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00:15:02 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1835E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 00:36:41 *** Progman [~progman@p57A1835E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:49:51 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@blfd-5d820e54.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 01:05:57 <Samu> just finished 01:06:02 <Samu> https://eag5jg.dm2304.livefilestore.com/y2phWk2A_mA-VthHGhIuln-OvmE5zH81VQ99308Buuz1AyoJ_-tZ_PG5P1rp680cJlI5PvUMiiAiJuV3rot2LQ5kMRv1dHsbQxdIrGJtV7Ug_8flmCu5XxfwJBKsK5fWGn0OLNv4yfJVMjECfnmCusIRA/canal%20owner%20bits%20table.png?psid=1 01:06:22 <Samu> have yet to check for mistakes/conflicts 01:06:40 <Samu> it's a big image, zoom in 01:09:08 <Samu> found 1 mistake already, :( 01:11:30 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Bye] 01:16:32 <Samu> https://eag5jg.dm2304.livefilestore.com/y2pv7gZMaNrAqXzqltg8j8wgU9HcnQxW7OaRnLOYsCbfv6jNWm0SNnZ0iNVfHhg4MFtoVA_XeDrdHWmBriAcRg2nvTwWBPJmJiB5kdT30mVgxIAAV2F5gvafv-8tnPV3eso1oMwx7bgyH1glMwgo6HCSw/canal%20owner%20bits%20table.png?psid=1 01:16:38 <Samu> corrected 01:18:47 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-154-197.netvisao.pt] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 01:26:50 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 01:34:04 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has joined #openttd 01:51:36 *** Flygon__ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has joined #openttd 01:54:07 *** Pikka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 01:58:17 *** Flygon_ [~Flygon@147.18.214.218.sta.commander.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 02:18:27 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:18:48 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 02:23:46 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-177-242.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 02:23:57 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:24:18 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 03:16:22 *** JGR_ [~JGR@host81-156-171-148.range81-156.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd 03:18:31 *** Biolunar_ [Biolunar@blfd-4d088381.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 03:19:16 *** JGR [~JGR@host81-129-179-128.range81-129.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:19:16 *** JGR_ is now known as JGR 03:20:31 *** glevans2 [~glevans2@71-8-126-76.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:22:46 *** Pokka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 03:25:30 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@blfd-5d820e54.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:26:00 *** glevans2 [~glevans2@71-8-126-76.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has joined #openttd 03:26:58 *** Pikka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 03:30:21 *** Flygon__ is now known as Flygon 03:30:35 <Flygon> supermop: Running low on Victorians in the Melbourne area. Want a free 32in widescreen CRT? 03:30:59 <supermop> sorry, no thanks 03:31:11 <supermop> not a tv kind of guy 03:31:22 <Flygon> Bugger 03:31:26 <Flygon> Thanks, anyway! 03:38:39 *** Quatroking [~Quatrokin@ip226-139-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 03:43:15 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6C7E8.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 04:58:20 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.57] has joined #openttd 05:12:25 <supermop> rendering this 7x7 grid of tram parts is really turning my laptop into a space heater 05:23:32 <supermop> 4x4 went by really quick, 6x6 was a bit slow, but 7x7 is taking forever 05:24:37 <supermop> of course adding a bunch of lights behind curved glass inside little boxes and some glowing surfaaces is probably not helping 05:29:10 <Pokka> :D 05:29:32 <Pokka> btw with the concertina parts just add them to the ends of the vehicles I reckon. half on each. 05:33:12 <supermop> i noticed a sprite rotated the wrong way halfway through through render so had to start over 05:33:33 <supermop> caving in and rendering at 256 instead of 512 px per tile 05:34:12 <supermop> i was rendering at double size then rescaling in PS as it seemed to allow a better quality rayrace 05:34:27 <supermop> trace 05:34:40 <supermop> on the d class trams 05:35:43 <supermop> the ends are the same for D1 and D2, and the center of D1 is the same as the second unit of D2 05:36:15 <supermop> so should i provide separate sprites for D1 or can it just reference those from D2's set of sprites? 05:36:39 <Pokka> if they're the same I only need one lot of sprites 05:36:56 *** Pokka is now known as Pikka 05:36:59 <supermop> im not going to render them separately but i can copy those sprites into a separate d1 folder 05:37:41 <supermop> if that is more helpful than the filesize saved by omitting them 05:37:45 <Pikka> sure, although you don't have to. I can code it with just one set of sprites used by both vehicles. reduce the file size a bit :) 05:39:00 <supermop> thats the only tram where different subclasses share identical parts so i didn't know if a non-standard bit of code was more of a pain than the extra MBs 05:41:05 <supermop> also a pain that the 2nd and 4th cars of the D2 are different lengths unlike the C2 - so it ends up asymetrical and requires 12 more sprites 05:41:25 <Pikka> oh, well 05:41:46 <Pikka> actually any shortened vehicle requires 8 views :) 05:42:08 <Pikka> even if you only render 4 I have to double them up for the different offsets 05:42:16 <supermop> ooff 05:43:26 <supermop> for 180degree symetric segments ive been doing 4 views for running and 8 for loading (assuming that doors only open on platform side) 05:43:49 <supermop> i can duplicate the running views if that helps though 05:44:06 <Pikka> it's all good 05:44:50 <supermop> for end cabs ive been doing 16 views so far - assuming that eventually i'll add taillights on 8 and headlights on 8 05:44:55 <Pikka> I render my shortened vehicles with 8 views, positioned with the front in the same place as the full-length vehicles, because it allows using the same offsets. but I've already worked out offsets for your other trams and hopefully the new ones will be the same size? ;) 05:45:04 <Pikka> cool :) 05:45:30 <supermop> im just centering all of the segments 05:45:36 <supermop> i could do differently 05:46:01 <Pikka> nope, all good. as long as they're consistent :) 05:46:46 <supermop> ok that took 17 min after halving (quartering) the size 05:50:33 <supermop> sort of feel like going to bunnings 05:50:48 <supermop> want a smaller chisel and some yello spray paint 05:56:02 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD577D.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [] 05:56:17 *** Eddi|zuHause [~johekr@p57BD4B43.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 06:27:32 *** roidal [~roland@193-154-138-156.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 06:28:13 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has joined #openttd 06:56:40 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has joined #openttd 06:56:43 *** mode/#openttd [+o Alberth] by ChanServ 07:05:32 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-238-128.