Log for #openttd on 14th April 2017:
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07:09:43  <andythenorth> o/
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07:29:05  <Wolf01> o/
07:31:28  <andythenorth> such test games are needed
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07:31:42  <Wolf01> Yeah, also test
07:31:45  * andythenorth made a lot of FIRS changes without testing yet
07:31:51  <Arveen> g'morning d00ds
07:32:07  <Wolf01> *also unit tests
07:32:29  <Wolf01> I was thinking about a functional test framework for grfs
07:34:22  <Wolf01> The problem of everything I think about is that points to a modular code :(
07:35:23  <Wolf01> Like using the OTTD code for (external) tools
07:37:26  <Wolf01> We could always have internal ones, like the sprite aligner etc
07:55:20  <Wolf01> Mmmh, I'm still with the idea that yesterday was friday and today is saturday
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08:05:57  <Eddi|zuHause> try this: yesterday was friday, and today is also friday
08:06:15  <Eddi|zuHause> or today is both friday and sunday
08:06:55  <Wolf01> Eh, totally not sunday, I don't want to lose another day XD
08:11:40  <argoneus> is anyone here using win10?
08:12:19  <Wolf01> Nope, I don't see anyone, but I'm using it
08:12:30  <argoneus> did you have trouble updating
08:12:32  <argoneus> to creators update
08:12:35  <Wolf01> No
08:12:38  <argoneus> ucky
08:12:39  <argoneus> lucky
08:12:43  <Wolf01> Only 1 hour wasted
08:12:44  <argoneus> it kept freezing for me
08:12:49  <argoneus> you'd never guess what the solution was
08:12:55  <Wolf01> Reinstall
08:12:59  <argoneus> I had to remove the sata cable from my dvd drive
08:13:02  <argoneus> ????????????
08:13:03  <Wolf01> Lol
08:13:21  <Wolf01> Usually are external drives the problem
08:13:42  <argoneus> but why
08:13:55  <Wolf01> To avoid it I usually unplug them before the update, but this time I forgot and it was fine
08:14:51  <Wolf01> Do you have any specific driver installed for the dvd drive?
08:15:13  <argoneus> no
08:15:31  <Wolf01> Dunno, then
08:16:59  <Wolf01> I have another problem instead... I can't purchase the endless space dlc because it's now included in the collection, and they didn't unlock it for me :(
08:20:20  <andythenorth> ha
08:20:32  * andythenorth might add industrial trains to Road Hog 
08:20:37  <andythenorth> separate to trams
08:20:42  <andythenorth> just to mess with people :P
08:27:04  <Eddi|zuHause> Wolf01: doesn't steam offer you a "complete your collection" package?
08:27:09  <Wolf01> No
08:27:14  <Wolf01> I already have the game
08:27:30  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, go to the game's store website
08:27:58  <Wolf01> The dlc is now part of the game edition I purchased back in 2012
08:28:19  <Eddi|zuHause> go to game properties and recheck data?
08:28:40  <Eddi|zuHause> or talk to steam support
08:29:20  <Wolf01> Tried everything, check game files, re-log in steam, ask for help... they said to remove the game from the library and purchase it again...
08:29:46  <Eddi|zuHause> then try to get it refunded
08:30:25  <Wolf01> Ok, it's 1€, but I have some more content which I purchased with the game and I don't know if it's included in the new packet
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08:31:31  <Samu> hi
08:32:10  <Eddi|zuHause> i think there's a "the game is now cheaper than when i bought it" option for refunds
08:32:20  <Wolf01> There is :D
08:32:26  <Eddi|zuHause> which probably applies if you refund all the dlcs
08:32:35  <Eddi|zuHause> and buy the new base game
08:33:07  <Wolf01> There is no more the base game, only the "complete collection"
08:34:22  <Eddi|zuHause> and if you put the collection into the cart, it doesn't only get the missing dlcs?
