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10:39:16 <andythenorth> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1008473233844097104/1057246283192074371/image.png 10:39:16 <andythenorth> oh we merged this 😄 10:39:18 <andythenorth> good 10:42:14 <petern> ; looks odd tbh. 10:42:53 <petern> Though we do use it in a few other cases. 10:43:45 <LordAro> mm 10:43:54 <LordAro> also moin 10:44:18 <petern> I'm lazy, all these days off and I'm not cycling :/ 10:46:55 <andythenorth> ; is unusual 10:47:00 <LordAro> also mm 10:47:23 <petern> No. 10:47:35 <petern> So even with 100% desktop scale... it still does this :/ 10:48:32 <dP> andythenorth: will it still say "bad luck" if there is no suitable place at all on the map? 10:48:46 <andythenorth> dunnno 10:48:50 <andythenorth> could be bad luck though 10:48:59 <dP> yeah, on map generation xD 10:49:04 <LordAro> "you generated an unsuitable map, bad luck" 10:49:26 <Pruple> the "; try again" is a little superfluous. Error messages don't usually include advice or instructions, do they? 10:49:51 <petern> Indeed. 10:50:05 <petern> Why does loading a font cause rendering to go weird? 10:50:09 <andythenorth> also you might have no money left to try 😛 10:50:19 <andythenorth> goes it make a branch and PR for a typo? 10:53:12 <LordAro> andythenorth: i thought the error message was distinct from not enough money? 10:53:18 <LordAro> it was supposed to be.. 10:53:21 <petern> Oof, I turned off HW acceleration and now the game crashes on start up. 10:53:26 <petern> "CreateDIBSection failed" 10:53:32 <LordAro> oh dear 10:54:03 <andythenorth> LordAro pretty certain it is, but the helpful advice 'try again' might not be possible 10:54:08 <andythenorth> if was your last dollar 10:57:59 <LordAro> oh i see 11:07:47 <Rubidium> "try again later"? 11:08:00 <Pruple> later than what? 11:09:58 <petern> Oh, whoever played Wentbourne didn't do shared orders. 11:10:15 <Rubidium> "try again later when you have enough money and are willing to gamble that money away on prospecting 11:10:45 <petern> 4833 trains, all with individual orders 😮 11:13:35 <LordAro> i don't think it was "played" as such 11:17:22 <petern> Uh 11:18:39 <petern> Oh dear. 11:21:39 <andythenorth> hmm 11:21:41 <andythenorth> lunch? 11:22:10 <Pruple> yes 11:38:58 <michi_cc[d]> Hmm, how bad would it be to completely ignore the hundreds and hundreds of lines of cargo handling from cargodist and duplicate it similar but slightly different... 11:39:31 <michi_cc[d]> Probably not the best idea, but unfortunately all this cargodist stuff is keyed on station from start to finish, while I need it on order level. 11:39:44 <andythenorth> dist model as content? 😛 11:39:50 <andythenorth> C++ plugin framework? 11:46:11 <LordAro> NoDist 12:02:09 <petern> Is it for cargodest? 12:02:19 <michi_cc[d]> Yes 12:03:03 <petern> Then you don't need to ignore cargodist, you can remove the bits no longer needed. 12:03:13 <michi_cc[d]> Keying all this stuff on StationID is totally fine for a statistical cargo distribution simulation, but if you want to actually route cargo, you need order granularity. 12:03:21 <petern> Yup. 12:04:23 <michi_cc[d]> I'm not sure I want to endure the drama for kicking cargodist out as it will completely wreck the network in existing games. 12:04:45 <petern> Maybe, but I think most people only use CargoDist because it gives them some sort of destination without having to do manual transfers, and would prefer CargoDest. 12:04:48 <reldred> Man it would be good for a laugh 12:05:51 <petern> Ah, my bug was I override OnInit() without calling the base OnInit(). oops. 12:06:06 <andythenorth> cargodist should be off for most players for most cargos 12:06:11 <andythenorth> it's broken 12:06:24 <reldred> TBH I have no problem with cargodist for cargo, cargodest would be cool for passengers 12:13:24 <JGR> michi_cc[d]: What do you mean by order granularity here? 12:15:15 <petern> andythenorth: it doesn't do what you expect doesn't mean it's broken 🙂 12:15:15 <michi_cc[d]> Cargodist sorts and assigns all the cargopackets and links by next station. But for real destination routing, there's a difference between a vehicle going A-B-C and A-B-D, so you need shared order list granularity, not just next station. 12:15:22 <petern> (like subtype refits ;)) 12:15:27 <andythenorth> oh yes 🙂 12:15:39 <andythenorth> I forget things 12:16:15 <andythenorth> petern: do I get a T-shirt with this on it? 12:16:54 <JGR> michi_cc[d]: I see what you mean now. I tried to look at this a couple of times before but never got anywhere useful. 12:17:02 <petern> Saying that, I'm sure loading "Inter Medium" shouldn't do what it does... 12:18:05 <petern> Ignoring removing CargoDist, I'm happy for bits to be duplicated if it means we get closer to CargoDest. 