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 07:09:17 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 07:46:38 *** Pensacola [~quassel@c80094.upc-c.chello.nl] has joined #openttd 07:57:36 *** Progman [~progman@p57A192C5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 08:02:53 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 08:03:05 <andythenorth> o/ 08:03:10 <Pikka> eek 08:03:13 <andythenorth> ook 08:04:33 <andythenorth> do the rest of you have ctrl-click for industry types in mini-map? Or is it just me? 08:05:14 <Pikka> just you, obviously 08:05:24 <Pikka> it works but I've never used it before 08:06:19 <Supercheese> the magick of the ctrl key 08:06:38 * andythenorth is wondering how much thread can be expended on a non-issue 08:06:50 <Pikka> well I usually want to show a couple of different industries so I just disable all then reenable the ones I want 08:07:17 <Supercheese> Yeah, that's the non-ctrl method 08:07:53 <Supercheese> although even with the white blink, single-tile town industries are sometimes still elusive 08:08:27 <andythenorth> town industries are a PITA 08:08:56 <andythenorth> oh eh, I bet theyâre using 1x GUI zoom as well 08:09:44 <Supercheese> GUI zoom is pretty new eh 08:10:47 <Alberth> moin 08:11:15 <andythenorth> lo Alberth 08:17:17 <DorpsGek> Commit by alberth :: r27174 /trunk/src (5 files in 5 dirs) (2015-03-01 08:17:14 UTC) 08:17:18 <DorpsGek> -Feature[FS#6236]: Display relative offset changes in the sprite aligner (juzza1). 08:17:28 <andythenorth> :o 08:17:39 <andythenorth> does that mean the numbers are actually useful? 08:18:11 <Alberth> I hope so, but I didn't do much :p 08:19:33 <Alberth> all praise should go to juzza :) 08:20:16 <Alberth> andythenorth: shall we make a new BB release? 08:20:24 <andythenorth> yes :) 08:20:33 <andythenorth> sorry, Iâve had no time to look at it even 08:20:44 <andythenorth> maybe for GS, we have to release early and often? 08:20:48 <andythenorth> let players find the bugs 08:20:53 <andythenorth> play-testing is time consuming 08:21:14 <Alberth> I tried it, last friday or so, and the new feature of not dropping goals where you work on, works 08:22:36 <Alberth> hmm, maybe I need to push some stuff, let's see :p 08:23:37 <Alberth> oh, I needed the name for the new release, let's do "RC2" ? 08:24:11 <Alberth> andythenorth: ^ 08:24:11 <andythenorth> yes 08:24:24 <andythenorth> eh, itâs a day of forum wrongness 08:24:31 * andythenorth wonders about correcting all the wrong 08:24:52 <Alberth> unsubscribe :) 08:27:08 <Alberth> tagging and publishing, how was that again 08:27:29 * andythenorth looks 08:28:11 <andythenorth> do we have a changelog? 08:28:15 * andythenorth looking 08:28:26 <Alberth> I added a 'features' in the readme 08:28:38 <andythenorth> yay 08:28:43 <andythenorth> hg tag RC2 08:28:46 <andythenorth> hg up RC2 08:28:50 <andythenorth> dunno how we do the build 08:29:02 <andythenorth> oh we have Makefile now? 08:29:21 <Alberth> we have that for a long time already :p 08:29:36 <Alberth> not sure whether the bananas thingie works correctly 08:30:07 <andythenorth> one way to find out⊠08:34:47 <Alberth> bananas doesn't like me :( 08:35:59 <andythenorth> oh 08:36:07 <andythenorth> Busy Bee is on my account for some reason 08:36:09 <andythenorth> thatâs stupid 08:36:14 <andythenorth> should be on coop account 08:36:23 <andythenorth> not even sure how that happened 08:36:28 <andythenorth> usually I am logged in as coop 08:36:43 <andythenorth> can it be moved? 08:36:45 <Alberth> pushed rc2 08:37:23 <Alberth> I made the first release, with both of us as author 08:37:48 <Alberth> but something went wrong, apparently 08:39:27 <andythenorth> hmm no musa here 08:39:33 * andythenorth looks how to get musa 08:42:07 <andythenorth> is there a correct way to install random python modules? 08:42:12 * andythenorth has never found one 08:43:46 <andythenorth> my nmlc only works due to luck 08:43:54 <andythenorth> and backups 08:44:07 <andythenorth> I somehow managed to make it work once, and now I fetch the backup when it breaks 08:45:10 <Alberth> add a user directory to PYTHONPATH, and install it there 08:45:30 <andythenorth> ah words I donât understand yet :D 08:45:38 <Alberth> nmlc is easier though, just leave it all in the project, and make a soft link to the nmlc program 08:46:20 <andythenorth> the âproblemâ is needing nmlc 0.3.x and 0.4.x 08:46:42 <andythenorth> although I think I fixed that now 08:46:55 <Alberth> you can change the name while making a softlink :) 08:47:23 * andythenorth ponders 08:47:39 <andythenorth> I treat my python environments as disposable, I think thatâs my problem here 08:47:40 <Alberth> ln -s /some/devzone/nml_trunk/nmlc nmlc_trunk 08:47:50 <andythenorth> so everything that can be got with pip install is fine 08:48:00 <andythenorth> but anything that needs configuration, I forget what I did 08:48:29 * andythenorth wonders if we can pip install musa and nml 08:48:30 <Alberth> I make a script or Makefile to record that stuff :p 08:48:46 * andythenorth considers sh make_my_python_work 08:49:00 <andythenorth> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/nml/0.2.4 08:49:16 <Alberth> if you need more than one configuration, it's quite messy, often 08:49:26 <andythenorth> yes 08:49:34 <andythenorth> currently I have 5 08:49:43 <andythenorth> hmm https://pypi.python.org/pypi/musa/3.4.1 08:50:17 <andythenorth> we are missing someone who likes packaging :D 08:52:52 <Pikka> http://pikkarail.com/openttd/among-the-gum-trees/ 08:53:15 <supermop> hmm, keep rendering, make bucatini, or go to a bar? 08:53:27 <Pikka> bar, obv 08:53:47 <supermop> dont feel like eating bucatini but its all i have on hand 08:54:06 <andythenorth> Pikka: is that your standard Brisbane type house? 08:54:42 <Pikka> maybe! 08:54:44 <supermop> looks swampy 08:54:53 <supermop> eaves should overhang more though? 08:55:26 <Pikka> you wouldn't be able to see the sides at all if the eaves were much bigger :) 08:55:27 <supermop> looks good 08:55:44 <Terkhen> good morning 08:55:49 <supermop> what about those shade things hanging on veranda/porch 08:55:50 <Pikka> it's a start, anyway... 08:55:52 <andythenorth> lo Terkhen 08:55:52 <Alberth> good morning Terkhen 08:55:56 <Pikka> good morning Terkhen 08:56:01 * andythenorth considers Pineapple FIRS economy 08:56:05 <supermop> is thing in back rainwater tank? 08:56:10 <andythenorth> if you could just quicly render all the industry sprites 08:56:11 <Pikka> si 08:56:22 <Pikka> I can render them very quickly andy 08:56:30 <Pikka> you just have to model and texture them :) 08:56:36 <andythenorth> this is problem 08:56:40 <andythenorth> I am busy see 08:56:48 <Alberth> s/see/bee/ 08:56:48 <andythenorth> helping explain to child why you canât convert buses 08:56:59 <andythenorth> also he has transfer-leg profit issues 08:57:35 <Alberth> oh dear, so young, and having money trouble arleady 08:57:48 <supermop> andy if you want basic shapes similar to what you have now, i can model some and export as meshes for Pikka to render 08:57:49 <andythenorth> he has built a route with about 7 transfer steps in it 08:58:03 <andythenorth> including needlessly putting a train portage across a small peninsual 08:58:07 <andythenorth> peninsula * 08:58:19 <Alberth> no doubt it looks pretty 