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00:00:06 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 00:00:11 *** valhalla1w [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has quit [] 00:00:25 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:00:56 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i528C37AB.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/nkczDT] 00:01:52 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 00:53:42 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 01:25:28 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:27:18 *** Aristide [~quassel@ALyon-156-1-198-41.w90-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:42:43 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 01:57:59 *** michelNL [michelNL@541E541A.cm-5-7b.dynamic.ziggo.nl] has quit [] 01:59:19 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.38.75] has joined #openttd 02:15:42 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.38.75] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:18:41 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:44:42 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6C8CD.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 02:50:46 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6D0D9.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:57:11 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@98.145.80.103] has joined #openttd 03:56:50 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 04:01:30 *** Super_Random|2 [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 04:01:30 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:20:36 *** Superuser [~superuser@cpc11-lewi15-2-0-cust98.2-4.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Hi, I'm a quit message virus. Please replace your old line with this line and help me take over the world of IRC.] 04:27:12 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 04:27:12 *** Super_Random|2 [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:30:28 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@p3EE3FEFB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:53:05 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/] 04:55:58 *** EyeMWing [~Wing@c-68-33-226-154.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 04:59:35 *** EyeMWing [~Wing@c-68-33-226-154.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #openttd 05:08:32 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 05:32:23 *** jrambo [~jrambo@93-86-92-138.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:32:48 *** jrambo [~jrambo@93-86-92-138.dynamic.isp.telekom.rs] has joined #openttd 05:47:50 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 05:49:17 <Flygon> Is it possible to modify a .sav file to uncap the 5000 vehicle limit? 05:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC67D30.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 05:56:17 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p5DC6631E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 06:01:03 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 06:15:03 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 06:16:14 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 06:42:44 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 06:48:28 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 06:59:21 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 07:16:54 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has joined #openttd 07:17:59 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 07:19:57 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has quit [] 07:21:07 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@68.125.32.96] has joined #openttd 07:25:08 *** tycoondemon2 [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has quit [] 07:25:27 *** tycoondemon [~ashnohoe@ip503d7ac1.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 07:36:48 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 07:45:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 07:46:23 <andythenorth> hrm 07:47:29 <andythenorth> this project has a bad structure 07:47:54 * andythenorth hates sorting out filesystem structure 07:49:38 <andythenorth> is planetmaker awake yet? o_O 07:56:47 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 08:08:09 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:08:21 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 08:10:23 <dihedral> good morning 08:12:38 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.93.118] has joined #openttd 08:20:16 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@98.145.80.103] has quit [Quit: Valete omnes] 08:24:17 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6C8CD.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:44:32 *** roadt__ [~roadt@60.168.91.24] has joined #openttd 08:50:53 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 08:53:15 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.93.118] has quit [Quit: ( www.adiirc.com :: AdiIRC 1.9.3 )] 08:54:44 *** Pereba [~UserNick@177.17.93.118] has joined #openttd 09:02:52 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.164.39] has joined #openttd 09:03:48 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has joined #openttd 09:04:47 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 09:16:50 *** Aristide [~quassel@ALyon-156-1-198-41.w90-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 09:17:26 <planetmaker> moin 09:17:37 <andythenorth> o/ 09:25:39 <andythenorth> planetmaker: I have a file naming puzzle o_O 09:25:48 <planetmaker> :) bring it on 09:26:42 <Aristide> xD 09:27:23 <Aristide> andythenorth: Only « puzzle » ? 