Log for #openttdcoop.devzone on 14th August 2010:
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00:46:38  *** Seberoth has quit IRC
01:14:49  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1228 (New): Ability to configure max production for primary ... (aantono) @
04:33:17  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #280: standard signals (2006TTD) @
04:47:57  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #885: Groundtile brack land (Toyland?) (2006TTD) @
04:47:57  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #883: Office building improvement (2006TTD) @
04:51:17  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #280: standard signals (2006TTD) @
04:51:17  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #683: Blue eyes too blue (2006TTD) @
05:21:48  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #741: toolbar info sprite blue instead red? (2006TTD) @
06:12:09  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1128:f6e4cc3ab2b7: Change: improved templating and snowl... (andythenorth) @
06:20:10  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1129:32c760284a20: Change: fix tile bug for Forest (andythenorth) @
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07:02:32  <planetmaker> [08:56]	<planetmaker>	[00:00:44] <-- does the trick with the filenames for me, andythenorth
07:02:53  <planetmaker> moin also :-)
07:02:57  <andythenorth> planetmaker: I'll try that later
07:03:08  <andythenorth> I'm in a fun world of cpp
07:03:15  <andythenorth> thanks
07:03:22  <planetmaker> hehe :-)
07:04:38  <planetmaker> andythenorth: airportsplus and opengfx+ have some fun cpp templates for repeated tasks. Also actually swedish rails. Maybe it helps:
07:04:55  <andythenorth> I think I have it
07:05:05  <andythenorth> I'm not sure anyone else will ever understand it though :|
07:05:40  <andythenorth> For each tile, I have to check (in order), climate, terrain, layout, slope
07:05:47  <planetmaker> he :-)
07:06:08  <planetmaker> <-- I thought of such function-like template as the last two lines
07:08:14  <planetmaker> the result is something like
07:08:54  <planetmaker> where tmpl_TTD_LC_old_temperate() and the offsets are given (partially) by the parameters of the function
07:09:18  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #348: maglev horizontal track (2006TTD) @
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07:13:38  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #348: maglev horizontal track (planetmaker) @
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07:29:06  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #280: standard signals (planetmaker) @
07:51:04  <planetmaker> @calc 13+12+6+11+6
07:51:04  <Webster> planetmaker: 48
07:51:13  <planetmaker> @calc 10+3+9+10+2
07:51:13  <Webster> planetmaker: 34
07:51:24  <planetmaker> @calc 48/(48+34)
07:51:24  <Webster> planetmaker: 0.585365853659
07:51:39  <planetmaker> @calc 48+28+12
07:51:39  <Webster> planetmaker: 88
07:51:45  <planetmaker> @calc 22+4+34
07:51:46  <Webster> planetmaker: 60
07:51:54  <planetmaker> @calc 88/(88+60)
07:51:54  <Webster> planetmaker: 0.594594594595
07:54:33  <planetmaker> @calc sqrt(88+60)/(88+60)
07:54:33  <Webster> planetmaker: 0.0821994936527
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07:55:55  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1130:735c7db61c7c: Change: reorganise Forest cpp stuff f... (andythenorth) @
07:55:55  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1131:0719f7b0f1c7: Change: make a sensible varact 2 & cp... (andythenorth) @
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08:14:58  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1132:57b5ecf1a743: Change: improved Tropic appearance of... (andythenorth) @
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09:42:38  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1133:2da77f0fd957: Feature: full snowline support for Fo... (andythenorth) @
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10:06:17  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #348: maglev horizontal track (2006TTD) @
10:18:43  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #280: standard signals (2006TTD) @
10:22:05  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #280: standard signals (planetmaker) @
10:25:59  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1134:c39f4a9e8bf5: Change: Forest improvements (andythenorth) @
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10:31:15  <planetmaker> Ammler: autostart is not accessible anymore without login to svn
10:47:13  <Brot6> metrotrackset: update from 1.0.0 to 1.0.1 done -
10:48:08  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Revision 48:43da701b6b8e: Feature: railtypes requires OpenTTD 1.0.3 / r20242 (c... (foobar) @
10:48:08  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Revision 49:7c1e079eb570: Doc: prepare for 1.0.1-release (foobar) @
10:48:08  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Revision 50:00e2891b3246: Release: 1.0.1 (foobar) @
10:48:08  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Feature #1186 (Closed): minimum openttd version (foobar) @
10:48:11  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Support #1227 (Closed): release 1.0.1 (foobar) @
10:49:51  <Alberth> planetmaker:
10:49:59  <Alberth>
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10:51:05  <Alberth> I am sure the mdep line can be improved
10:57:46  <planetmaker> Alberth: you remove the depend: target completely? I don't follow the diff quite... there seems to be no other way then to update dependencies than calling 'make Makefile.dep'?
11:08:35  <Alberth> and that you don't need to do, since you include that file
11:10:05  <Alberth> thus make will check its up-to-date-ness, and rebuild if needed
11:16:26  <Alberth> My main problem with depend was "all: depend"
11:18:37  <Alberth> depend: $(MAKEFILE_DEP)    may be useful indeed
11:22:34  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1135:7461e4a97172: Add: source psd for Forest (andythenorth) @
11:22:34  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1136:caf26724d66e: Add: pcx for Forest (andythenorth) @
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12:02:28  <planetmaker> Alberth: I include what file? Makefile.dep? As part of the repo?
12:02:52  <Alberth> -include ${MAKEFILE_DEP}
12:02:58  <planetmaker> it's conditionally included. If it's not found, it will be ignored. As in that patch it will never be generated
12:03:16  <planetmaker> yes. That means: use it, if present
12:03:24  <planetmaker> it doesn't mean: generate it
12:04:43  <Alberth> "...  Once it has finished reading makefiles, make will try to remake any that are out of date or don't exist..."
12:05:55  <planetmaker> yes. But Makefile.dep is nowhere a dependency
12:06:10  <Alberth> (02:03:19 PM) Alberth: -include ${MAKEFILE_DEP}
12:06:13  <planetmaker> you'd need to make $(MAIN_TARGET): $(MAKEFILE_DEP)
12:06:20  <planetmaker> Alberth: that's no dependency
12:06:32  <planetmaker> it's a conditional part of the makefile
12:06:34  <Alberth>
12:06:35  <Webster> Title: GNU `make' (at
12:07:04  <planetmaker> If you want make to simply ignore a makefile which does not exist or cannot be remade, with no error message, use the -include directive instead of include, like this:
12:07:06  <planetmaker>      -include filenames...
12:07:18  <planetmaker> ^
12:07:29  <Alberth> start reading here: "If an included makefile canno"
12:07:49  <Alberth> "or cannot be remade," is the key here
12:07:55  <Alberth> that does not hold
12:08:13  <planetmaker> hm... I never read it that way
12:08:19  <planetmaker> Did you test it that it does work?
12:08:36  <Alberth> make mrproper; make  regenerates the dependencies here
12:08:52  <planetmaker> :-) Nice
12:10:05  <Alberth> with RCS, you could type 'make' without having any file checked out. It detects a missing Makefile, and a RCS directory, and starts checking out the files by itself :)
12:10:55  <planetmaker> uh? where is that line from?
12:11:05  <planetmaker> that sounds just too awesome ;-)
12:11:25  <planetmaker> I guess then that solves the issue with double dep generation?
12:11:45  <Alberth> there are default make rules, and checkout from RCS was in there
12:12:02  <planetmaker> hm, I missed that
12:12:41  <Alberth> I am not sure that solved the issue, I more suspect the $(REV_FILENAME) dependency without having a target for that
12:16:19  <planetmaker> $(REV_FILENAME) is a target... basically creating that file
12:16:25  <planetmaker> It allows to detect a version change
12:18:44  <FooBar> Ammler: could you add a "Feature Request" (or just "Request") tracker to the devzone?
12:19:05  <planetmaker> FooBar: each project manager can do that for his/her project
12:19:11  <FooBar> I can?
12:19:13  <planetmaker> OpenGFX has 'Feature'
12:19:26  <FooBar> I looked, but I didn't see :( let me see again then :)
12:19:28  <Ammler> planetmaker: you need to create the tracker
12:19:36  <planetmaker> as does afaik firs
12:19:47  <andythenorth> oooh
12:19:49  <andythenorth> FooBar: :)
12:20:03  <Ammler> hello all, btw :-)
12:20:18  <planetmaker>
12:20:21  <FooBar> oh, that's a good one... hi all :)
12:20:32  <planetmaker> hi FooBar & Ammler :-)
12:20:46  <Ammler> I don't think, there is a tracker Request
12:21:17  <FooBar> I would like to differentiate between features that need implementing and features that users would like to see
12:21:43  <planetmaker> actually... otherwise there's 'Feature' in the trackers globally available
12:21:45  <FooBar> I use "Feature" for the first, but there isn't anything suitable for the second
12:21:57  <frosch123> "features that need implementing" <- aren't they bugs then?
