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00:12:40 *** Samu has quit IRC 00:55:58 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 01:38:57 *** Flygon has joined #openttd 01:46:19 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 01:46:38 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 02:28:41 *** debdog has joined #openttd 02:32:03 *** D-HUND has quit IRC 03:01:31 *** glx has quit IRC 03:42:38 *** moll has quit IRC 04:44:31 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 04:44:52 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 04:54:24 *** NotSYL has joined #openttd 04:56:16 <NotSYL> I want to apologize for getting angry at this IRC over something that I did not realize was outside their control. Please unban me (SimYouLater), or if you cannot, tell me I am unwelcome and I will leave voluntarily. 06:02:46 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] GabdaZM commented on pull request #7025: Add #6887: Option to show zone inside local authority boundary of towns https://git.io/fjcKY 06:33:47 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] dorobouNeko commented on pull request #7573: Fix #7561: Remove assumption between power and cost https://git.io/fjcKK 06:41:02 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 07:30:01 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 08:01:42 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 08:02:03 *** Supercheese has quit IRC 09:26:49 <andythenorth> well 09:26:51 <andythenorth> lunch? 09:27:50 <Artea> brunch 09:31:10 <Artea> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9M001Babz0o 09:32:58 <peter1138> Slightly early for lunch. 09:33:40 <andythenorth> elevenses then 09:34:03 <peter1138> But it's not 11 09:35:07 <andythenorth> it will be by the time I get off my arse and go downstairs 09:35:15 <andythenorth> all the food is downstairs 09:37:35 <peter1138> I had a croissant for breakfast. Pretty nice. 09:58:09 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 10:38:04 <andythenorth> oof I failed at elevenses 10:38:08 <andythenorth> more like twelveses 10:42:12 <peter1138> How so? 10:42:17 <peter1138> You delayed it? 10:44:16 <andythenorth> I made errors 10:44:30 <andythenorth> of judgement, and of execution 10:48:57 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor updated pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjc3i 10:56:03 <peter1138> Not sure "already exists in ... Locomotion" is a relevant factor. 10:56:10 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor updated pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjc3i 10:57:01 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor commented on pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjcXM 10:59:55 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor commented on pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjcXH 11:00:18 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor commented on pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjcX7 11:03:14 <peter1138> I just had twelveses. One crisp :p 11:04:17 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor updated pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjc3i 11:09:17 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor commented on pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph https://git.io/fjcXN 11:10:22 *** tycoondemon has quit IRC 11:11:21 <andythenorth> buying van insurance is dull 11:12:38 *** Lejving_ has quit IRC 11:18:20 <peter1138> https://www.humblebundle.com/books/python-oreilly-books 11:18:37 <peter1138> Maybe we need that to make nmlc better :p 11:21:17 <LordAro> heh 11:27:39 *** tycoondemon has joined #openttd 11:30:30 <peter1138> Is it lunch time now? 11:31:33 <andythenorth> I think so 11:40:24 <Heiki> many keyboards have a small gap between F8 and F9; hereby I suggest adding an F8½ key there so that we can have a hotkey for building traways 11:40:36 <Heiki> +m 11:40:53 <andythenorth> I have a stupid touchbar, I could actually do that :P 11:41:01 <andythenorth> mac emojibar support? o_O 11:41:39 <peter1138> We could do what Elite Dangerous seems to do every update... wipe out all the control settings... 