09:28:08 <Aristide> I have a directory named « prout » 09:28:40 <andythenorth> spritesheets are in '/graphics' 09:28:50 <andythenorth> .psd files and such are in '/graphics_sources' 09:29:03 <andythenorth> but I'm adding pixa, with generated spritesheets 09:29:21 <andythenorth> convention is then to make '/graphics' the destination for generated files 09:29:35 <andythenorth> and introduce '/graphics_src' for the initial spritesheets 09:29:44 <andythenorth> this makes '/graphics_sources' ambiguous 09:29:49 <planetmaker> my solution to that is to have the xcf (gimp) files in gfx-source, and the generated output in src/gfx/blah.gimp.png 09:29:59 <andythenorth> could do that 09:30:06 <planetmaker> pixa is scripted generation, so generated each time, yes? 09:30:07 <andythenorth> I have an aversion to generating things into srrc 09:30:10 <andythenorth> src * 09:30:15 <andythenorth> yes generated each time 09:30:25 <planetmaker> true, generating in src might not be ideal 09:30:33 <andythenorth> and make clean would remove the entire graphics dir 09:30:39 <planetmaker> you could add a new dir called 'build/gfx' 09:30:55 <andythenorth> or something like 'assets' and dump the .psds in there :P 09:31:28 <planetmaker> keeping them in graphics_sources is fine. Putting any generated stuff in graphics_sources is wrong. As wrong as in src ;) 09:31:40 <andythenorth> yup 09:32:29 <planetmaker> could also called generated_gfx 09:32:43 <andythenorth> nah, goes against the convention for generated lang, generated docs etc 09:32:51 <andythenorth> we agreed *_src 09:33:01 <planetmaker> gfx_src 09:33:09 <planetmaker> err... no, not generated stuff 09:33:25 <planetmaker> lang_src is your unmodified stuff. generated stuff is in lang 09:33:31 <andythenorth> yup 09:33:40 <planetmaker> so just use gfx then, if you want 09:33:51 <planetmaker> hm :) 09:34:08 <planetmaker> (I know I'm not consistent in this naming either, so I might not be a good guide there :D ) 09:34:19 <andythenorth> it just helps to check I'm not smoking crack tbh :) 09:34:45 <andythenorth> I'm just going to add 'assets' or something for graphics and sound source files 09:34:56 <andythenorth> they are not commonly used, they just need to live with the project 09:36:01 <andythenorth> 'media' :P 09:36:08 <planetmaker> I dislike 'assets' :D 09:36:37 <planetmaker> just call it generated then, maybe? 09:36:52 <planetmaker> otoh, andythenorth, the generated nml is also in src, no? 09:37:04 * andythenorth checks 09:37:11 <andythenorth> that just goes in root 09:37:27 <planetmaker> everything? 09:37:39 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 09:37:45 <planetmaker> there's only the one nml file generated by gcc (or is there no gcc anymore)? 09:38:14 <andythenorth> there's none in this IH project 09:38:16 <andythenorth> there is in FIRS 09:38:51 *** valhallasw [~valhallas@s55978e11.adsl.online.nl] has joined #openttd 09:39:35 <andythenorth> logically, the photoshop files etc should go in src/ :P 09:39:48 <andythenorth> but we don't do that - maybe because they are big and messy 09:40:27 <planetmaker> well, they could go in src/gfx or so, yes 09:40:44 <planetmaker> but indeed, I somewhen put mine separate for the reason you cited 09:40:56 <planetmaker> maybe time to move them. But the diff is ... big ;) 09:41:00 <andythenorth> indeed 09:41:30 * planetmaker added yesterday a diff of 40MByte where hg warned me about 'it may need >100MByte of ram to manage it" oh well :D 09:42:32 <planetmaker> should work out. facebook uses mercurial and they use HUGE repos 09:44:43 <andythenorth> I assume it would be confusing to have both 'graphics_src' (spritesheets) and 'graphics_sources' (psds etc) ? 09:44:55 <planetmaker> yes 09:45:14 <planetmaker> generated stuff also doesn't belong in an src dir 09:45:20 <andythenorth> no 09:45:21 <planetmaker> so the output just goes in graphics 09:45:24 <andythenorth> yes 09:45:37 <planetmaker> hm. graphics? 09:45:49 <andythenorth> I could just leave the src spritesheets in the same dir as the psds 09:46:04 <andythenorth> the issue here is three stage graphics pipeline 09:46:08 <andythenorth> everything else is two-stage 09:46:36 <andythenorth> source psd -> export png spritesheet -> render with pixa to final spritesheets 09:46:50 <andythenorth> the first step is manual always 09:46:56 <andythenorth> the second is programatic always 09:47:00 <planetmaker> psd->export png? 09:47:06 <planetmaker> why is that manual? 