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00:00:44 *** myr0 [~none@81-234-221-227-no23.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:04:05 *** SHOTbyGUN [shotbygun@213-186-253-83.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:49:15 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 00:49:20 <supermop> hi 01:17:42 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:42:53 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.41.239.232] has quit [Quit: AdiIRC - The only client that takes care of your wife while sancho not come. (www.adiirc.com)] 02:01:52 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-72-94-147-76.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:02:13 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-72-94-147-76.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 02:28:25 *** InvokeStatic__ [~Invoke@c-24-11-157-247.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:33:34 *** InvokeStatic [~Invoke@c-24-11-157-247.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 02:35:45 *** DabuYu [DabuYu@128.250.79.238] has joined #openttd 02:39:06 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 02:40:55 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 02:41:11 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 02:45:26 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:47:23 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:10:38 *** zeknurn` [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 03:15:31 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:15:31 *** zeknurn` is now known as zeknurn 03:17:55 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-83-94.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:19:09 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-83-94.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 03:41:14 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d58-106-23-62.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 03:49:52 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-72-94-147-76.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:49:57 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-72-94-147-76.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 04:06:25 *** Giratina548 [~james@107-209-131-23.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 04:35:43 *** Giratina548 [~james@107-209-131-23.lightspeed.mssnks.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 04:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67895.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 04:56:16 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4F17.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 05:07:36 *** MTsPony [~MTsPony@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:15:56 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 05:17:38 <supermop> hi 05:45:00 <supermop> it is surprisingly hard to get a good photo of pavement 05:48:30 <V453000> point. :) 05:48:55 <V453000> esp when you want to create a seamless texture from it 05:49:05 *** TomyLobo [~foo@91.65.115.103] has joined #openttd 05:50:46 <supermop> also could not get high enough anywhere downtown without having weird glare or reflections on the stone 05:52:35 <V453000> yeah I honestly dont know how people do it but I think by flying drones 05:55:10 <supermop> all i'd need is some kind of gantry or scaffold 05:55:26 <supermop> and patience for right lighting/time of day 05:55:46 <supermop> and permission from the city to perform this at various places around the city 05:56:35 <supermop> hmm 05:56:50 <supermop> also the right lens to get a flat image 06:00:08 <Pikka> surely the internet is full of freely-usable concrete pavement textures? :P 06:00:18 <Pikka> or non-concrete, for that matter 06:06:36 <supermop> honed victorian bluestone not so much 06:10:22 <V453000> xd 06:10:25 <V453000> cant be so picky 06:11:44 <supermop> pssh whats the point of a plain concrete sidewalk 06:13:39 <V453000> well perhaps get a texture from the web and photoshop it into something more interesting 06:13:47 <V453000> is what I would consider 06:13:50 <supermop> yeah 06:14:20 <supermop> other option is skewing the photos i took obliquely into something useful 06:16:04 <V453000> oh 06:16:11 <V453000> well that is standard workflow 06:16:23 <V453000> take photo - undistort - skew/do whatever to make it work 06:16:49 <V453000> I didnt do much of my own textures but it always was a lot of effort to get them right from the photo 06:17:26 <planetmaker> moin 06:17:59 <V453000> hy 06:29:16 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6BA88.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 06:33:43 *** TomyLobo [~foo@91.65.115.103] has quit [Quit: Standby mode...] 06:35:23 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@88.130.171.238] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:36:48 *** Yotson [~Yotson@2001:980:6ac8:1:19a2:a9f1:8735:8520] has joined #openttd 06:38:22 <Pikka> my textures are all hand-drawn because I'm a purist like that :P 06:38:54 *** Flygon__ is now known as Flygon 06:39:05 <Flygon> Man 06:39:11 <Flygon> I'm too lazy to even draw textures :U 06:39:18 <Flygon> All my stuff looks flat :U 06:44:44 <V453000> Pikka the hard working minion 06:46:38 <Pikka> I'm my own minion, though 06:46:43 <Pikka> an autominion, if you will. 06:53:49 <V453000> yay, 06:54:04 <V453000> how dare you not be slave of The Community (tm) 07:00:04 <Pikka> but which Community (tm)? 