12:20:11 <Merni> Will cargodest be more intelligent about taking routes with more stops if the direct route is overcrowded? :P 12:20:37 <JGR> It does that fine already, if the parameters are set reasonably 12:21:28 <JGR> It's things like skip-stopping patterns which are handled particularly badly 12:22:29 <michi_cc[d]> Non-deterministic conditional orders are also bad for any cargo routing, but would be even more bad for cargodest than cargodist. 12:23:07 <andythenorth> I have seen cdist do 'interesting' things, like route cargo the opposite way to the destination, because there's a connection 12:23:26 <JGR> That is common enough in real life 😛 12:23:40 <andythenorth> time vs. distance 😛 12:24:04 <JGR> The time based stuff which was merged into master recently works quite well 12:28:50 <Merni> JGR: Yeah, this is what I meant -- it always wants to take a non-stop route even if a better route with a few stops (not transfers) is available 12:31:27 <JGR> Cargo just getting on the first acceptable vehicle makes downstream capacity/usage estimation much more difficult 12:32:18 <JGR> The TTDP cargo dist implementation sort of worked that way 12:32:30 <JGR> It was rather difficult to tune 12:46:24 *** klote has joined #openttd 12:46:24 <klote> Hi any one here? 12:50:03 <debdog> funny, how everyone's suddenly getting silent when someone asks a trick question 12:50:26 <debdog> *going 12:52:03 <andythenorth> the logs show nobody here 12:52:13 <andythenorth> nobody talking at all for as much as 15 minutes 12:52:20 <andythenorth> so no, the channel is dead 12:52:25 <andythenorth> give up 12:54:48 <petern> klote: Yes 🙂 12:55:22 <andythenorth> also hi 🙂 12:58:18 <klote> hi hi 12:58:46 <klote> Was hoping some one could help me how to properly setup a dedicated openttd server 12:59:06 <klote> including some form of RCON bot with commands 12:59:51 <michi_cc[d]> There's a whole multiplayer section in this Discord, might be a better place to ask. 13:00:58 <klote> i did 13:01:13 <klote> sadly no one really responds 13:02:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] tpetazzoni commented on issue #10232: [Crash]: Black screen on startup and crash https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/10232 13:07:14 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] James103 commented on issue #10232: [Crash]: Black screen on startup and crash https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/10232 13:10:14 *** ag has quit IRC 13:15:48 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] tpetazzoni commented on issue #10232: [Crash]: Black screen on startup and crash https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/10232 13:16:03 *** Smedles_ has joined #openttd 13:19:17 *** Smedles has quit IRC 13:40:26 <FLHerne> klote: dP runs CityMania so presumably knows that stuff 13:41:14 <FLHerne> klote: you've read https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/docs/multiplayer.md , https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/blob/master/docs/admin_network.md and https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Development/Server%20admin%20port ? 13:42:05 <FLHerne> you're more likely to get answers to specific questions, people don't like committing to open-ended requests for "help" 13:47:52 *** iddi has quit IRC 13:48:55 <dP> CItyMania is not rly a good example, it uses patched server and a custom server runner 13:53:29 <dP> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1008473233844097104/1057295158191857705/Screenshot_from_2022-12-13_22-04-26.png 13:53:29 <dP> I even somewhat moved from commands to web admin lately xD 13:56:57 <klote> FLHerne: Thanks! problem is specific questions are quite hard if i don't really know what i am looking for precisely. the link https://wiki.openttd.org/en/Development/Server%20admin%20port you shared says libaries what does that mean? 13:58:58 <FLHerne> klote: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_(computing) - collection of functions etc. to make writing admin-port clients easier 14:01:21 <FLHerne> rather than writing all the code to send packets etc. yourself 14:01:28 <dP> klote: if you want custom commands you'll need to make an external program that defines their logic, and to communicate from that program to openttd you'll need a library unless you want to implement the admin port protocol yourself 14:02:42 <klote> dP: Ah right, yeah im not a coder. i was hoping there is a program tool that already had those functions 14:02:59 <klote> and only requires configuring 14:04:00 <dP> well, there is stuff like <https://github.com/ropenttd/suds> 14:04:13 <dP> not sure how useful it is for your usecase though 14:07:27 <klote> Will have a look thanks 14:07:54 <TallTyler> petern: Goes it approve #10151 or are you still playing with things or hoping to test other OS renderings first? 14:29:20 *** supermop_Home__ has joined #openttd 14:29:29 <supermop_Home__> good morning 14:33:43 <Pruple> yoyo 14:35:42 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 14:39:23 <petern> TallTyler: Oh yes, I was trying to build with FreeType on Windows so I could fiddle, and then got sidetracked. 