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www.ntalk.de] 07:00:32 *** supermop_ [~supermop@static-71-249-209-97.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 07:27:27 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~farci@i59F6ABB2.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 07:33:23 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~farci@i59F6ABB2.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:41:21 *** AdmiralKew [~pcc31@49.146.194.150] has joined #openttd 08:28:30 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 08:42:32 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc87201-aztw31-2-0-cust156.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 09:11:46 *** Clockworker_ [Clockworke@200.102.174.5] has joined #openttd 09:11:46 *** Clockworker__ [Clockworke@200.102.174.5] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:37:45 *** AdmiralKewl [~pcc31@49.146.194.150] has joined #openttd 09:43:04 *** AdmiralKew [~pcc31@49.146.194.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:03:29 *** AdmiralKewl [~pcc31@49.146.194.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:03:33 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:31:29 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-255-23.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd 10:31:38 <Samu> hi 10:33:20 <andythenorth> o/ 10:33:28 <Wolf01> o/ 10:39:43 *** MonkeyDrone [~MonkDAce@80.88.255.44] has joined #openttd 10:46:28 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-76-211.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 10:53:39 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-76-211.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:05:41 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc87201-aztw31-2-0-cust156.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has left #openttd [] 11:21:40 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.136.141.100] has joined #openttd 11:41:56 <Samu> i'm back to the saveload.cpp file 11:42:07 <Samu> when i save using the lzo encoder 11:42:17 <Samu> i can't load it back 11:42:39 <Samu> broken savegame - unexpected end of chunk. 11:44:26 <Samu> is that intended? to never use lzo to create savegames? 11:44:38 <Samu> i was only experimenting zlo 11:44:39 <Samu> lzo 11:47:39 <Samu> wait a minute 11:47:46 <Samu> now it loads 11:48:09 <Samu> so it depends on the build I had chosen to save? 11:50:00 <Samu> i saved with debug x64, i can load with debug x64, but not with release x64 11:50:23 <Samu> can't load in official 1.6.0 either 11:55:44 <Samu> it loads on debug win32 and also on release win32. it's only release x64 that it doesn't load 11:56:00 <Samu> turns out official 1.6.0 is x64 too 11:56:09 <Samu> and i guess it's release 11:56:40 <Samu> gonna try official 1.6.0 win32, brb 11:59:06 <Samu> doesn't work on official 1.6.0 win32, downloaded from https://www.openttd.org/en/download-stable 11:59:22 <Samu> what could this all mean? 12:06:10 <Samu> can someone try loading this savegame in your openttd? https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=23B29F3DE45F6F1F!1263&authkey=!AHcsjB_LoOMjjK0&ithint=file%2csav 12:06:18 <Samu> file name is Unnamed, 1950-01-02 lzo preset 0.sav 12:06:21 <Samu> 27.8 MB 12:07:55 <Samu> does it load, or does it say broken savegame - unexpected end of chunk. 12:08:02 <Samu> ty 12:09:06 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-195-191.gdiv2.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 12:12:05 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc87201-aztw31-2-0-cust156.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 12:29:14 *** sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:31:22 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 12:31:56 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 12:34:04 *** Snail [~jacopocol@cpe-98-14-130-227.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 12:37:01 <Samu> it appears to be a bug with openttd 32-bit version when saving a game with map sized 4096x4096 12:37:08 <Samu> have to test this better 12:37:29 <Samu> lzma error code 12:37:40 <peter1138> solution: don't play stupid map sizes 12:37:53 <Samu> :O 12:38:36 <Samu> seems to be the overhead of 15 AIs + the process of saving 12:38:52 <Samu> I'm merely pushing openttd to its limit :) 12:39:03 <Samu> it can save on the 64-bit 12:39:07 <Samu> but not on the 32-bit 12:40:21 <Samu> i currently got 16 GB RAM installed on the system, can't be that 12:44:23 <Samu> with lzma preset 9, the overhead is an extra 690.000 KB just for lzma, on top of mem copy 12:45:01 <Samu> what is the limit for 32-bit applications in openttd? what about large-adress aware stuff? 12:46:54 <Samu> no i'm wrong, 690.000K already includes mem copy 12:50:39 <Samu> weird, it doubles the effort for server to client, i just monitorized mem needed for a player to join a server 12:50:54 <Samu> about 1.1 GB more memory 12:51:02 <Samu> just during a client join 12:51:18 <Samu> well i gotta go now, be back alter 12:51:27 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-255-23.netvisao.pt] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 12:51:59 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:56:44 *** Snail [~jacopocol@cpe-98-14-130-227.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Snail] 13:04:44 *** Hiddenfunstuff [~Geth@y32.ip1.anvianet.fi] has joined #openttd 13:06:49 *** supermop [~supermop@pool-100-37-203-161.