08:58:32 <andythenorth> toyland 08:58:36 <andythenorth> original base set 08:58:41 <andythenorth> draw your own conclusion 08:59:51 <andythenorth> so can I ln musa.py from virtualenv/bin? 08:59:58 <andythenorth> or does it go in site-packages 09:00:11 <Alberth> I have been playing toyland a lot in my youth :) 09:00:16 <Alberth> you can just link it 09:00:45 <Alberth> python imports packages from the directory containing the program 09:01:53 <andythenorth> now it needs a config file 09:02:02 * andythenorth reads docs 09:02:07 <Alberth> 'make' provides one 09:02:18 <andythenorth> oh 09:02:21 <andythenorth> I tried âmake bananasâ 09:02:28 <andythenorth> print "reading configuration file %s..." % options.config 09:02:32 <andythenorth> oh itâs python 2 09:02:34 <andythenorth> oops 09:03:47 <Supercheese> make bananas -> you'll need quite the ripening time 09:05:38 <Alberth> that's why you first need to install musa :p 09:06:28 <Supercheese> and apparently you need ethylene gas too, hmm 09:06:46 <Supercheese> they should have mentioned that in chemistry class, it would have been more interesting 09:07:10 <Supercheese> "Ethylene is the simplest alkene, and it is used to ripen bananas" 09:08:22 <andythenorth> canât get a working musa 09:08:31 <andythenorth> might return to that later 09:08:37 <andythenorth> âproblems with python packaging' 09:08:47 <Alberth> :( 09:08:50 <Alberth> ok 09:09:00 <andythenorth> standard for me 09:09:16 <Supercheese> I thought pythons were carnivorous, but it seems to have eaten your bananas 09:09:51 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6C7E8.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 09:10:24 <andythenorth> my python is rejecting bananas 09:10:33 <andythenorth> etc 09:13:07 <andythenorth> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pbft3mxmv 09:13:13 <andythenorth> I need to declare an encoding? 09:14:01 <andythenorth> line 2 is empty 09:15:24 <andythenorth> hmm 09:15:41 <andythenorth> dunno 09:16:00 <andythenorth> âpython2.7 musa.py âversionâ works in the musa repo I have checked out 09:16:08 <andythenorth> but not when linked from Busy Bee 09:16:32 <andythenorth> if I put it in the virtualenv bin dir it has insufficient permissions 09:17:12 <Alberth> yes, "python bla.py" runs from whereever you start the program, and that's thus where your imports are 09:17:20 <Alberth> or rather, should be 09:17:39 <Alberth> what's 'python' at your system? 09:17:56 <Alberth> ie the first line of musa.py uses that 09:18:09 <andythenorth> depends on the active virtualenv 09:18:34 <andythenorth> Iâll change the shebang in musa 09:18:48 <Alberth> that's one option :) 09:19:25 <andythenorth> still need to put musa in the path somehow 09:19:43 * andythenorth has to go do children things 09:19:46 <andythenorth> bbl 09:19:57 <andythenorth> :| 09:20:05 <Alberth> PATH=$PATH:/some/where/musa_dir 09:22:42 <andythenorth> to make this work for newgrfs, I had a PATH in Makefile.config iirc 09:23:38 <Alberth> I have a $HOME/bin directory where I add my user scripts 09:24:03 <Alberth> and in the login startup script, I add that directory to my path 09:35:43 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd 09:38:29 <andythenorth> no setup.py for musa 09:38:38 * andythenorth was wondering about just installing it as a package 09:39:00 <andythenorth> the old-fashioned way :P 09:43:18 * andythenorth tries directly uploading BB to bananas 09:43:24 <andythenorth> bananas wonât accept the .tar 09:43:44 <andythenorth> Unknown file in pack: ._license.txt 09:44:08 <andythenorth> software development: all joy, no fun 09:45:43 * andythenorth admits defeat 09:45:57 <andythenorth> wonât accept a zip either 09:46:04 <andythenorth> zip doesnât have _license.txt in it 09:46:23 <andythenorth> :x 09:46:28 <andythenorth> bbl :) 09:46:29 <SpComb> you wouldn't upload unlicensed code, would you 09:46:35 <SpComb> it's like stealing a car 09:46:44 <andythenorth> eh, I think youâre missing the point 09:47:03 <andythenorth> or I am 09:47:05 <andythenorth> one of us anyway 09:49:42 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 10:01:23 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 10:01:37 <Wolf01> hi o/ 10:03:23 *** shadowalkerAFK is now known as shadowalker 10:11:17 <Alberth> moin 10:22:01 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:22:19 *** Celestar [~Celestar@ip-109-43-1-63.web.vodafone.de] has joined #openttd 10:26:16 *** Klanticus_ [~quassel@200-161-120-132.dsl.telesp.net.br] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:39:49 *** smoke_fumus [~smoke_fum@188.35.176.90] has joined #openttd 10:40:26 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.57] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 10:40:49 *** Celestar [~Celestar@ip-109-43-1-63.web.vodafone.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:42:38 *** luaduck is now known as luaduck_zzz 10:43:07 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d0130db.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 10:51:24 <Alberth> hai 10:51:47 <Alberth> I saw you did FS#6237 already, nice 10:56:04 <frosch123> moin 10:56:28 <frosch123> yes, though i wonder whether replacing the _cur_dpi backups with some conistructor/destructor magic 10:57:54 *** roidal_ [~roland@62-46-138-30.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd 11:00:00 <Alberth> which would imply your object would need a set of {} brackets. Not so nice imho 11:01:59 <Alberth> I can imagine a DrawLimitArea da; da.SetLimit(xpos, ypos, xsize, ysize); /* draw stuff */ da.ResetLimit(); 11:02:07 <frosch123> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/p1tainnyy <- i mean something like that 11:02:36 *** roidal [~roland@193-154-138-156.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 11:03:12 <frosch123> possibly derived from Backup<DrawPixelInfo> 11:03:30 <frosch123> though Backup enforced explicit calls to Restore 11:03:42 <frosch123> and only uses the destructor in case of errors 11:04:09 <Alberth> I like making things explicit, it's hard to see "}" drops the limit 11:05:06 <Alberth> especially if you fold it in something harmless like a 'then' if (...) { BackUp... ; ... ; ... ; } 11:08:36 <frosch123> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/paezrhq73 <- so, essentially that 11:09:17 <frosch123> maybe i missed a * or & somewhere :) 11:11:16 <Alberth> pretty much, although I would expect some _dpi global 11:11:58 <Alberth> oh it's in the constructor, right 11:12:38 <Alberth> should work 11:44:06 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.57] has joined #openttd 11:45:46 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 12:05:10 *** Quatroking [~Quatrokin@ip226-139-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl] has joined #openttd 12:08:46 *** Progman [~progman@p57A192C5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:32:09 *** Supercheese is now known as Guest228 12:32:14 *** Supercheese [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has joined #openttd 12:37:16 *** Guest228 [~Superchee@cpe-76-178-136-186.natnow.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:37:57 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 12:38:08 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 12:39:21 <andythenorth> Alberth: http://bananas.openttd.org/en/gs/ 12:39:24 <andythenorth> RC2 12:39:33 <Alberth> \o/ 12:39:40 <andythenorth> itâs still on the wrong account 12:39:45 <andythenorth> should move it to coop 12:39:47 <andythenorth> dunno how 12:40:07 <Alberth> "M" ? 