11:42:35 <andythenorth> yay 12:11:51 *** lpx has quit IRC 12:13:22 *** lpx has joined #openttd 12:27:42 *** spnda has joined #openttd 12:38:38 *** Arveen has quit IRC 13:29:04 *** glx has joined #openttd 13:29:04 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v glx 13:40:24 <Heiki> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.plassertheurer.tampinggame wow 13:42:07 *** Samu has joined #openttd 13:43:58 <andythenorth> wow 13:44:08 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 13:45:26 <Samu> hi 13:47:16 *** andythenorth has quit IRC 13:47:18 <Samu> @rand 9 13:56:37 <Samu> Round 18 beings 13:56:39 <Samu> begins 13:56:53 *** Lejving has joined #openttd 13:57:01 <Eddi|zuHause> Heiki: well, technically, the keycodes go to like F40 or so 14:02:34 * Artea on Let's Listen: Lufia II (SNES) - Sinistral Battle Theme (Extended) @ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s_sQDL2lyCU 14:02:53 <Artea> I <3 Lufia 14:03:04 <Artea> awesome SNES RPG 14:04:38 <Eddi|zuHause> never heard of it 14:05:19 <Artea> awwww 14:05:23 <Artea> you should play then 14:05:30 <Artea> is very good 14:05:41 <Artea> the graphics (for the time it came out) 14:05:49 <Artea> the story, the characters 14:05:58 <Artea> the puzzles 14:08:23 <Eddi|zuHause> i also never had any nintendo stuffs 14:08:52 <Artea> I only had GameBoy 14:09:21 <Artea> just wish had a SNES Classic 14:09:29 <Artea> so can play Lufia on TV 14:13:58 <Artea> Lufia (Germany).zip 14:13:58 <Artea> File Size : 2,17 mb 14:14:01 <Artea> want it, Eddi|zuHause ? 14:14:16 <Eddi|zuHause> i don't think so 14:14:34 <Artea> awww 14:14:53 <Eddi|zuHause> the whole point of retro games is that you pick games that remind you of your childhood... 14:15:03 <Eddi|zuHause> i have literally no connection to that game... 14:15:23 <Artea> well 14:15:33 <Artea> is a good game 14:17:12 *** Alberth has joined #openttd 14:17:12 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o Alberth 14:17:20 <Alberth> o/ 14:17:23 <Artea> hi 14:37:02 <Samu> every AI is having a hard time 14:37:10 <Samu> even with a £500K loan 14:37:26 <Samu> interesting 14:38:37 *** Gumle2 has joined #openttd 14:42:08 <Samu> Convoy and Terron are the two AIs that are doing better in all this 14:45:06 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 14:48:20 <Samu> Im a bit surprised by Convoy, honestly 14:48:40 <Samu> why is it succeeding 14:55:00 <Alberth> it's doing less worse than the others 14:55:30 <Samu> it has poor management 14:55:48 <Samu> it feels unmaintained, buggy even 14:56:04 <Samu> many stopped busses in depots for apparently no reason 14:56:09 <Samu> and yet... 14:56:16 <Samu> it's doing better 15:01:53 <Samu> sometimes no management is better than any management, I've come to notice that 15:02:43 *** andythenorth has joined #openttd 15:02:52 <Samu> but terron is quite the opposite of convoy 15:02:59 <Samu> it manages way too much 15:03:06 <Samu> and it's doing fine 15:03:38 <Samu> sells vehicles in every 2 years or something ,I dunno, but seems to do well for him 15:04:51 <Alberth> they must be doing something right :) 15:04:54 <Alberth> o/ andy 15:05:25 <Samu> DumbAI, an AI that only transports coal trucks 15:05:31 <Samu> is doing alright 15:05:48 <Samu> it even crashes in desert / toyland because of no coal 15:06:00 <Samu> just tells me coal is imba 15:06:09 <Samu> it's a very rudimentar AI 15:06:34 *** Arveen has joined #openttd 15:10:34 <andythenorth> hi 15:13:22 *** Flygon has quit IRC 15:14:15 <glx> coal is the easy money maker 15:16:01 <andythenorth> coal is one way 15:16:08 <andythenorth> pax is an easy moneymaker, bi-directional 15:17:15 <_dp_> you can do 2-way coal 15:17:56 <_dp_> pax still better though unless towns are tiny 15:18:59 *** NotSYL has quit IRC 15:19:26 <_dp_> coz it's much faster to build than 2way coal 15:28:36 * Artea on "Weird" Al Yankovic - Amish Paradise (Parody of "Gangsta's Paradise") @ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOfZLb33uCg 15:42:49 *** Laedek__ has quit IRC 15:43:13 *** Laedek has joined #openttd 16:06:45 *** sla_ro|master has joined #openttd 16:11:18 <andythenorth> V453000: Czech trains pretty awesome style https://railcolornews.com/category/cz-loko-effiliner-1600/ 16:14:00 <Eddi|zuHause> so what's special about that? 16:16:18 <Eddi|zuHause> also, how am i supposed to use a computer when a cat sits right in front of the screen, making no signs of moving any time soon? 16:16:51 <Alberth> either type blind, or give up 16:16:57 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: the overall proportions 16:17:55 <Alberth> alternatively, move the screen high enough such that the cat has a good spot under it without disturbing you 16:19:04 <Eddi|zuHause> that's solving half the problem... it also occupies space i'd normally put the keyboard on 16:20:13 <Alberth> right, perhaps add some office things there so the cat doesn't want to sit there again? 