08:35:09  <Wolf01> No, it's not a bundle
08:35:16  <Eddi|zuHause> anyway, i'd try the refund-game-and-all-dlcs way
08:41:26  <Wolf01> I'll try
08:58:49  <argoneus> I wish I could be a neet
08:58:58  <argoneus> whenever I feel like doing something fun like coding something for openttd or other games
08:59:03  <argoneus> I'm usually tired from the day
08:59:05  <argoneus> :(
09:02:03  <Wolf01> At least you don't panic when you start try to code something
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09:03:58  <Wolf01> I'm like this for a week so far... I open VS, look at the code, panic, and leave it minimized
09:04:00  <Wolf01> o/
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09:10:22  <Samu> i'm currently trying a patch to generate lock friendly town bridges over rivers
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09:17:56  <Wolf01> BTW Eddi|zuHause, Transport Fever is now officially playable
09:22:17  <Wolf01> :O
09:23:31  <Wolf01> LOL
09:23:40  <Wolf01> We need one for OTTD too
09:24:36  <Arveen> what does officially playable mean ?
09:25:02  <Arveen> was there a patch of interest ?
09:25:28  <Wolf01> You can play it without figuring why things don't work because stupid limitations, like terraforming near roads/tracks
09:25:54  <Wolf01> Also they finally added double-slip junctions
09:26:12  <Eddi|zuHause> oh, i've even seen some of that original episode with the cars on tracks :p
09:26:41  <Wolf01> It still miss one way roads and a sort of traffic control on road crossings (with enough traffic it seem to be like in India)
09:26:42  <Arveen> i was kind of interested in this game until i noticed the way how trains work is not like ottd
09:27:09  <Wolf01> Also now it's finally possible to force replace the vehicles
09:27:27  <Eddi|zuHause> Arveen: how is that a problem?
09:28:04  <Arveen> i like to build ottdcoop like networks
09:28:39  <Samu> damn asserts
09:28:50  <Eddi|zuHause> coop's a bit tricky without multiplayer :p
09:28:55  <Wolf01> Eh :D
09:29:36  <Wolf01> I would like to have an italian train set...
09:29:42  <Arveen> i did not look the game up after its initial release but back then it looked to me like you cant build complex networks
09:30:03  <Wolf01> Oh, you can, but they might not be profitable
09:30:16  <Samu> why am I getting an assert
09:30:39  <Samu> IsValidTile(bridge_tile + delta_side) && IsWaterTile(bridge_tile + delta) && IsInclinedSlope(GetTileSlope(bridge_tile + delta_side)) && IsRiver(bridge_tile + delta_side)
09:31:11  <Eddi|zuHause> the biggest problems with complex networks were that you couldn't put switches and bridges where you wanted them
09:31:41  <Samu> ah, i see
09:31:47  <Samu> delta_side check
09:31:49  <Eddi|zuHause> always some weird "slope too steep" or "pillar collision" or just general "collision" errors
09:31:50  <Samu> is wrong
09:32:28  <Wolf01> They reduced those problems, now you are more freedom
09:32:32  <Wolf01> *have
09:32:43  <Samu> i was adding the wrong delta :(
09:34:43  <Samu> generating a 4k map
09:34:56  <Samu> let's see if it doesn't error now
09:37:34  <Alberth> o/
09:37:44  <Alberth> wolf, just delete the code ?
09:37:56  <Wolf01> Eh ;D
09:38:42  <Wolf01> BTW, Arveen, the biggest difference with OTTD is that lines use only one platform in stations, so you can't have 25346 trains for the same line waiting in the station, and doesn't make sense to have them
09:39:25  <Arveen> ah yeah, i think that was another thing i noticed when watching some twitch streams
09:39:52  <Wolf01>
09:40:42  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, you cannot "load balance" between two platforms, that is a bit annoying if you have many lines that arrive infrequently
09:40:54  <Wolf01> Build more platforms
09:41:02  <Eddi|zuHause> or one line that is really frequent
09:41:17  <Wolf01> Build yards before stations
09:41:29  <Wolf01> And use lots of waypoints :D
09:42:02  <Eddi|zuHause> "one platform per line" is a bit space-inefficient
09:42:35  <Samu> generating 8192 rivers and 12032 towns
09:42:53  <Samu> ought to be enough to check if it asserts or not
09:43:26  <Wolf01> I have 5 trains on a steel mill, 3 steel and 2 iron ore, the station in just 2 platforms, the incoming track is split in 2 with waypoints and signals to accomodate 2 trains so it won't block the other route
09:44:44  <Wolf01> And since it almost matches my OTTD game style, I'm not so baffled about having stations with 2 platforms, or even one
09:47:17  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm not worried about putting 3 input lines on 1 platform, and 2 output lines on 1 platform.