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:23:47 *** Quatroking [~Quatrokin@ip226-139-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 13:25:23 <peter1138> thanks rain, waiting for me to go outside :p 13:26:16 <peter1138> monitorized... 13:29:21 <andythenorth> it will do that 13:34:32 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.136.141.100] has quit [] 13:38:45 <Wolf01> I'm tired :( 13:50:14 <supermop_> yo 13:55:48 <V453000> sup 13:58:12 <supermop_> rain 13:58:24 <supermop_> rhino modelling 13:59:21 <supermop_> and designing interiors for conversion of an old grain elevator at a brewery in Guang Zhou into a boutique beer hotel 14:08:05 <supermop_> andythenorth: does IH have some kkind of pallet means of switching headlights on and off, switching 1/2 cc etc? 14:08:22 <andythenorth> headlights are drawn on 14:08:46 <andythenorth> flipping 1cc and 2cc is automated with pixa 14:09:34 <V453000> brewery sounds great 14:10:44 <Alkel_U3> oh! Yesterday I should've checked TTD instead of TT for the water level settings. It was there in the original map generator, but not for Arctic and Tropic 14:10:53 <Alkel_U3> it didn't occur to me until now 14:18:27 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 14:18:30 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 14:18:37 <Wolf01> o/ 14:18:40 <Alberth> hi hi 14:18:41 <andythenorth> lo Alberth 14:25:42 *** CrazyIvan532 [~oftc-webi@cpc36-brad18-2-0-cust39.17-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 14:25:47 *** sim-al2 [~sim-al2@dns25-177.cbu.edu] has joined #openttd 14:27:25 <CrazyIvan532> Hello everyone, so i am trying to compile the latest stable release on my rasberry pi 3 but ive hit an error and im not sure what it means. the error is makefile:234: recipe for target 'script/api/script_industrytype.o' failed 14:28:25 <Alberth> there should be a compiler error too 14:29:00 <Alberth> you can use a paste service, like paste.openttdcoop.org if you have more text 14:29:01 <CrazyIvan532> make[1]: ***[script/api/script_industrytyper 14:29:18 <CrazyIvan532> make[1]: ***[script/api/script_industrytype.o] Error 1 14:29:22 <CrazyIvan532> is that it? 14:30:11 <Alberth> no, you run "make", which runs the c++ compiler. That program gives an error, and then "make" reports the build failed, and on what file 14:30:30 <Alberth> the c++ error is the root cause 14:30:53 <Alberth> anything "make[1]: ..." is from make 14:32:00 * andythenorth needs to search forum PMs 14:32:05 <andythenorth> canât see how 14:33:04 <CrazyIvan532> i cant copy and paste it because im not sure how to on a raspi 14:40:29 <Alberth> line number? 14:41:16 <Alberth> although not very useful without error message 14:42:54 <Alberth> it complains about a name? 14:43:04 <Alberth> try to find that name in other files 14:43:16 <CrazyIvan532> im gonna have to run the compile again this may take a few minutes, i closed the terminal window 14:43:50 <Alberth> make should pick up where it error-ed the last time 14:44:04 <CrazyIvan532> nope has to run it all over again 14:44:09 <CrazyIvan532> for some reason 14:44:39 <Alberth> weird 14:45:08 <CrazyIvan532> the latest stable is 1.6.0 isnt it? 14:45:24 <CrazyIvan532> has anything changed since 1.5.3 to be able to compile it? 14:45:58 <Alberth> no idea, not much, would be my guess 14:46:02 <CrazyIvan532> oh thats strange its failed at a different point this time 14:46:37 <Alberth> perhaps your compiler changed more than the openttd source :) 14:46:55 <CrazyIvan532> viewport.cpp this time 14:47:12 <CrazyIvan532> void viewportDODraw 14:51:45 <Alberth> pretty sure nothing changed there the last year 14:53:57 <CrazyIvan532> ok ive actually made progress, not sure what i did differently, all i did was update the os on my pi 14:54:16 <CrazyIvan532> rerun make and it did it fine this time :/ im not sure what was happening 14:55:36 <Alberth> you got an executable now? 14:56:38 <CrazyIvan532> yep worked first time after the update 14:57:19 <CrazyIvan532> is there a way to remove GFX files too, ive got an oversized gui which looks aweful on the raspi touchscreen 14:59:46 <Alberth> can't do that in the newgrf window? 14:59:58 <Alberth> otherwise, close openttd, and edit the openttd.cfg file 15:00:26 <planetmaker> oh, there's even an UI zoom setting in the game options. Maybe that helps? 15:00:30 <planetmaker> g'evening also :) 15:00:40 <Alberth> don't know what needs changing though, never installed such a file 15:00:45 <Alberth> evenink planetmaker :) 15:00:59 <andythenorth> lo planetmaker 15:01:05 <CrazyIvan532> cant seem to remove them from in there just activate or deactivate 15:01:22 *** Wormnest [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 15:01:26 <Alberth> deactivate should be sufficient to disable 15:02:11 <CrazyIvan532> it doesnt seem like it has 15:02:55 <Alberth> close openttd, and edit the cfg file? 15:03:14 <Alberth> program shouldn't load things that are not in that file 15:03:21 <CrazyIvan532> where do i find the config file 15:03:37 <Alberth> ~/.openttd/openttd.cfg ? 15:03:57 <Alberth> othewise, check the readme, it has a list of places to look 15:06:13 <CrazyIvan532> is that the same when its built from source? 