Log for #openttd on 7th January 2022:
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00:12:08  *** Wolf01 has quit IRC
00:16:57  <Gustavo6046> hmm
00:17:14  <Gustavo6046> what if spacing out timetables with ctrl-clicking Start Date doesn't work because you have to ctrl-click the "Set Date" button *after* it?
00:17:15  <Gustavo6046> Or both?
00:17:30  <Gustavo6046> Surely the c++ source would tell us more about it
00:18:42  <Gustavo6046> Also, is there no 2cc road vehicle newGRF with mail trucks?
00:18:45  <Gustavo6046> I do like trams
00:18:55  <Gustavo6046> Just not sure what the best way to station them out is
00:24:16  <Gustavo6046> Augh, it doesn't work with my ships
00:24:28  <Gustavo6046> It's so weird
00:54:55  <Gustavo6046> hmm
00:54:57  <Gustavo6046> when to bus, and when to tram?
01:07:14  <Gustavo6046> so those three cities I want to link with a small railway... is it worth having a train for these? I'm also having a bit of a hard time picturing how I'm going to lay out the stations and the rails connecting the cities. There's not a lot of room for two-lane rails and fancy junctions...
01:07:27  <Gustavo6046> I mean, that is some of the fun part of OpenTTD, absolutely! Figuring out the layouts
01:33:06  <supermop_Home> what does hardware acceleration do?
01:34:04  <supermop_Home> definitely worth a train, but probably a simple line
01:44:52  <_aD> Gustavo6046: defo worth trains IMO. n.b. I am a raving train fan.
01:45:14  <Gustavo6046> right! but it's 2cc trains and they're expensive and the running costs are pretty big
01:45:19  <Gustavo6046> supermop_Home, so one train?
01:45:28  <_aD> aha. No harm in growing with buses first :-)
01:45:28  <Gustavo6046> also, hardware acceleration I think moves some of the rendering work to OpenGL and the GPU
01:45:40  <_aD> hardware acceleration replaces the software engines in the trains with CPUS.
01:45:46  <Gustavo6046> growing with buses? o.o
01:45:50  <Gustavo6046> that sounds inappropriate
01:45:54  <Gustavo6046> almost
01:45:59  <_aD> speculate to accumulate!
01:46:10  <_aD> trams, perhaps.
01:47:55  <Gustavo6046> trammies! :D
02:18:11  <_aD> What train drivers wear to bed, when they need a rest from the trains.
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03:20:41  <supermop_Home> who wants to go on vacation?
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05:24:20  <Gustavo6046> ah
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13:03:20  <TrueBrain> w00p, a basic flow is working from RPN to NewGRF .. now to clean this stuff up and add functionality :P
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13:07:18  <peter1138> Okay, brain is failing.
13:07:29  <TrueBrain> AM NOT
13:07:30  <TrueBrain> :P
13:12:10  <peter1138> Trying to work out what percentage to add on a value to get a given margin. i.e. add 25% for a 20% margin
13:17:54  <TrueBrain> math hard, yes :P
13:18:00  <TrueBrain> Read past end of pseudo-sprite
13:18:01  <TrueBrain> hmm
13:18:03  <TrueBrain> that also sounds like a fail :)
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13:20:54  <glx> sounds like wrong sprite length
13:22:34  <TrueBrain> that is really unlikely, given that is all auto-calculated :)
13:22:42  <TrueBrain> I mostly get this error when I byte-encode the payload wrong
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13:26:43  <TrueBrain> synthing advanced varaction2 is tricky, as it wants to know the last entry in the chain (the 0x20 flag) .. and fields are not of a prefixed length .. hmmmmmm
13:31:10  <TrueBrain> well, I don't ever use div or modulo, so I guess I can cheat my way in :)
13:44:19  <glx> yeah fields depend on flags
13:45:48  <TrueBrain> right, next issue ... NewGRF is nothing like an AST or an RPN .. how do a synth a complex rhs ... eeeuuuuuhhhhhhh
13:46:02  <TrueBrain> guess I need a temporary register for that
13:46:41  <glx> one or more temporary registers yes
13:47:41  <glx> mixed with operands reordering
13:48:36  <glx> like a + (b * c) is easier to write in nfo as (b * c) + a
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13:49:51  <TrueBrain> RPN remember; I don't have that issue :P
13:50:48  <glx> yeah you can translate the stack with temp registers
13:52:26  <Eddi|zuHause> is that really easier to write?
13:52:33  <glx> advanced varact2 would be nice with some push/pop operators
13:52:46  <TrueBrain> or nesting
13:52:47  <TrueBrain> but it is fine
13:53:03  <TrueBrain> it is just the order of generation, it is not that big of a deal
13:53:07  <TrueBrain> just need to assign a register to it :)
13:54:33  <peter1138> Well, I still can't work it out :p
13:54:52  <Eddi|zuHause> you can have virtual push/pop operations and in a second pass replace them with explicit registers
13:55:27  <peter1138> Is it turing complete yet?
