Log for #openttd on 11th March 2019:
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00:29:51  <peter1138> Whew, that was a horrible performance regression there...
00:29:57  <peter1138> Turns out, debug-level 3 :/
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00:50:45  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison updated pull request #7081: Change: [Linkgraph] Pause the game when linkgraph jobs lag (#6470)
00:52:06  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison commented on pull request #7081: Change: [Linkgraph] Pause the game when linkgraph jobs lag (#6470)
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02:04:16  <supermop_Home_> why do no servers have cdist on?
02:04:22  <supermop_Home_> or use newgrfs
02:09:46  <Eddi|zuHause>  <peter1138> It's simple to add a 3rd tile that is actually a station tile. <-- i would probably do that
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02:14:51  <supermop_Home_> i hope these other players are AIs
02:15:49  <Eddi|zuHause> supermop_Home_: apparently there's too little overlap between players that want to play online and those that can accept a certain set of newgrfs that they did not hand.pick themselves
02:19:29  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison opened pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output.
02:19:34  <supermop_Home_> i would settle for almost anything other than tropic base set trains
02:20:10  <Samu> hey supermop_Home_ you're on my game?
02:22:53  <supermop_Home_> apparently
02:23:02  <Samu> red is an AI
02:23:10  <Samu> Bold Network
02:23:19  <supermop_Home_> hard to find anywhere to fit tracks between the ai rails
02:24:23  <Samu> I could try cargodist sometime
02:26:05  <Samu> which newgrfs do you want? I don't usually try newgrfs much
02:26:29  <supermop_Home_> basic stuff is pretty good, like iron horse
02:27:45  <Samu> there's iron horse, iron horse quicksilver add on, iron horse 2, termite
02:29:36  <Samu> just iron horse?
02:32:20  <Samu> what about ships, aircraft, road vehicles?
02:32:32  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison opened pull request #7367: Change: Include _current_company in crashlog AI config line
02:33:30  <Samu> so many newgrfs that I have a hard time to pick
02:35:41  <supermop_Home_> RVs i guess it doesn't matter as much, just something generic but that can be refitted, has better capacity than the defaults
02:36:46  <Samu> uhm, which ones? I'm very unfamiliar regarding newgrfs
02:39:36  <supermop_Home_> road hog is good, opengfx+ RVs is good
02:39:44  <supermop_Home_> egrvts is ok
02:39:48  <supermop_Home_> kind of old
02:40:10  <supermop_Home_> all of those will let you use newgrf industries
02:40:41  <supermop_Home_> and they are all pretty similar to the original vehicles, just a little nicer looking and more flexible
02:40:50  <Samu> oki, iron horse 1.9.1
02:40:59  <Samu> road hog 1.4.1
02:41:09  <Samu> would be a nice test for AIs
02:41:37  <Samu> ships and planes, anything worth using? and which industry newgrf?
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03:21:56  <Samu> supermop_Home_, you there?
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03:27:11  <supermop_Home_> yo
03:30:08  <supermop_Home_> going for a walk
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06:26:08  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output.
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06:47:36  <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, it's not simple :(
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07:11:24  <peter1138> So...
07:11:28  <andythenorth> docks?
07:12:28  <peter1138>
07:12:29  <peter1138> Yes
07:13:09  <peter1138> No custom tiles yet.
07:13:36  <peter1138> Station tile layout or house/industrytile/object style?
07:13:55  <andythenorth> jeez
07:14:19  <peter1138> red square is debugging for docking location for pathfinder.
07:14:20  <andythenorth> is there any reason to choose station tile layout?
07:14:28  <peter1138> andythenorth, only that it's already there.
07:14:39  <andythenorth> will this end up newgrf configurable?
07:14:43  <andythenorth> eventually?
07:15:01  <peter1138> But I think it may be easy to bolt on the "new style" for non-rail stations.
07:15:10  <peter1138> (Well, even rail stations but not tackling that)
07:15:17  <andythenorth> the old style never gained nml support
07:15:22  <andythenorth> nml ! stations
07:15:25  <peter1138> Quite
07:15:36  <andythenorth> but you probably want to add station support to nml, right?
07:15:38  <andythenorth> volunteering?
07:15:46  <peter1138> Maybe later.
07:15:52  <peter1138> I want to get this working.
07:16:01  <andythenorth> I lke the tile format for industrytile
07:16:06  <andythenorth> it works for me, makes sense
07:16:07  <peter1138> The red squares is just highlight debugging for docking tile
07:16:15  <peter1138> As I have to update it periodically if the tile gets changed.
07:16:17  <andythenorth> yes :)
07:16:34  <peter1138> Plan is the docking tile will be able to be adjacent to andy dock tile.
07:16:40  <peter1138> so single-tile docks.
07:16:48  <andythenorth> arbitrary slopes on the tile? o_O
07:16:51  <peter1138> Dock tile can then be placed on slope, or flat land.
07:17:00  <peter1138> yes, maybe any slope
07:17:05  <peter1138> direction isn't going to be important.
07:17:08  <andythenorth> arbitrary docking points in industries? o_O
07:17:15  <andythenorth> industry docks are weird :P
07:17:29  <peter1138> Yeah they are.
07:17:40  <peter1138> And it should be possible to place dock tiles... in water.
07:17:46  <peter1138> Which opens up a can of worms
07:18:07  <peter1138> maybe that won't be possible
07:18:15  <peter1138> you could just spam water tiles with docks then
07:18:36  <andythenorth> gr8!
07:18:36  <peter1138> But anyway
07:18:47  <peter1138> YAPF pathfinding seems to work.
07:18:50  <peter1138> I haven't tackled NPF.
07:19:03  <peter1138> And LOL @ OPF.
07:19:12  <andythenorth> opf is gone?
07:19:15  <peter1138> Not yet.
07:20:09  <peter1138> Hmm, SLV_MULTIPLE_DOCKS should... maybe SLV_MULTITILE_DOCKS
07:22:00  <peter1138> Hmm, should a buoy be able to be a docking tile?
07:22:07  <peter1138> I guess so.
07:23:17  <peter1138> What about a ship depot... I think that currently works but is kinda odd.
07:24:17  <peter1138> I haven't done anything with reserving slots so ships always take the nearest docking tile.
07:28:53  <andythenorth> a ship depot as dock?
07:29:41  <peter1138> Not a dock, a docking tile.
07:29:58  <andythenorth> "no need" ?
07:32:27  <peter1138>
07:32:33  <peter1138> ^ That is currently an arrangement that works.
07:32:52  <peter1138> As long as the ship can reach the docking tile...
07:32:59  <peter1138> Same with buoys.
07:34:57  <andythenorth> what if towns build blocking the tiles? o_O
07:35:11  <andythenorth> docking tiles on aqueducts?
07:35:59  <peter1138> If towns block the tiles then Samu will tell us about it.
07:39:37  <andythenorth> docking tiles in locks!
07:39:45  <andythenorth> ship goes up and down while docked
07:45:50  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh dismissed a review for pull request #7081: Change: [Linkgraph] Pause the game when linkgraph jobs lag (#6470)
07:48:17  <peter1138> Eh, not actually IN the lock.
07:48:22  <peter1138> But yes, either end is possible.
07:51:37  * andythenorth tries to think of any more silly ideas
07:52:08  <andythenorth> all out of water features
07:52:19  <andythenorth> dock tiles in ship tunnels? o_O
07:55:44  <andythenorth> shall we add minecarts?
07:55:47  <andythenorth> and crafting?
07:57:17  <peter1138> I need to make lunch.
07:57:31  <peter1138> And maybe have more breakfast. Is one slice of toast sufficient?
07:59:54  <andythenorth> no
08:00:00  <andythenorth> you need melon and some oranges
08:00:22  <peter1138> I have clementines but no melon.
08:00:23  <peter1138> Hmm
08:00:56  <peter1138> Ok, m1 bit 7 is free for station tiles too, that's good.
08:01:03  <peter1138> And, indeed, tunnels and bridges.
08:04:58  <Flygon> Oh nuts, can't buy out a human competitor in OTTD. x.x
08:05:11  <Flygon> Promised a friend I'd merge the two companies so he'd have an easier introduction into MP.
08:16:05  <Flygon> He made his own company, but felt overwhelmed by infrastructure sharing.
08:17:34  <peter1138> So you're not playing OpenTTD. Traitor!
08:17:41  <Flygon> :V
08:17:44  <Flygon> They're new to it!
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08:20:21  <peter1138> thats even worse ;)
08:21:34  <Flygon> :V
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08:39:41  <Flygon> So the only option is for them to totally disassemble their company?
08:39:46  <Flygon> No way to convert it into an AI player?
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09:11:05  <TrueBrain> I have been thinking ... talking about cutting old: we should drop DOS support. It has no threads (not fixable), it has no network (somewhat fixable, but nobody is going to do it), it has no cmake (NOOOO), any "real" DOS machine won't have the memory, it has bugs nobody is going to fix, it bloats our codebase for "a joke" (you can say a lot, but I
09:11:05  <TrueBrain> strongly doubt we have a real DOS userbase :P) .. so .. how about we just remove it? All ENABLE_NETWORK statements can be removed, some other special-case code can just vanish, etc. Too drastic? Agree? :D
09:12:58  <peter1138> Probably yes.
