Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 9th April 2010:
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01:29:56  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #843: Station showing empty string near junk yard <>
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09:50:42  <DJNekkid> good morning
09:52:42  <ODM> mornin
09:52:54  <Ammler> Sali Mr. DJ
09:57:39  <DJNekkid> any news?
10:05:18  <ODM> a llama escaped
10:06:35  <DJNekkid> oh no!
10:06:51  <DJNekkid> it went into a launch acro?
10:07:19  <ODM> say what now?
10:09:10  <DJNekkid> didnt you play SimCity 2000?
10:09:24  <DJNekkid> they had some wierd facination with llamas there...
10:09:38  <ODM> nop
10:09:46  <DJNekkid> oh....
10:09:58  <DJNekkid> and, a launch acro were the "ultimate" building...
10:10:14  <DJNekkid> could contain 50k ppl (iirc) in a 4x4 or 5x5 square
10:10:27  <DJNekkid> i've always missed thoose in 3000 and 4
10:11:30  <ODM> weird:P
10:44:59  <DJNekkid> bah, running out of cash
10:53:45  <ODM> make more money?:P
10:53:55  <Ammler> ctrl-alt-c
10:55:09  <Hirundo> Yexo: "what about action2 using only base sprites?" <- What do you mean by 'base sprites'?
10:56:19  <Ammler> sprties from base sets, I would guess
10:58:35  <Hirundo> These cannot be used in action2, except for houses/industry tiles, right?
11:01:49  <Ammler> I made station set that way
11:02:37  <Ammler> oh, Action0
11:03:33  <Ammler>
11:06:02  <Ammler> the whole grf:
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11:21:12  <Hirundo> If I get the station issue correctly, prop 09 defines the sprites to use from the action 1 set, and action 2 selects which action1 set to use
11:22:14  <Hirundo> setting bit 31 of the sprite number in action 0 prop 09 makes it a ttd sprite instead of a normal sprite
11:24:05  <Hirundo> so if all sprites are ttd sprites, an empty action1 set can be used, like you did
11:25:30  <Ammler> currently I am unable to use sprites from arctic or tropic
11:27:10  <Hirundo> In temperate, or in all climates?
11:28:02  <Ammler> in temp for example
11:28:17  <Ammler> well, I cheated also around the climtes
11:30:18  <Hirundo> ttd sprites will be replaced by arctic/tropic equivalents in those climates, right?
11:30:50  <Ammler> might be, but not with my grf
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11:31:08  <KenjiE20> nice timing Ammler
11:32:00  <Ammler> KenjiE20: ?
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12:04:51  <Yexo> Hirundo: as Ammler said, sprites from the base sets
12:05:08  <Yexo> no idea when they can be used, at least houses/industry tiles, I think that's all
12:05:58  <Hirundo> houses/industry tiles are not yet supported, they have a different action2 format
12:06:19  <Yexo> ah, ok
12:06:23  <Yexo> then it's all fine :)
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12:13:51  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: Modern Station Set - Revision 4: moderstationset: readme fixes (and trying my first Hg commit ;) ) <>
12:14:41  <Ammler> <-- DJNekkid, the license might not match
12:14:43  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - DSB Litra E in 2cc (at
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12:48:36  <DJNekkid> that post is rather old, isnt it?
12:49:20  <Ammler> omg :-o
12:49:30  <Ammler> how did I get ther :-D
13:08:34  <welshdragon> Ammler: i never realised that the news posted went on to the main #openttdcoop webpage
13:09:25  <welshdragon> i'll have to find and fix the download locations, migrating over to the new software's been a b****
13:12:07  <Ammler> welshdragon: he :-)
13:13:02  <Ammler> is a bit spammed from the devzone lately :-P
13:14:44  <welshdragon> aye
13:15:05  <Ammler> but that is nice
13:15:20  <Ammler> means "someone" is doing something
14:01:47  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: rsync & cp -Rl - Revision 0: Add: currently used backup script <>
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14:47:39  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: Java Game Logfile Analyzer - Revision 15: Improved the style of generated reports. <>
15:02:51  <Webster> Latest update from devactivity: Java Game Logfile Analyzer - Revision 16: Fixed arrayoutofbounds with new logstyle. <>
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17:03:38  <DJNekkid> Ammler: im trying to patch and compile openttd for my linux server...