15:07:45 <Alberth> should be, unless you give weird configure values :p 15:08:13 <Alberth> but euhm, find / -type f -name openttd.cfg -print 15:08:20 <CrazyIvan532> ive got a lot of files that have config in the title, just not one that looks like that 15:08:30 *** Wolf03 [~wolf01@host229-232-dynamic.20-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 15:08:31 *** Wolf01 is now known as Guest316 15:08:31 *** Wolf03 is now known as Wolf01 15:13:34 *** Guest316 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:22:30 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-147-239.lns20.mel8.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 15:24:07 <CrazyIvan532> im confused as to why it still has them and my saved games since i extracted the new version to a different file 15:27:29 <CrazyIvan532> ok i got it seems the zbase gfx set for some reason has bigger icons than the default base set, causing the toolbar to look odd 15:27:29 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:29:20 <peter1138> zbase has a lot of things wrong 15:29:44 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-76-211.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:29:55 <CrazyIvan532> anyone perhaps recommend an alternative that looks similar without the issues? 15:30:00 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-63-177.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 15:31:24 <Alberth> the opengfx baseset? 15:31:55 <CrazyIvan532> i was hoping for one that looks a little less jagged round the edges 15:34:00 <Alberth> reduce zoom :) 15:34:54 <CrazyIvan532> you mean zoom out or is that the name of a set lol? 15:35:35 <Alberth> I am always confused about zoom directions :) 15:36:14 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-147-239.lns20.mel8.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:37:34 <supermop_> do i need to draw 8/8 trains to look like 7.5/8 to get a visible gap between cars in / and \? 15:38:36 <andythenorth> just leave a row of pixels out or so 15:38:42 <andythenorth> itâs all not very scientific tbh 15:38:46 <andythenorth> and full of mistakes :) 15:38:52 <andythenorth> nobody really notices when playing 15:39:08 <Alberth> make train fast enough :p 15:41:48 <supermop_> oof 15:42:16 <supermop_> that throws off my set of placeholders 15:42:38 <supermop_> can leave off two pixels easier than 1 15:43:00 <supermop_> but i guess being placeholders it doesnt matter 15:43:44 <Alberth> remove random pixel in each row ? 15:44:03 * andythenorth watches ârealâ trains go round a circle 15:44:12 <supermop_> lego? 15:44:13 <andythenorth> no need to worry about lengths 15:44:24 <andythenorth> HO 15:45:16 <supermop_> need to "decide" on a remaining lengths in spreadsheet so can start assigning each vehicle a placeholder 15:45:30 <supermop_> kids old enough for HO now, andythenorth ? 15:45:37 <andythenorth> debatable 15:45:52 <supermop_> andythenorth is old enough for HO at least 15:45:52 <andythenorth> I am definitely old enough though 15:46:11 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.136.141.100] has joined #openttd 15:46:29 <supermop_> could use some Z gauge here 15:46:43 <supermop_> no room for N in manhattan apartment 15:47:06 <supermop_> maybe one N tram stop 15:49:31 <peter1138> have we done the 3d-model-graphics version of the game yet? 15:49:43 <andythenorth> nobody finished it 15:51:30 <supermop_> andythenorth: cargosprinter method for EMUs or fixed consists? or just single/double 8/8 units? 15:51:58 *** Clockworker_ [Clockworke@200.102.174.5] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:52:04 <supermop_> peter1138: what 3d model version? 15:53:31 <peter1138> the one we all want :p 15:54:15 <supermop_> rendered base set? 15:54:30 <supermop_> or in game rendering? 15:54:40 <Alberth> 3D openttd :p 15:55:56 *** TheMask96 [martijn@greed.vhost.ne2000.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:56:01 <andythenorth> supermop_: 8/8 units 15:56:27 <supermop_> pointy ends go away when sticking them together? 15:56:28 <andythenorth> assuming theyâre blunt ended, and donât have fancy end units 15:56:45 <andythenorth> if they have fancy end units (1) choose a different one to draw or (2) Iâll have to figure something out 15:56:47 <supermop_> duckbilled shinkansens, 15:57:15 <andythenorth> shinkansens should be built as 4 tile fixed consists 15:57:26 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5B0DAE69.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:57:42 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5B0DAE69.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:58:13 <supermop_> would you allow this guy as a "shinkansen" graphically then, or am i pushing my luck? 15:58:14 <supermop_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KiHa_281_series 15:58:54 <andythenorth> probably a case for doing it as two 8/8 units and using the cargo sprinter magic 15:59:07 <supermop_> o 15:59:08 <supermop_> k 15:59:34 <supermop_> that just turns the intermediate units into a flat fronted versions? 15:59:45 <andythenorth> yes 16:00:09 *** CrazyIvan532 [~oftc-webi@cpc36-brad18-2-0-cust39.17-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 16:00:17 *** aard [~aard@108.134.189.109.customer.cdi.no] has joined #openttd 16:00:46 *** TheMask96 [martijn@gluttony.vhost.ne2000.nl] has joined #openttd 16:01:10 <supermop_> for shinkansen, 8 cars of 8/8, or some other amount of a different length (8+6+6+6+6+6+6+6+6+8?) 16:01:13 <Rubidium> andythenorth: I won't agree; E2/E5 are 10 cars 16:01:40 <andythenorth> not realistic? 