Times are UTC Toggle Colours
00:00:04 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 00:19:00 *** kais58 has quit IRC 00:24:26 *** kais58 has joined #openttd 00:26:26 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 00:32:06 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 00:38:01 *** keoz has quit IRC 00:38:59 *** Samu has quit IRC 00:45:02 *** JezK_ has joined #openttd 00:54:59 *** JezK_ has quit IRC 01:02:52 *** JezK_ has joined #openttd 01:08:24 *** Compu has quit IRC 01:11:18 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 01:14:27 *** supermop___ has joined #openttd 01:17:25 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 01:17:34 *** JezK_ has quit IRC 01:17:47 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 01:20:21 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 01:20:43 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 01:22:26 *** supermop has quit IRC 01:23:36 *** Tharbakim has quit IRC 01:24:29 *** supermop has joined #openttd 01:25:31 *** Tharbakim has joined #openttd 01:26:15 *** JezK_ has joined #openttd 01:26:49 *** supermop___ has quit IRC 01:29:46 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 01:30:55 *** mindlesstux_ has joined #openttd 01:36:06 *** mindlesstux has quit IRC 01:36:06 *** mindlesstux_ is now known as mindlesstux 01:55:03 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 01:56:49 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 02:01:26 *** supermop has quit IRC 02:03:05 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 02:09:00 *** glx has quit IRC 02:30:47 *** supermop has joined #openttd 02:32:16 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 02:33:02 *** alask0ud has quit IRC 02:47:43 *** _dp_ has quit IRC 02:47:45 *** dP has joined #openttd 02:47:48 *** dP is now known as _dp_ 03:25:26 *** kais58 has quit IRC 03:25:42 *** kais58 has joined #openttd 03:33:47 *** Snail has quit IRC 03:39:31 *** Hiddenfunstuff has joined #openttd 03:50:16 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 03:52:54 *** supermop___ has joined #openttd 03:56:44 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 03:59:20 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 04:14:16 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 04:18:20 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 04:20:35 *** supermop___ has quit IRC 04:20:57 *** supermop___ has joined #openttd 04:21:13 *** Sylf has quit IRC 04:21:24 *** Sylf has joined #openttd 04:24:21 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 04:27:01 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 04:27:24 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 04:33:04 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 04:33:26 *** supermop___ has quit IRC 04:36:29 *** supermop has quit IRC 04:39:34 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 04:40:25 *** supermop has joined #openttd 04:46:06 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 04:46:36 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 04:50:29 *** supermop has quit IRC 05:01:32 *** supermop has joined #openttd 05:05:50 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 05:07:40 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 05:11:36 *** supermop has quit IRC 05:15:58 *** ConductorCat has joined #openttd 05:17:19 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 05:30:16 *** supermop has joined #openttd 05:35:10 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 05:36:39 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 05:50:13 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 05:55:54 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 05:56:05 *** supermop has quit IRC 05:59:01 *** supermop has joined #openttd 06:02:21 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 06:05:10 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 06:07:34 *** Compu has joined #openttd 06:08:25 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 06:14:14 *** supermop has quit IRC 06:24:05 *** supermop has joined #openttd 06:30:26 *** supermop_ has quit IRC 06:31:59 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 06:34:16 *** Speedy has quit IRC 06:34:18 *** Speedy` has joined #openttd 06:34:28 *** Speedy` is now known as Speedy 07:00:25 *** namad7 has joined #openttd 07:00:43 *** supermop_ has joined #openttd 07:02:48 *** namad7 has quit IRC 07:05:21 *** keoz has joined #openttd 07:09:49 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 07:11:05 *** Sova has joined #openttd 07:55:41 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 08:47:28 *** Cybert1nus is now known as Cybertinus 09:06:27 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 09:07:17 <Wolf01> o/ 09:14:10 *** JezK_ has quit IRC 09:15:22 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 09:15:30 <Wolf01> o/ 09:15:59 <andythenorth_> Luxury train carriages, improved payment rate, reduced capacity... 09:16:10 <andythenorth_> BAD FEATURE? 09:16:44 <Wolf01> Nah, seems good 09:17:37 <Wolf01> NotRoadTypes didn't let me have a good sleep 09:17:44 <Wolf01> But I have more ideas 09:18:22 <andythenorth_> :) 09:18:27 <V453000> andythenorth_: it makes no sense to use less capacity for more profit, but sure :D 09:18:34 <V453000> #gameizbroken 09:18:41 <V453000> #moneymattersnot 09:19:29 <andythenorth_> V seems like Doing It Just Because I Could 09:19:37 <andythenorth_> No eye candy benefit 09:19:46 <andythenorth_> No gameplay rationale 09:21:29 <andythenorth_> Wolf01 so...ideas? o_O 09:21:44 <V453000> that way you will end up hating it in 6 months 09:21:46 <Wolf01> Ideas on how to start patching 09:22:13 <andythenorth_> V I am hoping someone says 'no' :p 09:22:25 <Wolf01> Also, ideas on reverting half of the catenary 09:22:34 <andythenorth_> Although the idea is valid for ships I think 09:23:30 <Wolf01> Still no ideas on how to implement subtypes 09:24:21 <V453000> well yeah ships are senseless no matter what you do ;P 09:24:30 <V453000> WETRail is all i'm sayin 09:24:33 <andythenorth_> Wolf01 alberth gave me an enum that could be unpacked to fibd the subtypes, do you mean at that level, or more generally? :) 09:24:47 <Wolf01> More generally 09:25:16 <andythenorth_> V WETRail is a protest vote not a solution :D 09:26:20 <V453000> well it's the best solution we have so far :P 09:27:52 <andythenorth_> Bah maybe ships need a patch 09:28:10 <andythenorth_> What would it do? 09:28:55 <V453000> remove them? :> 09:29:19 <andythenorth_> Plausible 09:29:27 <V453000> for a start, colliding with each other would be necessary, which would probably make the pathfinder ultra wtf on CPU 09:29:51 <V453000> because that's one of the reasons why many of the things don't matter with them 09:30:11 <V453000> but other than that it's pretty hard to make them interesting 09:30:20 <Wolf01> Remove ships and make space for more stuff 09:30:29 <andythenorth_> Airplanes have same problem? 