09:16:04  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain merged pull request #7363: Lot of small codefixes related to configure
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09:17:46  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] Eddi-z commented on pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output.
09:20:19  <LordAro> TrueBrain: ask about it in the monthly dev blog :)
09:20:48  <TrueBrain> I guess that is fair
09:20:56  <TrueBrain> we can also ask about OS/2 and Haiku? :P
09:22:17  <LordAro> we could, but idk - i get dropping old and dead operating systems, but dropping little-used OSes because they're little-used is a bit self fulfilling
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09:25:49  <planetmaker> moin
09:29:00  <TrueBrain> LordAro: but there is little used, and never used :)
09:29:09  <TrueBrain> and we are not dropping it because it is little used
09:29:17  <TrueBrain> we are dropping it because we have a huge technical debt because of it
09:29:28  <TrueBrain> or you means OS/2 and Haiku?
09:29:36  <TrueBrain> sorry, my mind didn't change state :P
09:29:43  <TrueBrain> isn't OS/2 also dead?
09:29:50  <TrueBrain> and yeah, okay, Haiku is fine I guess :P
09:29:57  <TrueBrain> someone needs to fix the bugs in network, but .. that is minor
09:30:32  <Eddi|zuHause> how about adding android/iOS as supported platforms?
09:31:00  <TrueBrain> go for it Eddi|zuHause
09:31:10  <TrueBrain> hmm .. why is spelling check not working in GitHub editor :(
09:31:23  <LordAro> perhaps, but also Haiku & OS/2 are much lower maintrnance than DOS, as they do have networking, threads & cmake
09:32:31  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
09:32:39  <TrueBrain> LordAro: yeah, I am fine with Haiku
09:32:42  <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, I've managed to get it compiled for Android.
09:32:43  <TrueBrain> OS/2 .. no clue what the state is
09:32:50  <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, I've not tried running it yet though.
09:32:53  <TrueBrain> I haven't test it, and I doubt someone else has :D
09:33:03  <peter1138> Because I compiled it without a video driver :p
09:33:15  <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause: the biggest thing to fix in Android/iOS, is UI I guess :P
09:33:36  <peter1138> TrueBrain, ish.
09:33:48  <TrueBrain> LordAro: but okay, asked in the post about DOS; we will see if people reply :)
09:33:49  <peter1138> It needs to be done in a nice generic way.
09:33:54  <peter1138> Unlike what the patches do.
09:34:21  <peter1138> Toolbar buttons down the side of the screen might work quite well on desktop too.
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09:34:47  <TrueBrain> after porting to various of platforms in the old days, my personal opinion became that I do not believe OpenTTD is a playable game on a mobile device (including tablets)
09:35:01  <TrueBrain> I love to be proven wrong :D
09:35:15  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, switching to a "fat finger/touchscreen/miniscreen" mode must be generic enough to work on every OS, with maybe a detection routine to set a sane default
09:36:13  <peter1138> TrueBrain, yeah it needs a mouse pointer, I think.
09:36:20  <dwfreed> because you could be running openttd on windows with a touchscreen display (like a surface pro)
09:36:22  <Eddi|zuHause> it could incorporate the gui zoom/font zoom features
09:36:48  <TrueBrain> so, a new projct
09:36:54  <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause is the project owner
09:36:58  <TrueBrain> any questions can be directed to him
09:37:03  <TrueBrain> :D
09:37:05  <Eddi|zuHause> that sounds like a horrible idea :p
09:37:14  <TrueBrain> that's what she said
09:37:14  <LordAro> dwfreed: x2 gui zoom, done
09:37:17  <LordAro> :p
09:37:42  <Eddi|zuHause> ... and she was probably right
09:38:14  <planetmaker> there is an android port... it surely could be canibalized to make it proper
09:39:01  <peter1138> i have it imported heh
09:39:30  <peter1138> first step is to fix the build system
09:39:49  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output.
09:40:42  <peter1138> gui changes are obviously required but come later
09:41:18  <peter1138> sdl 1.2 android port is clunky, sdl 2 might be better
09:43:57  <Eddi|zuHause> have we settled on the debate of whether sdl2 support should remove sdl1.2 support or be a separate driver?
09:44:44  <Eddi|zuHause> i see the potential for lots of fringe cases breaking with sdl2
09:45:32  <peter1138> at the moment its not ready
09:45:36  <Eddi|zuHause> might be helpful to tell those people to use "-v sdl1"
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10:01:02  <TrueBrain> I am so happy I put a space in my folder name
10:01:12  <TrueBrain> once again glx broke support for that :P (it is either he or me doing it :D)
10:07:50  <Eddi|zuHause> good test case :)
10:08:20  <peter1138> Do we want the CI to build with fluidsynth suport?
10:08:22  <peter1138> *support
10:08:55  <peter1138> It would be an extra library for users to install.
10:09:34  <planetmaker> for the end user?
10:09:39  <planetmaker> hm
10:10:03  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
10:10:11  <planetmaker> well. On linux it doesn't hurt, if you install via package manager. Or you compile it in statically
10:10:16  <peter1138> Hmm, actually...
10:10:33  <peter1138>
10:10:42  <TrueBrain> peter1138: we only publish Debian packages that users can use on Linux
10:10:43  <peter1138> That post would suggest it is. Hmm.
10:10:50  <peter1138> TrueBrain, true.
10:10:51  <TrueBrain> the CI doesn't produce downloadable binaries
10:11:15  <TrueBrain> so I guess your question is two-fold: should we change os/debian, os/rpm, etc to include fluidsynth
10:11:25  <TrueBrain> and should we add fluidsynth to the CI so it is validated it still works?
10:11:35  <TrueBrain> on that last note, guess it would be good to install allegro etc too
10:11:38  <Eddi|zuHause> i think enough people requested a generic linux binary that we should consider providing one
10:11:53  <TrueBrain> Eddi|zuHause:
10:12:04  <TrueBrain> we considered it. The answer resulted in a ticket
10:12:05  <TrueBrain> now get to work :P
10:12:07  <peter1138> Eddi|zuHause, we should, just needs someone™ to set it up :)
10:12:38  <peter1138> TrueBrain, sorry I was conflating the two, I wasn't sure if adding it to the CI build rules would also affect the release/nightly builds.
10:12:45  <TrueBrain> we can't keep going in this same circle ;) It is not a question IF we should do it, but WHEN someone is going to :P
10:12:52  <TrueBrain> peter1138: nope :)
10:13:14  <TrueBrain> exactly the reason I split them in two flows btw :)
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10:15:15  <peter1138> Ok
10:16:36  <peter1138> Yeah so allegro too? Or are we dropping that?
10:17:55  <TrueBrain> for now, lets keep it
10:17:58  <peter1138> Ok.
10:18:04  <TrueBrain> CMake showed me a lot of these libraries that are missing on the CI
10:18:41  <TrueBrain> yeah, fluidsynth and allegro are not fixed yet on the CI
10:18:42  <TrueBrain> the rest is
10:26:48  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] JGRennison commented on pull request #7366: Add: List recently executed commands in crashlog output.
10:27:14  <andythenorth> TrueBrain: drop DOS, it's showboating to keep it
10:27:23  <andythenorth> I kill jokes quite often in newgrf
10:27:33  <andythenorth> after a few years, they're no longer funny
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10:46:06  <peter1138> Yes yes.
10:46:15  <peter1138> On branch multiple-docks
10:46:15  <peter1138> nothing to commit, working tree clean
10:46:17  <peter1138> Well
10:48:26  <peter1138> TrueBrain, hmm, I guess Linux dependencies are done differently from OSX?
10:48:38  <peter1138> It was azure-pipelines for OSX
10:49:12  <peter1138> I wonder if fluidsynth works on OSX? :D
10:51:17  <peter1138> andythenorth, did you ever try the palette "fix" I made? (SDL 1.2 only, dunno if you can run that)
10:53:38  <andythenorth> I didn't
10:53:40  <andythenorth> is it a PR? o_O
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11:02:20  <peter1138> Nah
11:05:41  <peter1138> Night mode sounds particularly useless.
11:05:49  <peter1138> Seeing as a game day takes about 2.5 seconds...
11:11:26  <Eddi|zuHause> i was browsing through some patches i stored ages ago, and among those was one that looked like it applied some palette magic to switch to night mode
11:12:31  <Eddi|zuHause> it was called "rAncient" and referenced .c files :p
11:15:09  <peter1138> :-)
11:15:34  <peter1138> Yeah, palette magic is actually easy, especially now we're in 32bpp mode these days.
11:15:48  <peter1138> It's just the lights, and the practicality of it.
