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00:05:15 *** Nat_AFK is now known as NataS 00:12:00 *** welterde [welterde@thinkbase.srv.welterde.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:14:13 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-152-250-188.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.88.2 [Firefox 13.0/20120531155942]] 00:31:16 <Wolf01> 'night all 00:31:22 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 00:46:31 *** KritiK [~Maxim@89-178-242-172.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:08:17 *** pugi [~pugi@host-091-097-017-188.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has quit [] 01:13:25 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-139.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 01:16:20 *** Firartix [~artixds@207.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 01:26:50 *** HootzMcToke_ [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 01:26:50 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 01:27:36 *** HootzMcTokeLP [~quassel@d205-250-9-231.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 01:34:08 *** xiong [~xiong@c-67-164-36-201.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 01:35:23 *** xiong [~xiong@c-67-164-36-201.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [] 01:48:15 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 02:02:20 *** HootzMcTokeLP [~quassel@d205-250-9-231.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 02:04:30 *** welterde [welterde@thinkbase.srv.welterde.de] has joined #openttd 02:05:33 *** Knogle [~knogle@1604ds5-soeb.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:06:15 *** Knogle [~knogle@1604ds5-soeb.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 02:18:06 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:34a8:8ed8:238c:1e7a] has quit [Quit: bye] 02:32:50 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.167] has joined #openttd 02:58:23 *** Dr_Tan [~Shep@00179a279bbd.click-network.com] has joined #openttd 03:05:22 *** NataS [~Shep@00179a279bbd.click-network.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:47:57 *** HootzMcToke_ is now known as HootzMcToke 03:48:04 <HootzMcToke> !nick 03:48:06 <HootzMcToke> !name 03:48:16 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.] 03:48:40 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 03:56:34 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:19:41 <Dr_Tan> what is "Road vehicle queuing with quantum effects"? 04:19:45 *** Dr_Tan is now known as Nat_aS 04:34:19 *** KouDy1 [~KouDy@115.133.12.255] has joined #openttd 04:41:13 *** KouDy [~KouDy@115.133.12.255] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:47:36 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4F1F.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [] 04:47:52 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC670E5.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 05:29:45 *** chlorine [~chlorine@tru75-4-82-227-168-156.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 05:29:55 <chlorine> Hello 05:39:55 <chlorine> Hey I observe some weird behaviour for my trains, I wonder if anybody could have any clue on what's happening? 05:40:17 <chlorine> Basically some of them go out of their way to go to stations they're not supposed to go to. 05:46:22 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 05:48:27 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 05:53:13 *** Rhamphoryncus [~rhamph@d161-184-227-133.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 05:55:33 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:56:15 *** Zeknurn [~Zeknurn@hd9483b0c.seveveb.dyn.perspektivbredband.net] has joined #openttd 06:18:27 <Nat_aS> check the path 06:18:39 <Nat_aS> trains will sometimes go directions just because they can 06:18:48 <Nat_aS> usualy this is because they can't go where they are suposed to go 06:20:23 <chlorine> Like if they're waiting for a free path? 06:20:30 <Nat_aS> yes 06:20:43 <Nat_aS> or sometimes even there is no free path because one of your signals is backwards 06:20:47 <Nat_aS> both are possible 06:21:03 <chlorine> No, the path is correct because most of the time the trains travel the line without problem. 06:21:11 <chlorine> And they always get to their destination. 06:21:33 <chlorine> But large portions of my line are a 2-way single track, so that might be the problem. 06:21:51 <chlorine> I'll improve that and see if it improves things. :) 06:22:19 <Nat_aS> yeah, trains often decide to try a diffrent route when waiting would be better 06:22:24 <Nat_aS> they don't like stoping if they can help it 06:22:43 <Nat_aS> so they sometimes will loop around if it's an option, even if it's a bad idea for your network 06:23:00 <chlorine> OK, thanks! :) 06:23:19 <chlorine> I hate to think of the time I'll need to upgrade the whole line to 2 tracks though :/ 06:24:24 <chlorine> I gotta run, bye. 06:24:30 *** chlorine [~chlorine@tru75-4-82-227-168-156.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 06:34:44 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:40:31 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 06:42:58 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #openttd 06:46:41 *** telanus [~Barney_Er@196-210-208-113.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #openttd 06:57:03 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has joined #openttd 07:10:36 <andythenorth> bongiorno 07:11:09 *** Nat_aS is now known as Nat_AFK 07:22:19 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:22:22 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 07:25:47 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:29:38 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 07:30:49 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd 07:30:52 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 07:32:39 <andythenorth> ho Alberth 07:32:53 <Alberth> hi hi 07:33:08 <Alberth> bandits are running again? :) 07:38:39 <V453000> get them back to prison? 07:42:24 <andythenorth> bandit works for me, dunno about the compile farm (offline) 07:43:03 <andythenorth> ho, actually bundles server has bandit from yesterday 07:43:09 <andythenorth> appears it worked 07:51:58 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@p3E9D2F65.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:04:59 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db13609.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 08:07:04 *** Devroush [~dennis@178-119-153-135.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 08:15:13 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCBF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 08:32:23 <andythenorth> would farms be better with roadtypes? 08:32:31 <andythenorth> less infrastructure 08:32:33 <andythenorth> hmm 08:33:32 * andythenorth ponders an insane scheme where loading vehicles can be told to leave a station to make room for an incoming vehicle dropping off 08:36:25 *** mal2__ [~mal2@port-92-206-82-241.