09:47:30 <andythenorth> no benefit to automating it 09:47:38 <andythenorth> there are so many variables with layers etc 09:47:55 * planetmaker found that the really beneficial thing :D 09:48:01 <andythenorth> it's also quite a rare step 09:48:02 <planetmaker> just draw and let scripts handle the rest 09:48:13 <planetmaker> but I do landscape, not vehicles or buildings 09:48:32 <andythenorth> leaving one layer on or off could bork the sprites, and it wouldn't be detectable with code 09:48:49 <planetmaker> of course. But I set the layers I want for export 09:49:06 <andythenorth> you must have well behaved artists contributing 09:49:09 <planetmaker> naming scheme for layers. Export script gives layers for individual files -> png 09:49:16 <planetmaker> I'm the only artist for that :D 09:49:56 <andythenorth> the only logical name is 'graphics_intermediates' for the middle stage :P 09:50:11 <planetmaker> yes, logical. Not a bad name either :) 09:50:47 <andythenorth> I'll do that then 09:58:45 *** roadt_ [~roadt@223.240.105.152] has joined #openttd 10:00:55 *** adf89 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 10:01:50 * andythenorth wonders if a 'build' folder might be wise for all the generated stuff 10:01:54 <andythenorth> otoh, flat is better 10:01:57 <andythenorth> easy to find 10:03:13 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:05:24 <andythenorth> let's see if I broke the build :P 10:05:34 *** roadt__ [~roadt@60.168.91.24] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:06:30 <planetmaker> I was pondering to move everything generated to the build folder 10:07:04 <planetmaker> makes it harder to tain sources and easier to clean up 10:08:31 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@host58-55-dynamic.182-80-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd 10:09:00 <Wolf01> hellol 10:10:26 <andythenorth> planetmaker: I am +0.5 10:10:44 <planetmaker> yeah. That's about my stance, too 10:10:45 <andythenorth> for lang and graphics and nml it makes sense 10:10:49 <andythenorth> only docs bothers me 10:10:59 <andythenorth> I actually use /docs a lot and I am used to where it is 10:10:59 <planetmaker> why does docs bother you? 10:11:13 <andythenorth> I use it to verify stats etc sometimes 10:11:16 *** Haube [~michi@77-20-215-214-dynip.superkabel.de] has joined #openttd 10:11:17 <planetmaker> well. 10:11:45 <andythenorth> I could just alias index.html 10:11:51 <planetmaker> docs should have what source ships with. Not what binary ships with 10:11:52 <andythenorth> then I'd stop editing the wrong changelog 10:12:09 <planetmaker> oh, the build directory would be completely generated in my idea 10:12:15 <planetmaker> nothing for you to edit in there 10:14:58 <andythenorth> +1 10:15:01 <andythenorth> total agreement 10:15:14 <andythenorth> currently I forget, and edit changelog in /docs 10:15:19 <andythenorth> instead of docs_src 10:15:26 <andythenorth> then my changes are blown away 10:23:51 <andythenorth> hmm 10:23:58 <andythenorth> strictly, docs are output, not build 10:24:02 <andythenorth> dunno :) 10:24:37 <andythenorth> anyway, I didn't break it yet :) 10:32:33 *** roadt_ [~roadt@223.240.105.152] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:49:02 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B8A3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 10:51:20 <andythenorth> hrm 10:51:23 <andythenorth> how does pixa work 10:55:13 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:980:272e:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 10:55:16 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 10:55:42 <andythenorth> o/ 10:56:27 <Alberth> hi hi 10:56:34 <LordAro> moin all 11:00:18 <planetmaker> moin moin 11:01:46 *** scshunt_ is now known as scshunt 11:20:42 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@p3EE3FEFB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 11:20:51 <fjb_mobile> Moin 11:20:57 <andythenorth> for once, it all makes sense :) 11:21:27 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 11:26:18 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@68.125.32.96] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:26:42 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@adsl-68-123-207-248.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has joined #openttd 11:35:40 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 11:37:35 *** skyem123 [~skyem123@cpc1-walt4-0-0-cust432.13-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 11:53:11 <andythenorth> ugh, I don't like the bit where I have to get the interface wrong 11:53:19 <andythenorth> so I can figure out what it should have been :P 11:57:47 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.38.75] has joined #openttd 11:57:49 *** Phoenix_the_II [~ralph@13-17-191-195.ftth.glasoperator.nl] has quit [Quit: ( www.nnscript.com :: NoNameScript 4.22 :: www.esnation.com )] 11:58:38 <Alberth> fix the docs, so you don't have to figure it out again in the future? 12:01:46 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i5387A511.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 12:04:41 <fjb_mobile> Our write an errata for the documentation. 12:06:45 <andythenorth> I have to design the interface before I could document it :) 12:06:48 <andythenorth> that will be wrong :P 12:06:57 <andythenorth> always is 12:07:09 <andythenorth> after much copy-paste, I'll figure out what it should have been 12:13:21 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:22:33 <planetmaker> what interface do you design, andythenorth ? 12:23:40 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 12:25:50 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d00d460.