Log for #openttd on 24th March 2013:
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07:17:47  <V453000> :D the new folder for screenshots confused the hell out of me :D
07:17:51  <V453000> good idea though
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07:23:10  <V453000> the prophet of doom is back!
07:23:25  <V453000> so what is dying today andythenorth? :P
07:23:47  <andythenorth> NUTS
07:29:40  <V453000> OH
07:29:49  <V453000> actually, no NUTS release for the longest time so far :P
07:29:54  <V453000> SOOOO
07:30:26  <andythenorth> @seen pikka
07:30:26  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 2 days, 22 hours, 47 minutes, and 38 seconds ago: <Pikka> I do not want to watch a half-hour video for the one little piece of information I need and which probably isn't in there anyway
07:30:36  <V453000> not like I am adding about 3000 sprites, no :D
07:30:39  <V453000> :P
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08:01:23  <V453000> hm, how would I code something like ... "have every odd wagon get sprite A, have every even wagon get sprite B"
08:03:09  <V453000> ah, might not need that :D solved
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08:42:24  <Zuu> @ports
08:42:24  <DorpsGek> Zuu: OpenTTD uses TCP and UDP port 3979 for server <-> client communication, UDP port 3978 for masterserver (advertise) communication (outbound), and TCP port 3978 for content service, a.k.a. BaNaNaS (outbound)
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09:14:36  <Alberth> hi hi
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09:34:50  <Terkhen> good morning
09:41:11  <Alberth> moin Terkhen
09:43:25  <Zuu> Hello
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10:22:49  <LordAro> moin all
10:23:25  <andythenorth> o/
10:27:00  <LordAro> hi andy
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10:32:36  <LordAro> it's _still_ snowing... :L
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10:35:02  <andythenorth> no snow here
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10:36:00  <LordAro> not all that much on the ground here (~3 inches) but it hasn't stopped falling for the last 24 hours...
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10:43:10  <Alberth> o/
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10:44:56  <Zuu> We were supposed to get a "snow storm" last monday/thusday but only ended up geting a decimeter of snow. :-p
10:46:56  <LordAro> a 'decimeter' is quite a lot round here :P
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11:05:04  <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25117 trunk/src/game/game_text.cpp (2013-03-24 11:04:58 UTC)
11:05:05  <DorpsGek> -Fix [FS#5511]: Silence warning.
11:20:43  <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25118 trunk/src/gfx.cpp (2013-03-24 11:20:37 UTC)
11:20:44  <DorpsGek> -Codechange: Deduplicate basic line clipping code. (fonsinchen)
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11:25:54  * andythenorth ponders extending CHIPS
11:27:58  * frosch123 ponders ranting about editors doing automatic linewrapping
11:29:55  <peter1139> hmm, decimeter isn't commonly used
11:31:07  <frosch123> i believe it's more common than decameter though :p
11:31:33  <Eddi|zuHause> is that deca or deka?
11:31:45  <frosch123> hmm, good question
11:32:16  <frosch123> oh... the engish si prefix page does not list it :o
11:32:21  <frosch123> only hecto
11:32:35  <frosch123> ah, it's only missing at the top
11:32:38  <frosch123> it's "deca"
11:33:35  <frosch123> but, yeah, the prefix "da" is fairly unknown :)
11:34:39  <frosch123> oh, i did not know that the prefixes were added over time
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11:36:29  <LordAro> frosch123: linewrapping: indeed :)
11:36:55  <Zuu> In the land where we got a named unit for 10 km, decimeter is also quite commonly used. :-)
11:37:03  <LordAro> ^ i blame nano for that one :L
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11:37:15  <Zuu> Especially when talking about amount of snow
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11:38:37  <frosch123> oh, you got zephyris on the project :)
11:39:01  <frosch123> aw, and you have more followers on twitter than ottd :p
11:39:34  <Eddi|zuHause> there is a twitter account?
11:39:45  <frosch123> though the ratio tweets/followers is about equal
11:39:51  <frosch123>
11:39:56  <frosch123>
11:40:20  <Eddi|zuHause> actually, i'm not even remotely interested :p
11:40:50  <frosch123> social media is important!
