:26 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:06:46 <Alberth> Eddi|zuHause: the newgrf author inventing horses should have realized the problem, and fix it by means of a newgrf spec change 21:06:50 <Eddi|zuHause> the most broken parts about breakdowns include: a breakdown is guaranteed to occur within 256 days, there is no way to reduce that. a breakdown will always cause a full stop, even for multiheaded trains. there is no way to design your network so broken down vehicles are avoided by using parallel tracks 21:08:09 <andythenorth> did you mention RVs yet? 21:08:32 <andythenorth> articulated ones (for all the known reasons) won't go round a break down 21:08:41 <andythenorth> also...broken down ships should....drift 21:08:45 <andythenorth> off course 21:08:47 <andythenorth> randomly 21:09:10 <Eddi|zuHause> and hit the cliffs? :p 21:10:04 <andythenorth> maybe 21:11:19 <SpComb> does anyone actually play with breakdowns and anything other than point-to-point tracks? 21:11:33 <Rhamphoryncus> wait, 256 days is the cap?! 21:11:56 <Eddi|zuHause> Rhamphoryncus: pretty sure 21:12:01 * andythenorth plays with breakdowns 21:12:05 <Rhamphoryncus> SpComb: nobody does because they suck 21:12:14 <Rhamphoryncus> andythenorth: you are nobody :P 21:13:01 <Rhamphoryncus> Would it be hard to make the pathfinder severely penalize broken down trains? That should be enough to make other trains go around 21:13:11 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:13:18 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:14:32 * Alberth plays with breakdowns too 21:14:35 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: vehicles need to be inspected, by law, every 256 days. A breakdown in a multiheaded vehicle is always an event that is significant enough to stop the train, e.g. a broken air hose or so 21:14:56 <rane> what's this called? http://cl.ly/3F3w121F1r0z2V3c070i 21:14:59 <Rubidium> if it wasn't significant enough it would just continue and you wouldn't notice it was broken 21:15:21 <peter1138> :) 21:15:23 <Rubidium> and even in the real world a broken train disrupts the stream of traffic significantly 21:16:04 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: but still, the other trains could be rerouted 21:16:15 <Alberth> Rhamphoryncus: the path finder does try to avoid other trains by default 21:16:17 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: maaaagic 21:16:43 <rane> openttdcoop network stuff is daunting :| 21:16:44 <Rhamphoryncus> Alberth: it avoids trains in general. Does it especially avoid broken trains? 21:16:58 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: and the point is, the breakdown is guaranteed every 256 ticks _even though_ you regularly service it. you could check every week, but you still get that guaranteed breakdown 21:17:07 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: that's actually a "prio" or priority merge 21:17:08 <Alberth> Rhamphoryncus: not that I am aware of 21:17:20 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: so servicing has hardly any effect 21:17:30 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: really every 256 ticks? 21:17:38 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: and track layout has hardly any effect either 21:17:42 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: i meant days 21:18:10 <Alberth> rane: yes, they are insane in a good way 21:18:25 <rane> it's also depressing me 21:18:27 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: The coal train is coming through an entry pre-signal. That requires the block following to be empty and an exit or combo pre-signal in that block to be green 21:18:38 <Eddi|zuHause> i can't play coop-style 21:18:53 <Eddi|zuHause> i mean: i don't want to. 21:18:54 <Rubidium> then I declare it a law to test the emergency brakes every 256 days ;) 21:19:23 <Alberth> rane: why? developing your own style is so much more fun than copying one 21:19:44 <rane> yeah, i agree 21:20:22 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6514 21:20:22 *** Guest6514 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:20:22 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:20:25 <rane> Rhamphoryncus: i think i would have to see that in action to understand how it works 21:20:47 <Alberth> rane: you can also download the games they play 21:21:11 <frosch123> lol, the template replacement guy started all his files with aaa_ :o 21:21:14 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: the real trick is that if there are no exit or combo signals from a certain direction (not merely red but actually not present) then it behaves like an ordinary block signal 21:21:42 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: noticed that as well, but didn't really care enough to say anything :p 21:22:07 <frosch123> probably a vim user considering how messed up the whitespace is 21:22:10 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: so a train coming from the bridge merely has 3 block signals. They look like presignals but they're not. 21:22:16 <Rubidium> Eddi|zuHause: what ensures the 256 days? 21:23:05 <rane> Rhamphoryncus: trains coming from which direction in that image have the priority? 