12:40:21 <Alberth> ah well :) 12:40:22 <andythenorth> I modified the Makefile to make it work 12:40:30 <andythenorth> and there was only one way to check it worked :P 12:40:35 <andythenorth> no dry run 12:41:11 <Alberth> musa does have that, but again it needs makefile editing :) 12:41:29 <Alberth> publishing needs more love 12:41:59 <Alberth> you want to make a post, or should I? 12:42:05 <andythenorth> you 12:42:08 <Alberth> k 12:42:08 * andythenorth is hanging out washing 12:42:16 <andythenorth> sorry, Iâm not much help on BB :P 12:42:23 <Alberth> concurrent processing :) 12:42:52 <frosch123> andythenorth: it shows only the first account, no matter what 12:42:52 <Alberth> I am not helping much on firs, iron horse, road hog 12:43:37 <andythenorth> frosch123: is there some way to move them? Edit MySQL or something? 12:43:46 <andythenorth> HEQS was moved to coop account years ago iirc 12:44:03 <frosch123> maybe if you change the sorting in bananas.ini 12:44:37 <andythenorth> oh maybe weâre talking at cross purposes 12:44:52 <andythenorth> youâre speaking wrt musa? 12:45:00 <frosch123> yes 12:45:04 <frosch123> are you not using musa? 12:45:32 <andythenorth> yes, but I originally uploaded BB to bananas on my andythenorth account 12:45:40 <andythenorth> for reasons I donât understand, probably just a mistake 12:45:56 <andythenorth> everything else is on the openttdcoop account 12:46:21 <Alberth> I did that 12:46:29 <Alberth> as you can see in bananas.ini 12:47:40 <andythenorth> where? 12:47:42 * andythenorth looking 12:58:51 <Alberth> posted http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?p=1140822#p1140822 12:58:51 <andythenorth> so what am I missing? 12:58:59 <andythenorth> musa asks for auth creds when it runs 12:59:11 <andythenorth> so I put in my account for RC2 because thatâs where BB is already 12:59:25 <andythenorth> does bananas.ini try and provide the account? 12:59:37 <frosch123> bananas.ini contains a list of accounts, which may update 12:59:44 <frosch123> you can use any account of those 12:59:53 <frosch123> but the website will only show one 13:00:01 <frosch123> no idea which, maybe the fist in the list in bananas.ini 13:00:08 <frosch123> maybe it updates when uploading a new version 13:00:29 <frosch123> but why do you even care what the website shows? :p 13:01:21 *** shadowalker is now known as shadowalkerAFK 13:02:02 <Alberth> it didn't like me, for some reason 13:03:25 <Alberth> so we wondered who owns BB :) 13:03:30 <andythenorth> can bananas content be uploaded via more than one account? :o 13:03:45 <andythenorth> I assumed it was tied to a specific account 13:04:17 <Alberth> in that case it would be buggy, as you didn't upload the first release :p 13:04:37 <andythenorth> hmm 13:05:03 <andythenorth> oh, so thatâs why itâs linked to my account? Because of your musa upload of RC1? 13:05:03 <Alberth> but it's an option :) 13:05:07 <andythenorth> I thought Iâd done a bad 13:05:12 <frosch123> andythenorth: what do you think the user list in bananas.ini is for? 13:05:20 <andythenorth> dunno, trying to find out :) 13:05:29 <andythenorth> Alberth: so how did you get my password? 13:05:38 <andythenorth> or is it just âauthâ 13:05:40 <Alberth> haha :D 13:05:45 <andythenorth> rather than specific user auth 13:05:55 * andythenorth wonders how bananas user model works :P 13:05:58 <planetmaker> o/ 13:06:07 <Alberth> moin planetmaker 13:06:30 <andythenorth> so it doesnât matter that itâs on my account, itâs not âlostâ if Iâm not around? 13:06:34 <planetmaker> andythenorth, bananas.ini gives a list of applicable users. You give on upload your own user + pw for authentication against bananas. It's independent 13:06:35 <andythenorth> other people can still maintain BB? 13:06:41 <planetmaker> it's just a list of users who may update later 13:06:58 <planetmaker> users not in the list in bananas.ini may never update the content (unless added in a later bananas.ini) 13:06:59 <Alberth> planetmaker: yep, that's the theory 13:07:08 <Alberth> but it didn't like me 13:07:27 <planetmaker> did you do something bad? ;) 13:07:41 <Alberth> while I uploaded the first release 13:08:33 <Alberth> perhaps I should have made more openttd patches? 13:08:48 <Alberth> don't know if bananas counts those :p 13:09:00 <andythenorth> so do Bananas content item have n owners? 13:09:16 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 13:09:29 <Alberth> are there other items with more than one owner? 13:09:34 <frosch123> Alberth: maybe it is case sensitive 13:10:06 <frosch123> is your account lowercase? 13:10:07 * andythenorth has that bananas VM somewhere 13:10:15 <andythenorth> we need to improve Bananas soon anyway :P 13:10:21 <andythenorth> could we do it by April 1? 13:10:24 <Alberth> soon(tm) 13:10:30 <frosch123> the vm is older than musa :p 13:10:39 <andythenorth> hmm 13:10:45 <andythenorth> well what do we need to improve? 13:10:56 <andythenorth> my main goal was to provide a html page for each item 13:11:10 <Alberth> frosch123: Uppercase "A" 13:11:19 <frosch123> Alberth: bananas.ini has lowercase 13:11:26 <frosch123> so, is that the problem? 13:11:43 <Alberth> could be, we'll find out on the next release :) 13:12:00 <andythenorth> so what can I do to âfixâ the Makefile? 13:12:09 <Alberth> although you wonder why I could upload the first time then 13:12:16 <SpComb> is this "subsidies" thing in the game some new GoalScripts feature? :P 13:12:30 <frosch123> Alberth: because it was the first time? 13:12:42 <frosch123> basically you uploaded with not granting you the right to update 13:12:54 <andythenorth> Makefile diff 13:12:55 <andythenorth> https://paste.openttdcoop.org/pjhkexhdg 13:13:09 <frosch123> but, well, musad should probably check whether the accounts actually exist 13:13:17 <andythenorth> basically I dumped musa into BusyBee dir, thatâs not essential, but avoided an ugly path :P 13:13:34 <andythenorth> I canât find a way to install musa as a python module / package 13:13:42 <Alberth> quite possible, but then it either has "alberth" and "Alberth" accounts, or something along the way dropped the lower case after the login check 13:13:51 <andythenorth> I tried giving it an __init__.py and putting it in bin or site-packages 13:14:01 <frosch123> andythenorth: stop installing stuff 13:14:08 <frosch123> just symlink them from /usr/local/bin 13:14:29 <andythenorth> how will python find it as a package from there? 13:14:36 <andythenorth> thatâs not in the path? 13:14:52 <Alberth> python uses the directory of the program as import directory 13:15:10 <andythenorth> am I conflating package and program? 13:15:52 <Alberth> for nml, "nmlc" is program, and "nml/" is package (directory) 13:16:24 <Alberth> since nmlc is right next to "nml" directory, it can "from nml import stuff" 13:17:00 <andythenorth> so I donât need musa to be available as a python package? Itâs just a program on my box? 13:18:04 <Alberth> it imports several .py files directly, it seems 13:18:27 * andythenorth looks up how to make symlinks 13:18:28 <Alberth> just keep the entire directory 13:18:37 <juzza1> https://wiki.openttd.org/Strings#Lifecycle the last part is still valid? i.e. delete all the translated strings manually if the string is changed in english.txt 13:18:56 <frosch123> wt3 does that as well 13:18:57 <Alberth> cd /usr/local/bin ; ln -s /path/to/musa/musa.py . 