11:40:58  <tycoondemon> egos are too
11:41:12  <frosch123> yup :)
11:41:30  <frosch123> whole websites are based on that
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11:42:25  <andythenorth> twitter is just news
11:42:33  <LordAro> Zephyris has, yet again, drawn huge amounts of excellent graphics
11:42:35  * andythenorth goes back to python
11:43:19  * LordAro will be back shortly, assuming he doesn't screw his system up in the process
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11:52:11  <andythenorth> if I have a docs folder where some files are generated, and some are static
11:52:35  <andythenorth> should I move the static ones into docs_src, then have the compiler mv them at compile time?
11:52:48  <andythenorth> otherwise it's confusing which files in docs are editable and which are generated :P
11:54:42  <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25119 trunk/src/gfx.cpp (2013-03-24 11:54:37 UTC)
11:54:43  <DorpsGek> -Codechange [FS#5512]: Improve the clipping/visiblity check before sending lines to blitter for drawing. (fonsinchen)
11:54:44  <Alberth> package them at a completely separate place?
11:55:12  <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: that would be silly from a user's point of view
11:55:30  <Eddi|zuHause> Alberth: why would a user search in two different places for documentation?
11:56:05  <Alberth> I mean to build a complete distribution in a separate directory
11:56:24  <andythenorth> I keep editing the wrong file :P
11:56:25  <Alberth> ie copy or build everything intended to distribute into that directory
11:56:33  <andythenorth> ok
11:56:38  <Alberth> andythenorth: remove all but one :)
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12:06:31  <LordAro> excellent, that worked
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12:18:28  * andythenorth should not be left alone to write makefiles
12:21:36  <andythenorth> planetmaker: could you help me with FIRS makefile (if it's convenient)? o_O
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12:32:57  <Alberth> planet maker seems kind of absent nowadays
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12:37:50  <andythenorth> many are :)
12:38:00  <andythenorth> hence my 'is dying' doom and gloom :D
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12:40:43  <LordAro> he was here yesterday
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13:37:17  <frosch123> hmm, if ottd dies... would that open the option to get zombies onto the project? :p
13:37:35  <frosch123> i heard zombies are good at programming
13:38:04  <frosch123> not sure whether they go well with unicorns though
13:38:31  <LordAro> or ponys
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13:45:17  <Thomas6966> Hello...
13:45:43  <Thomas6966> can somebody help me with the size of letters in the game?
13:46:24  <frosch123> <- the wiki can
13:49:25  <LordAro> frosch123: did you bring that up in your browser or did you type it out? :P
13:50:02  <Alberth> a standard set of bookmarked links :)
13:51:43  <Thomas6966> thanks a lot frosch... this sentence: "Note that you must change both the font and size entries for your changes to have any effect " in the FAQ was the important sentence   :)
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13:58:42  <frosch123> you are welcome :)
14:05:12  <LordAro> so, what's everybody doing?
14:05:41  <frosch123> watching sc2
14:07:47  <LordAro> starcraft?
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14:07:58  <LordAro> or simcity?
14:08:07  <frosch123> hots
14:08:45  <frosch123> hmm, the stream died in the deciding match :p
14:08:58  <LordAro> hots?
14:09:15  <frosch123> the current expansion of sc2
14:09:22  <LordAro> i see
14:09:56  * Zuu alternates between cleaning his apartment while listening to the radio and tying to find inspiration for what to do.
14:10:52  <LordAro> surely you could do all of those at the same time? :P
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14:11:25  <frosch123> finding an inspiration in cleaning your room? :o
14:12:30  <Zuu> More like finding inspiration for possible what hobby project to spend time with.
14:12:55  <Zuu> But maybe that is good because then more cleaning get done :-)
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14:13:00  <LordAro> a 4 letter acronym springs to mind :P
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14:15:07  *** Flygon_ is now known as Flygon
14:15:32  <Flygon> Super Hydralic Instantanious Transport?
14:15:51  <LordAro> lol
14:15:57  <Flygon> Now if there was a GRF for that
14:16:04  <Flygon> But the movie never revealed the design
14:16:10  <Flygon> Hyvaa yota
14:17:33  <LordAro> still snowing a bit here...
14:17:34  * andythenorth is holding a toddler who is learning how to build ottd track
14:17:47  <LordAro> although it seems to be meliting faster than it's coming down
14:17:52  <andythenorth> and wondering how to get a 2x and 4x zoom for the GUI as well as the game viewport
14:18:13  <LordAro> Big GUI ?
