Log for #openttdcoop.stable on 19th January 2016:
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11:08:02  <happpy> hi
11:11:56  <coopserver> *** Farnsworth has joined company #2
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11:14:16  <happpy> how things  Farnsworth
11:14:23  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> hi
11:14:25  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> good thanks
11:14:29  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> how yours?
11:14:35  <happpy> good
11:15:57  <happpy> i fixs won ov the  oill pick up  ther was a bit ov  train line was not ther and i dun the food pick up  station
11:16:54  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> great ill finish LLRR for machine shop
11:17:47  <happpy> its the station  space as stop ne doing it
11:18:20  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> station done now need to join it to network
11:20:25  <happpy> nice
11:48:56  <happpy> i dont no wher u going to doo the food drop of
11:49:15  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> im just looking for it
11:49:32  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> and i think i found a good spot
11:49:57  <happpy> nice dus ut need a slh
11:50:41  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> there is a town near to slh 01
11:50:54  <happpy> coll
11:50:55  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> and only 1 station connected to this slh
11:51:07  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> so no big traffic
11:51:16  <happpy> coll go for itv
11:51:19  <happpy> it
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12:18:04  <happpy> wb
12:18:19  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> ty
12:18:43  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> food drop ready and 2 more oil wells connected)
12:19:03  <happpy> nice
12:19:36  <happpy> that will help the petal
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15:35:14  <happpy> wb
15:35:32  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> :)
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16:43:48  <happpy> !ip
16:43:48  <coopserver> happpy:
16:44:22  <solitaire> oh
16:44:23  <solitaire> ok
16:44:24  <solitaire> thanks
16:44:25  <happpy> try thart  solitaire
16:44:35  <happpy> np
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16:45:05  <coopserver> *** solitaire has started a new company #6
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16:45:21  <happpy> welcome
16:45:33  <coopserver> <solitaire> it's time to suck at the game
16:45:42  <happpy> to see the rules doo ! rurls
16:46:00  <solitaire> i've already read the rules. thanks, though :)
16:46:07  <happpy> ok np
16:46:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> oh boy firs
16:46:23  <coopserver> <solitaire> this oughta be good
16:46:30  <happpy> ther no goal
16:46:42  <happpy> yep true
16:48:29  <happpy> ther need supplies so   u can get mor
16:48:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> ye
16:49:13  <happpy> if u clike on then it tels u whont ther need
16:49:28  <coopserver> <solitaire> i'm just gonna go with normal rail because i have no idea how nuts works
16:50:55  <happpy> nuts works like uver train set dus but the cargo  on the train can be all cargo
16:51:46  <coopserver> <solitaire> ah
16:55:43  <happpy>  if u need help just  say
16:56:06  <coopserver> <solitaire> just tryin to set up a nice looking hub rn
16:56:27  <happpy> ok
17:01:24  <happpy> if u  look at my company u will see sume bbh and slh and hub
17:01:52  <coopserver> <solitaire> probably gonna run out of money before i have a single train up
17:03:43  <happpy> hold on i give u sume
17:04:37  <happpy> give me 2 minrs
17:04:44  <happpy> mints
17:04:52  <coopserver> <solitaire> alright
17:05:12  <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients)
17:05:28  <coopserver> *** happy train sport has joined
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17:05:55  <coopserver> <solitaire> `
17:06:22  <coopserver> *** happy train sport has joined company #2
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17:06:46  <coopserver> <solitaire> that's
17:06:49  <coopserver> <solitaire> a lot of money
17:07:01  <happpy> yep
17:07:22  <happpy> i get it back from my trains
17:07:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> heh
17:07:36  <coopserver> <solitaire> thanks
17:07:40  <happpy> now go and get sune trains going
17:07:46  <coopserver> <solitaire> sure thing
17:07:49  <happpy> np
17:07:51  <coopserver> <solitaire> this is probably the shittiest junction ever made
17:08:07  <happpy> it dont mater
17:09:31  <happpy> just get sune trains going and get sune incume in
17:09:52  <happpy> have un
17:09:55  <happpy> fun
17:10:03  <coopserver> <solitaire> thank you
17:10:08  <happpy> np
17:12:59  <happpy> if u need mor money  get let me no
17:37:52  *** ChanServ sets mode: +v Mazur
17:37:53  *** ChanServ sets mode: -o Mark
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17:45:46  <coopserver> <Mark> hi
17:46:47  <coopserver> <Mark> solitaire: need tips already?
