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DorpsGek 07:03:57 *** shirish_ [~quassel@117.195.109.97] has joined #openttd 07:07:24 *** shirish [~quassel@0001358e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 07:15:40 *** smb_ [~smb_@174.84.239.58] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:24:16 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 07:29:37 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:39:11 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 07:45:46 *** LSky` [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:06:01 <planetmaker> moin 08:12:32 *** MJP [~mjp@hq.z77.fr] has joined #openttd 08:18:29 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 08:24:45 <andythenorth> o/ 08:25:07 <planetmaker> \o 08:28:51 <FLHerne> \o/ 08:30:17 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 08:31:05 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 08:42:13 <planetmaker> V453000, I guess you gotta try. Just from the sprites it looks as if the animation is extremely fine-grained 08:42:35 <planetmaker> But there's nothing else one could do than just check whether you need each or every 2nd, 3rd, 4th of them only 08:42:45 <V453000> wa 08:42:56 <V453000> ah 08:43:04 <planetmaker> I only saw motion when I compared 1st to 10th or so :P 08:43:11 <V453000> mhm :P 08:43:15 <V453000> will see 08:43:22 <V453000> this is for 25 fps and it was very fast in 25fps most of the time 08:43:33 <V453000> I think using all of them and using them in like 10-ish fps would be good 08:43:35 <planetmaker> openttd has 30fps. No less, no more. No change 08:44:21 <V453000> well the animation speed varies 08:45:04 <planetmaker> and animation can use 30, 15, 7.5, 3.75,... fps 08:45:09 <planetmaker> basically 30 / 2^n 08:45:10 <V453000> 15 is fine then 08:46:06 <planetmaker> in even more detail: (1000/30) / 2^n 08:46:07 <planetmaker> :P 08:46:11 <V453000> 128/15 is a nice 8 seconds 08:46:22 <V453000> or so 08:47:34 <V453000> can use 30 for some industries producing insanely fast, and 7.5 to start with 08:47:40 <V453000> 0 for unserviced ones? :P 08:47:45 <planetmaker> sure 08:48:05 <V453000> unserviced has 0 production so that should work :D 08:48:56 <planetmaker> basically what I tried to say: before you render everything with a zillion animation frames: try with one industry as of how many you really need 08:50:05 <V453000> will code one tonight 08:50:06 <V453000> and see 08:50:16 <V453000> rendering doesnt take effort :P 08:56:12 <planetmaker> V453000, slower speed does not necessarily mean more frames. As you can control the duration a frame is shown. So even for slow speeds it might work with less frames than you actually rendered / pushed 08:56:23 <planetmaker> which makes the NewGRF less cpu-heavy to use 08:57:06 <planetmaker> but yeah, needs testing. I'll be curious as of the results :) 09:01:50 <V453000> mhm :) 09:07:47 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 09:16:22 *** bdavenport [~davenport@aeolus.mindlesstux.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:25:40 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:31:04 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:39:14 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd 09:48:04 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 09:51:27 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 09:53:08 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:54:39 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 09:57:17 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:04:59 *** LSky` [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 10:22:43 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@5751e87a.skybroadband.com] has joined #openttd 10:23:41 <planetmaker> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/6237/1-X.wmv <-- hm, V453000, the gray stones, after compression should be smaller 10:23:47 <planetmaker> instead they seem to grow in size 10:25:41 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:26:25 <V453000> that wmv is probably old 10:26:29 <V453000> check repository 10:26:36 <V453000> I measured the volume and it is 1:1 10:26:42 <V453000> (previously wasnt) 10:28:20 <V453000> xcept it is in the shadow most of the time XD 10:28:46 <V453000> but the difference should be visible 10:28:49 <V453000> sec I will make a new wmv :P 10:29:10 <planetmaker> when you stamp something the volume should even shrink, not just stay the same. 10:29:15 <LadyHawk> [18/7][11:22:42] -NickServ- This hostname matches an entry on the access list of nickname LadyHawk. You 10:29:15 <LadyHawk> [18/7][11:22:42] -NickServ- have been automatically identified. 10:29:15 <LadyHawk> [18/7][11:24:42] -solenoid.oftc.net- Activating Cloak: 0001f1cd.user.oftc.net 10:29:16 <LadyHawk> <3 10:29:18 <planetmaker> I'd assume 10% shrinkage or so 10:30:04 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 10:30:16 *** TheMask96 [martijn@sloth.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 10:30:21 <V453000> volume of result: 1,89 m3 volume of input: 2,01 m3 :P 10:30:28 <V453000> 5% :) 10:30:29 <planetmaker> :) 10:31:18 <planetmaker> so, V453000 which industry is the sawmill + stone stamper? 10:31:27 <V453000> 1X, this one? :D 10:31:33 <planetmaker> (that's the clear disadvantage of numbering instead of naming ;) ) 10:31:37 <planetmaker> unrememberable :P 10:31:48 <V453000> oh you mean the name 10:31:52 <V453000> construction yard? :P 10:31:55 <planetmaker> yeah 1x 10:32:17 <planetmaker> indeed stones are smaller there now 10:32:19 <V453000> well once you remember that stone quarry, clay pit and forest are 1A, 1B and 1C, it isnt that bad :P 10:32:22 <planetmaker> video is old 10:32:54 <planetmaker> it's something I need to remember. That's bad ;) 10:32:57 <V453000> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/6277/1X.wmv 10:33:23 <planetmaker> All I usually can remember I saw a ... pit. Or a circle saw :) 10:33:27 <V453000> no you can remember either name, OR number :P OR both :P 10:33:37 <V453000> OR imagez =D 10:33:50 <V453000> and the stone should probably still be a bit smaller 10:33:58 <planetmaker> with an image I don#t need to remember names. With good naming it will explain what image is attached. Numbers never give that association :) 10:33:59 <V453000> OR the rock larger 10:34:09 <V453000> mhm :) 10:34:20 <V453000> 1X is multilingual? :P 10:34:35 <planetmaker> it's non-lingual 10:34:38 <V453000> :D 10:34:42 <V453000> it is omni-lingual 10:34:50 <V453000> xcept the shit with different letters :D 10:35:05 <V453000> hm I think the input stone should be larger 10:35:06 <V453000> Y? 10:35:16 <planetmaker> 1éš 10:35:23 <V453000> perfect 10:35:36 <planetmaker> 1ë¬ 10:35:51 <planetmaker> Ù 1 10:38:44 <planetmaker> hm... translations... 10:43:25 <planetmaker> any chance to activate translations for yeti, V453000 ? 