09:47:27  <Eddi|zuHause> i'm worried about 5 input lines on 3 platforms
09:47:58  <Eddi|zuHause> which are not synchronized, so however you distribute them, 2 trains will eventually arrive to the same platform
09:48:20  <Eddi|zuHause> and then the second train will wait there, while another platform clearly is free
09:48:55  <Wolf01> Oh, the most annoying thing of all: stations are separate between freight and pax, trains can enter each station (and have the wrong type in the orders too)
09:50:27  <Wolf01> I usually have that problem with these stations, as I build them in couple, so I can't even upgrade them because they block each other and I end up with like 6 lines in 2 platforms
09:51:44  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, it's so easy to put down the wrong station
09:52:03  <Eddi|zuHause> and you can't change over to the other type
09:52:16  <Eddi|zuHause> and you cannot rebuild them, because they have slightly different layouts
09:52:28  <Wolf01> <- I usually end up with this shit :D
09:54:23  <Eddi|zuHause> 404?
09:54:37  <Wolf01> Lol?
09:55:01  <Eddi|zuHause> link is probably incomplete
09:55:12  <Wolf01>
09:55:15  <Wolf01> Yup
09:55:28  <Eddi|zuHause> still
09:55:47  <__ln__> Not found
09:55:47  <Wolf01> Is steam stupid? I'm copying the entire link
09:56:10  <Wolf01>
09:57:16  <Wolf01> foook traffic
09:57:51  <Eddi|zuHause> that's a nice and tidy stockpile there :p
09:58:12  <Eddi|zuHause> and that definitely needs a more elaborate crossing
09:58:45  <Wolf01> It needs traffic lights, roundabouts and oneway roads
09:58:50  <Eddi|zuHause> that was also the first mod i downloaded for cities:skylines, allowing to modify crossings to forbid left turns and stuff
09:59:44  <Eddi|zuHause> nothing worse than a 6 lane road which blocks because some random guy wanted to turn left and block 3 opposing lanes
10:00:07  <Wolf01> On the first image, top-right, I destroyed that intersection and made it as a complete overpass with 4 ramps, but cars still keep use the wrong ramps :(
10:01:02  <Eddi|zuHause> i've not actually played much beyond 1950
10:01:17  <Wolf01> They should implement "prefer turn right if you can reach the same destination"
10:01:18  <Eddi|zuHause> so i didn't encounter that type of traffic problems
10:03:45  <Wolf01> I'm playing with "daylength" at 4x or 8x, this save has something like 40 hours on it and I just arrived to 1992
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11:48:21  <Wolf01>
11:48:34  <Wolf01> I should do some of this stuff
11:52:06  <Alberth> standard unix configuration :)
11:58:19  <Wolf01> I'm thinking about installing xming on windows
12:00:49  <Alberth> you have a remote unix system?
12:01:10  <Alberth> iirc that windows ubuntu thingie can also open X programs
12:01:12  <Eddi|zuHause> i don't really have a windows 10 to play around with
12:01:58  <Alberth> it's a bit silly imho, installing OS B inside OS A to run B programs
12:02:38  <Eddi|zuHause> how is that more silly than installing wine to run windows programs on linux?
12:02:48  <Alberth> it's not
12:04:01  <Wolf01> <Alberth> iirc that windows ubuntu thingie can also open X programs < Not yet, WSL doesn't have an xserver
12:04:56  <Wolf01> And since it doesn't have kernel access, you can't just install one in ubuntu
12:09:31  <Alberth> I was quite sure I read that recently, but can't find it :(
12:10:38  <Eddi|zuHause> but shouldn't a windows-x-server suffice?
12:11:17  <Wolf01> Yep, that's why I said to install xming or similar
12:12:58  <Alberth> ha, blog says to "export DISPLAY=:0", something we stopped doing since ssh connections became standard :)
12:13:28  <Wolf01> Yeah, but no xserver on display 0
12:14:21  <Wolf01> I would like if they add one by default, so one shouldn't need mingw crap
12:14:48  <Wolf01> *cygwin/msys
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12:20:08  <Wolf01> Quak
12:20:24  <frosch123> moi
12:26:43  <Arveen> Oink
12:28:48  <Alberth> o/
12:39:25  <Samu> rivers aren't generated in tropic anymore?