21:23:05 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:23:11 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: the bridge 21:23:19 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:23:29 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: afair there's a "breakdown counter", that gets initialized by a reliability table, reduced by 1 every day, randomly by 20, and breaks down when it hits 0 21:24:30 <Rhamphoryncus> How does the percentage factor in? 21:25:11 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@free.blinkenshell.org] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 0.3.6] 21:27:25 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@free.blinkenshell.org] has joined #openttd 21:28:21 <rane> Rhamphoryncus: thanks, i somewhat understand the concept better from these examples, http://wiki.openttdcoop.org/Priority 21:28:36 <rane> might've missed some important signals from the previous image 21:29:11 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6515 21:29:11 *** Guest6515 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:29:11 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:31:22 <michi_cc> Rubidium: Breakdown frequency is listed in http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=937910#p937910 and http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=933954#p933954 21:31:45 <michi_cc> Most important quote: "Servicing resets a vehicle's internal reliability score to the maximum, *but does not adjust the breakdown number*. This explains how vehicles can still break down just as they come out of the depot after being serviced." 21:34:06 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest6516 21:34:06 *** Guest6516 [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:34:06 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:34:39 *** root__ [root@bodum.pl] has joined #openttd 21:34:42 *** root__ is now known as TaKeN 21:34:45 <TaKeN> Hello 21:34:50 <Alberth> hi root 21:34:53 <andythenorth> breakdown behaviour is tedious 21:35:01 <andythenorth> I don't like turning breakdowns off 21:35:13 <andythenorth> the game needs stuff like that 21:35:29 <andythenorth> but the 'leave depot, breakdown' behaviour sucks :P 21:35:39 <andythenorth> as does the frequent inability of vehicles to route to depots 21:35:51 <TaKeN> there is any option to generate statistic of my servers ? i see on http://www.openttd.org/en/servers how many ppl is on and how many companies but i want statistic when is more ppl and when is less.. there is any option ? 21:36:25 <Yexo> you'll have to generate that yourself 21:36:29 <TaKeN> because i restart my servers every 6, 10, 18, 22 and now i create a new one 21:36:37 <Yexo> tools that might help you is a library to connect to the admin port to query the current status 21:36:39 <TaKeN> Yexo: aha :( so You don`t have stats for Yourself ? 21:36:49 <Yexo> I don't have a server 21:36:52 <Yexo> so no stats either :p 21:36:56 <TaKeN> but for servers oin webpage 21:37:02 <TaKeN> all servers i mean ;) 21:37:04 <rane> breakdowns should be a mechanic that can be dealt with by playing smart, or something presents a trade off for the player where they get penalized with breakdowns if they take shortcut, something like that. i don't like randomness. 21:37:12 <Yexo> ah, not sure 21:37:15 <Yexo> don't think so 21:37:15 <TaKeN> You don`t have stats all servers from http://www.openttd.org/en/servers 21:37:45 <Rubidium> there's no history of those numbers 21:38:00 <Alberth> rane: it does by making you pay heavily if you don't take care of reliability of your vehicles 21:38:14 <Rhamphoryncus> Breakdowns don't add any nuance to gameplay. You get that annoying noise, everything stops for a bit. 21:38:42 <Alberth> my trains are spaced out enough not to cause much trouble 21:38:44 <andythenorth> it makes you consider depot placement, which can be interestingly hard in some places 21:38:55 <Rhamphoryncus> If you have a hill and don't power your train enough to go from a standing start then everything stops for a long time. 21:38:57 <andythenorth> and at the start of a game, breakdowns can be a company killer 21:40:18 <Alberth> Rhamphoryncus: sure, so make sure you have a sane train setup :p 21:40:33 <Alberth> like having less wagons :) 21:40:34 <SpComb> collectd-openttd 21:40:40 <SpComb> quick, someone write a plugin 21:41:07 <Alberth> SpComb it's called an AI, I think 21:41:22 <SpComb> no, a collectd plugin to read from openttd admin port 21:41:41 *** Guest6499 [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:42:03 <rane> can you avoid breakdowns by having multiple maintain orders, depending on length of the route? that might be interesting to manage, or maybe too much overhead 21:42:05 <Eddi|zuHause> that reminds me, i wanted to factor the reliability into the maintenance costs 21:42:15 <Rhamphoryncus> Alberth: which means I can't have both normal trains and mountain trains. The mountain trains aren't designed for better *speed* in the presence of hills. They have to be designed not to stop *at all*. I end up so overpowering that everything ignores hills. 