07:00:20 <Pikka> it's dying, haven't you heard? 07:06:34 <V453000> o 07:06:36 <V453000> well shit 07:17:15 <V453000> Pikka what are your camera coordinates? 07:17:52 <V453000> for trains 07:17:57 <Pikka> why, what did you do? 07:18:15 <Pikka> same as for anything, isn't it? 07:18:22 <V453000> am trying to setup cameras and render resolution 07:18:37 <V453000> well for my industries I use one camera which sees all of the 16 tiles :) 07:18:50 <V453000> I Could just downsize it from there I suppose 07:19:16 <Pikka> probably best. since it's an orthoganal camera it can zoom in and out at will, so the position doesn't really make any difference 07:19:39 <Pikka> orthographic too 07:19:53 <V453000> sure but distance from object vs. rendering resolution matters 07:20:08 <Pikka> only proportionally :P 07:20:11 *** Extrems1 [borgs@modemcable204.141-177-173.mc.videotron.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:20:15 <V453000> me is thinking 07:20:22 <Pikka> always dangerous 07:20:45 <V453000> hm 07:20:46 <V453000> no 07:21:00 <V453000> moving the camera forward or backward (zooming it) changes things 07:21:11 <V453000> things get larger or smaller 07:21:17 <Pikka> fancy that 07:21:26 <Pikka> zooming makes things larger or smaller! 07:21:27 <Eddi|zuHause> that's kinda the point of zooming? 07:21:33 <V453000> yes, that is 07:21:46 <V453000> which means resolution matters more than just proportionally 07:21:58 <V453000> in relation to camera distance 07:22:13 <V453000> I can render in 256px width but I still need correct "zoom" 07:22:19 <Pikka> yes 07:22:21 <V453000> am asking if you have any tested vehicle value for such 07:22:27 <Pikka> oh 07:22:36 <Pikka> well, as you know, I have fun values, but 07:22:43 <V453000> thats fine 07:22:51 <Pikka> with my 560m tile :P 07:23:05 <Eddi|zuHause> if you reduce the size from 4x4 to 1x1, you need to zoom in 4x to get the same resolution 07:23:13 <Pikka> camera at 200/-200/163m 07:23:20 <Pikka> 82 degree FOV 07:23:28 <V453000> O_O 07:23:29 <V453000> 82? 07:23:30 <Pikka> rendering at 320x320 07:23:52 <V453000> hmm 07:24:08 <Pikka> it's only a couple hundred m from the origin with a 560m tile length, so it's zoomed right out :P 07:24:20 <V453000> that is clear 07:24:25 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: alternatively, you render 4x4 anyway, and just cut off the excessive stuff 07:24:27 <V453000> hm 07:24:33 <V453000> yeah Eddi I thought about that too 07:24:35 <V453000> :D 07:24:41 <V453000> might actually do that 07:24:42 <Eddi|zuHause> you already have a cutting routine 07:24:54 <V453000> yarr 07:25:06 <V453000> yeah that might be best 07:25:12 <Pikka> lol 07:25:23 <peter1138> Let's use non-orthogonal render, that'll work out well... 07:25:24 <V453000> mainly cause I can get multiple sprites rendered in one go 07:25:25 <Pikka> well, the way I ended up with an 82 degree fov was to just put the camera wherever 07:25:37 <Pikka> and then just tweak the fov until the sprites came out the right size. 07:25:40 <V453000> -whereever- ? :D 07:25:42 <V453000> XD oh 07:25:51 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 07:25:56 <Pikka> I mean, at an arbitrary distance from the origin :P 07:26:07 <peter1138> It's only the camera angle that matters... 07:26:11 <Pikka> yse 07:26:11 <V453000> well idk I went from having FOV 45deg, have the camera at 30deg looking down, and then zoom in/out to get it rights 07:26:23 <Pikka> an arbitrary distance but the correct angle :P 07:26:27 <V453000> yay 07:26:42 <V453000> well I will consider how valid rendering 4x4 is XD 07:26:53 <V453000> probably very actually 07:28:25 *** Extrems [borgs@modemcable204.141-177-173.mc.videotron.ca] has joined #openttd 07:29:54 <peter1138> Did it turn out the Pikka's 10cc engines are the right length in - view? 07:30:10 <peter1138> With that silly 21-24-28-32 argument... 07:30:11 <V453000> maybe "right" but definitely not "nice" :( 07:30:58 <Pikka> well, my engines are rendered so by definition they're the right length :P 07:32:42 <Pikka> and they are...90 px coupler-face to coupler-face? so 22.5. :D 07:33:12 <peter1138> Sounds about right. Someone had a different measurement for them than 90px. 07:33:24 <peter1138> Must've been measuring something else :S 07:33:42 <V453000> it doesnt matter how right it is, it still looks wrong :P 07:33:46 <Pikka> they might not have been measuring from the same place, I know how the couplers are "supposed" to overlap. 07:33:49 <Pikka> why does it look wrong? 07:34:00 <Pikka> the stretched views look ridiculous to me now I'm used to pineapples ;) 07:34:01 <V453000> gaps between stuff are very wtf 07:34:06 <Pikka> the gaps are a problem 07:34:17 <Pikka> but probably not unfixable if someone took the time 07:34:23 <Pikka> that one patch was almost there? 