16:21:43 <Alberth> she might find a spot that is even more troubling though :p 16:22:29 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 16:25:57 *** HerzogDeXtEr has joined #openttd 16:35:40 <Eddi|zuHause> ok, the problem is "solved"... as soon as i left the room, the cat moved from the desk... to the chair :p 16:36:34 *** Supercheese has joined #openttd 16:48:23 *** arikover has joined #openttd 16:49:37 <andythenorth> peter1138: so are you -1 to using sprite layers where not essential? 16:49:42 * andythenorth about to do intermodal containers :P 16:51:12 *** Gumle2 has joined #openttd 16:52:43 <V453000> wot :D I'm about to use all 4 layers on all wagons 16:52:51 <andythenorth> V453000: another boss train https://www.railpictures.net/showimage.php?id=696413&key=2993885 16:52:56 <V453000> andythenorth: I've never seen that. 16:53:14 <V453000> the second one is cool 16:53:51 <peter1138> andythenorth, don't ask me, I've never benchmarked it. It's obviously going to be doing more work though. 16:53:54 <V453000> is the drawing going to go nuts with 4 layers or? 16:54:55 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 16:55:01 <andythenorth> probably nobody knows 16:55:19 <andythenorth> I was going to do intermodal containers in layers, then I can share the sprites across wagons 16:55:22 <andythenorth> and have a faster compile 16:55:24 <andythenorth> but eh 16:57:35 <andythenorth> it's harder than I thought, because I have to composite front and rear of wagon over the containers 16:57:44 <V453000> faster compile, I just care about future friendliness, I believe adding a bunch more support for new FIRS5 cargoes is easier through code if I have 10 wagon classes 16:57:47 <andythenorth> so I have to draw masks and generate some extra sprites 16:57:56 <V453000> right 16:58:03 <V453000> unless the container has holes in it :) 16:58:16 <V453000> for the wagon 16:58:19 <andythenorth> different shaped wagons :P 16:58:22 <andythenorth> 'ooof' 16:58:29 <V453000> yeah, that kind of variety is nice 16:58:34 <andythenorth> so you don't composite all your sprites yet V453000? o_O 16:58:36 <V453000> but costly work-wise :) 16:58:41 <V453000> well none so far 16:58:42 <andythenorth> but you totally have the skills :P 16:59:00 <V453000> in subway I have been drawing blue alpha over my flatbd wagons :D 16:59:08 <V453000> preparing them so I could do the code part some day 16:59:33 <andythenorth> composited cargos means MOAR WAGONS is ez 17:00:08 <V453000> eh skills, for example I was planning for my now-not-happening train set that wagons would not have dedicated loading stages, I would draw 9 stages and for example 1st gen wagons would only get stages 1-3, 2nd gen 1-5, 3rd gen 1-7 etc 17:00:15 <V453000> so that the later gens look fuller and more capacity 17:00:33 <V453000> but that's cute theory, actually drawing it in a way to make this work and function properly I am a bit sceptical about 17:00:58 <andythenorth> all very things 17:00:59 <andythenorth> and stuff 17:01:02 <V453000> for example, having heaps clearly and completely overlap the further away wall of the hopper wagon is really important 17:01:05 <V453000> and that's quite some precision 17:01:20 <andythenorth> I do masks and crap 17:01:28 <andythenorth> it took ages to set up, but is super scalable 17:01:47 <V453000> for now I will stay conservative and just do layers + recolouring but no masks+full cargo sprites which are overdrawn by wagon part in top layer 17:01:56 <V453000> right 17:02:05 <V453000> well I would probably do masks if I were doing it in 3D 17:02:09 <V453000> but idk 17:03:05 <V453000> layers + recolouring already means that for example hoppers get 1 empty wagon + 1 cargo sprite in 3 loading stages... that's only 4 spritesheets. I can see myself immediately trying to draw 3 varieties for all of them, and that alone would majorly improve how it looks 17:03:24 <V453000> randoms which just change stripes or alter how the heaps in hoppers look are amazing 17:03:29 <andythenorth> :o 17:03:34 <andythenorth> random hopper cargos :D 17:03:38 * andythenorth hasn't done that yet 17:03:42 <V453000> and once you have the 1st sprite it's not that much work 17:04:00 <V453000> the daunting part is when you have