10:44:52 <V453000> I wouldnt do that at least yet 10:45:00 <planetmaker> why not? 10:45:11 <V453000> many strings are subject to change 10:45:30 <planetmaker> They are. And they would continuously adopt 10:49:06 <V453000> will see 10:49:10 <V453000> but you know what I think about translation 10:49:13 <planetmaker> and I don't see the industry and cargoe names change 10:49:18 <planetmaker> I do. And I totally disagree 10:49:25 <V453000> which is fine 10:49:31 <planetmaker> it's also a dent in my fun playing it, tbh 10:49:51 <planetmaker> it's one of the things stopping it being a perfect newgrf 10:50:15 <planetmaker> the love to the last detail lacking for this 10:50:36 <planetmaker> which you have elsewhere. Which makes it hard to understand really 10:51:03 <planetmaker> even more so as they don't cost you *anything* 10:53:58 <V453000> BAD FEATURE :) 10:54:14 <planetmaker> no. It's what makes the game popular and accessible 10:54:39 <V453000> I meant the missing translation being a bad feature 10:55:22 <planetmaker> a bad feature is missing them without good reason 10:56:18 <V453000> there is 1X 1A? :D :P 10:57:07 <planetmaker> doesn't translate well to Arabic, Korean, Chinese, Russian, or Thai ;) 10:57:22 <V453000> well enough :P 10:57:39 <planetmaker> might actually make it unplayable as openttd might not find any font to display it all. Thus showing only rectangles 10:57:47 <planetmaker> or what-not 10:58:15 <planetmaker> thus no translations might really cause problems for non-latin character systems 10:58:50 <planetmaker> or at least make it look very bad due to only bad font being available 10:59:17 *** mist__ [~mist@c-74fa70d5.034-4-67626721.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has left #openttd [] 11:00:26 *** tycoondemon2 [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:00:41 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 11:05:19 <planetmaker> should we maybe try how it goes and looks V453000 ? 11:09:16 <V453000> I still dont get what does anybody need translation for, 5 year olds are able to play the game without reading just as much 11:09:36 <V453000> and I dont get how does anybody not want to learn english when they exist on the internet 11:10:10 <__ln__> i bet there is a huge non-english internet which you and me are not aware of. 11:10:37 <planetmaker> many people speak less well English than you and me. And they'll be happy to understand things instead of just seeing it 11:10:54 <V453000> those people are a bad feature 11:11:01 <planetmaker> no, they aren't 11:13:01 <planetmaker> languages shape the way we think. Different languages lead to different ways to think and look at things. It's a bonus usually 11:17:07 <planetmaker> and anyway, it won't change how you play the game, nor shall it. But why deny others theirs if it doesn't cost you? 11:17:23 <planetmaker> just because you can? That's petty then really 11:18:25 <planetmaker> and it probably will give you also more testers 11:18:43 <planetmaker> which won't be bad. In the worst case you just ignore their advice ;) 11:30:10 <V453000> k, what does it require me to do 11:30:59 <planetmaker> Not much. It requires to add one or two files to the yeti repo - which I can do for you, if you like 11:31:28 <planetmaker> so people can translate. And the other allows the translation service to add back the translations to the repository. It's optional 11:31:34 <V453000> + pull before every pushint? or? 11:31:37 <V453000> pushing 11:32:00 <planetmaker> it's then advisable to pull before every *commit* (not push) 11:32:12 <planetmaker> though it only commits max. once per day, early evening 11:32:14 <V453000> right 11:32:19 <planetmaker> thus you know when 11:32:24 <V453000> that is not so bad 11:32:29 <V453000> do it then please 11:32:38 <planetmaker> happily will. thanks :) 11:33:04 <V453000> yes yes pleasure on my side meh unicorns blabla cowpig 11:33:18 <V453000> /me opens discussion whether cowpig should be translateable 11:33:30 <planetmaker> :) 11:34:11 <planetmaker> and... yes: should be translatable. Kuhschwein 11:34:16 <V453000> pff 11:35:31 <planetmaker> Schweinekuh would work, too. And sound better. But also closer to a swear word :P 11:35:48 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:35:49 <V453000> :D perfect 11:36:10 <planetmaker> the translation of pigdog is a swear word in German ;) 11:36:32 <V453000> didnt know that 11:36:37 <V453000> schweinhund? :D 11:36:41 <planetmaker> https://translator.openttdcoop.org/project/yeti <-- there we go 11:36:45 <planetmaker> Schweinehund 11:36:53 <planetmaker> (so plural of pig) 11:37:29 <V453000> :D 11:37:30 <V453000> aha 11:37:38 <V453000> so multiple pigs + 1 dog = german wtf thing 11:37:38 <V453000> nice 11:38:33 <planetmaker> not so much wtf, but a mild version version of calling someone an asshole or so 11:38:50 <V453000> basically a person who is from the majority a pig 11:38:51 <V453000> :> 11:39:03 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 11:39:03 <V453000> might want to get an exact ratio 11:39:16 <V453000> s0 how do I add e.g. czech translation to the shit? 11:39:27 <planetmaker> are you translator? 11:39:39 <V453000> idk, am I? :D 11:40:23 <V453000> I did manage to log in and I told it to create cs_cz 11:40:29 <planetmaker> no. But now. There wasn't a czech translator yet 11:40:34 <V453000> it sez upload language file to start translation 11:40:35 <V453000> :d 11:40:41 <planetmaker> uh? 11:40:58 <V453000> never mind :D 11:41:06 <planetmaker> it says to select language, no? 11:41:27 <V453000> all fine now 11:41:56 <V453000> WTF this quiz is tough 11:42:03 <planetmaker> :) 11:42:04 <V453000> I dont even know the translation for clay XD 11:42:10 <planetmaker> :D 11:42:10 <V453000> it is just clay. 11:42:15 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 11:42:24 <planetmaker> In German it's Lehm or Ton 11:42:43 <V453000> ye, jÃl or hlÃna 11:42:47 <V453000> the same almost 11:43:05 <planetmaker> almost, yes. The granularity differs slightly 11:43:35 <V453000> what is the .acc ? 11:43:41 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 11:43:48 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 11:43:54 <planetmaker> probably cases for Czech. Dunno whether it has 11:43:58 <V453000> big, dat :d wat 11:44:19 <V453000> ._. 11:45:11 <planetmaker> oh gosh. It has a shitload of cases 11:45:45 <V453000> oh t hat 11:45:46 <V453000> nom voc 11:45:48 <V453000> jesus fuck 11:45:50 <V453000> the 7 things 11:45:52 <planetmaker> nom(inativ), gen(itiv), dat(iv), acc(usativ) voc(ativ) loc(ativ) ins(?) big(?) small(?) 11:45:54 <planetmaker> yeah 11:45:55 <V453000> I see 11:45:57 <V453000> amazing 11:46:04 <V453000> ins big small idk what is 11:46:06 <V453000> but the other yeah 11:46:18 <V453000> I will just fill in the first thing 11:46:25 <planetmaker> and obviously czech also has a shitload of genders... 11:46:33 <planetmaker> m, f, n, map, nmp, fp, np :P 11:47:01 <planetmaker> skip the cases, if you think it doesn't matter 11:47:08 <V453000> ye 11:47:11 <planetmaker> i.e. if the wording is the same 11:47:19 <V453000> I dont think the whole translation matters, remember? :P 11:47:31 <planetmaker> cargoes seem to need normal, gen and big and acc 11:47:36 <V453000> the cases almost always change the words somehow 11:47:46 <V453000> but it is understandable without it 11:48:16 <planetmaker> and mail has everything in the openttd lang file ;) 11:48:54 <V453000> is it just me or is the translation thingy giving me random strings to fill in? XD 11:49:30 <V453000> I gues it makes more sense to pull the file and edit it locally? 