12:22:10  <FooBar> not really...
12:22:21  <Ammler> frosch123: that's not openttd :-P
12:22:30  <FooBar> if it works without the feature, it's not a bug IMO
12:22:34  <planetmaker> well. Personally I don't see the difference between 'Feature' and 'Feature request'
12:22:55  <FooBar> hmmm...let me try to explain...
12:22:59  <planetmaker> an unimplemented feature is a feature request
12:23:28  <Alberth> there was no  $(REV_FILENAME):   rule, it was done while building the $(MAKEFILE_DEP).
12:23:28  <Alberth> Since, $(MAKEFILE_DEP): $(REV_FILENAME)   you were changing time stamps of sub-targets while computing the makefile.dep file. That does not feel right to me
12:23:34  <Ammler> there are 2 features, some which others want and some which the devs want :-)
12:23:50  <FooBar> example:
12:24:21  <planetmaker> yes, what about that?
12:24:24  <Ammler> FooBar: basically every feature without a target version could be a feature request
12:24:45  <FooBar> michi_cc added that as Feature, but from the main issue list I could not see that it was something he wanted or I actually intended to add
12:24:52  <planetmaker> I'm reluctant to define inflationary new issue categories
12:25:15  <planetmaker> FooBar: 'wanted to add' is defined by 'assigned' and possibly 'version'
12:25:24  <Ammler> true
12:25:57  <planetmaker> otherwise it's a feature request w/o anyone working on it in particular
12:26:38  <FooBar> well, you guys don't need to enable it for your projects...
12:26:47  <Ammler> planetmaker: well, we can add it
12:26:56  <Ammler> true, as FooBar said
12:27:07  <planetmaker> well. There's two things: one per-project (what I linked to) and one globally.
12:27:29  <planetmaker> the trackers is globally
12:27:35  <FooBar> planetmaker: I still don't see that I can create one for myself
12:27:36  <andythenorth> a feature is a feature
12:27:37  <planetmaker> the issue category is per-project
12:27:49  <FooBar> oh, that one :)
12:27:51  <planetmaker> the latter you  can do yourself. And I propose to work with that in this case
12:28:00  <andythenorth> it's either in the backlog (in which case it's a feature request), or it's in an iteration / milestone
12:28:06  <andythenorth> in which case it's still a feature
12:28:17  <andythenorth> we don't need two classes
12:28:29  <andythenorth> use iteration planning to indicate what is actually being worked on
12:28:48  <andythenorth> basically what Ammler said earlier :)
12:28:50  <planetmaker> we even have that.
12:28:59  <planetmaker> it's defined by setting an issue assigned to you ;-)
12:28:59  <andythenorth> that's how I do it for FIRS
12:29:13  <FooBar> ok, I'll try issue category first then :)
12:29:48  <FooBar> I do think random users fail to set that when asking for something to be implemented...
12:30:00  <planetmaker> But I still don't see the difference whether you make a feature request for your project or another person
12:30:34  <planetmaker> as manager you review an issue anyway. And if you like it, You set the feature to 'assigend' and a target version
12:30:44  <Ammler> if a non member adds a feature, it _is_ a FR always, isn't?
12:30:44  <planetmaker> otherwise leave it or reject it
12:30:52  <planetmaker> yes, of course
12:30:56  <FooBar> If I make it for myself I know I want it some time. If some other person makes the request, I need to find it first, then review it and then accept/deny it
12:31:12  <andythenorth> just reject it if you don't like it
12:31:16  <planetmaker> yes. But... ^
12:31:31  <Ammler> or don't assign a version
12:31:48  <andythenorth> planetmaker: you didn't fancy doing the desert transition action 2 for forest? :P
12:31:52  <Ammler> or create a version 10.0 and assign it there :-)
12:32:03  <FooBar> true, but actually finding a feature request from a user in the first place is the hard part, hence the seperate tracker ;)
12:32:24  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1137:40d6d7e0e6f8: Feature: add landing tile for Forest (andythenorth) @
12:32:24  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1138:390d2b8e5b9e: Change: add log loader to pcx (curren... (andythenorth) @
12:33:10  <FooBar> I see it got added, thanks :)
12:33:28  <planetmaker> andythenorth: actually... I'm afraid, no. I fancied pondering about dep checks
12:33:48  <andythenorth> it can wait :)
12:35:54  <planetmaker> he
12:36:29  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1139:da94a619e216: Change: improve appearance of Forest ... (andythenorth) @
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12:49:21  <Hirundo> Allow me to state the obvious for the (n+1)th time: MSVC sucks
12:49:48  <Ammler> wrong channel, no other MSVC user here, I fear :-P
12:50:35  <andythenorth> hmm
12:52:20  <Ammler> is it too early to ask 2006TTD, if he would like to code it self?
12:52:51  <andythenorth> right
12:52:56  <andythenorth> I've kind of done the FIRS forest
12:53:01  <andythenorth> it could bear some improvements
12:53:12  <andythenorth> that was a bit of hard thinking :o
12:54:03  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1140:6a44a1bc8b50: Feature: prevent Forest tiles being b... (andythenorth) @
12:59:13  <andythenorth> what next?
13:01:41  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1141:fc1b2bb8e3f6: Change: improved Forest in arctic (andythenorth) @
13:02:06  <andythenorth> hmm
13:02:17  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #741: toolbar info sprite blue instead red? (Ammler) @
13:02:18  <Ammler> economy splitting?
13:02:21  <andythenorth> time to improve Fruit Plantation?
13:02:29  <andythenorth> Ammler: I'm going to leave economies to a later release
13:08:53  <Ammler> planetmaker: this compile is dedicated to you: :-)
13:08:56  <Brot6> opengfx: compile of r478 failed -
13:09:16  <Ammler> make: *** No rule to make target `sprites/nfo/extra/extra-toyland-infrastructure.pnfo', needed by `sprites/ogfxe_extra.pnfo'.  Stop.
13:09:32  <Ammler> thanks to the awesome dep check :-P
13:23:54  <andythenorth> FooBar planetmaker: so how should the Fruit Plantation work?  Resp. appearance, etc.  Needs to be similar to Forest...
13:24:40  <FooBar> for temperate, it should be an orchard or vinyard IMO
13:25:18  <FooBar> for arctic, a greenhouse would work
13:25:26  <andythenorth> see any suitable trees in the base set for temperate?
13:25:31  <FooBar> and for tropic the current tropic forest is fine
13:25:40  * FooBar looks
13:26:48  <andythenorth> I like sprite 1633 and 1634 for fruit trees
13:26:55  <FooBar> the first or second-to-last tree from the tree buy menu could work
13:27:01  <FooBar> they have some sort of red berries in it
13:27:17  <FooBar> let me get trg1r.pcx...
13:27:30  <planetmaker> [15:09]	<Ammler>	thanks to the awesome dep check :-P <-- exactly. Without dep check, the build would have succeeded.
13:27:47  <andythenorth> 1599 is pretty good too
13:27:54  <planetmaker> So please stop that bitching
13:28:05  <andythenorth> FooBar: you could use the sprite picker (and next / previous)
13:28:26  <FooBar> hmmm
13:28:50  <FooBar> I believe the numbers from the sprite picker are different than the numbers in trg
13:29:19  <andythenorth> sprite picker is accurate resp. using the numbers in nfo
13:29:28  <FooBar> maybe not...
13:29:54  <planetmaker> FooBar: the numbers in the sprite picker are only accurate if the sprite is part of the base grf.
13:30:05  <planetmaker> Other climates than temperate not
13:30:20  <planetmaker> They only replace some sprites in the base grf, but not every single one
13:30:49  <andythenorth> what makes a good ground tile for a plantation
13:30:50  <andythenorth> ?
13:31:15  <andythenorth> how about 4164?
13:31:16  <FooBar> trees: 1620 and 1689 imo
13:31:36  <andythenorth> ok
13:31:44  <FooBar> 4164 works for me
13:33:25  <FooBar> 1633 and 1634 also work for me as fruit tree, but 1599 doesn't really look like fruit to me
13:35:06  <FooBar> 1620, 1633, 1634 and 1689 as well as 4164 also work for OpenGFX, so that's good
13:38:35  * andythenorth does some nfo
13:45:30  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1142:afe22ba3999a: Change: Forest accepts FMSP instead o... (andythenorth) @
13:45:36  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 479:d06d544319c7: Fix (r478): Adding graphics is not enough (planetmaker) @
13:52:44  <Ammler> [15:27] <planetmaker> [15:09] <Ammler> thanks to the awesome dep check  <-- exactly. Without dep check, the build would have succeeded. <-- not really?