11:18:26  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh approved pull request #7367: Change: Include _current_company in crashlog AI config line
11:28:45  <TrueBrain> peter1138: Linux are done via Docker, as we need to run on different "OSes" there
11:28:55  <TrueBrain> OSX only has one, as does Windows, so they are done directly via Azure Pipelines
11:29:04  <peter1138> Yup. That makes sense.
11:29:07  <TrueBrain> bit annoying, but what can you do
11:29:49  <peter1138> I'll have to figure out how to play with docker. No bad thing.
11:30:17  <TrueBrain> I have to figure out why my spinning disk is causing hickups on my system :(
11:30:28  <TrueBrain> to see how the Dockers are build (and run) you can check the Azure Pipelines
11:30:42  <TrueBrain> if you want more detailed walk-through, let me know :)
11:31:21  <TrueBrain> okay, my computer is acting REALLY weird now .. lol .. stupid Windows :(
11:31:47  <TrueBrain> only Chrome works .. rest of the windows are stuck :P
11:32:00  <TrueBrain> but only with mouse interactions
11:32:02  <TrueBrain> with keyboard it is fine
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11:33:09  <peter1138> Oh dear...
11:33:16  <peter1138> I hope your drive is not toast :/
11:33:48  <TrueBrain> rebooted the system, everything is fine again
11:33:48  <TrueBrain> weird
11:35:16  <Eddi|zuHause> sounds like typical Windows :p
11:35:47  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
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11:43:41  <TrueBrain> owh, I fixed non-MSVC, but that broke MSVC :D
11:43:42  <TrueBrain> NICE
11:44:02  <Eddi|zuHause> sounds like a tuesday
11:44:06  <Eddi|zuHause> (on monday)
11:53:13  <TrueBrain> okay ... cmake lost the ability to find msbuild all of a sudden
11:54:49  <TrueBrain> things on Windows work like MAGIC
12:00:57  <peter1138> The std::vector patch is looking a bit... conflicty :/
12:02:48  <peter1138> Can a GameScript take over map creation?
12:03:15  <peter1138> Well, not landscape but town and industry placement.
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12:13:17  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
12:13:21  <TrueBrain> sounds to me nielsm was just being lazy :P :P :P
12:13:46  <TrueBrain> he even merged something in that repo recently :) So yeah, he for sure has write access :D
12:47:50  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] LordAro merged pull request #7367: Change: Include _current_company in crashlog AI config line
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13:03:07  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM closed pull request #7242: Codechange: Improve performance of town name refresh on viewports
13:03:08  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM commented on pull request #7242: Codechange: Improve performance of town name refresh on viewports
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13:13:09  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM opened pull request #7368: Codechange: town sign update on population change
13:16:12  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh updated pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
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13:33:13  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM updated pull request #7025: Add #6887: Option to show zone inside local authority boundary of towns
13:39:09  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7025: Add #6887: Option to show zone inside local authority boundary of towns
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13:49:43  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] stale[bot] commented on issue #7006: Hardware mouse cursor
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13:54:18  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain updated pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
13:55:57  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nikolas commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
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13:57:27  <peter1138> "These changes/fixes can obviously be controversial, so please discuss and ask aobut them."
13:57:30  <peter1138> Nooo :p
13:58:41  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
13:58:59  <TrueBrain> clicking edit is REALLY easy, so I expect a commit in 20 seconds? :D
14:02:37  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nikolas commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
14:02:43  <andythenorth> peter1138: livery stuff, best feature ever
14:02:55  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
14:03:11  <peter1138> Who what?
14:03:16  <TrueBrain> peter1138: you
14:03:44  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
14:04:07  <TrueBrain> (I assumed you were talking about people's inability to write "about" correct :P)
14:04:25  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on issue #7006: Hardware mouse cursor
14:04:43  <peter1138> TrueBrain, no, didn't even notice that.
14:04:48  <TrueBrain> ah :D
14:04:50  <TrueBrain> my bad :)
14:04:53  <andythenorth> 'oof'
14:05:01  <andythenorth> is it lunchtime?
14:05:02  <TrueBrain> jumping to the wrong conclusion there :D
14:05:09  <TrueBrain> andythenorth: +/- 2 hours late, sure
14:05:15  <peter1138> andythenorth, oh I see, he's using group liveries to ... do livery changes.
14:05:19  <andythenorth> yes!
14:05:19  <peter1138> TrueBrain, that's my job :D
14:05:23  <andythenorth> it's amazing
14:05:28  <andythenorth> best feature
14:05:31  <andythenorth> hmm
14:05:41  <TrueBrain> peter1138: again, my apologies :D
14:05:43  <peter1138> I had lunch. It was low calorie until I ate the roll, crisps, and scone.
14:05:51  <andythenorth> I had: half a packet of cookies, some hula hoops, a tomato, and a lasagne
14:05:55  <andythenorth> so is it lunch?
14:06:04  <TrueBrain> why is MSBuild not on my search path :(
14:06:07  <peter1138> It sounds like you had it.
14:06:15  <andythenorth> that was a snack
14:06:21  <peter1138> I had a lotus biscuit. Not quite half a packet.
14:06:31  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7025: Add #6887: Option to show zone inside local authority boundary of towns
14:06:38  <TrueBrain> owh, that error happens because I have VS2019 installed, it says
14:06:39  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nikolas updated pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
14:06:40  <TrueBrain> nooooo
14:07:00  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] TrueBrain commented on pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
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14:07:43  <m3henry> Airport burger here
14:08:28  <TrueBrain> HOW DID HE KNOW?!
14:08:30  <TrueBrain> *scared now*
14:09:34  * m3henry is wondering how many merge-fixups are needed when he gets back
14:10:07  <peter1138> m3henry, welllllll
14:10:13  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM commented on pull request #7025: Add #6887: Option to show zone inside local authority boundary of towns
14:15:08  <TrueBrain> okay, CMake is working again \o/
14:15:09  <TrueBrain> w00p
14:15:24  <TrueBrain> baseset generation is also working (tnx to glx)
14:15:27  <TrueBrain> source.list is no longer needed
14:15:32  <TrueBrain> all in all, looking good :)
14:15:58  <TrueBrain> biggest thing left, is regression :)
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14:16:20  <peter1138> Nice
14:16:26  *** supermop_work has quit IRC
14:16:52  * andythenorth had a creme egg
14:18:14  <peter1138> TrueBrain,
14:18:56  <peter1138> TrueBrain, last three commits there might be interesting
14:19:07  <TrueBrain> yippie, peter1138 is going to port those to CMake :D \o/ :)
14:19:10  <peter1138> TrueBrain, but i believe that should be done sseparate afterwards
14:19:15  <LordAro> andythenorth: yes please
14:19:18  <peter1138> TrueBrain, yup, that's partly why i stopped developing it.
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14:19:51  <peter1138> I have 2 Oreo eggs. They're not quite the same.
14:20:03  <peter1138> Much less sweet.
14:20:03  <TrueBrain> with CMake it becomes so much easier .. 1 script to do all platforms with
14:20:09  <TrueBrain> instead of all this shell/vbs shit constantly :P
14:20:13  <peter1138> TrueBrain, hopefully
14:20:16  <TrueBrain> but yeah, that would be really great to just generate those files on build
14:20:20  <TrueBrain> instead of storing them in repo
14:20:24  <TrueBrain> which is a bit iffy .. always has been :P
14:20:36  <peter1138> Yeah, and we keep missing these files, as glx tells us :)
14:20:52  <TrueBrain> one of the things we also should work for, is using more folders :P
14:20:56  <TrueBrain> 'src' really has too many files
14:21:08  <TrueBrain> silly enough, in MSVC we do use more folders
14:21:14  <TrueBrain> but ONLY MSVC does :P
14:21:18  <TrueBrain> (virtual folders, that is)
14:21:29  <peter1138> Yeah, these files should perhaps not going in src as they are genearted.
14:21:39  <TrueBrain> I meant outside the generated files
14:21:41  <TrueBrain> just in general
14:21:43  <peter1138> Also there's an odd one in there which is autogenerated, but not completely.
14:21:48  <peter1138> Ah
14:22:02  <TrueBrain> source.list has categories for MSVC projects
14:22:10  <TrueBrain> but most of the files in those categories are in 'src'
14:22:18  <TrueBrain> so .. all non-MSVC people are punished :P
14:22:28  <TrueBrain> possibly 'src' should only contain folders ..
14:22:49  <peter1138> src/newgrf/
14:24:02  <peter1138> All my C# stuff is one-file-per-class, and mostly namespaces-as-directories
14:24:17  <TrueBrain> THE SANITY! STOP IT! :P
14:24:49  <peter1138> Maybe we should use namespaces...
14:25:24  <peter1138> andythenorth, I've got a kiwi fruit. Not quite a creme egg :(
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14:44:18  <nielsm> hell-o
14:44:22  <TrueBrain> hi :)
14:44:45  <TrueBrain> nielsm: minor request, in markdown, please hit that enter key after every end-of-sentence marker; makes diffs a lot easier :) (minor thingy :P)
14:45:05  <nielsm> your change afterwards reminded me :)
14:45:10  <TrueBrain> :D
14:57:11  <nielsm> so, does anyone remember where the Wentbound save originates from? :)
14:59:26  <nielsm> wentbourne* ...