11:49:37 <V453000> or? 11:50:12 <planetmaker> I don't know the order it gives you strings 11:51:18 <V453000> hm, and every time I update some strings in english, the thingy will detect it and set them as outdated? 11:51:24 <planetmaker> yes 11:51:30 <planetmaker> but only the changed one 11:51:54 <planetmaker> and the translator will see old and new versions 11:52:10 <planetmaker> so s/he can decide whether a change needs translation (or e.g. is just a typo fix) 11:52:31 <V453000> right 11:54:25 <planetmaker> STR_c2B__units_of_cargo and STR_c2B__items_of_cargo seem to be the same? 11:54:36 <V453000> probably? :D 11:54:48 <planetmaker> I like the suggestion of related strings 11:54:52 <V453000> I dont know the intended difference and this looed ok 11:54:55 <planetmaker> helps to keep translation uniform 11:56:35 *** trendynick [~trendynic@188.26.254.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:00:51 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:01:59 <planetmaker> hm, what's the difference between a construction yard and a worker yard, V453000 ? 12:02:10 <V453000> 1X and 4X? :P 12:02:14 <V453000> one produces BDMT and one YETI 12:02:35 <planetmaker> ah. Yeti-breeding plant ;) 12:02:49 <V453000> in CZ I translated worker yard as Pracovnà ÃÅad which is the office you go to whne you are unemployed 12:03:07 <planetmaker> ok, that's a good idea 12:03:43 <planetmaker> I'll call it unemployment office for yetis 12:03:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 12:05:40 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 12:05:44 <planetmaker> k... done. Now fixing the mistakes I made ;) 12:07:16 <planetmaker> one translation done. Sort of 12:09:37 <V453000> 99 correct =D 12:13:56 *** Hazzard_ [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 12:14:00 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 12:15:01 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 12:15:36 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 12:16:12 <V453000> how do discover that devzone thing commited the translationss? 12:16:17 <V453000> will it say in the channel? 12:16:56 <planetmaker> currently it won't tell at all 12:17:23 <planetmaker> obviously the repository will be updated, thus if you pull, you'll get new stuff 12:18:01 <planetmaker> if we re-activate brot, it would tell 12:18:21 <planetmaker> besides a lot of other stuff it would tell :P 12:18:43 <V453000> XD I get the meaning of a lot 12:19:42 <planetmaker> I don't quite yet dare to suggest to you to activate also compilation so that translators can check ingame their translation :P 12:20:09 <planetmaker> but a successful compile would be announced. And would then happen when there was a commit by translators ;) 12:20:42 *** Hazzard [~quassel@c-67-174-253-44.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:41:41 *** trendynick [~trendynic@188.26.254.160] has joined #openttd 12:44:24 *** bdavenport [~davenport@aeolus.mindlesstux.com] has joined #openttd 12:46:56 *** tycoondemon2 [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 12:49:50 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 12:51:12 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 12:52:56 <V453000> sooooooooooooo 12:52:57 <V453000> wat do now 12:57:55 <planetmaker> feed the yetis? 12:58:03 <planetmaker> or give them moaar work? 12:58:18 <V453000> probably make their stuf move 12:58:32 <planetmaker> sounds like a plan 12:59:03 <Eddi|zuHause> LadyHawk: that cloak is useless because you join channels before it's active. so everybody has your IP already 12:59:16 <planetmaker> :P 13:01:02 <V453000> does this make sense? http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/3510/ 13:02:35 <planetmaker> lines 1-9 seem valid NML 13:02:52 <__ln__> also the url seems like a valid url 13:03:31 <V453000> and without the -> things, is that how I would call each of thesprites? 13:03:59 <planetmaker> yes, you can reference them that way, yes 13:05:22 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 13:05:47 <V453000> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/3511/ this then? 13:06:28 <planetmaker> you also have a spriteset in 8bpp for those alternative sprites, yes? 13:06:44 <planetmaker> then the animation switch looks fine 13:06:45 <V453000> 8bpp has to have the animation too? 13:06:49 <planetmaker> of course 13:06:58 <V453000> k I will just fake it 13:06:59 <planetmaker> every sprite needs to be 8bpp 1x 13:07:02 <V453000> right 13:07:06 <V453000> I will just load the same image 13:07:08 <planetmaker> that's fair enough to fake it :) 13:07:09 <V453000> for now at least :> 13:07:25 <V453000> if oldschool stuff, then oldschool without animation :P 13:07:49 <V453000> do you think the second one in graphics{} I have there should work? 13:07:53 <V453000> or should I just do the switch? 13:08:29 <planetmaker> oh, the 2nd one will work just fine the graphics switch 13:08:38 <planetmaker> if you have nothing else which (also) influences the choice of graphics 13:08:52 <V453000> no, nothing else should :) 13:08:54 <V453000> for now :D 13:09:02 <planetmaker> you'll still need the callbacks to decide on animation frame, of course 13:11:29 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:12:38 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 13:13:03 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 13:14:22 <LadyHawk> [18/7][13:59:02] <Eddi|zuHause> LadyHawk: that cloak is useless because you join channels before it's active. so everybody has your IP already 13:14:23 <LadyHawk> i know 13:14:37 <LadyHawk> i've turned it back off, i dont mind people seeing my ip 13:15:06 <LadyHawk> it'll just tell you i'm an idle fool 13:15:07 <LadyHawk> :) 13:15:09 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@0001f1cd.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Things turn out best for those who make the best of how things turn out] 13:15:22 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@5751e87a.skybroadband.com] has joined #openttd 13:15:35 <LadyHawk> aw wait it doesnt 13:15:55 <LadyHawk> ipv4, bubble burst :( 13:16:43 <LadyHawk> the only cloak i was really interested in is off limits.. @need.a.sledgehammer.to.fix.router 13:17:56 <LadyHawk> it's a vhost i tend to set everywhere i can.. comes from back when i was the lucky owner of this http://ladyhawk.flawlesscorruption.net/screens/OUCHrouter.gif 13:23:22 <V453000> hm 13:23:36 <V453000> so just anim_control: returning only ANIMATION_START; ? 