13:55:46  <Eddi|zuHause> there's no loops in NFO
13:55:53  <peter1138> Yet.
13:56:23  <peter1138> (Ever.)
14:03:45  <glx> in theory NML could do loops (with unfolding)
14:03:59  <TrueBrain> so only against constants ;)
14:04:11  <TrueBrain> that still won't make you turing complete :)
14:04:58  <glx> it can work with variables too, but very expensive depending on variable size :)
14:06:14  <TrueBrain> hmm, calculating stack-depth is surprisingly difficult
14:14:04  <TrueBrain> right, now to add code to actually read a register :D
14:14:08  <TrueBrain> might be important .. might not :P
14:29:27  <glx> var7D for constant index, var7B for dynamic index
14:29:50  <TrueBrain> 7C, but I can read the specs, yes :)
14:30:00  <TrueBrain> (at least, I need 7C atm :P)
14:30:06  <TrueBrain> but I had no infra for parameters yet
14:30:16  <TrueBrain> hope it is working as I read the specs .. that is always fingers crossed
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14:34:57  <TrueBrain> meh, I really have to make a new chain for every complex right hand side, don't I? Meh :P
14:35:02  <TrueBrain> was hoping I could keep on chaining advanced varaction2
14:35:31  <TrueBrain> but there is no noop operator
14:35:51  <TrueBrain> that is just sad :P New chains take so many bytes ... as they need a switch-case :)
14:36:21  <glx> you can put everything in the same varact2
14:36:59  <TrueBrain> how? As I said, there is no "noop" operator
14:37:17  <TrueBrain> I can't make a new head mid-chain
14:37:32  <TrueBrain> yeah, "& 0"
14:37:33  <glx> you have rst
14:38:00  <TrueBrain> ah, tnx, that is what I was looking for. That is kinda hiding :P
14:39:14  <glx> only scope change needs a new varact2, but I think temp regs can help here too
14:39:28  <supermop_Home> good morning
14:40:37  <glx> like fill regs with related scope values then chain to self scope varact2 and use regs there
14:44:50  <andythenorth> peter1138 you want a 20% margin on the final price? :P
14:45:51  <andythenorth> so COGS is 80%?
14:46:03  <andythenorth> is it not just multiply COGS by 5/4?
14:46:14  <TrueBrain> how does "grfcodec -d" works :P
14:46:19  <andythenorth> yes
14:47:19  <TrueBrain> with a lot of effort
14:47:24  <TrueBrain> is the correct answer
14:48:01  <TrueBrain> 02 0A 00 89 A8 20 FF 00 00 00 * "}ÿ ÿÿÿÿ" sto 1A 00 FE 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 "ÿÿÿÿý" 00
14:48:10  <TrueBrain> euuh ... what a weird characters :P
14:48:54  <TrueBrain> 02 0A 00 89 A8 20 FF 00 00 00 * 7D FF 20 FF FF FF FF sto 1A 00 FE 00 00 00 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 FF FF FF FF FD 00
14:48:55  <TrueBrain> lot better
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14:58:35  <TrueBrain>   result:outputs ctt:COAL [] industry:colour industry:colour * industry:colour industry:colour * + =
14:58:37  <TrueBrain> gives another result than
14:58:39  <TrueBrain>   result:outputs ctt:COAL [] industry:colour industry:colour industry:colour industry:colour * * + =
14:58:44  <TrueBrain> think I am doing something wrong still :D
14:59:11  <TrueBrain> owh, no, it should
14:59:12  <TrueBrain> duh
14:59:12  <TrueBrain> lol
15:00:28  <TrueBrain> yippie, means this kinda work :) Still need depth-detection, but we can revisit that later :)
15:02:26  <TrueBrain>   result:outputs ctt:COAL [] 12 industry:colour * industry:colour 12 * + =
15:02:27  <TrueBrain> works too
15:02:41  <TrueBrain> what is funny now, that depending on the order of your instructions, things can generate more or less efficient :)
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17:07:16  <supermop_Home> how do i indicate a grf is meant to be static in nml?
17:08:40  <frosch123> in the readme
17:09:03  <frosch123> only humans know what "static newgrf" are
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17:13:55  <supermop_Home> can a static newgrf have parameters?
17:15:04  <frosch123> i guess there is no gui to set them, but they should work in openttd.cfg
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17:45:26  <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/team] srekoslav opened issue #284: [hr_HR] Translator access request
17:57:45  <glx> oh we are in the latest GOG email I received
17:58:08  <frosch123> what? new year's sale?
17:58:30  <glx> more than 30 free games
17:59:49  <glx> and they show 4 of them in the newletter, cave's story secret santa, symphonia, samorost 1 and openttd
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18:26:03  <TrueBrain> Cool :)
18:53:16  <peter1138> Oh of course, rain tomorrow.
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20:12:28  <andythenorth> frosch rage quit early today
20:15:27  <TrueBrain> :(
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21:21:20  <peter1138> Wut
21:21:38  <peter1138> Balls, missed Discovery due to video call :(
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