13:19:09 <frosch123> anyway, everything on strings on the wiki is old stuff 13:19:15 <planetmaker> frosch123, can bananas.ini remove people again from bananas access? 13:19:28 <frosch123> planetmaker: no idea, i did not write it 13:19:33 <frosch123> and it was most likely not tested 13:19:48 <planetmaker> juzza1, yes-ish. Depends a bit whether the meaning changes or it's just a typo fix or amendment 13:20:07 <planetmaker> juzza1, if you want to force a new translation (thus make it obvious), then remove the translations. In a separate commit 13:20:40 <juzza1> I'm amending "Ctrl+click to do this and that" 13:20:40 <frosch123> juzza1: but don't even consider doing that, unless you know how to use "sed" or similar tools :p 13:21:20 <andythenorth> ok, Iâve linked musa, that works 13:21:47 <planetmaker> juzza1, not sure that amending the ctrl+click information warrants to invalidate translations as that only is an amendment 13:21:59 <andythenorth> no makefile changes needed 13:22:15 <planetmaker> juzza1, in that case imho it's sufficient if translators see them in the category of changed strings. The current translation isn't wrong in that case. Just not complete 13:22:21 <Alberth> andythenorth: great 13:23:02 <planetmaker> juzza1, but indeed removing strings from translations is two console commands with grep and sed :) 13:23:04 <andythenorth> maybe one day Iâll understand computers 13:23:05 <Alberth> we'll understand how to publish a script eventually :p 13:23:21 <juzza1> planetmaker: ok 13:23:37 <juzza1> and yes, i did it with sed :P 13:23:40 * andythenorth wonders if he could improve musa docs 13:23:45 <andythenorth> not sure how 13:24:20 <Alberth> your time is better spent on a nicer web thingie, probably 13:24:51 <andythenorth> my world contains a lot of python files, almost none of which can be called directly 13:25:04 <andythenorth> so I set about musa.py all wrong:P 13:25:52 <Alberth> directly callable scripts are very nice, you may want to consider adding more in your world 13:32:21 <andythenorth> well, it tends to cause issues with shebangs 13:32:30 <planetmaker> version RC2M, eh? 13:32:32 <andythenorth> unless you have something like buildout that can set the shebang 13:32:43 <andythenorth> also, mostly, modules modules modules :) 13:32:46 <planetmaker> the shebang is set in the script? 13:33:04 <andythenorth> conventionally 13:33:16 <andythenorth> is there a sys arg method? 13:33:30 <planetmaker> #! /usr/bin/env python3 13:33:36 <planetmaker> or something like that is a nice shebang 13:33:38 <andythenorth> shebang 13:33:44 <andythenorth> useless for isolation 13:34:17 <andythenorth> :) 13:34:59 <andythenorth> which python 3 is that? :P 13:35:19 <andythenorth> although there is a hideous port select utility on OS X that letâs you set current python 13:35:53 <planetmaker> python should always be python2. And python3 is... well... python3. Isn't that the case with your ports? 13:36:11 <planetmaker> same broken-ness as with linux arch then :P 13:36:39 <Alberth> bdfl sees "python" as "the python interpreter" which ever version :p 13:37:13 <Alberth> so it may be wise to specifically set a version if required 13:38:02 <andythenorth> he 13:38:25 <andythenorth> for work I need python 2.4, 2.6 and 2.7 13:38:34 <andythenorth> for newgrfs I need 3.2, 3.4, and 2.7 and 2.6 13:38:40 <andythenorth> so eh :) 13:40:12 <Alberth> just buy 5 computers :p 13:41:19 <andythenorth> got seriously close to using vagrant :P 13:41:27 <andythenorth> virtualbox for each project 13:41:31 <andythenorth> totally portable :P 13:41:35 <Alberth> but 2.6 -> 2.7 and 3.2 -> 3.4 should be feasible quite easily ? 13:41:55 <andythenorth> ish yes 13:42:19 <andythenorth> you have 3.4 though, and I rely on you to repro my current bugs :P 13:42:23 <andythenorth> whereas devzone has 3.2 13:42:45 <andythenorth> and the 2.6 stuff would need a full production QA run to be moved to 2.7, and the production environment redeployed 13:42:52 <andythenorth> 2.4 is best not mentioned :( 13:43:45 <Alberth> I didn't, for exactly that reason :p 13:44:01 <andythenorth> every package you want to useâŠ.doesnât exist :( 13:44:05 <andythenorth> itâs like crippleware 13:44:33 <Alberth> indeed, open source tends to move very fast to the newest stuff 13:44:57 <planetmaker> well, depends on which / how it is used 13:45:07 <planetmaker> distros don't exactly update the python version they ship 13:45:19 <planetmaker> thus yes, 3.2 is still debian current. As is 2.7 13:45:39 <andythenorth> there tends to be conservatism around databases and stuff which has to be zero defect 13:45:44 <andythenorth> âletâs stick with the known bugs" 13:46:05 <planetmaker> makes sense, if your source of revenue depends on it :) 13:46:30 <andythenorth> I dunno 13:46:38 <andythenorth> playing it safe tends to cause a lot of trouble in the long run 13:46:42 <andythenorth> to quote Banksy 13:46:59 <planetmaker> well, the point with production systems is: you want them running and you need to make sure they're safe 13:46:59 * andythenorth is stuck with a large app in python 2.4, which is dead :P 13:47:11 <planetmaker> any single change in version of one of the software pieces used may change that 13:47:25 <planetmaker> thus... setup the system, let it run for a few years safe security backports 13:47:39 <planetmaker> then setup new system with newer stuff, test, and switch 13:48:15 <planetmaker> different probably for desktop... but then... yes, I don't want to re-install my workplace desktop too often either. It also takes time 13:49:18 <andythenorth> so should we update bananas for April? 13:49:34 <planetmaker> please do :) 13:50:06 <planetmaker> if you ask TrueBrain nicely he might even give you a VM clone of bananas with a DB copy and have you experiment till it runs :) 13:50:18 <planetmaker> or ... there used to be a VM ... wasn't there, frosch123 ? 13:51:12 <andythenorth> I have one 13:51:34 <planetmaker> there might have been the issue that it integrates with the rest of openttd web frontend 13:52:09 <planetmaker> but granted... that can possibly be separated 13:52:29 *** Defaultti [defaultti@lakka.kapsi.fi] has quit [Quit: Quitting.] 13:54:04 <TrueBrain> [14:49] <andythenorth> virtualbox for each project <- use virtualenv, and yo dont need a vm for each project ;) 13:54:27 <andythenorth> exactly 13:54:42 <andythenorth> also isolated pythons which can be rebuilt on demand 13:54:49 <TrueBrain> [14:57] <andythenorth> so should we update bananas for April? <- why April, and what update? 