13:23:44 <V453000> if I wanted it all the time? 13:25:15 <planetmaker> yes. And anim_next_frame: CB_RESULT_NEXT_FRAME 13:25:37 <planetmaker> though it might jump sometimes, when animation is re-triggered 13:25:51 <planetmaker> and you want one value for anim_speed, too :) 13:26:04 <planetmaker> thugh... fine when set as property 13:26:16 <planetmaker> though even 13:30:48 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd 13:46:54 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:48:40 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 13:52:30 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:58:20 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@5751e87a.skybroadband.com] has quit [Quit: Power corrupts. Absolute power corrupts absolutely] 14:10:09 <V453000> WTF it compiled :D 14:12:31 <andythenorth> :o 14:12:33 <andythenorth> fml 14:12:38 * andythenorth is shocked 14:12:45 <andythenorth> v wrote code :o 14:12:54 <andythenorth> @seen pikka 14:12:54 <DorpsGek> andythenorth: pikka was last seen in #openttd 1 week, 6 days, 18 hours, 52 minutes, and 50 seconds ago: <Pikka> is there really not an option to disable airport limits yet? outrageous 14:13:00 <andythenorth> come back pikka chu 14:13:42 <planetmaker> 'lo andy 14:14:19 <planetmaker> seems FIRS gets fierce competition ;) 14:14:53 <planetmaker> hm... "yet I think FIRS gets fierce competition" looks even better :P 14:14:55 <V453000> wat andy 14:15:25 <V453000> I just copypasted shit, frosch wrote the functional part :P 14:15:31 <V453000> 3 lines ._. 14:19:15 <andythenorth> hmm 14:19:22 <andythenorth> I will raise the game for FIRS 14:19:24 <V453000> anim_control: CB_RESULT_START_ANIMATION; anim_next_frame: CB_RESULT_NEXT_FRAME; anim_speed: 3; 14:19:32 <V453000> should this be enough to make it permanently animate? 14:19:32 * andythenorth thinks up âwtfâ for industries 14:19:41 <andythenorth> FIRS is too boring 14:19:55 <V453000> http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/3513/ 14:20:07 <V453000> andythenorth: you still havent created the economy I suggested :P 14:21:31 <V453000> http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Animation_speed animation length is total length or frame rate? 14:25:40 <planetmaker> V453000, yes. though maybe it needs also triggers set in the property 14:26:20 <planetmaker> animation length in ticks is the length per frame. As is the value in real time 14:32:45 *** kero [~keikoz@78.250.231.109] has joined #openttd 14:34:55 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 14:36:28 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6D3E4.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 14:42:25 <V453000> got it! :D 14:42:46 <V453000> animation_info: [ANIMATION_LOOPING, 128]; this was missing 14:44:10 <V453000> but I have it, one tile animates :> 14:44:19 <planetmaker> <3 14:45:40 <V453000> 12mb larger than the previous one 14:45:50 <V453000> -> 12x16 14:45:52 <V453000> is insane 14:46:11 <V453000> expected, BUT my sprites overlap as they arent <> but square 14:46:25 <V453000> so it is like 50% extra 14:47:28 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:47:48 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 14:47:52 <V453000> now to make the other 15 tiles :-D 14:48:48 <planetmaker> :) 14:58:34 <V453000> 2! :D 14:58:37 <V453000> it is amazing already 14:58:45 <planetmaker> :) 14:58:52 <planetmaker> having fun, eh? 14:58:52 <V453000> no clue about cpu 14:59:03 <V453000> yeah :) 15:05:12 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:05:19 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 15:10:09 <Eddi|zuHause> something's weird today... first, zypper takes ages to start downloading files from the repo, and now it took me 3 tries to download a file from github 15:10:26 <Eddi|zuHause> normal browsing is fine, though 15:35:19 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 15:35:22 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 15:35:44 <Alberth> moin 15:35:52 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 15:36:53 <LordAro> niom 15:41:30 <Eddi|zuHause> mjam 15:43:06 <planetmaker> 'lo 15:43:31 <Taede> hya 15:46:16 *** tycoondemon2 [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:46:31 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 15:48:42 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008b4a.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 15:58:34 *** LSky [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 16:03:15 *** LSky` [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:04:10 *** pthagnar [~pthagnar@cpc7-pres17-2-0-cust28.18-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:11:45 <frosch123> V453000: don't use the "anim_speed" callback, only use the "animation_speed" property 16:11:57 <V453000> okayz :) 16:12:07 <frosch123> else you won't have fun with many industries 16:12:10 <V453000> purely coincidentally, that is what I did :) 16:12:14 <V453000> right 16:12:54 <frosch123> let's say every industry tile on the map with "anim_speed" costs you the performance of one train :p 16:14:07 <V453000> nice :D 16:15:38 <planetmaker> quaak :) 16:15:52 <frosch123> hai 16:17:42 <planetmaker> I found late last night that the patch for the slovak language was already committed. How did you prune it from my hard disk? You must have a trojan installed on my machine ;) 16:18:52 <Alberth> magic bit teleportations 16:19:17 <planetmaker> yeah. And given the size, the bit wise equivalence only allows that assumption 16:19:19 <Eddi|zuHause> i can has teleportation plz? 16:19:29 <planetmaker> sorry, not you, Eddi|zuHause ;) 16:19:56 <planetmaker> first some more cat pictures or so 16:20:16 <Alberth> \o/ cat piccies! 16:20:51 <Alberth> I wonder whether they are yeti resistent :p 16:20:58 <planetmaker> nope 16:21:31 <Eddi|zuHause> pigcats? 16:21:38 <planetmaker> http://www.smbc-comics.com/?id=3415#comic <-- probably something similar applies to yetis and cats 16:29:59 *** LSky [~LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [] 16:31:42 <frosch123> planetmaker: i was upset that you claimed to know my bookmarks 16:31:46 <frosch123> so i tried to compensate 16:32:00 <planetmaker> ah. fair enough :P 16:39:55 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:42:03 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 16:46:50 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:51:38 <Alberth> o/ 16:53:37 <andythenorth> o/ 16:56:31 <V453000> o/ 16:56:34 <V453000> FIRS COMPETITOR 16:58:07 <andythenorth> is that the new name for YETI! 16:58:08 <andythenorth> ?? 16:58:16 <V453000> top secret name 16:58:26 <V453000> FIRS is now a BAD FEATURE 16:58:29 <V453000> :> 16:58:31 <V453000> /evil 16:59:20 <andythenorth> FIRS is CRAP 16:59:30 <V453000> iznt 16:59:34 <V453000> just could use some adjustments :P 17:00:34 <V453000> TO COMPETE BETTER 17:00:35 <V453000> :> 17:00:58 <andythenorth> LOSER 17:02:06 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C31D1.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 17:03:25 <andythenorth> is it makefile re-writing day? 17:04:46 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 17:11:37 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 17:12:12 <planetmaker> see you later 17:14:23 <Alberth> it's that, or parser input language rewriting :) 17:14:53 <V453000> yeti compiling time through the roof with just one animated industry :| 17:15:56 <Eddi|zuHause> partial compiles! 