13:53:08  <Ammler> cpp would fail
13:53:25  <andythenorth> bah
13:53:30  * andythenorth blew up the game badly
13:54:27  <Ammler> planetmaker: you should have made the Action7 outside in the main nfo
13:54:40  <Ammler> like we do for the rest
13:56:22  <Ammler> there should be no non-toyland thing in a toyland nfo
13:56:33  <andythenorth> FooBar:
13:57:28  <Ammler> trees should be almost unique
13:57:34  <FooBar> personally I would've put the trees in some neat rows, probably sorted by type...
13:57:36  <Ammler> and a bit more space, imo
13:57:54  <andythenorth> FooBar: I'll commit shortly and you can do that :)
13:58:02  <andythenorth> I'm just reusing Forest code right now
13:58:22  <FooBar> ok, I'll look into that later then
13:58:44  <Ammler> such things should work with farm fields
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14:00:01  <andythenorth> Ammler: ??
14:00:24  <Ammler> bigger :-)
14:01:14  <andythenorth> Ammler: layouts are easy to add later
14:01:27  <Ammler> well, you can't make it bigger
14:01:35  <andythenorth> I could
14:01:40  <Ammler> since that would block rail and road
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14:01:47  <andythenorth> it would be better done with field tiles
14:01:51  <andythenorth> which don't exist yet :P
14:02:06  <andythenorth> send cookies to frosch123 and they might get done
14:14:01  <planetmaker> [15:52]	<Ammler>	[15:27] <planetmaker> [15:09] <Ammler> thanks to the awesome dep check <-- exactly. Without dep check, the build would have succeeded. <-- not really? <-- yes. Really.
14:14:24  <Ammler> so cpp would not fail if a #include is missing?
14:14:27  <planetmaker> If I break on error in grfcodec, it'll fail on all 'acceptable' errors and warnings, too
14:14:42  <andythenorth> cpp does not break if a #include is missing
14:14:53  <andythenorth> I have proven that numerous times this morning :)
14:15:06  <andythenorth> the grf however does not performa as expected :P
14:15:14  <planetmaker> hehe. Exactly
14:15:20  <Ammler> hmm, I don't believe you
14:15:23  <Ammler> but well
14:15:36  <planetmaker> Please proof it wrong
14:15:37  <andythenorth> Ammler: try it
14:15:43  <planetmaker> *prove
14:15:48  <andythenorth> check out FIRS, set the wrong path to an included template
14:15:57  <andythenorth> it will build
14:15:59  <andythenorth> but it won't work
14:16:04  <planetmaker> or just change a filename
14:16:25  <Ammler> how do skip the dep check?
14:16:30  <Ammler> to*
14:16:52  <planetmaker> look at the diffs in the issue
14:17:07  <Ammler> that if for firs, which doesn't apply on opengfx
14:17:17  <Ammler> already tried
14:17:35  <planetmaker> remove the hunk for
14:17:52  <Ammler> well, I can try with firs
14:45:07  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1143:a7e8c5ec0a9d: Change: split files for Fruit Plantat... (andythenorth) @
14:45:07  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1144:7ca10ef8f132: Change: Fruit Plantation graphics upd... (andythenorth) @
14:45:07  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1145:702ef42091d5: Add: pcx for Fruit Plantation (andythenorth) @
14:45:09  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1146:57cced7cc091: Change: building sprite for Fruit Pla... (andythenorth) @
14:45:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1147:a1ce3b4fa516: Change: arctic tiles for Fruit Planta... (andythenorth) @
14:45:19  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1148:a7ba273d6a0f: Add: template for slope check avoidin... (andythenorth) @
14:58:01  <andythenorth> FooBar:
14:58:28  <andythenorth> greenhouses will be possible, but they will need a little more work
14:58:32  <andythenorth> like sprites and suchlike
14:58:39  <andythenorth> and then lots of work with custom foundations :o
14:59:13  <FooBar> I like it
14:59:24  <FooBar> with this, greenhouse is not top priority
14:59:45  <andythenorth> it can be built more strictly below the snowline, it's not a lot more work to do that
14:59:53  <andythenorth> but I'm not so bothered right now
15:07:04  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1228 (Rejected): Ability to configure max production for pri... (andythenorth) @
15:07:05  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1222 (Resolved): Forest should accept FMSP instead of ENSP (andythenorth) @
15:07:20  <DJNekkid> FooBar: do you use the same labels in the metro set as i do i nutracks?
15:08:03  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1220 (Closed): Forest - unfinished (andythenorth) @
15:08:03  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1089 (Closed): Forest in tropic (andythenorth) @
15:08:03  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1222 (Closed): Forest should accept FMSP instead of ENSP (andythenorth) @
15:08:03  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1218 (Closed): Forest - Action 0 may not be complete (andythenorth) @
15:08:25  <FooBar> DJNekkid: I use 3RDR and 3RDC, as recommended in the spec
15:08:49  <FooBar> That is also what Pikka uses
15:09:01  <DJNekkid> oki, goodie :D
15:09:10  <DJNekkid> probably because the 3RDC was invented by me :P
15:09:13  <DJNekkid> either way
15:09:22  <DJNekkid> i think we should add support for eachother?
15:09:22  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #927: prevent industries being built in the desert (andythenorth) @
15:10:15  <FooBar> well, support is easy if we use the same railtype labels: if metrotracks is loaded after nutracks, metrotracks will be used for 3RDR and 3RDC. If the other way round, there's no point in loading metrotracks :P
15:10:38  <FooBar> or what support are you thinking of?
15:10:40  <DJNekkid> we should go abit further then that imho :)
15:10:58  <DJNekkid> "if nutracks is or will be active" you action7/9 out your action0
15:11:13  <DJNekkid> and "if metrotracks is or will be active" i action7/9 out my gfx-bits
15:11:40  <DJNekkid> that way prices and such will stay as they are "supposed" to
15:12:04  <FooBar> what are your prices anyways?
15:12:11  <FooBar> I just did an educated guess :P
15:12:20  <FooBar> but yes, something like that is possible
15:12:29  * andythenorth ponders
15:12:36  <DJNekkid> 200 and 700 iirc
15:12:49  <andythenorth> what next
15:12:52  <andythenorth> ?
15:12:59  <andythenorth> farm snowline dependencies?
15:13:06  <FooBar> DJNekkid: and in \wx that is?
15:13:14  <FooBar> oh never mind, I prolly can look that up...
15:13:37  <DJNekkid> \w1400
15:13:43  <DJNekkid> atleast with my basecost
15:13:55  <DJNekkid> and \w400
15:14:15  <DJNekkid> but my basecost is down at 04
15:14:16  <FooBar> oh, that's something different than 0A and 0E respectively :P
15:14:54  <DJNekkid> indeed
15:15:15  <DJNekkid> thats why im saying, "if nutracks, skip A0's"
15:15:19  <DJNekkid> and vica verca
15:15:46  <FooBar> I balanced against default costs: third rail is cheaper than electrified and both is as much more expensive as 3rd rail is more expensive than normal rail :)
15:16:42  <DJNekkid> i did my own balance in nutracks...
15:16:58  <DJNekkid> default (i.e. 120kmh rails) cost 100, elrails(120kmh) cost 500
15:18:10  <FooBar> do your 3RDR and 3RDC have a low speed limit?
15:18:15  <DJNekkid> 120kmh
15:18:30  <FooBar> ok, that's fine
15:19:05  <FooBar> I can imagine that people who load metrotracks after nutracks only want to use metrotracks for 3RDR but don't want a strict speed limit with that
15:19:13  <FooBar> but 120 km/h should be fine
15:19:34  <FooBar> if not, people will complain with either me or you and then we can see if we need to do something about that :)
15:19:40  <Ammler> you mainly use nutracks because of the limits
15:20:01  <DJNekkid> yes, i would think so... limits and whatever realism is in there
15:20:17  <FooBar> but yes, I'll skip my action0's if nutracks active
15:20:42  <DJNekkid> :D
15:21:30  <FooBar> I also have a lot of these "allow RAIL on 3RDR and 3RDC"-like thinks, skip those too?
15:22:10  <DJNekkid> i have all my action0 stuff in "one" action0 (per tracks)
15:22:13  <DJNekkid> -s
15:22:34  <DJNekkid> but yes, skip thoose to, i have them in nutracks as wel
15:22:41  <DJNekkid> btw, grfid?
15:22:57  <DJNekkid> DJT 01 is mine :D
15:23:01  <DJNekkid> "DJT" 01
15:23:08  <Ammler> what is actually the difference between the nutracks metro and metrotracks?