17:47:35  <coopserver> <solitaire> i mean
17:47:40  <coopserver> <solitaire> i can appreciate feedback on my network
17:47:48  <coopserver> <solitaire> apart from 'the train is really slow'
17:48:00  <coopserver> <Mark> well thats easy
17:48:02  <coopserver> <solitaire> which i'm... already kinda aware i should fix
17:48:03  <coopserver> <Mark> add a locomotive
17:48:04  <coopserver> <Mark> :P
17:48:08  <coopserver> <solitaire> not that slow
17:48:21  <coopserver> <solitaire> but yeah i'm using a steam loco so it's bound to be slow
17:48:28  <coopserver> <Mark> for TL5 you should usually have 2 locs
17:48:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> what's a tl5
17:48:35  <coopserver> <Mark> you know about autoreplace right?
17:48:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> ye
17:48:42  <coopserver> <Mark> train length 5 tiles
17:49:12  <coopserver> <Mark> you know how to place oneway signals?
17:49:29  <coopserver> <solitaire> if you mean OW-PBS, i already have quite a few of those
17:49:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> if you mean... other stuff, then no
17:49:37  <coopserver> <Mark> i mean oneway block signals
17:49:40  <coopserver> <solitaire> oh
17:49:41  <coopserver> <solitaire> yeah
17:49:44  <coopserver> <Mark> alright
17:49:49  <coopserver> <Mark> ALWAYS use oneway block signals
17:49:52  <coopserver> <solitaire> i don't really see the point of doing that here, given the ow-pbs at the end
17:50:05  <coopserver> <solitaire> just a lot more work to click each thing once or twice :P
17:50:20  <coopserver> <Mark> there are a few situations where you can use twoway block signals, but thats advanced stuff
17:50:38  <coopserver> <Mark> what if a train stops and turns around
17:50:40  <coopserver> <Mark> for whatever reason
17:50:52  <coopserver> <solitaire> why would it do that
17:50:55  <coopserver> <Mark> it might be fine in the simple network you have now, but not in the future
17:51:01  <coopserver> <Mark> just use oneway signals
17:51:07  <coopserver> <Mark> please
17:51:08  <coopserver> <solitaire> sigh
17:51:11  <coopserver> <solitaire> here's to a lot of clicking
17:51:15  <coopserver> <Mark> no its not
17:51:25  <coopserver> <Mark> you know how to autosignal?
17:51:37  <coopserver> <solitaire> [whistling]
17:51:43  <coopserver> <Mark> watch !here
17:51:53  <coopserver> <Mark> see it?
17:52:00  <coopserver> <solitaire> i don't even know how to find the sign list
17:52:09  <coopserver> <Mark> its right next to your network
17:52:13  <coopserver> <solitaire> oh there we go
17:52:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> i'm lookin
17:52:23  <coopserver> <Mark> alright
17:52:26  <coopserver> <Mark> so place one signal
17:52:30  <coopserver> <Mark> see the little signal box?