12:40:09  <Alberth> were they ever ?
12:40:14  <Wolf01> Yes
12:40:16  <Samu> yes
12:40:30  <Wolf01> We removed rivers \o/
12:40:39  <Samu> testing r27854 and i don't see rivers being generated, weird
12:41:14  <Wolf01> Time to update the topic with "- Feature: removed rivers from tropic because yes"
12:41:37  <Samu> tested in temperate tileset, and they're generated here
12:41:43  <Samu> what happened
12:43:39  <Samu> they're also generated in arctic
12:44:30  <Samu> and in toyland too, just tested
12:44:34  <Samu> why not tropic?
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13:08:45  <andythenorth> isn’t it
13:09:06  <peter1138> no
13:11:20  <LordAro> maybe
13:13:13  <andythenorth> it might have been
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13:13:40  <andythenorth> Samu: tropic just doesn’t generate rivers much
13:13:44  <andythenorth> nobody knows why :)
13:22:09  <peter1138> it's dry :p
13:24:45  <supermop> depends on where tropic is i guess
13:25:56  <andythenorth> it’s somewhere without rivers
13:26:03  <andythenorth> also somewhere without mountains eh
13:26:41  <andythenorth> it’s a bit better without TGP
13:27:17  <andythenorth> at least original generator had the idea of half rainforest / half desert
13:27:28  <andythenorth> instead of all flat, unfeatured
13:29:14  <andythenorth> original tropic has crap coasts though
13:31:28  <andythenorth> peter1138: why does TGP bother with so many lines of crap for tropic? o_O
13:31:34  <andythenorth> it doesn’t need to do all that, just to make flat
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13:38:44  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: richk was a bit... strange?
13:39:32  <andythenorth> it’s l
13:39:41  <andythenorth> * literally just lies
13:40:02  <andythenorth> “Desert landscape is handled different to all others to give a desert valley between two high mountains.”
13:40:05  <andythenorth> is not the case
13:40:13  <andythenorth> :)
13:40:24  <andythenorth> amusing situation
13:40:49  <Eddi|zuHause> i think what he meant was that desert is not applied above a certain level
13:41:49  <Eddi|zuHause> which is a silly thing as well, but it's not TGP's fault
13:50:46  <andythenorth> tile 24 (dec) is the water station tile?
13:55:23  <frosch123> if in doubt, check whether it worked before mhl
14:11:16  <andythenorth> I have 1.3.0 here
14:11:31  <andythenorth> that doesn’t appear to have mhl, and tropic TGP is useless there too :)
14:16:00  <peter1138> maybe i should relook at my own generator
14:17:30  <andythenorth> give it some weird tuning parameters :)
14:17:35  <andythenorth> so we can make weird things
14:17:45  <andythenorth> instead of a bunch of sensible parameters that do nothing good :)
14:19:01  <andythenorth> plateaus: small<->wide
14:19:08  <andythenorth> valleys: small<->wide
14:19:29  <andythenorth> volcanoes: none<->lots
14:19:48  <andythenorth> polders: none<->lots
14:19:58  <peter1138> i couldn't make it as fast as tgp
14:20:21  <peter1138> but then again
14:22:34  <andythenorth> pick two
14:22:46  <andythenorth> TGP is cheap, and fast :P
14:26:09  <supermop> waiting for land to generate isn't that bad
14:26:45  <supermop> unless you are insane and constantly rolling new 4kx4k maps
14:27:00  <peter1138> well you need to with tgp cos it's often poo :p
14:27:07  <peter1138> especially with the stupid variety bollocks
14:28:04  <andythenorth> between TGP crap maps, and the random choices in GS, I have to use ‘newgame’ a lot :P
14:28:14  <andythenorth> also FIRS building ports in stupid tiny seas
14:28:32  <andythenorth> sometimes takes 15 mins to get a decent map-GS-FIRS combo
14:30:21  <andythenorth> maybe I should fork Silicon Valley
14:30:31  <andythenorth> add a cargo choosing menu
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14:48:54  <quiznilo> in the base game, without any newgrfs, is there some year that cabooses become obsolete?