15:23:19  <FooBar> graphics
15:23:32  <FooBar> and ttdp support
15:23:43  <FooBar> oh, grfid, let me look
15:23:58  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Feature #1229 (Assigned): nutracks compatibility (foobar) @
15:24:32  <FooBar> DJNekkid: grfid: FB FB 04 *
15:24:46  <DJNekkid> * works?
15:24:51  <DJNekkid> or should i just 3 byts?
15:25:13  <FooBar> well, you need to code that, but it leaves room for me to bump the grfid without you having to change nutracks as well
15:25:23  <FooBar> the current full grfid is FB FB 04 02
15:25:49  <DJNekkid> 3 bytes should suffice
15:26:07  <DJNekkid> -1 * 0  09 88 03 09
15:26:10  <FooBar> in your case, would "DJT" 11 also be nutracks?
15:26:11  <DJNekkid> FB FB 04
15:26:12  <DJNekkid> F0
15:26:24  <FooBar> hypothetically speaking :)
15:26:36  <DJNekkid> DJT is "nutracks", 01 is version
15:26:37  <DJNekkid> so yes
15:26:40  <DJNekkid> i think?
15:26:41  <DJNekkid> hehe
15:26:43  <FooBar> ok cool
15:27:11  <FooBar> what is with devzone? I create issue and it says "Doodle successfully created"
15:27:24  <Ammler> lol
15:27:25  <FooBar> haven't seen that one before :P
15:27:28  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1057 (Rejected): Some industries shouldn't be built above sn... (andythenorth) @
15:28:34  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Feature #1229 (Assigned): nutracks compatibility (foobar) @
15:29:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #1230 (New): Toyland Buoy Follow up (2006TTD) @
15:29:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #1231 (New): Toyland Buoy Follow up (2006TTD) @
15:29:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #1230: Toyland Buoy Follow up (2006TTD) @
15:29:48  <DJNekkid> but, back to cleaing the CD-briefcase i guess... its overdue a LONG time ago
15:36:56  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #1231 (Rejected): Toyland Buoy Follow up (2006TTD) @
15:36:56  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #1230 (Rejected): Toyland Buoy Follow up (Ammler) @
15:36:56  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #1231 (Rejected): Toyland Buoy Follow up (Ammler) @
15:36:56  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #1230 (New): Toyland Buoy Follow up (Ammler) @
15:38:51  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1059 (Closed): Farm snowline dependency (andythenorth) @
15:40:45  <andythenorth> good luck building stations near FIRS forests now :P
15:42:21  <FooBar> use trucks ;)
15:43:32  <andythenorth> indeed
15:43:57  <Ammler> or distant-join
15:44:08  <andythenorth> meh
15:44:12  <Ammler> :-P
15:44:53  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1150:95eef50b41ce: Feature: Dairy Farm can't build above... (andythenorth) @
15:44:53  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1151:78df62a7b364: Feature: Mixed Farm can't build above... (andythenorth) @
15:44:53  <Brot6> Nutracks - Revision 91:92d4e8419d21: Add: Metro track support (DJNekkid) @
15:44:54  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1152:4731299a7e7a: Feature: Arable Farm can't build abov... (andythenorth) @
15:44:58  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Feature #1199 (Closed): add action 14 (foobar) @
15:47:15  * andythenorth ponders
15:47:22  <andythenorth> more FIRS tickets, or do something else...
15:50:34  <andythenorth> silence from the audience :)
15:50:39  <andythenorth> something else in that case :P
15:56:38  <Alberth> the audience went away to do other things :p
15:57:52  <FooBar> actually, the audience went to take a leak :P
16:16:34  <andythenorth> I saw a great talk at SXSW on that subject :P
16:16:37  <Webster> Title: UK Creatives at SXSW 2009 » Blog Archive » Bruce Sterling Hates Me! (at
16:17:12  <Brot6> 2cctrainset: compile of r577 failed -
16:17:50  *** Seberoth has quit IRC
16:18:09  <Brot6> firs: update from r1121 to r1152 done (4 errors) -
16:18:38  <Ammler> andythenorth: didn't you say, you remove all bugs :-P
16:18:46  <andythenorth> no
16:18:52  <andythenorth> I reduced bugs from about 150 to 4 :P
16:18:55  <Brot6> grfcodec: update from r224 to r226 done -
16:19:01  <Ammler> a well, good job!
16:19:11  <andythenorth> I am happy to send cookies to whoever fixes the remaining 4 :[
16:19:25  *** FooBar has quit IRC
16:19:31  <Brot6> metrotrackset: update from r43 to r52 done -
16:20:55  <Brot6> nforenum: update from r465 to r467 done -
16:21:59  <Brot6> nutracks: update from r90 to r91 done (15 errors) -
16:23:15  <Brot6> opengfx: update from r477 to r479 done -
16:23:21  <Brot6> Following repos didn't need a nightlies update: 32bpp-extra (r38), airportsplus (r52), basecosts (r20), comic-houses (r71), fish (r386), heqs (r371), newgrf_makefile (r124), nml (r670), ogfxplus (r41), openmsx (r97), opensfx (r97), snowlinemod (r15), swedishrails (r141), transrapidtrackset (r15), worldairlinersset (r659)
16:23:50  <Brot6> 2cctrainset: compile of r577 failed -
16:28:30  <Brot6> 2cctrainset: compile of r577 failed -
16:31:30  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1233 (New): Try and prevent industry locating within 1 t... (andythenorth) @
16:32:12  <Rubidium> am I right when I say the action 14 palette bit isn't in FIRS yet?
16:33:05  <Brot6> Following repos rebuilds successful without any difference to earlier nightlies builds: fish (6 errors) (Diffsize: 13), heqs (Diffsize: 13), metrotrackset (Diffsize: 11), newgrf_makefile (Diffsize: 13), snowlinemod (Diffsize: 13), transrapidtrackset (Diffsize: 11), worldairlinersset (Diffsize: 13)
16:33:08  <andythenorth> probably
16:33:15  <andythenorth> probably right that is
16:33:18  <andythenorth> need me to add it?
16:33:35  <Ammler> why do you split the Action14 in different sprites?
16:33:42  <andythenorth> lack of understanding
16:33:47  <andythenorth> feel free to consolidate them :)
16:36:35  <Ammler> at least the compiler should now work as expected
16:38:25  <Brot6> #openttdcoop - Revision 119:33214da8a23a: [Compiler] Change: rewrite, cleanup, fix... (Ammler) @
16:42:31  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1228: Ability to configure max production for primary indust... (aantono) @
16:45:00  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Revision 52:27d56fbb4fb6: Feature: 3RDC: third rail with catenary tracks (close... (foobar) @
16:45:00  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1228: Ability to configure max production for primary indust... (andythenorth) @
16:45:00  <Brot6> Metro Track Set - Feature #1224 (Closed): 3rd rail with catenary (foobar) @
16:50:43  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1176 (Closed): Faulty tile on Aluminium Plant (andythenorth) @
16:53:17  <DJNekkid> btw, can you guys look at the sovjet flag, and see if its good enough?
16:57:55  <Ammler> DJNekkid: it doesn't build :-)
16:58:30  <Ammler>
16:59:56  <Ammler> 99% of failed compiles is a missing file
17:00:39  * andythenorth thinks something needs to be done
17:01:10  <Ammler> imo, more important then the dep check :-P
17:01:47  <Ammler> oh, I need still to prove that
17:01:56  <andythenorth> I meant this...but anyway...
17:02:57  <Ammler> hmm, isn't that a old topic?
17:03:03  <andythenorth> yes
17:03:11  <andythenorth> might be time to try and fix it
17:03:13  <Ammler> well, multiple sandpits is nice
17:03:32  <andythenorth> yexo had a trunk patch that prevented industry building within n tiles of each other, but it didn't make trunk :(
17:03:34  <Ammler> clusters are nice
17:03:38  <andythenorth> clusters are nice
17:03:42  <Ammler> :-)
17:03:53  <andythenorth> industries with a 1 tile gap would be nicer
17:04:26  <andythenorth> I'll have to do it with tile checks :(
17:04:27  <Ammler> yes, maybe 2
17:04:51  <andythenorth> we can test that when I've figured out the code
17:05:11  <Ammler> 2 for same industry and something else for different
17:14:22  <andythenorth> for var 60 how many bits do I shift to get the landscape class?
17:14:28  <andythenorth>
17:14:59  <Rubidium> every letter = 4 bits
17:15:19  <andythenorth> if it's just one nibble is the mask 0F?