17:52:38  <coopserver> <Mark> set the number to 2
17:52:41  <coopserver> <solitaire> the sad and lonely signal? yeah
17:52:50  <coopserver> <Mark> the signal selection gui box
17:52:53  <coopserver> <solitaire> oh
17:52:55  <coopserver> <solitaire> it's already set to 2
17:52:58  <coopserver> <Mark> k
17:53:11  <coopserver> <Mark> so hover over the signal, hold ctrl and drag a few tiles
17:53:17  <coopserver> <Mark> in the direction you  want to signal
17:53:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> the holding ctrl part is the one i missed
17:53:21  <coopserver> <Mark> done
17:53:29  <coopserver> <Mark> it will go around corners too
17:53:41  <coopserver> <Mark> and bridges
17:53:46  <coopserver> <Mark> untill it hits a junction
17:54:01  <coopserver> <solitaire> well i guess this is useful for placing new signals
17:54:08  <coopserver> <solitaire> anything to make replacing all the signals i already have a bit easier?
17:54:56  <coopserver> <Mark> press r and ctrl drag to remove signals
17:55:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> probably should've just used normal drag so i don't remove the pbs at the end :D
17:55:54  <coopserver> <solitaire> aaaand nope, still generated 2-way block singals
17:55:59  <coopserver> <solitaire> signals*
17:56:16  <coopserver> <Mark> it shouldnt
17:56:42  <coopserver> <solitaire> holding ctrl basically completes the line as far as it can, right?
17:56:46  <coopserver> <Mark> yes
17:56:59  <coopserver> <solitaire> but the dragging direction doesn't seem to affect block signals at all
17:57:07  <coopserver> <solitaire> i can flip PBS by dragging
17:57:13  <coopserver> <solitaire> doesn't seem like the block signals care
17:57:39  <coopserver> <Mark> they do
17:57:45  <coopserver> <Mark> can i join your company?
17:57:49  <coopserver> <solitaire> sure
17:57:52  <coopserver> *** Mark has joined company #6
17:57:57  <coopserver> <Mark> watch that hub
17:58:02  <coopserver> <Mark> i will resignal it
17:58:03  <coopserver> <solitaire> made a little piece of test rail to the side
17:58:05  <coopserver> <solitaire> just use that for now
17:58:17  <coopserver> <solitaire> here, i'll click and drag:
17:58:22  <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients)
17:58:23  <coopserver> <solitaire> whoops wrong signal
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17:58:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> see?
17:58:37  <coopserver> <Mark> done
17:58:38  <coopserver> <Mark> easy
17:58:43  <coopserver> <Mark> just keep playing with it
17:58:45  <coopserver> <Mark> it works
17:59:00  <coopserver> <solitaire> pretty sure you just killed all of my pbs
17:59:06  <coopserver> <Mark> yes theyre pointless
17:59:22  <coopserver> <Mark> you only need pbs when a track splits AND theres a signal gap afterwards
17:59:29  <coopserver> <Mark> you never need them at joins
17:59:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> what about the depot hubs or the x-rails?
17:59:41  <coopserver> <Mark> so the ones at your station entry are good, the rest are pointless
17:59:52  <coopserver> <Mark> get rid of the depot hubs
17:59:57  <coopserver> <Mark> they will cause jams
18:00:04  <coopserver> <Mark> just place a depot at both sides
18:00:12  <coopserver> <solitaire> alright
18:00:43  <coopserver> *** Mazur has left the game (Leaving)
18:00:46  <coopserver> <solitaire> weird, dragging worked now
18:00:53  <coopserver> <solitaire> and then it didn't again
18:01:18  <coopserver> <solitaire> spooky
18:01:21  <Mazur> It stops at hte first signal or split or join it encounters.
18:01:31  <coopserver> <solitaire> no, not ctrl
18:01:37  <coopserver> <solitaire> i mean dragging to set block signal direction
18:02:17  <coopserver> <solitaire> mark: by your saying, it shouldn't be possible to drag-place two-way signals, right?
18:02:21  <Mazur> That does not work, it's clicking that cycles through the 6 types.
18:02:33  <coopserver> <solitaire> seems to work fine for mark
18:02:41  <Mazur> Damn, now I confuse myself.