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 08:39:03 <planetmaker> ho, what did you change to make it work? 08:39:18 <Alberth> maybe I am missing something, but why is a single road not enough? 08:40:01 <andythenorth> planetmaker: I fixed the stupid error I committed 08:40:15 <andythenorth> which I wouldn't have noticed locally until I did a manual clean of generated files 08:40:17 <planetmaker> :-) I'm happy that it works again 08:40:23 <andythenorth> moi aussi 08:41:01 <Alberth> planetmaker: http://paste.openttdcoop.org/show/1455/ :D 08:41:01 <andythenorth> Alberth: with road vehicles at farms, I need a 2-4 tile station for pickup cargo 1, 2-4 tile station for pickup cargo 2, 1 tile station drop off FMSP 08:41:10 <andythenorth> and also loops for queing 08:41:13 <andythenorth> and depots 08:41:21 <andythenorth> because RVs are stupid about routing to depots 08:41:41 <Alberth> woow, that much?! :o 08:42:12 <planetmaker> oh, lol, Alberth :-) 08:42:17 <andythenorth> worse with trams, because trams are bigger 08:42:31 <V453000> RVs are indeed ridiculously dumb about routing to depots - espcecially as you dont have any means to make them do it right as signals with trains 08:42:53 <andythenorth> I have to build a lot of depots, and/or use force-to-depot orders 08:42:54 <planetmaker> you can use "waypoints" aka drive-through road stops 08:43:10 <V453000> well I guess it is rather the lack of various tracks than signals 08:43:26 <V453000> well sure, waypoints ... but if you set autoreplace they dont really care :D 08:44:02 <V453000> "well that is a nice waypoint but you know what? I have autoreplace, I will screw up with the worst depot I could find" is their logic I think 08:44:18 <V453000> or something close to that ^^ 08:44:47 <Alberth> :) 08:46:18 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 08:47:45 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3047/farms.png 08:48:00 <andythenorth> ^ these are relatively low production farms 08:48:36 <andythenorth> there is 946t of sugar beet waiting at one of them :P 08:48:45 <andythenorth> I can't be bothered to build more trucks to take it away 08:49:21 <Alberth> what if you make a loop, so trucks can use it from both sides? 08:49:53 <andythenorth> valid 08:52:06 <andythenorth> bigger trucks? 08:52:06 <andythenorth> the 08:52:12 <andythenorth> these are only 15t 08:53:12 <FLHerne> Massive trains? :P 08:59:05 <andythenorth> covering the map in rail track? 08:59:16 * andythenorth forgot; openttd is a train game 08:59:31 <andythenorth> perhaps I should rm -r bandit/* 08:59:38 <andythenorth> saving everyone a lot of trouble 08:59:47 <andythenorth> these farms are both ugly and tedious 09:00:03 <Alberth> they're a challenge :p 09:00:05 <FLHerne> No, they aren't :-) 09:00:13 <FLHerne> They're brilliant fun :D 09:00:18 *** mal2__ [~mal2@port-92-206-82-241.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:00:29 <andythenorth> low production doesn't work; high production means 'click 1 billion times to clone yet-another-truck' 09:01:19 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d66-183-113-159.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: for the love of god this is not safe for work] 09:01:33 <Alberth> trucks just scale badly 09:01:46 <FLHerne> What's wrong with low-production, deliver supplies for a bit to get slightly-higher-production? 09:02:00 <FLHerne> i.e. how it is :P 09:02:00 <andythenorth> if production is low, it's not worth the cost of building the route 09:02:16 <andythenorth> and the secondary processor produces ~zero cargo 09:02:52 <telanus> sorry for noob question 09:02:53 <telanus> But why is ogfx-trains.tar.zip suddenly so big. Last time I downloaded it ( a bit more than a month ago) it was hardly a meg, now 38 meg ? 09:03:16 <FLHerne> They added 32-bit trains, didn't they? 09:03:24 <Zuu_> I started on a GS that would clone vehicles for you and sell them as well if production goes down. However, I got the idication that this kind of script was not welcome by the devs. So if released, the API functions used to clone/sell might be closed down in 1.3. 09:03:46 <andythenorth> I think my goals here are fundamentally incompatible 09:03:56 <Zuu_> Thus, it was never completed nor released. 09:03:56 <andythenorth> - moderate or high production, to get enough cargo out 09:04:04 <andythenorth> - desire to have minimal infrastructure at farms 09:04:19 <andythenorth> these are in conflict, and it's not an interesting conflict 09:05:19 <FLHerne> andythenorth: Serving lots of low-production farms: http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=160661 09:05:23 *** Zuu_ is now known as Zuu 09:05:58 <FLHerne> That's ten, with another couple off the edge. Works ok :-) 09:05:59 <andythenorth> are those all feeding one processor? 09:06:23 <Terkhen> good morning 09:06:28 <andythenorth> lo Terkhen 09:06:34 <FLHerne> They all go to the rail station in the middle, then by train to the far side of the map :P 09:06:45 <andythenorth> so you get pretty high production out at the other end 09:06:48 <FLHerne> I've got a few clusters like that... 09:06:48 <andythenorth> ? 09:06:52 <FLHerne> Yep 09:06:54 <andythenorth> k 09:07:00 <andythenorth> so I play 256x256 maps 09:07:06 <andythenorth> I get 2 grain farms maybe 09:07:10 <andythenorth> maybe 1 sheep farm 09:07:19 <andythenorth> 2 dairy farms 09:07:22 <andythenorth> etc 09:07:24 <FLHerne> Mine are 512x512 or 512x1024 mostly 09:07:45 <FLHerne> Make farms more common on smaller maps? :-) 09:07:53 <andythenorth> this is one possibility yes 09:08:01 <andythenorth> we now have a cb for construction probability 09:08:03 <FLHerne> Can Newgrfs detect map size? 09:08:06 <andythenorth> yes 09:08:39 <FLHerne> Oh, ok. Would be possible then :-) 09:08:55 <andythenorth> the electrified tramways running all over the countryside don't bother you? 09:09:40 <__ln__> in continental europe it's normal to have electricity in the countryside 09:09:55 <telanus> here tooo 09:10:09 <FLHerne> I'd rather have unelectrified ones 09:10:21 <FLHerne> No roadtypes yet, though :-( 09:11:21 <andythenorth> how are you delivering FMSP? 09:12:21 <FLHerne> More trams! :P 09:12:23 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-152-250-188.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 09:12:30 <FLHerne> Those little ones you added... 09:13:12 <FLHerne> The Plant Fibre trains come back with FMSP (Autorefit) and then the trams distribute them 09:13:27 <andythenorth> I only see one station at most farms 09:13:36 <andythenorth> how do you get the FMSP delivered? 09:13:51 <andythenorth> without being blocked by loading trams? 09:14:48 <Zuu> If the trams are point to point, they could use autorefit to deliver farm supplies on the way back. 09:14:49 <FLHerne> There are 2 at each 09:14:57 <FLHerne> It just doesn't show 09:15:02 <andythenorth> k 09:15:16 <Zuu> If they visit several stations and load a little bit here and there, that will not work though. 