14:18:20  <LordAro> or whatever it's called
14:18:22  <andythenorth> meh
14:18:25  <andythenorth> it's not the original?
14:18:31  <LordAro> it mostly works :L
14:18:56  <andythenorth> I have a 1280x800 screen, and I want a double-sized 640x400 game window for it
14:19:15  <andythenorth> I can't run full screen at lower resolutions in OS X anymore :(
14:19:33  <andythenorth> and it was never very crisp anyway, as it wasn't the default screen resolution
14:19:46  <LordAro> there must be some sort of zoom software somewhere
14:19:49  <andythenorth> whereas if I use the OS X screen zoom tool, it looks awesome, but I have to scroll a lot
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14:22:40  <frosch123> andythenorth: <- start with that, fix all the glitches (which probly also apply to biggui), then we can make it a setting
14:23:50  <andythenorth> :o
14:23:53  <andythenorth> ok cool
14:23:55  <andythenorth> hmm
14:24:01  <LordAro> lol, easy as that :)
14:24:06  <andythenorth> biab, teaching toddlers to build in arctic
14:24:46  <LordAro> frosch123: you should add it to the todo list :)
14:25:59  <andythenorth> ugh
14:26:05  <andythenorth> maybe I just found a use for toyland :P
14:26:08  <andythenorth> user *
14:26:35  <LordAro> pffft. i always liked toyland
14:26:54  <LordAro> especially maddog's toyshop(?) that came with TTD
14:29:50  <LordAro> screw it, i'll play it now :)
14:31:54  <V453000> toyland is awesome!
14:31:58  <V453000> !!
14:32:00  <V453000> !
14:32:01  <V453000> .
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14:32:12  <LordAro>
14:32:22  <V453000> nuff sed
14:33:15  <LordAro> actually, no i won't play toyland now, cos Formula1 is on
14:33:20  <LordAro> i'll come back though :)
14:35:17  <andythenorth> also...
14:35:28  <andythenorth> we need to be able to colour vehicles individually
14:35:36  <andythenorth> according to at least one 3 year old
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14:35:52  <frosch123> play nuts
14:36:06  <frosch123> resp. poke v to finish it :p
14:36:59  <andythenorth> spose I could do some horrible thing in newgrf
14:37:00  <andythenorth> :P
14:37:25  <andythenorth> now we have a  nnbhbuce nice sy b subtype refit
14:37:34  <andythenorth> keyboarbd contention :P
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14:38:20  <frosch123> are you now going to join the masses who tried to make a lego newgrf?
14:38:35  <andythenorth> nah
14:39:48  <andythenorth> apparently we need red snow :P
14:43:20  <frosch123> turning ottd into a zombie massacre game?
14:43:43  <frosch123> kill zombies with trains
14:44:31  <goodger> survival horror: the tower defence of 2012
14:44:45  <V453000> what isnt finished? :)
14:45:23  <V453000> also, colour schemes for train groups would be awesome, was saying that for ages too
14:46:04  <frosch123> oh yeah! andythenorth: we did not have a livery discussion for long :)
14:46:15  <andythenorth> true :P
14:46:35  <andythenorth> normally it is derailed by thirty-something railfans who are overly addicted to counting rivets
14:46:42  <andythenorth> the pov of a toddler is more interesting :P
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15:01:53  <V453000> in fact I actually am consireding making my wagons use MU
15:02:10  <V453000> so you could recolour these wagons depending on track type at least
15:02:39  <frosch123> wagons changing colour when entering different track? :p
15:03:33  <V453000> no
15:03:38  <V453000> like the passenger wagon (rail)
15:03:43  <V453000> you only have -freight wagons-
15:04:02  <V453000> I figure if I use the MU flag on freight wagons it will make them use that too?
15:13:01  <HellTiger> hm will crashed plains disapear?
15:13:06  <HellTiger> or should i react
15:16:53  <HellTiger> and, about passengers, do i have to build trainstation very near to many buildings?
15:19:21  <V453000> no they will be there till you restart your pc
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15:24:55  <Zuu> HellTiger: The crashed aircraft will disapear in a few in-game months
15:25:28  <HellTiger> V453000: i did alrdy two times. it didnt helped.