14:49:59 *** nielsm has quit IRC 14:58:57 *** nielsm has joined #openttd 15:01:30 *** Tirili has joined #openttd 15:18:13 <dP> ugh, nmlc crops sprites :( 15:18:22 <dP> was hoping to decompile templates 15:19:03 <dP> guess I still can, just more work 15:29:12 *** frosch has joined #openttd 15:29:12 <frosch> dP: there is an option to disable that 15:30:33 <dP> yeah, but I only have grf file to work with 15:30:37 <dP> also, hi :) 15:40:51 * petern fiddles with layouts again 15:46:08 <michi_cc[d]> Oh, a frosch. Quick, hide the chaos we made 🙂 15:53:25 <andythenorth> did you replace cdist yet? 😛 15:57:15 <petern> Hmm, sizing gui to fit strings: takes up less space with English, and about double the width with German... 16:19:52 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN opened pull request #10286: Change: Make vehicle list dropdown buttons resize to fit strings. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10286 16:41:00 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler commented on pull request #10286: Change: Make vehicle list dropdown buttons resize to fit strings. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10286#pullrequestreview-1230826264 16:44:24 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN commented on pull request #10286: Change: Make vehicle list dropdown buttons resize to fit strings. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10286#pullrequestreview-1230828349 16:49:24 *** Flygon_ has quit IRC 16:59:12 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN updated pull request #10286: Change: Make vehicle list dropdown buttons resize to fit strings. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10286 17:02:08 <FLHerne> is anyone doing #10271 (NRT road stops) 17:02:09 <FLHerne> ? 17:06:39 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] hpiirai opened issue #10287: [Bug]: Useless buttons when founding town in game https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/issues/10287 17:08:37 <Heiki> https://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=937308#p937308 “Hiding buttons is easy, since the GUI rewrite. Just somebody has to do it.” but nobody has in almost 12 years ☺ 17:11:20 <petern> It's actually not. 17:11:43 <petern> But I had no idea there was an option to allow founding towns in game. 17:23:45 *** Wolf01 has joined #openttd 17:37:14 *** wallabra_ has joined #openttd 17:37:20 *** wallabra has quit IRC 17:37:25 *** wallabra_ is now known as wallabra 17:38:48 <petern> FLHerne, don't think so. 17:38:59 *** NekoMaster has joined #openttd 17:38:59 <NekoMaster> That options been around for ages now, foudning towns in game 17:52:28 <FLHerne> I'll try doing it then 17:58:27 <TallTyler> Heiki: For hiding buttons, look at how we’ve hidden block signals 18:00:04 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] 2TallTyler approved pull request #10286: Change: Make vehicle list dropdown buttons resize to fit strings. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10286#pullrequestreview-1230889470 18:00:13 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kaomoneus commented on discussion #8397: Daylength https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/discussions/8397 18:01:25 <FLHerne> Pruple: should NRT road stops have different ground sprites for bus vs. truck stations? 18:01:29 <FLHerne> the baseset seems to 18:01:45 <FLHerne> despite them being identical 18:01:51 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] kaomoneus commented on discussion #8397: Daylength https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/discussions/8397 18:02:16 <Pruple> hmm 18:05:22 <Pruple> I want to say probably not? since the old spec only provided one. And I'm too lazy to redo the test grf. And realistically, if you did want different ground sprites, you could just provide them using one of the rear sprites. 🙂 18:12:47 <Pruple> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1008473233844097104/1057360412988940309/Windybury_Transport_1981-06-20.png 18:12:51 <Pruple> depots seem to be done 18:13:04 <Pruple> road stops might be next 😄 18:20:44 *** Wormnest has joined #openttd 18:36:18 <TallTyler> Do we even need NRT specific road stops, or just use NewGRF road stops? (Theres a PR to upstream them from JGRPP) 18:36:41 <Pruple> TallTyler: yes, we do 18:37:39 <Pruple> newroadstops require cooperation from the player, roadtype-specific defaults do not 🙂 18:37:47 <Pruple> and if they're easy to add, why not add them? 18:39:05 <Pruple> and having roadtype-specific defaults doesn't conflict with newroadstops at all 18:39:41 <DorpsGek> [OpenTTD/OpenTTD] PeterN merged pull request #10286: Change: Make vehicle list dropdown buttons resize to fit strings. https://github.com/OpenTTD/OpenTTD/pull/10286 18:54:39 <FLHerne> TallTyler: it's even a TTD feature when it comes to railtypes :p 18:54:59 <FL