17:03:56  <DJNekkid> did get the truck
17:03:58  <Ammler> nice :-)
17:04:06  <DJNekkid> svn up'ed to 19527
17:04:18  <Ammler> use hg
17:04:24  <DJNekkid> and then i go to the src dir
17:04:40  <DJNekkid> and patch -p0 (and i tried 1 as well) < blablabla.patch
17:04:48  <DJNekkid> but it askes for what file to modify
17:04:52  <Ammler> patch from root
17:05:03  <Ammler> patches are made from root
17:05:14  <DJNekkid> oh
17:05:17  <DJNekkid> bah
17:05:30  <Ammler> sometimes you need to patch other things then just src/
17:05:39  <DJNekkid> i see
17:07:11  <Yexo> if all files are in src/ you could also use patch -p2 (or -p1 in case of svn patches) < file.patch in the src dir
17:11:35  <DJNekkid> bah
17:11:40  <DJNekkid> seem to lack some libs
17:13:23  <Ammler> <-- look for buildrequires
17:13:27  <Ammler> and centos
17:14:05  <Ammler> centos=rhel
17:15:11  <Ammler> yum install <package>
17:15:19  <DJNekkid> hehe, i know...
17:19:18  <DJNekkid> yey
17:19:20  <DJNekkid> something works :)
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18:34:55  <Yexo> when playing with firs+2ccset, the refridgerated car can transport scrap metal
18:36:17  <DJNekkid> nightly?
18:36:22  <DJNekkid> or 1.0.1 ?
18:37:03  <Yexo> firs 0.1.2, 2dd set 1.0.1
18:39:31  <Ammler> use 3d set ;-)
18:39:49  <DJNekkid> tried r500+ nightly?
18:40:02  <Yexo> compiling a new 2ccset build now
18:42:13  <DJNekkid> hmm
18:43:58  <DJNekkid> why doesnt my linux build recognize the same .grfs as my windows build?
18:44:05  <DJNekkid> same dir structure and all!
18:46:47  <Yexo> it's fixed in r506 :)
18:47:00  <Yexo> only flatbed wagon can transport scrap metal now (in 1950)
18:47:09  <DJNekkid> its the same wagons all over
18:49:17  <Ammler> DJNekkid: that is randomly
18:50:14  <Ammler> but only a proplem, if the grf isn't there at all, else it finds it with md5sum
18:51:08  <DJNekkid> its both in the ~/.openttd/data and ~/openttd/bin/data
18:51:40  <Ammler> run with -d grf=1
18:54:39  <DJNekkid> anything i should look for?
18:55:40  <DJNekkid> ignoring invalid NewGRF 'ottdc_grfpack_infrastructure\totalbridges\total_bridges.grf': not found
18:55:43  <DJNekkid> for example
18:55:52  <DJNekkid> aaah!
18:55:59  <DJNekkid> should change \s with /'s ?
18:57:03  <DJNekkid> yea, that worked!
18:59:26  <DJNekkid> can you see if you can join it Ammler ?
19:01:49  <Ammler> use bananas, if possible
19:02:32  <Ammler> is the server announced, else you should post the address
19:02:42  <DJNekkid>
19:02:55  <DJNekkid> should be anonced tho, but i cant check that from "inside"
19:02:57  <DJNekkid> (afaik)
19:03:17  <DJNekkid> should i post 2cc r06 on banans?
19:03:21  <DJNekkid> r506
19:04:01  <Ammler> now install Autopilot and join to :-)
19:04:31  <Ammler> DJNekkid: upload it and define min version nightly
19:04:44  <DJNekkid> can even do min and max 19527
19:04:50  <Ammler> well
19:05:12  <Ammler> oh, might not work
19:05:18  <Ammler> dunno
19:05:22  <DJNekkid> i _have_ installed AP+
19:05:26  <DJNekkid> that is
19:05:30  <Ammler> :-o
19:05:35  <DJNekkid> svn co blablabla/ap+
19:05:39  <Ammler> yes
19:05:44  <DJNekkid> but i have NO idea on how to use it P
19:05:45  <DJNekkid> :P
19:06:14  <Ammler> easiest is to copy the bundle compiled to ap+
19:06:29  <Ammler> the bundle of openttd: make bundle
19:06:41  <DJNekkid> or just copy the entire bin-folder?
19:06:43  <Ammler> cp bundle/* autopilot/ -Rf
19:06:51  <Ammler> bin is bad
19:06:55  <Ammler> because of .svn
19:07:00  <DJNekkid> oh?