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 12:28:14 <Alberth> hi hi 12:30:38 <LordAro> quak 12:31:00 <frosch123> hola 12:32:31 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 12:32:35 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 12:36:38 <andythenorth> planetmaker: interface to call pixa graphics processing (if needed) on a vehicle 12:37:09 <andythenorth> I mean interface in scripting sense, not UI :) 12:38:38 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-88-1.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:38:39 <planetmaker> oh :) 12:53:08 *** adf89 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:04:48 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@irc.blinkenshell.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:07:18 *** fjb_mobile is now known as Guest3462 13:07:19 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@89.204.138.3] has joined #openttd 13:07:24 *** adf88 [~Thunderbi@wis-zul.spine.pl] has joined #openttd 13:14:30 *** Guest3462 [~frank@p3EE3FEFB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:14:36 *** Aristide [~quassel@ALyon-156-1-198-41.w90-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:17:28 *** jjavaholic_ [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has joined #openttd 13:20:23 *** fjb_mobile is now known as Guest3467 13:20:24 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@p4FC60BB3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 13:22:31 *** jjavaholic [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:26:58 *** Guest3467 [~frank@89.204.138.3] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:27:01 *** jjavaholic_ [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 13:35:36 *** jjavaholic_ [~jjavaholi@grahamg63.plus.com] has joined #openttd 13:36:21 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.38.75] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:36:47 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.38.75] has joined #openttd 13:40:35 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 13:41:19 <planetmaker> hm, quite convenient. It suffices to draw and code the 4x sprites. OpenTTD does the rest :D 13:41:40 <planetmaker> (if you still have some 1x 8bpp) 13:48:09 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:49:43 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 13:55:36 <Alberth> at the cost of a bit of quality, probably :) 13:56:06 *** Superuser [~superuser@cpc11-lewi15-2-0-cust98.2-4.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 13:59:45 <planetmaker> not that bad really 13:59:53 <planetmaker> http://devs.openttd.org/~planetmaker/patches/other_tropic.png 14:00:40 <planetmaker> http://devs.openttd.org/~planetmaker/patches/other_tropics2.png 14:02:18 *** fjb_mobile is now known as Guest3469 14:02:19 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@89.204.130.104] has joined #openttd 14:02:20 *** Guest3469 [~frank@p4FC60BB3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: No route to host] 14:02:48 *** fjb_mobile is now known as Guest3470 14:02:49 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@p4FC60BB3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 14:07:42 *** mode/#openttd [+b *!~Gernon@ip-88-153-128-97.unitymediagroup.de] by planetmaker 14:09:13 *** fjb_mobile is now known as Guest3471 14:09:14 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@89.204.137.67] has joined #openttd 14:10:06 <Alberth> looks very neat :) 14:10:23 *** Guest3470 [~frank@89.204.130.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:13:30 <DorpsGek> Commit by planetmaker :: r26235 trunk/src/lang/korean.txt (2014-01-11 14:13:23 UTC) 14:13:31 <DorpsGek> -Fix: Decimal and digit separators were swapped for Korean language 14:15:17 *** Taede [~Taede@cpc10-linl9-2-0-cust80.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:15:33 *** Guest3471 [~frank@p4FC60BB3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:28:18 *** fjb_mobile is now known as Guest3473 14:28:19 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@82.113.121.163] has joined #openttd 14:29:16 *** KenjiE20 [kenjie20@irc.blinkenshell.org] has joined #openttd 14:30:35 *** KritiK [~Maxim@0001264a.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 14:32:06 *** Guest3473 [~frank@89.204.137.67] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 14:36:24 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@82.113.121.163] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:01:21 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has joined #openttd 15:04:53 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has quit [] 15:08:18 *** Elukka [~Elukka@a91-152-213-89.elisa-laajakaista.fi] has quit [] 15:29:48 *** gdfhrefghre [~id@37.140.115.246] has joined #openttd 15:37:36 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@p3EE3FEFB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:46:38 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has quit [] 15:49:36 *** Haube [~michi@77-20-215-214-dynip.superkabel.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 15:54:00 *** Devroush [~dennis@dD5765BAC.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd 15:56:18 *** Japa_ [~Japa@112.79.37.97] has joined #openttd 16:03:03 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.38.75] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:07:01 *** Sonny_Jim [~Anonymous@host109-151-209-29.range109-151.