varieties, loading stages, and 30 different cargoes done manually 17:04:05 <andythenorth> innit 17:04:08 <V453000> when a cargo is just a recolour table, damn 17:04:37 <V453000> and there is one more thing, though quite specific for NUTS - for example my building material wagons are usually yellow iirc 17:04:41 <V453000> but goods wagons are gray 17:04:50 <V453000> that means that they are completely separate and can't be combined 17:05:02 <V453000> but for example YETI and I believe some versions of FIRS didn't have goods 17:05:15 <V453000> yet the building materials didn't use containers etc 17:05:40 <V453000> if I have layers, I can easily define which cargoes can be on the flatbed without having to duplicate sprites just to change the colour of the wagon base 17:05:44 <andythenorth> oh the devzone cert expired? 17:05:53 <V453000> yes 17:06:27 <andythenorth> false colours https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/iron-horse/repository/entry/src/graphics/pony/box_car_pony_gen_6C.png 17:06:30 <andythenorth> repainted in compile 17:06:33 <andythenorth> makes 3 wagons 17:06:52 <andythenorth> I have missed V453000 17:06:56 <andythenorth> automate all things! 17:07:33 <V453000> :) 17:18:56 <Samu> convoy failed later on 17:19:04 <Samu> did not replace his old busses 17:20:32 <Samu> Tried to play Path of Exile with 24 OpenTTDs open 17:20:40 <Samu> bad idea 17:22:02 <Samu> i want a new cpu, a 32 core would suffice 17:22:11 <Samu> give me money 17:23:06 *** Progman has joined #openttd 17:25:10 <Samu> :) 17:25:39 <Samu> I can't do anything with the computer 17:25:50 <Alberth> read a book 17:26:00 <Samu> must wait for the ais to complete £10M 17:26:14 <Samu> ewww... reading books... 17:26:31 <Samu> unless it's something I really want to read, no thx 17:27:13 <peter1138> Read a book you really want a read... 17:28:15 <Samu> terron also failed 17:28:37 <Samu> most successful Ais, failing 17:28:51 <Samu> i got a feeling, no one is gonna finish 17:29:08 <LordAro> read a book on testing 17:29:11 <LordAro> or AI design 17:29:32 <peter1138> Or Python ;-) 17:31:13 <peter1138> Hmm, such a long list of parties. 17:32:31 <peter1138> Change UK - The Independent Group, Conservative and Unionist Party, Green Party, Labour Party, Liberal Democrats, The Brexit Party, The Socialist Party of Great Britain, UK European Union Party (UKEUP), UK Independence Party (UKIP), and... three independents. 17:37:03 <andythenorth> Peter Party? 17:40:55 <peter1138> Nah, too busy mountainbiking. 17:41:04 <peter1138> Which I am about to get ready for. 17:41:24 <peter1138> Hmm, 90% chance of rain O_o 17:44:12 <Eddi|zuHause> "UKEUP" is that intentionally close to "UKIP"? 17:45:00 <Eddi|zuHause> peter1138: there are some 30 odd parties up for vote in germany 17:49:53 <Eddi|zuHause> of which like 13 made it in last time, after a high court overturned both a 5% and a 3% entry barrier 17:50:51 <Eddi|zuHause> 5% barrier is usual for elections in germany, to avoid a too fractured parliament. but the court said that argument doesn't count for the eu parliament 17:51:37 <Eddi|zuHause> you need like 0.6% for one seat 17:53:21 <Eddi|zuHause> (this number will be different for each EU member state, as the seats don't proportionally scale with population) 17:53:43 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 17:55:00 <Wolf01> o/ 17:56:33 <Eddi|zuHause> story doesn't end there, because germany tried to push for an EU election reform, mandating a 3% barrier in each member state. which all the states passed, except for germany itself, where the smaller opposition parties went like: "are you crazy? we're not changing this so close to the election" 17:58:11 *** frosch123 has joined #openttd 17:58:17 <Eddi|zuHause> (iirc this was bundled with some other stuff, like which countries would get which of the UK seats in case brexit actually happened) 18:02:28 <frosch123> can the uk write in their last will, who should get the seats? 18:03:07 <peter1138> Off out now, see you later. 