15:25:31  <HellTiger> thanks Zuu
15:26:48  <frosch123> HellTiger: the population inside the covarage area of the station decides the pax and mail production
15:27:24  <frosch123> it's like industries, you only get the cargo if the industry is near the station
15:27:25  <HellTiger> ok
15:27:31  <frosch123> same holds for every single house
15:27:37  <HellTiger> ah!
15:27:46  <HellTiger> that was a great point :>
15:29:39  <Zuu> HellTiger: In English, an airplane is a flying thing with wings. A aircraft could be an airplane but also a helicopter or zepelin. Just "plane" is an abrivation of "airplane". In this game "aircraft" or "airplane" is used commonly.
15:30:13  <HellTiger> ok
15:30:42  <Zuu> "plains" is not airplane in plural :-)
15:31:00  <Zuu> Which is what V453000 tried to make a joke out of
15:31:52  <V453000> actually I didnt even notice the typo
15:31:54  <V453000> :(
15:37:31  <HellTiger> hm i tried some youtubes yet but i didnt find any single rail solutions where you have a small passing track at critical position
15:37:42  <HellTiger> is a two rail so common?
15:38:01  <Zuu> two way rail is cheap enough in OpenTTD.
15:39:36  <Zuu> I read that in Sweden about 17% of all tracks are double tracks (and the rest is single track. 3 or more is really uncommon)
15:39:51  <Alberth>
15:40:31  <HellTiger> i know from germany many single tracks
15:40:36  <Alberth> being too cheap is easily solved with a basecost modification grf :)
15:40:38  <HellTiger> and they where connected to very big industry
15:40:43  <HellTiger> like hoechst, bayer degusa
15:40:54  <HellTiger> there where some double ones some times
15:41:03  <HellTiger> and on stations ofc a lot more.
15:41:40  <frosch123> HellTiger: single track with passing points is common in the early game
15:42:11  <frosch123> at least i saw others doing it, not only me :p
15:43:02  <HellTiger> deep things.
15:43:09  <HellTiger> hurts a bit in the brain yet
15:43:17  <Zuu> Switzerland which is far more dense (than Sweden) have about 60% double tracks. Eg. even there, there are a considerable amount of single tracks. In OpenTTD, it is often just easier to double. Requires often less time and though than single track systems which only are worth the hassle when you are short in money.
15:44:38  <Alberth> or short on time, if you play to get a goal :)
15:45:54  <Zuu> Doing it double from start doesn't take longer time to build. Makeing the bypass lines and signaling them takes some effort.
15:47:39  <frosch123> usually i build a one line track, then the train, then the second track :)
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16:55:26  <LordAro> how is the random starting company colour generated? i always (>80%) seem to get pink :L
16:56:22  <planetmaker> hello
16:56:46  <frosch123> LordAro: it tries to not use a colour which is similar to an existing company's
16:58:11  <LordAro> hey planetmaker
16:58:20  <frosch123> oh, and there is also some colour ranking
16:58:58  <LordAro> i'll look into it, shall i? :P
16:59:20  <andythenorth> o/ planetmaker
16:59:25  <Zuu> Hello planetmaker
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17:03:57  <LordAro> that's unusual
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18:45:16  <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r25120 /trunk/src/lang (unfinished/macedonian.txt vietnamese.txt) (2013-03-24 18:45:09 UTC)
18:45:17  <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0:
18:45:18  <DorpsGek> macedonian - 1 changes by Ristovski
18:45:19  <DorpsGek> vietnamese - 2 changes by nglekhoi
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19:35:59  <frosch123> andythenorth: the 2x gui zoom looks really scary actually
19:36:12  <frosch123> did it really look like that 18 years ago?
19:36:40  <andythenorth> yes
19:36:42  <andythenorth> big
19:36:45  <andythenorth> easy to use
19:37:00  <andythenorth> frosch123: you have a flat panel screen right?
19:37:14  <frosch123> yeah, that might make the pixels more rectangular
19:37:28  <andythenorth> in 1994, crts had pixels you could see if you put your eye close
19:37:37  <andythenorth> but they were round-ish :)
19:37:41  <andythenorth> and bled
19:37:46  <andythenorth> also they jittered somewhat
19:37:47  <andythenorth> :P
19:38:06  <andythenorth> 2x gui zoom looks good using my os zoom tool :)
19:41:06  <HellTiger_> strange, i just removed tracks directly on river to build bridge, but i have also bombed the river and can now just build tracks
19:41:26  <frosch123> andythenorth: the 2x zoom works surprisingly well
19:41:35  <HellTiger_> but now i see the costs!