09:30:39 <V453000> yeah but airports have capacity limit 09:30:53 <V453000> for aircraft I always thought it is similar to ships, but there is the option of making something like modular airports 09:30:59 <V453000> maybe making modular docks would be the thing 09:31:03 <andythenorth_> I think colliding ships is wtf 09:31:13 <andythenorth_> Docks are the problem 09:31:14 <V453000> you know, unloading area, loading area, waiting area 09:31:15 <V453000> or something 09:31:22 <V453000> with cranes and shit, you name it 09:31:52 <argoneus> good morning train friends 09:32:03 <V453000> ship friends * 09:32:09 <andythenorth_> Seas need weather 09:32:14 <V453000> haha 09:32:14 <argoneus> no 09:32:17 <V453000> kraken approachez 09:32:18 <Wolf01> Colliding ships adds more thinking when making routes, specially with canals 09:32:21 <argoneus> ship acquaintances 09:32:31 <V453000> I think modular docks would be right way to go 09:32:31 <andythenorth_> Small ships get sunk by storms 09:32:39 <andythenorth_> +lots 09:33:03 <andythenorth_> But still, does nothing to differentiate types? 09:33:19 <V453000> well it could start making a difference 09:33:21 <andythenorth_> Ha ha ShipDockTypes? 09:33:28 <V453000> if the dock setup is really complex 09:33:39 <V453000> simple to understand but hard to mASSter 09:33:41 <andythenorth_> we have roadstop types 09:34:07 <Wolf01> Cruise ships, you'll get paid on start and then you can forget it 09:34:11 <andythenorth_> pax ships have to go to pax dock 09:34:25 <andythenorth_> Cargo ships to cargo dock 09:34:54 <V453000> it probably doesn't fit into openttd 09:34:58 <andythenorth_> game is about routes yes/no? 09:35:03 <V453000> could have shit like waves shouldn't be able to get into dock etc 09:35:09 <V453000> storm-proof docks 09:35:15 <V453000> slug invasion proof docks 09:35:18 <andythenorth_> and crime of ships is that routes have no challenge 09:35:26 <andythenorth_> CRIME 09:35:33 <V453000> well it doesn'y have to be about routes 09:35:37 <V453000> trains are 09:35:41 <V453000> doesn't mean everything should 09:35:49 <Wolf01> Game is about making money, but singe you can make a shitload of money with just 1 aircraft, the game is pointless, at least add complexity to the puzzle part 09:35:52 <Wolf01> *since 09:36:01 <V453000> aircraft and ships are about nothing then 09:36:04 <andythenorth_> Yeah true...but it is about routes anyway V 09:36:09 <V453000> making them about airport/station is fine 09:36:26 <andythenorth_> Coulda woulda shoulda, but it's a routing game :p 09:36:35 <Wolf01> Yes, and the route should be fun, not just a traight line 09:36:40 <Wolf01> *straight 09:36:50 <V453000> XD 09:36:51 <Wolf01> WTF is with my fingers today? 09:37:05 <andythenorth_> only complexity to ships is bouys, and that is just tedious yak shaving 09:37:21 <Wolf01> +1 09:37:35 *** Flygon_ has quit IRC 09:37:37 <Wolf01> Automatic buoys assignment? 09:37:38 <andythenorth_> infinite capacity per tile, no other transport type has that in ottd 09:37:53 <V453000> remoov shitz 09:37:56 *** Flygon_ has joined #openttd 09:38:03 <andythenorth_> Limiting docks forces ships to take up more tiles 09:38:16 <andythenorth_> also eye candy 09:38:18 <V453000> well mainly it puts them into non-infinite shit 09:38:23 <V453000> and eye candy docks are amazing 09:38:48 <andythenorth_> ok we just need to implement the fucker then 09:39:10 <Wolf01> I would like also one ship per lock, and removing the "sliding locks" which is nonsense 09:39:16 <andythenorth_> But all eye candy tiles are in rail station grfs :( 09:39:21 <V453000> just make 1 ship max at 1 dock at a time 09:39:25 <V453000> don't need to make ships not overlap 09:39:26 <andythenorth_> Locks are stupid 09:39:37 <V453000> grfs -> base shit ? :P 09:39:44 <andythenorth_> I am going to patch locks to be 2 tiles 09:40:04 <andythenorth_> And they need some kind of speed penalty or wait time or such 09:40:13 <Wolf01> +1 09:40:22 <V453000> syck 09:40:41 <peter1138> i had a patch for that... 09:40:43 <peter1138> not quite 09:40:49 <andythenorth_> yair :) 09:40:55 <andythenorth_> CanalTypes? 09:41:10 <andythenorth_> 7mph, 9mph, 15mph :p 09:41:17 <Wolf01> Ships need to be nerfed badly and at the same time made more pleasant to play with 09:41:30 <V453000> fuck nerfing 09:41:31 * andythenorth_ trolling about CanalTypes 09:41:33 <V453000> just need more mechanics 09:41:50 <andythenorth_> one ship per time in locks? 09:42:12 <andythenorth_> I spent 2 boring hours on the hydrofoil in Vienna waiting for lock 09:42:37 <Wolf01> And ship elevators 09:42:49 <V453000> one ship per entity in general makes sense 09:42:53 <V453000> be it a dock or a lock 09:42:58 <Wolf01> Yes 09:43:05 <V453000> rhyme the fuck out of this bitch 09:43:11 <andythenorth_> problem of locks/canals is, I just lower land to sea level always 09:43:26 <andythenorth_> Because reasons 09:44:18 <andythenorth_> LockTypes? :p 09:44:40 <V453000> WETLocks? 09:45:08 <andythenorth_> Hmm game could auto-bouy when adding orders, pathfinder could figure it out 09:45:21 <andythenorth_> Bouy would have to exist already 09:45:24 <V453000> would be a nice thing 09:45:31 <V453000> certainly much less annoying 09:45:42 <Wolf01> That what I said before 09:45:57 <andythenorth_> :D 09:46:17 <V453000> idea stolen 09:46:18 <andythenorth_> Might sometimea have stupid results depending on location of bouy 09:46:21 <V453000> max profit 09:46:23 <andythenorth_> But eh 09:46:42 <V453000> it's not like ships currently don't have stupid results 09:46:59 <Wolf01> We also need water levels, with huge ships not being able to travel on shallow water 09:46:59 <andythenorth_> Bouys could maintain a linkgraph of reachable docks 09:47:18 <andythenorth_> Then ship just routes to bouy 09:47:37 * andythenorth_ wavey hands 09:47:56 <andythenorth_> Docks could cache routes to other docks :p 09:48:08 <Wolf01> https://sites.google.com/site/boekabart/deepwater <- 09:50:05 <Wolf01> Cached routes will be a good idea, maybe they'll need to be cleared once in a while if the terrain/canals change 09:50:35 * andythenorth_ looking at deep water 09:52:19 <andythenorth_> Dunno about deep water 09:52:54 <andythenorth_> Might be like MHL, sounds good, looks good, but zero gameplay effect? 