19:07:09  <Ammler> make bundle is easy
19:07:28  <Ammler> that creates a nice directory with only the needed files
19:08:38  <DJNekkid> and copy the bundle-dir (or contents?) to the ap+ dir?
19:08:54  <Ammler> yes not the dir the content bundle/*
19:09:18  <Ammler> so you have openttd and autopilot.tcl in same location
19:10:09  <Ammler> then copy openttd_additionals.cfg to openttd.cfg
19:10:35  <DJNekkid> the content of the file?
19:10:53  <DJNekkid> to ~/.openttd/openttd.cfg ?
19:10:58  <Ammler> no
19:11:13  <Ammler> cat openttd_additionals.cfg >> openttd.cfg
19:11:28  <Ammler> so you get a cfg in same location as autopilot.tcl
19:11:29  <DJNekkid> but wont i need the content of openttd.cfg to have the "correct" settings?
19:11:40  <Ammler> yes
19:11:49  <DJNekkid> cant it read the the "global" one?
19:11:54  <Ammler> but starting with defaults is quite a nice thing, imo.
19:12:30  <Ammler> after first start, you get the defaults :-)
19:13:17  <Ammler> ./autopilot.tcl starts openttd with -c openttd.cfg
19:13:34  <Ammler> you could modify the tcl script...
19:14:06  <Ammler> but I recommend using a special cfg per autopilot
19:14:23  <Ammler> and using a special autopilot per server :-)
19:16:57  <DJNekkid>
19:17:43  <Ammler> doesn't look like you installed ap+
19:18:05  <Ammler> looks more like an older version with setting patches
19:18:22  <Ammler> can you paste "svn info"
19:18:40  <Ammler> @devzone Autopilot
19:18:44  <Webster> Search - #openttdcoop Development Zone -
19:19:08  <Ammler>
19:19:16  <DJNekkid>
19:19:27  <DJNekkid> thats the ap+
19:19:34  <Ammler> hmm
19:19:49  <Ammler> and you installed tcllib, expect tclx?
19:21:16  <DJNekkid> yum install tcllib ?
19:21:20  <DJNekkid> if so; it cant find it
19:23:46  <Ammler> yum search tcl
19:24:01  <Ammler> and then tell me what package you get
19:24:34  <Ammler> mäh, it is almost a year ago I used centos ;-)
19:25:04  <DJNekkid> want an account and the root pwd? :P
19:25:58  <DJNekkid>
19:27:04  <Ammler> :-)
19:27:23  <DJNekkid> did u get any wiser?
19:27:50  <Ammler> yum install tcl tclx expect
19:28:46  <Ammler> another bad thing of centos is that it does mix 32 and 64 repos quite badly
19:29:03  <Ammler> s/repos/packages/
19:30:03  <Ammler> DJNekkid: if you want you can install my ssh key for your openttd user
19:30:11  <Ammler> but please no root access :-P
19:31:04  <DJNekkid> it installed stuff :P
19:31:18  <DJNekkid> still complains about line 83
19:31:24  <Ammler> paste?
19:32:07  <DJNekkid> same as the first one
19:32:44  <Ammler> my key:
19:32:55  <DJNekkid>
19:33:16  <Ammler> is the cfg set?
19:33:32  <Ammler> you might need to run ./openttd -D once
19:33:59  <DJNekkid> lol
19:34:09  <DJNekkid> it gives me that no lang-files is found
19:34:24  <Ammler> oh, you didn't copy recursively
19:34:38  <Ammler> [21:06] <Ammler> cp bundle/* autopilot/ -Rf
19:35:29  <Ammler> well, the other things are needed too
19:35:45  <DJNekkid> i used the GUI :P
19:35:46  <Ammler> but first, someone should alsways run openttd without autopilot
19:35:47  <DJNekkid> now
19:36:23  <DJNekkid> well
19:36:25  <DJNekkid> now its up anyways
19:36:33  <Ammler> ?
19:36:46  <DJNekkid> files are copied, server is running with default stuff
19:36:58  <Ammler> quit
19:37:09  <DJNekkid> quat :P
19:37:20  <Ammler> that is the command :-P
19:37:33  <DJNekkid> ctrl-c works too :)
19:39:13  <Ammler> hmm
19:39:15  <Ammler> not sure
19:39:23  <Ammler> if then openttd will save the settings
19:39:33  <DJNekkid> it does :=)
19:39:37  <DJNekkid> but i want "my" settings :)
19:40:47  <Ammler> then copy your cft
19:40:50  <Ammler> cfg*
19:40:58  <DJNekkid> openttd.cfg to the ap+ folder?