09:15:22 <FLHerne> Turning signs off for good screenshots doesn't help that :P 09:15:43 <andythenorth> you don't have depots at the pickup stations? 09:15:56 <FLHerne> HEQS doesn't autorefit yet, does it? 09:15:59 <andythenorth> how do you prevent 'tram arrives, turns around, goes back (long way) to depot for service'? 09:16:13 * FLHerne turned off breakdowns/services 09:16:18 <andythenorth> oh 09:16:20 <andythenorth> :( 09:16:25 <FLHerne> It just gets very annoying 09:16:46 <andythenorth> it bothers me that the feature is so broken 09:16:51 <andythenorth> turning it off seems like cheating 09:17:03 <FLHerne> When I have quad-track mainlines at capacity, I really don't want holdups... 09:17:27 <FLHerne> ...especially because those the stop the service and cause more breakdowns :-( 09:17:28 <andythenorth> breakdowns / servicing doesn't add interesting challenge, it's jus tedious 09:17:31 <andythenorth> yet I leave it on :P 09:17:40 <andythenorth> btw HEQS does autorefit trams, don't use it, it causes a trapped assert, and HEQS will be disabled 09:17:59 <planetmaker> hm 09:18:02 <FLHerne> So basically, it doesn't? :P 09:18:03 <planetmaker> not good :-( 09:18:27 <andythenorth> it's the spec 09:18:36 <andythenorth> 'vehicles may not change length' 09:18:46 <andythenorth> but of course, the spec also allows that they can 09:19:00 <FLHerne> Separate vehicles for lengths? 09:19:18 <FLHerne> I think I said that before, actually :-( 09:19:21 <andythenorth> removing auto-refit would be the more correct solution 09:19:31 <andythenorth> as length-changing predates it 09:19:35 <Chris_Booth> hi all 09:20:09 <FLHerne> 09:20:41 <FLHerne> But how many sets actually use length-changing anyway? 09:20:52 <Chris_Booth> HEQS 09:21:12 <FLHerne> I know. Can't think of any others though. 09:21:37 <Chris_Booth> erm there was a bus set I was using the otherday 09:21:52 <Chris_Booth> but only 2 or 3 out of all the RV sets 09:22:10 <FLHerne> Length-changing breaks AIs anyway, and auto-refit is more use than a slight reduction in buy-menu entries 09:23:55 <Chris_Booth> Ikarus was the other set 09:24:07 <FLHerne> Oh, ok 09:24:12 <Chris_Booth> oh and Long Vehicles 09:24:21 <Chris_Booth> so those 3 are the only 3 I know of 09:24:30 <andythenorth> some tram sets use it 09:24:35 <andythenorth> BANDIT will use it 09:24:38 <FLHerne> Do those get broken by auto-refits? 09:24:51 <andythenorth> if they use auto-refit they will be disabled 09:25:32 <FLHerne> Perhaps there should be a 'don't let the player autorefit these' flag of some kind? 09:25:45 <FLHerne> Although autorefitting would be better :P 09:26:04 <Chris_Booth> don't mean to sound stupid, but what is autorefit? 09:26:29 <Terkhen> Chris_Booth: refit your vehicles to different cargos at stations 09:26:52 <Chris_Booth> oh so removing the need for to go depot and refit 09:26:54 <Terkhen> OpenGFX+ Trains stable and OpenGFX+ Road Vehicles nightly support it 09:26:55 <FLHerne> Based on what's there, too :D 09:27:11 <FLHerne> So makes multi-cargo trains possible finally :-) 09:27:25 <andythenorth> FLHerne: auto-refit has to be explicitly enabled, so it won't break existing sets 09:27:32 <Terkhen> in OpenGFX+ we adopted a scheme based on the cargo type and the vehicle/wagon type 09:27:51 <andythenorth> but well-meaning authors can enable it without understanding that it causes the grf to be disabled / game to be paused with warning (can't remember which) 09:27:59 <Terkhen> you can't refit a wagon that has been carrying coal to wheat without cleaning it at a depot first :P 09:28:11 <FLHerne> andythenorth: So why does HEQS not-exactly-support it? 09:28:28 <andythenorth> (1) I didn't enable it for all vehicles yet 09:28:35 <Chris_Booth> can you implicitly tell auto refit to refit to only one cargo, something like oil -> autorefit to petrol -> autorefit to engineering supplies -> autorefit to oil? 09:28:37 <FLHerne> Or do you count as a'well-meaning author'? 09:28:48 <andythenorth> (2) the vehicles it is enabled for should not have it enabled 09:28:48 <FLHerne> You can, yes 09:29:09 <Chris_Booth> hhhm could make my FIRS station 50% smaller 09:32:51 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has joined #openttd 09:34:13 * FLHerne grumbles about poor livestock support in UKRS2 09:34:29 <FLHerne> Realistic, but very inconvenient :-( 09:36:35 <andythenorth> you need trucks after about 1965 09:36:58 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@p3E9D2F65.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 09:37:07 <FLHerne> I know. That's the probelem :-( 09:37:21 <Chris_Booth> sounds strange forcing you to change from trains to trucks in 1965 09:37:59 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@p3E9D2F65.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 09:38:03 <FLHerne> Realistic for the UK... 09:38:13 <FLHerne> Not helpful in OTTD though 09:38:59 <Chris_Booth> the UK is a strange place 09:41:08 <FLHerne> Perfectly normal. Everywhere else seems strange from here, though... 09:42:16 <Chris_Booth> lol, being from the UK I think it is strange 09:43:17 * FLHerne was joking. Definitely strange :P 09:43:49 <FLHerne> The rail system just doesn't make sense anymore... 09:46:19 <Terkhen> why? 09:46:40 *** pugi [~pugi@dyndsl-091-096-035-222.ewe-ip-backbone.de] has joined #openttd 09:50:29 <tycoondemon> !password 09:53:47 <Eddi|zuHause> where's glx when you need him? 09:55:44 <Terkhen> tycoondemon: try #openttdcoop 09:55:57 * Terkhen thought that the kicking was automatic :P 09:56:13 <__ln__> it is but only when glx is here, or something like that 10:12:20 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@p3E9D2F65.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:15:07 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has joined #openttd 10:23:23 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00bbd4.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:23:46 <__ln__> when will the OpenTTD user interface be competely redesigned and fucked up to make it touch-optimized? 10:26:41 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@p3E9D2F65.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 10:29:39 <Alberth> when the keyboard and mice have gone 10:32:18 <frosch123> yeah, i wondered whether that was also the idea behind the default-packager of wheezy 10:34:18 <__ln__> in two years all the desktops and laptops at homes are replaced by tablets, and the number of OTTD users will drop to zero because it's not touch-touch-touch. 10:36:06 <andythenorth> plausible 10:36:19 * andythenorth wonders if drawing pixels is easier on tablet 10:36:26 <andythenorth> hmm 10:36:38 <andythenorth> also andythenorth forgot the golden YouTube rule 10:37:18 <Terkhen> ignore comments? 10:37:31 *** APTX [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:40:10 *** telanus [~Barney_Er@196-210-208-113.