19:41:57  <frosch123> the only stuff that is really broken are vehicles in lists, depot and such
19:42:17  <michi_cc> We already have all the loading and resizing code for zoom-level specific sprites, we "just" need to dynamically select a zoom level (i.e. you want to finish up ;)
19:42:19  <andythenorth> screenshot?
19:43:02  <frosch123> andythenorth: you did not test yourself? :(
19:43:09  <andythenorth> not yet
19:43:09  <frosch123> it's such an easy diff
19:43:22  <andythenorth> had a trip to hospital to glue a child's head back together earlier :P
19:43:33  <andythenorth> will test shortly
19:46:47  <frosch123>
19:47:13  <frosch123> random selection of windows, with that one-line change :p
19:47:28  <frosch123> no idea what michi_cc might already have fixed :)
19:48:54  <michi_cc> Most of the stuff on your screenshot except those weired inconsistencies where some things use sprites and others font glyphs (like up/down scroll arrows compared to left/right scroll arrows).
19:50:56  <michi_cc> Which lead me on a tangential drift to font selection/ui, which lead to OSX CJK input with a diversion via the other upen OSX patches, which lead back to Windows CJK input, which lead to patching up the gapping holes on the non-Unicode windows build and some other Unicode fails.
19:51:58  <michi_cc> And if we start with e.g. the storyboard stuff we really need a proper text rendering engine that isn't completely ignoring things like combining characters :p
19:51:59  <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r25121 trunk/src/widget.cpp (2013-03-24 19:51:53 UTC)
19:52:00  <DorpsGek> -Fix: Editboxes could become too small when resizing windows.
19:52:34  <frosch123> michi_cc: do you want to add rtl support for editboxes to that list? :p
19:53:57  <frosch123> anyway, the intro GUI looks the most scariest of all those windows
19:54:05  <frosch123> maybe also the company gui :)
19:54:35  <michi_cc> The support itself is probably easy, but deciding when input is RTL and when LTR is the difficult part I'd guess.
19:55:19  <frosch123> one of the problem is that our editboxes have no horizontal scrolling
19:55:27  <frosch123> only a magic hack which works surprisingly well
19:56:25  <frosch123> if the text in the editbox is wider than the editbox, it always scrolls so that the cursor is at the right border
19:57:54  <frosch123> that's also why i was not able to implement cursor positioning with the mouse :p because you cannot position the cursor in the middle of an editbox if the text is longer
19:58:11  <michi_cc> Editbox handling (or textbuf morr exactly) could be made a little bit less magic in general by storing the characters as UTF-32 instead of UTF-8 (tiny bot confusing to store some values in pixels, bytes and characters), but I'm not sure where the length limits are arbitrarily set and where mandated by the network protocol.
19:58:43  <frosch123> i don't think that would improve anything
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19:58:58  <frosch123> considering rtl control characters and such
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19:59:27  <frosch123> hmm, though maybe we do not allow entering those directly
20:00:42  <frosch123> but positioning the cursor when icu inserts ligatures
20:00:51  <frosch123> won't be easier :)
20:00:52  <michi_cc> It improves the code. CJK/IME handling for OS X must (and for Windows should) support painting not-yet-finished characters differently, and the current code is already quite complex because if the variable length characters.
20:01:20  <Zuu> frosch123: Detecting where a user clicked sounds very similar to my click-on-text patch :-)
20:01:36  <frosch123> Zuu: detecting is not the problem
20:01:43  <frosch123> just the editbox cannot draw a cursor in the middle
20:02:07  <Zuu> ok
20:02:10  <frosch123> because it always scrolls in a way which positions the cursor at the right border
20:03:06  <frosch123> and because the same textbuf can be displayed in multiple windows with differently sized editboxes, you cannot just add a scrolling variable to the textbuf :p
20:03:10  <frosch123> it needs to go to the widget
20:04:17  <Zuu> If I put more content into a widget than fits it, I can still move around the cursor in the visible area.