19:41:22  <DJNekkid> or the content of it above/under the autopilot stuff?
19:41:45  <Ammler> doesn't matter
19:42:25  <DJNekkid> but in the same file, yes?
19:44:14  <Ammler> yes
19:44:51  <Ammler> easiest is, you use your cfg and paste openttd_additionals.cfg
19:46:12  <DJNekkid> yea :)
19:46:47  <DJNekkid> i edited the IRC-part abit
19:46:52  <DJNekkid> and now it complains :)
19:47:14  <Ammler> paste :-P
19:47:22  <DJNekkid> can't find package irc
19:47:24  <DJNekkid> basicly
19:47:27  <Ammler> @wiki setdef
19:47:30  <Webster> Setdef - #openttdcoop Wiki -
19:47:46  <Ammler> that is for settings you might like to change
19:47:56  <Ammler> yum install tcl-devel
19:49:02  <DJNekkid> afk abit, wife + food :D
19:49:16  <Ammler> yum install tcllib
20:10:01  <DJNekkid> No package tcllib available.
20:43:22  <DJNekkid> oki, server online .)
20:44:15  <Ammler> with irc?
20:44:26  <DJNekkid> no
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21:10:39  <GT> Ammler, can I create a differential mq patch queue from a series of complete diffs created on different revision levels?
21:12:12  <GT> I've added all diffs I published for the 32EZ patch to a directory patch archive, but would like to have a patch queue for the future
21:12:24  <frosch123> apply the first one, store the patch in the queue, revert the working copy without the queue noticing it, apply the second patch, store the patch in the queue
21:15:13  <GT> yeah, but the problem is that they are made on different revisions, and that I have to have the patch active before refreshing it, which will give merge problems. That was often the reason to create a new diff. I don't really feel like redoing the merge work of 2 years again.
21:16:24  <GT> Oh, wait, the interesting part here is: revert the wd without the queue noticing it, how do I do that?
21:16:49  <frosch123> well, but that would still require the diff to apply
21:17:13  <frosch123> so if there are that huge revision differences, i doubt there is a nice way to do it
21:18:37  <Ammler> GT: you have one patch only, just based on different versions?
21:19:21  <GT> Right, but I may split it in the future, there are different functionalities in it, that would be split better
21:19:51  <Ammler> yes, but for now, just use that single patch based on clean openttd trunk
21:20:26  <Ammler> create a repo in .hg/patches/
21:20:47  <Ammler> and commit every version but same file
21:21:45  <Ammler> make commit message with svn version it matches
21:22:26  <Ammler> but I am not sure, if current openttd compile farm can handle it
21:22:45  <Ammler> so you might need a merged repo anyway
21:23:52  <Ammler> I asked Hirundo to make some docs about his workflow, but I fear he never did :-(
21:24:47  <Ammler> IS2 has 2 repos, one with paches and one the merged repo
21:26:04  <Ammler> anyway, working with patch queue seems fine
21:26:27  <Ammler> you can pop and push? patches
21:26:27  <GT> The repo of 32bpp-EZ is a merged repo, ie ottd trunk with the patch applied, but added an extra repo for the patches is what I was thinking of too, to separate the history of the patch a bit better, and to make things easier in the future
21:26:40  <Ammler> no, your repo is a mess :-)
21:26:45  <Ammler> or did you fix it?
21:27:00  <GT> Depends on what you think still is a mess
21:27:48  <Ammler> well, it reports you as author of the license file for example
21:28:04  <Ammler> or do we need to rescan?
21:28:37  <Ammler>
21:29:27  <Ammler> that tells me, you didn't use openttd trunk as base
21:29:46  <Ammler> you used a svn checkout or whatever
21:30:38  <Ammler> if you like to make that right, do "hg clone -r<firstpatch> trunk.hg"
21:30:45  <Ammler> apply your patch and merge
21:31:10  <Ammler> then do hg pull -r<nextpatchversion>
21:31:22  <Ammler> apply your new patch and merge
21:31:30  <Ammler> etc...