17:17:12 <Alberth> tasty things take time to cook :p 17:18:21 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:24:48 <V453000> still not done :| 17:28:39 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 17:31:06 <V453000> excellent 17:31:06 <V453000> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/20419525/yetiwrecksshit.png 17:31:42 <juzza1> V453000: looks like your source pngs are not compressed? size halved when i resaved some with full compression. might help some weird fellas who want to download and compile for themselves :P 17:31:56 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.137.74.191] has joined #openttd 17:32:09 <V453000> I have no idea how to make 3DS max compress them however 17:33:20 <frosch123> V453000: try encoding an .nfo from nml instead 17:33:30 <V453000> frosch123: how? :d 17:33:39 <frosch123> it's some parameter to nmlc 17:33:57 <frosch123> --nfo instead of --grf 17:34:57 <V453000> trying 17:34:59 <V453000> :D was fast 17:35:26 <V453000> what to do with that? 17:35:28 <frosch123> next try whether grfcodec manages to encode it 17:35:36 <frosch123> or whether we have to write something new :p 17:35:51 <V453000> uhmm 17:35:55 <V453000> never worked with grfcoded 17:35:58 <V453000> c 17:36:31 <frosch123> it's a crappy tool, but the only one we have :p 17:37:37 <frosch123> but if it also fails, we finally have a reason to write something better :) 17:37:55 <frosch123> which i always wanted, but never really did, because it is so boring 17:38:23 <Rubidium> but in what language? 17:38:26 <juzza1> in what format are images stored inside grf? if compressed, does grfcodec/nmlc compress the input images? 17:38:53 <frosch123> it's a lzw compressed bmp 17:38:58 <V453000> ok I downloaded grfcodec 17:38:59 <V453000> what do? 17:39:21 <frosch123> check the nfo what paths it uses for the image files 17:39:30 <andythenorth> partial compiles! 17:39:33 * andythenorth rejoins 17:39:44 <frosch123> then run grfcodec from the directory for which those paths would be valid 17:39:46 <V453000> gfx/ 17:39:49 <V453000> right 17:40:00 <V453000> so I need to copy it to my YETI repository basically 17:40:14 <frosch123> no, you just need to start it from there 17:40:27 <V453000> uhmmm 17:40:31 <V453000> like cd to YETI 17:40:33 <V453000> and then there what 17:40:33 <frosch123> grfcodec resolved path relative to where you started it, instead of relative to the file which references them 17:40:35 <andythenorth> grfcodec isnât crappy! 17:40:39 * andythenorth loves grfcodec 17:41:07 <frosch123> V453000: grfcodec --help :p 17:41:36 <V453000> that doesnt do anything until I would go to the folder where I have grfcodec 17:41:54 <frosch123> put the path in front of it 17:42:07 <frosch123> c:\blabla\grfcodec 17:42:08 <V453000> aha 17:42:10 <V453000> god :D 17:42:27 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:42:50 <frosch123> andythenorth: it's only good since everyone knows the weaknesses and works around them :p 17:43:15 <andythenorth> itâs fast :P 17:43:25 <andythenorth> the only thing that scares me about it is maintenance 17:43:25 <andythenorth> :P 17:43:44 <frosch123> andythenorth: depending on the input data it can be very very slow 17:44:02 <frosch123> decode zbase with it, and try reencoding it 17:44:18 <frosch123> you can go to the pub while it does that 17:44:21 <andythenorth> itâs fast for [limited cases] 17:44:22 <andythenorth> :P 17:44:27 <V453000> managed to run help 17:44:33 <V453000> sooooooo :D 17:45:13 <frosch123> grfcodec -e -g 2 yeti.grf -c path/to/yeti.nfo 17:45:40 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:45:43 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 17:45:49 <frosch123> maybe better put the "-c" more in front though 17:45:59 <frosch123> grfcodec -e -g 2 -c yeti.grf path/to/yeti.nfo 17:47:20 <andythenorth> -s :P 17:48:45 <V453000> no such file or directory ... in which directory do I need to make yeti.nfo if I want to just write YETI.nfo ? instead of path/to/ 17:48:52 <V453000> I have it in both grfcodec and YETI folders 17:48:56 <V453000> throws error 17:49:04 <V453000> do I just have to write there the C:/meh 17:49:13 <frosch123> where is the nfo? 17:49:25 <V453000> in both grfcodec and YETI folders 17:49:43 <V453000> grfcodec folder is where I am starting the grfcodec, from the YETI folder 17:49:49 <frosch123> actually, it's just "path/to", without the "yeti.nfo" 17:50:02 <V453000> XD wat 17:50:14 <frosch123> so, is the .nfo in the folder you start grfcodec from? 17:50:24 <V453000> yes 17:50:26 <frosch123> then do "grfcodec -e -g 2 -c yeti.grf ." 17:50:47 <V453000> it is doing something :D 17:50:49 <V453000> loading sprites 17:53:59 *** smb_ [~smb_@174.84.239.58] has joined #openttd 17:54:13 <Rubidium> and now it's purring along? 17:54:33 <V453000> it is just loading the 2096x2 sprites of death 17:55:09 <frosch123> you can consider the loading as a progress bar :) 17:55:14 <frosch123> loading happens in parallel to encoding 17:55:19 <V453000> :) 17:55:21 <frosch123> so, once it has loaded the last one, it is done 17:55:41 <frosch123> (well, not "parallel", but "interleaved") 17:56:48 <Eddi|zuHause> programs should use daisy-chaining more often :p 17:57:15 <frosch123> is that something dirty about comic fetishism? 17:57:58 <Eddi|zuHause> no. it's what's used in theoretical computer science to run potentially infinite algorithms combined 17:58:02 <Eddi|zuHause> do step 1 of process 1 17:58:11 <Eddi|zuHause> do step 1 of process 2 17:58:15 <Eddi|zuHause> do step 2 of process 1 17:58:18 <Eddi|zuHause> do step 1 of process 3 17:58:21 <Eddi|zuHause> do step 2 of process 2 17:58:28 <Eddi|zuHause> do step 3 of process 1 17:58:30 <Eddi|zuHause> ... 17:58:43 <V453000> wawaaaat Renaming yeti.grf to yeti.bak 17:58:48 <V453000> Replacing yeti.grf with yeti.new 17:58:50 <V453000> what do :D 17:58:57 <Eddi|zuHause> that means it's done 17:59:05 <Eddi|zuHause> and made a backup of your previous build 17:59:05 <frosch123> how big? 17:59:10 <V453000> well yeah that is also what it explicitly says but where do I find it 17:59:19 <frosch123> in the directory you are 17:59:28 <V453000> oh cute 17:59:30 <V453000> 280MB 17:59:40 <glx> for a grf ? 17:59:42 <V453000> 277 more like :P 17:59:46 <V453000> yes 17:59:48 <glx> crazy 17:59:52 <frosch123> so, what's the the extrapolation for the final one? 17:59:56 <Eddi|zuHause> for one industry... .p 18:00:05 <frosch123> 15 times that size? 18:00:35 <V453000> well this is one industry, theoretical final one could be 16 times as much 18:00:39 <V453000> right now I have 5 animations 18:00:49 <V453000> that I woud like to get there 18:00:59 <frosch123> i fear you may break ottd :p 18:01:06 <V453000> one or two could probably be majorly reduced 18:01:08 <V453000> so lets say 3 18:01:12 <frosch123> if you fill the 2GB of spritecache, animation will be sluggish :p 18:01:28 <V453000> mhm 18:01:29 <Eddi|zuHause> frosch123: but the 2GB are uncompressed? 