07:34:43 <V453000> I doubt it is valid if it breaks existing newgrfs 07:34:55 <Pikka> it'd have to be optional 07:35:18 <V453000> that would create 2 concurrent standards which would be even bigger mess 07:35:29 <Eddi|zuHause> it can't be optional 07:35:44 <Eddi|zuHause> or... it'd be extremely messy 07:35:51 <peter1138> That patch almost worked. 07:35:57 <peter1138> But didn't always. 07:36:10 <Pikka> V453000, in that case, let's break existing newgrfs :D 07:36:30 <peter1138> Problem is, it breaks the original GRFs as well. 07:36:42 <V453000> I think if you wanted to break existing content, it would be a lot more valid to already create a lot more of OpenTTD 2.0 than that :P 07:36:46 <Pikka> original grfs have gaps between vehicles 07:36:53 <Pikka> not as big, they're slightly stretched 07:36:57 <peter1138> They're 28px long. 07:36:59 <Pikka> but it's not "broken" anyway 07:37:06 <Pikka> sprites overlapping isn't "broken", just ugly. 07:37:10 <peter1138> Which is 5.5 pixels longer than 22.5. 07:37:15 <Pikka> all the grfs will still work properly. 07:37:26 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:37:43 <Eddi|zuHause> Pikka: i'm pretty sure CETS will be "broken" 07:38:03 <V453000> you still believe CETS will ever get graphics? :d 07:38:13 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe 07:38:21 <peter1138> I have a feeling we really need to update the vehicle position resolution to make it work well. 07:38:22 <Pikka> CETS will become easier to make because the vehicles won't have to stretch between views :P 07:39:02 <peter1138> We should add sub-angles too 07:39:16 <Eddi|zuHause> Pikka: possibly. but existing CETS will still break 07:39:19 <peter1138> Base it on virtual axle positions. 07:39:53 <peter1138> And then instead of 8 angles, you could have... many. 07:40:01 <Pikka> but nobody uses existing CETS, I say, based on no evidence whatsoever. 07:40:05 <Pikka> wrong, peter1138 07:40:06 <peter1138> Just because 10cc isn't big enough already. 07:40:09 <Pikka> exactly. 07:40:36 <V453000> yay 07:40:40 <Eddi|zuHause> only one solution to that: use 3D models :p 07:40:46 <peter1138> Let's make engines as models, and let ottd render them... 07:40:47 <peter1138> HAH 07:52:06 *** blathijs [matthijs@tika.stderr.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:52:28 *** lugo [~oftc-webi@tmo-106-237.customers.d1-online.com] has joined #openttd 07:53:57 *** blathijs [matthijs@tika.stderr.nl] has joined #openttd 07:54:31 *** namad7 [aaaaa@pool-74-111-111-176.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 07:54:53 *** liq4 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 07:56:45 <V453000> it isnt as bad idea as it sounds peter :P 07:57:19 *** Cybert1nus [~Cybertinu@cybertinus.customer.cloud.nl] has joined #openttd 07:59:34 *** ProfFrink [~proffrink@37.86.208.46.dyn.plus.net] has joined #openttd 08:00:11 *** Netsplit graviton.oftc.net <-> oxygen.oftc.net quits: liq3, Prof_Frink, namad8, @Belugas, jinks, mgrunin, Cybertinus, Wing_ 08:00:11 *** ProfFrink is now known as Prof_Frink 08:02:28 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d58-106-23-62.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:02:36 *** EyeMWing [~Wing@c-68-33-226-154.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 08:02:56 *** Netsplit over, joins: mgrunin 08:03:06 *** Belugas [~belugas@216.191.111.230] has joined #openttd 08:03:09 *** mode/#openttd [+o Belugas] by ChanServ 08:03:32 *** Netsplit over, joins: jinks 08:08:42 <peter1138> voxels! 08:12:21 <V453000> hmmmmmmmm 08:14:03 <LordAro> mmmmmmmmh 08:19:48 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 08:21:56 *** blathijs [matthijs@tika.stderr.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 08:23:34 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 08:24:56 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@76.178.136.186] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 08:29:58 *** blathijs [matthijs@tika.stderr.nl] has joined #openttd 08:30:02 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:30:27 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 08:30:41 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:09:14 <argoneus> good morning train friends 09:09:33 <Eddi|zuHause> what if there are train haters? 09:10:13 <argoneus> are you trying to say 09:10:19 <argoneus> the set of people who dislike trains is not empty? 09:10:49 <Eddi|zuHause> no, i was asking. 09:10:57 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:12:06 <argoneus> I dunno 09:12:07 * argoneus shrugs 09:19:59 <peter1138> I LIKE TRAINS 09:21:05 <V453000> I does not 09:21:35 <V453000> hm I guess max train height of 2.5m isnt enough if one yeti is 3m 09:21:43 <V453000> bad template :( 09:21:46 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Quit: .] 