21:31:49  <Ammler> but if you like to use patch queue, we can trash that repo
21:33:31  <Ammler> and you commit your patches from as single file
21:33:36  <Ammler> with history
21:36:55  <Ammler> the problem is, myself isn't really a coder, I speak just from theory, the practical guy would be Hirundo or the openttd devs
21:37:40  <Ammler> but I can prepare the repo and talk to Hirundo, when he is around...
21:39:27  <Ammler> also yexo has experience with patch queue, maybe he can help :-)
21:39:40  <GT> You're right about the svn checkout, that was what I did use before, so initially I svn updated to the first patch rev, applied the path and hg pushed that. Then I found out that the sources differ: the $id is present in the top of the file in the svn checkout, and not in the hg pull. So I hg pulled from trunk and merged all the revs again, making the annotates right again, but it seems the original author cannot be repaired anymore, me bei
21:40:52  <Ammler> ok, so just r0 is messed :-)
21:41:25  <Ammler> Well, decide what you want, branch(es) or patch queue
21:42:32  <Ammler> if you make patch queue, keep in mind, currently there is only one patch in the series
21:42:48  <Ammler> the patch name does not have any version infos
21:43:01  <Ammler> such things you could add to the commit message
21:44:29  <GT> Patch queue definately, but I cannot repair the author issue, unless I import all 15000 diffs in the queue, which does not sound very attractive. I already did have the habit of setting the svn rev in the diff name, so I understand the need of adding the revnr to the commits
21:45:27  <GT> Another thing, is there a way to create nightlies, or weeklies or monthlies out of the repo, or is your toolchain not set up for that?
21:50:31  <DJNekkid> @calc 60000/5
21:50:31  <Webster> DJNekkid: 12000
21:53:04  <DJNekkid> omg
21:53:12  <DJNekkid> thats a EPIC error!
21:53:48  <DJNekkid> daylength patch devide and not multiply running costs
21:53:59  <DJNekkid> two trains with aprox 30k running costs
21:54:18  <DJNekkid> at the end of the year the running costs have come up to 12k, and not 30*5
21:54:22  <DJNekkid> (daysetting at 5x)
21:58:41  <GT> Just another idea I had about repairing the repo: what would happen to the author info if i just hg rm-ed all files from the repo, and then hg pulled from trunk again?
21:59:26  <GT> Well, there's one way to find out..
22:01:56  <Ammler> GT wouldn't work
22:02:05  <Ammler> the data are already pushed to the server
22:02:27  <Ammler> but if you like to use patch queue, why does it matter
22:02:41  <Ammler> this repo is for trash anyway
22:02:54  <Ammler> create a new repo, for example 32bpp-ez-patches
22:03:28  <Ammler> and that one you keep in trunk.hg/.hg/patches
22:04:16  <Ammler> well, I will create that repo on the server
22:04:40  <Ammler> so you can clone it to your .hg/patches dir
22:05:36  <Ammler> We don't build openttd nightlies on our server
22:06:11  <Ammler> and without building for windows, dunno if it would be useful
22:06:38  <Ammler> but you could from time to time ask the openttd CF to make a build
22:07:01  <GT> Just ask TrueBrain or who?
22:07:14  <Ammler> no, a dev
22:07:30  <DJNekkid> Ammler: do you have "Flugel" (u with ¨s on it) in your country?
22:07:33  <Ammler> they will "forward" it to truebrain or Rubi
22:07:49  <Ammler> DJNekkid: planes have those
22:08:00  <Ammler> wings
22:08:19  <DJNekkid> its a premixed drink/shooter tingy
22:08:24  <DJNekkid>
22:09:12  <GT> Always though  Truebrain was dev?
22:09:13  <Ammler> oh well, might be, I prefer beer, wine and wiskey :-)
22:09:34  <GT> @DJNekkid, I know flugel, but prefer Grolsch
22:09:45  <DJNekkid> hehe
22:09:56  <SmatZ> TrueBrain is dev (retired)
22:10:01  <DJNekkid> i were wondering if anyone could send me a pack or three :P
22:10:04  <Ammler> GT, Truebrain is SysOp there
22:10:06  <DJNekkid> i'll pay ofc
22:11:38  <Ammler> according to the homepage we haven't
22:13:18  <Ammler> GT, Truebrain can start the compile, but he prefers a dev asking him
22:16:28  <Ammler> I am too young to view the webpage :-P
22:16:53  <Rubidium> or rather, he wants someone to say it's safe
22:17:48  <GT> save in which way?