18:01:39 <frosch123> it's runlength-encoded 18:01:49 <frosch123> so, not completely uncompressed 18:02:07 <Eddi|zuHause> that only helps if you have long stretches of same colour, like transparent 18:03:06 <frosch123> if that fails, then V may have to try differential animation 18:03:18 <frosch123> which reuse sprites by drawing them over each other 18:03:35 <Eddi|zuHause> aaaaanyway... "daisy chaining" makes sure that processes that actually do finish get finished in a finite time, even if some processes started earlier run indefinitely 18:04:09 <Eddi|zuHause> basically like cantor's enumeration scheme for merging infinite sets 18:04:31 <Eddi|zuHause> countably-infinite 18:05:15 *** kero [~keikoz@78.250.231.109] has quit [Quit: kero] 18:06:53 * andythenorth cracks knuckles 18:06:58 <andythenorth> ~64 industries to rewrite 18:07:11 <frosch123> 64? 18:07:32 <andythenorth> 62 18:07:42 <Eddi|zuHause> multiple non-overlapping economies 18:07:55 <Eddi|zuHause> overlapping is the wrong word 18:08:22 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Better FIRS? :D 18:08:52 <Eddi|zuHause> what i mean is that of two economies, neither is a subset of the other 18:09:44 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 18:09:53 <andythenorth> FLHerne: unchanged to the end user 18:10:08 * andythenorth just thought of an ugly shortcut though 18:10:49 <V453000> tried to load the grf in openttd, it works correctly, the animation is amazing :D 18:10:50 <FLHerne> But if it's easier to develop, you can save time to slave away making more cool stuff :P 18:12:03 <andythenorth> if I stick in a pointless action 0 for every industry, then the numeric ids will resolve 18:12:07 <Eddi|zuHause> i'm afraid it's already way beyond this chart :p http://xkcd.com/1205/ 18:12:08 <andythenorth> which is the current problem 18:15:37 * andythenorth tries to figure out how many compiles in a week 18:16:02 <andythenorth> maybe about 30 across all newgrfs 18:16:10 <andythenorth> I donât get to work on stuff much these days 18:16:18 <andythenorth> letâs call that 5/day 18:16:40 <andythenorth> yeah, Iâm probably at the limit for winning 18:19:04 <andythenorth> I reckon re-writing 62 FIRS industries puts me on the wrong side 18:19:14 * andythenorth will cheat 18:22:30 <frosch123> do it the av9 way 18:22:35 <frosch123> two industries is enough 18:22:45 <frosch123> one to produce, one to processs 18:22:45 <V453000> so I guess I will just try to code 3 animations and see what comes out of it the nfo way? :D 18:23:33 <V453000> yeti way: all industries except one process :P 18:24:04 <frosch123> V453000: you may need some automated image processing which makes the sprites only contain differences to a base image 18:24:17 <V453000> yeah :| 18:24:29 <frosch123> i believe you can save a lot of spritecache that way, when sprites are mostly transparent 18:27:44 <V453000> well IF I had the sprites not overlap, I could save like 30% too 18:27:56 <V453000> but since it is one image and nml takes squares from it, it overlaps a lot 18:28:05 <V453000> which is certainly not optimal either 18:34:54 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:34:58 <Wolf01> moin 18:35:36 <Rubidium> frosch123: detecting that and performing such "optimizations" might be something useful for your new GRF codec ;) 18:36:20 <frosch123> haha, it won't code the nfo for you? 18:36:32 <frosch123> s/?// 18:37:57 <frosch123> maybe it is just a plan by pm: make yeti require 3 tools for building, so v starts using a compile farm :p 18:39:49 <frosch123> anyway, yet again no reason to replace grfcodec 18:40:14 <Rubidium> but with the nfo you can deduce whether sections of (ground) sprites are overlapping and then cut them accordingly... or just always cut them to ground tile sizes 18:40:52 <Rubidium> and you might be able to deduce which sprites are to be drawn overlapping and remove duplication from the overlapping sprites 18:41:06 <frosch123> sounds more like something for nml 18:41:12 <frosch123> you do not need the sprite data for that 18:41:24 <andythenorth> V453000: do you have a mostly static background, and only small moving parts? 18:41:52 <V453000> rather like everything moving in this case 18:41:57 <andythenorth> hmm 18:42:25 <andythenorth> so you canât render out static sprites and animated sprites? 18:42:42 <andythenorth> are they fully animated, or just moving position? 18:42:43 <frosch123> hmm, i think the sprites are mostly static 18:42:53 <frosch123> except the machinery factory maybe 18:43:00 * andythenorth wonders if weâre pushing the limits of sprite-based blitters 18:43:09 <frosch123> but, the rest i would claim < 10% moving pixels 18:43:10 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has joined #openttd 18:43:10 <andythenorth> V453000: how long do your renders actually take? 18:43:21 <V453000> well yeah, other than the machinery factory it is qutie fine 18:43:27 <V453000> quite* 18:43:40 <andythenorth> are the renders seconds or minutes? 18:43:41 <V453000> andythenorth: generally 2-15 minutes per frame 18:43:44 <andythenorth> :o 18:43:49 <andythenorth> you have high poliygon count? 18:43:55 <andythenorth> loads of radiosity? 18:44:05 <andythenorth> youâre rendering 10k frame size? 18:44:05 <V453000> 750 000 polygons in total for all 16 industries 18:44:26 <V453000> I use displacement maps a lot, that adds a lot of time 18:44:35 <andythenorth> is that a high poly count these days? 18:44:39 * andythenorth is 10 years behind in CGI 18:44:51 <V453000> idk, it mainly is for the whole scene for all industries in total 18:44:53 <Wolf01> lol, I just received the first "wikia newsletter" and my reaction was "how about no?" -> one click unsubscribe 18:44:53 <V453000> sooo meh 18:44:57 <andythenorth> bin most of your polys, use simple meshes, tun off lighting effects 18:45:03 <andythenorth> then convert ottd to 3D render 18:45:05 <V453000> e.g. the construction factory takes 3 minutes to render now 18:45:06 <andythenorth> simples 18:45:14 <V453000> lol 18:45:53 <frosch123> andythenorth: you mean, if we do not have enough space to store the texture, then also add 3d data? 18:46:10 <andythenorth> the texture would be highly compressed 18:46:18 <V453000> frosch123: 128 rendered frames is a bigger problem than animated 3D model probably 18:46:26 <andythenorth> also canât we just dump all that onto OpenGL and have the graphics card do it? 18:46:33 <andythenorth> or whatever the modern Open GL is? 18:46:52 <frosch123> i rather rewrite grfcodec :p 18:47:10 <andythenorth> 3D OpenTTD 18:47:13 <andythenorth> itâs the logical conclusion 18:47:22 <andythenorth> also with pay-to-pay DLC 18:47:25 <andythenorth> and subways 18:47:31 <andythenorth> but not daylength 18:47:46 <frosch123> isn't daylength part of every pay-to-play? 18:47:57 <andythenorth> kinda 18:48:02 <andythenorth> pay money, game goes faster 18:48:16 <andythenorth> donât pay money, watch slow progress bars 18:48:19 <andythenorth> so yeah 18:48:21 <frosch123> play 5 minutes on smart phone to put house, wait 1 day for it to complete 18:48:30 <frosch123> unless boosted with even more money :) 18:48:34 * andythenorth considers inverse pay-to-play 18:48:35 <Eddi|zuHause> that's kind of the opposite of what people want daylength for? 18:48:40 <andythenorth> the train nerds just want it slower right? 