18:02:48  <coopserver> <Mark> of course you can drag click twoway signals
18:02:50  <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients)
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18:02:54  <coopserver> <Mark> drag place
18:02:56  <coopserver> *** Mazur has started a new company #7
18:03:03  <coopserver> <solitaire> so how do i drag place one-ways then
18:03:20  <coopserver> *** Mazur has left the game (Leaving)
18:03:34  <coopserver> <Mark> place the first one, hover the mouse over it, hold ctrl and drag
18:03:42  <coopserver> <solitaire> well
18:03:46  <coopserver> <solitaire> now i know
18:03:54  <coopserver> <Mark> you can do it with any signal
18:03:58  <coopserver> <solitaire> thought i just had to click and drag like onbpbs
18:04:04  <Mazur> You place the first, click to get the fright direction, and, still holding hte last click, drag,
18:04:39  <coopserver> <Mark> you need the pbs at the station entries btw
18:04:43  <coopserver> <Mark> all others can go
18:05:59  <coopserver> <solitaire> aight
18:07:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> alright, current setup should work, then
18:07:52  <coopserver> <solitaire> gonna replace the loco on one of my trains for a little comparision
18:10:08  <coopserver> <solitaire> i'm guessing "SUPERSTRONG" isn't really the type of loco i want for a TL5
18:10:23  <coopserver> <Mark> you could
18:10:34  <coopserver> <Mark> theyre more suitable for pulling long trains up big hills
18:10:45  <coopserver> <solitaire> i mean i don't have any big hills
18:10:46  <coopserver> <solitaire> but ok
18:10:58  <coopserver> <Mark> soilwork is a good choice
18:11:03  <coopserver> <Mark> but you will have to convert to mrail
18:11:10  <coopserver> <solitaire> i accidentally just gave it 570000F
18:11:21  <coopserver> <solitaire> this is too much power
18:11:40  <coopserver> <Mark> its fine
18:11:50  <coopserver> <solitaire> alright. gonna replace the other loco and go grab dinner
18:12:05  <coopserver> <Mark> kk
18:12:10  <coopserver> *** Mark has joined company #1
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18:20:55  <coopserver> <solitaire> [spooky noises]
18:21:15  <coopserver> <solitaire> alright time for part 2
18:21:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> the lumber route
18:22:28  <coopserver> <solitaire> btw mark what do you think of my /wonderful/ hub
18:23:26  <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients)
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18:26:42  <coopserver> <solitaire> made a slightly nicer looking yet even more space wasteful junction
18:28:21  <coopserver> <solitaire> lumber line done
18:30:43  <coopserver> <solitaire> lumber line online
18:33:41  <coopserver> <solitaire> goods line online
18:34:50  <coopserver> <solitaire> why do all of my trains start out as hopelessly clueless
18:35:18  <happpy> heem
18:35:23  <coopserver> <solitaire> huh?
18:35:37  <happpy> not shor
18:37:01  <coopserver> <solitaire> i think i have too much train
18:37:16  <coopserver> <Mark> your hub looks fine solitaire
18:37:23  <coopserver> <solitaire> thanks
18:37:27  <coopserver> <Mark> and you dont have too much trains
18:37:30  <coopserver> <solitaire> my woods aren't outputting nearly enough to sustain this much train
18:37:36  <coopserver> <Mark> sure they are
18:37:45  <coopserver> <solitaire> ?
18:37:46  <coopserver> <Mark> its fine to have 2 platforms taken at all times
18:37:54  <coopserver> <solitaire> sure, but i mean i have two trains for /every/ line
18:37:57  <coopserver> <solitaire> which might be too much
18:38:07  <coopserver> <Mark> its fine
18:38:16  <coopserver> <Mark> id probably have 3 if it was my network
18:38:19  <coopserver> <solitaire> the trains spend like 90% of their time just roaming around between stations
18:39:03  <coopserver> <Mark> theres an issue with your new hub
18:39:08  <coopserver> <Mark> it joins before splitting
18:39:24  <coopserver> <Mark> basically the worst thing you can do to a hub
18:39:30  <coopserver> *** Mark has joined company #6
18:39:42  <coopserver> <Mark> do you see what i mean?