16:01:49 <supermop_> Rubidium: no E2s in iron crane 16:02:04 <supermop_> but the above 8s and 6s give 10 cars 16:02:22 <andythenorth> you need to fake more :P 16:02:37 <andythenorth> use pre-production prototypes or never-built units or something 16:02:43 <supermop_> i only have 4 generic shinkansens 16:02:50 *** sim-al2 [~sim-al2@dns25-177.cbu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:03:01 <Rubidium> and the plethora of 12 car consists get even shorter? 16:03:12 <andythenorth> donât listen to Rubidium heâs a naughty troll :) 16:03:12 <Rubidium> just so it fits in 4 tiles 16:03:35 <supermop_> a roughly 60s on, a roughly 80s one, a mid 90s one, and a late 90s/00s one 16:03:54 <supermop_> Rubidium: i like short cars personally 16:04:13 <andythenorth> supermop_: cargo sprinter substitutes an intermediate car when needed: https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/graphics/cargo_sprinter_template.png 16:04:19 <andythenorth> see middle set of sprites 16:04:21 <Rubidium> supermop_: start with DHR 16:04:56 <supermop_> andythenorth: stylistically i think i am set for shinkansen, just wondering if it looks better to have end cars a different length 16:05:20 <andythenorth> if theyâre fixed consist yes 16:05:22 <andythenorth> otherwise no 16:05:29 <andythenorth> we could build them as individual vehicles 16:05:37 <andythenorth> with front and back engines separate 16:05:38 <andythenorth> but eh 16:06:31 <supermop_> have a 1000hp shinkansen dining car 16:06:45 <supermop_> and hook it up to a steam engine 16:06:45 <Rubidium> supermop_: it would be realistic for the N700 series to have longer end cars 16:07:36 <Rubidium> likewise for the 500 series (my favorite) 16:07:50 <Rubidium> although the difference is about 10% 16:08:16 <supermop_> Rubidium: "500" is my third shinkansen, 700/n700 basis for 4th 16:08:48 <supermop_> 2nd is amalgamation of 100 and 200, maybe 300 instead 16:08:57 <supermop_> 1st is 0 of course 16:09:05 <supermop_> powers and speeds faked 16:09:47 <Rubidium> IIRC the odd first digit ones are for the east, the even ones for the west 16:10:02 <supermop_> 6/8 shinkansen cars may look too tiny next to the regular NG trains 16:10:11 <supermop_> correct Rubidium 16:10:11 <Rubidium> uhm... I reversed east and west I guess 16:10:20 <supermop_> 300 is west 16:10:23 <supermop_> yeah 16:10:45 <supermop_> 800 on kyushu 16:11:59 <Rubidium> oh, so they've messed the nice system up... 16:11:59 <supermop_> Iron crane gets only 4 though, use on either side of your map as you please 16:12:27 <supermop_> well east now uses E(n) 16:12:57 <Rubidium> and the bilevels? 16:13:41 <supermop_> believe those are all to the east 16:16:15 <supermop_> andythenorth: your CS sprinter looks like 7/8? 16:16:26 <andythenorth> might be 16:16:28 <supermop_> ok 16:16:34 <andythenorth> it fits to the container lengths 16:16:49 <andythenorth> you donât have to use that length 16:17:18 <supermop_> using 6/8 would necessitate rewriting all the weird cod though, right? 16:17:25 <supermop_> code 16:17:32 <supermop_> or cod too i guess 16:17:42 <andythenorth> no 16:17:59 <andythenorth> all units have to be same length, and the sprite swapping code doesnât touch length 16:18:23 <andythenorth> it should work with anything up to 10/8 16:18:33 <supermop_> still easiest to just provide sprites same size as what you have and use same template though, right? 16:18:55 *** Wormnest_ [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 16:19:40 <supermop_> you have code that randomizes color of the pink and purple containers? 16:20:12 <andythenorth> yes 16:20:16 <supermop_> cool 16:20:31 <andythenorth> only to blue and white currently, but thatâs variable 16:21:13 <supermop_> every container ive seen i japan is the same maroon JR Freight livery though 16:21:15 *** JacobD88 [~Thunderbi@cpc80661-stap13-2-0-cust817.12-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:21:23 <supermop_> lunch time 16:26:14 *** Wormnest [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:44:35 *** aminos [~aminos@41.225.139.229] has joined #openttd 16:47:28 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~farci@i59F6CFA3.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:50:10 <Wolf01> I always fail to understand how to pass data to event handlers :| I usually implement the handler on the same class (usually with a delegate) and get the data from the class, but what when I have a shared handler? 16:52:13 <Wolf01> I don't know if I need to do some magic with that lambda brainfuck or just duplicate the code 16:52:29 <andythenorth> does the code do the same thing? 16:52:46 <Wolf01> yeah 16:52:58 * andythenorth has no ideas 16:53:08 <andythenorth> I have NFI about âproperâ OO code 16:53:25 <andythenorth> I would just pass classes around that have some common interface 16:53:34 <andythenorth> or better yet, try and avoid the whole situation :) 16:53:49 <Wolf01> I could put the code on a common class and then use the handler to call it 16:54:03 <andythenorth> I would end up having some class like âApplicationâ or whatever 16:54:33 <andythenorth> but my ways probably arenât recognisable to most OO coders 16:54:41 <andythenorth> I just try and keep it really dumb as far as possible 16:55:01 <andythenorth> and keep entities as self-contained as possible :P 16:55:47 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18674.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 16:56:06 <supermop_> ok 16:56:19 *** DDR [~David@S0106602ad0773a2e.