09:53:28 <Wolf01> MAke aircrafts avoid mountains, so Samu will be more happy 09:56:19 <Wolf01> Btw with MHL naturally occurring steep slopes would be a good idea, make the cliffs more eyecandy and tries to avoid lowering an entire row up to the top if you are lowering a tile on the mountain base 09:58:02 * andythenorth_ back to ship set ideas 09:59:00 <andythenorth_> Not sure whether to keep 'utility ships' (refit pax or freight), or ditch them 09:59:51 <andythenorth_> Road Hog does not have this - RVs can't due to stations 10:00:20 <andythenorth_> Iron Horse has it for specific cases of small trains for small routes 10:00:41 <andythenorth_> Otherwise not 10:00:59 <andythenorth_> Pikka's planes all do it 10:02:40 *** Samu has joined #openttd 10:03:03 <andythenorth_> It makes buy menu shorter, but if you run pax mail food to small town, all ships will be same 10:03:39 <andythenorth_> Is realism kind of, except irl it would be one ship carrying all cargos at once 10:04:42 <Wolf01> Make only goods ships 10:04:57 <Wolf01> And reroute every cargo to goods 10:05:29 <Wolf01> Except oil tankers 10:06:34 <Wolf01> It would be good having shore industries which need to be built near roads which produce vehicles, so we could have ferries 10:11:09 *** keoz has quit IRC 10:11:19 <andythenorth_> Which is worse, long buy menu, or monoculture of vehicles in-game? 10:11:38 <Wolf01> Both 10:11:42 <Samu> hi 10:11:50 <Wolf01> (implementation detail: uses 4 bits each, uses 8 bits free in m8) <- So m8 is completely free or there's an offset? 10:12:31 <Wolf01> struct TileExtended { 10:12:31 <Wolf01> byte m6; ///< General purpose 10:12:31 <Wolf01> byte m7; ///< Primarily used for newgrf support 10:12:31 <Wolf01> }; 10:12:35 <Wolf01> I think is free... 10:12:46 *** keoz has joined #openttd 10:13:03 <Samu> is there a setting to change the max distance between 2 docks for ship orders? 10:13:17 <Samu> for YAPF, that is 10:13:54 <Samu> ais don't like 128 tiles distance to be the limit 10:14:05 <andythenorth_> Wolf01 I can't check on my phone, but iirc there was a block of spare bits ;) 10:14:07 <Samu> i see ships with single orders 10:14:27 <andythenorth_> AI can't build bouys reliably? 10:14:36 <Samu> they could 10:14:42 <Samu> but some ais are not prepared 10:14:57 <Samu> i guess they were tested under NPF 10:15:04 <Samu> NPF allows unlimited range 10:15:19 <Samu> but NPF has some other problems though 10:19:11 <Wolf01> Also, if I understood it well, the 4 extended bits for sub road types are the features? 10:19:31 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 10:19:39 *** Myhorta has joined #openttd 10:20:05 <Wolf01> Or they are just the index of the sub road type? 10:24:24 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 10:28:16 <andythenorth_> They would index to labels (I assume) 10:28:32 <andythenorth_> The type would define the features via newgrf 10:30:07 *** Myhorta has quit IRC 10:30:28 <Samu> hmm, from my understanding, reading the log 10:30:44 <Samu> trans wants to transport passengers by ship from Wuwood to Wuwood 10:30:53 <Samu> the city is quite big, but it only uses 1 dock 10:30:59 <Samu> :( 10:31:11 <Samu> seems to be an AI problem, not a YAPF problem 10:31:27 <Samu> it only has 1 dock total 10:31:48 <Samu> i also see a mention to Mentwood as another possible destination, but I see no dock near Mentwood 10:32:16 <Samu> Mentwood is close to Wuwood, maybe the AI intended to make a connection between Wuwood and Mentwood, not Wuwood and Wuwood 10:32:38 <Samu> I dunno, log isn't clear enough 10:32:50 <Samu> I've already tried YAPF and NPF, it fails on both cases 10:34:03 <Samu> otviai, on the other hand 10:34:10 <Samu> benefits greatly with npf 10:40:39 <peter1138> multistop docks! 10:40:41 <peter1138> i had a patch for that... 10:42:51 * Wolf01 googles "how to implement this stuff I'm working on" 10:45:02 <andythenorth_> Multistop newgrf docks? Peter1138 :p 10:47:57 <Samu> from my previous test: https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=75144 10:48:43 <Samu> terron, otvi, wmdot, nonocab, dictatorai benefit better from NPF than YAPF 10:49:14 <Samu> nocab and trans benefit better from YAPF than NPF 10:49:27 <Samu> hmm 10:50:08 <Samu> dictatorai is difficult to judge 10:50:15 <Samu> could do well on either NPF and YAPF 10:51:02 <Samu> nocab and nonocab are also withing margin of error 10:51:18 <Samu> nocab and nonocab are also within* margin of error 10:51:52 <Samu> maybe not nocab 10:52:05 <Samu> nocab appears to have a better advantage later game with YAPF 10:53:07 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 10:53:32 <Samu> terron, otvi, wmdot seem to prefer NPF clearly 10:54:10 *** Snail has joined #openttd 10:54:16 <Samu> nocab seem to have a late game advantage with YAPF clearly 10:54:27 <Samu> I guess overall NPF is preferible for AIs 10:58:20 <Samu> trans appears to benefit better with YAPF 10:58:31 <Samu> interesting... must test this further 10:59:41 <Samu> trans problem is that it generates a ton of lost ships 11:00:02 <Samu> and NPF is prone to having lost ships 11:00:08 <Samu> same as original 11:00:53 <Samu> YAPF seems better on avoiding lost ships, but there's the limitation of 128 tiles max distance which some ais can't cope well 11:04:19 <Wolf01> ShowBuildRoadToolbar(RoadType roadtype) <- I need to pass a sub road type too, or change the RoadType to the SubRoadType and then get the RoadType from that, but I don't know how to define SubRoadType as it should be handled by the newgrfs (I could put there the current ones) 11:05:37 <Wolf01> How does it work for rails? 11:09:21 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 11:10:11 *** Myhorta has joined #openttd 11:13:05 *** Snail has quit IRC 11:13:10 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 11:18:47 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 11:19:08 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 11:30:32 <Samu> noob question, i'm trying to fix something on WMDot, i want to have it do unload and leave empty in one of its vehicle orders 11:30:44 <Samu> AIOrder.AppendOrder(MyVehicle, DockLocation, AIOrder.OF_NONE); 11:30:56 <Samu> it's AIOrder.???? 11:31:02 <Samu> what do I change it to? 11:37:00 <Samu> gonna try OF_NO_LOAD 11:37:04 <Samu> brb 11:49:56 <Samu> YES, it werks! 11:57:30 <Wolf01> ROTF_CATENARY <- I would add a L 12:00:55 <Samu> who's an expert on orders? 12:01:20 <Samu> what's the difference between No loading and unload and leave empty? 12:01:39 <Samu> i think i know, but 12:01:52 <Wolf01> Unload forces the unload even if the station does not accept the cargo 12:02:06 <Samu> I see 12:02:14 <Samu> from an AI standpoint, what would be better? 