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has left #openttd [PING 1338720516] 10:43:22 <andythenorth> yup 10:46:26 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-168-27.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 10:46:39 <Alberth> moin LordAro 10:46:57 <LordAro> hai Alberth 10:51:55 *** Firartix [~artixds@207.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 10:56:45 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has joined #openttd 10:56:50 <Wolf01> hello 10:57:12 <Alberth> hello 11:00:05 <andythenorth> ho 11:00:09 <andythenorth> this pixa thing is quite good 11:04:53 *** APTX [APTX@89-78-217-144.dynamic.chello.pl] has joined #openttd 11:13:55 <andythenorth> Alberth: space after comma in tuples? 11:14:27 <Alberth> space after comma always 11:14:55 <Alberth> there is a reason why the spacebar is so large :p 11:14:59 * andythenorth has caved in and is hard-coding some x-y offsets 11:15:16 <andythenorth> in every other part of BANDIT I've been able to use magic pixels for locating sprite sequences 11:15:19 <andythenorth> but not here :P 11:18:37 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@dsl-149-87-36.hive.is] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:19:32 <andythenorth> if this works, BANDIT will composite truck cabs with bodies and chassis 11:20:19 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@dsl-149-87-36.hive.is] has joined #openttd 11:34:47 *** BodomitdenBagger [b21b1478@ircip3.mibbit.com] has joined #openttd 11:36:15 *** BodomitdenBagger [b21b1478@ircip3.mibbit.com] has quit [] 11:41:10 *** KritiK [~Maxim@93-80-122-221.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd 11:45:14 <andythenorth> so when I update pixa, how will the compile farm install of it be updated? 12:01:40 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 12:03:30 <andythenorth> hmm 12:03:48 <andythenorth> I can no longer import pixa 12:04:26 <andythenorth> setup.py doesn't put it in the correct path 12:05:50 <frosch123> hmm, it does not longer crash, it does something different than before, it was wrong before... how to tell whether it is right now? 12:06:48 <andythenorth> did it build a grf? 12:07:01 <andythenorth> or did you try the latest pixa? 12:07:18 * andythenorth really is starting to hate setuptools 12:07:30 <FLHerne> Aargh. 14,726 Passengers waiting :-( 12:07:39 <frosch123> no, i am at FS#4254 12:07:46 <FLHerne> I need bigger trams :P 12:08:02 <frosch123> build subway 12:08:14 *** cyph3r [~Miranda@ip-213-220-193-139.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 12:09:59 <FLHerne> Hmm, might work. I'd have to blow up a lot of stuff to make room though :-( 12:10:23 * FLHerne doubles the number of trams 12:12:12 <andythenorth> so how do I install a python package? 12:12:13 *** telanus [~Barney_Er@196-210-208-113.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has joined #openttd 12:13:19 <frosch123> alberts method with PYTHONPATH worked well for me 12:13:29 <frosch123> no need to mess with the system 12:14:54 <andythenorth> I'll try that 12:14:59 <andythenorth> just wondering why the setup.py fails 12:15:05 <andythenorth> it's built as per instructions 12:16:40 <Alberth> no rights to install it at its destination? 12:18:03 <andythenorth> it installs 12:18:13 <andythenorth> Writing /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.6/lib/python2.6/site-packages/Pixa-0.2dev-py2.6.egg-info 12:18:21 <andythenorth> but that python won't see it 12:19:00 <andythenorth> it expects it to be here: /Library/Python/2.6/site-packages/pixa 12:19:06 <andythenorth> for reasons I can't discern 12:19:39 <andythenorth> I've copied it there manually, but this suggests my setup.py is junk 12:21:04 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-152-250-188.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:22:18 <Alberth> or the eggy stuff is junk 12:22:35 <Alberth> which I consider a real possibility 12:23:02 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@79-68-110-255.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has joined #openttd 12:24:18 <andythenorth> there's another way besides setuptools? 12:25:29 <Alberth> I used either distutils or autoconf tools 12:25:54 <andythenorth> actually this is distutils 12:25:54 <Alberth> where the former is the python way of doing things, and the latter the gnu way of doing things 12:26:39 * Alberth looks at the pixa setup.py file 12:27:19 <andythenorth> grab your towel :P 12:28:15 <Alberth> that looks sane 12:28:43 <Alberth> so your Python setup is insane? 12:28:50 <andythenorth> probably 12:29:12 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.65.94] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:29:19 <andythenorth> also...I added PixaShiftDX, alongside PixaShiftDY 12:29:31 <andythenorth> but might be better to have PixaShiftDXDY 12:29:34 <andythenorth> ? 12:29:48 <andythenorth> or PixaShiftXY 12:29:49 <andythenorth> or such 12:29:51 <andythenorth> ? 12:30:37 <Alberth> seems better, unless you always shift horiontally or vertically 12:30:58 <andythenorth> no, I have a case now to do both 12:31:15 <andythenorth> what do I do about backwards compatibility? 12:31:41 <andythenorth> ignore it and see if anyone complains? 12:31:50 <Alberth> def PixaShiftDY(dy): return PixaShiftXY(0, dy) 12:32:25 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.65.131] has joined #openttd 12:37:09 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@79-68-110-255.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:44:00 *** flaa [~flaa@188.141.45.124] has joined #openttd 12:46:00 *** sla_ro|master [slaco@78.96.213.97] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 12:47:10 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 12:57:18 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@p3E9D2F65.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:59:57 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-168-27.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:12:56 *** Elu [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 13:17:56 *** Elukka [Elukka@78-27-90-14.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:31:50 <andythenorth> hmm 13:32:26 <andythenorth> Alberth: I have a function that has args x, y 13:32:34 <andythenorth> e.g. blah(x, y) 13:32:44 <andythenorth> and I have the args in a tuple (x, y) 13:32:54 <telanus> Hi. Translating today, and struggling a small bit :( 13:32:54 <telanus> Is it OK to translate game tick (reference to game time) as speletjie tyd (= game time). As we don't have the idea/concept of game ticks in Afrikaans 13:33:13 <andythenorth> how can I unpack the tuple to args in a small amount of code (without modifying the function) 13:33:26 <andythenorth> ? 13:34:00 <andythenorth> or maybe I just modify the function :P 13:34:05 <Alberth> blah(*tup) 13:34:31 <andythenorth> ho 13:34:33 <andythenorth> that works :) 13:34:54 *** Firartix [~artixds@207.