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:56:36 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 16:56:39 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 17:04:00 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-186-230.lns20.mel8.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 17:11:14 *** Flygon [~Flygon@ppp118-209-63-177.lns20.mel4.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:20:32 *** frosch123 [~frosch@00013ce7.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:23:31 <Wolf01> o/ 17:28:34 *** sim-al2 [~sim-al2@dns25-177.cbu.edu] has joined #openttd 17:29:41 <frosch123> hoi 17:30:24 <V453000> hy frog 17:39:25 <frosch123> V453000: https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=73374&start=100 <- haha, i thought i already had encountered the most stupid message today 17:40:12 <V453000> XD 17:40:14 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-238-150.lns20.mel8.internode.on.net] has joined #openttd 17:41:14 <V453000> well at least he knows where to look :P 17:41:40 <frosch123> yeah, not the most obvious place for f backstage photos 17:41:49 <V453000> :D 17:43:43 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:43:46 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 17:47:14 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@ppp118-209-186-230.lns20.mel8.internode.on.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:49:46 *** aminos [~aminos@41.225.139.229] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:50:31 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:52:08 *** Arveen [~Arveen@ip-95-223-75-47.hsi16.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #openttd 17:59:37 <andythenorth> also 18:00:01 <andythenorth> what to do about tropic landscape gen? o_O 18:00:54 <supermop_> idk 18:01:03 <supermop_> what is tropic supposed to be 18:01:54 <andythenorth> a landscape for building trains on? 18:03:03 <andythenorth> all landscapes should be much the same, irrespective of chosen climate 18:03:08 <andythenorth> gameplay needs 18:03:19 <andythenorth> - mountains (which can be suppressed by choosing flat landscape) 18:03:35 <andythenorth> - valleys (which are created by mountains being formed) 18:03:53 <andythenorth> - open water (which can be suppressed by turning down sea amount) 18:03:57 <andythenorth> - rivers (which can be disabled) 18:04:10 <andythenorth> all this crap about plateaus and sine waves is not doing anything for gameplay 18:05:25 <supermop_> would be nice to have different shapes of mountains or canyons or plateaus , but not dependent on climate 18:06:38 <andythenorth> so many tuning controls already, and then they behave differently depending on chosen climate 18:06:43 <andythenorth> meh 18:07:12 <supermop_> although with tropic, the shape of the land has a big effect of the greenness of the land 18:10:12 <andythenorth> [shrug] 18:10:24 <andythenorth> works fine for me with temperate terrain algorithm :) 18:11:50 <supermop_> yeah that seems reasonable 18:13:45 <andythenorth> maybe expose the algorithm in terrain gen window? 18:13:57 <andythenorth> and make it an explicit choice, not a climate-dependent choice? 18:14:37 <andythenorth> or could we provide a box to paste code into? o_O 18:15:59 <supermop_> why not just have multiple generators selectable 18:16:31 <andythenorth> V453000: your child shares birthday with mine? o_O 18:16:37 <andythenorth> I think we knew that already? 18:16:56 <V453000> we might have mentioned it but I haven't remembered it tbh 18:17:45 <andythenorth> I remember nothing any more :P 18:17:52 <andythenorth> due to ENoSleep 18:19:12 <V453000> :D 18:21:47 <andythenorth> I canât remember what it felt like to have enough sleep most days :) 18:27:14 <supermop_> andythenorth: just delete all but one, either temperate or arctic 18:30:20 <andythenorth> thatâs not how trunk commits get made ;) 18:30:35 <supermop_> i just acheived a goal of deliver 1000 mnsp to a flour mill, then busy bee gave me a goal to deliver more mnsp to the same mill 18:31:03 <supermop_> fine as i already have trains headed there, but is that intended? 18:36:47 <andythenorth> there is code in recent BB to try and avoid it 18:36:56 <andythenorth> itâs mostly succesful in my test games 18:38:26 *** urdh [~urdh@00013d7a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Boom!] 18:39:11 *** urdh [~urdh@00013d7a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:42:00 <supermop_> ah this is rewarding bee 18:46:53 <supermop_> express emus all seem to be 21,000 mm, and commuter all 20,000 (except for very old 17,000mm ones from the 20s) 18:47:08 <supermop_> going to use 7/8 for all of those 18:53:05 *** ConductorCat [~Conductor@pool-108-56-8-121.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 18:55:19 *** ConductingCat [~Conductor@pool-108-56-8-121.washdc.east.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 18:59:34 *** ConductCat [~Conductor@pool-108-56-8-121.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:02:09 *** ConductorCat [~Conductor@pool-108-56-8-121.washdc.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:04:46 <andythenorth> supermop_: sometimes itâs useful to consider visual progression 19:04:56 <andythenorth> i.e. generations look longer / bigger 19:05:06 <andythenorth> other times, itâs more useful to keep train lengths unchanged 19:05:09 <andythenorth> potato / potato 19:06:10 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:06:17 <supermop_> assuming user replaces like for like, increasing car length could make trains protude from platforms and get stuck in termini? 