12:02:35 <Wolf01> Depends on the situation 12:03:00 <Samu> i'm unsure what WmDOT does when the oil refinery disappears 12:03:14 <Samu> i guess unload and leave empty would be better 12:03:50 <Samu> gonna try magic bulldozer the refinery 12:05:34 <Wolf01> You just move the problem to another place 12:05:43 <Wolf01> May be even worse 12:06:09 <Samu> No Load is bad, he keeps adding ships 12:06:14 <Samu> must try unload and leave empty 12:06:21 <Samu> how would I do that? 12:06:35 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: the subtype is an index into an array, and the array member is filled with data from the newgrf (or marked invalid) 12:07:06 <Samu> https://noai.openttd.org/api/1.5.0/classAIOrder.html#ca4eab6320c32ec982461231f14d1c6e 12:07:09 <Samu> halp 12:07:22 <Samu> AIOrder.AppendOrder(MyVehicle, DockLocation, AIOrder.OF_???????); 12:07:52 <Wolf01> Samu, you should check if vehicles return loaded when they are supposed to return empty 12:08:13 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 12:08:18 <Samu> the way the ai works, it keeps adding ships because of the amount of cargo waiting at the oild rig 12:08:35 <Wolf01> The AI is borked 12:08:46 <Samu> if I force unload, he won't add that many ships 12:09:00 <Samu> unless oil rig increases prodcution 12:09:00 <Wolf01> Not the right fix 12:09:23 <Wolf01> You should change the unload station if possible instead of wasting oil 12:09:41 <Samu> well, i am not gonna dwelve into his code, just wanted an easy fix 12:10:20 <Wolf01> Like breaking your other leg to not feel pain in the first one 12:10:26 <Samu> hehe 12:10:48 <Samu> i suppose the AI doesn't expect oil refineries to disappear 12:10:53 <Samu> I'm unsure 12:11:05 <Samu> magic bulldozer isn't the same as saying refinery announced closure 12:11:10 <Wolf01> Eddi, could you guide me a bit? 12:11:27 <Samu> maybe the ai does handle refinery closure 12:11:32 <Samu> but not magic bulldozer 12:11:40 <Samu> don't feel like investigating 12:12:15 <Wolf01> Need more debugging tool, like "force industry closure" 12:12:29 <Samu> ugh, maybe i should 12:14:15 <Wolf01> Eddi, I'm looking at rail.h to get inspiration, I could put in the new road.h some stuff to help the subtypes 12:16:17 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 12:16:20 <Samu> case AIEvent.ET_INDUSTRY_CLOSE: Log.Note("Nice event and all, but I have no idea what to do about it...", 4); 12:16:29 <Samu> looks like wmdot doesn't care 12:17:23 <Samu> that means... unload and leave empty is the lesser problem for a quick fix, yet not the ideal solution 12:18:17 <Wolf01> It should shut downs the route 12:18:26 <Wolf01> This is the easiest fix 12:19:00 <Wolf01> At least if you don't want to lose money 12:19:19 <Samu> how would I code that? my skills are bad 12:19:33 <Samu> i don't even know how to put a unload and leave empty order 12:19:54 <Wolf01> Read docs? 12:20:14 <Samu> i managed to do a no load order though, but unload and leave empty seems to be a mix of NO_LOAD and UNLOAD 12:20:23 <Samu> added together 12:26:00 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 12:28:58 <Samu> the index UNLOAD does not exist :( 12:29:36 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 12:30:19 <Samu> oh, right 12:30:22 <Samu> OF_UNLOAD, not UNLOAD 12:30:40 *** Gja has joined #openttd 12:31:16 <Samu> unload and take cargo.... bah :( 12:31:23 <Samu> must be unload and leave empty 12:31:32 *** Gja has quit IRC 12:34:41 <Samu> i can't manage to do it, grrr 12:34:47 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 12:36:25 <Samu> must find an AI that already does unload and leave empty 12:36:34 <Samu> copy paste skills 12:42:17 <Samu> aha 12:42:20 <Samu> AIOrder.AppendOrder(vehicleID, roadList[0].tile, AIOrder.OF_UNLOAD | AIOrder.OF_NO_LOAD); 12:42:29 <Samu> let's try 12:43:38 <Samu> YES, i did it :) 12:46:40 <Samu> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=53698&p=1175569#p1175569 12:46:52 <Samu> who's MinchinWeb? does he post on this channel? 12:57:22 *** Sova has quit IRC 13:02:01 *** Sova has joined #openttd 13:06:09 <Alkel_U3> hm, roadtypes... will ice roads have a bonus in curves and corners? :-) https://media.giphy.com/media/l0K3XYocfxgMiCwBq/giphy.gif 13:08:33 <Wolf01> Sure 13:09:31 <Alkel_U3> also 5-tile stopping distance 13:11:04 <Eddi|zuHause> Alkel_U3: max_te is a vehicle's responsibility 13:12:46 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: sorry, i don't have any of the details 13:13:04 <Wolf01> So, I made up a definition for the original roadtypes, I'll have to move the sprite definition too, but I think it could be done later 13:13:37 <Wolf01> Now I only need to fill the _roadtypes[] array 13:14:20 <Eddi|zuHause> that's easy: {default, invalid, invalid, invalid, ...} 13:14:43 <Wolf01> The problem is where... rail seem to do it in newgrf 13:15:26 <Eddi|zuHause> you could just make a dummy function that gets replaced once you do newgrf stuff 13:15:39 <Wolf01> Yes, still no clue where to call it 13:15:44 <Eddi|zuHause> or you could already build in the newgrf stub 13:15:59 <Eddi|zuHause> somewere in the new game code 13:16:13 <Alkel_U3> Eddi|zuHause: well, I wasn't being too serious, but it could be lowered on snowy roads in arctic climate... unless that's a bad feature, of course :-) 13:16:56 <Eddi|zuHause> Alkel_U3: i'm just saying, vehicles that know about roadtypes could do it, but others can not. 13:17:12 <Eddi|zuHause> the roadtype itself has no influence on this 13:17:19 <Alkel_U3> ah, I see 13:17:49 <Alkel_U3> I didn't look at that that way 13:20:19 <Wolf01> It will be possible to set up a max speed for RoadTypes 13:37:56 *** TheMask96 has quit IRC 13:40:22 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 13:41:47 *** TheMask96 has joined #openttd 14:03:25 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 14:19:00 *** sim-al2 has quit IRC 14:21:17 <supermop> good morning 14:23:01 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 14:31:06 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 14:34:13 <Wolf01> Nice, sorting the RoadTypes made Tramway first choice 14:34:34 <Wolf01> Not a problem, because I'm still using the old gui 14:36:44 <V453000> TRAMZ > ALL 14:36:49 <V453000> get rekt 14:37:56 <Wolf01> Still no clue on how to add more hardcoded roadtypes of type 'TRAM' 14:38:39 <Wolf01> The function in newgrf.cpp is weird enough to make me desist 14:38:46 <V453000> Yo program, please add dem TRAM rodetypoz. Thanks, yours sincerely fuck you computer. 14:38:49 <V453000> ez 14:38:56 <Wolf01> :D 14:39:07 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 14:41:44 <Samu> i'm experimenting wmdot with my fix on the same test conditions i used before 14:41:53 <Samu> let's see if there's a noticeable difference 14:41:56 <Wolf01> Labels need to be exactly 4 chars? 14:42:27 <Wolf01> Or could I use "LTRAIL" and "ELTRAIL" instead of "TRAM"? 