18:48:43 <andythenorth> so charge them 18:48:50 <glx> real time train speed 18:48:53 <andythenorth> âpay â¬1 to make this progress bar stop" 18:49:07 <frosch123> you need to pay the money equivalence of the train fuel? 18:49:13 <frosch123> solar trains are cheaper? 18:49:35 <glx> engine building time 18:49:56 <glx> and you can build only one at the time (per depot) 18:50:24 <glx> (RTS style :) ) 18:51:53 <andythenorth> can I make a newgrf and sell it to the train nerds? 18:51:57 <andythenorth> just with silly dates 18:52:07 *** smb_ [~smb_@174.84.239.58] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:52:12 <andythenorth> ship it with an openttd fork 18:52:16 <andythenorth> preinstalled 18:52:22 <andythenorth> âfork' 18:52:27 <Alberth> patch the game :p 18:52:41 <Alberth> remove the date :) 18:52:59 <Alberth> you don't need it anyway :) 18:53:25 <V453000> hm 18:53:40 <V453000> so a good thing would be to render 1 statick background, and 1 file with all moving objects? 18:54:38 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: sounds reasonable 18:55:23 <V453000> I guess I then mix them in the spritelayout right 18:55:51 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, as child sprites 18:56:32 <FLHerne> "andythenorth wonders if weâre pushing the limits of sprite-based blitters" Does any other game with OTTD's graphical complexity still use sprite blitters? 18:57:10 <Eddi|zuHause> opensource? maybe. commercial? no 18:57:27 *** smb_ [~smb_@174.84.239.58] has joined #openttd 18:57:44 <glx> commercial usually use paid engines 18:57:49 <glx> and framework 18:58:02 <FLHerne> What commercial things are still sprite-based? Some strange Japanese thing? 18:58:16 <FLHerne> Mobile apps, but those aren't so fiddly 18:59:05 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:06:05 *** LSky` [LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has joined #openttd 19:07:00 <V453000> well, for today I will just complete the 300MB newGRF 19:07:20 <V453000> and I will try to tind out how to render the things as I need them afterwards 19:10:04 <FLHerne> It's a strange world when addons are a couple of orders of magnitude bigger than the actual game o.O 19:13:12 <andythenorth> plenty of sprite based iOS apps 19:13:18 <andythenorth> dunno how theyâre blitting though 19:18:28 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has joined #openttd 19:19:30 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:19:38 <frosch123> FLHerne: consider "factorio" :) 19:20:03 <frosch123> they decided against an established engine, since they (reasonably) doubted it would handle 100k of objects 19:20:41 <frosch123> it uses opengl, but the source sprites are all .png 19:22:50 <FLHerne> Compared to OTTD, it doesn't look like it does recolouring, or palette animation, or trying to sort sprites in isometric fake-3D? 19:23:27 <frosch123> haha, ofc no recolouring and palette animation :p 19:23:54 <frosch123> i guess it is pretty much isometric fake-3d though 19:24:12 <frosch123> it has smooth zooming (with opengl), but no rotation (well, because sprites) 19:24:45 <FLHerne> frosch123: The screenshots I've seen just look top-down, except individual sprites. Have they rejigged it at some point? 19:25:11 *** trendynick [~trendynic@188.26.254.160] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:25:13 <frosch123> huh? i said "no rotation" 19:25:21 <frosch123> so, always "top down" 19:26:48 <FLHerne> I mean pure top-down, without isometric fake-3d-ness 19:27:17 <FLHerne> Not that I've played it, I'm just looking through screenshots 19:27:46 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 19:28:11 <frosch123> stuff slightly overlaps, but there are no bridges 19:28:40 <frosch123> it also uses horizontal/vertical as main directiions 19:28:44 <frosch123> instead of diagonal like ottd 19:28:52 <frosch123> so yes, it may be somewhat easier wrt. sorting 19:29:07 <frosch123> FLHerne: you should watch the trailer, it's awesome :) 19:29:24 <frosch123> correction to earlier: they added recoloring this week :p 19:31:48 <andythenorth> looks retro 19:32:01 <andythenorth> like an amiga game 19:32:37 <andythenorth> hmm, OS X version 19:32:43 * andythenorth has plans though 19:32:50 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.137.74.191] has quit [] 19:37:33 *** Defaultti [defaultti@lakka.kapsi.fi] has quit [Quit: Quitting.] 19:38:44 *** Defaultti [defaultti@lakka.kapsi.fi] has joined #openttd 19:38:46 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 19:56:15 *** Smedles [~quassel@58.160.136.199] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:57:05 *** Smedles [~quassel@58.160.136.199] has joined #openttd 20:01:35 <andythenorth> ho ho 20:01:40 <andythenorth> Iron Horse misses all trains :) 20:01:46 <andythenorth> partial compile not ftw 20:02:07 * andythenorth back to reading uncommented nfo :P 20:04:31 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:05:52 <andythenorth> oopsie :o 20:05:56 <andythenorth> copy and paste fail 20:07:15 *** Yotson [~Yotson@2001:980:6ac8:1:2013:9ec8:b6b:ed6f] has quit [Quit: .] 20:10:54 * andythenorth tried to make a grf by repeating header block over and over again 20:12:06 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 20:12:29 <andythenorth> partial compile is awesome when it works though 20:12:38 * andythenorth can test graphics changes much faster 20:13:34 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 20:14:51 <Eddi|zuHause> need a new game to obsess about :/ 20:15:56 *** LadyHawk [~LadyHawk@85.255.233.38] has joined #openttd 20:15:57 <FLHerne> Eddi|zuHause: Warzone2100 is ok, except for the graphics and the AI 20:16:10 <FLHerne> And 0ad is nice, but painfully slow 20:16:26 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has joined #openttd 20:16:35 *** LadyHawk is now known as Guest3162 20:16:35 *** Guest3162 [~LadyHawk@85.255.233.38] has quit [] 20:17:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i tried to play path of exile again, but it's painfully unplayable 20:17:53 <Eddi|zuHause> boss appears, boss strikes, screen freezes 5 seconds to load the hit animation, and you're lying dead on the ground 20:19:19 <andythenorth> doom? 20:19:54 <Eddi|zuHause> have i mentioned that i don't have any reflexes for this kind of game? 20:20:08 <andythenorth> nah doom is easy 20:20:16 <andythenorth> youâre reflexes canât be much worse than mine 20:20:37 <andythenorth> anyway, /me biab 20:20:39 <andythenorth> or bed 20:20:39 <FLHerne> Assaultcube? You still need daft reflexes because of the obsessive loonies, but at least it doesn't lag 20:20:41 <Eddi|zuHause> i played some doom a few decades ago 20:20:45 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 20:21:14 <Eddi|zuHause> i generally don't like that kind of genre 20:23:32 <FLHerne> Minecraft? Commercial, but still awesome :D 20:24:14 <FLHerne> SimSig is kind of fun, in a rail-enthusiast-obsessive kind of way 20:29:31 *** MJP [~mjp@hq.z77.fr] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:34:38 *** LSky` [LSky@5ED4B2EA.cm-7-5c.