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 16:07:12 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:07:14 <Sonny_Jim> Hi, I'm trying to join one of the openttd servers and it says I've been banned? 16:08:42 <Sonny_Jim> In fact it seems I can't join any of the btpro servers?? 16:09:15 <Sonny_Jim> Other servers seem to work, do I have the wrong client version or something? 16:09:47 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 16:10:23 <Eddi|zuHause> you have to contact the server owner 16:11:13 *** Sonny_Ji1 [~Anonymous@host109-151-209-29.range109-151.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 16:11:35 <Rubidium> either you have been banned, or one of the people that use the same provider as you has been banned 16:12:15 <Superuser> I wonder what you need to do to get banned from ottd 16:12:21 <Rubidium> in any case, the developers of OpenTTD can't do anything about bans that are done by third parties (i.e. game server hosters) 16:13:12 <Eddi|zuHause> Superuser: either you spam or you destroy the game (e.g. flatten all land to sea level or so) 16:14:17 <Rubidium> ... or someone in your IP range does that and the game server hoster bans the whole range and/or your ISP rotates IP addresses so you get the IP address that someone else who got banned had 16:15:08 <Sonny_Ji1> So what can I do? 16:15:50 <Sonny_Ji1> Is there a way I can see why that IP range was banned or anything? 16:15:59 <Alberth> ask the server owner 16:16:02 <Sonny_Ji1> Erm 16:16:11 <Sonny_Ji1> Who runs the BT Pro servers? 16:16:26 <Sonny_Ji1> I got a link from the BTPro website to here, so I assumed here was the palce 16:16:30 * Rubidium doesn't know 16:16:31 <Sonny_Ji1> *place 16:16:32 <Eddi|zuHause> read their website? 16:16:38 * Sonny_Ji1 looks again 16:16:50 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:17:24 <Sonny_Ji1> Ah, it's on a different network 16:17:27 <Sonny_Ji1> thanks anwyay 16:17:28 *** Sonny_Ji1 [~Anonymous@host109-151-209-29.range109-151.btcentralplus.com] has left #openttd [] 16:17:58 *** Sonny_Jim [~Anonymous@host109-151-209-29.range109-151.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:20:51 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 16:21:50 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:26:07 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6C8CD.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 16:56:18 *** Taede [turbulent@cpc4-linl9-2-0-cust152.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 16:59:21 *** jjavaholic_ is now known as jjavaholic 17:03:17 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.36.141] has joined #openttd 17:06:33 *** Japa_ [~Japa@112.79.37.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:16:44 *** Taede [turbulent@cpc4-linl9-2-0-cust152.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:21:11 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has joined #openttd 17:21:14 <triad> could you guys recommend me a good printer ? 17:24:26 <Superuser> anyone in here speak arabic? 17:24:31 <Superuser> triad: depends on your requirements 17:25:03 <Superuser> i.e. what quantity of paper you are looking to print, what additional features are you looking for (e.g. scanning), whether it will be laser or inkjet... 17:25:31 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1B8A3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:26:34 <triad> office printing 17:26:39 <triad> general purpose 17:26:45 <triad> nothing fancy 17:28:06 *** gdfhrefghre [~id@37.140.115.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:28:07 <Superuser> as in, small business office? Are we talking say 50 pages a week? 17:28:26 <planetmaker> err... this is not exactly a printer recommendation channel, no? 17:28:46 <andythenorth> there are no good printers 17:28:50 <andythenorth> all printers are rubbish 17:29:22 <triad> max 300-400 pages/month 17:29:23 <andythenorth> I have been the unsatisfied owner of Epson, Canon, Lexmark, Xerox and Brother 17:29:33 <Superuser> oh dear, epson 17:29:38 <andythenorth> inkjet, photo inkjet, colour laser, black and white laser 17:29:41 <andythenorth> many kinds 17:29:52 <triad> so what's the most cheapest thing to do 17:29:56 <andythenorth> currently I own 2 HP office all-in-one thingies 17:30:04 <Superuser> well triad then an inkjet will do you fine provided that you don't care about insane levels of quality 17:30:06 <andythenorth> the ink is frighteningly expensive, but the printer is good 17:30:18 <Superuser> yeah we had an all-in-one too for a while 17:30:25 <Superuser> now we have a canon 17:30:38 <andythenorth> I got bored of Canon's drying the print heads out 17:30:45 <andythenorth> had about 4 of them 17:30:48 <andythenorth> cheap to buy 17:30:49 <Superuser> the nice thing about canon is that there are lots of unofficial cartridges 17:30:55 <Superuser> (it depends on the printer ofc) 17:31:32 <andythenorth> printers are consumable 17:31:35 <andythenorth> the asset is the ink 17:32:12 <triad> what do you think about lasers ? 