18:39:53  <coopserver> <solitaire> huh
18:40:24  <coopserver> <Mark> you did it right on the first hub
18:40:40  <coopserver> <solitaire> i'm not sure i follow
18:40:53  <coopserver> <Mark> lines should always split before another line joins it again
18:41:02  <coopserver> <solitaire> ah
18:41:15  <coopserver> <solitaire> lemme see if i can make some changes
18:41:26  <coopserver> <Mark> its fine with low traffic, but it will break with medium traffic
18:43:16  <coopserver> <Mark> see !hub
18:43:31  <coopserver> <Mark> thats the easiest and most effecient way to do a regular 3-way
18:44:12  <coopserver> <Mark> youre still joining before splitting :P
18:44:36  <coopserver> <solitaire> fucking christ
18:44:43  <coopserver> <solitaire> i basically did and then immediately undid my changes by accident
18:45:14  <coopserver> <Mark> thats a way to do it
18:45:44  <coopserver> <solitaire> there
18:45:48  <coopserver> <Mark> :)
18:45:49  <coopserver> <solitaire> that looks chaotic as fuck
18:45:54  <coopserver> <Mark> sure does
18:46:10  <coopserver> <solitaire> but yeah, i basically just avoided that really simple design because i like keeping the mainline level
18:46:24  <coopserver> <Mark> ok...
18:46:37  <coopserver> <solitaire> helps it
18:46:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> go faster
18:46:40  <coopserver> <solitaire> at least in my mind
18:46:45  <coopserver> <Mark> it doesnt
18:46:51  <coopserver> <Mark> but its up to you :P
18:47:03  <coopserver> <solitaire> it probably actually ends up making it go slower due to those huge-ass loops
18:47:09  <coopserver> <Mark> designs like this one take a LOT more space when you start using more tracks
18:47:53  <coopserver> <solitaire> i wonder if there's any good spot/way to learn the other kinds of signals
18:47:57  <coopserver> *** Mark has joined company #1
18:48:03  <coopserver> <Mark> presignals?
18:48:06  <coopserver> <solitaire> also that bridge has a support going straight through the railway under it lol
18:48:09  <coopserver> *** Mark has joined company #6
18:48:38  <coopserver> <Mark> you can create a pretty decent network with block signals and one way pbs
18:48:54  <coopserver> <solitaire> yeah but i wanna learn those other ones too so i can like
18:48:59  <coopserver> <solitaire> not fuck up stuff on coop
18:49:07  <coopserver> <Mark> ok ill show you
18:49:15  <coopserver> <Mark> look !here again
18:49:26  <coopserver> <solitaire> am
18:49:40  <coopserver> <Mark> 3 types
18:49:58  <coopserver> <Mark> an entry signal is red if all exit signals in the block after it are red
18:50:15  <coopserver> <Mark> a combo is both exit and entry
18:50:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> that's
18:50:21  <coopserver> <Mark> thats basically it.
18:50:23  <coopserver> <solitaire> simpler than i imagined
18:50:29  <coopserver> <solitaire> what about all that priority noise
18:50:48  <coopserver> <Mark> there are a lot of ways to combine them
18:50:52  <coopserver> <Mark> prio works the same way
18:51:29  <coopserver> <Mark> see
18:51:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> so basically
18:51:48  <coopserver> <solitaire> what's it waiting for?
18:52:07  <coopserver> <Mark> i stopped it
18:52:10  <coopserver> <Mark> to demonstrate
18:52:11  <coopserver> <solitaire> oh
18:52:40  <coopserver> <Mark> understand why this can be useful?
18:53:13  <coopserver> <solitaire> so lemme understand this: it's basically closing down the incoming line further ahead of the train so that it can always take priority?