09:22:30 *** zeknurn [~sup@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 09:23:29 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 09:23:33 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 09:23:42 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 09:24:34 <Eddi|zuHause> usual train cars are 4m high and 3m wide 09:26:40 <V453000> which doesnt apply much to 5m long train if tile is 10m :P 09:27:43 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 09:28:29 <Eddi|zuHause> my tiles are 32m long 09:29:35 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-83-94.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:30:26 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:31:04 <V453000> so like /8 high 09:31:12 <V453000> wat :D 09:31:25 <V453000> hm 09:31:41 <V453000> will have to test shit :D 09:34:09 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:35:55 <Eddi|zuHause> well. originally i wanted to go with 24m, which would probably fit TT-scale a bit better, but then vehicles would get more than 1 tile long 09:36:45 <Eddi|zuHause> with 32m the vehicles get more "fine-scale"-ish 09:38:21 <peter1138> Let's support longer than 8/8 vehicles! 09:38:45 <peter1138> (By making them separate parts that split on bends) 09:40:09 *** Fuco [foobar@server.dasnet.cz] has joined #openttd 09:43:01 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.41.239.232] has joined #openttd 09:45:40 *** pixar [~Mychomize@46-236-110-230.customer.t3.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:46:02 *** pixar [~Mychomize@46-236-110-230.customer.t3.se] has joined #openttd 09:46:36 *** SHOTbyGUN [shotbygun@213-186-253-83.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 09:47:22 <argoneus> wouldn't it be possible to implement metro though 09:47:28 <argoneus> like, make railroad tracks that have no collision 09:47:33 <argoneus> and make them super expensive 09:47:44 <argoneus> (to discourage long distances) 09:47:51 <Eddi|zuHause> what would that solve? 09:48:00 <argoneus> you could have realistic metro around cities 09:48:20 <argoneus> perhaps a special transparency mode 09:48:23 <argoneus> which would simulate underground 09:48:24 * argoneus shrugs 09:49:13 <Eddi|zuHause> and why would collisions be the key point? 09:49:47 <Eddi|zuHause> the key point of metro is that you don't have to destroy a lot of houses... 09:50:09 <argoneus> exactly 09:50:14 <argoneus> no collision so you could build through houses 09:50:31 <Eddi|zuHause> that's not what a collision is 09:50:55 <argoneus> what is a collision then? 09:50:58 <Eddi|zuHause> and no, that is not possible. 09:51:12 <Eddi|zuHause> a "collision" is: "two vehicles cannot be at the same place" 09:51:57 <argoneus> two entities cannot be at the same place 09:51:59 <argoneus> railroad + building 09:52:02 <argoneus> ??? 09:52:38 <Eddi|zuHause> but in this game, railroads and buildings are not "entities" in that sense 09:52:56 <argoneus> well I don't know 09:53:03 <argoneus> but it seems logical to me that a railroad would collide with a house 09:53:35 <Eddi|zuHause> well, not in the sense that you can just switch it off... 09:53:56 <Eddi|zuHause> (which would be possible for trains, road vehicles, etc.) 09:54:03 <argoneus> oh 09:54:14 <argoneus> I thought every static object had a common parent 09:54:15 <Eddi|zuHause> (because those are "entities" 09:54:20 <argoneus> railroads, houses, industries etc 09:54:35 <Eddi|zuHause> ) 09:54:35 <argoneus> that's how I would implement it anyway, but then again my programming skills a shit :< 09:54:55 <Eddi|zuHause> that's how you would implement it, but that's not how it's implemented 09:55:28 <argoneus> :( 09:56:15 <Eddi|zuHause> the way it is implemented is much faster and space efficient, but less flexible 09:56:43 <argoneus> can you give a tldr on how it's implemented? 09:57:22 <Eddi|zuHause> it's called a "map array". each tile is an array entry of fixed size 09:57:40 <Eddi|zuHause> so you can fit a house on a tile, or a railway track, but not both, because that would require more space 09:58:36 <argoneus> well 09:58:40 <argoneus> but isn't it the same 09:58:44 <argoneus> if you had an array of Object* 09:58:46 <argoneus> ? 09:58:49 <Eddi|zuHause> no 09:59:13 <Eddi|zuHause> because then you had an array of pointers, but the Objects themselves are all over the place 09:59:25 <Eddi|zuHause> which causes fragmented memory and cache misses and stuff 09:59:29 <argoneus> oh 09:59:45 <argoneus> I never really dwelved into optimizing (is that the correct spelling?) 09:59:46 <peter1138> Oh gods no. 10:00:03 <Eddi|zuHause> also, creating and destroying objects takes a lot of time 10:00:17 <peter1138> There is a reason that OpenTTD doesn't suck all your system's RAM. It's because we care, unlike a lot of modern games.... 10:00:46 <Eddi|zuHause> afaik, simutrans is implemented this way, and it's horrible 10:01:00 *** lugo [~oftc-webi@000189e6.user.oftc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:01:10 <Eddi|zuHause> you couldn't have 4096x4096 maps with that 10:01:14 <argoneus> so instead of having flexible polymorphism 10:01:18 <peter1138> I read somewhere that Simutrans uses a hundred bytes or so for each tile. May not have been accurate. 10:01:18 <argoneus> you just make everything fixed 10:01:27 <argoneus> which makes it faster and more predictable? 