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 13:35:00 <andythenorth> seemed like a common case 13:35:09 <telanus> already didn't translate "scrolling" as the concept is more understood in english than afrikaans 13:35:18 *** Firartix [~artixds@207.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has joined #openttd 13:36:55 <Alberth> telanus: game tick is more a time-step 13:38:16 <telanus> I'll leave it as "ticks" then 13:39:16 <Zuu> Each in-game day have 74 ticks. 13:39:49 <telanus> ok 13:51:21 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCBF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:54:26 <frosch123> so, a tick is rough 20 minutes :p 13:56:22 <andythenorth> did I mention ship smoke recently? 13:56:29 <andythenorth> nvm 13:56:33 * andythenorth goes back to trucks 13:58:09 * FLHerne waits patiently for andythenorth to finish them :P 14:00:38 <Alberth> he prefers you to impatiently help him :p 14:05:09 *** Knogle [~knogle@1604ds5-soeb.0.fullrate.dk] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:06:03 *** Knogle [~knogle@1604ds5-soeb.0.fullrate.dk] has joined #openttd 14:10:20 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~Flex@88.130.164.14] has joined #openttd 14:14:01 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-168-27.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 14:16:51 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~Flex@i59F6A1BD.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:27:19 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@78.96.213.97] has joined #openttd 14:29:48 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:30:02 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 14:36:43 *** flaa [~flaa@188.141.45.124] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:47:15 *** chlorine [~chlorine@tru75-4-82-227-168-156.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd 14:47:22 <chlorine> Hello 14:48:30 <Alberth> hi 14:59:06 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: frosch * r24321 /trunk/src/ (4 files): -Change/Fix [FS#4254]: [NewGRF] Group vehicles in the purchase list properly by source GRF, but also consider engine GRFID overrides. 15:01:58 * andythenorth compiles 15:05:44 <andythenorth> ukrs2 seems less jumbled up in the buy menu now 15:07:33 *** flaa [~flaa@188.141.45.124] has joined #openttd 15:14:43 <Elu> http://i.imgur.com/ySzCm.jpg 15:14:46 *** Elu is now known as Elukka 15:14:52 <Elukka> COULD YOUR CHILDREN BE CODING IN LUA? 15:15:20 <Alberth> nah 15:15:50 <Alberth> language is too small to be useful 15:16:51 <Elukka> good enough for israeli and/or american cyberwarfare 15:19:09 <andythenorth> hmm 15:19:13 * andythenorth has minor brainache 15:24:23 <Eddi|zuHause> Elukka: worse... it's based on the ENGLISH LANGUAGE, which is spoken/understood in MOST OF THE WORLD! 15:24:39 <Elukka> D: 15:24:52 <Alberth> not chinese? 15:25:11 <Elukka> why chinese 15:25:21 <Eddi|zuHause> AND 99% OF ALL TERRORISTS ATE BREAD 24 HOURS BEFORE SUICIDE BOMBING! 15:25:56 <Elukka> HITLER WORE PANTS 15:26:11 <__ln__> actually english probably is not spoken/understood in most of the world 15:27:05 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: not by most of the people, but among larger groups of people it's rather likely that there is at least one person understanding it, who can translate to the others 15:27:34 <Eddi|zuHause> the estimate was that there are around 1 billion people speaking english 15:28:29 <__ln__> but they aren't equally distributed within the earth population 15:28:41 <Eddi|zuHause> the british empire covered around 25% of the worlds territorries, and that was after they lost the USA 15:31:01 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: but there's a reason why english is the lingua franca of todays world, and not e.g. french or german (which both were for some time in the past), or greek or latin (which is somewhat longer ago) 15:34:18 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: most villagers will not speak a foreign language, but most villages have educated people/leaders which do, and then that foreign language is very likely to be english 15:35:15 <__ln__> i agree it's probably more lingua franca than any other language, but english is not widely spoken or understood in places as close as Belgium or Poland. 15:36:01 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.167] has joined #openttd 15:41:05 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:48:40 <chlorine> Phew I finished converting my line to two one-way tracks, and it seems it stopped the glitches I observed, but it took _forever_! 15:49:01 <chlorine> Either I'm not good at it or my map is really two big (I suspect a mix of both) 15:50:24 <__ln__> i guess two big is better than three big 15:50:27 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 15:50:43 <chlorine> Sorry for the typo :p 15:50:57 <chlorine> And by the way does anybody know how to get rid of the away status? 15:51:22 <chlorine> /away tells me I'm already marked away... 15:57:15 <Eddi|zuHause> [705] away Without an argument, it will set you back. 15:57:58 <chlorine> away 15:58:05 <chlorine> Nope :/ 15:58:17 <Eddi|zuHause> well, with / obviously 15:58:23 <chlorine> With the / it tells me I'm already away, without it prints away 15:58:26 <chlorine> obviously :p 15:59:23 <Eddi|zuHause> works here... 15:59:28 <Eddi|zuHause> 03.06.2012 18:07] [Abwesend] Sie sind nun als abwesend markiert (Grund: test). 15:59:30 <Eddi|zuHause> [03.06.2012 18:07] [Abwesend] Sie sind nicht mehr als abwesend markiert. 15:59:38 <chlorine> Well I guess I'll just bue the ghost of the channel... 15:59:52 <Eddi|zuHause> must be your client screwing things up 15:59:53 <chlorine> s/bue/be 16:00:16 <chlorine> Yes I guess it must. I thought xchat was a good one though. 16:00:34 <chlorine> No big problem though. 16:05:05 <__ln__> there could be some other command for that, /unaway or something. 16:05:36 <chlorine> :D 16:05:41 <chlorine> Thanks, it's /back 16:05:52 <chlorine> Should have been obvious. 16:13:45 <andythenorth> ho ho ho 16:15:55 *** dfox [~dfox@89.177.105.49] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:17:35 *** dfox [~dfox@89.177.105.49] has joined #openttd 16:19:36 <frosch123> you're more than 6 months too early 16:23:17 <Eddi|zuHause> __ln__: does "HyvÀÀ PÀivÀÀ" have a meaning? 16:27:42 <__ln__> Eddi|zuHause: yes, it means "guten tag" 16:28:28 <__ln__> the second word shouldn't be capitalized though 16:34:40 *** Nat_AFK is now known as Nat_aS 16:34:54 <chlorine> Is there a setting or grf that allows to give orders like 'load until 50% full' to vehicles? 16:36:37 <Zuu> No 16:37:17 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3049/foo.png 16:37:55 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@port-92-195-87-227.