17:32:21 <Sanfred> Wait, there are people that still use ink printers? Seems like madness to me. 17:32:30 <andythenorth> lasers need toner 17:32:35 <andythenorth> toner is frighteningly expensive 17:32:44 <andythenorth> and lasers aren't as fast as you might hope 17:32:55 <Sanfred> Toner is much, much cheaper per page when compared to ink. 17:33:02 <andythenorth> I remember seeing a B+W laser printing 50ppm in about 1994 17:33:10 <andythenorth> but it would have cost £4k 17:33:13 <triad> Sanfred: you recommend laser ? what kind ? 17:33:29 <andythenorth> every laser I have owned can manage about 10ppm, badly 17:33:34 <triad> there are any shitty things like drying if you don't print 1 month ? 17:33:42 <andythenorth> but then we spend £250 on them, so meh 17:33:56 <Superuser> laser is very expensive 17:34:02 <Superuser> not just the printer, the 'ink' too 17:34:36 <andythenorth> I wish the forum was less strongly opinonated about eating my cookies 17:34:41 <andythenorth> I have to log in every few hours 17:35:05 <Sanfred> I bought a Samsung SCX-4200 printer about 7 years ago for about 0. Since then I've printed about 5000 pages and spent about 0 on toner. Still works great. 17:35:56 <triad> Sanfred: at the laser printer there are shitty things like at ink: if you don't print something it will dry and eventually you need to replace something 17:36:19 <triad> ? 17:36:27 <Sanfred> triad: no. Give it toner and paper and it will work. 17:36:51 <triad> so it can stay with no printing how much i want ? 17:37:04 <Sanfred> If you print extremely much, you will have to replace the drum unit eventually. Still no big deal. 17:37:23 <triad> so it can stay with no printing how much i want ? 17:38:05 <Sanfred> yes. I've seen a printer that was used for three days, then stored for half a year, then used for three days again. Has worked for years with no service. 17:38:17 <triad> extremely meaning how much ? (by the way, thx for answering my questions. all of you :] ) 17:38:22 <Sanfred> (that one is a Brother laser) 17:39:12 <Sanfred> check the specifications for the printer you're interested in, for number of pages the drum unit is supposed to manage before being replaced 17:39:32 <triad> oh, ok 17:40:52 <Sanfred> And don't forget to check that you get a full toner with the printer, not some 300-pages "get started toner" 17:41:34 <triad> good point! 17:44:20 <planetmaker> nice. Finally animated water in 32bpp 17:46:56 <Sanfred> is 32bpp rendering actuall faster than 8bpp on a modern cpu? 17:48:20 <Sanfred> My openttd window is 3840x1200 pixels and it is extremely slow when moving around (1.4-beta2 with cargodist enabled for all cargo types) 17:49:32 <planetmaker> Sanfred, read up on the 32bpp sse blitter thread in the forums :) 17:49:36 <planetmaker> it has all the numbers 17:49:46 <Sanfred> will do, thanks 17:56:17 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 18:04:39 *** Super_Random [~kvirc@75-102-176-79.d2.itctel.com] has joined #openttd 18:04:41 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:04:44 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 18:06:14 *** GriffinOneTwo [~oftc-webi@adsl-68-123-207-248.dsl.irvnca.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 18:31:07 *** Aristide [~quassel@ALyon-156-1-198-41.w90-14.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #openttd 18:57:32 *** fjb [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 18:57:43 <Rubidium> Sanfred: it heavily depends on the circumstances whether 32bpp is faster and on your GPU/OS/libraries 18:57:55 *** Pol [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 18:58:04 <Rubidium> in any case, the most significant improvement you can get is by using the 64 bit binary instead of 32 bit binary 19:00:13 <Rubidium> in the 'no drawing' case OpenTTD's 64 bits Windows binary is about 5% faster than the 32 bits binary. In the animated blitter case that increases up to 15% and that is simply using a different binary 19:01:07 <Rubidium> the blitter numbers in the thread are usually only counting the time spent in the blitting methods, so those improvements aren't necessarily as big as they seem 19:01:46 *** fjb_mobile [~frank@p3EE3FEFB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Bye] 19:01:49 <Rubidium> nevertheless, you can have improvements of 5-15% as well there 19:03:08 <Rubidium> so if you would go from a 32 bits binary with 32bpp-anim to a 64 bits binary with 32bpp-sse4-anim you could see improvements of like 30% 19:03:43 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:05:29 <planetmaker> wild wild landscape http://devs.openttd.org/~planetmaker/patches/other_tropic.png 19:06:06 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:06:12 <Rubidium> that's definitely patchy 19:06:37 <planetmaker> yes, shores are missing 19:06:40 <LordAro> looks fancy, what's it for? 19:06:58 <planetmaker> for my pleasure, LordAro ;) 19:07:03 <LordAro> :D 19:07:15 <LordAro> planetmaker = zephyris :p 19:07:34 <planetmaker> his work flow definitely is different 19:08:18 <planetmaker> Rubidium, it's unpatched OpenTTD, should you have meant that 19:10:13 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 19:14:06 *** fjb is now known as Guest3488 19:14:07 *** fjb [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:14:52 <Alberth> o/ fjb 19:15:10 <fjb> Moin Alberth 19:20:56 *** Guest3488 [~frank@000158aa.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:21:51 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #openttd 19:25:12 *** Superuser [~superuser@cpc11-lewi15-2-0-cust98.2-4.