10:01:33 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 10:01:33 <argoneus> like, where your memory is etc 10:01:50 <peter1138> Only the map array is fixed size like that. 10:02:13 <peter1138> Other things are regular objects, also we use custom memory pools to arrange that as well. 10:03:41 <argoneus> oh, no idea what those are 10:04:01 <argoneus> is that like 10:04:23 <argoneus> instead of letting the RAM put things wherever it wants, you define your own huge "RAM" and put things there manually? 10:04:34 <Eddi|zuHause> somewhat 10:04:34 <argoneus> the system*** 10:04:52 <Eddi|zuHause> like "all vehicles go in this general area" 10:05:21 <Eddi|zuHause> which, again, helps with caching when you loop over all vehicles 10:05:41 <peter1138> And means you don't need to waste time with reference tracking./ 10:09:53 *** liq4 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 10:18:25 *** fjb is now known as Guest2468 10:18:27 *** fjb [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:23:48 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 10:25:31 *** Guest2468 [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:28:46 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out] 10:48:08 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 10:50:44 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d58-106-23-62.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 11:04:33 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 11:24:02 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 11:30:37 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:40:36 <Eddi|zuHause> www.informatik.uni-halle.de/~krause/Bildschirmfoto31.png <- this looks weird... 11:45:56 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 12:00:40 <peter1138> Heh, nice. 12:00:57 <peter1138> Seems you broke the tunnel... 12:08:06 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:12:21 <fjb> Moin 12:13:42 <fjb> Multi level crossings in train fewer are difficult. 12:17:14 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 12:17:32 <Eddi|zuHause> and directly next to a station it's impossible 12:17:54 <V453000> bad featurz 12:18:10 <b_jonas> heh, "train fewer" 12:20:30 <Pikka> drain fever, innit 12:21:23 <V453000> me is counting if 256 variations of a wagon is enough 12:21:35 <V453000> 8 loading stages, gives max of 32 cargoes 12:21:40 <V453000> should be about right 12:21:50 <Pikka> 8 loading stages? 12:22:04 <V453000> sure thingz 12:24:05 <Pikka> very slow loading rate? 12:24:09 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 12:24:16 <Pikka> more than 3 is a waste imo. 12:24:34 <V453000> BUT GRAFIX 12:24:36 <V453000> yeah 3 is just fine 12:25:00 <Pikka> why are you limited to 256 variations, anyway? :P 12:25:01 <V453000> but having amount of loading ticks == amount of loading sprites is very nice 12:25:12 <V453000> well am not limited, just inconvenient 12:25:18 <Pikka> in nml? 12:25:40 <V453000> I am creating infrastructure to render the 256 variations at once 12:25:46 <Eddi|zuHause> you can have wagons in more than one file... 12:25:47 <V453000> and then cut them in postproduction from it 12:26:18 <V453000> it isnt about files Eddi, it is about not having to batch cameras in max 12:26:36 <V453000> one camera looking at 256 objects, 8 frames, 8 rotations 12:26:39 <V453000> easy 12:28:57 <b_jonas> but the camera is always the same, it's the train that rotates 12:30:08 <V453000> that doesnt make sense with lighting 12:30:23 <V453000> actually it should, too 12:30:42 <V453000> or 12:30:52 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:30:56 <b_jonas> um, are we talking about openttd or not? in openttd, the camera is fixed. 12:31:14 <V453000> hm valid point :D 12:32:03 <V453000> yeah the model should rotate 12:32:08 <V453000> OR light has to rotate with it but hm 12:32:17 <V453000> actually having camera and light rotate is probably better 12:33:12 *** Jinassi [~Jinassi@0001ec72.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 12:33:59 <Pikka> my models rotate 12:34:08 <Pikka> or, the helper they're attached to rotates. 12:34:14 <V453000> yeah that I understand 12:34:20 <V453000> still you have to attach all of them to helpers 12:34:28 <V453000> not like that is a big issue 12:34:32 <V453000> but easier to have rotate a camera and sun 12:34:53 <Eddi|zuHause> but doesn't that flip the positions all over the place? 12:35:02 <b_jonas> why? is the full loaded carriage, like, too heavy, much heavier than the camera and the sun? 12:35:21 <Pikka> it's pretty much six of one and half a dozen of the other. 