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 16:37:57 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 16:37:57 <Zuu> There is a trick to have trucks shuttle back and forth between the station and a depot (or dummy station) and load cargo if available at the station. Using a conditional order, the truck will exit this back and forth shuttle and go to the destination when a given condition, eg. 50% load is met. 16:37:58 <chlorine> Hmm, too bad. 16:38:26 <Zuu> Check out eg. AIAI. It employs that tactic. 16:38:48 <chlorine> I'll check it out, but I'm not sure it would be useful in my case. 16:39:27 <chlorine> I would like to use it to have passenger trains wait a bit if they come in the station when it's completely empty, but I don't want to make them wait till they're completely full. 16:39:44 <chlorine> Well, I'm gonna go and try to improve my shuttle service to the train station. 16:39:53 <Zuu> Using the timetable, you can make them wait eg. 5 or 10 days. 16:40:16 <Zuu> However, in that case, they will wait the set time amount also if they are already full. 16:41:17 <chlorine> I'm not mastering my network enough to use a timetable I guess. 16:41:36 <chlorine> But that's something I want to try out sometime. 16:42:06 <Zuu> You don't need to set times for the traveling links. Only set the wait time at stations. That means that the trains will wait so many days at the given station. 16:43:12 <Zuu> If you time-table and also set wait time at stations, then the train might wait shorter time on the stations if they run late. But if you don't time the transport links, the trains don't know if they are late and will thus just wait the given time at the stations. 16:43:29 <chlorine> Hmm, this sounds good! :) I'll go check it. 16:43:55 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-49-99.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:44:07 <Zuu> The downside to this is that if a train become full, it will still sit around and wait. But at least it will contribute to the station rating also if its full I think. 16:49:13 <andythenorth> "most of my code is optimised not for speed or beauty, but for later doing find and replace' :P 16:51:01 <chlorine> I've set the waiting time to 2 days, it shouldn't block the train long and allow _some_ waiting. 16:51:11 <chlorine> It seems to work fine, thanks. :) 16:59:27 <andythenorth> ho ho ho 17:02:05 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3050/foo.png 17:11:14 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCBF.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd 17:14:00 *** Nat_aS is now known as Nat_AFK 17:17:09 *** glx [glx@2a01:e35:2f59:c7c0:7163:5957:446b:b67e] has joined #openttd 17:17:12 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 17:30:54 <Alberth> for some reason I always think you're missing pixels at the left (due to the missing white) :) 17:32:44 <andythenorth> I could add spurious padding :P 17:32:54 <andythenorth> trips me up too sometimes 17:34:32 <andythenorth> anyway, this is cabs + bodies composited 17:34:40 <andythenorth> adding the rear wheels is probably trivial 17:35:19 <andythenorth> I need to tweak the appearance quite a bit 17:36:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: translators * r24322 /trunk/src/lang/ (afrikaans.txt german.txt latvian.txt lithuanian.txt): 17:36:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:36:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: afrikaans - 22 changes by telanus 17:36:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: german - 25 changes by Jogio 17:36:57 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: latvian - 3 changes by Parastais 17:36:58 <CIA-1> OpenTTD: lithuanian - 65 changes by Stabilitronas 17:46:38 *** andythenorth is now known as Guest2581 17:46:38 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 17:47:03 *** Guest2581 [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 17:58:14 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-152-250-188.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:14:31 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:15:50 *** Nat_AFK is now known as Nat_aS 18:31:23 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 18:43:50 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@cpe-69-203-124-125.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 18:53:58 *** kkimlabs [~kkimlabs@NYUFGA-WLESSAUTHCLIENTS-01.NATPOOL.NYU.EDU] has joined #openttd 19:09:07 *** mal2__ [~mal2@port-92-206-82-241.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 19:17:25 <andythenorth> commentations? http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=160681 19:17:36 *** flaa [~flaa@188.141.45.124] has quit [Quit: leaving] 19:18:03 <Terkhen> it looks nice 19:18:08 <Terkhen> no 32bpp with 8x zoom? 19:18:10 <Terkhen> :P 19:18:22 <planetmaker> :-D loool 19:18:31 <planetmaker> Damn you Terkhen, you stole my comment! 19:18:43 <Terkhen> it was an easy one :) 19:20:18 <V453000> lol :) 19:20:29 <V453000> nice trucks indeed andy 19:23:35 <andythenorth> watch how fast I can draw one carrying steel 19:23:37 * andythenorth starts now 19:23:42 <V453000> :D 19:23:51 <V453000> after months of coding 19:24:43 <andythenorth> http://dev.openttdcoop.org/attachments/download/3051/foo.png 19:26:10 *** DDR [~chatzilla@d66-183-113-159.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 19:26:14 * planetmaker wonders why the owner bought such big truck for so little cargo ;-) 19:26:53 <andythenorth> steel is heavy :P 19:27:22 <planetmaker> I also wonder why the vehicle in the left-turn (moving NW) has the steel coil nearly falling off to the back of the sprite 19:27:23 <V453000> nice :) 19:27:23 *** perk11 [~perk11@46.242.11.118] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org] 19:27:44 <planetmaker> (right most sprites) 19:27:45 <andythenorth> http://www.myteeproducts.com/product_extra_images/25/CoilTarpsOnFlatbedTruck.jpg 19:28:15 <andythenorth> planetmaker: good catch on the coil falling off 19:28:24 <andythenorth> that's for this: http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/windsor/story/2009/11/11/windsor-coil-rollover-091111.html 19:28:51 <planetmaker> :-O 19:29:12 <andythenorth> he survived 19:29:24 <andythenorth> I wouldn't have linked it if it had been deaths :| 19:34:18 <andythenorth> improved the coil placement 19:34:19 <andythenorth> http://www.tt-forums.net/download/file.php?id=160682 19:35:31 <__ln__> not steel but paper here: http://www.hs.fi/english/picture/1101979929334 19:36:09 <planetmaker> looks much better andythenorth :-) 19:36:50 <planetmaker> __ln__: the difference is "unharmed" vs. "worst road crash". 