19:06:21 <frosch123> i prefer noodles and rice 19:06:46 <andythenorth> noodles / rice 19:06:47 <andythenorth> hmm 19:06:52 <supermop_> frosch123 is still in singapore? 19:06:56 <andythenorth> dunno if the analogy holds :) 19:06:57 <frosch123> not necessarily together :p 19:07:09 <frosch123> supermop_: nope, back to normal 19:07:13 <andythenorth> rice noodles 19:09:39 *** sim-al2 [~sim-al2@dns25-177.cbu.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:11:44 <supermop_> pho 19:12:56 *** gelignite [~gelignite@x4e31ec1a.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #openttd 19:24:14 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-255-23.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd 19:26:47 *** aard [~aard@108.134.189.109.customer.cdi.no] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:41:14 *** Progman_ [~progman@p57A18136.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:43:32 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 19:44:21 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18674.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:44:35 *** Progman_ is now known as Progman 19:45:51 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:46:04 <Eddi|zuHause> wtf is a rice noodle? 19:47:43 <Taede> thin noodles you usually put in soup 19:47:50 <Wolf01> https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/66/d1/b6/66d1b6d8f6a87e368f9c07490f63be81.jpg 19:47:52 <Taede> also known as glass noodle 19:48:21 <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, glass noodles i know. never heard the term "rice noodle" for those, though 19:48:22 <Wolf01> I always order that when I go on a chinese restaurant 19:51:19 *** urdh_ [~urdh@109-124-150-97.customer.t3.se] has joined #openttd 19:52:39 *** urdh [~urdh@00013d7a.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:52:39 *** urdh_ is now known as urdh 19:54:52 <supermop_> don't think anyone calls banh pho "glass noodles" 19:55:16 <Wolf01> indeed they are more like plastic 19:56:22 <Samu> hi 19:56:34 <Wolf01> hi 19:56:37 <Samu> who's a savegame expert? 19:56:52 <Samu> saveload.cpp file 19:59:37 <Samu> the issue i have is a savegame file that used lzo encoder 20:01:38 <frosch123> Eddi|zuHause: noodles made of rice 20:02:09 <Wolf01> IE, is that you? 20:02:13 <frosch123> about everything you can make from some grain you can make from about any grain 20:02:49 <supermop_> man researching steam locomotives really doesn't hold my interest 20:02:51 * andythenorth has been exploring this a lot 20:03:00 <andythenorth> due to body canât process wheat 20:03:13 <supermop_> andythenorth: just eat pho 20:03:35 * andythenorth is eating corn pasta 20:03:40 <Samu> when the server is generating a map, the client attempting to join receives a timeout error 20:04:06 <Samu> (because the server is taking time to generate a 4096x4096 map) 20:04:17 <Samu> how do i increase this timeout thing? 20:04:21 <frosch123> andythenorth: there is a gluten free restaurant in my town with corn pasta 20:04:31 <frosch123> my niece cannot handle gluten 20:08:51 <supermop_> just end up reading about old rail disasters instead 20:09:40 <Samu> there is a bug somewhere in the saveload.cpp in one of the builds, i had a lzma error earlier today, and now i can't reproduce it for some reason 20:09:56 <Samu> i was messing with the different builds 20:10:21 <Wolf01> you saved it with x64 release, does it work now? 20:11:20 <Samu> there is another issue with the lzo too, but the lzma error kind of surprised me 20:11:34 <Samu> i'm testing all the different encoding methods 20:12:08 <Samu> i remember lzma was set in the code to use preset 9 which is very memory intensive 20:12:22 <Samu> i'm not really sure what was the build, if 32-bit debug or 32-bit release 20:12:49 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@89.136.141.100] has quit [] 20:12:50 <Samu> and then the issue was that i was using another client to joing the server 20:13:16 <Samu> so, i had 2 builds, not sure if the 2nd build was also 32-bit or 64-bit, i have to test all combinations 20:14:18 <Samu> it appears that the server failed to create the savefile 20:14:27 <Samu> and the client attempting to join, could not load the save 20:15:24 <Samu> but since this was me experimenting with preset 9, i don't know if you really care about it 20:19:09 <Samu> about the lzo: when the build is release x64, it cannot load the savegame encoded in lzo. but apparently all builds can generate the savegame correctly 20:21:20 <supermop_> andythenorth: 1870,1890, 1900, 1910, 1920, 1940 enough steam engines? 20:21:33 <andythenorth> thereâs no right amount :) 20:21:56 <andythenorth> one every 10 years is quite closely spaced 20:22:16 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 20:23:38 *** DanMacK [~3fee8a84@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has joined #openttd 20:23:50 <supermop_> ooh a DanMacK 20:24:11 <supermop_> this guy seems like he may know a thing or two about steam trains? 20:27:35 *** sim-al2 [~sim-al2@108-221-157-231.lightspeed.mmphtn.