12:35:46 *** MTsPony [~MTsPony@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has joined #openttd 12:36:00 <V453000> Eddi, rotating camera or the model is identical in orthographic 12:36:00 <Eddi|zuHause> but half a dozen is much more than six 12:36:13 <V453000> the only difference is light has to rotate with it 12:37:24 <Eddi|zuHause> V453000: maybe i'm imagining it wrong: you have 256 items lined up in some way, and render them from 8 directions. that means, the relative position of the 256 from each other changes 12:37:54 <Eddi|zuHause> like first A is right of B, then A is on top of B, etc. 12:38:03 <V453000> well if you look from a different direction, sure it changes, the same way they would change as if you rotated the model 12:38:12 <V453000> the whole model that is 12:38:17 *** kais58__2 is now known as kais58|AFK 12:38:22 *** kais58|AFK is now known as kais58__2 12:38:24 <Eddi|zuHause> not if you rotate each of the 256 objects 12:38:25 <V453000> ah right you thought each rotating locally 12:38:57 <V453000> hm 12:39:07 <V453000> that point is valid but it is just linking in postproduction 12:39:07 <Eddi|zuHause> well, i imagine scripting rotation of 256 objects easier than figuring out 8x256 offsets 12:39:09 <V453000> cutting is the same 12:40:18 <V453000> you dont even need to script it you just create objects which are its parent and which rotate 12:40:54 <V453000> hm :) 12:41:17 <V453000> also considering some small sub-pixel nuances in case the scale isnt 100% precise, which it probably isnt 12:41:27 <V453000> each train rotating locally is better 12:43:19 *** Pikka [~Octomom@d58-106-23-62.rdl801.qld.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:57:47 <peter1138> Crap, my second PC has stopped booting :S 12:58:08 <Eddi|zuHause> that constantly happens to me 12:58:28 <Eddi|zuHause> the less often you boot, the more likely it doesn't work :p 12:58:44 <peter1138> It was alright this morning, although the CD drive had stopped responding... 12:59:17 <fjb> Then disconnect the CD drive. 12:59:45 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, could be stuck in the detection stage 13:00:18 <Eddi|zuHause> happened to me when the data cable was connected to a disk, but the power cable was not 13:01:36 <Jinassi> Try hard reset tool, one time use only. Proven to detect and enhance hardware issues. 13:03:29 <Eddi|zuHause> "enhance issues", as in afterwards they are bigger issues? :p 13:03:31 <peter1138> Nah, it's not POSTing at all. 13:03:49 <Eddi|zuHause> try removing components until it beeps 13:04:39 <Eddi|zuHause> disconnect the pc speaker last :p 13:05:11 <Rubidium> and disconnect the PSU first? ;) 13:05:56 <Jinassi> no magic smoke smell? 13:10:42 <Eddi|zuHause> Rubidium: definitely yes. when you have another PSU to try :p 13:10:59 <Eddi|zuHause> PSUs are one of the easiest things to break 13:12:11 <peter1138> Not got a spare PSU to test. 13:12:19 <peter1138> Oh well... 13:12:27 <peter1138> It's quieter without that on anyway. 13:13:24 <Eddi|zuHause> hehe :) 13:13:36 <Eddi|zuHause> that's why i moved my 2nd PC to the basement 13:14:14 <peter1138> Yeah but is England, we don't do basements :( 13:14:29 <V453000> dancing cubes XD this is great 13:14:42 <peter1138> Dancing Qubicles!# 13:15:09 <V453000> yeah 13:17:42 <Eddi|zuHause> anyone know how to fix my chromium? it doesn't play youtube anymore :/ 13:18:18 <peter1138> Is it in HTML5 mode? 13:18:27 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 13:18:32 <Eddi|zuHause> at least it used to... 13:18:32 <peter1138> :S 13:18:55 <LordAro> "html5 mode" is always on now, i think 13:19:15 <peter1138> Not always. 13:19:41 <peter1138> Firefox doesn't support everything. 13:19:49 <peter1138> (Or at least, Iceweasel doesn't support everything.) 13:22:01 <Eddi|zuHause> well, i switched it on some time ago, but i can never find that setting 13:22:06 <Eddi|zuHause> it works in firefox 13:22:20 <Eddi|zuHause> but it has some nasty memleak, which is why i switched to chromium 13:23:01 <Eddi|zuHause> also, firefox has some minor annoyances when switching to full screen 13:23:22 *** Celestar [~Celestar@mnch-4d0456d3.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 13:24:06 <peter1138> I never understood the fullscreen warning... 13:24:17 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 13:24:24 <Celestar> Warning! Fullscreen! 13:24:27 <peter1138> <page switches to fullscreen> hey this webpage is fullscreen, do you want to allow that? 13:24:35 <peter1138> ... er... isn't that a bit late? 13:24:38 <Celestar> well. 13:24:51 <Celestar> they thought: 'if your disk is full, you want a warning'. 13:24:55 <Celestar> so if your screen is full ... 13:24:59 <peter1138> Must be 13:25:03 <peter1138> Morning 13:25:07 <Celestar> gday :) 13:26:28 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, but also the video skips backwards a few seconds 13:27:32 <Eddi|zuHause> i guess the point of that warning is to have a way to exit full screen 13:27:59 <Eddi|zuHause> for people who don't find the [Esc] key... 13:29:11 <argoneus> is there a button in openttd 13:29:16 <argoneus> to close the most recently opened window? 13:29:21 <argoneus> I know of delete, but that's rather aggressive 13:29:21 <dihedral> hello 13:29:23 <Eddi|zuHause> no 13:29:36 <Eddi|zuHause> only all windows, and all windows that are not stickied 13:29:40 <argoneus> oh 13:29:51 <argoneus> is there a reason why it's not possible to do only the last one? 13:30:05 <Eddi|zuHause> because nobody ever requested that 13:30:17 <Eddi|zuHause> also, that information is probably not stored anywhere 13:30:58 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:31:13 <argoneus> I would use it so much :( 13:31:30 <Eddi|zuHause> well, then implement it 13:31:47 <Eddi|zuHause> shouldn't take more than a day or so 13:33:19 <argoneus> I wish I had more time than a few hours in the evening 13:33:22 <argoneus> if even that 13:33:57 *** MTs-iPad_ [~MTs-iPad@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has joined #openttd 13:34:09 <planetmaker> argoneus, how many time do you think other people have who regularily contribute? 