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:36:09 <V453000> OMFG I WROTE A .BAT TO COMPILE THE NFO WAY EASILY 20:36:34 <V453000> come on tell me I am awesome linux code madmen 20:40:03 <Alberth> :D 20:41:25 <Alberth> .BAT files aren't that expressive compared to real unix shell scripts, but it's a good step towards using a computer in the way it is intended 20:41:32 <Alberth> so YAY ! 20:44:02 <Eddi|zuHause> is the windows command line still in the dos 6 age? 20:44:04 <frosch123> we will get him there :) 20:44:33 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:44:47 *** Pereba [~UserNick@187.59.110.112] has joined #openttd 20:44:52 <frosch123> is there a difference between dos 6 and dos 3? 20:45:50 <Alberth> it's twice as big? or twice as slow? 20:46:05 <frosch123> i mean wrt. scripting support 20:46:11 <V453000> hm, how do I make the industry animate only when producing? 20:46:19 <V453000> animation_triggers: bitmask(ANIM_TRIGGER_INDTILE_DISTRIBUTES_CARGO); 20:46:22 <V453000> added this into properties 20:46:24 <V453000> wrong? :D 20:46:57 <frosch123> didn't you use the "next_frame" callback? 20:46:57 <V453000> it animates all the time apparently 20:47:00 <V453000> I did 20:47:12 <frosch123> then, make it a switch and check whether there is cargo waiting 20:47:16 <V453000> graphics { default: industry_3X_33_spritelayout; anim_control: CB_RESULT_START_ANIMATION; anim_next_frame: CB_RESULT_NEXT_FRAME; } 20:47:18 <frosch123> return the same frame when nothing is waiting 20:47:29 <V453000> aha 20:47:39 <V453000> and remove the animation_triggers then? 20:47:47 <frosch123> alternatively you can do complicated stuff to start/stop animation 20:47:55 <frosch123> which is better wrt. performance 20:48:03 <V453000> mhf 20:48:17 <V453000> I just thought making it animate only when producing will save some performance 20:48:31 <frosch123> you could use ANIM_TRIGGER_INDTILE_RECEIVED_CARGO to start the animation 20:48:51 <frosch123> and anim_next_frame to stop it 20:48:58 <frosch123> yeah, i guess that would be best 20:49:46 <frosch123> V453000: if you want to save performance, then you need to stop it, returning the same frame does not work then :) 20:49:56 <V453000> right 20:49:58 <V453000> soo 20:50:06 <V453000> how do I apply the trigger to a switch? 20:50:58 <frosch123> set the animation trigger property to bitmask(blabla_RECEIVED_CARGO, blabla_INDUSTRY_LOOP) 20:51:14 <frosch123> link the "anim_control" to a switch 20:51:29 <frosch123> which checks "extra_callback_info2" 20:51:58 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has joined #openttd 20:52:05 <V453000> isnt distributes_cargo better for the overtime production 20:52:28 <V453000> guess that would require that the player is picking up the cargo which isnt guaranteed 20:52:41 <frosch123> then make it return "start"/"stop" animation and "nothing" as default case 20:52:52 <frosch123> V453000: i thought: start when cargo arrives, stop when cargo is empty 20:52:59 <frosch123> no idea what you want with "distribute" 20:53:15 <V453000> k your approach makes sense :P 20:53:40 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 20:54:33 <frosch123> night 20:54:37 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d008b4a.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 20:59:47 <V453000> hm, the question is what does extra_callback_info2 output there :d 21:00:06 <V453000> aka what to put to "XX" in XX: CB_RESULT... 21:00:19 <V453000> to make the switch react to result XX 21:09:27 <Alberth> in callback_flags of industry tiles? 21:09:36 <Alberth> it says not to use those 21:09:47 <V453000> frosch sed :D 21:10:22 <V453000> but this is from the anim_control callback 21:10:29 <V453000> checking for extra_info2 21:10:47 <V453000> like, when current_date gives e.g. 1920, I dont know what extra_info2 gives 21:11:07 <Alberth> ah, right. I see that box :) 21:11:14 <Alberth> now trying to decode it :) 21:12:10 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 21:12:59 <Alberth> extra_callback_info2 contains the reason to trigger the animation, see the table below <-- and pointing to http://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:IndustryTiles#Animation_triggers at the bottom 21:13:13 <V453000> well yeah 21:13:14 <V453000> but 21:13:16 <V453000> :d 21:13:58 <V453000> aha 21:13:59 <V453000> so like ANIM_TRIGGER_INDTILE_RECEIVED_CARGO : CB_RESULT_START_ANIMATION; 21:14:29 <Alberth> yes 21:14:44 <V453000> hm stop if cargo is empty 21:14:58 <Alberth> and probably more frame numbers, as you can also return a frame number 21:16:22 <V453000> what do you mean? 21:16:25 <Alberth> CB_RESULT_START_ANIMATION does "respectively start the animation in its current frame" it seems, so I think you must return 0 for the first frame 21:17:09 <Alberth> "Return the animation frame to show, or CB_RESULT_XXX ..." <-- is says you can also return a frame number 21:17:16 <Alberth> *It 21:18:35 <Alberth> so I am guessing return 0, and with anim_next_frame the next frame CB_RESULT_NEXT_FRAME or CB_RESULT_STOP_ANIMATION 21:18:54 <Alberth> with a few random bits if you want it randomized 21:22:18 <Alberth> gn 21:22:23 <V453000> gn 21:23:45 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 21:37:48 *** Brumi [~quassel@78-131-41-191.pool.digikabel.hu] has quit [] 21:39:38 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:50:27 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 21:51:04 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6D3E4.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 21:59:03 *** smb_ [~smb_@174.84.239.58] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:59:35 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C31D1.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/nkczDT] 22:02:08 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:12:38 *** SylvieLorxu [~sylvie@dhcp-077-251-165-191.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 22:35:12 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 22:35:53 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-108-52-130-213.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 22:40:07 *** MTsPony1 [~marctraid@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has joined #openttd 22:40:07 *** MTsPony is now known as Guest3169 22:40:08 *** MTsPony1 is now known as MTsPony 22:40:17 <Wolf01> 'night 22:40:26 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 22:44:32 *** Guest3169 [~marctraid@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:12:19 *** MTsPony is now known as MTsPony_zzz 23:22:55 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:24:24 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6D3E4.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 23:32:21 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCC4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:46:09 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]