17:15:33  <Rubidium> yes
17:16:02  <Rubidium> so, there're 6 letters after the c, so... 6*4 (you do the math)
17:23:47  <andythenorth> thanks
17:37:45  <andythenorth> so I need to check 8 tiles with 1 advanced varact 2
17:39:17  <andythenorth> what does a bitwise OR do?
17:40:53  <Rubidium> andythenorth: you mean to check whether one of those 8 tiles is an industry tile?
17:41:00  <andythenorth> yup
17:41:08  <andythenorth> landscape class will be 8 if so
17:41:22  <andythenorth> I know there's a clean way to do it, but I don't know what that is :P
17:41:32  <Rubidium> question is whether you want to count objects / tunnels as well
17:41:46  <andythenorth> hmm
17:41:48  <andythenorth> good point
17:42:10  <andythenorth> would it be cleaner to do those in a separate action (if needed)
17:42:15  <Rubidium> although... you can do 1 << landscape_class and or those
17:42:20  <andythenorth> I'm nor sure it's necessary to check those
17:42:26  <Rubidium> if then 1 << 8 is set, there's an industry tile
17:43:21  <andythenorth> so that's operator 14 (shift left) ?
17:43:33  <andythenorth> and first create value 1?
17:44:29  <Rubidium> could be; don't know that part of NFO. I'm only giving advice on a more general level
17:44:39  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1153:2cd3bd9d0bda: Fix: restored electrical substation t... (andythenorth) @
17:45:06  <andythenorth> I'll try it and see, then call super-frosch otherwise :)
17:52:37  <andythenorth> frosch123: trying to check class of neighbouring tiles to see if industry....
17:59:14  <frosch123> makes no sense :)
17:59:20  <frosch123> what shall it do?
17:59:56  <andythenorth> check 8 nearby tiles, return something if they are industry class
17:59:57  <andythenorth> I have no idea what I'm doing :P
18:00:10  <frosch123> what shall those << do?
18:00:20  <andythenorth> I'm trying to find an elegant way to do it, rubi suggested one, but I probably didn't understand
18:02:23  <frosch123> then use | and use a shift-and-mul-add var-adjust to subtract 8 from the tileclass
18:02:54  <frosch123> then the result is 0 if all were industry tiles
18:03:19  <frosch123> hmm, no, you want to check if there is no indsutry tile, right?
18:04:11  <andythenorth> currently I want to check if there *is* industry tile
18:04:16  <Rubidium> frosch123: just | the 1 << tileclass of each of the tiles and check bit 8 at the end
18:04:17  <andythenorth> I could do it either way
18:05:06  <frosch123> oh, there is no setbit operator to do that easily
18:05:18  <andythenorth> I could check for no industry tile
18:05:24  <frosch123> you need lots of sto for that
18:06:13  <andythenorth> is this easier with 8 separate varact 2?
18:09:36  <andythenorth> frosch123: I'm going to do it with separate action 2...just in case you're trying to think of a solution ;)
18:12:58  <frosch123> use a #define for it :p
18:13:15  <andythenorth> harder to read :P
18:13:25  <andythenorth> I need to do a silly alternating action 2 ID thing so I don't run out
18:13:31  <andythenorth> tis done
18:13:38  <andythenorth> does it work though :P
18:14:49  <andythenorth> :o
18:14:52  <andythenorth> seems to work
18:45:30  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1154:44b8cd0848a0: Change: partial progress on preventin... (andythenorth) @
18:45:30  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1155:f6ecc62eced6: Feature: (many industries) prevent in... (andythenorth) @
18:54:58  *** Seberoth has joined #openttdcoop.devzone
19:00:54  * Rubidium wonders whether to make the actual release of grfcodec and nforenum today. frosch123, what's your opinion on the stability/bugs? Anything that hasn't received enough testing?
19:02:57  <Ammler> the dist_dir should be mentioned in the changelog
19:03:58  <Ammler> and that you can use make install at all
19:05:13  <Rubidium> so just some general notification that the whole installation part of the makefile has been redone
19:05:14  <frosch123> was there a successful rebuild of the stuff in the devzone since the last changes?
19:05:53  <Ammler> is the 0compile.txt still needed?
19:05:53  <Rubidium> there was only a mention that X packages were rebuilt without changes
19:06:12  <Ammler> isn't that a pre-readme.txt file?
19:06:54  <Ammler> frosch123: every newgrf here uses the nightly tools
19:07:02  <Rubidium> yes, though it's a bit more specific about stuff and AFAIK not incorrect. So better leave it as-is I'd say
19:07:05  <Ammler> and does rebuild and compare if those changes
19:08:19  <Ammler> frosch123: e.g.
19:08:36  <Ammler> 9 times rebuild since the grf had a change
19:10:38  <planetmaker> as far as I see it, there's no (major) issues
19:10:56  <planetmaker> I don't even know minor ones :-P
19:12:55  <frosch123> my impression is that there are lots of issues, which everyone forgot :)
19:13:22  <Ammler> there is much changed for package maintainers...
19:14:53  <Ammler> but maybe nobody of those noticed so far, as they don't repackage nforenum without openttd release
19:16:13  <planetmaker> frosch123: that's why I wrote 'I see' and 'I know' and specifically not 'there aren't' ;-)
19:16:26  <planetmaker> I know how fail-prone my memories are...
19:16:37  <planetmaker> what did you say? :-P
19:17:55  <Rubidium> the question is how long it takes for a NewGRF dev to use the new version of GRFCodec/NFORenum. I've actively asked some people about it and fixed all the issues they came up with
19:18:13  <frosch123> planetmaker: i remember four things i did for grfcodec: fix the pcx-width-needs-to-be-a-multipe-of-bla-bug (present for years), adding escape sequences (missing for years), and fixing the \d \w \b processing with whitespace after them (broken in the nightly due to a fix, which was not ported to grfcodec, so effectively was useless/untested itself)
19:21:06  <andythenorth> Rubidium: I'm using new renum
19:21:09  <andythenorth> no issues so far
19:21:29  <Ammler> andythenorth: nforenum* :-P
19:21:36  <andythenorth> I should get new grfcodec
19:22:35  <planetmaker> yes
19:22:42  <planetmaker> andythenorth: you could just checkout and compile
19:22:52  <andythenorth> true
19:22:53  <planetmaker> though... you need boost
19:23:01  <andythenorth> I could learn to set paths on OS X as well
19:23:23  <andythenorth> for some reason I don't understand, my grfcodec works natively
19:23:25  <planetmaker> not that bad :-)
19:23:45  <andythenorth> I guess there's a bash.conf or something somewhere
19:23:50  <planetmaker>
19:23:52  <Webster> Title: Browse Boost C++ Libraries Files on (at
19:24:22  <andythenorth> hmm
19:24:34  <andythenorth> grfcodec is not n my .bash_profile
19:24:41  <andythenorth> so how does the OS find it?
19:24:42  <planetmaker> it doesn't need to be
19:24:50  <Rubidium> andythenorth: type whereis grfcodec
19:25:03  <planetmaker> your grfcodec might be in /usr/local/bin or so
19:25:08  <andythenorth> it's in /usr/bin
19:25:11  <andythenorth> so that makes sense now
19:25:15  <planetmaker> that's automatically found then
19:25:28  <Rubidium> so you copied it there, or you made a symlink
19:25:31  <planetmaker> though I go for a link from there to the dir I compile it in
19:26:26  <planetmaker> the only real 'difficulty' is to get boost
19:26:41  <andythenorth> I'm sure I have boost already
19:27:09  <andythenorth> my ports list shows boost
19:27:13  <Ammler> /usr/include
19:28:03  <Ammler> you need the boost sources, afaik
19:28:07  <frosch123> andythenorth: what do nforenum -v and grfcodec -v tell youi? :p
19:28:41  <Rubidium> frosch123: probably that it's an invalid parameter :)
19:29:20  <andythenorth> yup
19:29:30  <andythenorth> unrecognised option '-v'
19:29:33  <Ammler> on both?
19:29:44  <andythenorth> I don't have OS X nforenum
19:29:49  <andythenorth> so only on grfcodec
19:30:19  <andythenorth> I'll get renum now
19:31:12  <Ammler> there is no renum anymore
19:31:30  <andythenorth> I've got nforenum now
19:31:33  <Ammler> :-D
19:31:43  <andythenorth> I'll change my makefile.local(s) to use it
19:32:05  <Ammler> maybe you should also make a symlink from nforenum to renum :-P
19:34:29  <andythenorth> ah
19:34:35  <andythenorth> mac renum can't create files
19:34:39  <andythenorth> that's why I don't use it
19:34:41  <andythenorth> I remember now
19:34:44  <andythenorth> it fails
19:34:52  <andythenorth> how about a bug report?
19:35:36  <andythenorth> planetmaker: does OS X nforenum work for you?