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Hi, I'm a quit message virus. Please replace your old line with this line and help me take over the world of IRC.] 19:25:30 *** Superuser [~superuser@cpc11-lewi15-2-0-cust98.2-4.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 19:43:50 <andythenorth> python 19:44:04 <andythenorth> I have a string, which I want to convert to an object reference 19:44:18 <andythenorth> because at the point it's first defined, I don't have the object in scope 19:44:20 <Eddi|zuHause> use a dict 19:44:30 <andythenorth> I was trying to avoid a mapping :) 19:44:39 <andythenorth> and I've been conditioned to never ever ever use eval 19:44:40 <andythenorth> ever 19:44:44 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 19:44:50 <Eddi|zuHause> never ever use eval 19:44:50 <andythenorth> probably the answer is change the design I think 19:45:03 <Eddi|zuHause> but if a dict is not the right answer, i need more context 19:45:16 <andythenorth> I am just being lazy about getting the object in scope 19:45:27 <andythenorth> it means adding an import to about 60 files or so 19:45:39 <Eddi|zuHause> that was not the question 19:46:13 <andythenorth> I know, I am thinking of best explanation 19:46:44 <andythenorth> a dict is the correct answer tbh 19:46:52 <andythenorth> I just didn't want to maintain a mapping 19:47:04 *** triad [~triad@5-13-83-159.residential.rdsnet.ro] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 19:50:01 <Eddi|zuHause> a factory method could also help 19:51:20 <Eddi|zuHause> but these code patterns are usually of the kind "we have these two already developed code pieces, make them fit together", and can often be solved better if developed from scratch to be fit 19:52:30 <andythenorth> the specific case is that I want to have a vehicle specify which of several graphics processors to use 19:52:40 <andythenorth> the processors are just modules 19:53:14 <andythenorth> or classes in a single module, not written yet, could be either 19:54:20 <andythenorth> when I call the init for the vehicle, I need to pass the module name as a parameter 19:55:13 <andythenorth> there are ~40 modules for vehicles so far :P 19:55:28 <andythenorth> so I can either add an import to every vehicle module, or I can pass a string, and use a lookup table later 19:56:00 <andythenorth> the table looks like a much better bet, except it has to be manually maintained every time I add a new processor 19:56:09 <andythenorth> or maybe I can do that programatically? 19:56:35 <andythenorth> have each module register itself 19:56:49 <andythenorth> ok thanks 19:56:56 <andythenorth> you made me answer it for myself :) 20:01:20 <Alberth> annoying eh, teddy bears talking back :p 20:05:15 <andythenorth> :P 20:06:52 <andythenorth> pixa stuff always makes my head hurt 20:07:14 <andythenorth> not even going to try and describe my current puzzle :) 20:07:29 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 20:14:29 *** Pol [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:22:44 <Eddi|zuHause> often describing your problem with actual words will make the solution obvious 20:23:27 <planetmaker> ^^ 20:25:56 <andythenorth> do I create a potentially large number of named singletons to use as graphics processors (names might be long and fiddly) 20:26:24 <andythenorth> or do I have fewer, and pass parameters, but I might be repeating myself often, and have a maintenance headache if changes are needed 20:26:59 <andythenorth> e.g. all hopper wagons use same processor 20:27:29 <Eddi|zuHause> prepare a factory method that translates names into parameters 20:27:53 <andythenorth> that's the same pattern as last time I tried this I think 20:28:05 <andythenorth> BANDIT (never-finished truck set) 20:28:12 <andythenorth> splits filenames into params 20:28:24 <andythenorth> which also reduced work in thinking up unique names :P 20:47:30 <andythenorth> any comments on this? http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1108372&sid=601824082e401260b60fde406a899fe3#p1108372 20:53:11 <Alberth> missing words are easy to add imho 20:53:36 <Alberth> as for the units, it would clean up quite a few strings imho 20:54:46 <frosch123> hmm, we have no newgrf stringcode for cargo amounts 20:55:01 *** retro|cz [~retro@ip-89-176-82-80.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 20:58:37 <andythenorth> nope 20:58:47 <andythenorth> that's one reason I was 'meh' about that comment :) 20:59:03 <frosch123> yeah, i think the lack of such a string command is the actualy problem :p 20:59:27 <andythenorth> there has been so much faff with those industry strings in FIRS 20:59:33 <andythenorth> so many mistakes, unit corrections etc 21:06:01 <frosch123> hmm, how to pack cargotype and cargoamount onto the text stack? 21:06:08 <frosch123> most amounts use words 21:06:22 <frosch123> cargotype could live with a byte 21:06:40 <frosch123> so, should it use 2+1 bytes, or 2+2? 21:07:11 <planetmaker> for stations you likely would rather want 2 bytes for the amount? 21:07:32 <frosch123> 2 for amount is settlerd 21:07:46 <frosch123> but for the cargotype i can either use 1 to make it compact, or 2 to make it easier to sue 21:07:57 <frosch123> yeah, i think 2+2 is way better 21:08:10 <planetmaker> why does cargotype need two? 21:08:12 <Alberth> perhaps also specify how to output? 