20:04:40  <frosch123> the cursor is always at the right
20:04:43  <Zuu> (using (ctrl)+arrows)
20:04:46  <frosch123> you cannot move it to the middle of the wdiget
20:05:00  <Zuu> Not?
20:05:10  <frosch123> unless the text is already scrolled to the very left
20:05:32  <Zuu> Ah, then it was that.
20:06:02  <frosch123> when the text is not scrolled to the very left, the cursor keys effectively scroll the editbox instead of only moving the cursor
20:06:21  <Zuu> Yes, I see that now.
20:10:24  <frosch123> detecting the click position is easy in the editbox, because there are only simple characters with the same size :)
20:10:38  <frosch123> no control codes and such, so you do not have to hook into the whole string system
20:11:09  <frosch123> though that is also the reason why rtl does not work :p
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20:20:56  <HellTiger_> i am so confused. wich signal i place at entrance of station to force train not to turn?
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20:21:39  <HellTiger_> ah maybe the one way path thing.
20:22:34  <Zuu> With path signaling you cannot force the train to not turn back by puting signals just before the station. Instead turn the signals infront of the station intersection from "path" to "oneway path"
20:24:13  <Zuu> HellTiger_: In this example you can see how I gave a suggestion to some forum user on how to improve signaling:
20:24:31  <HellTiger_> thanks!
20:25:02  <Zuu> The forum post with some comments is here:
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20:51:41  <andythenorth> frosch123: may I have the link to the zoom diff?  (Can't find it in logs, must be blind) ;P
20:52:06  <frosch123> go to zoom_type.h
20:52:13  <frosch123> and change the GUI constant to 2x instead of 4x
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20:52:59  <andythenorth> ta
20:59:13  <andythenorth> fancy helping translate FIRS ahead of April 1? o_O
20:59:20  <andythenorth> offer open to all :)
20:59:33  <andythenorth> who's czech?
20:59:40  <frosch123> v
20:59:50  <andythenorth> thought so :)
20:59:55  <frosch123> not sure whether he offers translations though :)
21:00:26  <frosch123> all czech i have meet, ranted about czech translations just like i rant over german :)
21:00:40  <andythenorth> frosch123: the 2x GUI zoom is awesome
21:01:01  <andythenorth> I don't care that the font doesn't zoom, it's totally legible
21:01:05  <frosch123> did you saw michi's git repo?
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21:01:26  <frosch123> andythenorth: don't tell me you don't know how to change font size :o
21:01:31  <andythenorth> no idea
21:01:45  <andythenorth> adv. settings is borked
21:01:50  <andythenorth> the + icons
21:02:01  <frosch123> yup, also visible in my screenshot
21:02:06  <frosch123> the company gui is also fancy :p
21:02:09  <andythenorth> so are station guis etc
21:02:24  <frosch123> but wrt. playability the depot gui and vehicle list might be the most important ones
21:02:30  <andythenorth> oops, asset
21:02:32  <andythenorth> assert
21:02:39  <andythenorth>
21:02:41  <andythenorth> ?
21:02:43  <andythenorth> meh
21:02:46  <andythenorth> bad copy
21:02:53  <andythenorth> Assertion failed at line 153 of /Users/andy/Documents/workspace/openttd/src/core/math_func.hpp: min <= max
21:02:56  <Supercheese> 1 outdated string for US english?
21:02:58  <Supercheese> hrm
21:03:11  <frosch123> andythenorth: one of those things which you need to fix :)
21:03:18  <andythenorth> lovely :)
21:03:24  <Supercheese> "both" vs. "two or more"
21:03:26  <Supercheese> bah
21:03:28  <frosch123> some windows do not expect images to be bigger than they thought
21:03:58  <andythenorth> Supercheese: user-suggested via pm :P
21:04:03  <andythenorth> it was inconsistent
21:04:11  <Supercheese> eh, fix things however you see fit; just 1 strong :P
21:04:14  <Supercheese> string*
21:04:26  <andythenorth> frosch123: so think it's a plausible project, or a death march? o_O
21:04:43  <frosch123> take a look at michi_cc's git :)
21:05:15  <andythenorth> :)
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21:05:46  <andythenorth> it's probably the single best improvement I could think of in ottd
21:05:54  <andythenorth> "new features?"