18:04:41 <andythenorth> bai 18:08:52 <Samu> aha. the first game is complete! Convoy reaches £10M after bankrupting the first time 18:13:26 *** Gumle2 has quit IRC 18:17:43 <Wolf01> Meh, disabled extensions again even with the extension fix 18:34:33 *** cesar[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** grag[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** patrickm[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** VoId23[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** jact[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** ciet[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** twom[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** hylshols7qui[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** remmalj[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** tops[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** fiddeldibu[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** Meiki has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** glothit7ok[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** yoltid[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** lapav[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** ist5shreawf[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** ookfof[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** pothyurf[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** labs[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** buggeas40d[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** nartir[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** blim[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** iarp[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** khavik[m] has quit IRC 18:34:33 *** ad5twoknebor[m] has quit IRC 18:34:34 *** olmvnec[m] has quit IRC 18:34:34 *** godva[m] has quit IRC 18:34:34 *** cawal[m] has quit IRC 18:34:34 *** yur3shmukcik[m] has quit IRC 18:34:34 *** dag[m] has quit IRC 18:38:12 <Wolf01> Botnet? 18:39:01 <spnda> yeah I was wondering why they all had that [m] behind their name 18:39:05 <LordAro> matrix 18:39:08 <Samu> recessions have a much bigger impact on inflation enabled games 18:39:12 <Samu> interesting 18:39:33 <Samu> profits go right into negative 18:40:26 *** khavik[m] has joined #openttd 18:53:27 *** Progman has quit IRC 18:55:46 <frosch123> they were looking for [f] 18:56:31 <Eddi|zuHause> to pay respects? 18:59:57 <Wolf01> @seen __ln__ 18:59:57 <DorpsGek> Wolf01: __ln__ was last seen in #openttd 43 weeks, 2 days, 22 hours, 54 minutes, and 57 seconds ago: <__ln__> TrueBrain: also, how hard can it be to figure out my comment COULD be related to a repo that was mentioned on the previous line? 19:00:10 <Wolf01> Hmmm 19:00:43 <Eddi|zuHause> i doubt he'll come back any time soon 19:01:02 <Eddi|zuHause> after how that conversation ended... 19:02:56 <Wolf01> Too much people ragequits 19:03:19 <LordAro> that wasn't a ragequit 19:03:23 <LordAro> that was TB banning him 19:07:08 <andythenorth> oof 19:10:55 *** gelignite has joined #openttd 19:11:32 *** tokai|noir has joined #openttd 19:11:32 *** ChanServ sets mode: +v tokai|noir 19:18:14 *** tokai has quit IRC 19:22:02 <Samu> lol 155 days 19:22:11 <Samu> inflation on loan makes these absurd results 19:24:33 <Samu> this is the last time I test inflation 19:24:40 <andythenorth> nielsm: yo 19:26:34 <nielsm> jo 19:28:06 <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] michicc updated pull request #7572: GDI engine for font glyph rendering as a replacement for FreeType (take 2) https://git.io/fjngD 19:29:30 <andythenorth> nielsm: so where's the draft docs again? 19:30:27 <nielsm> the industry properties are not updated at all 19:30:27 <nielsm> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Industries#Industry_properties 19:31:26 <nielsm> the produce block should be "finished" https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Produce 19:31:27 <andythenorth> ok, I read 19:31:32 <nielsm> but I'm not sure if the example is too long 19:32:09 <andythenorth> the nfo docs are all done iirc? 19:32:14 <nielsm> yeah 19:32:21 *** sla_ro|master has quit IRC 19:34:05 <andythenorth> example is a bit long, but I'm not minded to rewrite it 19:34:31 <andythenorth> just warehouse_prod_cb1 switch is quite overwhelming 19:35:45 *** spnda has quit IRC 19:36:00 <andythenorth> ok so props, we deprecated some? 19:36:04 <nielsm> yeah I was trying to think of something not entirely contrived or everything would be too simple to show off the important bits 19:36:05 <andythenorth> prod_cargo_types 19:36:08 <andythenorth> accept_cargo_types 19:36:10 <andythenorth> prod_multiplier 19:36:18 <andythenorth> input_multiplier_1 19:36:19 <nielsm> yea 19:36:19 <andythenorth> input_multiplier_2 19:36:21 <andythenorth> input_multiplier_3 19:36:25 <andythenorth> deprecated 19:36:29 <andythenorth> cargo_types 19:36:30 <andythenorth> added 19:36:39 <andythenorth> not just deprecated, removed 19:37:04 <andythenorth> so there's probably a wiki format for NML < 0.5 19:37:11 <andythenorth> in the props table 19:37:37 <nielsm> I couldn't figure out how to put a < in the template instantiation 19:37:47 <andythenorth> or are old props just deleted? 