15:00:04  <peter1138> <peter1138>Testing with a massive savegame I found on the forum that makes my i7 struggle.
15:00:07  <peter1138> Hmm
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15:00:44  <Alberth> moin
15:00:50  <greeter> greetings Alberth
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15:04:52  <LordAro> hi hi Alberth
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15:06:40  <Alberth> not so terribly busy here atm :)
15:07:24  <Alberth> or did everyone agreed on what they should do, and are busy doing that now, perhaps
15:07:56  <andythenorth> we're all tapping our fingers waiting for nml2
15:08:02  <andythenorth> all work stopped :)
15:08:28  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM opened pull request #7369: Add: k-d tree element checker function
15:11:12  <LordAro> Alberth: you should review some PRs to pass the time ;)
15:12:49  <nielsm> illustration: "do not load wentbourne in a debug build"
15:14:00  <peter1138> Hmm, should I have the second lotus biscuit?
15:15:03  <peter1138> Too late.
15:16:58  <Alberth> andy: I did ponder on nfo linking, in particular how to do an experiment that's not too much work
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15:19:25  <peter1138> orudge, is there a way to search on upload filename on tt-f?
15:22:28  <nielsm> or file size
15:22:44  <TrueBrain> funny .. os2_m.cpp is never compiled
15:22:50  <TrueBrain> when is the last time os2 was tested? :P
15:25:50  <Eddi|zuHause> who knows...
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15:34:23  <peter1138> os2 was orudge's thing, wasn't it?
15:34:56  <nielsm> I think so yes
15:39:15  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nielsmh updated pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
15:41:08  <TrueBrain> it used to be that coop provided the most extreme savegames :P
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15:45:20  <nielsm> well ProZone 13 is still also a test case :)
15:47:04  <TrueBrain> meh, SSE fails again with CMake .. setting properties on files is difficult :D
15:49:09  <TrueBrain> set_source_files_properties only works after you added the file to an executable
15:49:22  <TrueBrain> so .. I guess it is not marked as source file before that
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15:50:54  <TrueBrain> 'Due to historical development reasons, source file properties
15:50:54  <TrueBrain> are scoped only in the directory where they are set.'
15:50:55  <TrueBrain> right
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16:08:49  <TrueBrain> glx: as a FYI, I am doing some massive work in CMake; just in case you were planning to do the same :D
16:09:09  <glx> I'm working on generate_widget :)
16:09:34  <glx> I guess you are replacing add_files with target_sources
16:09:35  <peter1138> Did you look at y branch?
16:09:40  <peter1138> *my
16:10:17  <TrueBrain> glx: not currently, but that is a good idea yes :)
16:11:05  <peter1138>
16:11:09  <peter1138> That is about all I did on that one :p
16:11:23  <glx> btw I have 2 allegro files only in SOURCE_LIST2
16:11:48  <TrueBrain> yup
16:11:53  <TrueBrain> source.list was weird there
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16:13:47  <glx>
16:14:01  <glx> that's what I have for now
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16:14:32  <glx> and I keed the original script_window.hpp to compare my output
16:14:36  <glx> *keep
16:14:55  <peter1138> *nod*
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16:15:15  <TrueBrain> spend 20 minutes figuring out I misspelled CFLAGS :P
16:15:19  <Samu> I created a game with newgrfs, supermop_work
16:16:47  * glx like configure_file() cmake function :)
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16:19:33  <glx> TrueBrain: I guess you noticed all the ugly stuff in src/os/* just to keep source list parsing output
16:20:27  <glx> mainly for headers, as source files where properly selected in source.list
16:20:49  <glx> but most headers were just added even when unneeded
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16:21:54  <andythenorth> vehicle variants then?
16:22:10  <andythenorth> Horse 2 is nearly finished, so I need a reason to delay it
16:22:37  <nielsm> did you make the nuclear steam-electric loco yet?
16:22:59  <TrueBrain> glx: fixed that already :)
16:23:32  <glx> :)
16:23:45  <andythenorth> I did not make nuclear electric steam engine no
16:23:47  <glx> but my first step was perfect matching
16:24:06  <andythenorth> nor did I add the parameter to scale intro dates by atrbitrary amount
16:24:16  <andythenorth> Eddi said I wasn't allowed :(
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16:27:13  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7369: Add: k-d tree element checker function
16:27:19  <peter1138> andythenorth, oh, variants... Hmm.
16:27:35  <andythenorth> think of the liveries I could draw
16:27:38  <peter1138> andythenorth, multitle docks is going well, so... after.
16:27:41  <andythenorth> I could delay Horse for years
16:27:49  <andythenorth> I love multititle docs
16:28:04  <andythenorth> is it a branch yet?
16:28:10  <peter1138> Also, should we add rgb company colours, or just add a fixed set of more (but 8bpp) colours?
16:28:18  <andythenorth> pantones :P
16:28:23  <andythenorth> then we can look up the real liveries
16:28:26  <TrueBrain> glx: I now wrote something that makes sure we can set the sse flags locally, and that it still all works .. its a bit weird :P
16:28:28  <andythenorth> for accuracy
16:28:34  <peter1138> RGB might be "too much choice" ?
16:28:54  <andythenorth> it would for me
16:28:58  <andythenorth> not very TTD
16:29:16  <peter1138> Although it's possible to offer fixed colours which happen to be RGB.
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16:32:57  <TrueBrain> glx: and now I want to look if add_files() can have a parameter to do the filter, removing this if() debt, which is horrible to read :D
16:33:18  <andythenorth> so I've added spec_flag IND_FLAG_LONG_CARGO_TYPE_LISTS
16:33:33  <andythenorth> now I need to read different bits, and match up the cargos to the industry cargos in the economy
16:34:06  * andythenorth wonders, can we merge 16-cargos yet?
16:34:14  <andythenorth> and have some nml docs? o_O
16:34:38  <glx> TrueBrain: it's easy to add a parameter
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16:35:15  <glx> but the foreach ARGV will need some care
16:36:16  <TrueBrain> yeah, that I now figured out how that should work :)
16:36:26  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/website] nikolas updated pull request #65: Add: Monthly Dev Post of April 2019
16:37:13  <glx> cmake language is quite powerful, but sometimes need ugly solutions
16:39:08  <peter1138> andythenorth, oh yeah, need to fix that bug, eh?
16:39:28  <andythenorth> yuss :)
16:39:36  <TrueBrain> they also have a bad case of "backwards compatibility"
16:40:07  <peter1138> I used to use CMake but got annoyed ;(
16:40:18  <peter1138> It was better than ./waf though.
16:40:27  <TrueBrain> because, for example, with target_sources you can add sources to a target; awesome
16:40:27  <TrueBrain> BUT
16:40:33  <TrueBrain> you cannot create a target without at least a single source
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16:49:27  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7351: Add: Warn players that company passwords are not truly secure
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16:51:31  <TrueBrain> glx:
16:51:33  <TrueBrain> that works now :)
16:52:28  <glx> nice
16:52:38  <TrueBrain> less nesting
16:52:46  <TrueBrain> so video/CMakeLists.txt is somewhat more readable :P
16:52:51  <glx> hehe
16:52:53  <LordAro> purely for interest purposes, i looked up the first reference to "wentbourne" in my logs:
16:53:31  <LordAro> [21:07:08] <peter1138> Testing with a massive savegame I found on the forum that makes my i7 struggle.
16:53:35  <TrueBrain> glx: FILTER a good word?
16:53:40  <TrueBrain> LordAro: peter1138 said so already, yes :)
16:53:57  <glx> so you make a temporary list then append it depending on filter test
16:54:01  <LordAro> TrueBrain: pfft.
16:54:13  <TrueBrain> EXCLUDE_IF ?
16:54:25  <TrueBrain> INCLUDE_IF ?
16:54:28  <TrueBrain> ADD_IF ?
16:55:13  <TrueBrain> ONLY_IF ?
16:55:21  <glx> ADD_IF seems good
16:55:33  <TrueBrain> CONDITIONAL
16:55:34  <TrueBrain> ?
16:55:50  <glx> hmm CONDITION
16:56:09  <glx> like in azure :)
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17:14:13  <TrueBrain> w00p, this seems to work :)
17:14:22  <TrueBrain> slowly we are creeping to cleaner and cleaner code :)
17:14:32  <nielsm> can we make Window::nested_array a std::vector or something?
17:15:43  <andythenorth> is this like a slow controlled bonfire? :P
17:15:46  * andythenorth likes a bonfire
17:16:06  <TrueBrain> I like bonfires too, as long as they are not inside my house :D
17:18:25  <TrueBrain> lets see what I broke ...