18:53:21  <coopserver> <Mark> yes
18:53:43  <coopserver> <solitaire> it seems kind of silly that you need an extra piece of entirely unused rail to do this
18:53:54  <coopserver> <Mark> well, you can do it another way
18:54:04  <coopserver> <Mark> like that
18:54:09  <coopserver> <solitaire> hmm
18:54:11  <coopserver> <Mark> but you cant make it any longer
18:54:19  <coopserver> <Mark> otherwise it will start blocking the other way
18:54:31  <coopserver> <Mark> watch this
18:54:51  <coopserver> <Mark> see how the first signal is still red
18:55:02  <coopserver> <solitaire> ah
18:55:03  <coopserver> <Mark> if theres another train close behind the first one, it will stop
18:55:19  <coopserver> <Mark> these prios are fine, but never make them longer than 2 signals
18:55:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> are the two-way combos on purpose or just accidental
18:55:26  <coopserver> <Mark> they have to be twoway
18:55:35  <coopserver> <Mark> cause they work both ways
18:55:50  <coopserver> <Mark> they let a train through from one side, but write to the entry signal the other way
18:56:18  <coopserver> <solitaire> this is pretty confusing. i'm probably gonna have to stare at this setup for a bit to get it
18:57:55  <coopserver> <Mark> yeah pre signals are very simple but they can be combined into very complicated systems
18:58:29  <coopserver> *** Game paused (connecting clients)
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18:58:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> ok, i see, so this is basically abusing the train's pathfinding
18:58:47  <coopserver> <Mark> abusing how?
18:58:52  <coopserver> <Mark> its just presignal functionality
18:58:53  <coopserver> <Farnsworth> hey
18:58:56  <coopserver> <Mark> hi
18:59:01  <coopserver> <solitaire> it can't actually turn from the entry signal towards the combo ones
18:59:07  <coopserver> <Mark> no
18:59:09  <coopserver> <solitaire> but it still waits for them to be clear
18:59:15  <coopserver> <Mark> yes
18:59:31  <coopserver> <solitaire> so it can go out the exit that doesn't even have an exit/combo signal
18:59:43  <coopserver> <Mark> yea
19:00:03  <coopserver> <solitaire> i see
19:00:11  <coopserver> <Mark> this isnt what presignals originally were for though
19:00:15  <coopserver> <Mark> they were used for station entries
19:00:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> how so?
19:00:59  <coopserver> <Mark> because now a train will wait at the entry if all platforms are taken
19:01:04  <coopserver> <solitaire> ah
19:01:06  <coopserver> <solitaire> makes sense
19:01:10  <coopserver> <Mark> otherwise it might go the wrong platform
19:01:17  <coopserver> <Mark> ie one that clears last
19:01:25  <coopserver> <Mark> but a oneway presignal does exactly the same
19:01:27  <coopserver> <solitaire> so basically the other prio design you showed me
19:01:34  <coopserver> <solitaire> works better because neither of the two trains can acces the dummy rail
19:01:40  <coopserver> <Mark> yes
19:02:28  <coopserver> <solitaire> hmm
19:02:33  <coopserver> <solitaire> can you build the original design again, please?
19:02:38  <coopserver> <solitaire> i still have a bit of confusion on that
19:03:16  <coopserver> <solitaire> hmm
19:03:23  <coopserver> <Mark> the gap between the connections with the dummy rail cant be greater than the length of the train
19:03:24  <coopserver> <solitaire> so it's basically something like
19:03:45  <coopserver> <solitaire> the mainline has no reason to even care that the prio setup is there, and just goes ahead
19:03:51  <coopserver> <Mark> yes
19:04:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> the incoming line on the other hand has its presignal pathfinding loop back behind the mainline train
19:04:24  <coopserver> <solitaire> see that it's busy
19:04:27  <coopserver> <solitaire> and stop
19:05:20  <coopserver> <solitaire> i guess i could try going back to coop
19:05:25  <coopserver> <Mark> exactly
19:05:26  <coopserver> <solitaire> i like working with you :D
19:05:32  <coopserver> <Mark> :)
19:05:37  <coopserver> <solitaire> see you on the other side
19:05:38  <coopserver> <Mark> its fun explaining stuff
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