13:54:52 <andythenorth> but you do have to fight setuptools 6 times :( 13:55:03 <andythenorth> April 1 is traditional release date? 13:55:18 <TrueBrain> I run Python2.7, Python 2.6 and PyPy 2.5 in different virtualenvs, all isolated :D Main system doesn't even have Python running 13:55:24 <TrueBrain> I love that shit :) 13:55:34 <andythenorth> I love it now I have got it written down and repeatable :P 13:55:38 <andythenorth> I didnât love learning it 13:56:00 <andythenorth> Bananas update: I have only the idea of a html page for each item, showing the description etc 13:56:02 <TrueBrain> anyway, I have no clue what you guys talk about :) 13:56:05 <andythenorth> like a web preview 13:56:10 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: there inded is a dev VM, which should work fine 13:56:32 <TrueBrain> a DB copy would be impropable to give :P 13:56:53 <TrueBrain> but it cant be hard to fill the dev VM with dummy data ofc :) 13:57:19 <planetmaker> it would be nice to be able to give that to andy :) 13:57:26 <TrueBrain> ah; well, feel free to improve BaNaNaS :) 13:57:27 <andythenorth> and anyone else who wants to improve it⊠13:57:33 * andythenorth wonders about a reskin some time 13:57:39 <TrueBrain> planetmaker: give what? Bit vague after my lines :D 13:57:51 <Alberth> DB scheme? 13:57:57 <TrueBrain> should be in the VM 13:57:59 <Alberth> or, what dies if you change that? 13:58:09 <TrueBrain> I at least assume frosch did a proper job there; I have no reason to doubt him :D 13:58:16 <andythenorth> could we have a populate script? (first run, dummy data) 13:58:27 <planetmaker> the DB scheme with at least dummy DB, access to it, so that he can stab at it till it squeaks back 13:58:44 <TrueBrain> the VM, as far as I understood, is a working version of BaNaNaS 13:58:48 <TrueBrain> so .. that should be in there 13:58:59 <TrueBrain> I doubt otherwise the dev VM would be useful :D 13:59:12 <TrueBrain> so to me it seems that information is already supplied, wrapped in a nice VM :D 13:59:33 *** Defaultti [defaultti@lakka.kapsi.fi] has joined #openttd 13:59:42 <TrueBrain> and as BaNaNaS is build on Django, any DB changes should be trivial to apply to live system :) 14:00:00 <TrueBrain> django-admin syncdb *waits* :D 14:00:14 <TrueBrain> so knock yourself out with it, and let us know any patches you cook up 14:00:38 <planetmaker> I think the idea is: python3 instead of 2 :P 14:00:47 <TrueBrain> that is a very bad idea :) 14:00:53 <TrueBrain> for so many reasons, but most importantly: django :) 14:00:55 <Wolf01> andythenorth: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m01_wVwmR6s 14:01:10 <Wolf01> (not mine) 14:01:13 <TrueBrain> and also, very few reasons to upgrade to Python 3 atm :) 14:01:29 <TrueBrain> (and then I talk about BaNaNaS, not musa btw :P) 14:01:37 <TrueBrain> musa would be nice if it also ran under Python3 ofc :) 14:01:47 <planetmaker> actually the reasons become more to also use py3 14:02:06 <TrueBrain> and for a server-side only thing that is not really useful 14:02:13 <TrueBrain> client-side stuff, I totally agree :) 14:02:22 <TrueBrain> so I wonder if we are all talking about the same thing here :) 14:03:07 <TrueBrain> so lets rewind, and let me ask: what piece of software do you want to give Python3 support? 14:06:50 <andythenorth> afaik, none of the big Python web frameworks can port to Python 3 yet 14:06:55 <TrueBrain> nope 14:07:01 <andythenorth> too many deps stuck on python 2 14:07:04 <TrueBrain> so making BaNaNaS Py3 compatible is silly atm :D 14:07:32 <andythenorth> we are going to try moving a small web app to python 3 in 2016 14:07:36 <andythenorth> at work 14:07:52 <andythenorth> some stuff in python 3.4 makes it look slightly more possible 14:08:32 <TrueBrain> Py3 is much nicer than Py2 14:08:39 <TrueBrain> just too bad so many libs depend on CPython2 .. 14:09:05 <TrueBrain> and I mention CPython explicitly, because working with PyPy can also be troublesome :D 14:09:26 <TrueBrain> but so what does planetmaker want to port to Py3? (and why?, curious etc :D) 14:11:37 <planetmaker> oh, I thought that's what andy tried to suggest when saying rewrite as he port(ed) everything to py3. A mis-understanding on my part 14:11:59 <TrueBrain> ah :) 14:12:12 <TrueBrain> server-side stuff will be a while before they can be ported to Py3, sadly 14:12:25 <TrueBrain> and Py3 is already at version .. what, 3.4? 14:12:32 <TrueBrain> I mean ... slow moving shit there :( 14:12:55 <planetmaker> I also wasn't aware that things look so gloomy wrt the big frameworks and py3 14:13:08 <TrueBrain> in general, I find very few projects running Py3 :( 14:13:29 <planetmaker> yeah, well. 14:14:26 <frosch123> planetmaker: remember when devzone migrated to psql? :p 14:14:42 <TrueBrain> anyway, andythenorth, the dev vm frosch made should be enough to work on anything BaNaNaS related, as far as I understood 14:14:45 <andythenorth> k 14:14:51 <andythenorth> I donât even know how to start bananas 14:14:52 <TrueBrain> if you need anything else/more, just poke me, and we will see what I can fix up for you :) 14:14:55 <andythenorth> thanks :) 14:15:02 <andythenorth> not today, today is lego + kids day 14:15:07 <TrueBrain> hmm .. lega ... 14:15:07 <frosch123> it's already running in the vm 14:15:09 <TrueBrain> lego 14:15:11 <TrueBrain> typing is hard :P 14:15:25 <frosch123> but well, the vm is from before musa 14:15:27 <andythenorth> has anyone else got any bananas (website) ideas? 14:15:42 * andythenorth ponders reskinning it for amusement 14:15:52 <frosch123> iirc the vm used psql, so no idea whether musad will actually work there 14:16:00 <planetmaker> frosch123, I do :) 14:16:15 * andythenorth could apply Bootstrap styles, as http://bundles.openttdcoop.org/firs/releases/LATEST/docs/html/economies.html 14:16:35 <TrueBrain> might be nice to keep everything in the same style 14:17:01 <TrueBrain> but I might be biased :D I hate that so many websites look like Bootstrap these days .. 14:17:02 <andythenorth> thereâs no real need to change 14:17:06 <TrueBrain> it is like Frontpage all over again :P 14:17:13 <andythenorth> Bootstrap can be made not like Bootstrap 14:17:15 <planetmaker> andythenorth, you could - however - be creative and suggest a new style for the whole web presence ;) 14:17:27 <planetmaker> suggest means, implementing, of course :P 14:17:29 <TrueBrain> the current design is from 2008 I believe 14:17:38 <TrueBrain> a total redesign is suggestable ;) :D 14:18:04 <andythenorth> not by April 1 14:18:05 <andythenorth> but yeah 14:18:11 <planetmaker> we could hire V453000 for some design elements. But he's been lagging with supplying the promised ones to #openttdcoop :P 14:18:19 <TrueBrain> no, that would take a bit longer ;) 14:18:30 <TrueBrain> hire suggests paying .. :P 14:18:39 <planetmaker> we pay with fame ;) 14:18:52 <TrueBrain> that is not "hire", that is "volunteering" :P 14:18:54 <TrueBrain> just saying :D 14:18:55 <andythenorth> how is OpenTTD website stuff deployed? 14:18:56 <frosch123> V is paid in beer 14:18:58 <andythenorth> is it on a tag? 14:19:04 <andythenorth> or is it just manual update to rev? 14:19:06 <planetmaker> true. beer 14:19:07 <TrueBrain> svn update 14:19:08 <TrueBrain> :D 14:19:16 <frosch123> andythenorth: you have a vm with the complete website :p 14:19:20 <andythenorth> I know 14:19:29 <andythenorth> I havenât looked in it though 14:19:33 <TrueBrain> we used to run test and live, but it turned out the release cycles were so close together 14:19:35 <TrueBrain> there was no use :P 14:19:42 <andythenorth> is there any staging environment 14:19:43 <andythenorth> ? 