19:44:17  <Ammler> andythenorth: you should pastebin the output
19:44:46  <andythenorth> it's an OS X permissions problem almost certainly
19:45:01  <andythenorth> the only one who can help is probably planetmaker and he's on a different OS
19:45:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1156:e5c291989417: Add: template to handle generic cb2f (andythenorth) @
19:45:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1157:28fa8ed08206: Feature: Aluminium Plant uses 1 tile ... (andythenorth) @
19:45:15  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1158:0b2d4a523337: Feature: Bakery uses 1 tile buffer to... (andythenorth) @
19:45:17  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1159:7f6fbcf7f231: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
19:45:32  <Ammler> you run nforenum in the same location, where you run grfcodec?
19:46:01  <andythenorth> yup
19:46:02  <Ammler> or is the problem that osx can't read and write to the same file?
19:46:10  <andythenorth> dunno
19:46:13  <andythenorth> let me past
19:46:15  <andythenorth> paste /s
19:46:20  <andythenorth> works fine using wine
19:47:15  <andythenorth> Ammler: most of this obviously junk.  Only one line is useful:
19:47:21  <andythenorth> Could not open output file "sprites/" for input "firs.nfo".
19:47:36  <Ammler> hmm, could you not just run nforenum
19:47:43  <Ammler> and check that
19:47:47  <Ammler> for start
19:48:20  <Ammler> what does nforenum -v output?
19:48:37  <Rubidium> I reckon 4.0.0-RC1
19:48:55  <andythenorth> yup
19:49:01  <andythenorth> this is an old issue for me though
19:49:14  <andythenorth> last time it was concluded "don't use such a flaky OS"
19:49:20  <andythenorth> pdq2s-macbook-3:firs_build andy$ nforenum sprites/firs.nfo
19:49:20  <andythenorth> NFORenum 4.0.0-RC1 - Copyright 2004-2010 Dale McCoy.
19:49:20  <andythenorth> Could not open output file "sprites/" for input "sprites/firs.nfo".
19:49:23  <Rubidium> could you do a strace nforenum firs.nfo and paste that result (huge)
19:49:27  <Ammler> with -k?
19:49:53  <andythenorth> trace or strace?
19:50:11  <Rubidium> strace
19:50:42  <andythenorth> I don't have it, nor does ports
19:50:50  * andythenorth google
19:51:29  <Ammler> try with -k in the meantime
19:52:09  <andythenorth> pdq2s-macbook-3:firs_build andy$ nforenum -k sprites/firs.nfo
19:52:09  <andythenorth> NFORenum 4.0.0-RC1 - Copyright 2004-2010 Dale McCoy.
19:52:09  <andythenorth> Could not open output file "sprites/" for input "sprites/firs.nfo".
19:52:10  <Rubidium> andythenorth: seems it is called ktrace or dtrace
19:52:17  <andythenorth> I'm trying dtrace now
19:53:12  <andythenorth> Rubidium:
19:55:22  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1234 (New): 1 tile buffer - Coal Mine (andythenorth) @
19:55:53  <Rubidium> andythenorth: did you compile it yourself?
19:56:18  <andythenorth> nope, dl from
19:56:45  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1235 (New): 1 tile buffer - Generic Tiles (andythenorth) @
19:57:38  <Rubidium> andythenorth: could you compile it yourself please? Maybe it's just something that's broken in the compile farm
19:57:53  <andythenorth> yup
19:59:02  * Rubidium shouldn't try to ask questions he knows the answer of
20:00:02  <andythenorth> Rubidium: I need to get boost
20:00:09  <andythenorth> let me try that
20:01:11  <andythenorth> that might take a while to build
20:01:21  <Rubidium> no need to build boost
20:01:39  <Rubidium> nforenum and grfcodec only need some of the headers, nothing more
20:02:34  <andythenorth> I'll let macports do its thing for a bit
20:02:43  <andythenorth> unless there's a faster way?
20:03:09  <Rubidium> although... if boost insists on compiling before installing the headers you're off to a "long" wait
20:03:39  <Rubidium> andythenorth: get the source package from the website and copy the boost directory in there to your includes directory
20:03:55  <Rubidium> so copy it to /usr/local/include/
20:04:04  <Rubidium> so there is a /usr/local/include/boost/...
20:05:56  <andythenorth> doing it now
20:12:46  <andythenorth> Rubidium: I've now got /usr/local/include/boost/
20:12:56  <andythenorth> however make[1]: *** No rule to make target `boost/current_function.hpp', needed by `objs/IDs.o'.  Stop.
20:13:32  <Rubidium> oh... stupid thing... what if you move it to /opt/local/include ?
20:15:22  <frosch123> "CFLAGS+=+I/use/local/include" in Makefile.local?
20:16:03  <Rubidium> frosch123: better to move it somewhere where the compiler can find it by default :)
20:16:04  <andythenorth> Rubidium: doesn't work in /opt/local/include
20:16:30  <andythenorth> funny thing, locate can't find boost
20:16:53  <Rubidium> locate needs an update cycle to update it's database
20:17:33  <Rubidium> hmm, then add the CXXFLAGS=-I/opt/local/include to Makefile.local (or /usr/local/include if it's there)
20:18:31  <andythenorth> boost has gone from /opt/local/include
20:18:32  <andythenorth> it was there
20:18:36  <andythenorth> weird
20:19:12  <Rubidium> maybe ports messed with it?
20:20:35  <andythenorth> think so
20:20:39  <andythenorth> it's still building
20:21:25  <Rubidium> then put the headers in /usr/local/include and add CXXFLAGS=-I/usr/local/include to Makefile.local
20:21:35  <Rubidium> or wait till ports is finished
20:21:35  <planetmaker> [22:12]	<andythenorth>	however make[1]: *** No rule to make target `boost/current_function.hpp', needed by `objs/IDs.o'. Stop. <-- that looks strangely familiar...
20:21:45  <planetmaker> ... but I don't know what I did anymore
20:22:34  <Rubidium> gcc's depend stuff doesn't recognise it as being in a system include directory
20:23:08  <andythenorth> looks like ports has put boost headers in  /usr/local/include
20:23:17  <Rubidium> so... maybe adding CXXFLAGS=-isystem/usr/local/include to Makefile.local resolves the issue
20:23:19  <planetmaker> that's the default location
20:24:27  <planetmaker> hm, though my boost is in /opt/local/include
20:24:53  <andythenorth> bah
20:24:59  <planetmaker> Rubidium: care, if I extend the .hgignore for both nforenum and grfcodec?
20:24:59  <andythenorth> CXXFLAGS=-isystem/usr/local/include doesn't help
20:25:11  <planetmaker> it doesn't ignore any intermediate files
20:25:16  <Rubidium> planetmaker: extend with what?
20:25:31  <Rubidium> as I don't get intermediate files
20:25:34  <planetmaker> *.o *.o.d *.obj.d *.os *.os.d
20:25:51  <Rubidium> planetmaker: in the 'root'?
20:26:09  <planetmaker> hm, yes
20:26:15  <Rubidium> if so, that's old crap from moving them to objs
20:26:32  <andythenorth> supporting OS X is a hassle :P
20:26:42  <andythenorth> renum.exe works well for me :)
20:27:41  <Rubidium> hmm, other way around... planetmaker: can you reproduce andythenorth's issue with the binary created by the CF?
20:27:58  <planetmaker> let's check.... My guess is: yes
20:28:22  <Rubidium> if that's the case, then I'll just declare the CF broken and be done with the issue :)
20:28:29  <planetmaker> :-P
20:29:55  <planetmaker> well... nforenum seems to work
20:30:10  <Rubidium> then I'm flabbergasted
20:30:16  <planetmaker> yes
20:30:25  <Rubidium> andythenorth: could you do a ls -alhR of your firs directory?
20:30:46  <andythenorth> what, all of it :o
20:30:55  <Rubidium> yeah :)
20:31:21  <Rubidium> I rather get too much information than too little
20:31:27  <planetmaker> hm, wait. I have to give local path. And now this funny thing again:NFORenum 4.0.0-RC1 - Copyright 2004-2010 Dale McCoy.
20:31:28  <planetmaker> Could not open output file "/Users/ingo/ottd/grfdev/firs/sprites/" for input "/Users/ingo/ottd/grfdev/firs/sprites/firs.nfo".
20:31:46  <planetmaker> which clearly works with my local version
20:32:08  <Rubidium> so... the CF creates something broken
20:32:10  <Rubidium> good
20:32:20  <planetmaker> not quite
20:32:31  <planetmaker> this is a strange thing
20:32:37  <andythenorth> Rubidium:
20:34:46  <planetmaker> Rubidium: I think I posted a solution to this once in the old nforenum thread...