21:05:59  <andythenorth> "no, make it look like 1994" :P
21:06:19  <Supercheese> GameFAQs poll supports the 90s' superiority
21:06:25  <Supercheese>
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21:08:18  <frosch123> Supercheese: isn't that more like a profile of the readers?
21:08:38  <frosch123> i would think 80% consider those games best which they played at age 16 to 20
21:09:05  <Supercheese> Nah, the 90s were the best, totally objective ;)
21:09:33  <Supercheese> I was only 0-9 in that decade
21:09:52  <Supercheese> No bias whatsoever :P
21:10:57  * andythenorth tries 'regular' sized gui
21:10:59  <andythenorth> hmm
21:11:01  <andythenorth> squinty
21:11:04  <andythenorth> I need new eyes
21:11:37  <Supercheese> Google sells those, don't they?
21:11:45  <Supercheese> Or have those not hit the market yet? ;)
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21:17:07  <andythenorth> FIRS docs, auto-generated
21:17:09  <andythenorth> well
21:17:20  <andythenorth> 'docs' might be better
21:17:25  <andythenorth> sparse :P
21:18:06  <Zuu> Replace "_" with " "?
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21:19:25  <andythenorth> I have more than that in mind :)
21:19:40  <andythenorth> I'm going to replicate this, only it will be....accurate
21:19:53  <andythenorth> the old site is outdated, maintaining it against src was a PITA
21:20:25  <andythenorth> this one will be canonical, as it comes from src :)
21:21:06  <Supercheese> andy: no guano mine yet? :P
21:21:13  <andythenorth> not yet
21:21:16  <andythenorth> won't be in 1.0
21:21:21  <andythenorth> I have art for it
21:21:48  <Supercheese> I had never even heard of guano having industrial applications until FIRS mentioned it
21:21:55  <Supercheese> old website I think
21:22:37  <Supercheese>
21:22:45  <frosch123> i think if you use the clay pit, and just fill it with white stuff....
21:22:50  <frosch123> it would look disgusting :p
21:22:52  <andythenorth> :P
21:24:36  <Supercheese> Huh, some nice quonset huts here:
21:24:54  <Supercheese> what're the graphic sources?
21:25:09  <andythenorth> survey base
21:25:16  <andythenorth> Guano Mine from DanMacK
21:25:34  <andythenorth> I keep meaning to use those huts
21:25:37  <andythenorth> haven't found a purpose
21:25:44  <andythenorth> 'someone' should do newairports
21:25:46  <Supercheese> license for graphics?
21:25:56  <andythenorth> gpl
21:25:56  * Supercheese would add them to his object set
21:26:04  <Supercheese> would have to swap licenses then, hmmmm
21:26:20  <andythenorth> or by arrangement
21:26:28  <Supercheese> Danmack's?
21:26:52  <andythenorth> guano mine is
21:27:00  <andythenorth> survey base is me
21:29:22  <Supercheese> Ugh, file transfer operations just grind computers to a halt
21:29:41  <Supercheese> I just want to copy a gigabyte or two from place to place
21:30:01  <Supercheese> Firefox just dies while that's happening :(
21:30:37  <andythenorth> SSD
21:30:57  <andythenorth> FF has probably also eaten all your RAM and is in swap
21:30:57  <andythenorth> OS X?
21:31:09  <andythenorth> hmm wrong Super*
21:31:17  <Supercheese> the fox is a giant memory hog
21:31:55  <Supercheese> Windows probably is too
21:32:12  <Supercheese> Right click -> properties
21:32:18  <Supercheese> 45 seconds later, get results
21:32:48  <Supercheese> Oh jeez, now even Winamp is lagging
21:35:43  <HellTiger_> how do i skip a "send train to depot"
21:35:47  <HellTiger_> i didnt need anymore
21:35:50  <Supercheese> click it again?