17:18:25  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
17:22:36  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh updated pull request #7351: Add: Warn players that company passwords are not truly secure
17:24:05  <TrueBrain> ha, it works :D Sweet :)
17:25:46  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7351: Add: Warn players that company passwords are not truly secure
17:26:01  <TrueBrain> except that it doesnt ..
17:26:08  <TrueBrain> I selected too many files for OSX :D
17:26:26  <TrueBrain> yeah, okay, I already was a bit: huh? .. but so that is correct :P
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17:30:16  <LordAro> nielsm: get the smallvector removal merged first :p
17:30:27  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
17:32:08  <Alberth> niels: not much use, it never changes after initial construction
17:32:56  <Alberth> TB just deleted all source code :p
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17:40:47  <planetmaker> :P
17:40:58  <glx> pff stupid cmake regex failures
17:41:21  <glx>  string sub-command REGEX, mode MATCH regex "" matched an empty string.
17:41:34  <planetmaker> rm -rf / path/to/somewhere ?
17:41:37  <glx> stuff like that is allowed in any other language
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17:42:33  <LordAro> planetmaker: rm -rf /home/$USRE/.myfiles more like
17:43:07  <planetmaker> I left the space in the path deliberately :P
17:43:15  <LordAro> oh i know :p
17:43:30  <LordAro> i think Steam's was rm -rf ~/$SOMEVARIBEL
17:43:41  <planetmaker> yeah, I think so, too
17:43:55  <LordAro> yup
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17:45:07  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
17:45:17  <Alberth> he just updated the PR ".. (and removing all other project-related code)"
17:48:21  <LordAro> pfft, who needed that anyway?
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18:05:34  <peter1138> Hi :)
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18:06:50  <peter1138> Yeah, the std::vector PR needs to be updated and then reviewed.
18:06:59  <peter1138> Hi J0anJosep
18:08:15  <J0anJosep> Hi
18:08:32  <J0anJosep> How is the multidock PR going?
18:09:10  <J0anJosep> I had done some work on it (multidock, ship separation and others). Maybe I can help at some point.
18:09:30  <peter1138> I looked at that in the past but got kinda lost.
18:10:15  <J0anJosep> I can create a separate branch to check it.
18:11:10  <J0anJosep> But I still have to rebase all my previous work to your catchment improvement.
18:11:13  <peter1138> Basically in all my previous attempts I was stumbling on how to efficiently get the docking tiles, without making them "physical" station tiles.
18:11:33  <peter1138> Doing that would be awkward for savegame compatibility.
18:11:38  <J0anJosep> Why not making them physical station tiles?
18:12:00  <peter1138> Because there are plenty of cases where there's no space in an existing game to put a station tile there.
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18:13:00  <J0anJosep> If you make the tile on the water the tile where ships dock, that is solved. You can then tell specifically which tracks can be used for docking, which prevents weird 45º "docking".
18:14:54  <peter1138> Okay that would work, but I'm not sure. It effectively force-breaks every save.
18:15:07  <J0anJosep> Why?
18:15:56  <peter1138> Because existing docks get changed.
18:17:03  <J0anJosep> You can update them. The only thing is new docks will have a visible tile and and invisible tile, insetad of two visible tiles (the one in a sloped tile and the one in the water.)
18:18:12  <peter1138> Yeah, that "only thing" is what I mean, it's quite a change.
18:22:59  <J0anJosep> I also know this is quite a change, but is doable. Savegame compatibility isn't affected by it.
18:23:35  <J0anJosep> And it also allows for docks in 1-tile wide rivers, without having to terraform the river.
18:24:01  <peter1138> I intend to allow all that, but just keep the existing docks as they are.
18:24:11  <peter1138> Well, appearance-wise, anyway.
18:26:39  <J0anJosep> Ok. Other types of docks? How will they be?
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18:27:04  <peter1138> However a NewGRF defines them.
18:27:20  <Wolf01> o/
18:29:11  <peter1138> I'm torn, because the method I've used works.
18:29:36  <peter1138> If it was guaranteed to always have the space I'd just plonk a docking tile down on the end :/
18:30:56  <J0anJosep> What if there are three different docks with the same docking tile?
18:31:40  <peter1138> Yeah that's also a problem.
18:31:49  <peter1138> Not a problem with your method or my current method.
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18:33:49  <J0anJosep> Yes. I chose to do it that way because I thought about separating ships as well.
18:34:05  *** andythenorth has joined #openttd
18:34:28  <peter1138> Not show how separating ships is relevant.
18:34:55  <peter1138> *sure
18:35:14  <andythenorth> this is a weird problem to have
18:35:17  <J0anJosep> I also thought about doing it adding a new docking tile, but then three different competitors could share the same docking tile.
18:35:53  <andythenorth> ^^ does the OP there just not know about pressing 'escape'
18:36:36  <m3henry> tram > bendy bus > plane > bigger plane > EMU > HST > DMU > 3rd rail EMU. I just need to take a boat and helicopter today and I'll be a transport tycoon
18:36:49  <peter1138> My docking tile is 'virtual'
18:37:36  <peter1138> It's 1 bit in the map array that says signals ships and the PF to do additional stuff.
18:38:54  <peter1138> The bit available on any water tile, and also station tiles (for buoys) & bridge heads (aqueducts).
18:39:03  <J0anJosep> Ok. I was thinking if only 1 ship could be in a tile, sharing that tile could be troublesome.
18:40:55  <peter1138> Okay, so...
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18:41:39  <peter1138> Effectively we'd break backwards compatiblity by making the existing water part the docking tile.
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18:41:52  <J0anJosep> Why?
18:41:59  <peter1138> But it solves lots of issues in the long run.
18:42:13  <J0anJosep> By the way, your idea looks ok.
18:42:16  <peter1138> J0anJosep, backwards compatibility means it stays the same.
18:42:46  <J0anJosep> I'm lost know. My way makes it breaks backwards compatibility?
18:43:04  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
18:43:05  <peter1138> Yes, because it changes the visual representation.
18:43:16  <peter1138> I'm not talking about technical compatibility.
18:43:18  <andythenorth> break stuff!
18:43:41  <peter1138> Obviously old saves still load, but the result is differen.t
18:43:53  <m3henry> Are there any save versions which can't be loaded by 1.9.0?
18:44:04  <peter1138> On the other hand, it's appealling because it solves more issues
18:44:15  <peter1138> m3henry, anything from a patchpack :p
18:44:44  <peter1138> Any save from an official version should be loadable.
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18:44:45  <m3henry> well yeah, but you know that's not what I meant
18:44:51  <peter1138> If not, there's a bug.
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18:45:04  <peter1138> And it's not that improbable, savegame conversion is ... fun.
18:45:23  *** Compu has quit IRC
18:46:15  <m3henry> :3 At what point will maintaining complete backwards compat become too large a burden?
18:47:13  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain updated pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
18:47:20  <peter1138> Well...
18:47:39  <peter1138> Usually you only need to take care about converting from the previous to the current version.
18:47:49  <peter1138> Everything before that is handled by the code that's already there.
18:48:27  <peter1138> But it can get awkward when things are shuffled around. We basically do intermediate conversions.
18:50:42  <peter1138> J0anJosep, with my method, when I encounter a tile marked as a docking tile, I have to check all 4 adjacent tiles.
18:51:12  <peter1138> J0anJosep, it's not slow but it's clearly more complex than just checking an actual station tile.
18:51:30  <peter1138> J0anJosep, there's also the extra effort needed to maintain the docking tile flag.
18:52:45  <andythenorth> nielsm: to confirm my understanding....I now check cargos explicitly by label, instead of relying on position?
18:52:49  <J0anJosep> It's not that hard. I discarded that way because it was too complex at the moment I tried it (years ago, few coding experience in OpenTTD).
18:53:10  <nielsm> andythenorth yes
18:53:27  <nielsm> compare bits 16..23 to cargotype("COAL") etc
18:53:32  <peter1138> J0anJosep, simply, making it an actual station tile is superior, apart from having to wipe out the existing water part of the dock.
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18:53:58  <andythenorth> thanks
18:54:00  <J0anJosep> peter1138, if it is more lines of coding but the result is better, go with it.
18:54:08  <andythenorth> think I'll need to wrap that in an economy switch
18:54:20  <peter1138> J0anJosep, i'm leaning to deferring to the community :p
18:54:49  <peter1138> J0anJosep, did you ever do anything with custom graphics or not get that far?
18:55:13  <peter1138> s/custom/NewGRF/
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18:57:38  <andythenorth> hmm
18:57:56  <andythenorth> wonder if I can just set() all the accepted cargos across all economies
18:58:14  <J0anJosep> peter1138, I didn't go that far. But there are 13+16 free bits (even after adding dock tracks, reserved tracks, the edges and the corners of river banks, and trackdir preferences on the map array). I think it should be no problem.
18:58:33  <peter1138> Free bits wasn't an issue I am worried about :)
18:59:07  <J0anJosep> Would be any added problem then? I don't think so.
18:59:27  <peter1138> No problem, just wondering if you'd done anything on it.