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 20:27:39 <Eddi|zuHause> an andythenorth and a DanMacK can never be in the same place at the same time! 20:28:12 <supermop_> andythenorth: that sequence is: general, express, general, general, heavy freight, general 20:28:31 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@50.37.120.168] has joined #openttd 20:32:46 <sim-al2> Small detail, but some cars seem to be 19500mm long, with 20000mm long end cars 20:33:12 <sim-al2> Some private railways still use 18000mm long cars 20:34:51 *** Ketsuban [~ketsuban@2a02:c7d:a34a:9000:7dcc:c980:b002:ab6e] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:35:22 <andythenorth> that is indeed a small detail 20:36:58 *** Progman [~progman@p57A18136.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:39:44 *** Arioch [~oftc-webi@host252.14.170.prov.ru] has joined #openttd 20:40:30 <Arioch> test 20:40:36 *** Arioch [~oftc-webi@host252.14.170.prov.ru] has quit [] 20:40:41 <sim-al2> oh 20:40:50 *** Arioch_Tmp [~oftc-webi@host252.14.170.prov.ru] has joined #openttd 20:41:12 <Arioch_Tmp> hello! anyone is active ? 20:41:24 <sim-al2> hi 20:41:31 <supermop_> i feel like 6 engines is enough, but seems weird to be in a situation where the "fast engine" is much older than the "slow engine" 20:42:26 <Arioch_Tmp> can anyon report bug for 1.6.0 ? i have no account there... 20:42:39 <Arioch_Tmp> Sad, i did not make it timely with 1.6rc1 20:43:00 <sim-al2> Yeah, seems that there used to be general-purpose engines that were used on passenger and freight, and geared high, but replaced with dedicated engines in recent times 20:43:41 *** Arveen [~Arveen@ip-95-223-75-47.hsi16.unitymediagroup.de] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 20:45:53 <Samu> i have a bad habit of not taking notes of the tests I conduct :( 20:48:45 <Wolf01> just read the chat logs 20:49:54 <andythenorth> run a keylogger 20:49:55 <andythenorth> :P 20:50:41 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~farci@i59F6CFA3.versanet.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:51:49 <Samu> generating a world in debug mode takes sooo much time :( 20:53:01 <supermop_> should dates be revised so that there is a bigger gap between engines, but "different" engines are released closer together 20:53:21 <andythenorth> I tend to release pax and freight at same time 20:53:39 <andythenorth> otherwise you get weird effects where new pax engine is boss for freight, but only for 7 years or so 20:53:47 <andythenorth> kind of odd 20:53:50 <andythenorth> not good hax 20:55:15 <supermop_> these wikipedia pages will say things like "x was the most powerful japanese steam locomotive" but not say what the HP was 20:55:33 <supermop_> but they will give the diameter of every wheel 20:55:55 <sim-al2> Steam locomotive horsepower is somewhat difficult, compared to combustion engine 20:56:20 <supermop_> the "real" fastest JNR steam engine seems to top out at 80mph 20:56:24 <sim-al2> There are formulas to calculate if you have the size of the grate, etc 20:56:30 <supermop_> might need to fake that upward 20:56:41 *** Arioch_Tmp [~oftc-webi@host252.14.170.prov.ru] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20:57:11 <sim-al2> 130 km/h is pretty fast on 1067mm gauge already 20:57:20 <sim-al2> Especially pre-war 20:57:25 *** Hiddenfunstuff [~Geth@y32.ip1.anvianet.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:57:48 <supermop_> yeah that is the record for a NG steam train globally 20:58:02 <supermop_> or at least was 20:58:11 <sim-al2> Many of the normal carriages used into the 70's had a top speed of only 95km/h 20:58:58 <sim-al2> Pretty much all locomotive-hauled express trains were timetabled for 100km/h, but allowed 110km/h if required to make up time 20:59:21 <supermop_> i should make room for another 30s/40s/50s locomotive - because these huge smoke deflectors look badass 20:59:47 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 21:00:02 <andythenorth> steam locomotive HP is easy to set 21:00:19 <andythenorth> the numbers in the brit roster are about right for the speeds needed 21:00:40 <andythenorth> and thereâs little to be gained from changing them, unless the whole roster is slower, in which case reduce by 10% or whatever 21:00:46 <andythenorth> low HP is boring to play with though 21:01:38 <sim-al2> Though when you're dealing with engines of less than 1000hp like many of these narrow gauge engines were, 10% is a big deal 21:03:56 <sim-al2> Supermop, check this site out: http://homepage3.nifty.com/EF57/engines/LM-flame.html 21:04:58 <sim-al2> Has maximum horsepower at the drivers (PS is a German horsepower unit, really really close to American/British definitions of horsepower) 21:06:38 <sim-al2> The C62 seems to be rated for "only" 1620PS, and normal service speed is 100 km/h 21:07:44 *** frosch123 [~frosch@00013ce7.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 21:08:11 <supermop_> 1600 is fine i think 21:08:39 <supermop_> ill just step each worse engine incrementally downward from that 21:09:05 <sim-al2> It's worth mentioning, but often the record speed of a locomotive is far higher than what could actually be reasonably used in service 21:09:28 <supermop_> i was thinking my little bear, which will be the first diesel, in the 50s or so will be 800 hp 21:09:38 <sim-al2> The Mallard for example starting overheating during it's run 21:10:17 <supermop_> if players want to run 1 car trains downhill they should be able to get high speeds though 21:10:52 <supermop_> you can always set your service speed downward with timetables 21:11:00 <sim-al2> True 21:12:24 <supermop_> the shear number of types introduced there in the 30s has be wondering if my list is skewed too early 21:12:58 <supermop_> i don't want to buy a ton of locomotive right before i start electrifying though 21:13:34 <sim-al2> Electrification began very early in Japan, but didn't really finish all the major lines until the late 60's 21:13:54 <sim-al2> Steam lasted into the 70's in the rural areas, especially the far north and south 21:14:37 *** gelignite [~gelignite@x4e31ec1a.