21:42:30 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause pikka fakes that by using age as a proxy I think 21:43:13 <Eddi|zuHause> not age, reliability. so you'll have an incentive to service while breakdowns are off 21:43:57 <TaKeN> Yexo: what tools can check every 1 hour stats from all my 3 servers and put on www or something like this ? 21:44:21 <Yexo> TaKeN: there is no tool for that 21:44:21 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:44:25 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 21:44:58 <Alberth> TaKeN: all general purpose programming languages, but you have to tell them how 21:45:10 <Rhamphoryncus> rane: Nope, sufficient maintenance will not avoid breakdowns. At a certain point it has no more effect. 21:46:14 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.jkit.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:46:51 *** AD [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has joined #openttd 21:47:03 <TaKeN> oks 21:47:06 <TaKeN> thanks guys 21:47:14 <TaKeN> take care 21:47:16 <TaKeN> cya around 21:47:23 *** TaKeN [root@bodum.pl] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:47:26 *** AD is now known as Guest6518 21:47:45 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host86-158-149-6.range86-158.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.1 [Firefox 11.0/20120310173008]] 21:48:12 <rane> are there hotkeys for choosing signal type? other than ctrl-click 21:48:36 *** lmergen [~lmergen@5352EA70.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 21:48:41 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: you could also adjust speed and power in line with reliability :P 21:49:40 <Pulec> 3 hours of plain, two players 21:49:45 <Pulec> http://zoom.it/9WBB 21:50:14 <Pulec> had the idea of building from one corner and transport everything that could be transported, than move on 21:54:53 <andythenorth> good night 21:54:53 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc23-aztw25-2-0-cust33.aztw.cable.virginmedia.com] has left #openttd [] 21:57:15 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.jkit.nl] has joined #openttd 22:05:34 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@95.76.26.172] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 22:09:14 *** Guest6518 [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:15:10 *** AD_ [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has joined #openttd 22:15:38 *** lmergen [~lmergen@5352EA70.cm-6-3d.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:19:10 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 22:30:51 <Rhamphoryncus> Woops. Arable farms are, apparently, not great sources of plant fibres. 22:33:56 <FLHerne> FIRS has too many kinds of farm 22:35:59 *** AD_ [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:36:02 <Eddi|zuHause> Economies! 22:36:20 *** AD_ [wilberforc@drinks.mountaindew.org] has joined #openttd 22:38:20 <FLHerne> Yes... I only have rail services to about 40 of the things :P 22:47:04 <Eddi|zuHause> not what i meant 22:48:03 <Rhamphoryncus> FIRS will ultimately let you select which set of industries is active 22:48:11 <FLHerne> Ah, that 22:51:32 <Rhamphoryncus> Ahh, tricky. First autorefit fails and you don't get the cargo.. because the industry isn't delivering it yet. 22:54:02 <michi_cc> If you rely extensively on autorefit, you might want to disable the "deliver only on demand" setting. 22:55:24 <Rhamphoryncus> It should be fine. Just surprising. 22:55:32 *** xiong [~xiong@76-218-102-28.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 23:03:44 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1A26A.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:05:07 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Popidopidopido] 23:07:23 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe autorefit should create "demand" for all eligible cargos 23:09:08 <frosch123> that would rather break stuff 23:09:16 <Eddi|zuHause> how? 23:09:20 <frosch123> it should be possible to enable demand via the station gui 23:09:35 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: it would effectively call demand on everything 23:09:48 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: only if the current order has autorefit 23:09:53 <frosch123> even if you do not want to transport the stuff 23:10:01 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: for all "normal" orders it'll be fine 23:10:49 <frosch123> anyway, night :) 23:10:53 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-590fc0f0.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:13:54 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.jkit.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:14:16 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.jkit.nl] has joined #openttd 23:16:23 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.jkit.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:18:33 *** Cybertinus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.jkit.nl] has joined #openttd 23:19:26 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has joined #openttd 23:20:19 *** mahmoud [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-11-241.