14:45:46 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 14:46:32 * andythenorth ponders 14:47:00 <andythenorth> 1. Restrict ships to only visit compatible docks 14:47:15 <andythenorth> 2. Extend that to arbitrary types, newgrf defined 14:48:09 <andythenorth> 3. Limit docks to n ship stops, and make ships wait somewhere nearby 14:48:22 <andythenorth> 4. Permit multiple docks per station 14:48:48 <andythenorth> 5. Change docks to single tile, and allow building on coast or flat land 14:49:14 <andythenorth> 6. Enable arbitrary dock graphics per type, newgrf defined 14:49:20 <andythenorth> 7. Profit 14:49:46 <andythenorth> Peter1138 where did ships wait for MultiDocks? 14:49:51 <Alkel_U3> also make ships dock broadside when it's already being fiddled with, perhaps 14:50:11 <Wolf01> Mmmh, nothing changed in game, trying now to effectively call the function 14:51:30 <Samu> hey andythenorth, can you improve dock placement checks? 14:51:40 <Wolf01> Need to bypass the GrfSpecFeature 14:51:49 <Samu> to avoid ship blocking when placing docks 14:52:24 <Samu> only water around is not an enough check 14:53:21 <Samu> this is only to help ais, because humans won't place docks purposedly to block ships, but ais may do it by accident 14:53:59 <andythenorth> Wolf01 AIUI there is an enum which correspons to the railtypes, but I don't know how that connects to a newgrf define data structure further 14:54:20 <andythenorth> Bad typing on tablet :| 14:54:52 <andythenorth> There must be some railtype class or something 14:54:52 <Samu> erm, let me screenshot an example 14:55:17 <Wolf01> Yes I already made roadtype 14:57:04 * Wolf01 crosses fingers 14:57:18 <Wolf01> Something exploded 14:57:20 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: labels are just an integer, that they translate to exactly 4 characters is just a convention 14:57:40 <Eddi|zuHause> they can't be more than 4 characters, though 14:59:09 <andythenorth> They map directly to the bits in the map, no? 14:59:13 *** Sova has quit IRC 14:59:20 <Eddi|zuHause> no 14:59:42 <Samu> andythenorth: http://imgur.com/a/KfXSE - ships are blocked 14:59:58 <Samu> ship 1 is blocked because as the ship was arriving at the dock, a ship depot was placed in front of it 15:00:00 <Eddi|zuHause> the map has 4 bits for (rail)type, the label is 32 bit 15:00:09 <Wolf01> Bah, linker doesn't resolve a function call, removing that, useless 15:00:31 <Wolf01> Ok, the game don't explode 15:00:38 <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: did you add the file to sources.lst and then run projects/generate? 15:00:43 <Wolf01> Yes 15:00:48 <Samu> ship 2 is blocked because the dock to the right was placed when the ship was docking at ship 1 when coming to it from NE-NW direction 15:00:59 <Samu> oops typo 15:01:10 <Samu> ship 2 is blocked because the dock to the right was placed when the ship was docking at the dock to the left when coming to it from NE-NW direction 15:01:23 <andythenorth> Not sure that's related :) 15:02:02 <Samu> when it tries go to the way back, NW-NE, it's blocked by the dock to the right 15:02:40 <andythenorth> Players need to build in better locations? o_O 15:02:51 <Samu> well, players don't have a problem with that 15:02:58 <Samu> ais do have problems 15:03:08 <Samu> they can't easily fix it 15:04:05 <andythenorth> it's an issue, but it doesn't help me design a ship newgrf :) 15:04:25 <andythenorth> I am not an ottd dev, so I can't fix the placement problem 15:07:33 <andythenorth> Fast ships: luxury (payment bonus) or uncomfortable (payment penalty)? 15:08:01 <andythenorth> RL is no guide here 15:08:39 <Wolf01> Oh really, I'm an idiot, I never implemented the function 15:08:50 <V453000> andythenorth: XD 15:08:53 <V453000> usually luxury 15:09:11 <V453000> real life rekt 15:09:11 <andythenorth> Hovercraft can be quite variable 15:09:20 <V453000> then make it hovercat or rubberduck 15:09:20 <V453000> GG 15:09:52 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: scrap fast ships, all ships the same speed. 15:10:18 <andythenorth> I tried that, I think it's a bit limiting on types 15:10:51 <Eddi|zuHause> in a comparison between slow and fast, fast always wins, so might just as well scrap all slow ships then 15:10:51 <andythenorth> it means by 1970 or so everything is hovercraft or hydrofoil 15:14:17 <andythenorth> Also, does the argument hold? Why build metro trains instead of 200mph maglev? o_O 15:16:44 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v planetmaker 15:16:44 *** ChanServ changes topic to "1.6.1 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: hg, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only | Logs: @logs | #openttd.dev if this channel is really spammy" 15:16:44 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v Belugas 15:16:44 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v orudge 15:16:49 <Alkel_U3> those can have slow acceleration and loading times 15:18:07 <andythenorth> Ship acceleration :p 15:23:09 <Samu> i'm opening a 1 TB log file... zzzzz 15:23:44 <Samu> 952 MB (998.860.730 bytes) 15:23:52 <Samu> not 1 TB, but close 15:24:20 <Wolf01> Ekranoplanes, ships that moves at aircraft speed 15:25:34 <Wolf01> andythenorth: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AgUFeOGLNNfVhYcE-9rgJMb4PMn6-w 15:26:07 <Eddi|zuHause> the problem is that the game doesn't model a lot of things that could make shipsinteresting/diverse/useful 15:26:16 <Wolf01> I don't know if ipad let you open the diff to see 15:30:10 <Samu> teshinet crashed again 15:30:33 <Samu> always the same error 15:33:45 <andythenorth> Yeah no diff on ipad 15:33:57 <peter1138> hi 15:34:29 <Samu> hi 15:34:36 <andythenorth> Eddi assume game *did* offer something (anything), what classes of pax ship would then be interesting to have in game? 15:34:51 <Samu> yate 15:35:32 <Samu> carries tourists, move super slow, high running costs, hmm... but tourists are super rich and pay a lot 15:35:53 <Samu> lel 15:38:07 <Eddi|zuHause> well, let's start with something easy: ferry (high loading speed, fast cargo decay) vs. cruise ship (low loading speed, slow cargo decay) 15:38:30 <supermop> articulated 15:38:55 <andythenorth> Trade station dwell time against travel time 15:39:10 <supermop> ro-ro ferry can carry goods or mail in addition to passengers, watertaxi carries only passengers 15:39:20 <andythenorth> Ferries are for dense cities, like metro 15:39:58 <supermop> water taxi is like metro, big ferry is like regional rail, ocean liners are like inter-city 15:40:02 <supermop> but more so 15:40:26 <andythenorth> But the load time would have to be substantially different 15:41:00 <Alkel_U3> separately refittable cargo holds would be awesome, but that's certainly beyond the scope of this 15:41:25 <supermop> i mean boats should load slower than trains anyway to ofset the infinite capacity of a canal 15:42:02 <Eddi|zuHause> like