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/1kso8Ta] 21:26:52 <Wolf01> I really miss Japan :( 21:27:52 <supermop_> sim-al2: any player starting a game in 1900 or so will have plenty of cash to electrify almost everything by the 50s 21:32:08 <sim-al2> Yeah, the game mechanics allow that pretty easily, can't really prevent it 21:37:06 <supermop_> i dont want to have only one locomotive from 1870 until 1920, then a flood of new options for the last 20-30 years of steam 21:37:53 <sim-al2> There were a variety of imports during the 1870's 21:44:42 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc87201-aztw31-2-0-cust156.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has left #openttd [] 21:48:47 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 21:55:54 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@x4d02401a.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:57:08 <Samu> sometimes i feel like i'm the only one testing stuff no one cares about 21:57:46 *** Wormnest_ [~Wormnest@s5596abd2.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:57:49 <Wolf01> it might be :/ 22:02:54 *** supermop_ [~supermop@static-71-249-209-97.nycmny.east.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:02:59 *** LongyanG [~long@15255.s.time4vps.eu] has joined #openttd 22:08:56 *** Long_yanG [~long@15255.s.time4vps.eu] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:15:53 <Samu> this is what I'm testing, still working on it 22:15:54 <Samu> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pvxirfhhh 22:16:02 <Samu> only made a few tests 22:17:54 <Samu> lzma 2 means = using lzma filter with default compression which points to preset 2 of lzma 22:18:07 <Samu> what openttd currently has set 22:22:37 <Samu> the most boring part of these tests is generating a 4096x4096 map in debug mode :( 22:22:47 <Samu> takes ~13 minutes :( 22:22:57 <Samu> why is debug mode so slow' 22:32:45 *** DanMacK [~3fee8a84@188.cimarosa.openttdcoop.org] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:37:02 <Wolf01> why don't you just load a savegame? 22:37:43 <Samu> i do that in the 2nd phase of the test 22:38:12 <Samu> first, generate, have clients load, then save, then load 22:38:25 <Samu> clients join* 22:38:33 <Samu> erm just 1 client in this case* 22:40:48 <Samu> im surprised that the debug can save in less than 20 seconds, else the client would receive a "server did not answer in xx seconds" timeout :( 22:44:58 <Samu> this wouldn't be the case with a stronger preset 22:45:04 <Samu> t.t 22:52:17 <Wolf01> \o/ 15 minutes to update the smartphone 22:52:54 <Wolf01> ok... it was the first step 22:53:17 <Wolf01> I had the impression it was too fast 23:00:36 <Samu> seems like i triggered something erroneous 23:01:26 <Wolf01> 'night 23:01:29 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:02:30 <Samu> when the client was joining the server, and the server was doing the save to send to client, I went to the load game menu on the server and clicked a savegame from the list. 23:02:40 <Samu> server got stuck 23:03:42 <Samu> client got "network connection lost" error and went back to main menu 23:03:47 <Samu> server is stuck... 23:03:51 <Samu> cant interact 23:05:39 <Samu> anything i can see on visual studio? it doesn't say anything special, just it lets me pause 23:05:46 <Samu> gonna try pause 23:08:43 <Samu> last action points to a Sleep(1) inside a for kind of loop 23:08:56 <Samu> win32_v.cpp 23:09:33 <Samu> /* The game loop is the part that can run asynchronously. 23:09:41 <Samu> * The rest except sleeping can't. */ 23:10:05 <Samu> /* Release the thread while sleeping */ 23:10:10 <Samu> and the sleep is there 23:10:18 <Samu> i think it's doing this indefinitely 23:10:30 <Samu> but idont know for sure, i can't really understand this code 23:11:21 <Samu> crap, sorry, i was looking at the wrong visual studio 23:11:29 <Samu> ignore this sleep stuff 23:12:23 <Samu> paused the correct openttd now, Call Stack says: [External Code] 23:12:29 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 23:12:34 <Samu> [Frames below may be incorrect and/or missing, no symbols loaded for ntdll.dll] 23:12:43 <Samu> there's nothing below 23:12:49 <Samu> what now? 23:21:26 <Samu> HALP 23:21:45 <Samu> just noticed the Thread dropdown menu 23:22:20 <Samu> there's Main Thread with: WaitForSingleObject(this->thread, INFINITE); 23:22:48 <Samu> there's 2 other openttd:start_threads with: this->BeginCritical(); 23:22:50 <Samu> both 23:23:09 <Samu> oops thread_start* 23:24:46 <Samu> everyone's asleep? :( 23:25:06 <Samu> gonna try reproduce this with 1.6.0, see if it also happens there 23:28:25 <Samu> yup, it happens 23:28:43 <Samu> since everyone's asleep, i'm creating a bug report 23:53:46 *** Quatroking [~Quatrokin@ip226-139-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:59:22 *** MonkeyDrone [~MonkDAce@80.88.255.44] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]