14:51:28  <andythenorth> there are no cabooses in base game
14:51:41  <quiznilo> interesting
14:51:51  <quiznilo> that's why none are mentioned on the wiki
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14:54:13  <andythenorth> ammonia plant should be like a mine eh?
14:54:25  <andythenorth> haber process -> chemicals etc
14:55:02  <quiznilo> fertilizer?
14:55:55  <andythenorth> yes
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15:03:49  <DannyK_> Hello, do bus or train depots have maintenance costs?
15:04:47  <frosch123> yes
15:05:01  <DannyK_> frosch123: how high?
15:05:05  <frosch123> if you enable infra maintenance cost
15:06:16  <frosch123> actually they only cost the same as track
15:06:46  <DannyK_> frosch123: was it introduced in openttd or already there in ttd?
15:07:01  <frosch123> infra maintenance is ottd 1.2 or 1.3
15:08:27  <DannyK_> I'm asking and considering whether or not having four or more depots per line would be a good idea ...
15:09:46  <_dp_> enabling breakdowns is a bad idea :p
15:10:29  <DannyK_> _dp_: :)
15:12:39  <Eddi|zuHause> there was a basic station maintenance before infra maintenance
15:12:48  <Eddi|zuHause> but afaik nothing for depots
15:15:11  <DannyK_> thank you all
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15:24:53  <quiznilo> I use breakdowns
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15:25:19  <quiznilo> they're cool, you have to be clever in places
15:26:14  <DannyK_> quiznilo: yeah, I don't like making my life easier in games
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15:26:39  <quiznilo> it's a challenge
15:28:10  <DannyK_> quiznilo: I wonder if it would be possible to take 00 and build a highly profitable network, starting with buses
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15:28:22  <Samu> i think I got this, town bridges are no longer building over
15:28:30  <quiznilo> I've given up trying to make money with road vehicles
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15:28:39  <Samu> river tiles or near if there could be built a lock
15:28:43  <quiznilo> I mean, it's possible, just looking at yearly profits
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15:28:49  <andythenorth> Dakkus: if 00 buys you a bus, a depot, and 2 stops
15:28:50  <quiznilo> I use them in special situations
15:28:51  <andythenorth> then yes
15:29:16  <Alberth> and connecting road between the stops :p
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15:30:29  <Wolf01> Mmmh, mastering docker ebook, should I master docker too?
15:30:48  <Alberth> maybe one day
15:30:58  <Wolf01> I'll download it anywau
15:31:00  <Wolf01> *y
15:31:04  <Alberth> :)
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15:31:35  <Alberth> trouble of that is that at some point you also need to read all of it
15:31:55  <Wolf01> Maybe... but this should be valid for my steam library too
15:31:59  <Wolf01> I'm a hoarding wolf
15:32:12  <quiznilo> I built new high-speed passenger line yesterday in competitive game... opponent thought he would be funny
15:33:18  <andythenorth> Alberth: just build in town :)
15:33:26  <quiznilo>
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15:36:46  <andythenorth> looked at that when I was designing FIRS Steeltown
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15:38:52  <quiznilo> which newGRF was it that had vehicles starting in year 0?
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15:52:38  <andythenorth> ha
15:52:53  * andythenorth got rid of last elements from C-pre-processor FIRS
15:54:49  <Alberth> :O
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15:57:21  <andythenorth> took a while :)
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15:57:46  * andythenorth has an interesting refactoring problem
15:57:52  <Alberth> it's faster now?
15:58:33  <andythenorth> it’s been faster for a month or so
15:58:37  <andythenorth> for multiple reasons :)
15:58:52  <andythenorth> the last couple of things I removed today were just tidying code
15:59:10  <Alberth> :)
15:59:28  <andythenorth> so I have hundreds of spritesets, all declaring a spurious ‘id’ string
15:59:34  <andythenorth> because I didn’t know about __name__
15:59:35  <andythenorth>
16:00:27  <andythenorth> I’d like to remove them with a script
16:01:02  <Alberth> sed magics
16:01:23  <andythenorth> I figured there was a better way than reading the file with python and using splits :P
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16:01:41  <Alberth> python works too
16:02:13  <Alberth> I often read it as a list of lines, hack the lines, then write it back
16:02:46  <Alberth> especially useful for multi-line stuff
16:06:22  <Alberth> industry doesn't know a unique prefix?