14:19:47 <TrueBrain> not anymore 14:19:59 <TrueBrain> took more effort to maintain the test env than anything else :P 14:20:07 <TrueBrain> (we are not mission critical etc) 14:20:13 <planetmaker> hm 14:20:14 <TrueBrain> but then again, there hasnt been any real work on it either 14:20:30 <TrueBrain> when there is some real work, which needs reviewing by others, we can dust off the test env 14:20:33 <TrueBrain> shouldnt be a real issue 14:20:54 <TrueBrain> I think test-www is only not routed .. but is still online etc :P 14:22:33 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-154-197.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd 14:22:43 <Samu> hi 14:23:23 <andythenorth> I can probably open a port in my router to show people local changes 14:23:29 <andythenorth> staging is useful for getting an opinion 14:23:49 <TrueBrain> yeah; like I said, we can always start it up if you want to 14:23:51 <TrueBrain> not a real issue 14:24:30 <planetmaker> TrueBrain, that's why I suggested access to andy on some test VM. Easier to communicate. And possibly collaborate on that 14:24:41 <planetmaker> test VM as hosted on our server 14:24:41 <TrueBrain> lets get there when we get there, tbh 14:25:00 <frosch123> planetmaker: we already have a test vm 14:25:02 <TrueBrain> he can start on his own VM; we can always launch a test VM on the server when he has results to show 14:25:19 <frosch123> there is litterally nothing that prevents doing bananas website development 14:25:26 <andythenorth> except lego 14:25:28 <planetmaker> kk 14:25:32 <andythenorth> and a 5 year old 14:25:32 <frosch123> it just needs someone to stop talking and start working :p 14:25:35 <andythenorth> and a 3 year old 14:25:41 <TrueBrain> lol @ frosch :D 14:25:45 <planetmaker> :P 14:25:46 <andythenorth> two poos cleaned up since we started talking :P 14:25:49 <andythenorth> you have no idea 14:26:01 <TrueBrain> and seriously, if you start working on it, and have something to show, just poke me and we arrange something 14:26:17 <TrueBrain> it takes relative little effort to setup the test env 14:26:38 <andythenorth> is there any project tracker for the website? 14:26:48 <TrueBrain> in what sense/way? 14:26:50 <andythenorth> or should I just randomly work on stuff? 14:26:53 <andythenorth> devzone project 14:27:05 <frosch123> there is a project an fs and a project on devzone 14:27:07 <TrueBrain> not much more clear :D 14:27:15 <TrueBrain> but yeah, bugs.openttd.org has a Website category 14:27:29 <TrueBrain> not of a lot of use, but .. its there :P 14:27:30 <frosch123> https://bugs.openttd.org/index.php?project=4&do=index&switch=1 14:28:08 <frosch123> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/openttd-website 14:30:02 <frosch123> https://dev.openttdcoop.org/projects/openttd-testenv <- that's the old vm 14:30:30 <frosch123> hmm, repository is empty though :p 14:30:47 <TrueBrain> that is just hateful :P 14:31:06 <planetmaker> hm... 14:31:09 <frosch123> either it got lost on some devzone migration 14:31:12 <frosch123> or i never pushed :p 14:31:53 <planetmaker> I *think* the latter. Due to safety concerns 14:32:06 * andythenorth not so good at Latin: âEnsete ventricosum" 14:32:15 <planetmaker> banana ;) 14:32:20 <TrueBrain> ..... 14:32:31 <TrueBrain> really? :P 14:32:53 <frosch123> hmm, maybe musa was already around 14:33:11 <frosch123> no other reason to pick such name otherwise :p 14:38:19 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 14:39:18 <planetmaker> frosch123, definitely, in no backup however old it is, there is a commit in the openttd-testdev repository 14:40:02 <planetmaker> at least for what we still have. We've snapshots back to August 2013 of the repos 14:41:49 <frosch123> yup, my repo has 2 commits, but no push location 14:43:23 <planetmaker> neither of those two projects is set as public. So... should rather be safe, I think 14:43:55 <frosch123> was more a rhodecode issue back then or something 14:45:04 <planetmaker> yeah, just looking there 14:45:15 <Samu> hi 14:46:01 <Samu> here's the schematics for canal ownership: https://eag5jg.dm2304.livefilestore.com/y2pxAxqMQ1TyZ4Qgq0SsEQgyNktHiQtFSZSTOWeTGWj-7QO1wbNrRSh1oIn_iabAgtWY8PKOorF0lLcr0ErjjLGhnWcN6V-MvqSKYI1ISubMDUzucZTX5eeUGbakLeuActLTuNHqYoEPjEcrc5S93FP8A/canal%20owner%20bits%20table.png?psid=1 14:46:04 <planetmaker> but I can set projects there to private, too 14:46:20 <Samu> now i can start asking questions how to code :) 14:46:51 <planetmaker> thus... can you - without login - see them now, both openttd-website as well as openttd-testenv? 14:47:23 <planetmaker> I can't, but ... :) 14:48:46 <frosch123> both give my a login prompt :) 14:49:13 <planetmaker> do you have a rhodecode one? 14:49:34 <planetmaker> hm, yes :P 14:49:43 <frosch123> pushed 14:49:58 <Samu> locks waterclass is canal or river right? 14:50:46 <planetmaker> ok... so adding andy to the project people there? 14:56:58 *** Pensacola [~quassel@c80094.upc-c.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:05:31 *** Pokka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has joined #openttd 15:11:33 *** Pikka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:13:12 <andythenorth> Pokka o/ 15:19:41 <supermop> hey is it better to organize sprites as Tram / Class / Segment / running or loading / livery or some other hierarchy? 15:24:28 <planetmaker> supermop, whatever suits you, really 15:30:31 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 15:30:34 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai|noir] by ChanServ 15:30:59 *** Celestar [~Celestar@p5DE45E7B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 15:36:17 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-238-128.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:39:32 <supermop> ok 15:39:39 <supermop> i should get to bed 15:44:16 *** Pokka [~Octomom@203-206-161-219.perm.iinet.net.au] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:50:11 *** roadt [~roadt@60.168.94.57] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:53:31 *** Celestar [~Celestar@p5DE45E7B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 15:54:21 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-177-242.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:05:24 *** Celestar [~Celestar@ip-109-43-2-87.web.vodafone.de] has joined #openttd 16:33:26 <Samu> uhmm... 16:34:43 <Samu> I'm going to create a topic 16:38:58 <Samu> going to concentrate all my ideas in one place, one topic 16:42:02 <Samu> which objects can be built on water? 16:42:09 <Samu> Class A tile type 16:42:50 <Samu> can't think of any 16:42:56 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:47:17 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-154-197.netvisao.pt] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:47:28 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 16:47:56 *** Samu [~oftc-webi@po-217-129-154-197.netvisao.pt] has joined #openttd 16:48:04 <Samu> oops i dropped 17:01:24 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@blfd-4d082a67.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 17:08:22 *** Biolunar_ [Biolunar@blfd-4d088381.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:20:41 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 17:24:38 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 17:28:11 *** Celestar [~Celestar@ip-109-43-2-87.web.vodafone.