i said, i wouldn't vary the travel speed too much 15:42:04 <supermop> that or use that old patch that spaces ot ships and the only pass through one another at low speed 15:42:20 <supermop> Eddi|zuHause: yeah 15:42:30 <andythenorth> Eddi not varying travel speeds precludes too many types imo 15:42:40 <andythenorth> Maybe 15:42:46 <supermop> most modern single hull ships go the same speed, gradually increasing with size 15:43:12 <andythenorth> No hovercraft, no hydrofoils 15:43:20 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 15:43:24 <andythenorth> No jet ferry 15:43:25 <supermop> nuclear icebreakers or supercarriers would be faster in open water than a little motorboat 15:43:31 <Eddi|zuHause> can live without those 15:43:37 <supermop> but not by much 15:44:15 <supermop> newest supercarriers go maybe 40 knots, most small ships are close to that 15:44:29 <andythenorth> Eddi, ships limited to 25mph? 15:44:34 <supermop> need a catamaran to go faster 15:45:35 <andythenorth> Nerfed ships :) 15:50:57 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 15:50:57 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 15:51:05 <Alberth> hi hi 15:51:17 <Wolf01> o/ 15:53:03 <Wolf01> Load trains on ships and road vehicles on trains 15:55:13 <Alberth> and ships on RVs 15:55:46 <Samu> strange, wmdot does fine till the year 2010, then something strange happens 15:56:04 <Samu> sells most ships, keeps only a few, i don't understand 15:56:43 <Samu> sold like 95% of his total 15:56:45 <Samu> :( 15:57:19 <Samu> seems to be related to old model expiration 15:57:36 <Samu> he can't clone old model anymore by the year 2010 15:57:41 <Samu> could it be that? 15:58:12 <Samu> but old model expires by year 1990, not 2010, hmm must investigate better 16:03:15 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 16:05:19 <Samu> question, when did you introduce that thing that doesn't put cargo on stations after a year or so without having a vehicle loading? 16:05:29 <Samu> that kinda ruined wmdot 16:05:45 <Samu> he's always evaluating waiting cargo, but it's always 0 now 16:06:21 <Samu> he got routes with 0 ships :o 16:06:33 <Samu> valid routes, but no ships 16:07:35 <Samu> i guess it would be updating the routes to the new model should there be cargo waiting 16:13:29 <Samu> his route manager is buggy, he says route 47, 48 needs more ships, but it's actually adding them to route 57 16:15:04 <Samu> there is no route 57 group 16:15:11 <Samu> it's being added to route 56 16:15:36 <andythenorth> Biab 16:15:39 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 16:15:58 <Samu> he's using the ship depot close to route 48 to duplicate ships for route 57 which doesn't have a group 16:16:14 <Samu> that means, ships have to cross half the map to reach destination 16:16:23 <Samu> :( 16:16:36 <Samu> they got to cross about 1000 tiles distance 16:17:30 <Samu> expecting bankrupt at some point 16:17:45 <Samu> he's wasting all his money on ships crossing 1000 tiles, based on waiting cargo 16:18:31 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 16:18:40 <Samu> he got £20M in the bank to burn 16:18:48 <Samu> lel 16:18:58 <Samu> seems the problem only occurs past year 2010 16:19:28 <Samu> let me look at previous screenshots of this problem 16:19:48 <Samu> yeap, 2041 16:19:51 <Samu> that's past 2010 16:23:32 *** Gja has joined #openttd 16:27:48 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 16:29:54 *** glx has joined #openttd 16:29:54 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 16:32:07 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 16:35:37 <Samu> calculate distance going from coordinates 1012,397 to 11,343 16:36:49 <Samu> (1012-11)+(397-343) 16:37:17 <Samu> 1055 tiles 16:38:18 <Samu> every 10 tiles, wmdot builds 2 ships 16:39:43 <Samu> there's obstacles in the way, ships actually cross more than 1055 tiles 16:39:48 <Samu> :( 16:39:58 <Samu> poor wmdot 16:42:10 *** Nitrodev has joined #openttd 16:43:50 *** Progman has joined #openttd 16:45:08 <Alberth> @calc 1.4*(397-343)+(1012-11) 16:45:08 <DorpsGek> Alberth: 1076.6 16:45:23 <Alberth> hmm, no 16:45:41 <Alberth> @calc 1.4*(397-343)+(1012-11)-(397-343) 16:45:41 <DorpsGek> Alberth: 1022.6 16:46:17 *** Arveen has joined #openttd 16:46:33 <Samu> omg i got this all wrong 16:47:15 <Samu> there's route 48 and 49, essentially they got the same orders 16:47:35 <Samu> when the route manager investigates for waiting cargo 16:47:35 *** JacobD88 has joined #openttd 16:48:02 <Samu> it says route 47 and 48, but 48 and 49 have the so 1300 oil waiting at the oil rig 16:48:24 <Samu> the depot of choice is of that for route 48 16:48:46 <Samu> that depot is near that oil rig 16:48:56 <Samu> but... the ships get the wrong orders 16:49:20 <Samu> they get orders that tells them to go to the wrong oil rig 16:49:29 <Samu> making them traverse half the world 16:49:36 <Samu> that wrong oil rig is of route 56 16:49:46 <Samu> and it does not have 1300 oil waiting 16:49:55 <Samu> it's actually fully saturated 16:50:22 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 16:51:02 <Samu> my observations are wrong 16:51:40 <andythenorth> So pax-only ships, or universal? 16:51:57 <Samu> darn, i must correct the post, brb 16:52:06 <andythenorth> If universal, then all other ship types are related to pax 16:52:21 <andythenorth> Which is...harder :p 16:53:23 <Alberth> pax ships have different graphics, don't they? 16:53:39 <andythenorth> Depends 16:53:52 <andythenorth> Ferries, for example, are pretty universal 16:53:55 <Alberth> ferry-ish ? 16:54:07 <Alberth> hmm, true 16:54:34 <andythenorth> RL keeps intervening in a neat and tidy set design 16:54:41 <andythenorth> Silly RL 16:56:14 <Wolf01> Mmmh I need a good steam locomotives video I've not yet seen 16:56:56 * andythenorth needs dedicated ferry dock 16:57:12 <andythenorth> (see logs) 16:57:19 <andythenorth> NotDockTypes 16:57:23 <Nitrodev> should i really go as the tutorial on the wiki suggests 16:57:28 <andythenorth> No 16:57:36 <andythenorth> Whatever it says :) 16:57:49 <Nitrodev> okay then 16:57:49 *** JacobD88 has quit IRC 16:59:09 <andythenorth> Tutorial is fine, but just skims the surface ;) 16:59:16 * andythenorth just read it 16:59:57 <Nitrodev> well, as i just downloaded the game, and all i have is a single bus going between two stations, i kinda need the start up 17:00:54 <Alberth> it's useful if you never played the game 17:02:09 <andythenorth> Hmm 17:02:26 <Nitrodev> what andythenorth? 17:02:42 <andythenorth> So Eddi|zuHause the solution is to level all pax ship speeds for any given year? 17:02:54 <andythenorth> But they could all be 'fast'? 