22:18:09  <GT> s/v/f/
22:18:45  <Rubidium> configure hasn't been tampered with in a way that destroy the compile farm
22:18:58  <Rubidium> the changes look sane, i.e. no obvious exploits
22:19:21  <Rubidium> has a decent chance of actually compiling
22:20:31  <GT> So a patch that's been around for 2 yrs on the forums, and downloaded by > 1000 people would have a chance? Im talking about the extra zoom level patch.
22:21:06  <GT> Btw GT == GeekToo
22:21:10  <Rubidium> yup
22:21:50  <Ammler> Rubidium: can the new compile farm also compile with a svn patch?
22:21:54  <Rubidium> as long as it has a source repository that looks openttd-ish and an (external) place to dump the binaries, it should be mostly fine
22:21:58  <Ammler> or does it need a repo?
22:22:41  <Ammler> the old (wwottdgd/1) was able to make binaries based on a patch
22:22:44  <Rubidium> it needs the repo
22:23:17  <Rubidium> that's the old CF and I reckon TB made some temporary repository
22:23:37  <Rubidium> and if it's possible I wouldn't know how to do it
22:24:30  <Ammler> so GT, I recommend  to do it like IS2, we can make a server side script
22:24:57  <Ammler> I guess, Hirundo already did something, need to ask him next time he is around...
22:25:28  <GT> You're right Ammler, I already plan to do so
22:25:43  <GT> ie, do it like IS2
22:27:59  <Ammler> <-- use this repo for the queue
22:28:13  <GT> Thanks, will do
22:29:10  <Ammler> <-- this is how the patch queue of is2 looks
22:31:06  <GT> Now for something completely different: does anyone know the game FreeCiv, I encountered it in the Gentoo packages, is it worth emerging it
22:31:42  <GT> ?
22:32:08  <Ammler> doesn't gentoo have a uninstall function? :-P
22:32:16  <Rubidium> by name I know it
22:33:18  <GT> of course, emerge --unmerge
22:33:53  <GT> Just asking for user experiences before wasting valuable spare time
22:34:05  <nighthawk_c_m> freeciv is kind of fun if you like civilization games, dunno how good it is nowadays
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22:35:23  <Ammler> was there more than one civilization game?
22:35:35  <Ammler> I liked that game quite much :-)
22:35:55  <nighthawk_c_m> civilization 4 or 5 is the actual one ^
22:36:17  <nighthawk_c_m> and back in the day there was a counterpart called colonization
22:36:36  <nighthawk_c_m> basically the same game just with a different theme, colonizing the new world
22:36:49  <nighthawk_c_m> night guys
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22:37:19  <Ammler> ah
22:37:26  <Ammler> indeed, I had colonization in mind
22:40:07  <GT> Well, I did like Settlers, though that was a long time ago, so I think I'll give FreeCiv a try
22:40:53  <Ammler> there is openSettlers around
22:41:20  <Ammler> Widelands called
22:41:29  <GT> And a Linux counterpart of Commandos really would make my day
22:43:28  <Ammler> Pingus is a nice Lemmings clone
22:43:31  <GT> emerge --searchdesc Wideland
22:44:11  <Ammler>
22:44:13  <Webster> Title: (at
22:49:52  <GT> Searching...
22:49:52  <GT> [ Results for search key : Wideland ]
22:49:52  <GT> [ Applications found : 1 ]
22:49:52  <GT> *  games-strategy/widelands
22:49:52  <GT>       Latest version available: 0.0.14
22:49:53  <GT>       Latest version installed: [ Not Installed ]
22:49:53  <GT>       Size of files: 62,263 kB
22:49:55  <GT>       Homepage:
22:49:55  <GT>       Description:   A game similar to Settlers 2
22:49:57  <GT>       License:       GPL-2
22:49:58  <Webster> Title: (at
22:51:20  <GT> Shit, I'll quit my job, too many interesting thing to try, and too little time
22:55:02  <Rubidium> that sounds freakishly new and huge
22:56:03  <Rubidium> oh... and I like it already
22:57:57  <Ammler> because?