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:31:13 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 17:34:13 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has joined #openttd 17:46:13 <DorpsGek> Commit by translators :: r27175 /trunk/src/lang (3 files) (2015-03-01 17:46:04 UTC) 17:46:14 <DorpsGek> -Update from WebTranslator v3.0: 17:46:15 <DorpsGek> catalan - 14 changes by arnau 17:46:16 <DorpsGek> italian - 4 changes by lorenzodv 17:46:17 <DorpsGek> korean - 3 changes by telk5093 17:49:33 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i5387A192.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 18:01:02 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 18:05:18 *** Plaete [~moffi@dsdf-4d0a5fa4.pool.mediaways.net] has joined #openttd 18:11:05 *** liq3 [liq3@CPE-120-147-178-81.gdfw1.lon.bigpond.net.au] has quit [] 18:28:44 <Samu> so here's my gigantic topic 18:28:47 <Samu> http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=72691&p=1143661#p1143661 18:28:59 *** sgtbigman [~sgtbigman@104-48-204-167.lightspeed.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has joined #openttd 18:29:12 <Samu> anyone cares to look? 18:37:56 <Alberth> so your unused bit is not unused at all, for you :) 18:38:03 *** Plaete2 [~moffi@dsdf-5f7653cd.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 18:38:06 <Samu> yeah 18:38:23 <Alberth> which means the reported bug is not a bug, but the first step in your patch 18:39:10 <Alberth> ie you should redefine the bits as being used, and thus fix the demolishing that happens in trunk 18:39:37 <Alberth> (ie what you did in your patch) 18:40:40 <Alberth> except you didn't update the documentation, probably 18:41:08 <Alberth> also, you need a place to store your changes in the code somewhere 18:41:38 <Alberth> although for now, it could be at your machine 18:42:31 *** Plaete [~moffi@dsdf-4d0a5fa4.pool.mediaways.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:00:16 <Samu> i'm storing in OneDrive 19:00:21 <Samu> those patch-files 19:01:29 <Samu> synced to my computer 19:01:51 <Samu> "and thus fix the demolishing that happens in trunk", what do you mean with this? 19:02:31 *** Plaete2 [~moffi@dsdf-5f7653cd.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de] 19:03:01 <Alberth> in trunk, the bits are not used, and can get any value they like 19:03:24 <Alberth> in your patch, you have given them meaning, so you care about the value of the bits 19:03:43 <Samu> ah, i see 19:03:47 <Alberth> thus you should fix all cases where the bits are assigned a value 19:03:53 <Samu> have to edit that html document 19:04:55 <Alberth> your patch in 6235 is not a bug in the trunk code 19:06:13 <Samu> fix all cases where the bits are assigned a value, isn't that what I've done with that patch? 19:06:23 <Samu> ok, i got it on my machine 19:06:27 <Samu> you can delete the bug report 19:06:55 <Alberth> yes, but the patch doesn't belong in the bug tracker, as trunk has no meaning for the bits 19:10:15 <planetmaker> that patch in FS only starts to make sense in the context of *some* other patch(es) which utilize that bit and make use of that meaning 19:10:18 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-77-25.dynamic.qsc.de] has joined #openttd 19:15:02 *** tokai|noir [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:22:10 *** Celestar [~Celestar@p4FFB977C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 19:23:15 *** tokai|mdlx [~tokai@port-92-195-77-25.dynamic.qsc.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 19:29:06 <Samu> hmm interesting 19:29:08 <Samu> ⢠m3 bits 7..4: owner of road type 1 (tram); OWNER_NONE (10) is stored as OWNER_TOWN (0F) 19:29:14 <Samu> this, for roads 19:29:24 <Samu> so it's possible :) 19:35:31 *** roidal_ [~roland@62-46-138-30.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.0.1] 19:51:48 *** Celestar [~Celestar@p4FFB977C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:52:14 *** glevans2 [~glevans2@71-8-126-76.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 19:58:46 *** glx [~glx@000128ec.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 19:58:49 *** mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ 20:08:12 *** tokai [~tokai@00012860.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 20:08:15 *** mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ 20:16:27 *** glevans2 [~glevans2@71-8-126-76.dhcp.ftwo.tx.charter.com] has joined #openttd 20:31:43 *** sla_ro|master [slamaster@95.76.27.245] has quit [] 20:38:15 *** frosch123 [~frosch@frnk-4d0130db.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: be yourself, except: if you have the opportunity to be a unicorn, then be a unicorn] 20:42:43 *** Myhorta [~Myhorta@00018fad.user.oftc.net] has joined #openttd 20:52:17 *** Progman [~progman@p57A192C5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd 20:58:46 *** Alberth [~alberth@2001:981:c6c5:1:be5f:f4ff:feac:e11] has left #openttd [] 20:59:48 *** HerzogDeXtEr1 [~flex@i59F6C28E.versanet.de] has joined #openttd 21:00:59 <Terkhen> good night 21:03:41 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@blfd-4d082a67.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:05:08 *** HerzogDeXtEr [~flex@i59F6C7E8.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:14:02 *** sgtbigman [~sgtbigman@104-48-204-167.lightspeed.bcvloh.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: leaving] 21:24:34 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: andythenorth] 21:26:08 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 21:26:29 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 21:27:07 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 21:28:44 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 21:29:25 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 21:30:37 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [] 21:31:05 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 21:31:17 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #openttd 21:34:25 *** Tirili [~chatzilla@dslc-082-083-143-208.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd 21:39:23 *** andythenorth [~Andy@cpc10-aztw26-2-0-cust867.18-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 21:52:54 *** oskari89 [oskari89@83-102-63-32.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [] 22:02:12 *** Tirili [~chatzilla@dslc-082-083-143-208.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds] 22:23:16 <Wolf01> 'night 22:23:19 *** Wolf01 [~wolf01@0001288e.user.oftc.net] has quit [Quit: Once again the world is quick to bury me.] 23:01:42 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 23:02:03 *** DDR [~david@S010600254bbe4e1c.vc.shawcable.net] has joined #openttd 23:21:30 *** supermop [~supermop@d110-33-177-242.sun801.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd 23:24:32 <supermop> roll out of bed - first thing to do is wake up computer and start a render 23:24:40 <supermop> now to make coffee 23:27:39 *** Biolunar [Biolunar@blfd-4d082a67.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd 23:29:31 *** FLHerne [~flh@dsl-217-155-24-22.zen.co.uk] has quit [Quit: There's a real world out here!] 23:38:30 *** Progman [~progman@p57A192C5.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:41:32 *** Pereba [~UserNick@191.32.225.155] has joined #openttd 23:53:15 *** gelignite [~gelignite@i5387A192.versanet.de] has quit [Quit: http://bit.ly/1kso8Ta]