17:02:59 <Eddi|zuHause> yes, pretty much 17:03:05 <Wolf01> http://img-9gag-fun.9cache.com/photo/abZOQ2r_460s.jpg pfffff it already crashed 17:03:06 <andythenorth> The actual value is atbitrary 17:03:07 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 17:03:21 <andythenorth> Arbitrary* 17:03:59 *** FLHerne has quit IRC 17:05:09 <andythenorth> If there was a hard limit on ship sprite sizes, designing would be much easier :p 17:05:20 <andythenorth> More constraints would help 17:05:53 <andythenorth> But self-imposed constraint on number of ships did mot work :x 17:05:58 <supermop__> Wolf01: man with movie camera 17:06:11 <supermop__> old soviet film from 20s 17:06:54 *** supermop has quit IRC 17:08:20 <supermop__> has (for the time) ground break train shots 17:08:51 <Samu> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=53698&p=1175575#p1175575 17:11:30 <Nitrodev> sigh, still the train left the coal station without any coal 17:15:11 <Alberth> no set "full load" ? 17:15:14 <Alberth> *not 17:16:04 <Nitrodev> there we go 17:16:10 <Nitrodev> and it was 17:16:12 <Nitrodev> i think 17:16:42 <andythenorth> 30 knot steam pax ships https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cunard_Line 17:17:10 <Alberth> the first time a train arrives, there is no cargo, so if you don't say "full load", it immediately leaves, since it loaded everything there was (ie nothing) 17:17:15 <andythenorth> Also, irl, express ships rely on frequency of service, one giant ship not as good as three smaller ones 17:17:43 <andythenorth> Give or take other factors, like passenger numbers 17:18:38 <Alberth> very big ships :) 17:19:52 *** supermop has joined #openttd 17:21:46 <andythenorth> Ach, pax only ships will do 17:21:57 <andythenorth> Unblocks designing the cargo ships 17:22:12 <andythenorth> No pax-freight universal ships 17:22:36 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 17:23:24 <andythenorth> RL doesn't apply 17:23:47 <Alberth> just show the ships bottom, in the buy menu, and add the top part in refitting :) 17:24:06 *** Matarazzo has joined #openttd 17:24:13 <andythenorth> Ha 17:24:37 <Alberth> but having cargo specific ships is much nicer to choose from, imho 17:25:16 <Alberth> especially pax / no-pax 17:25:19 <Samu> group route 56, with 316 ships, of which only 2 are necessary 17:25:51 <Alberth> no no, the AI thinks it needs 316 ships, so 316 ships it is :) 17:26:20 <Samu> the AI is now doing this: ship doesn't profit, sell 17:26:29 <Alberth> :) 17:26:39 <Samu> then adds again on the other side 17:26:39 <Alberth> so it sells all 316? :) 17:26:50 <Samu> 316 > 317 > 316 > 317 17:26:56 <Alberth> haha :D 17:27:19 <Alberth> one good way to loose your money :) 17:27:56 <Samu> on another note, NPF pathfinder did actually find a path going through 1055 tiles distance 17:28:00 <Samu> no lost ships 17:28:03 <Alberth> although it's likely hard to prevent these things from happening 17:28:06 <Samu> but extremely slow server 17:29:45 * Matarazzo slaps Matarazzo around a bit with a large fishbot 17:30:55 <Samu> log range for routes is 0-55, group name range for routes is 1-56, i was being mislead 17:31:02 <Samu> grr 17:31:08 <Samu> just fixed explanation on the topic 17:31:35 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 17:32:33 *** Matarazzo has quit IRC 17:34:52 *** Myhorta has quit IRC 17:35:36 <Nitrodev> should i consider buying a new vehicle if there are many people or mail waiting at a station 17:35:58 <Nitrodev> and station in this case can refer to airports as well 17:37:09 *** supermop has quit IRC 17:37:36 <Samu> legal question: can I post my modified version of wmdot on the forum? I don't really understand licenses 17:37:50 <Samu> so i'm afraid of doing it 17:41:00 <Alberth> for what purpose? 17:41:06 <Nitrodev> is it logical to make buses that go between towns? 17:41:50 <Alberth> Nitrodev: pax (passengers/mail) is hard to handle, you have an endless supply 17:41:50 <Samu> to load my savegame if it's not compatible 17:41:56 <Samu> but i guess it is 17:42:39 <Samu> i've edited wmdot to make his orders at the destination unload and leave empty 17:42:47 <Alberth> Samu: I'd keep the version for a while, until you hear it couild be loaded 17:42:53 <Samu> ok 17:43:40 <Alberth> although it should be fine for this purpose, I think 17:44:11 <Alberth> if you would publish your own AI, based on wmdot, you'd better give it a new name 17:44:32 <frosch123> yay, finally made the bot work to delete spam from the wiki \o/ 17:44:35 <Samu> ah no, i'm not skilled enough for that 17:44:47 <Alberth> but assuming wmdot is GPL, you can still put the source on the forum 17:44:56 <Alberth> frosch123: \o/ 17:45:58 *** ChanServ changes topic to "1.6.1 | Website: *.openttd.org (translator: translator, server list: servers, wiki: wiki, patches & bug-reports: bugs, revision log: hg, release info: finger) | Don't ask to ask, just ask | 'Latest' is not a valid version, 'Most recent' neither | English only | Logs: @logs | #openttd.dev if this channel is really spammy" 17:45:58 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v Alberth 17:46:21 <Alberth> euhm, ok, thanks ChanServ :) 17:46:57 * frosch123 waits for speech 17:47:34 <Alberth> Nitrodev: passengers between towns works nicely, pax in both directions :) 17:48:04 <Alberth> they might have run out of alphabet letter for +"speech" :) 17:48:14 <Alberth> *letters 17:52:34 *** Macha has joined #openttd 17:57:23 *** srhnsn has joined #openttd 17:59:25 <Samu> Copyright 2011-2014 by W. Minchin 18:00:42 * andythenorth ponders DockTypes spec 18:01:05 <Samu> Permission is granted to you to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell this software, and provide these rights to others, provided: 18:01:11 <andythenorth> Specifically, whether to optionally preserve current inifinite dock behaviour as option 18:01:28 <Samu> bah whatever, i'll wait for an answer 18:01:45 <frosch123> what should it do when the dock is full? 18:02:10 <frosch123> skip the station? 18:03:22 <andythenorth> Wait 18:03:26 <andythenorth> But where? 18:03:32 <frosch123> exactly :) 18:03:37 <andythenorth> On the tile, but not loading? 18:04:18 <andythenorth> Or do docks have some pre-defined holding point? 18:04:20 <frosch123> so you want to limit loading speed to 1 ship at a time 18:04:35 <andythenorth> Yeup 18:04:51 <andythenorth> Also must be compatible with the type of dock... 18:04:53 <Alberth> enable "improved loading" 18:04:58 <frosch123> it already loads only ship, it only starts with the next one of there is enough cargo waiting to completely fill the previous ones 18:05:16 <frosch123> so, are you talking about docks with thousand of cargo wating? 18:06:13 <frosch123> maybe multi-tile docks can just load faster? 