13:34:13 <planetmaker> s/many/much/ 13:34:26 <argoneus> I dunno 13:34:27 <planetmaker> few hours in the evening make it possible to write that in a week 13:34:32 <argoneus> I imagined most people are working people 13:34:35 <planetmaker> should it require a whole day 13:34:36 <argoneus> who come home from work and do hobbies 13:34:41 *** MTs-iPad [~MTs-iPad@008-086-128-083.dynamic.caiway.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:34:42 <argoneus> no? 13:34:50 <planetmaker> yeah. So an evening is what they have. At most 13:34:53 <argoneus> yeah 13:35:05 <argoneus> I come home from either work or uni at 7, and then I need to do my assignments and/or study for exams 13:35:08 <argoneus> ;_; 13:35:23 <argoneus> and after all that I'm rarely motivated to code my own things for fun 13:35:29 <argoneus> because my brain is just ded 13:35:38 <Celestar> O_O 13:36:32 <dihedral> Celestar, :-) 13:36:38 <Celestar> :D 13:36:45 <argoneus> then again 13:36:54 <argoneus> I am probably just weak, if I really wanted to find time, I maybe would 13:36:59 <planetmaker> a dihedral and a Celestar. Rare guests :) 13:37:06 <dihedral> at the same time ;-) 13:37:38 <planetmaker> like Easter and Christmas at the same date :P 13:38:01 <V453000> LOL 13:39:02 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 13:39:22 <V453000> Ok I think I will just render 4096x2048 sprites XD 13:40:04 <V453000> moar pixulz 13:40:46 <b_jonas> V453000: sure, but render them in 64 bit per pixel depth 13:40:57 <V453000> nö 13:41:01 <V453000> 256 14:24:30 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 14:31:06 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:35:08 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:46:02 *** guru3_ [~guru3@90-230-86-71-no225.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:47:54 *** Celestar [~Celestar@mnch-4d0456d3.pool.mediaWays.net] has left #openttd [] 15:08:32 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6BA88.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:08:59 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 15:09:02 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 15:13:37 *** luaduck_zzz is now known as luaduck 15:17:08 *** oskari892 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 15:22:37 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 15:31:49 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 15:35:39 *** guru3 [~guru3@000128ea.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:42:05 *** Bolli [~B0ll1@186.81.115.87.dyn.plus.net] has joined #openttd 15:42:53 <Bolli> Hi 15:43:01 <Alberth> o/ 16:09:51 *** Bolli [~B0ll1@186.81.115.87.dyn.plus.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:10:29 *** TheMask96 [martijn@lust.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:12:01 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B43B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:13:34 *** TheMask96 [martijn@wrath.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 16:55:11 *** Jinassi [~Jinassi@0001ec72.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:55:26 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 16:55:29 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 16:55:46 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00d841.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 16:58:22 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r27026 /trunk/src (script/api/script_company.cpp settings_gui.cpp) (2014-10-21 16:58:15 UTC) 16:58:23 <DorpsGek> -Fix: some (older-ish) GCC compiler warnings 16:58:23 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220149.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 17:00:40 *** TomyLobo [~foo@91.65.115.103] has joined #openttd 17:12:53 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220149.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:20:39 *** Klanticus [~quassel@187.39.191.115] has joined #openttd 17:48:12 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27027 /trunk/src/lang (5 files) (2014-10-21 17:48:00 UTC) 17:48:13 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:48:14 <DorpsGek> catalan - 2 changes by juanjo 17:48:15 <DorpsGek> dutch - 2 changes by habell 17:48:16 <DorpsGek> finnish - 45 changes by jpx_ 17:48:17 <DorpsGek> irish - 58 changes by tem 17:48:18 <DorpsGek> spanish - 2 changes by SilverSurferZzZ 18:15:05 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 18:16:31 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C3833.