18:59:42  <peter1138> If not, that's good because there's no thing to throw away :)
19:00:15  <J0anJosep> Did you do it already?
19:00:24  <peter1138> No, not got that far yet, but I have plans.
19:01:29  *** m3henry has quit IRC
19:02:45  <andythenorth> hmm this is going to be slow to compile
19:03:54  <peter1138> Right, I'm leaving it for now.
19:04:01  <peter1138> #7364 needs attention.
19:04:16  <peter1138> I'm concerned about adding flags to say a callback result is invalid.
19:04:22  * andythenorth wonders about an nml linter
19:04:38  <andythenorth> it's tedious waiting 40s for a syntax error
19:08:36  <peter1138> Hmm, if I disable the group, will it still load, or throw a different error.
19:10:34  <peter1138> dbg: [grf] [d/firs.grf:3341] GetGroupFromGroupID(0xF6:0x89): Groupid 0x00F6 does not exist, leaving empty
19:10:39  <peter1138> Hmm, I guess that still works.
19:11:13  <peter1138> Means you can't have diagnostics.
19:11:33  <andythenorth> do we have some problems with windows not being marked dirty?
19:11:46  <peter1138> andythenorth, be more specific please.
19:11:47  <andythenorth> industry window notably, and newgrf industry debug
19:11:59  <andythenorth> I've also got station signs missing parts
19:12:12  <andythenorth> I'll see if it's reproducible
19:12:25  <peter1138> Station signs missing parts would be something for nielsm to look into.
19:12:39  <peter1138> I never use the newgrf debug windows so ... no idea.
19:14:24  <andythenorth>
19:14:41  <andythenorth> also industry text failing to update / misdrawn, but harder to repro
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19:14:42  <peter1138> Massive font.
19:15:50  <andythenorth> just checking my branch to see if it's something weird locally
19:16:29  <andythenorth> I was messing around with SDL PR, and blitters
19:17:09  <andythenorth> classic "I can't just post a savegame"
19:17:19  <andythenorth> due to unreleased + broken newgrfs
19:19:32  <nielsm>  <-- wild ideas running wild, or something to pursue?
19:20:29  <andythenorth> is there a TL;DR spec in bullet points? o_O
19:20:34  <nielsm> nope
19:20:47  <andythenorth> in principle offering GS control of zones is potentially interesting
19:20:48  <nielsm> but read zone_type.h it should show most ideas
19:20:59  <nielsm> yeah GS control is one goal
19:21:35  <andythenorth> I have long wanted GS based on opening up a map
19:21:43  <andythenorth> (removing restrictions as reward for completing goals)
19:21:49  <nielsm> railroad tycoon 2 allowed some potentially interesting gameplay with territories granting you permissions after achieving goals/hitting marks
19:21:52  <andythenorth> yes
19:21:54  <andythenorth> all of that
19:21:59  <andythenorth> the problem I forsee
19:22:07  <andythenorth> is that realistically I will never ever write a GS
19:22:10  <nielsm> :D
19:22:14  <andythenorth> and not many other people do
19:22:22  <nielsm> ow, late, need to get food before everything closes
19:22:22  <nielsm> bbl
19:22:23  <andythenorth> otherwise it's great :P
19:22:43  <nielsm> there should also be tools for setting it up in scenario editor without GS :)
19:23:07  <nielsm> so you could do dumb things like make a map where each company has an island to themselves and can't interfere
19:23:09  <andythenorth> ha
19:23:24  <andythenorth> I can't repro this dirty redraw bug (signs screenshot)
19:23:43  <andythenorth> I tried things like SDL recently, maybe I had a bad configure or something
19:24:30  * andythenorth deletes the screenshot
19:29:46  <nielsm> hmm, I guess "bedrock mountain" might not be a great zone after all? since it's not quite exclusive with being a territory
19:30:46  <nielsm> unless maybe restricting towns from building on it at all?
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19:56:35  <peter1138> Hmm
20:02:49  *** octernion has joined #openttd
20:08:09  *** Alberth has left #openttd
20:12:27  <andythenorth> now what eh?
20:12:43  <Wolf01> Party time
20:12:55  <peter1138> Now what
20:13:09  <peter1138> Should I "break" existing savegames by turning the water-part of docks into the docking tile?>
20:14:29  <Wolf01> Why not
20:15:11  <peter1138> Well I don't think we've ever done a change like that before
20:15:38  <andythenorth> 2.0.0
20:15:43  <andythenorth> major version API change
20:15:50  <andythenorth> save up a few other things to go with it
20:15:59  <nielsm> if some saves may fail to load that's def. version 2.0
20:16:03  <andythenorth> or make a savegame migration tool
20:16:04  <andythenorth> :P
20:16:10  <peter1138> Jesus
20:16:17  <peter1138> No, savegames won't fail to load.
20:16:27  <andythenorth> it just changes behaviour, yes?
20:16:27  <peter1138> And no, fuck waiting around for a mythical 2.0.0
20:16:34  *** m3henry has joined #openttd
20:16:58  <peter1138> Hmm, I might simplify this PR to make it backportable.
20:16:59  <andythenorth> 5th November 2019
20:17:01  <nielsm> so if the docking tile is blocked by something else, does the dock then disappear or what happens?
20:17:11  <andythenorth> 2.0.0, bonfire party!
20:17:35  <TrueBrain> your place?
20:18:06  <peter1138> nielsm, the part of a dock that is on water will turn into effectively a water tile (but it's a station tile)
20:18:13  <peter1138> It can't be blocked.
20:18:34  <andythenorth> TrueBrain: not yours?
20:18:48  <TrueBrain> a bonfire in nov? Are you crazy?
20:18:54  <TrueBrain> I was assuming it was indoors at your place :)
20:19:06  <andythenorth> we are celebrating an English hero that day
20:19:21  <andythenorth> a man who was legally killed for trying to blow up our democracy
20:19:23  <TrueBrain> nobody cares about that :P
20:19:51  <andythenorth> we do, much fireworks
20:19:57  <peter1138> Okay, I had my fish.
20:19:59  <TrueBrain> 2 months later again fireworks
20:20:04  <peter1138> What's for dessert?
20:20:05  <TrueBrain> you love your fireworks
20:20:12  <TrueBrain> peter1138: a bonfire?
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20:24:21  <andythenorth> yes a bonfire
20:24:32  <LordAro> smoked fish is very nice
20:24:33  <andythenorth> flames are so entrancing
20:24:38  <andythenorth> as is deleting stuff
20:24:40  <nielsm> I remembered I have ice cream in the freezer
20:24:57  <andythenorth> can't burn that
20:24:59  <andythenorth> silly
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20:25:16  <andythenorth> so is that nml 16-cargo PR done?
20:25:48  <nielsm> doubt it
20:25:50  <andythenorth>
20:25:58  <andythenorth> FIRS exercises some of the spec there
20:26:10  <peter1138> What's needed?
20:26:19  <peter1138> Doesn't it work?
20:26:22  <andythenorth> accept / produce props, produce block, cb 37, new flag, and new tile flag
20:26:32  <andythenorth> everything I tried so far works now
20:26:44  <andythenorth> 'works' = nml compiles it
20:27:04  <andythenorth> and with #7364 it works in OpenTTD as expected
20:27:23  <andythenorth> not saying it's 'done done' and bug free, but we have .z versions for bug fixes eh?
20:27:37  <andythenorth> nml needs to get out there, it will only find bugs by authors using it
20:28:17  <andythenorth> is this PR up to date?
20:28:21  <m3henry> These merge conflicts are rather confusing
20:28:24  <andythenorth> I can't keep up with who has rebased what
20:29:12  <nielsm> I think I may have had a dream about some kind of nml2 syntax recently, and I'm not sure that is healthy
20:29:26  <andythenorth> I've done worse
20:29:26  <nielsm> but I don't remember any specifics
20:31:24  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/nml] andythenorth commented on pull request #15: Industries: support 16 cargos in / 16 cargos out
20:31:47  <andythenorth> planetmaker: ^ I'm proposing that we approve that, ship it, and wait for bug reports
20:31:50  <andythenorth> dunno though
20:32:03  <andythenorth> the error handling of the old prod. cb formats is poor
20:32:14  <andythenorth> that could be fixed in a future release
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20:32:23  <andythenorth> nml needs to scorch the earth a bit, and just get into use
20:35:39  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN updated pull request #7364: Fix e66cec8f86: Permit loading of industry production callback with invalid cargo type.
20:37:50  <peter1138> Hmm...
20:38:25  <peter1138> So... ditch half of my multiple docks patch and go with butchering the existing docks?
20:38:49  <peter1138> Is that too much change, aesthetically?
20:39:27  <andythenorth> picture?
20:39:39  <andythenorth> what gets the most interesting result?
20:40:05  <m3henry> Oh I get it, st->industries_near has been changed to std::vector by someone else right?
20:40:50  <peter1138> m3henry, it's a std::set now
20:40:59  <m3henry> right
20:41:17  <peter1138> StationList as well.