19:39:54 <__ln__> yeah 19:40:48 <telanus> !night @ll 19:41:22 *** telanus [~Barney_Er@196-210-208-113.dynamic.isadsl.co.za] has left #openttd [PING 1338752991] 19:44:45 <Nat_aS> what's a good scenerio> 19:44:53 <Nat_aS> I'm pretty much done with my barrens map 19:44:59 <Nat_aS> I have almost all the industries covered 19:45:07 <Nat_aS> just a few farms and mines 19:45:16 <Nat_aS> but all the sawmills and most of the copper mines 19:45:28 * Terkhen prefers to generate random ones 19:45:42 * Nat_aS can't stand random maps 19:46:01 <Nat_aS> I like it when there are tons of priamaries and few secondaries 19:46:10 <Nat_aS> so you can focus on building a network 19:46:12 <Nat_aS> one to many 19:46:37 <Terkhen> pregenerated ones have the annoying habit of forcing you to use certain NewGRF sets :) 19:46:48 <Nat_aS> yes sadly 19:47:11 <Nat_aS> but I find i don't get (many) errors if I swap trainsets before building anything 19:47:24 <Nat_aS> if I build something, and then swap them, then trains start vanishing later on 19:47:30 <Nat_aS> but not if I do it first 19:47:55 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:48:00 <Alberth> load scenario, save heightmap, load heightmap as game 19:48:12 <Nat_aS> then I have to rebuild towns 19:48:16 <Nat_aS> and place industries 19:51:09 <frosch123> Nat_aS: write a newgrf to reduce the number of secondary industries to 1 19:51:23 <Nat_aS> how? 19:51:54 <frosch123> for default industries just set the probability to 1, or even use cb 28 20:00:53 <Sacro> grr, is there an ubuntu dedicated server package that doesn't require half of X? 20:01:13 <Alberth> ubuntu and not X ? :D 20:01:41 <Sacro> Yes 20:01:42 <planetmaker> like windows without gui? ;-) 20:01:46 <Sacro> I'm running Ubuntu Server 20:02:10 <frosch123> is there also kubuntu server? 20:02:20 <frosch123> which uses kde instead of gnome for the server? 20:02:30 <Alberth> that's for the other half of X :) 20:03:02 <Sacro> I don't run X on it 20:03:08 <glx> Sacro: compile yourself then 20:03:10 <Sacro> hmm 20:03:20 <Sacro> actually, the requirements for compiling don't include all that cruft 20:03:25 <Sacro> but do require the -dev stuff 20:03:26 <frosch123> btw. someone knows when debian will release separate releases for touch-screen and non-touch-screen devices? 20:03:45 <Alberth> Sacro: I don't think ubuntu understands that people may not want to use X 20:03:57 <Sacro> Alberth: it's not ubuntu that's the issue 20:04:17 <Sacro> it's openttd not releasing openttd-server packages :p 20:04:43 <Alberth> oh, for those 20 server owners? 20:04:46 <Terkhen> you can compile OpenTTD with the options to allow that 20:05:05 <Terkhen> or use a normal (GUI) package for your sever 20:05:06 <Sacro> Terkhen: I was hoping they'd be prebuilt so I don't need to install all the -dev packages on my server 20:05:07 <Terkhen> server* 20:05:21 <Alberth> where half of them use windows probably, so have a gui anyway 20:05:34 <Terkhen> what I mean is: we give precompiled builds and the options for anyone else to compile the game as they want to 20:05:45 <Terkhen> linux distributions could easily create openttd-server packages if they wanted to 20:05:51 <Alberth> build at your desktop :p 20:06:26 <Sacro> my desktop runs Arch 20:08:22 <Sacro> http://ie.archive.ubuntu.com/pld-linux/pool/o/openttd-server/ 20:08:23 <Sacro> hmm 20:08:31 <Terkhen> if your server had Arch too you could create openttd-server in the aur :P 20:08:44 <Sacro> Terkhen: I already wrote all the ones in the AUR 20:08:52 <Sacro> the stable PKGBUILD was written by me too 20:08:54 <Terkhen> I know :) 20:09:11 <Terkhen> I checked them when I installed Arch 20:09:23 <Sacro> -svn still has me as the contributer 20:09:25 <frosch123> then build on arch 20:09:30 <Sacro> I wrote the first one back for 0.4.0 20:09:40 <Sacro> that was awful Makefile hackery 20:10:02 <frosch123> a dedicated build which does not need all the weird libraries is probably portable between distributions 20:10:26 <frosch123> no icu and such 20:10:34 <Sacro> hmm 20:10:38 <Terkhen> yes, IIRC icu is the biggest PITA 20:10:39 <Sacro> I'd rather have a deb :( 20:10:44 <Sacro> might install LXC and do it in there 20:26:56 <chlorine> What's a gook moneymaker train for toyland? 20:27:11 <chlorine> I chose bubbles but I think I might have made a mistake :/ 20:27:21 <Terkhen> sugar, toffee and candyfloss 20:28:09 <andythenorth> what is toyland? :o 20:28:12 <chlorine> OK, thanks! 20:28:31 <chlorine> toyland is a type of map you can play on. 20:29:04 <chlorine> Industries are replaced by toy versions, like candy factory that requires sugar, fuzzy drink factory which requires bubbles, and so on. 20:29:15 <chlorine> It's the first time I'm trying to play a toyland game. 20:29:26 <frosch123> yup, indeed, sugar, toffee, candyfloss 20:29:49 <frosch123> all go to sweet factory, so you get lots of sweets quite fast 20:30:18 <frosch123> andythenorth: the climate with the most detailed industry animations 20:30:28 * andythenorth ponders patching his game to remove toyland 20:30:34 <andythenorth> just the menu item 20:30:48 <chlorine> I'll wait to get some of my money from the bubble train then I'll try sugar, toffee or candyfloss 20:31:15 <Terkhen> chlorine: HEQS works fine for carrying those cargos in toyland :D 20:31:29 <andythenorth> maybe I should change the climate availability on that :P 20:31:42 <Terkhen> as long as you don't mind a fork :P 20:31:50 <frosch123> sadly av8 seems to have done that 20:32:06 <frosch123> there are no planes with av8 in toyland, it does not even give an error message 20:32:15 <andythenorth> toyland specific graphics: antenna for RC 20:32:21 <chlorine> Terkhen, what's HEQS? 20:32:22 <andythenorth> [and remove the smoke effects] 20:33:11 <Terkhen> chlorine: HEQS is a road vehicle NewGRF set that includes Heavy Equipment, such as mining vehicles 20:33:22 <Terkhen> but the author might not like it being used in toyland :P 20:33:22 <andythenorth> http://0.tqn.com/d/rcvehicles/1/0/i/6/-/-/CatMiniRemoteDumpTruck.jpg 20:33:32 <planetmaker> most awesome cargo IMHO are bubbles :-) 20:33:59 <Terkhen> frosch123: yes, I never understood that 20:34:28 <chlorine> Ah, heavy vehicules would be nice, my trains are _slow_! 20:34:40 <chlorine> These bubbles must weigh a lot! :p 20:35:00 * Alberth always does the toy chain 20:35:00 <chlorine> But it _is_ quite awesome to be carrying bubbles around in train cars. :) 20:35:03 <planetmaker> one ton of bubbles surely weighs more than one ton of feathers :-P 20:35:14 <chlorine> :D 20:35:24 <andythenorth> right BANDIT is finished, let's release v1.0 20:35:24 <chlorine> Alberth: OK, I 20:35:37 <chlorine> OK, I'll just have to try all the industry chains. 20:35:56 *** Nat_aS is now known as Nat_AFK 20:36:05 <andythenorth> oops, andythenorth was smoking crack 20:36:05 <andythenorth> BANDIT is not finished :P 20:38:01 <Alberth> good night 20:38:07 <andythenorth> moi aussi 20:38:13 <andythenorth> bye 20:38:16 *** andythenorth [~Andy@host86-129-120-89.range86-129.btcentralplus.com] has left #openttd [] 20:38:42 *** Alberth [~hat3@a82-95-164-127.adsl.xs4all.nl] has left #openttd [] 20:41:20 <chlorine> Darn I messed up my signals and now my trains are blocked! 20:41:26 <chlorine> I still got a lot to learn. 