22:58:56  <Rubidium>
22:58:58  <Webster> Title: DebuggingDesyncs - Wiki - (at
23:00:31  <planetmaker> GT: FreeCiv is very similar to Civilization II
23:00:53  <planetmaker> it's fun. But if you know Civ III or Civ IV you miss a few things
23:01:04  <planetmaker> and hello folks :-)
23:01:23  <Rubidium> oh, hi planetmaker
23:01:39  <Ammler> lol Rubidium
23:02:18  <Rubidium> planetmaker: the desync dump stuff is kinda broken in 1.0.0, so I'm having quite a bit of trouble getting it to work right
23:02:27  <Rubidium> replays seem to be working right now
23:03:04  <planetmaker> oh... :S That's not the best news I've been hoping for... but not the worst either :-)
23:03:22  <Rubidium> but it requires replaying the whole game (again) just to fix some bugs in the game state
23:03:26  <Rubidium> which takes quite a while
23:03:45  <Rubidium> yay for adding fast forward to the dedicated server
23:03:52  <planetmaker> you did?
23:04:53  <Ammler> heya pm
23:05:44  <planetmaker> Rubidium: can we improve on the desync situation somehow?
23:06:16  <Rubidium> planetmaker: once I've confirmed this method works I'll make a diff for 1.0.0 so it gets useful data
23:06:35  <Rubidium> after that it's "just" trying to reproduce it I fear
23:07:16  <Ammler> oh, Muxy has a patch to restore company passwords btw.
23:07:21  <planetmaker> :-) You answered the question I just wanted to ask - wether you'd like to server-side patch it such to improve output :-)
23:07:43  <planetmaker> Ammler: interesting :-) in forums?
23:07:55  <Ammler> in his patch pack
23:08:16  <Ammler> the issue is, he doesn't have the single patches anymore
23:08:21  <planetmaker> oh, new patch pack season?
23:08:34  <planetmaker> he, how very bad of him
23:08:58  <Ammler> well, it is the qoulp server patch
23:09:20  <Rubidium> is he also of that 'compaign'/citybuilder patch on the forum?
23:09:41  <Ammler> <-- not a pack :-)
23:09:42  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - [Patch] Goulp Server Side Patch (at
23:10:53  <Rubidium> oh, it's even a 0.7.x patch
23:11:51  <Rubidium> +		ci->locked = ci->locked?false:true;
23:12:10  <Rubidium> should I start screaming?
23:12:14  <Ammler> :-)
23:12:39  <Ammler> did you see, how he solved the company password part?
23:12:47  <planetmaker> hehe :-)
23:14:08  <planetmaker> oh... big patch...
23:14:34  <Rubidium> yeah, kinda fails when you open an older savegame with the same seed
23:15:12  <Rubidium> it's not as bad as the citybuilder patch, but still it needs a huge amount of cleanups
23:16:22  <Rubidium> +	if(cp->cmd==671875131 || cp->cmd==671940667) // rename or delete sign
23:16:28  <planetmaker> I think I haven't seen the city builders' patch ever... but nvm :-)
23:16:34  <planetmaker> uh... what does that do?
23:16:42  <Rubidium> ^ that's a) totally unmaintainable and b) oh how easy I can work around those restrictions
23:16:58  <planetmaker> yeah
23:18:18  <Ammler> I recommended him to use patch queue
23:18:21  <Rubidium> +void CB_handleTextCommand(int from_index, char*cmd, bool echo)
23:18:24  <Rubidium> +	if (cmd=="rules")
23:18:26  <Ammler> but he seems not interested
23:18:47  <Rubidium> that's when I started to stop reading it
23:21:28  <planetmaker> hm... you seem to be reading another patch than me.
23:22:08  <SmatZ> Rubidium: hehe, nice ones :)
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23:25:50  <Rubidium> so, how does cope with dishing out 625 less OpenGFX, 567 less OpenMSX and 539 less OpenSFX? :)
23:26:32  <planetmaker> it works. May that be because of that or because of nginx.
23:26:48  <Rubidium> nobody knows
23:27:03  <Rubidium> you can only be sure if you can recreate the traffic of a few days ago
23:27:17  <planetmaker> we won't be able
23:27:40  <planetmaker> or I don't see how that would work on a short-term basis
23:28:04  <planetmaker> anyway the hits on the server halfed approximately
23:29:26  <planetmaker> but it would be interesting to know whether it works now...
23:30:14  <GT> Rubidium, any remarks about the 32bpp-EZ patch that needs improvement? It all started like a major personal hack patch, but I seem to have created a nice community, so a quality upgrade would be appropriate.
