Log for #openttd on 16th June 2019:
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06:08:27  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor updated pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph
06:11:14  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor commented on pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph
06:13:13  <DorpsGek_II> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kiwitreekor updated pull request #7575: Feature: Add industry production graph
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06:13:48  <andythenorth> moin
06:17:19  <LordAro> o/
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06:24:25  <andythenorth> feldbahn intro dates, 1860, 1900, 1950, 2000
06:25:05  <andythenorth> might drop the 2000, there's no real stats progression compared to 1950, just 100HP and a few pixels change
06:25:40  <andythenorth> cuts about 48 vehicles out
06:25:54  * andythenorth bear coding
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06:44:24  <Eddi|zuHause> there's the CarGoTram for 2000-ish?
06:50:46  <andythenorth> yes, that's an actual tram though
06:51:11  <andythenorth> Hog already has a set of freight trams, slightly based on RL
06:51:28  <andythenorth> I'm keeping those, because they're 'done' :P
06:52:01  * andythenorth does some maths
06:52:06  <andythenorth> 12 types
06:52:19  <andythenorth> @calc 12 * 2 * 2 * 4
06:52:19  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 192
06:52:36  <andythenorth> 2 lengths, 2 power types, 4 generations = far too many
06:52:49  <andythenorth> @ calc 12 * 2 * 2
06:52:49  <DorpsGek> andythenorth: 48
06:53:03  <andythenorth> 2 lengths, 1 power type, just 2 generations
06:53:04  <andythenorth> better
06:53:20  <nielsm> power type = diesel or electric?
06:53:37  <nielsm> maybe just decree that 3rd generation is a switch from diesel to electric?
06:54:11  <andythenorth> I could do that
06:54:30  <andythenorth> it's a lot of tedious track conversion though :)
07:01:27  <andythenorth> just 2 generations would be 'efficient'
07:01:40  <andythenorth> but it makes balancing against other vehicle types tricky :D
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13:31:30  <spnda> Where is this window defined? I can't seem to find it...
13:32:08  <spnda> Right after I ask this, I find it.... wow..
13:52:25  <Eddi|zuHause> that's how teddy bear coding works
13:52:44  <Eddi|zuHause> sometimes you have to say a thing outloud for it to properly manifest itself
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15:49:07  <spnda> Where are files read which are listed in the fios gui to get the details?
15:51:24  <spnda> Or else, how does LoadCheckData work?
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16:09:10  <nielsm> spnda: the entire load/save infrastructure is rather complex and in general you should not need to touch the middle layers of it ever
16:16:38  <spnda> soo.. what would I do if I want to add something like the start date or map size to a file?
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16:38:06  <peter1138> What kind of file?
16:38:19  <peter1138> If it's a savegame, it will already have map size. Not sure about start date.
16:42:05  <nielsm> doesn't look like start date is saved
16:42:19  <nielsm> you can check the earliest inaugurated_year for companies
16:42:36  <nielsm> (in singleplayer that will be the start date, in multiplayer all bets are off)
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16:43:54  <peter1138> Might be part of the game log :-)
16:44:27  <peter1138> Which is not machine readable, I guess.
16:44:47  <nielsm> I think it is
16:45:46  <nielsm> but it doesn't contain a game date
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16:48:24  <nielsm> or wait... isn't it part of the game settings?
16:49:14  <nielsm> GameSettings::game_creation.starting_year
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16:50:40  <nielsm> spnda: yeah try _load_check_data.settings.game_creation.starting_year
16:51:35  <LordAro> that's not from the savegame though? just the current setting?
16:51:49  <nielsm> no that's from the savegame
16:51:59  <LordAro> well fair enough :)
16:52:11  <nielsm> _load_check_data is a global containing data from a savegame partially loaded via LoadCheckData()
16:52:21  <nielsm> including the game settings
16:53:53  <nielsm> and starting year _is_ displayed....
16:54:01  <nielsm> so I'm not sure what spnda's question is about
16:54:10  <spnda> hmm ok, I'll check that. Will have to see how those values are saved to the file though.
16:54:25  <nielsm> why?
16:54:34  <nielsm> I think we have an x-y problem here
16:56:04  <nielsm> fios_gui.cpp around like 498 is pretty clear about starting year being saved to the game and then displayed in the load game window when selecting a savegame file
16:56:56  <nielsm> it _is_ being saved, and it's being saved as part of the greater "game creation settings" structure which contains (among other things) all the setting chosen in the new game window
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16:58:33  <nielsm> the way it's defined as something to be saved is by being declared in the settings.ini file, which is used to generate the settings.h file (and possibly more?) during build, and this provides a table of items to load/save from a file, their data size and format, location, saveload-versions they are valid in, and which in-memory structure to load/save the value from
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17:55:24  <andythenorth> o/
17:55:32  <Markk> \o
18:10:21  <peter1138> . /o\
18:17:20  <LordAro> |o|
18:23:49  <spnda> oo
18:59:30  <spnda> When I want a different type of game to have a pop up at the start and track the games progress and when it saves into a different file, should I make a new gamemode? (From openttd.h, line 18)
19:01:16  <nielsm> what?
19:02:46  <nielsm> the game mode is how the game systems are operating, whether they are in "main menu" mode, in "playing the game" mode, in "scenario editor" mode, or some special init stuff
19:03:03  <nielsm> if you want to change the rules of the game slightly, introducing a new game mode is probably the wrong solution
19:03:16  <spnda> ok ok, so what would you suggest?
19:03:27  <nielsm> I don't understand what you want to do
19:05:34  <spnda> Just an idea I had to have challenges. Something like "Make 100.000$ by the year 1990". New button to load up a map and then ingame also have a window for progress tracking. When completed, you can continue it as a normal game, but you get achievement points like the highscore table.
19:05:56  <nielsm> that sounds like you should make a Game Script
19:06:19  <nielsm> maybe it needs some additional support features in the GS API to do some of the things (high score table)
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19:16:10  <andythenorth> that is a GS pretty much
19:16:23  <andythenorth> spnda: have you tried any gamescripts? :)
19:16:57  <spnda> No, never even played with any
19:19:31  <andythenorth> there are 3 or 4 cargo goal scripts
19:19:38  <andythenorth> try one of those to get ideas :)
19:19:50  <andythenorth> NoCarGoal, Busy Bee, Silicon Valley are 3 I use
19:23:46  <spnda> When using a gamescript, you wouldn't have the option of using maps/games from other people with a given challenge. You basically get something random every single time. Also unsure on how well this would work when you save a game and later reload it...
19:24:23  <nielsm> you mean you want to take an existing save of an in-progress game and apply a GS to it?
19:24:35  <andythenorth> this sounds more like a scripted scenario
19:24:51  <spnda> could be
19:24:52  <andythenorth> what happened to New Scenario Format?
19:24:58  <nielsm> (you can select which GS to use yourself, you can configure it yourself, and depending on how the GS is programmed it doesn't have to be random)
19:25:09  <andythenorth>
19:26:03  <nielsm> also GS do have functions to save its own data to the savegame file, they can definitely resume from a save/reload if programmed correctly
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19:34:33  <spnda> I think, GS still make sence if you want to have a few goals in your ordinary game... Though I don't feel that integration is good enough to have a real challenge. A challenge could go over a rather long time, maybe disable a few features (No airplanes, no trains) and has multiple different windows to see progress, your challenge, and highscores.
19:35:17  <spnda> Also challenges could give the option to create scripted scenarios. Maybe a company which is not making any profit and you need to get the company to make profit. As an example. I feel that could give much more options ot the player.
19:36:56  <nielsm> I agree GS needs a proper way to configure specific scenarios
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