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 18:31:15 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host156-13-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 18:31:21 <Wolf01> hi hi 18:31:58 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r27028 /branches/1.4 (5 files in 3 dirs) (2014-10-21 18:31:51 UTC) 18:31:59 <DorpsGek> [1.4] -Update documentation 18:33:30 <DorpsGek> Commit by frosch :: r27029 /tags/1.4.4 (10 files in 4 dirs) (2014-10-21 18:33:24 UTC) 18:33:31 <DorpsGek> -Release: 1.4.4 18:33:36 <Wolf01> :o 18:34:33 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-72-94-147-76.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:34:55 *** KWKdesign [~KWKdesign@pool-72-94-147-76.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 18:36:47 <peter1138> o: 18:47:16 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 18:49:07 *** Flippy [~flippy@2a02:25b0:aaaa:5da:face:face:face:1112] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:54:33 <andythenorth> o/ 18:54:40 <Wolf01> \o 18:56:10 <iamtakingiteasy> hi, is there any options in openttd.cfg which affect probability, and frequence of industries bankruption and eventually closing? 18:57:17 <andythenorth> not afaik 18:57:20 <__ln__> *are there + plural 18:57:31 <andythenorth> smooth economy setting affects it 18:57:36 <andythenorth> but thatâs in the UI 18:58:11 <iamtakingiteasy> __ln__: sorry. My English is pretty weak, indeed. 18:58:26 <iamtakingiteasy> andythenorth: oh, there is smooth_economy in config 18:59:00 <iamtakingiteasy> thank you, i'll try this option 19:11:01 <Eddi|zuHause> mind you that smooth economy will probably not affect most NewGRF industries 19:16:56 <DorpsGek> Commit by rubidium :: r27030 /trunk/src (4 files) (2014-10-21 19:16:47 UTC) 19:16:57 <DorpsGek> -Fix: crash when having the vehicle list opened from a buoy or oil rig while the buoy/oil rig gets its final removal (i.e. the sign gets removed) 19:17:01 *** Jinassi [~Jinassi@0001ec72.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:21:08 <Eddi|zuHause> s/ed// 19:26:15 *** Yotson [~Yotson@2001:980:6ac8:1:19a2:a9f1:8735:8520] has quit [Quit: .] 19:29:58 <frosch123> @topic set 1 1.4.4 19:29:59 *** DorpsGek changed the topic of #openttd to: 1.4.4 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: hg, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only | #openttd.dev for dev-talk | #openttd.notice for commit notices 19:30:05 <frosch123> heffer: blathijs: new release \o/ 19:30:16 <heffer> yaay 19:41:21 <andythenorth> :) 19:46:20 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 19:51:45 *** Celestar [~Celestar@p5DE45EC0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:01:15 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 20:02:33 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 20:13:54 *** Celestar [~Celestar@p5DE45EC0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has left #openttd [] 20:15:55 <blathijs> frosch123: Awesome :-D 20:21:28 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 20:22:32 *** Jomann [~abchirk@p4FE223EC.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:27:52 <Wolf01> 'night 20:27:59 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 20:34:27 *** TomyLobo [~foo@91.65.115.103] has quit [Quit: Standby mode...] 20:44:31 *** liq3 [~liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 20:47:15 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 20:50:17 *** Jinassi [~Jinassi@0001ec72.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:55:25 *** myr0 [~none@81-234-221-227-no23.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #openttd 21:12:24 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B43B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:32:17 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C3833.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/nkczDT] 21:51:04 *** Jomann [~abchirk@p4FE223EC.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:57:19 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 22:08:23 *** Flygon [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 22:08:23 *** kais58__2 [~kais58@cpc3-cwma7-2-0-cust221.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 22:08:31 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 22:09:54 <frosch123> night 22:09:58 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00d841.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 22:14:05 *** kais58__2 [~kais58@cpc3-cwma7-2-0-cust221.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 22:14:42 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:43:33 <argoneus> good night train friends 22:52:48 *** myr0 [~none@81-234-221-227-no23.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 22:59:42 *** Pereba_ [~UserNick@186.212.236.85] has joined #openttd 23:04:54 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.41.239.232] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:05:02 *** Pereba_ is now known as Pereba 23:08:48 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-191-31.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:24:19 *** pixar [~Mychomize@46-236-110-230.customer.t3.se] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:56:48 *** Pereba [~UserNick@186.212.236.85] has quit [Quit: www.AdiIRC.com - Building a better IRC client.]