19:37:49 <andythenorth> I don't know 19:37:50 <nielsm> < just showed up literally 19:38:01 <nielsm> I think keep them for now 19:38:12 <nielsm> since there's still nml 0.4 projects around 19:38:31 <andythenorth> there's also a format for the OpenTTD version, I guess we need that 19:38:37 <andythenorth> quite faffy isn't it :D 19:38:39 *** Gumle2 has joined #openttd 19:38:48 <andythenorth> also we need a version of https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Changes_0.4 19:39:37 <andythenorth> oh 0.5 is not released 19:39:59 <andythenorth> ok I'm confused as usual :P 19:40:55 <andythenorth> looks like 16 cargos is 0.4.5? 19:41:00 <andythenorth> no changelog 19:41:11 <nielsm> no idea :/ 19:41:45 <andythenorth> I'm going by dates https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/releases 19:41:45 <nielsm> but a syntax break like this warrants a bigger version increase 19:41:54 <andythenorth> planetmaker is this thing on? :) 19:49:50 <andythenorth> yeah I assumed it would be 0.5 19:49:56 <andythenorth> assumptions = fail :P 19:49:58 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 19:51:51 <andythenorth> can't find an established format for deprecating 19:52:18 <frosch123> andythenorth: it's just the old version 19:52:42 <andythenorth> so just [0.4.4] or so? 19:52:46 <frosch123> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:General#General_variables <- like htere for snowline_height 19:52:55 <frosch123> 0.2: foo 19:52:57 <frosch123> 0.3: bar 19:53:12 <frosch123> also, i second that the new industry syntax needs a 0.5 19:53:13 <andythenorth> yes 19:53:18 <andythenorth> and yes 19:53:54 <andythenorth> I also found "As of NML 0.3, do not use this. Use cargo_[dis]allow_refit (see below) instead." 19:54:00 <andythenorth> which is just plain text 19:54:15 *** Alberth has left #openttd 19:54:44 <frosch123> i think nml 0.3 predates the wiki 19:54:51 <frosch123> so, if noone found it, noone added the icon 19:54:59 <andythenorth> ok let's do cargo_types first, then mark up deprecated 19:55:10 * andythenorth prepares to battle with wiki 19:55:15 *** Gustavo6046 has quit IRC 19:57:02 *** Gumle2 has quit IRC 19:58:31 *** Gustavo6046 has joined #openttd 19:59:43 <andythenorth> https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Industries#Industry_properties 19:59:46 <andythenorth> 'cargo_types' 19:59:51 <andythenorth> is that accurate? 20:00:44 <andythenorth> frosch123 so bump to 0.5? 20:00:51 <andythenorth> the genie is already out of the bottle, but eh 20:02:27 <frosch123> is there an explicit version in nml somewhere? 20:02:33 <frosch123> i thought it's just the tag somewhen 20:02:45 <andythenorth> I think it's just the tag afaict 20:02:53 <Eddi|zuHause> the "major" version bump isn't really about the new syntax, but about the removal of the old syntax 20:02:55 <andythenorth> might be setup.py I'll look 20:03:00 <frosch123> well, i would wait for the tag until pm confirms that there is a farm :p 20:03:10 <frosch123> no point in a tag that does not compile 20:03:39 <frosch123> it may need new .devzone stuff or whatever 20:03:51 <andythenorth> 0.4.5 is already shipped though? 20:03:53 <Eddi|zuHause> (which i still think is unnecessary, there wouldn't have needed to be put much effort in to keep the old syntax working) 20:04:10 <frosch123> andythenorth: 0.4.5 is a year old? 20:04:16 <andythenorth> did I misread dates? 20:04:22 <andythenorth> oic 20:04:30 <andythenorth> that makes a lot more sense 20:04:33 <andythenorth> good 20:04:47 <andythenorth> 0.5 then :D 20:05:34 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: iirc the plan was to make a maintenance release and a new bumped release around the time of the openttd release, but i guess that ship sailed... 20:06:52 <andythenorth> ok is this better? https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Industries 20:07:06 <andythenorth> not all done yet 20:07:42 *** gelignite has quit IRC 20:08:28 <Samu> I'm getting weird results 20:08:41 <Samu> in 90 days a company makes £10M in value 20:08:49 <Samu> due to loan+inflation 20:08:54 <Samu> I think I'm gonna repeat this 20:09:15 <Eddi|zuHause> btw, cat still hasn't moved from the chair... 