18:06:39 <frosch123> ship "length" defines how many docks a ship can make use of 18:06:58 <andythenorth> maybe 18:08:37 <andythenorth> intent is to a) introduce 'types' for ships by limiting compatibilty to specific docks b) as side effect, increase physical size of docks if lots of ship routes use them 18:08:54 <andythenorth> b is definitely side effect, not intention 18:09:21 *** zeknurn has quit IRC 18:10:10 * andythenorth must to dinner, biab 18:10:18 <andythenorth> Also....eye candy :p 18:10:28 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 18:14:26 <Nitrodev> i have 106 passengers waiting at one airport... 18:15:48 <Samu> crap, notepad can't open log files over 1 TB 18:16:29 <Samu> what am i supposed to do now? I need to find out if an AI crashed or not 18:17:25 <Samu> i dont feel like installing word, i dont even know if word would open 18:19:26 <Samu> trying wordpad 18:19:52 <Wolf01> Try less 18:21:18 <Samu> it's PAXLink log 18:22:07 <Wolf01> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Less_(Unix) 18:23:32 <Alberth> Nitrodev: oh, only 106 :) 18:24:05 <Alberth> I tend to have 2000 to 4000 :) 18:25:00 <Alberth> try tail :) 18:26:06 <Samu> I'm trying type 18:26:10 <Samu> type Core5.txt 18:26:19 <Samu> it's scrolling all over it 18:26:22 <Samu> must wait lol 18:27:14 <Nitrodev> i'm losing money 18:27:58 <Alberth> click on the vehicle list, and sort on income 18:28:16 <Alberth> look at the vehicles with negative profits :p 18:30:06 <Alberth> Samu: close the window, stuff scrolls a lot quicker then 18:30:15 <Alberth> minimize, actually 18:30:41 <Samu> :) i did that, still not reached the end 18:30:59 <Alberth> 1TB is a lot of lines :) 18:31:15 <Alberth> imagine you have a disk that has 100 times that :) 18:31:36 <Samu> did i say tb? 18:31:40 <Samu> crap, it's 1 GB 18:31:49 <Samu> lol i'm so dumb at times 18:32:17 <Samu> let me see 18:32:34 <Samu> 1,06 GB (1.143.425.929 bytes) 18:32:37 <Samu> yeah 1,06GB 18:32:48 <Samu> how did I come up with TB 18:33:59 <Nitrodev> every vehicle is making money... 18:35:59 *** nilez has quit IRC 18:36:19 *** nilez has joined #openttd 18:38:27 <Nitrodev> -3000 dollars 18:38:29 <Alberth> too much loan? 18:39:53 <Nitrodev> property mainttenance 18:39:56 <Nitrodev> haven't touched loan 18:40:09 <Nitrodev> i mean, i haven't gotten mroe loan 18:40:16 <Nitrodev> since the game starts you off with a loan 18:40:23 <Alberth> ah, enabled infra structure thingie 18:41:35 <Alberth> infrastructure maintenance is its name 18:41:44 *** andythenorth_ has joined #openttd 18:42:00 <Alberth> yep, that grows exponentially as you have more tracks/roads/stations/etc 18:42:16 <Alberth> open the finances windows, bottom right has a "infrastructure window 18:42:19 <Alberth> button 18:42:35 <Nitrodev> abandoned 18:43:07 <Samu> real time priority, zzzz 18:43:29 <Nitrodev> nah 18:43:34 <Alberth> zzzzz is very good, especially in horizontal position :) 18:43:35 <Nitrodev> just got annoyed 18:43:45 *** Nitrodev has quit IRC 18:43:55 <Samu> it can't go any faster than this :( 18:44:33 *** andythenorth_ has quit IRC 18:46:11 *** zeknurn has joined #openttd 18:46:20 <Samu> nice, reachd the end of it 18:46:27 <Samu> AI did not crash 18:46:43 <Samu> still needs 15 more years for 2051 18:49:31 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 18:51:38 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 18:52:46 *** keoz has quit IRC 19:10:26 *** alask0ud has joined #openttd 19:21:10 *** nilez has quit IRC 19:21:39 *** nilez has joined #openttd 19:21:49 *** Arveen has quit IRC 19:23:58 *** srhnsn has quit IRC 19:31:36 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:43:56 *** chnkr_ has quit IRC 20:00:06 <Samu> gelignite: did you create gelignAIte? 20:02:54 <gelignite> it's been a while, but yes. 20:04:04 <Samu> ah nice nice, do you want to participate on this topic?https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=65&t=75176 20:05:24 *** Alberth has left #openttd 20:07:24 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 20:08:02 *** sim-al2 has joined #openttd 20:22:32 *** Hiddenfunstuff has quit IRC 20:50:05 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 20:58:06 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 20:59:32 <gelignite> Samu, sure, but it'll take some time for me to get into that stuff again. as said, it's been a while and i forgot most of it. :-/ 21:03:54 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 21:10:50 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:15:50 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 21:16:45 <andythenorth> Is cat 21:17:00 <Wolf01> Sure 21:32:20 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:33:15 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 21:35:52 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 21:36:12 <andythenorth> Is bed 21:36:22 <andythenorth> Bad connection also 21:36:24 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 21:37:26 *** tokai has joined #openttd 21:37:27 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai 21:44:21 *** tokai|noir has quit IRC 21:45:22 *** chnkr_ has joined #openttd 21:46:43 *** gelignite has quit IRC 21:55:19 *** Myhorta has joined #openttd 22:18:14 <Samu> something inside me tells me that the Zen cpus will be slightly below Broadwell level of performance 22:19:26 <Samu> will be between Haswell and Broadwell 22:19:52 <Samu> core ix-4xxx series and core ix-5xxx series 22:20:27 <Samu> intel is launching core ix-7xxx series when zen come out... :( zen will disappoint 22:24:21 <Samu> i even doubt a 4 core zen will match a 8 core bulldozer in some of the benchmarks 22:25:28 <Samu> especially integer multi-threaded based 22:31:22 <Wolf01> 'night 22:31:25 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 22:33:49 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:38:42 *** FLHerne has joined #openttd 22:48:25 *** supermop has joined #openttd 22:54:44 *** supermop__ has quit IRC 23:01:14 *** ElleKitty has quit IRC 23:01:46 *** ElleKitty has joined #openttd 23:03:50 *** keoz has joined #openttd 23:07:25 *** supermop__ has joined #openttd 23:07:52 *** Gja has quit IRC 23:13:55 *** supermop has quit IRC 23:20:47 *** NGC3982 has quit IRC 23:21:04 *** NGC3982 has joined #openttd 23:35:40 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 23:46:27 <Samu> looks like trees actually affect AI perfomance 23:46:53 <Samu> evil trees 23:47:09 <goodger> is that just if the ents patch is enabled? 23:47:17 *** Myhorta has quit IRC 23:47:49 <Samu> affects some ais pathfinder cost predictions 23:47:54 <Samu> i see incomplete roads 23:49:33 <Samu> epictrans bankrupted again, I'm gonna try him on a map without trees 23:49:53 <Samu> if any tree is placed, that's the ai placing them 23:57:26 *** supermop has joined #openttd