20:42:12 <Terkhen> still happens even after you learn 20:42:16 <Terkhen> :P 20:42:29 <opa> then you just got a bigger mess :P 20:42:36 <Terkhen> indeed 20:43:30 <chlorine> I don't know if it's reassuring or not. 20:43:50 <chlorine> Anyway it was a smaller mistake than it seemed, I've already fixed it. :) 20:43:56 <Terkhen> it means that the fun will still be there after you learn :P 20:47:07 <chlorine> :) 20:47:21 <Sacro> Collation: the regex [a-f] imbued with a French locale should match the character é. torti[^x]a in a Spanish locale should match "tortilla", as the double-l is counted as a single character. 20:47:25 <Sacro> Similarly, \w in a Finnish locale should match the character À (but [a-z] should not, as å, À and ö collate after z in Finnish 20:47:28 <Sacro> :| 20:48:20 <Terkhen> I tried to understand collations when I coded natural sorting... my conclusion was that collation is a magic box that does language specific stuff 20:50:05 <__ln__> indeed, but that's why locale data exists 20:51:25 <__ln__> although... locale data doesn't always contain all the details 20:52:54 <Terkhen> stuff like "ll is considered a single character in spanish" is difficult to be taken into account 20:53:05 <Terkhen> although I think that's not true anymore :P 20:53:45 <__ln__> are you aware of the standard C function strcoll()? 20:54:28 <Terkhen> it does UTF? 20:56:42 <__ln__> probably implementation-defined 20:56:49 <TinoDidriksen> Doesn't do UTF. 20:57:00 <TinoDidriksen> At least not correctly. 20:57:16 <__ln__> program correctness is so 80's 20:57:47 <Terkhen> it's not an option then 20:58:09 <Terkhen> honestly, I don't know much about different options to do language specific sorting 20:58:12 <TinoDidriksen> ICU 20:58:19 <Terkhen> I just used ICU because OpenTTD already included it 20:59:53 <TinoDidriksen> ICU is by far the best... 21:01:12 <michi_cc> More like the only one... Unicode (and not just the encoding stuff) is a *monster* :) 21:01:15 <Eddi|zuHause> hm... i'm not an expert, but "name[strlen(name)-1]=0" seems a little nonsensical to me... 21:02:15 <TinoDidriksen> It trims the last char from the string. 21:03:17 <Zuu> does it work with multi byte characters? 21:04:56 <Eddi|zuHause> it's a line following an fgets, so possibly it's supposed to remove the '\n' 21:06:23 <frosch123> or "\r" :p 21:06:45 <Eddi|zuHause> see... it'll already fail on an "\n\r" 21:06:53 <Eddi|zuHause> or the other way around 21:08:37 <TinoDidriksen> It's not great code, sure... 21:10:56 <TinoDidriksen> for (size_t z = strlen(name) ; z > 1 && (name[z-1] == '\n' || name[z-1] == '\r' || name[z-1] == '...all the other valid linebreaks...') ; --z) { name[z-1] = 0; } 21:12:00 <Eddi|zuHause> call this stuff "trim", "strip" or similar, and make it a libary function... 21:12:19 <Eddi|zuHause> life could be so easy... 21:12:22 *** Zuu [~Zuu@h-114-141.a98.priv.bahnhof.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:13:02 <Terkhen> if you want nice, shiny stuff in your common libraries just use Java, but the real world is nastier :P 21:13:19 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1BCBF.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:13:37 <Eddi|zuHause> i'll stick to python unless there's a very good reason not to... 21:13:38 <TinoDidriksen> Or use C++ and Boost and ICU. 21:14:25 <Terkhen> I can't talk about python myself, but from what I have heard it is nice in these regards too :P 21:15:20 <Terkhen> TinoDidriksen: I was talking about niceness in the "default libraries have a good, consistent function for everything" way 21:15:52 <TinoDidriksen> Python and Unicode wasn't very nice in Python 2. No clue about Python 3, though, but 2 got it mostly wrong. 21:17:21 <Eddi|zuHause> the problem with java is that it's very noisy bloat until you can actually start doing what you want 21:17:54 <Eddi|zuHause> that stuff always puts me off 21:18:07 <Terkhen> indeed, that's why I mentioned "the real world" 21:18:54 <Eddi|zuHause> when i programmed java some 10-ish years ago (man, i'm getting old) you needed to go through all kinds of hoops to get even a console input 21:19:30 <Terkhen> oh, that kind of bloat? no, it is quite easy now 21:19:48 <Terkhen> mostly everything is easy 21:20:12 <Terkhen> but you have to create a lot of objects to do simple things 21:20:29 <Eddi|zuHause> the other kind of bloat is that you need to specify deep.libary.location.in.the.structure.to.do.something() 21:20:42 <Terkhen> you can use imports for that 21:21:02 <chlorine> OK, time to go to bed. See you! 21:21:05 *** chlorine [~chlorine@tru75-4-82-227-168-156.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:21:32 <Eddi|zuHause> and a few shortcomings that made it annoying 21:22:11 <Terkhen> yup 21:22:39 <Eddi|zuHause> while almost everything feels natural in python 21:22:59 <Eddi|zuHause> only the lack of switch/case i occasionally stumble upon 21:25:50 <frosch123> night 21:25:53 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00bbd4.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:32:41 *** sla_ro|master [~slaco@78.96.213.97] has quit [Quit: DANGER sla.ro is OFFLINE DANGER] 21:32:41 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.65.131] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 21:33:08 *** Pixa [~pixa@85.210.65.131] has joined #openttd 21:37:29 <Wolf01> 'night all 21:37:31 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@95.232.234.29] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 21:38:37 <Terkhen> good night 21:55:38 *** TWerkhoven [~twerkhove@cpc3-linl7-2-0-cust522.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: He who can look into the future, has a brighter future to look into] 22:05:17 *** TGYoshi [~TGYoshi@86.81.146.146] has quit [Quit: Popidopidopido] 22:13:14 *** FLHerne [~francis_h@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:25:42 *** Biolunar [~mahdi@blfd-4db13609.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: All your IRC are belong to us] 22:30:35 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 22:30:39 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [] 22:32:18 *** Devroush [~dennis@178-119-153-135.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 22:37:45 *** HootzMcToke [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 22:40:51 *** DreadfulVee [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 22:41:04 *** Firartix [~artixds@207.140.0.93.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:41:16 *** DreadfulVee [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:41:21 *** DreadfulVee [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #openttd 22:42:23 *** DreadfulVee [~quassel@d50-92-68-219.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [] 22:48:22 *** Chris_Booth [~chatzilla@host81-152-250-188.range81-152.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:13:16 *** Nat_AFK is now known as Nat_aS 23:35:32 *** LordAro [~LordAro@host81-155-168-27.range81-155.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:54:59 *** LordPixaII [~pixa@85.210.76.143] has joined #openttd