20:09:54 <Samu> man, i dunno what to do 20:10:07 <Samu> re-do this round without inflation? 20:10:36 <Samu> or keep at it 20:11:10 <andythenorth> ouch wiki formatting bites :( 20:11:12 <Samu> what the heck, i'll keep at it 20:11:16 <nielsm> change the rule so the goal 10M is also affected by inflation? 20:11:44 <Samu> that means i'd have to work on the GS 20:12:49 <Samu> it's gonna be something on my to-do list 20:13:02 *** Progman has joined #openttd 20:14:21 <andythenorth> nielsm: was there a more complex version of cargo_types with ratios per cargo? 20:14:26 <andythenorth> or did I talk you out of that? 20:14:35 <andythenorth> (for produced) 20:14:51 <Eddi|zuHause> andythenorth: i can't put my finger on it, but the layout/phrasing seems... off 20:14:55 <Samu> i would have to re-do all rounds where I played with inflation on 20:15:15 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: refresh, to be sure you're not looking at a broken version 20:15:23 <andythenorth> but yeah, writing docs, not my strong point 20:15:23 <Samu> but indeed, these results are skewed 20:15:29 <Samu> doesn't look fair 20:16:15 <Samu> ok, stopping all openttds... what has to be done, has to be done 20:16:20 <Samu> :( 20:16:35 <Eddi|zuHause> maybe make a separate table for entries removed in 0.5? 20:16:41 <andythenorth> Eddi|zuHause: maybe 20:16:52 <andythenorth> seems nobody really knows, so maybe we just invent new? 20:17:22 <andythenorth> separately we need this for 0.5 https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Changes_0.4 20:17:42 * andythenorth afk a bit 20:17:49 <Eddi|zuHause> also, green doesn't seem to be a fitting colour for "removed in this version" 20:18:05 <nielsm> andythenorth yes, there is the classic callback-less method of a input-to-output multiplier matrix 20:19:01 <nielsm> accept_cargo("IORE", produce_cargo("STEL", 1), produce_cargo("SLAG", 0.25)) 20:21:25 <Samu> Round 5 and Round 12 had inflation turned on 20:21:29 <Samu> must re-do them 20:21:34 <andythenorth> I'd better add those 20:22:28 <Samu> but for now, I'm restarting round 18, without inflation 20:22:39 <Samu> so boring! 20:24:17 <andythenorth> nielsm: I've updated cargo_type https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Industries#Industry_properties 20:24:25 <andythenorth> not sure how to make it really clear 20:24:30 <andythenorth> done > perfect 20:25:41 <nielsm> yeah it's a complex expression that's not well suited for a small table cell to explain :P 20:26:06 <nielsm> might be best to make a full section somewhere on the page to explain the expression syntax 20:26:19 <andythenorth> hmm 20:26:40 <nielsm> and well the rule isn't so much how many parts are to the array, but how many different cargo labels appear in it 20:27:11 * andythenorth awaiting inspiration :) 20:27:24 <andythenorth> I found it really easy to understand, in the final format, after all the initial debate 20:27:27 <andythenorth> but hard to explain :P 20:28:22 * Wolf01 going to bed 20:28:33 *** Wolf01 has quit IRC 20:36:13 *** hylshols7qui[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:13 *** glothit7ok[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:14 *** ist5shreawf[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:15 *** ad5twoknebor[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:15 *** remmalj[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:16 *** lapav[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:17 *** olmvnec[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:18 *** buggeas40d[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:18 *** yoltid[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:19 *** yur3shmukcik[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:20 *** tops[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:20 *** fiddeldibu[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:21 *** ookfof[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:25 *** Meiki has joined #openttd 20:36:25 *** blim[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:26 *** cawal[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:27 *** twom[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:27 *** pothyurf[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:28 *** dag[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:29 *** godva[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:30 *** iarp[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:30 *** nartir[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:31 *** ciet[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:32 *** grag[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:32 *** jact[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:33 *** cesar[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:34 *** labs[m] has joined #openttd 20:36:36 <frosch123> @mode +R 20:36:36 *** DorpsGek sets mode: +R 20:37:30 <LordAro> frosch123: not a spam attack 20:37:34 <LordAro> i don't think 20:37:50 <LordAro> just matrix people rejoining 20:37:56 <LordAro> maybe. 