21:08:24 <Alberth> ie override the user setting? 21:08:41 <frosch123> planetmaker: 1 would be enough, but putting 3 bytes on the textstack makes it a lot harder for newgrf and nml 21:09:03 <frosch123> Alberth: why would anyone want to do that? 21:09:15 <Alberth> no idea 21:09:16 <Rubidium> I'd say word because of string codes 85 and 86 21:11:41 <frosch123> is there any reason why some newgrf stringcodes interpret stuff as signed or unsigned? 21:12:01 <Rubidium> Chris? 21:16:59 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 21:21:50 *** Pensacola [~quassel@h220216.upc-h.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 21:29:03 <frosch123> crap 21:29:14 <frosch123> we cannot nest strings from different grfs :p 21:30:26 <frosch123> hmm, but since dparams are 64bit, maybe i can remove _last_grfid and put the grfid into the param along the string id 21:37:35 <Rubidium> you probably can ;) 21:39:36 <Eddi|zuHause> yay for removing magic global variables :) 21:44:29 *** Taede [turbulent@cpc4-linl9-2-0-cust152.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 21:48:06 <frosch123> @calc 26 << 11 21:48:06 <DorpsGek> frosch123: Error: Something in there wasn't a valid number. 21:48:16 <frosch123> @calc 26 * 2**11 21:48:16 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 53248 21:48:23 <frosch123> @base 10 16 53248 21:48:23 <DorpsGek> frosch123: D000 21:48:44 <frosch123> @calc 2**11 21:48:44 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 2048 21:48:52 <frosch123> @base 10 16 2048 21:48:52 <DorpsGek> frosch123: 800 22:02:52 *** bob_ [~oftc-webi@pool-108-40-2-207.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has joined #openttd 22:04:24 *** yorick [~yorick@ip51cd0513.speed.planet.nl] has joined #openttd 22:06:48 <frosch123> hmm, this might even fix the dubious newgrf-can-crash-ottd-with-weird-stringid-unkown bug 22:07:28 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@98.145.80.103] has joined #openttd 22:13:31 *** jamesstanford [~jamesstan@87.114.181.106] has joined #openttd 22:15:15 *** jamesstanford [~jamesstan@87.114.181.106] has quit [] 22:17:10 <Rubidium> you want to make string IDs <newgrfid> << 32 | localid ? 22:17:33 <frosch123> no, does not look like that is needed 22:19:11 *** bob_ [~oftc-webi@pool-108-40-2-207.bltmmd.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 22:22:56 *** bdavenport [~davenport@99-62-16-103.lightspeed.chrlnc.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:33:01 *** Alberth [~hat@2001:980:272e:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 22:40:40 *** oskari89 [oskari89@62-241-226-106.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 22:47:08 <planetmaker> slowly getting somewhere: http://devs.openttd.org/~planetmaker/patches/robinson_island.png 22:49:52 <frosch123> do cyclops live on thas island? 22:50:08 <frosch123> it is owned by Nobody 22:51:16 <planetmaker> definitely 22:52:14 <planetmaker> but the AI crash so many planes, surely somewhen a plane will also fall on that island 22:54:43 <Eddi|zuHause> the shoreline needs some work 22:55:55 <planetmaker> yes, but that's the details :P 22:56:35 <frosch123> it definitely uses a different set of colours, so looks all new and fresh 23:12:26 *** DarkAce-Z [~BillyMays@pppoe-184-8-90-218.dsl.hrbg.epix.net] has joined #openttd 23:17:09 *** DarkAceZ [~BillyMays@50-32-30-32.drr01.hrbg.pa.frontiernet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:27:32 <planetmaker> good night 23:31:33 *** Japa [~Japa@112.79.36.141] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 23:35:34 *** JVassie [Mortelugo@cpc14-nmal18-2-0-cust85.19-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 23:38:52 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has joined #openttd 23:40:23 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.164.39] has quit [] 23:40:40 <JVassie> anyone around who's a dab hand with NML? 23:41:58 <Eddi|zuHause> anyone around who's a dab hand with metaquestions? 23:42:22 <JVassie> I shall rephrase :P 23:42:58 <JVassie> Anyone here who has an NML environment setup who wouldn't mind quickly compiling a .grf for me from my ready-prepared .nml and .lng files? 23:44:40 <Eddi|zuHause> request a repo at the devzone? 23:44:56 <JVassie> was that a suggestion or a question? :) 23:45:03 <Eddi|zuHause> yes 23:45:03 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has quit [Quit: ZNC - http://znc.in] 23:46:59 *** Stimrol [~Stimrol@46-239-219-51.tal.is] has joined #openttd 23:53:59 <JVassie> "I you like help to code your Town Names NewGRF, please open a Ticket or meet us on IRC." 23:54:04 <JVassie> quoted from devzone 23:55:05 <frosch123> so you want a townname project? 23:55:11 <JVassie> Indeed please 23:55:20 <JVassie> I have the .nml and .lng files ready to go 23:56:39 <frosch123> planetmaker: how official is your upload-test thingie? 23:57:11 *** bdavenport [~davenport@chronos.rpi.mindlesstux.com] has joined #openttd 23:57:12 <frosch123> oh, he said good night half an hour ago 23:57:55 <frosch123> JVassie: better open a ticket then 23:58:04 <frosch123> devzone is currently not in a ready-to-go state 23:58:47 <JVassie> using the 'Apply for a project' link yes? 23:58:51 <frosch123> yes 23:59:02 <JVassie> tracker type, membership, that ok? 23:59:09 <frosch123> yes