16:06:48  <andythenorth> in which case? o_O
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16:07:21  <Alberth> industry.add_spriteset(...)   <-- seems like it could inject an id
16:07:51  <Alberth> ie why do you manually specify id = ...   ?
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16:10:53  <andythenorth> exactly :)
16:11:00  <andythenorth> that’s why I want to delete them
16:11:07  <andythenorth> it’s historical reasons
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16:11:15  <Alberth> ok
16:11:37  <andythenorth> I can probably just count first line after add_spriteset
16:11:43  <andythenorth> and drop it
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16:11:57  <andythenorth> then fix any error s manually
16:12:27  <Alberth> any   "id = " line removed?
16:12:39  <Alberth> you seem to have more
16:12:43  <andythenorth> any “id = “ *inside* a spriteset
16:13:09  <andythenorth> spritelayout ids are needed currently
16:13:25  <Alberth> python script looks easiest
16:14:03  <Alberth> likely sed can do it too, but I'd need to search how to do it only for sprite sets
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16:47:24  <Samu> - posted
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16:52:11  <andythenorth> nice
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16:55:06  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: you could use python's compiler module to read the abstract syntax tree, delete the node with the id assignment, and generate new python code
16:56:09  <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: I considered just writing out new code with a template
16:56:58  <andythenorth> your method sounds more sophisticated :)
16:57:15  <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: or you use awk, and on each spriteset line you switch on a flag, on each spritelayout line you switch off a flag, then drop the id line based on whether that flag is set
16:58:49  <Eddi|zuHause> or just drop the lines matching "id.*spriteset"
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17:00:20  <andythenorth> hmm
17:00:37  <andythenorth> not sure I can get the name for a python object
17:01:18  <andythenorth> they don’t have names
17:01:26  <andythenorth> without the name….I still need the id :)
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17:04:24  <Eddi|zuHause> i really don't know what you're trying to do
17:04:45  <Eddi|zuHause> but probably you can generate the id on the fly by just increasing a counter while you write the nml code
17:05:52  <Eddi|zuHause> also, you can probably drop the variable for each spriteset, and just make a list of spritesets
17:06:17  <andythenorth> not easy to reuse without the variable
17:06:34  <andythenorth> I’m sure the spriteset ids could be generated
17:06:49  <andythenorth> they’re meaningless as long as they’re unique and stable
17:07:55  <Eddi|zuHause> how is "spritesets[10]" more difficult to use than "spriteset_11"?
17:08:26  <andythenorth> it isn’t
17:08:35  <andythenorth> but spriteset[10] is harder to use than spriteset_crane_animated
17:08:51  <andythenorth> the variables aren’t always named spriteset_n
17:09:30  <andythenorth> spritesets get stored in a list, generating ids should be trivial
17:09:33  <Eddi|zuHause> hm, whatever
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18:18:45  <andythenorth> done that
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18:23:12  <andythenorth> hmm
18:23:25  <andythenorth> multiplayer game? o-O
18:26:35  <Wolf01> mesmerizing *_*
18:32:31  * andythenorth trying to play openttd
18:33:01  <andythenorth> can’t get a map without ports in tiny lakes
18:37:00  <Wolf01> Increase water
18:43:00  <andythenorth> could a coast tile cache a flag - for ‘is connected to map edge via sea’?
18:43:09  <andythenorth> pathfinding that on demand might be unwise :P
18:45:27  <Wolf01> Wat?
18:49:30  <andythenorth> Wolf01: trying to prevent cases like this
18:50:08  <quiznilo> do industries in FIRS expand?
18:50:26  <Wolf01> Mmmmh, that might be tricky
18:50:28  <andythenorth> no industries in OpenTTD expand
18:50:36  <andythenorth> Wolf01: it’s tricky :P
18:51:08  <quiznilo> this oil refinery I have is giant, I don't remember it being this big, 4x6
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18:51:56  <andythenorth> there have been suggestions about tile checks, $someone on here insisted there was a way
18:51:56  <andythenorth> but it wasn’t Eddi so they were wrong :|
18:51:56  <andythenorth> I think it needs to be handled by openttd, pathdinging
18:51:56  <andythenorth> pathfinding :P
18:51:56  <andythenorth> not newgrf
18:52:49  <Wolf01> Pathdinging seem a good idea
18:53:52  <andythenorth> quiznilo: probably just a big layout
18:54:35  <Wolf01> If we do something really good for ships, like identification of water bodies, we should be able to fix even this problem for port industries
18:55:27  <andythenorth> could kill it at source, by preventing tiny enclosed seas
18:55:42  <andythenorth> TGP is, being kind to it, crap
18:55:45  <Wolf01> Tiny enclosed seas are nice
18:56:23  <Wolf01> Going to dine, bbl
18:56:28  <andythenorth> if they were tiny enclosed lakes, the issue would disappear :)
18:56:38  <andythenorth> sea types :P
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19:27:35  <andythenorth> does anyone else get openttd window focus on mouse hover?