20:35:01  <planetmaker> let me dig
20:38:51  <planetmaker> <-- this will also need checking (mostly memory for myself)
20:38:53  <Webster> Title: Transport Tycoon Forums • View topic - GRFCodec feature discussion thread (at
20:41:23  <Rubidium> there's something about the CF's build asserting, but that doesn't happen now
20:42:16  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1236 (New): 1 tile buffer should be ignored when player ... (andythenorth) @
20:43:54  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1237 (New): 1 tile buffer - Iron Ore Mine (andythenorth) @
20:45:38  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 227:e5a433743592: Update: changelog + documentation (Rubidium) @
20:45:38  <Brot6> NFORenum - Revision 468:44cea243912d: Update: changelog + documentation (Rubidium) @
20:46:10  <Rubidium> damn... I did do that a *long* time ago
20:47:09  <planetmaker> hm. I don't find it. Then maybe I didn't put that in writing anywhere there
20:48:02  <Rubidium> yay! :(
20:48:28  <Rubidium> then I'll just blame the CF :)
20:48:31  <planetmaker> Might be that I then just resorted to compiling my own...
20:48:48  <planetmaker> which I anyway did.
20:49:12  <planetmaker> bad bad CF
20:49:49  <Rubidium> but it basically means that nobody really used the mac binaries
20:50:04  <planetmaker> which I wonder. At least dandan and andy should ;-)
20:50:13  <andythenorth> I didn't because they failed :)
20:50:50  <planetmaker> what's your failure for renum?
20:51:07  <andythenorth> can't create
20:51:12  <planetmaker> ok. same here
20:51:27  <planetmaker> then it was us two which talked about it probably.
20:53:33  <planetmaker> yeah :-)
20:53:43  <planetmaker> grfcodec -d doesn't produce invalid pcx :-)
20:54:04  <planetmaker> you must have (accidentially) fixed that, too in some of the commits
20:55:01  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1238 (New): 1 tile buffer - Oil Refinery Mine (andythenorth) @
20:55:01  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1239 (New): 1 tile buffer - Paper Mill (andythenorth) @
20:55:45  <planetmaker> but please only for automatic placement, andythenorth :-) ^
20:56:10  <andythenorth> planetmaker: see #1236
20:56:15  <planetmaker> or industrial complexes might look a bit more boring ;-)
20:56:33  <planetmaker> ah :-)
20:56:37  <andythenorth> you'll want to build roads and stations anyway :P
20:58:14  <andythenorth> can building industry be a griefing tactic in MP?
20:58:21  <andythenorth> I suppose no more so than buying land?
21:00:10  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1240 (New): 1 tile buffer - Steel Mill (andythenorth) @
21:03:49  <Ammler> planetmaker: does openttd use the same buoy for the GUI and the map?
21:04:12  <planetmaker> yes
21:04:27  <Ammler> and why isn't that a openttd bug?
21:04:46  <planetmaker> it's by design I was told
21:05:26  <planetmaker> But I don't really know the answer to your question
21:05:34  <planetmaker> maybe frosch knows ;-)
21:05:47  <Ammler> also it breaks the ttdp compatiblity, which we might not care, but...
21:06:02  <planetmaker> I guess I don't care anymore
21:06:06  <Ammler> :-)
21:06:23  <Ammler> I just don't get it
21:06:36  <planetmaker> since DaleStan left basically the last dev who did regularily *something* left
21:06:57  <planetmaker> so I consider it a zombi
21:07:09  <planetmaker> not yet quite dead, but dead in its core
21:07:39  <planetmaker> the nicer metaphor would be coral reef ;-)
21:08:02  <planetmaker> some flowers and nice things outside, but inside set in dead stone ;-)
21:08:11  <frosch123> Ammler: ttdp also does not use the buoy with water if you activate canals
21:08:25  <planetmaker> ah there was the reason
21:08:30  <frosch123> only the guy sprite is used since canals
21:08:36  <frosch123> so, basically since ever :p
21:08:43  <Ammler> oh, ok :-)
21:08:51  * planetmaker also wants girl sprites, if there are guy sprites :-P
21:09:51  <planetmaker> frosch123: I guess not much point re-defining that baseset sprite?
21:10:02  * andythenorth is done for the day
21:10:10  <planetmaker> as it would get trouble with the TTD baseset?
21:10:38  <Rubidium> planetmaker: does your grfcodec issue still happen?
21:10:39  <frosch123> what?
21:11:05  <planetmaker> frosch123: re-defining the 4 gui sprites in the base sets (each climate buoy) as an overlay sprite
21:11:22  <planetmaker> Rubidium: the invalid pcx? Doesn't seem so. I got a valid pcx for se rails
21:11:35  <planetmaker> for my self-compiled grfcodec
21:11:50  <Rubidium> good, so self-compiled on OSX works and no other known issues
21:12:24  <planetmaker> did you remove the osx binaries already?
21:13:01  <Rubidium> on the main server; haven't pushed it to the mirrors yet
21:15:22  <andythenorth> hmm
21:15:30  <andythenorth> my boost build finished now
21:15:51  <andythenorth> nforenum still won't build though
21:16:17  <planetmaker> well. grfcodec works/ed.
21:16:45  <planetmaker> so in principle you could continue to supply it. But w/o nforenum there's not much point
21:17:36  <Rubidium> andythenorth: what's the error now?
21:17:43  <andythenorth> same as before
21:17:49  <andythenorth> can't find the boost libraries
21:17:59  <Rubidium> (in a completely clean repository; no Makefile.local)
21:17:59  <andythenorth> I tried the various suggestions for makefile.local you gave
21:18:29  <Rubidium> where did it install boost and what version of boost did it install?
21:20:04  <andythenorth> in opt/local/include
21:20:05  <andythenorth> boost @1.38.0_0+darwin_9
21:20:26  <planetmaker> that's not really new
21:21:42  <planetmaker> I know it works with 1.40. Though... I *think* that the boost version of yours is not the problem
21:21:59  <andythenorth> I had 1.43 installed manually earlier
21:22:14  <andythenorth> is it time to call time on this?
21:22:40  <andythenorth> or still digging?
21:23:14  <Rubidium> there's a /opt/local/include/boost/current_function.hpp ?
21:24:04  <Rubidium> could you do a make clean? And then a make?
21:24:12  <Rubidium> maybe something old is messing up stuff
21:24:25  <andythenorth> Rubidium: current_function.hpp exists in that path
21:24:58  <andythenorth> Rubidium: make clean then make looks promising
21:27:02  <andythenorth> ok I'm now cooking with OS X nforenum :)
21:27:09  <andythenorth> done
21:28:47  <planetmaker> :-)
21:28:56  <Rubidium> yay!
21:29:01  <planetmaker> yuhu!
21:29:06  <Rubidium> one less reason to use wine! :)
21:30:09  <planetmaker> andythenorth: then go for grfcodec, too
21:30:10  <Ammler> planetmaker: please note my fix... :-)
21:30:20  <planetmaker> Ammler: fix?
21:30:20  <andythenorth> planetmaker: grfcodec already works for me on OS X
21:30:24  <planetmaker> ah
21:30:25  <andythenorth> been using it for months :)
21:30:27  <planetmaker> good :-)
21:30:38  <planetmaker> also the new one? ;-)
21:30:41  <andythenorth> haven't tried building it
21:30:52  <planetmaker> see. Just as easy as nforenum
21:31:05  <planetmaker> You could add updating them to your usual newgrf updating routines
21:31:17  <planetmaker> newgrf in the sense of repository pulls
21:31:27  <Ammler> brot?
21:32:19  <planetmaker> hm?
21:32:22  <Rubidium> Ammler: brot is a lazy today; he'll reply when he thinks it's a good time to do so
21:33:14  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Revision 480:93e57581f051: Fix (r478,r479): The clima skip is made in the main nfo, add... (Ammler) @
21:33:16  <Ammler> I slapped him, should be back and fit again :-)
21:33:31  <Ammler> planetmaker: this fix ^
21:33:40  <andythenorth> grfcodec built and appears to work
21:33:55  <planetmaker> oh, you did do that. well. ok
21:34:22  *** Alberth has left #openttdcoop.devzone
21:35:36  <andythenorth> some time soon I'll have to rebuild/replace default industries in FIRS
21:35:38  <andythenorth> :P
21:35:39  <Rubidium> so no reasons to stop grfcodec 1.0.0 and nforenum 4.0.0? :)
21:35:53  <Ammler> planetmaker: is the dot between "that" and "well" intended? :-P
21:36:04  <planetmaker> yes
21:36:21  <planetmaker> Rubidium: still I know no good reason :-)
21:36:26  <frosch123> Rubidium: likely not :)
21:36:26  <planetmaker> But good that we checked
21:36:58  <Ammler> I do also commit the white on blue info toolbar sprite, ok?