23:30:42  <planetmaker> ... but your mirror gets way more traffic than our site now
23:31:10  <Rubidium> planetmaker: that's what the mirrors are for :)
23:31:20  <Rubidium> GT: haven't looked at it in ages
23:33:08  <planetmaker> true :-)
23:35:35  <GT> Rubidium; No problem, just saw a chance to learn from the Ottd pros
23:40:31  <Rubidium> the code can definitely use a patch queue + description per patch :)
23:41:29  <Ammler> I am quite sure, it isn't the mirror
23:41:38  <Rubidium> the coding style looks like an enormous mess at many places
23:41:59  <Rubidium> and there are chunks with seemingly unneeded changes; why add a newline somewhere totally unrelated?
23:44:05  <Rubidium> Ammler: the mirrors seem to be dishing out a median of 85 GB
23:45:15  <Rubidium> against a median of 28 GB for OpenTTD's server
23:45:25  <Rubidium> @calc 28/(85+28)*100
23:45:25  <Webster> Rubidium: 24.7787610619
23:45:35  <Ammler> Rubidium: I meant why our server works again
23:46:03  <Ammler> still runs on apache
23:47:53  <Ammler> I am not sure, if should change it to nginx or make some proxy things
23:48:20  <Ammler> so we can keep the rewrite stuff
23:48:56  <Rubidium> for serving simple files it doesn't matter that much what httpd you're using
23:49:30  <Rubidium> the stuff that requires real server-side processing is the problematic thing
23:49:48  <planetmaker> Ammler: but also the hits on dev... halfed. Not only bundles
23:50:18  <Ammler> planetmaker: yes and?
23:50:27  <Ammler> it is still higher than before...
23:50:43  <planetmaker> 50% higher. But not 400% as before :-)
23:51:05  <Ammler> where do you look at?
23:51:09  <GT> Thanks, for taking a look, empty  newlines etc are probably a result of addding debug statements and removing them again partly, but when the comments are limited to whitespace and coding style, I think I can fix that pretty easy. Most coding style issues probably related to the fact that that coding rules are opposite from what I use at work: ottd uses indian hill indenting, in day to day work I don't, ottd uses tabs for indenting, in day
23:51:09  <planetmaker> not 400%, 100%
23:51:11  <Rubidium> it's like a highways; reduce traffic by 1% and you reduce traffic jams by like 5%
23:51:20  <planetmaker>
23:51:21  <Webster> Title: Google Analytics (at
23:51:58  <Ammler> planetmaker: but the peak ran with nginx
23:52:07  <planetmaker> did it?
23:52:15  <Ammler> yeah, 3rd day now
23:52:21  <Rubidium> GT: I haven't done anything "in-depth", just a quick scan... so I won't notice the more hidden things
23:52:22  <planetmaker> then my memory is subject to a off-by-one error ;-)
23:52:51  <Rubidium> booh... need to login to get graphs :(
23:52:55  <Ammler> well, if our server would have worked 4 days ago, we had more hits
23:53:29  <Ammler> Rubidium: if you have google login, we can add you
23:54:02  <Rubidium> I don't have one and won't have one
23:55:00  <Rubidium> @calc (746044 - 738945)/365/65*60
23:55:00  <Webster> Rubidium: 17.9532139094
23:55:02  <planetmaker> <-- @ Rubidium
23:55:17  <Rubidium> lovely... 18 years an hours for replaying the stable game
23:55:25  <Ammler> planetmaker: setup nginx afternoon 7.April
23:55:33  <GT> Rubidium, but that's important too, if I use a coding style that makes the regular Ottd dev puke, that needs fixing too.
23:56:02  <Ammler> that google chart has a american timezone
23:56:05  <Ammler> afaik
23:56:10  <planetmaker> Ammler: so hard to tell? :-)
23:56:50  <Rubidium> ooh... the client plays ball... openttd running at 3x :)
23:57:26  <planetmaker> the chart for bundles.openttdcoop looks nearly the same on all accounts.
23:58:06  <Ammler>
23:58:16  <Rubidium> oh, 3x seems like a decent "speed-up" for client play (server @85% CPU, client @75%)
23:58:55  <Ammler> anyway
23:59:04  <Rubidium> those graphs look quite odd (the webalizer ones)
23:59:20  <Rubidium> <- how ours look

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