20:42:15  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nielsmh commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
20:43:15  <andythenorth> anyone else want to approve this?
20:43:22  <andythenorth> it's my PR, so I shouldn't
20:43:39  <peter1138> No.
20:43:40  <nielsm> should it be squashed or used as-is?
20:43:43  <peter1138> I needs to be squashed.
20:43:46  <peter1138> *It
20:43:52  <peter1138> Well, you could do a squash commit, I suppose.
20:44:06  <andythenorth> there's a button right there in GH :P
20:44:52  <peter1138> We definitely don't want that kind of history in repos :p
20:44:59  <andythenorth> certainly, I would place a small bet that nobody else is going to test that PR :)
20:45:18  <andythenorth> we have a handful of nml industry sets, and not many of those authors can install nml from a PR
20:45:21  <peter1138> 1 commit may be too little.
20:45:30  <peter1138> Should I manually squash bits?
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20:46:02  <peter1138> Hmm, no, I'm busy :p
20:48:59  <andythenorth> just squash it to one, move on?
20:56:57  <peter1138>
20:56:59  <peter1138> ^ looks like that.
20:57:54  <LordAro> so what's wrong with 2 tile docks?
20:58:01  <LordAro> i've not been paying attention
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21:01:05  <peter1138> Nothing as such, but you can't reliably convert them to be 3 tile docks (3rd tile as an actual station tile but just water)
21:01:18  <peter1138> This is a 2 tile dock still, just the second part is water.
21:01:36  <LordAro> why do we want 3 tile docks?
21:01:43  <peter1138>
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21:02:07  <peter1138> By making the 3rd tile an actual station tile, it simplifies a lot.
21:02:54  <LordAro> how aren't they already effectively 3 tiles long then?
21:02:55  <peter1138> That image handily illustrates why the docking tile can't be converted.
21:03:09  <peter1138> the tile at the end is not part of the station
21:03:19  <peter1138> It is where the ship loads, though.
21:03:32  <peter1138> Basically all vehicles stop ON a station tile to do loading
21:03:34  <peter1138> Except ships.
21:04:10  <peter1138> I'm of the opinion that changing the way docks work like this is unacceptable.
21:04:52  <peter1138> Er, "like this" ... i specifically mean replacing the 2nd part with something that looks like water.
21:05:31  <peter1138>
21:05:36  <peter1138> This is what I have working in my branch.
21:05:59  <peter1138> the red square is just debugging
21:06:14  <LordAro> but that image is post-samu patch, isn't it? did that get merged?
21:06:18  <peter1138> Each red square is a regular water tile with a special flag in the map array that says it is a docking tile.
21:06:54  <peter1138> LordAro, it illustrates the current possibilities of docks.
21:07:21  <peter1138> samu's patch was about the ability to place docks in those locations, which is not possible, but you can terraform or place buoys afterwards.
21:07:34  <LordAro> ah, i see
21:07:37  <LordAro> hmm
21:07:38  <peter1138> But samu's patch is irrelevant here, just a handy picture :)
21:07:55  <peter1138> So with the "red square method"...
21:08:28  <peter1138> There's a bit in the map array, and if a ship/pf encounters it, it has to look at the 4 adjacent tiles to see what to do.
21:08:48  <peter1138> Kinda ugly, but does work. And doesn't "break" docks like in docks3.png
21:09:29  <andythenorth> replace everything with docking tiles, build objects for the quays and stuff?
21:09:35  <andythenorth> or rail station tiles?
21:09:46  <andythenorth> marico and friends?
21:09:50  <peter1138> LordAro, and andythenorth misses the point :)
21:10:32  * andythenorth reads again :P
21:10:41  <peter1138> andythenorth, and no, a dock tile has to be a dock tile, not a "newobject"
21:11:00  <andythenorth> the tile would be a dock tile
21:11:11  <andythenorth> hmm
21:12:15  <andythenorth> mmmmm.....marico
21:14:34  <peter1138> Yeah, well, part of this plan is use-newobjects-style graphics chain, but with station variables.
21:14:40  <peter1138> Might need some duplication.
21:14:56  <peter1138> Things like platforms etc are irrelevant, cos it's a rail station.
21:20:07  <andythenorth> oof, so is anyone ever going to write a GS? o_O
21:20:38  <andythenorth> it's been about 8 years :)
21:22:29  <peter1138> There's lots of them?
21:23:57  <peter1138> LordAro, so yeah. "removing" the part on water is a no go, right?
21:25:17  <LordAro> peter1138: i wouldn't like it, anyway :p
21:25:38  <peter1138> I better edit landscape_grid.html then :)
21:28:15  <peter1138> Oh, and of course, I think it will be possible to make dock tiles which a docking tiles in the future.
21:28:22  <peter1138> Just not for the existing docks.
21:29:03  <LordAro> just not necessarily for existing docks
21:29:36  <peter1138> Well, awkwardly, going that route means this map bit only needed for old maps. Hmmmmm...
21:29:44  <peter1138> Maybe I should come up with a different way.
21:30:01  <LordAro> how awful would it be for old style docks (with no position in front of them) to use the 2nd dock tile instead?
21:30:34  <peter1138> Didn't we agree that it's not good?
21:30:43  <peter1138> Hmm
21:30:48  <LordAro> i mean just clip through it
21:31:00  <peter1138> Oh.
21:31:02  <peter1138> ew.
21:31:06  <LordAro> yeah
21:31:18  <LordAro> but the number of docks like that must be very small
21:33:19  <LordAro> the number of docks that either have had land terraformed in front of them or had a buoy placed in front of them must be vanishingly small
21:33:45  <peter1138> So convert to 2 tile dock if it can't be converted to a 3 tile dock?
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21:34:03  <LordAro> i'm wildly speculating, but yeah
21:34:16  <andythenorth> seems plausible
21:34:28  <andythenorth> fallback
21:35:33  <peter1138> Hmm, catchment...
21:35:52  <andythenorth> there's always something :P
21:36:06  <LordAro> well station catchment has already been changed
21:36:12  <peter1138> Yup
21:37:34  <peter1138> Also oil rigs.
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21:37:40  <peter1138> They "just work" right now.
21:38:14  <LordAro> maybe a good time to properly remove oil rig's specialness? :p
21:38:25  <LordAro> oil rigs'*
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21:47:24  <nielsm> and make industries with own road stops too?
21:47:41  <nielsm> somehow industries with own rail stations?!
21:47:48  <LordAro> haha
21:50:35  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] M3Henry updated pull request #7165: [core] Implement SmallVector using std::vector
21:51:02  <andythenorth> airports!
21:51:43  <andythenorth> where's my industry airport screenshot :P
21:51:50  <andythenorth> I've lost it
21:52:10  <nielsm> airport industry?
21:52:24  <nielsm> airport owned by a third party and you rent terminals at it
21:53:41  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] M3Henry updated pull request #7165: [core] Implement SmallVector using std::vector
21:53:57  <andythenorth> there was a patch for arbitrary airports at industries
21:55:13  <peter1138> airports at industries?
21:55:17  <peter1138> Hm
21:56:12  <andythenorth> it was a yexo patch
21:56:27  <andythenorth> related to
21:59:58  <andythenorth> found some nfo for it :P
22:00:13  <andythenorth> I probably have a test grf in forum pms somewhere
22:00:25  <andythenorth> I think it was a wind turbine that a helicopter could land on
22:01:23  *** Flygon has joined #openttd
22:02:19  <m3henry> hopefully that was the last rebase
22:07:04  <peter1138> andythenorth, hmm, source no longer available.
22:07:40  <andythenorth> oh dear :|
22:07:48  <andythenorth> hmm, bedtime also
22:07:51  *** andythenorth has quit IRC
22:11:57  <peter1138> TrueBrain, is it possible to access the old repos somehow?
22:12:21  <peter1138> TrueBrain, or at least long enough to make a clone of it all...
22:12:52  <TrueBrain> sure. what patch do you have that is only there? :p
22:12:54  <peter1138> TrueBrain, I mean the stuff under
22:12:58  <peter1138> Haha
22:13:06  <peter1138>
22:13:10  <peter1138> Was looking at ^
22:13:16  <peter1138> Dunno what it is, never seen it :p
22:13:23  <peter1138> But of course the link is no more.
22:13:39  <TrueBrain> give me a moment .. need to boot my PC and stuff
22:13:43  <peter1138> Oh
22:13:47  <peter1138> It's not that important!
22:14:12  <TrueBrain> nah. small effort :)
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22:17:30  <peter1138> Oh dear.
22:17:48  <peter1138> I need to allow bridges above station tiles :p
22:17:56  *** nielsm has quit IRC
22:20:04  <TrueBrain> right; hg .. where are they hiding ..