21:35:52  <HellTiger_> and its not there yet
21:35:53  <HellTiger_> ah
21:36:04  <HellTiger_> thx
21:36:07  <Supercheese> you're welcome
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21:45:21  <Supercheese> derp, now windows has decided to lag out on a "moving to recycle bin" window
21:45:33  <Supercheese> no progress for ~3 minutes, can't close the window
21:53:12  <HellTiger_> where can i read in the log about closed fabrics? my target just disapeared while fast forward
21:53:46  <frosch123> top right, in the newspaper menu
21:53:58  <HellTiger_> its not in
21:54:20  <HellTiger_> ah now setted to full if closing
21:54:24  <glx> log size is limited
21:54:48  <HellTiger_> ye
21:54:49  <andythenorth> herp
21:55:07  <andythenorth> generating industry names for docs is tricky when they rely on the default OTTD string :P
21:55:09  <HellTiger_> warnings arent good handled yet while fast forward
21:55:43  <Zuu> andythenorth: Just implement the OpenTTD string parameter system :-p
21:55:49  <andythenorth> lovely
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21:57:54  <frosch123> just remove powerplants and sawmills and such
21:58:03  <frosch123> ottd does not have a default string for guano mines
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22:01:23  <HellTiger_> god damit, second factory just disapeard while train was pretty near.
22:01:25  <HellTiger_> FAK :D
22:02:02  <frosch123> it's weird :) i never encountered that problem
22:02:12  <frosch123> but sometimes people comlpani about it happening all the time
22:03:58  <HellTiger_> i am on learning signals
22:04:08  <HellTiger_> is there some auto pause setting for events?
22:05:07  <frosch123> no
22:05:14  <frosch123> and wouldn't make any sense for multiplayer
22:05:25  <HellTiger_> if i get enaraged enough i will make a feature request.
22:05:46  <frosch123> and ottd is quite targeted to multiplayer, i believe :)
22:06:34  <HellTiger_> oh
22:06:51  <HellTiger_> right i could not imaginate how it work, if some one just build into your way for fun
22:06:57  <frosch123> even though it might not relfect the majority of players :p
22:07:00  <andythenorth> what happens if I copy default industry names into FIRS?
22:07:03  <andythenorth> does the sky fall?
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22:07:31  <frosch123> you lose tamil translations of them
22:07:45  <frosch123> can you copy them to your doc script instead?
22:08:29  <andythenorth> yes
22:12:22  <HellTiger_> hrm quite strange to build just a extreme over huge station, then remove only single parts and the accept of other to far away goods is possible
22:12:59  <frosch123> press ctrl when building :p
22:13:05  <frosch123> then you can skip the "remove" part
22:13:39  <andythenorth> station walking
22:13:44  <frosch123> anyway, it's called "station walking" in the cheat book :p
22:13:45  <Supercheese> there's some strangeness about station rectangles and such
22:13:51  <Supercheese> for acceptance/delivering
22:14:17  <Supercheese> i.e. you can deliver cargo even if not directly in the catchment, or some such
22:14:42  <HellTiger_> what do you mean with holding crtl? i dont understand mechanics
22:14:45  <HellTiger_> what to do next
22:15:11  <frosch123> buld one station piece
22:15:28  <frosch123> then build a second one with ctrl+click some tiles aways fromit
22:15:39  <HellTiger_> ah now i see
22:16:05  <HellTiger_> oh man
22:16:10  <HellTiger_> now i am confused again.
22:16:15  <HellTiger_> i think i skip station walking for now
22:17:23  <HellTiger_> will it work just normal if i chain with just 1x1 things to a resource part near? i mean, i could chain up tons of stations
22:17:30  <HellTiger_> where is the litle problem about it
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22:31:00  <Zuu> HellTiger_: The problem about it is that there is a setting called maximum station spread. It sets the limit of how large the total station rectangle can be.
22:31:15  <Zuu> Also, your idea of how the game should be played may set limits.
22:31:38  <Zuu> And thirdly MP server rules tend to have an idea on what is OK and not OK.
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22:58:20  <frosch123> night
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22:59:25  <HellTiger_> ho do i make curve for tunnel?
22:59:48  <Eddi|zuHause> it's not possible
23:00:01  <Eddi|zuHause> tunnels and bridges must be straight
23:01:13  <HellTiger_> ok
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23:19:01  <HellTiger_> is it ok just to transfare iron and let goods stock up?
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23:28:32  <Eddi|zuHause> your question doesn't make much sense
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23:30:37  <HellTiger_> Eddi|zuHause: i wana deliver iron ore without gettint any steel from the same location yet.
23:31:24  <Eddi|zuHause> steel will not be piling up on your station until you send a wagon/truck to pick it up
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23:36:43  <HellTiger_> thanks
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