21:37:50  <Brot6> GRFCodec - Revision 228:c25d0a368034: Added tag 1.0.0 for changeset e5a433743592 (Rubidium) @
21:37:50  <Brot6> NFORenum - Revision 469:ca85281a9d4a: Added tag 4.0.0 for changeset 44cea243912d (Rubidium) @
21:37:50  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Feature #1233 (Closed): Try and prevent industry locating within ... (andythenorth) @
21:38:06  <planetmaker> I'd personally prefer a slightly more bright blue than this violet
21:38:44  <Ammler> oh, ok, please comment
21:38:53  <planetmaker> But I'm undecided on that issue :-)
21:39:04  <andythenorth> what industries shouldn't build in desert, besides Forest?
21:39:16  <planetmaker> Farms. Unless you model them as oasis
21:39:22  <Ammler> I agree with that we need to change it to a question mark
21:39:37  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1196 (Closed): Settings GUI support missing in r1098 (andythenorth) @
21:39:57  <andythenorth> Might draw a water pump for farms
21:40:10  <planetmaker> andythenorth: is there water in FIRS?
21:40:15  <andythenorth> in Tropic yes
21:40:18  <Ammler> shall we use releases to build grfs or keep on with nightly?
21:40:24  <andythenorth> we discussed delivering water to farms a while ago
21:40:26  <planetmaker> might be rather not in desert then a resource ;-)
21:40:30  <Ammler> (on the compiler farm)
21:40:35  <planetmaker> Ammler: nightly
21:40:37  <Rubidium> keep the nightlies :)
21:40:56  <andythenorth> planetmaker: you mean no water plants in desert?
21:41:01  <planetmaker> yes
21:41:04  <andythenorth> ok
21:41:10  <Ammler> oasis
21:41:13  <andythenorth> they should be on the coast (desalination)
21:41:19  <andythenorth> Ammler is right - oasis
21:41:21  <planetmaker> that's ok
21:41:34  <planetmaker> But oasis don't export water
21:41:41  <planetmaker> Oasis are farms ;-)
21:42:08  <planetmaker> One could argue actually for many things to be not present in the desert
21:42:36  <andythenorth> I'm making a add suggestions now!
21:42:40  <Ammler> spice
21:43:24  <andythenorth> an optional cargo I suppose
21:43:31  <Ammler> :-)
21:44:19  <andythenorth> any others?
21:45:52  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1165:898c52face8a: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:45:52  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1166:ee772c423a64: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:45:52  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1167:062efadb0972: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:45:54  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1168:96ce7fd3fcff: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:45:58  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1169:7116c6ab7361: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:46:02  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1170:595c9c91eaca: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:46:06  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Revision 1171:54ed8fe01305: Feature: use 1 tile buffer to nearest... (andythenorth) @
21:46:51  <planetmaker> let's think... mines are ok. Probably the secondary ones, too
21:47:11  <andythenorth> I think everything else is valid for desert
21:47:22  <Ammler> maybe on desert boarders?
21:47:39  <Ammler> in the middle of desert, nothing
21:47:50  <planetmaker> I like that idea, yeah
21:49:47  <andythenorth> sounds like it could have unintended consequences...
21:52:47  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Feature #741: toolbar info sprite blue instead red? (Ammler) @
21:53:27  <andythenorth> not sure how I'd implement desert checking
21:53:39  <andythenorth> I can check tile type no problem
21:53:58  <andythenorth> but not for n tiles outwards, that will be a performance pig I think
21:54:29  <andythenorth> checking for 'not desert' will be easier
21:54:37  <Ammler> what about at least one tile needs to be desert
21:54:37  * andythenorth visits TTDP wiki
21:54:47  <Ammler> at least one non-desert
21:54:56  <andythenorth> at least one desert is plausible
21:55:00  <andythenorth> sorry
21:55:06  <andythenorth> at least one non-desert
21:55:28  <andythenorth> or even a check of neighbouring tiles for maybe radius 2
21:55:49  <Ammler> oh, so tiles needs be desert
21:56:03  <Ammler> but neighbour needs to be non-desert at one side
21:56:19  <andythenorth> something like that
21:56:43  <andythenorth> hmm
21:56:53  * andythenorth rediscovers industry var 62
21:57:04  <andythenorth>
21:57:11  <Ammler> I am not sure, if it is worth
21:57:17  <andythenorth> me neither
21:57:23  <Ammler> the deserts are mostly not _that_ big
21:57:40  <andythenorth> not with terragenesis
21:57:49  <andythenorth> I think with default mapgen they are bigger
21:58:29  <andythenorth> default mapgen makes nicer tropic maps in some ways
22:01:11  <andythenorth> Ammler: planetmaker farms do look a bit weird in desert
22:01:14  <andythenorth> I might prevent them
22:01:41  <planetmaker> by the game: of course
22:01:42  <Ammler> yes, you would need special graphics
22:01:50  <planetmaker> by the player. Dunno
22:01:54  <Ammler> with somehting oasisish
22:02:37  <andythenorth> planetmaker: (nearly) all location restrictions for FIRS apply to map gen only :)
22:03:11  <planetmaker> yeah :-) I'm damaged by ECS uber-restrictive behaviour ;-)
22:05:11  <andythenorth> resp desert, I could probably find a picture for most types of industry in desert *somewhere* :)
22:05:11  <andythenorth>
22:05:38  <andythenorth> nevada and california for example
22:05:40  <andythenorth> or australia
22:06:18  <Brot6> GRFCodec - GRFCodec 1.0.0 (Rubidium) @
22:08:46  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1241 (New): Many industries are incorrectly allowed to build... (andythenorth) @
22:08:51  <andythenorth> hmm
22:08:56  * andythenorth sad face
22:09:46  <Brot6> NFORenum - NFORenum 4.0.0 (Rubidium) @
22:10:40  <Brot6> OpenGFX - Bug #1230: Toyland Buoy Follow up (athanasios) @
22:11:26  <andythenorth> good night
22:12:54  <Brot6> FIRS Industry Replacement Set - Bug #1241 (New): Many industries are incorrectly allowed to build... (andythenorth) @
22:13:42  *** ODM has quit IRC
22:14:28  <Rubidium> night andythenorth
22:20:44  <frosch123> night
22:20:49  *** frosch123 has quit IRC
22:35:11  <Ammler> Rubidium: 404
22:36:12  <Rubidium> where did I post that url?
22:36:48  <Ammler> you didn't post any url, so I used the url from the RC
22:37:00  <Rubidium> then remove the trailing / or add 4.0.0
22:37:06  <Ammler>
22:37:37  <Ammler> hmm, yes works
23:10:48  <Ammler> Rubidium: install: cannot create directory `/usr/share/doc/grfcodec': Permission denied
23:11:59  <Rubidium> you ain't root?
23:12:23  <Ammler> oh, a typo
23:12:41  <Ammler> DEST not DIST :-)
23:17:12  <Ammler> that is just because of those cargodist patch
23:23:13  <Rubidium> now you only have to dump SLES9
23:25:00  <Ammler> I guess, that happens officially this autumn anyway
23:26:50  <Rubidium> why does the nforenum spec have nforenum-boost and the grfcodec one not?
23:27:06  <Ammler> because grfcodec doesn't need newest boost
23:27:21  <Ammler> nforenum needs min. 1.4x
23:27:30  <Rubidium> ah, mkay
23:28:03  <Ammler> or something new, maybe 1.39 didn't really look deeper
23:28:22  <Ammler> that nforenum-boost is for the old distros only
23:38:33  <Ammler> <-- tried to build for debian too :-)
23:40:08  <Rubidium> yeah, we use the "latest" packaging stuff, which isn't in stable releases yet :)
23:40:37  <Rubidium> it can be installed in 5.0 via backports, though that doesn't help you much
23:40:44  <Rubidium> even then... what's the point?
23:41:07  <Rubidium> unsupported distro and distro we already build binaries for
23:43:05  <Ammler> dedicated version
23:43:17  <Ammler> and wondering :-)
23:44:18  <Ammler> you would rather support dedicated version instead 10 different versions of the same
23:44:38  <Ammler> not 10, but 2-3
23:45:58  <Rubidium> ever figured out why ttdviewer fails? :)
23:48:42  <Ammler> abort: requirement 'fncache' not supported!
23:48:57  <Ammler> would need a newer hg
23:49:06  <Ammler> or a hg at all :-)
23:49:16  <Rubidium> exactly... working copy is newer than what "I" support
23:50:26  <Ammler> well, the older release didn't have requirement of hg

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