22:21:47  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] TrueBrain commented on pull request #7270: Introduce CMake (and removing all other project-related code)
22:23:19  <TrueBrain> wow .. that was 3 server-iterations ago :D
22:23:32  <peter1138> o_O
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22:25:07  <TrueBrain> send you the tarball in PM
22:25:14  <TrueBrain> that is a tarball of the server-side hg repo
22:25:17  <TrueBrain> no clue what is in there, etc
22:25:40  <TrueBrain> possibly the answer to world peace
22:25:41  <peter1138> Thanks.,
22:25:55  <TrueBrain> I assume you can figure out how to get information out of it? :)
22:26:15  <peter1138> $ hg clone airports.hg airports
22:26:29  <peter1138> Gives me a regular tree.
22:26:36  <TrueBrain> cool :D
22:26:37  <peter1138> Of course, it's hg so makes no sense, but other than that... ;)
22:26:48  <TrueBrain> convert to git and put it on GitHub? :P
22:26:51  <peter1138> Heh, hg log doesn't page :D
22:26:56  <peter1138> Praps
22:26:57  <TrueBrain> anyway, enjoy :D If you need any other, lemme know!
22:27:00  <peter1138> Thanks
22:27:11  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] nikolas updated pull request #7086: Change #6173: Update SDL driver to use SDL 2.0
22:27:13  <TrueBrain> no problem
22:27:38  <TrueBrain> we have backups of backups of backups of old servers, so yeah :D Happy they are useful :P
22:28:14  <TrueBrain> "Subscriptions 683"; tnx GitHub .... nice to know .. I follow ... 600+ things ...
22:28:25  <peter1138> Hm, 2010.
22:28:39  <peter1138> Nice :)
22:29:00  <TrueBrain> there was some dust involved :P
22:29:04  <LordAro> TrueBrain: mine said "1000+" and then i decided to close the tab
22:29:23  <TrueBrain> yeah ... I unwatched OpenTTD a while ago :D (well .. I watch releases)
22:29:38  <TrueBrain> I don't understand how watching is useful for these kind of repositories
22:29:47  <LordAro> mm, i should probably unwatch
22:29:53  <TrueBrain> just a notification when something is created
22:29:54  <TrueBrain> that is what I want
22:29:59  <TrueBrain> not all things happening with it from there
22:31:02  <peter1138> Hmm, I think this is just the trunk branch. Odd.
22:31:09  <TrueBrain> no branches in there?
22:31:15  <peter1138> Just "default"
22:32:51  <TrueBrain> no, there are merges in there
22:33:03  <TrueBrain> so I guess somewhere deep down is something of interest
22:33:07  <peter1138> LordAro, hmm...
22:33:11  <peter1138> Oh
22:33:31  <TrueBrain> 16249 for example
22:33:37  <TrueBrain> lot of syncing :D
22:33:38  <LordAro> peter1138: hmm
22:34:28  <Eddi|zuHause> rebasing a branch with existing sync commits is somewhat of a pain
22:34:32  <TrueBrain> so yeah, without an upstream attached to this .. this is difficult to see
22:34:52  <peter1138> Yeah, it's like a "standalone" branch :/
22:34:59  <peter1138> 1 clone per feature? o_O
22:35:02  <peter1138> LordAro,  is it terrible?
22:35:14  <LordAro> peter1138: better than just clipping, i guess
22:35:38  <LordAro> and as long as its only a possibility for the "legacy" docks
22:36:13  <TrueBrain> the diff is pretty big
22:37:15  <TrueBrain> peter1138:
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22:38:00  <TrueBrain> I did a git clone, changed to the latest sync version, removed all the files, copied the hg clone content in there
22:38:03  <TrueBrain> and there you have it :P
22:38:09  <TrueBrain> lost the history, got the content :D
22:38:16  <LordAro> that looks suspiciously like newgrf airports :o
22:38:26  <TrueBrain> possibly because it is? :P
22:38:30  <LordAro> maybe!
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22:39:18  <peter1138> Wait what, we already have newgrf_airport and newgrf_airporttiles?
22:39:21  <TrueBrain> sorry for the patch extension; it was refusing to show .patch inline :P
22:39:36  <peter1138> Thanks TrueBrain
22:39:52  <Eddi|zuHause> yeah, the only thing missing from newgrf airports is state machines
22:39:58  <peter1138> I...
22:40:01  <peter1138> I had no idea.
22:40:04  <peter1138> What does the current stuff do? o_O
22:40:08  <peter1138> Do newgrfs exist?
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22:40:12  <TrueBrain> right, I am off to bed :) Night all!
22:40:16  <Eddi|zuHause> OpenGFX+Airports
22:40:17  <LordAro> opengfx+ airports is a thing
22:40:27  <Eddi|zuHause> mostly, providing alternate graphics and rotating
22:40:30  <LordAro> reskins and rotations
22:40:32  <LordAro> Eddi|zuHause: echo
22:40:36  <Beerbelott> gn TrueBrain
22:40:51  <Eddi|zuHause> LordAro: Otto
22:41:04  <peter1138> Small Seaplane Port
22:41:11  <Eddi|zuHause> (sorry, that was from a silly scene from a comedy movie like 30 years ago)
22:41:51  <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: yeah, airport tiles can be on water, like industry tiles
22:42:05  <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: there's just no check to only allow seaplanes
22:42:06  <peter1138> And this has been there for 9+ years...
22:42:07  <peter1138> WTF...
22:42:28  <peter1138> Oh
22:42:37  <peter1138> Can't place a seaplane port on water...
22:42:47  <Eddi|zuHause> must be on the shore, afaik
22:42:56  <peter1138> No, it must be on land.
22:43:04  <Eddi|zuHause> hu?
22:43:07  <Eddi|zuHause> well, i never tried
22:43:25  <peter1138> Oh, now I'm seeing glitching station signs :/
22:44:56  <peter1138> Hmm, well, time for a debug build.
22:50:36  <peter1138> Urgh, blocked oilrig...
22:50:59  <peter1138> scrollto 0x393fc
22:51:01  <peter1138> erm
22:51:44  <LordAro> peter1138: can't really just remove a tile from the oilrig :p
22:52:05  <peter1138> Oh
22:52:27  <peter1138> Just remembered also that multiple docks can currently 'share' the 3rd tile.
22:52:41  <peter1138> Different stations, different owners even.
22:52:45  <LordAro> oho
22:53:04  <peter1138> And this method fails for oilrigs yes.
22:55:41  <peter1138> With my 'first' method none of that matters.
22:55:44  <peter1138> Hmm
22:56:02  <peter1138> And actually I can easily make all tiles around an oil-rig be docking tiles.
22:56:49  *** Beerbelott has left #openttd
22:57:26  <peter1138> Although that requires a bit extra effort in my "flood" routine.
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23:06:24  <LordAro> peter1138: did you say that the fluidsynth PR didn't make any difference? Can you comment on it as such so it doesn't get merged "accidentally" ?
23:08:12  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #7365: Fix: Fluidsynth should not try to lock sample data in memory
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23:09:23  <Samu> bah... newgrfs solves everything
23:09:35  <Samu> I was wondering where did this go...
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23:11:28  <peter1138> " actually I can easily make all tiles around an oil-rig " ahhahahaa
23:11:30  <peter1138> easily
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23:12:30  <peter1138> GFX_OILRIG_1
23:12:35  <peter1138> I think that's a bad test... so no.
23:12:41  <peter1138> OH....
23:13:53  <peter1138> Industry::GetByTile(tile)->neutral_station != NULL
23:14:08  <peter1138> lol crash
23:15:47  <peter1138> Hmm
23:15:51  <peter1138> Well... that works
23:16:51  <Samu> is there actually a newgrf that disables rail/road crossings?
23:17:29  <peter1138> Probaly just one to test the feature :p
23:18:45  <peter1138> LordAro, my ... earlier version ...
23:18:56  <peter1138> red square inside the depot...
23:20:09  <Samu> so, forbidding multi-engine trains is also another newgrf solves request
23:20:31  <peter1138> definitely.
23:20:31  <Samu> why do you hate the base set so much
23:21:17  <LordAro> blame Chris Sawyer
23:21:52  <Samu> i blame newgrfs
23:22:04  <peter1138> OH MY GOD
23:22:16  <peter1138> Wentbourne in debug mode :/
23:22:45  <LordAro> how many spf ?
23:22:49  <peter1138> :)
23:23:24  <peter1138> Hmm, this ship save is a bit slower, I think.
23:25:07  <peter1138> Not one of these 4,966 ships is an oil tanker.
23:26:10  <Samu> I don't even know how to make a newgrf
23:26:23  <peter1138> 5ms penalty :(
23:27:00  <peter1138> So multiple docks slows the same down again.
23:27:06  <peter1138> I mean, obviously it would, but...
23:27:25  <peter1138> same->game
23:30:28  <peter1138> Hmm, I know what that will be.
23:30:34  <peter1138> Maybe.
23:31:48  <peter1138> Eh, kinda.
23:34:17  <peter1138> Hmm, station rect needs to be updated. Boo.
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23:58:48  <Eddi|zuHause>  <peter1138> " actually I can easily make all tiles around an oil-rig " ahhahahaa <-- what about other newgrf industries which have an oilrig station?

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