19:27:38  <andythenorth> it’s driving me nuts
19:27:43  <andythenorth> it appears to be intermittent
19:33:41  <peter1138> calculate water area
19:33:46  <peter1138> somehow :p
19:34:33  <andythenorth> count connected water tiles
19:39:22  <andythenorth> don’t even need to count all of them
19:39:51  <andythenorth> @calc 32*32
19:39:51  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 1024
19:40:01  <andythenorth> @calc 64*64
19:40:01  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 4096
19:40:36  <andythenorth> could cap at 4096
19:40:44  <andythenorth> that’s definitely not a small sea
19:57:20  <Alberth> smallest map enitrely sea :p
19:58:24  <Alberth> so no sea industries at 64x64 ?
19:59:08  <andythenorth> o_O
19:59:27  <andythenorth> this is a good point :P
19:59:39  <Alberth> not sure if the economies make sense at such a map
19:59:40  <andythenorth> any solution so far has unwanted side effects :)
20:00:06  <Alberth> I think "border" should count as infinite
20:00:20  <Alberth> or "nuf"
20:00:52  <Alberth> "enuf"  is better, probably
20:01:53  <Alberth> I think I played at 64x64 with FIRS one time, looong time ago. Island was so crowded, you had to use trucks
20:02:25  <Alberth> neighbouring industries just a handful of tiles away :)
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20:03:21  <Alberth> I had one of each, I think, was quite fun
20:08:29  <andythenorth> surprised they fit :)
20:09:35  <peter1138> i think 64x64 is a bit small
20:09:41  <peter1138> but i played a good 128x128 game once
20:09:49  <peter1138> also 64x128+ is okay
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20:13:12  <andythenorth> so 32x32 minimum sea? :P
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20:20:39  <Alberth> try it, imho
20:21:22  <andythenorth> no idea how to do that :)
20:21:48  <andythenorth> I’m assuming it either (1) is enforced at map gen time or (2) newgrf can treat it as a tile property
20:27:12  <Wolf01> So, remove water, problem solved
20:29:11  <andythenorth> :P
20:31:56  <Alberth> can't you peek at a few tiles, say one every 3x3, and require at least N of them are water?
20:32:02  <Alberth> nn
20:32:02  <Wolf01> I'm thinking to remove some code this evening but I'm afraid I would panic as soon as I look at the code
20:32:07  <andythenorth> bye Alberth
20:32:13  <Wolf01> nn
20:32:23  <Alberth> delete lines with eyes closed :p
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20:45:40  <V453000> friday friday gotta get forum riot on friday
20:46:52  <__ln__> did anyone know that chinese airspace operates in meters, not feet?
20:47:07  <__ln__> well i hope the pilots knew, but i mean anyone here.
20:48:07  <V453000> I iz slug pilot
20:48:10  <V453000> do I count?
20:49:24  <__ln__> from now on you shall be the count V453000
20:49:43  <argoneus> hello??
20:49:45  <V453000> good, then I dare answering thee that I didn't know for shit
20:49:54  <argoneus> what forum riot V friend
20:50:14  <V453000> people just getting very impatient about factorio update
20:50:19  <V453000> I understand them but yeah
20:51:09  <Wolf01> You old fooook, you are playing the next version since forever :D
20:55:04  <__ln__>
21:02:45  <V453000> I was playing it Wolf01 when it didn't have almost any of the new features :) after that I simply didn't have time
21:03:46  <Wolf01> Busy V is good V :P
21:04:01  <andythenorth> such bed
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21:05:25  <V453000> gnight
21:05:29  <Wolf01> nn
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22:32:07  <Wolf01> 'night
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