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 23:25:43 *** DOUK [~KEM@ALyon-158-1-20-91.w90-29.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:26:40 *** Devroush [~dennis@178-119-153-135.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 23:31:56 <Ricaz> I'm trying to figure out signals. 23:31:58 <Ricaz> http://rcz.dk/files/openttd.png 23:32:04 <Ricaz> This is a station I have built to test 23:32:15 <Ricaz> But I'm unsure what signals to use where 23:33:30 <Eddi|zuHause> put a path signal behind the platform (from train's direction) 23:33:45 *** brambles [brambles@79.133.200.49] has joined #openttd 23:34:07 <Ricaz> Hm? Let's start by the lower side 23:34:20 <Ricaz> trains only run on the right track of the line 23:35:33 <Eddi|zuHause> let's go along the inner track. you have lots of basic block signals along the track, that's alright 23:35:49 <Eddi|zuHause> then you have a one-way path signal at the end of the track (with the red bar) 23:35:57 <Eddi|zuHause> then the junction 23:35:59 <michi_cc> Ricaz: Enable "show reserved tracks" if you haven't yet. Helps for such stuff. 23:36:02 <Eddi|zuHause> then the platform 23:36:07 <Eddi|zuHause> then another junction 23:36:12 <Ricaz> how michi_cc? 23:36:20 <Eddi|zuHause> and get back to the inner track with the block signals 23:36:34 <michi_cc> Somewhere under Interface in the advanced settings. 23:36:37 <Ricaz> well 23:36:52 <Ricaz> the first 1W path signal is good? 23:36:58 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 23:37:10 <Eddi|zuHause> now add 2-way pathsignals to each platform 23:37:10 <Ricaz> then I need more path signals after that one? 23:37:18 <Eddi|zuHause> so that the train can see them from inside the station 23:37:40 <Ricaz> oh so they need to face the opposite way 23:37:50 <Ricaz> of the 1W one 23:37:53 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 23:37:55 <Ricaz> okay 23:38:38 <Ricaz> and then? 23:39:05 <Eddi|zuHause> then you're basically done 23:39:23 <Eddi|zuHause> replicate that same setup for the outer track in the other direction 23:39:36 <Ricaz> well if 6 trains come from that direction, will they properly slide into the station? 23:39:45 <Ricaz> or do I need more paths? 23:40:05 *** supermop [~daniel_er@cpe-67-250-2-219.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 23:40:43 <Eddi|zuHause> just let them drive for a while, you'll learn to see the bottlenecks :) 23:42:25 <Ricaz> well this is one big bottleneck now lol 23:44:15 *** jazzyjaffa [~jazzyjaff@213.123.113.33] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:44:18 *** th_gergo [~thiering@2E6B2A8B.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:44:36 <Ricaz> now this happens: 23:44:37 <Ricaz> http://rcz.dk/files/openttd2.png 23:44:37 *** jazzyjaffa [~jazzyjaff@94-193-52-238.zone7.bethere.co.uk] has joined #openttd 23:45:07 <Yexo> the signals facing the station have to be right next to each platform 23:45:42 <Yexo> <michi_cc> Ricaz: Enable "show reserved tracks" if you haven't yet. Helps for such stuff. <_ this helps to spot why 23:46:06 <Ricaz> I just did enable that, no difference :s 23:46:22 <Yexo> where do you expect the stopped train to go to? 23:46:41 <Ricaz> I want it to go to a free slot 23:46:54 <Ricaz> So I just need 12 path signals at eash side? :o 23:47:04 <Yexo> no, 6 at each side 23:47:17 <michi_cc> Ricaz: You can actually see the path on the exit of track A. I think with the TTD graphics that is easier to see. 23:48:30 <Ricaz> ah they darken 23:48:52 <Ricaz> Thanks, that helped a lot :D 23:49:38 * FLHerne tries to merge lots of patches 23:50:19 <FLHerne> Does anyone have an estimate on how long OTTD should take to compile? I need to sleep sometime :-( 23:50:25 <Yexo> Ricaz: http://devs.openttd.org/~yexo/screenshot.png 23:50:59 <Ricaz> thanks Yexo, that is almost what I have now 23:50:59 <Yexo> FLHerne: depends a lot on your computer, but not very long 23:51:39 <FLHerne> That was a completely pointless question, wasn't it? 8-) 23:51:57 <Yexo> well, yes :) 23:52:12 <Yexo> it takes 1m11s for me after a make clean 23:52:26 <FLHerne> Given I've had 40 mins to 8 hours, I really should know better... 23:53:03 <FLHerne> I've got one attempt compiling on each core to see what errors I get :P 23:54:16 <Ricaz> How come I can't choose a road layout and Large size for the town I'm about to found? 23:55:17 <Yexo> not sure about the road layout 23:55:30 <Yexo> town sizes are only available in the scenario editor, when founding a town in game it's always "small" 23:55:47 <Ricaz> Well, I can choose small, medium and random 23:55:47 * FLHerne still can't get Cargodist and More Heightlevels to coexist :-( 23:55:59 <Ricaz> for the roads I can change it in the advanced settings 23:56:14 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has left #openttd [] 23:57:21 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 23:58:38 <Ricaz> Is there a way to force a town to expand? 23:58:52 *** Devroush [~dennis@178-119-153-135.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 23:59:51 <FLHerne> In recent trunk, should there be a gap between 'Abandon Game' and 'Exit' in the save menu?