20:38:03 <debdog> ahh, hence the [m] 20:38:15 <LordAro> actually, i don't trust any of those nicks at all 20:38:37 <LordAro> and all from the same /96 20:39:09 <LordAro> i didn't notice them joining originally.. 20:39:45 <frosch123> i saw the movie, but no idea waht you mean with matrix 20:39:51 <frosch123> but yes, they are all on the same node 20:39:52 <FLHerne> LordAro: All from the same bridge isn't surprising, if it's really Matrix 20:39:59 <LordAro> frosch123: https://matrix.org/blog/index 20:40:05 <frosch123> dockers or something 20:40:23 <frosch123> is that the new mattermore? 20:40:34 <LordAro> something like that 20:40:41 <FLHerne> frosch123: It's pretty much an attempt to recreate IRC, but modern 20:42:00 <FLHerne> Massively multi-user chat, but with support for inline pictures, VOIP, webcams etc. 20:42:15 <glx> ah like discord 20:42:27 <FLHerne> [alternatively, like a FOSS Skype protocol] 20:42:30 <FLHerne> Or that 20:42:46 <FLHerne> Anyway, you can bridge IRC <-> Matrix channels 20:42:54 <FLHerne> So all the [m 20:45:43 <FLHerne> ] users are actually clients connected to some Matrix channel that's bridged to this one 20:49:11 <nielsm> andythenorth: I wrote a full section on the cargo_types array 20:50:29 <andythenorth> awesome 20:50:48 <andythenorth> shall we add a final note 20:50:59 <andythenorth> "for more complex production, see the produce cb" 20:51:00 <andythenorth> ? 20:51:09 <nielsm> fixed some bad wikicode :P 20:53:46 <andythenorth> thanks :) 20:55:59 <nielsm> and also crosslinked "produce-block" in the callbacks list to the page describing produce blocks now :P 20:57:09 <andythenorth> cool 21:01:28 <SpComb^> matrix should get some cloaking or reverse-dns action going for those IPv6 bridges, might look more legit 21:03:30 <nielsm> andythenorth: there's also several of the variables that changed, but I'd rather wait to do those until tomorrow 21:05:50 <andythenorth> ok 21:05:54 <andythenorth> I think it's bedtime 21:09:53 *** andythenorth has left #openttd 21:30:52 *** frosch123 has quit IRC 21:33:57 <dwfreed> LordAro: it is indeed matrix 21:34:54 <LordAro> dwfreed: nicks look very spammy though 21:35:02 <dwfreed> it's not 21:35:11 <dwfreed> they idle in here like everybody else 21:35:21 <dwfreed> the bridge went down at 18:34 UTC; this is just the bridge coming back up 21:35:35 <LordAro> if you say so 21:35:46 <LordAro> they do look like random strings of letters & numbers though 21:35:50 <dwfreed> rather than 2,000 reconnections at once, it does one ever 3 seconds 21:35:58 <dwfreed> people have weird matrix usernames 21:36:19 *** LordAro sets mode: -R 21:36:38 <dwfreed> the bridge sets the username and homeserver as the realname 21:36:39 <dwfreed> eg: 21:36:40 <dwfreed> 2019-05-08 21:36:12 [TrekWebOFTC] -!- jact[m] [~jactopeni@2001:470:1af1:101::36cc] 21:36:40 <dwfreed> 2019-05-08 21:36:12 [TrekWebOFTC] -!- ircname : @jact:openintents.modular.im 21:37:07 <LordAro> i'm more concerned by one like ad5twoknebor 21:37:26 <dwfreed> 2019-05-08 21:37:15 [TrekWebOFTC] -!- ad5twoknebor[m] [~ad5twokne@2001:470:1af1:101::33c7] 21:37:26 <dwfreed> 2019-05-08 21:37:15 [TrekWebOFTC] -!- ircname : @ad5twoknebor:kde.org 21:37:29 <LordAro> the shorter ones are indeed not suspicious 21:37:52 <LordAro> but regardless, i defer to your judgement :) 21:40:53 *** nielsm has quit IRC 21:45:44 *** Wormnest has quit IRC 21:46:13 <Samu> remind me to re-do rounds 5 and 12 without inflation 22:18:37 *** Progman has quit IRC 22:43:18 <arikover> ²quit 22:43:25 *** arikover has quit IRC 22:51:02 *** Leftie has joined #openttd 22:54:11 *** Leftie has left #openttd 23:03:20 *** HerzogDeXtEr has quit IRC 23:12:42 <Artea> [00:12:24] [cesar[m] VERSION reply]: matrix-appservice-irc, part of the Matrix.org Network 23:55:18 *** Supercheese has quit IRC